Guest essay by Eric Worrall
The Guardian even mentions nuclear energy in a vaguely positive light (unlike the Moore film).
Planet of the Humans review – contrarian eco-doc from the Michael Moore stable
4 out of 5 stars.
Peter Bradshaw @PeterBradshaw1
Wed 22 Apr 2020 18.32 AEST
Last modified on Wed 22 Apr 2020 19.32 AESTJeff Gibbs’ film, produced by Michael Moore, takes a pop at green, liberal A-listers such as Al Gore – but doesn’t dare criticise Greta Thunberg
…
Gibbs has a cheeky habit of going backstage at music festivals that solemnly declare themselves to be using 100% renewable energy, only to find that the fancy array of solar panels behind the tent is enough to power a single bass guitar. The rest of the energy is provided by just plugging into the shameful old electricity grid, provided by fossil fuels. He sees it as symptomatic of the mainstream environmental movement, running on delusional piety.
All the green, liberal A-listers – Bill McKibben, Al Gore, Van Jones, Robert F Kennedy Jr – are attacked in this film as a pompous and complacent high-priest caste of the environmental movement, who are shilling for a fossil fuel industry that has sneakily taken them over. (Although it should be said that, for all his radical bravado, Gibbs does not dare criticise Thunberg.)
…
Gibbs doesn’t mention nuclear and – a little lamely, perhaps – has no clear lesson or moral, other than the need to take a fiercely critical look at the environmental establishment. Well, it’s always valuable to re-examine a sacred cow.
…
Read more: https://www.theguardian.com/film/2020/apr/22/planet-of-the-humans-review-environment-michael-moore-jeff-gibbs
What is happening to the Guardian? The other day they praised seafront property development, now they’re praising a movie which trashes renewables.
Have greens secretly hated renewables all along, and suddenly feel able to talk about it? Or are they just softening us up, because they are about to spring something even worse on us?
The company i work for has been pushed around by green groups and the MSM for some time now. Over the past few months management has decided that installing wind turbines at the work site will get them off our backs.
I advised against it because over the last number of months I’ve noticed the green tide is turning against wind turbines. They ignored my advice, partly because I didn’t have good evidence.
I do now.
If you need evidence find the article on Wattsupwiththat about Poland and the wind turbines being BANNED for their adverse health effects. Read the article and then find the comment by “Sommer and watch the video. Devastating to turbines.
It still has an apocalyptic view of the state of the planet.
Quote ‘I don’t think the people in charge are near nervous enough’.
Quote ‘By not thinking about it, it stands a good chance of doing us in’
So, what would be the solution ? I suspect a substantial shut down of the modern world.
True. However, selling the masses on reverting to an 1820’s lifestyle will be much more difficult than selling them on higher taxes (on other people) to subsidize green boondoggles.
It will be interesting to see which way this goes.
People today aren’t NEARLY intelligent enough to live an “1820’s livestyle.” Not nearly tough enough, either, believe me! Read “Washington’s Crossing” to learn what our ancestors REALLY endured for their ideals! I’d be we haven’t 1/10th of 1% today who would or could endure that.
The left also want to kill off 90% of the population, so to them this is a feature, not a bug.
Of course, most of the left will end up in the 90% who are unable to survive a 19th century lifestyle. 99% of the 10% who survive will be ‘Deplorables’.
An Australian greenie model has reportedly called Covid a planet-saving gift from God.
It is unclear whether she would seek medical treatment for herself if needed (I write sarcastically).
Well [bleep] most of them wouldn’t be able to handle life on working farm in the 20th century, let alone the 1820s.
Models (the human kind) need to remember that if we wanted to hear them speak they would be voice actors.
They exist because we are willing to look at them.
Yep!
And the poverty-induced death toll and political instability would make what we’re going through with Covid-19 look like a minor event.
There seemed to be a subtle message regarding the human population, reduce it.
I did find the information about “renewables” very useful.
Keitho
There was nothing subtle about the desire for population control in that documentary.
Planned population (PP) protocols and schemes were normalized with social progress. People and societies are evolving, but what is the fitness function?
So, what would be the solution? Every Leftist on earth becomes an incel. Problem solved! 😉
Most leftist men are already incels, so nothing new there.
Women only marry leftist men for their resources, not their bodies.
Sacrifice MIchael Moore to the volcano God. Should be lots for everybody to eat once he’s gone.
Meanwhile this guy is still a phenomenal retard, it took him that long to realize that the green utopias he supported and milted for so far paid dividends to his masters and peanuts to him.
One more delusional green. However I don’t count on a landslide effect. There’s too much free money on the stake and paychecks can be very efficient indoctrination textbook pages.
Yes, a more rational person who had been pointing out the implausibility of solar & wind for decades now would be too embarrassed to now come out with his belated realization of the realities at play on this subject.
But I did notice there were many commenters on the Guardian article who were rejecting the doco’s evidence and conclusions about the uselessness of wind & solar.
Dare we label such rusted-on renewable disciples as “deniers”?
The human capacity for self-delusion is simply amazing.
In 1919 Lincoln Steffens visited the new Soviet Union and famously said “I have seen the future and it works.” Man, was he ever wrong! Back in the 1960’s when I was in college there were students who thought Mao in China was a great man and my best friend in college told me that Castro in Cuba was the future. Tell that to the millions who died in Mao’s Cultural Revolution and the thousands who fled Cuba for Florida. And then we have people like Al Gore, Greta Turnberg and Michael Moore. They probably are very sincere. Just like Lincoln Steffens was probably very sincere.
In the unlikely event that I were ever to take up a cause, like for example “save the ardvarks”, I think I’d make damn sure that I knew what I was talking about first.
“Tell that to the millions who died in Mao’s Cultural Revolution and the thousands who fled Cuba for Florida. And then we have people like Al Gore, Greta Turnberg and Michael Moore. They probably are very sincere. Just like Lincoln Steffens was probably very sincere.”
Could you please add AOC to that list, Marty?
https://www.facebook.com/JohnStossel/videos/vb.46675576620/652367732225333/?type=2&theater
Marty, I’d grant that Thunberg and Moore might be sincere about their beliefs.
Gore – NO WAY!
A rank carpetbagger of the first order.
+1000
I concur!
In case you had any doubts, g here’s where th Billions to add to the MIllions Gore gets paid to promote j his own climate change protection racket. THAT”S the way the money goes.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bkar4jn3JWw&feature=youtu.be
This is the neatest explanation I have seen anywhere in the 4 years I have researched the climate side of this racket, having taken four years before that to establish the engineering reality that the renewables cure to the claimed problem was simply overpriced snake oil we are forced to buy by law, made by crooked politicians to enrich their lobbyists. Then it turns out CO2 is not significant in natural climate change either. You can’t make it up. THat’s their job.
I recall reading something to the effect that Steffens had that phrase in mind BEFORE he visited the workers’ paradise. Hence, I doubt his sincerity. (I wish I could remember the source.)
I can’t tell if your spelling of “aardvarks” was intentional or not. 😀
Lenin dubbed them “useful idiots”
So Moore has gone to stating the obvious that escapes the ecoloons. Let’s see how far he gets before they demonized him.
The left always eats their own.
Surprising to see the Graun attacking saintly figures like Gore and Kibben. They must be scared.
It might be interesting to point out to the Guardian’s readers the many, many ways their other heroes have echoed these same maniac ideas. They pretend to support the poor and under advantaged and then push this economically disastrous nonsense off on them.
“We are not idiots” Even the most glassy-eyed acolytes of millenarian cults sometimes feel the need to validate their basic intelligence to others. There are some great documentaries on Jonestown featuring long-time members who keep saying that they knew something was wrong all along. The Guardian is one of many propaganda outlets for the Climate Crises scam that gets that itch every so often. Still, they will continue to sell the green Kool-Aid just like they continued selling the red stuff long after it was proven sour.
The hidden message of this film? … it’s all “capitalsim’s fault”. See! LOOK at all those $$RICH individuals and corporations EXPLOITING ‘renewable” energy for personal gain! See! We need Socialism and Communism NOW!!
Here in CA … all the wildfire death and destruction has been laid on the doorstep of the PG&E ewwwwww Corporation. Corporate “GREED” caused the conflagrations, it has been concluded. “Green” Policies that drove every single decision by the quasi-public Board of PG&E and the PUBLIC Utilities Commission … are swept under the carpet. Just like this film sweeps all the “renewable” “green” energy nonsense under the carpet of “GREEDY” “green” capitalists.
Oh! and the other message in this film? Population control. Worldwide procreation controls. One child policies. Euthanasia … Death Panels. The ONLY way to “solve the problem” … they claim
kenji
100% mate.
★★★★★
Capitalism is just individual free-market economic initiative propagated society-wide. As such, capitalism cannot exist without individualism. Freedom cannot exist without individualism.
The enmity toward capitalism is really an enmity toward individualism. Capitalism is just a stalking horse. Individualism is the true target.
I’ve written about individualism as the target in Progressivism is Hostile to Humanism.
Socialism is merely the self-delusional politics of reflexive collectivists. Reflexive collectivists yearn to submerge themselves into a mindlessly moralized society. To be slaves of a greater whole in other words, where thought need be no more than reaction. Socialism is merely their vehicle for that end.
The Romantic response to the Enlightenment is the attack of collectivists against an emergent individualism and the free societies individualists have engendered. Their innate and reflexive collectivism is the ground-substance of socialism.
In a way, one feels sorry for innate collectivists. They probably feel lost and confused in a society of free people, where law and behavior require thought and negotiation rather than obedience to a normative morality.
Too bad for them.
The world economy is in the process of being crippled by the actions taken in response to CV19. As it happens, we were already on course to cripple the economy anyway via the idiotic green net zero carbon plans. We should now mothball those plans with immediate effect.
TC: Mothballed implies being preserved for potential use in the future. Those plans need to be burned to ash, ground to a fine powder and scattered to the four winds. CO2 is unlikely to ever become an actual problem. While we may someday run out of economically viable fossil fuels, by then we will certainly have 4th, 5th or 6th generation nuclear fission and perhaps even viable fusion. Economic and environmentally sound applications for wind and solar exist, but they are very limited.
I chose “mothballed” with a view to not scaring the horses. Those of us who don’t buy into CAGW just need the passage of time to knock the whole thing on the head.
Nothing scarier than a climate activist with his back against the wall. If they see the renewable energy thing as BS, their only alternative is human depopulation. How will they propose to accomplish that?
I’ve spent the last 20 years around “alternative energy” projects and recognize several shown in the documentary. Viability of projects is often in the eye of the beholder and the local political scene. Some investors are easy to fool by stroking their idealism. I worked several around cement plants. Those guys are different. They go strictly on return on investment.
Besides, Al Gore is a dope.
“their only alternative is human depopulation. How will they propose to accomplish that”
They will murder the deniers and unbelievers, in the name of saving mankind.
Global Thermonuclear War, the Hing Kong varient
“How will they propose to accomplish that?”
Could they lock everyone in their houses, ban them from buying seeds to grow their own food, and shut down the farms and meat-packing plants?
Just a thought.
Forced vaccination is more human way to do it, and it´s easy to do behind corona-curtain. And we will happily accept it, because we are scared.
They’ll have to catch me first.
The medical profession’s “standard of care” has so little empirical evidence to support most practices that the average person would be APPALLED if they knew. How ’bout those BP pills that seem to be attracting COVID-19 like a magnet? But NOOOO, don’t stop taking them for a clear & present threat vs. a mostly theoretical future one, because Novartis’ $$ or something.
I’d rather be pulled down and eaten by WOLVES than be hospitalized.
Maybe they could somehow get the population to allow government to put in place shut down orders requiring everyone to stay indoors, close all but essential businesses, and bring the economy to a halt. Not sure how that would be accomplished but I am sure there is a way. ….
The fact that these people never seem aware of the revoutionary new nuclear designs, particularly molten salt small modular reactors that can burn either uranium or Thoriium (both of which will lastpractically forever),
is a clear indication that they are not serious when it comes to future energy sources.
Ya – speaking of revolutionary designs! Consider this validation report* of a device with 275 kW power output and a power density of 5 MW per Liter:
Report: https://tinyurl.com/yczwpv25
And the associated calorimetry test protocol: https://tinyurl.com/ybvjy5o2
(Now, this is post is going to draw a few ‘flies’, notably (most likely) MarkW for one … )
.
.
* By Dr. Mark Nansteel, Ph.D. University of California, Berkeley
The Greens are temporarily piggybacking on CoVid-19, which has put their agenda(21) 10% towards the final solution.
Fossil Fuels to the rescue. But we must do better
Natural gas can be consumed much more efficiently by industry and large commercial.
Coal and oil can be combusted with near zero CO2 emissions.
Fossil fuel power plants can with TLC last 60 to 80 years. Solar and wind have to be replaced 3 or 4 times in that same time frame. Where are the greatest CO2 savings?
Loved this movie. Finally the Truth comes out.
Sadly … the film only focused on one small forest decimation in Vermont. They should have shown before and after pictures of landscape after landscape after landscape utterly defiled by wind and solar plants. Shown dead birds of prey littering the killing fields of these giant wind contraptions.
And then shown the pristine seascape of John F Kennedy Jr’s waterfront home.
not to mention the devastation of palm oil plantations….
and followed by the before and after pictures Glacier disappearances in more temperate climates…
“and followed by the before and after pictures Glacier disappearances in more temperate climates…”
… in many cases BEFORE 1950!
Spending money to get rid of a gas that is so beneficial?
Only a total idiot would propose such a scheme.
Yes, and overwhelming majority are total idiots. Many decades propaganda has shown its power, again.
“Coal and oil can be combusted with near zero CO2 emissions.”
No, they can’t.
Sid’s been pushing a proprietary carbon capture scheme for months.
Still can’t find any investors.
**Coal and oil can be combusted with near zero CO2 emissions.**
No, maybe near zero pollution, but CO2 is good for us.
“Have greens secretly hated renewables all along, and suddenly feel able to talk about it? Or are they just softening us up, because they are about to spring something even worse on us?”
Hmmm…get off the warming meme if coastal/esplanade RE prices aren’t following the plant food doomsday scenario and jump on the species extinction bandwagon particularly with the Rona out and about-
https://infotel.ca/newsitem/un-report-humans-accelerating-extinction-of-species/it61919
IPBES now but he was thick with the IPCC-
https://tyndall.ac.uk/people/robert-watson
It’s all about humans exploiting wildlife and extinction of species and Covid is Gaia’s warning to you all about the coming dooming if you don’t repent-
https://www.msn.com/en-au/news/world/humanitys-exploitation-of-wildlife-is-putting-us-all-at-risk/ar-BB12WpRM
…and climate change.
No matter what it is, if it’s bad, the fossil fuel industry is somehow behind it.
Do they have any actual, like, evidence, to support their claim that the reason why the environmental movement has become ineffective is because it’s been taken over by the fossil fuel industry?
Or is it more likely that the environmental movement has become ineffective because it’s been taken over by communists?
What is happening to the Guardian?
I wonder about that as much as wonder what’s happening to the National Enquirer.
SCIENCE … real science had mocked these green schemes since DAY ONE. So, only now … 3-years past Obama’s “cleansing of the planet” do they acknowledge that the math was tainted … the truth buried? NEXT: the sudden realization that Elon Musk is less a “visionary” than an exploitative charlatan.
Who killed the electric car? Well … it wasn’t the coal power plant charging the car … that’s for sure.
They’re ALL Solyndra’s now …
“Who killed the electric car?”
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dSpOjj4YD8c
WEEEE DOOOO! WEEEE DOOOO!
Like, prophecy maaan . . .
Michael Moore carries a lot of weight in leftist circles (pun intended). Nevertheless, he’s shining light on the problem that renewables are nothing more than a delusion. At the very least, this will force some people to examine his claims about the delusion and some people will be enlightened.
Moore will still be wrong about most of his views, but this movie can be used as a tool against the leftist greens.
Scissor
You’re right up to a point.
But as has been pointed out, this ‘documentary’ was as much about evil Capitalism and population control as anything else.
Yes, I agree with that.
And that is fine as now these people have to break cover.
I still don’t understand Moore’s angle
He’s on board with Bernie and AOC and the GND
This directly attacks 90% of the face of GND and can only hurt Biden and the Dems this fall
Aside from the fact it’s all true, Moore claims the only thing of importance is getting rid of trump but this has to help him
Ideas?
They already have sprung worse on us.
Its called pandemic lock down. Who needs a phony Climate Change argument from invisible CO2, when a simple little invisible virus will do. So much simpler and immediately scary so people will cower and shelter in place. The corona gonna get ya! They finally figured out a way to institute socialism practically overnight.
Sadly, for the officious left, gone are the days of the taxpayer funded per Diem vacations to exciting locations to promote doom and gloom. Now, when they whip up the next pandemic, they will have to order up netflix and stock up on popcorn and toilet paper.
You forgot the “artisanal” Ice Cream . . .
Patrick Moore, PhD Wattsupwiththat Aug 3, 2018
Some time ago it struck me that the majority of alleged environmental catastrophes and threats are invisible or very remote, thus making it virtually impossible for the average person to validate them through observation. Observations, along with replications of those observations, are the very foundation of the scientific method. Seeing is believing, and seeing the same result again and again under similar circumstances reinforces the belief. Is it possible that activist groups and the media choose to cite supposed catastrophes and threats that are invisible, very remote or both because the majority of people cannot verify them in person and therefore must rely on the activists, the media, and other third parties to tell them the truth?
People who are generally green, but without green incentives, aren’t so green about The Green Blight.
I wonder which of Moore’s houses he is sequestered in while the rest of us kill the planet….
“https://www.theloop.ca/inside-michael-moores-jaw-dropping-michigan-lake-house-yours-for-6-8m/”
🙂
Ethan Brand
Thanks for the link. I watched the entire film. Had plenty of time on a misty day during this virus time.
The film dumped on the largely fake and, or failed renewable energy industry as it has developed over recent decades.
Some topics I noted: The Ivanapah solar failure burns natural gas for hours every morning as has previously been discussed at WUWT. Broken mirrors littering the ground at Ivanapah solar site. A skid steer mulching 500 year-old yucca plants when the Ivanpah site was being cleared for construction at 0:39. “Environmental sand dunes” at a vacated historic former solar farm near Daggatt, CA.- It did not last long! A collage of mine site photos illustrating the energy and minerals needed to create wind, solar, electric things in contravention to their claimed sustainability and environmental virtues.
The film used several minutes to take a big shot at biomass energy. “Going green by burning trees.” at 1:01. “What if they themselves had become misguided?” 1:10. The film directly zinged Al Gore at 1:19. After that,
Portrayed McKibben to be an idiot. And so on. Maybe the sun will come out tomorrow.
Clueless. The movie was done and in the can by the time Thunberg came along.
1 – The movie points out that renewable energy is a scam.
2 – The point of the movie is that we’re raping the Earth and have to cut way back or we’re doomed. We can’t delude ourselves into thinking renewable energy is going to let us continue our profligate lifestyle.
Malthus and Moore and Gibbs and Suzuki, etc., etc., etc. are all wrong. Because people are way smarter than coyotes and rabbits, people aren’t doomed to an existence of population booms and collapses.
The best way to take advantage of people’s intelligence is to make them prosperous enough that all their energy isn’t spent scrabbling just to get the next meal. That’s why the invention of cooking was such a game changer. We an do things other than spending our whole lives chewing leaves.
Civilization is amazing. People don’t value it near enough.
Your comment deserves five stars. ★★★★★
Yes to all of your message.
+1000
“Civilization is amazing. ”
It is. Until it turns into Mouse Utopia.
Which is where we are today.
Few of the SJWs and other low-lives who make our lives hell would have survived without civilization, and even fewer would find anyone eager to listen to them.
Civilization is created by competent, hard-working men. But it creates the conditions that allow SJWs and other low-lives to thrive. And they then destroy it.
That’s been the cycle for thousands of years now. Because everyone ignores the obvious warnings from history, because ‘it’s different this time.’
Well. If it is Mouse Utopia (assuming you meant that living conditions are excellent for mice), then (((LOOK OUT!!!!)))😲
–> it is CAT Utopia! Bwah, ha, ha, ha, haaaaaaa!😸😼
This comment was purely just for fun.
P.S. I am NOT a cat fan — DOGS RULE!🐕🦺🐕
Yes. A cat would have solved Mouse Utopia’s problems pretty quickly by removing the dysfunctional mice. At least in the early generations before the mice stopped breeding at all.
Machiavelli, famous for The Prince, also wrote The Discourses on Livy. link
The Discourses points out the advantages of republics over the other kinds of government extant at Machiavelli’s time or in previous history. The book is a font of great wisdom.
Machiavelli points out that, when a nation becomes effeminate, it is doomed.
It seems to be a surprise to young men that they should pick up the heaviest load they can bear and carry it. That’s what they want and need. It’s been beaten out of them by the radical feminists who pollute out educational system.
Every cycle comes to its peak and then starts to go the other way. I fervently hope we have passed peak SJW because, as you point out, our society’s survival is at stake.
“The best way to take advantage of people’s intelligence is to make them prosperous enough that all their energy isn’t spent scrabbling just to get the next meal.” No, you are close but the answer is a bit further along. The key here is toilet paper. Not only because of the recent ‘TP crisis, which illustrates the level that it can distract, but because of a story a guy from Poland told me. He lived under the communist system. He explained that when you and your wife are laying in bed at night trying to figure out which store will have shit paper the next day, you don’t spend much time on anything else. So the obvious way to maintain a high functioning human intellect is to guarantee abundant shit paper.
To paraphrase The Guardian: there are too many wind turbines in the fields affecting environmental diversity.
I wonder if this is a reaction to a new relationship with China, which cuts short environmentalism’s out-of-sight and out-of-mind philosophy.
The Formula (for….. well, you decide what for ….)
1. False assertion:
The conjecture about human CO2 emissions causing significant shifts in the climate zones of the earth is true.
Conclusion: fossil fuel consumption is bad.
2. False assertion:
People living as they are is destroying the planet — citing all kinds of unsupported, wildly inaccurate, “facts” such as:
(From the “Q & A” livestreamed yesterday on youtube here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HBGcEK8FD3w with the films Exec. Producer, Moore, Director, Gibbs, and Producer, Zehner — from ~ 29:00, mostly Gibbs and more Gibbs and MORE GIBBS – Zehner gets to smile and nod sometimes and put in a tiny word edgewise — perhaps, Zehner got more in later, but by around 41:00, I had heard enough)
Gibbs:
(31:38) “97%** of all mammals are now humans, cows, and pets … 70% of birds are chickens … in the last 40 years, maybe half of all wildlife has died off … ”
(33:21) “… invent the sustainable human and the sustainable culture … ”
(40:37) “we [in the 1800’s] burned down all the trees in North America …”
**97 – Seriously. He used 97%. lol (And he wields “the hockey stick” like a champ around 39:00 or so — you can’t write this stuff. Heh.)
Conclusion: The world (especially the U.S.) uses way too much stuff and has way too many cows and chickens (i.e., meat).
GRAND CONCLUSION:
(1) We need fewer people AND (2) people must use less (“less is the new more,” Gibbs says with puzzling pride) land, water, fuel, anything — just less of all of it. And we need “to live closer together and share more.” (<– what does that last bit sound like, hm?)
WHAT TO DO? WHAT? TO? DO??
(sound of heavy footfalls in the hallway…. door opens… and in steps…. (((whoa!))) Algore (he doesn’t mind playing the fool or the knave (he really plays those well in the Moore-Gibbs film — just so he can make money)). To the rescue! With:
Beyond Meat.
https://www.cnsnews.com/commentary/marc-morano/will-al-gore-be-first-fake-meat-billionaire
(Beyond Meat is holy and good because: meat raising uses too much water and land and also uses fossil fuels and causes “emissions” (eye roll))
“And that brings us back to…..
dough***, dough, dough, dough.” (that starts with “d” which rhymes with “c” and that stands for, ssshhhhhh….. CAPITALISM! lol — Uh, oh. Terrrrrouble in River City….)
D’OH!
cui bono
***”dough” means money (in American English 🙂 )
*****************
Re: Ozzie Zehner — I think he is just a true believer being used (along with vegan people who won’t even allow for humane raising and use of animals for human consumption) He really believes ( that material consumption beyond subsistence (or about that level) is wrong). His sharp intellect and bold willingness to speak the truth are being used by the likes of Algore. Zehner isn’t one of the “bad guys.” Just a nice guy blinded by something — not sure what. Gibbs may also just be a much less intelligent, far less informed, Zehner ….. not sure about ol’ Gibbs at this point (sure about his intelligence and ignorance, just not about his motive)….
[Yay! My comment appeared very quickly! So, here are the links, linked to it. 🙂 ]
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My comment just *poof* disappeared (into the auto-moderation) and I wanted to add these links to it (because too many links will put one into formal “moderation” which can last for HOURS): Hoping these links are not too far below my comment of about 11:45AM today:
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https://greenstarsproject.org/2019/04/14/beyond-meat-sustainability-ethics-lca-impact/
https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2018/may/31/avoiding-meat-and-dairy-is-single-biggest-way-to-reduce-your-impact-on-earth
My comment just *poof* disappeared (into the auto-moderation) and I wanted to add these links to it (because too many links will put one into formal “moderation” which can last for HOURS): Hoping these links are not too far below my comment of about 11:45AM today:
https://greenstarsproject.org/2019/04/14/beyond-meat-sustainability-ethics-lca-impact/
https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2018/may/31/avoiding-meat-and-dairy-is-single-biggest-way-to-reduce-your-impact-on-earth
Uh, moderator? The above comment (11:48AM) is now just clutter… . Just FYI. 🙂
Look ….
The eco-warriors are not going to declare one day that they were mistaken.
Instead, we are going to see one by one, subtle changes of direction….and , hastened by the damned virus (specifically, the various government responses) more and more members of the public saying “we had a glimpse of your alternative world, and didn’t like it much. And by the way, your models suck.”
This seems to me simply a forward march of the underlying purpose of the whole movement. Remember, the goal has never truly been “green energy” but “transformation” of society and economics. The movie does well in showing what skeptics have been saying for years now, but it doubles-down on the basic “problem” of CO2. Having now established that no green alternatives exist that can possibly supply enough energy to meet our demands, the only way out is to lower our expectations and lifestyle. It’s no accident that the movie doesn’t even mention nuclear power (well, one quick split-second mention and it’s gone).
First you set up CO2 as the villain, which is produced by virtually every energy method we have with the exception of hydro and nuclear. Then you start replacing the high-energy methods such as fossil fuels with lower-energy methods such as animal fat and wood chips which still produce CO2, and more of it in ration to the energy output. Then you “discover” that these methods are not going to work, but since CO2 remains as the villain, the only option now is to bring everyone on board to destroy the economy and revert to the Middle Ages.
I do not believe that COVID-19 was developed in a lab. But by God, it’s sure a wonderful opportunity to help promote all this, isn’t it?
But they need power to do this
The Green new deal is the proposed vessel and the public face of that is renewable energy and this movie just gutted that
I don’t see how this movie doesn’t help Trump
A lot of middle of the road types are going to look at depopulation, deindustrialization and reverting to living in sack cloth and decide that “adaptation” sounds pretty good after all
The ones who believe the CO2 myth
We can send them all to Quebec and close the borders
Near the end they admit the need to control human behavior and population to not let natural selection, plagues, wars, famine and disasters do it. They want communism to level everyone and dictate the use of resources.
But that means they broke cover and their true beliefs are on display publicly
Can’t help but help us actual humans
Saw the film on YouTube. No chance it will ever be shown on UK TV, it’s politically incorrect. However, the Guardian response was astonishing, what will happen to that reporter? A spell in the gulag, at the very least.
Why do people disagree with Moore’s comments about population control and using less resources? It’s the only way to go, surely.
This is an important movie. It is very convincing.
The movie is astonishingly honest about the fact that there is more environmental damage…
…because of the green scams (including electric cars) and almost no reduction in CO2 emissions, ignoring the fact that we did not cause the CO2 rise and the CO2 rise did not cause the temperature change.
The movie shows Gore, Blumberg, and the other billionaires in the green game and the promoters such as Bill McKibben, to be slimy opportunists, pushing a fake narrative for profit and power.
I has particularly surprised at how it showed Bill McKibben to have commercial interests in cutting down forests and burning the wood.
The movie showed massive piles of cut trees waiting to be chopped and burned and then showed clips of McKibben talking to Bill Mahler making promises that cutting down trees and burning them is good for the environment.
McKibben is one of those selfish, uncaring, people that heat their homes with wood. Great ‘savings’ except for the incredible air pollution and the loss of forests for wildlife and people.
Burning every tree in the US would power the US for one year. Kind of sad when that year is over.
I also agree, the movie makes a case for action to reduce the damage per person to the earth and stopping the uncontrolled growth in population.
That ship however has sailed.
Due to the 30% reduction in world GDP, there is going to be an immediate crisis in all of the developing countries.
Re: It’s the only way to go, surely. That was great humor. In the off chance that you were not being sarcastic there:
1. The planet doesn’t need us to live small to save it.
Nicely articulated by George Carlin — Saving the Planet
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7W33HRc1A6c
(Warning: foul language — but, you probably guessed that, lol)
And we have the CONCEIT to think that somehow we’re a THREAT?? (at 3:01)
2. Living small is:
(edited from my WUWT comment here: https://wattsupwiththat.com/2020/04/22/earthday-epic-michael-moores-new-film-trashes-planet-saving-renewable-energy-full-movie-here/#comment-2973815 )
1) a solution looking for a problem:
Because that would be stupid.
(1) The underlying premise, that human ingenuity will not enable us to adapt to whatever natural resource situation we find ourselves in in the centuries to come, is wrong.
(2) The current known (not to mention projected) petroleum/coal reserves are enough to last for many decades (if not centuries). That is, there is no emergent need to “save us.” There will be plenty of time when things begin to run out (i.e., their price goes up), to adopt new technology/sources of energy.
(3) We have NUCLEAR POWER, a viable, robust, alternative (to wind and solar, etc.), source of energy.
AND
2) Wrong.
Human consumption is the CHOICE of each individual. That is, the main thing is: LIBERTY. It is a religious belief of Zehner (“The Planet of the Humans” producer) et al. that “materialism” or “over-consumption” or the like is “wrong.” It is not wrong. It simply is.
What is wrong is tyrannically restricting individual liberty in ways NOT narrowly tailored to meet a genuine public safety/other issue (thus, violating the 14th Am. of the Constitution of the United States of America).
They are free to practice their religion. They are not free to force the rest of us to do so.
There are other issues here. For example, the expansion of the population of Africa means that in 50 years time there will be few if any large animals left in the wild – all usable land will be taken by humans for living space and crop growing. The Serengeti will be an urban slum.
The UN has not held a population conference since 1994, as climate has been the only game in town since then.
Once population reaches saturation levels it’s very difficult to go into reverse – people live a long time and won’t conveniently curl up and die.
An increasing number of people will be on permanent food aid – is this what you want? Africa first, then Latin America. And everywhere huge numbers attempting to flee to countries which have stabilised their populations and have grown wealthy as a result.
1) the expansion of the population of Africa
As societies grow wealthier, they have fewer children.
2) in 50 years time there will be few if any large animals left in the wild – all usable land will be taken by humans for living space and crop growing.
Nonsense. Not nonsense? Prove it.
3) saturation levels
What are they? Birth/death rate data say that the world population is on track to level off at about 9.8 billion. Our current crop yield per acre can EASILY support that number.
4) An increasing number of people will be on permanent food aid
Nonsense. Merely unsupported, highly implausible, speculation.
5) stabilised their populations and have grown wealthy as a result.
You have that exactly BACKWARDS.
Recommended reading: Hard Green (by Peter Huber)
Societies can’t grow wealthier if they keep having 5 children per family – too many unproductive people. Too much effort going into caring/education, Economic growth lagging behind population growth. Of course I can’t prove that the disasters I predicted will happen. But the excess population is already baked in,
It’s true that population growth globally is slowing, but that’s mainly because of the drastic action taken by China in ordaining one child per family, as well as stabilisation of population growth in Europe.
I blame the UN. They have virtually stopped doing anything about population growth as it is too sensitive a subject for them – sounds racist, patronising etc, Instead, climate is the only game is town – blame the rich countries, easy to do that.
Ethiopia’s population was 34 million in 1984 – the “Feed the World” thing. It’s now 114 million. No sign of any slowing down there. 10 million on permanent food aid. Keep your eye on the ball.
re: “Societies can’t grow wealthier if they keep having 5 children per family”
More likely, it depends on the (so-called) “society”; Many (so-called “societies”) would not quite qualify as ‘civil’, a prerequisite for definition of civilization in my book, although meeting the loose definition of society.
How do the Amish fare in this? Do they not have ‘large’ families? Are they ‘wealthy’ insofar as a) having a roof over their head and b) adequate nutrition over the course of a day?
There is a missing ingredient in all this; the mechanics of a society (cargo cult science edition) are insufficient, it requires the needs of the soul be met too.
Quote: “There are other issues here. For example, the expansion of the population of Africa means that in 50 years time there will be few if any large animals left in the wild – all usable land will be taken by humans for living space and crop growing. The Serengeti will be an urban slum.”
There is the Club of Rome prediction scare again. You are literally not able to predict five days ahead but still expect everybody to believe the future hell in 50 years you predict.
You are totally wrong just as all of your collegue predictors have been totally wrong. Scaremongering to make a buck. Lowlife.
The only thing missing is you asking for our money.
Just as after Copenhagen 2009, many are celebrating… So sad.
If The Guardian praises this stuff it is because it delivers the real message, that is an apology of de-growth.
Just as the European Parliament is an expensive window dressing for NATO, the 350 and other green peddlers were the necessary agitprop arm of the eugenicists.
Now they really can cut this arm without fear because they replaced their climate emergency in 2050 with a perfect, invisible killer virus.
They hope also by shedding this arm that the frustration that is about to boil because of the freedoms infringements will go after the fake prophets and not at the real manipulating ones. Notice how Greta, that is the youth, is absent from the documentary?
That’s because they’ll use her and the gullible youth for the cull.
If they serve it to us on a silver plate, it is because they have a much better way of cooking us later.
Hi, Tom. 🙂
Exactly right re: Greta. And using this child (she is now just 17 which means that she has been under 18 (the age of consent in the U.S.) during all of her exploitation) is extra troubling, for she is mentally disabled (“‘high-functioning’ autism and obsessive compulsive disorder” – https://thehill.com/changing-america/sustainability/climate-change/484337-greta-thunberg-book-details-childhood-struggle ).
Using her is no more ethical than producing and showing to children a video of science realist children exploding (the now taken-down 10:10 video https://wattsupwiththat.com/2010/10/01/1010-exploding-skeptical-children-video-disappears/ ).
https://milnepublishing.geneseo.edu/good-corporation-bad-corporation/chapter/6-marketing-ethics-selling-controversial-products/
Praying for you still.
Your WUWT friend,
Janice
Indeed, thanks Janice!
😊
The wind is currently not blowing for Green, read Prehistoric, electricity generation. UK is currently getting 5% of it’s electricity from wind or compatible with two small modern power stations. Denmark and Germany have for weeks not done much better. It is terrible with this sunny high pressure over northern Europe.
https://gridwatch.co.uk/
https://energinet.dk/
So Moore is right on that account.
WUWT has been telling this story for years but the greens ignore, ignore, ignore. I sent a letter to the editor in my local paper which copied what WUWT has been saying” NOT A SINGLE PROGNOSTICATION BY THE GREENS HAS COME TRUE IN 50 YEARS. Whatever happened to the “boy who cried wolf?” I don’t think many of the greens will be convinced of the truth since Environmentalism is a religion by now and nothing we can say will change that. But Michael Moore”s movie will change SOME people’s minds, those that are more in the independent camp. We can only hope that in time most people will accept that the world will carry on and that the greens are wrong again.
In the USA as in canada elections are decided by the moderate middle
A small shift among reasonable people in the middle kills this dead
There are multiple factions involved along the green spectrum. This phrase caught my attention on Moores Youtube introduction to the film “. . . getting a grip on our out-of-control human presence and consumption. . . ” That phrase is indicative of the dark green Maltusian end of the spectrum for whom too many “unenlightened” people are the problem and who need to be eliminated from the gene pool, but strangely enough that standard does not apply to them they have children, live to ripe old age and travel the planet e.g. Bill Gates and David Attenborough, they tend to disguise their sentiments in the name of saving the planet unlike the like of Pentti Linkola.
Moore the millionaire capitalist specializes in identifying himself as a member of the proletariat and selling that illusion to wealthy progressives who fund him by poking fun at Republicans and creating ‘Monty Burns’ cartoon caricatures of anyone who does not fit his worldview. In this mocumentary he attacks the dollar green aka climate finance part of the environmental spectrum.
Then there are the watermelons who are green on the outside and red on the inside, these people march under the ‘climate justice’ banner. They are mostly displaced socialists, bureaucrats and university activists who lust for money and power but have settled for secure job with an index linked pension instead.
Can you say XR?
How dare you!!
I don’t think this is the end of Big Green. The Green Blob is nothing but resilient. Deluded, yes, but resilient. This movie will make a bit of a dent, but it will be stuffed down the memory-hole in rather quickly, and the Green Blob will keep marching on.
I’ve just been to the Guardian website (10pm 23 April UK time)
I can’t find the article – in news, culture or environment sections.
I have had a few drinks though. Hic. sorry etc.
Dear Mr. Tallboys,
I believe I found that article here: https://www.theguardian.com/film/2020/apr/22/planet-of-the-humans-review-environment-michael-moore-jeff-gibbs
Enjoy reading it…. tomorrow…. 🙂
Cheers!
Janice in the U.S.A.
And, I just did a Google search to find it directly. If you want to find it via the G’s website, it is, sort of “buried on the bottom of page 48″…. Go to News –> Environment –> Energy, within “Energy,” one of about 6 little boxes on the middle/right side of screen contains the title to the “Planet of the Humans” review.
Bye for now!
Sleep well.
🙂
Well. IF it is Mouse Utopia (assuming you meant that living conditions are excellent for mice), then (((LOOK OUT!!!!)))😲 THEN
–> it is CAT Utopia! Bwah, ha, ha, ha, haaaaaaa!😸😼
This comment was purely JFF (Just For Fun 🙂 )
P.S. I am NOT a cat fan — DOGS RULE!🐕🦺🐕
?? This comment was, I thought, a “Reply” to Mark G here: https://wattsupwiththat.com/2020/04/23/the-end-of-big-green-the-guardian-praises-michael-moores-anti-renewables-flick-planet-of-the-humans/#comment-2975755
I just re-posted the same again up there to get it to post in the proper spot on the thread.
Janice
You should check out guinea-pigs
BUT by far the more interesting thing that may have passed you by is that he is being allowed to produce this doco, and the fact it’s being ALLOWED to air on UTube .
So for 10 years thousands of scientists have been pointing out the very obvious failures of renewables and how utterly ridiculous they are and they have been completely supressed , denigrated , talked down to , “97% of scientists can’t be wrong “ etc etc etc ad nauseum .
Then – basically out of the blue – old lardarse himself , suddenly , can work it out for himself what a crock renewables are .
What is this telling us
A) The world is so bloody broke that conning the sheeple into investing in solar and turbines to make the elites running this scam rich has become problematic .
( money out of a stone etc )
Or
B) Profits are going to be tight enough anyway so paying a fortune for electricity in the USA / Europe while India and China blissfully go full tilt into cheap coal fired electricity is suddenly not such a good idea ?
Especially if the sheeple are going to demand manufacturing move back to the USA asap !!
Either way – clearly the elite have decided to drop to renewable scam and the globull warming scam I feel sure will soon follow .
So – for those of you invested in renewables and the climate hoax related eg electric cars etc – be afraid .
“Then – basically out of the blue – old lardarse himself , suddenly , can work it out for himself what a crock renewables are,”
Moore only put his imprimatur on the film, and funded it somewhat—he had virtually nothing to do with its creation—or so I’ve read.
Have greens secretly hated renewables all along, and suddenly feel able to talk about it? Or are they just softening us up, because they are about to spring something even worse on us?
Possibly the latter. They may have figured out windmills and solar panels are a dead end and will ultimately come to grief.
It takes a special kind of denial for anyone to say they like the look of windmills on their favorite scenic views. Even greens know they are doing bad things.
Perhaps the Grauniad is experiencing financial hardships and is switching course in the hope of garnering greater revenue. Whatever it is, it will be nothing honourable from the Manchester Fish & Chip wrapper.
“Although it should be said that, for all his radical bravado, Gibbs does not dare criticise Thunberg”. Don’t criticize Greta. You just fall into their trap. Now you’re a big meanie who attacks disabled children. Attack the ethic-less turds who use her.
It will probably be another 2 or 3 documentaries down the road before Moore finally comes to the realization that ecological disaster is a non issue and he’s been duped from the get go.
I went to:
https://michaelmoore.com/
…and there is no mention of “Planet of the Humans”
He lists all his movies but not this one. I suspect he wants to keep his leftist/socialist friends and media ignorant of this film, and that’s probably why there has been no outrage by the left about him as I thought would happen.
I was going to contact him on his site to let him know some of the WUWT thought about his movie and CO2 etc.
– JPP
I sent this YouTube movie link to many of my liberal friends, and not one of them have commented on it.
– JPP
I posted a link with a short descrip on our local nextdoor.com page (this is a neighborhood posting BB style thing) and got a few nibbles as comments; I would imagine a certain few who upon viewing it probably go into a sort of cognitive dissonance (epileptic-like) ‘shock’ at some point …
“He lists all his movies but not this one.”
He didn’t make this movie, only put his name on it and promoted it. See my comment above.
Michael Moore presents Planet of the Humans | is on the top of the Movie Page !
– JPP
From JoNova’s site:
http://joannenova.com.au/2020/04/the-moment-greens-realize-theyve-been-used-by-big-money-renewables-the-michael-moore-documentary/
The moment greens realize they’ve been used by Big Money Renewables — the Michael Moore documentary:
https://youtu.be/Zk11vI-7czE
“It’s like someone read all the major skeptic blogs in the world and turned them into a documentary.
The new Michael Moore documentary: Planet of The Humans
1 – unapologetically exposes Al Gore, Bill McKibben, Robert Kennedy, etc. for being con artists and hypocrites,
2 – crucifies the Sierra Club and their ilk for being disingenuous and primarily in it for the money and influence, and
3 – also carefully documents how wind, solar and biofuels are scams.”
Been reading comments on this for days and still don’t see any reasonable theory as to why Moore produced this?
He supports Bernie and AOC and the GND
This movie obliterates the public pretense of the GND which can only help Trump.
Did he decide Trump is going to win again and decided go big or go home, admit to the green energy scam but double down on the world is ending garbage and hope to scare people to vote Trump out?
Elections are decided by small shifts in the middle, I don’t see how this does anything but push that middle to Trump even if they dislike him personally
Step 2: He embraces Bill Gates’ nuclear project named “Terrapower”. (That, or he’s reached an agreement with Dr. Mills on his (inaptly named) “SunCell(tm)” hydrino-powered devices (doubtful).)
https://www.terrapower.com/
The journalist who produced the film started the project expecting to find a big oil conspiracy, and to his horror found the it wasn’t the oil tycoons who were lying their butts off.
For now I’m prepared to accept that this is an exercise in integrity – they might be wildly wrong on a lot of issues, but they couldn’t simply sit on what they discovered.
These giant green NGOs mentioned in the film are funded with huge amounts of oil money. That is the real story here.
‘The whole affair, according to Klein, underlines a painful truth behind the “catastrophic failure” of some environmental organisations to combat the fossil-fuel industries responsible for soaring greenhouse gas emissions. “Large parts of the movement aren’t actually fighting those interests – they have merged with them,” she writes, pointing to green groups that have accepted fossil-fuel industry donations or partnerships and invited industry executives on to their boards.
http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/e373bd70-3d8e-11e4-b782-00144feabdc0.html#axzz3IlD0mBsv
But releasing this now can only help Trump and hurt Biden
Whether Moore now believes green energy is a scam, releasing this now helps trump demonize AOC and the dems
Okay, so what exactly did Moore do with this film. He is listed as ‘Producer’ as far as I know, not writer, director or ‘actor’.
This other bloke, Gibbs, seems to be the driving force of this movie, not Moore.
So, what can we speculate on in regards to this relationship? Moore is no longer the golden boy edgy indy documentary maker he once was. I am led to believe his last attempt at a film (Fahrenheit 11/9?) sort of went the way of nearly all other hipster indy toss.
(also Fahrenheit 451 isn’t about what you think it is about (censorship from above), it is about the slow decline of ‘group’ society into a bunch of apathetic slackers who surround themselves with their new ‘friends’ and, provided their immediate needs for happiness are filled, simply do not care about the outside world and instead actively resent it. Basically it is a warning not to let social media become your entire life.)
So, back to Moore. He has become yesterday’s movie maker and is struggling to gain traction and importance in the crowded field of people with TDS. To be honest he probably suffers more from Trump Distaste than Trump Delusion and has enough awareness to know how quickly he would be thrown under a bus by the Left should he ever say something actually honest about Orange Man.
So what you going to do? You still have an ex-wife to support and there is no market for endless Orange Man Bad (audience? yes. Market? No. Lefts don’t pay for anything they can get someone else to provide for free) so Moore is forced to actually do something ‘edgy’ again to get his name back in the charts.
So? Renewable Industry is a Lie supported by Big Oil!
So he has an edgy topic. He is dipping carefully into Conservative talk points (Renews are a Lie) but still holding onto his Left roots (Big Oil is to blame). He has a degree of separation (Gibbs) in case anything goes wrong. He has his name in the credits in case anything goes right. And, at the end of the day, if the reviews are to be believed, he never actually offers an actual argument.
I feel we are reading too much into this. I feel we should be keeping popcorn to hand because Left on Left violence is always entertaining, but this isn’t really about Moore seeing the 24/7 light powered by proper baseload. It is about Moore trying to keep his head above water on the public stage by kicking the sacred hornet’s nest.
Still, popcorn 😀
Executive Producer.
Its in the credits!
I get all of that Craig
But why release it now when it only helps Trump slam the dems and GND ?
He is still pushing that even though he produced this movie that says it’s all bs
We know the real GND is elimination of capitalism, but this movie parts the curtains in an election year.
I remain unconvinced
This is a Greens movie made by Greens, about Greens, for Greens. The heroes are Green whistleblowers, the villains are also Greens. While Gibbs says that anyone who thinks renewable energy will save the planet is “delusional” he cannot bring himself to acknowledge the large numbers of people who have been vilified fro the last twenty years saying precisely that. “The Right” are only mentioned as religious nutters who believe that fossil fuels are unlimited – therefore nothing we have ever said has validity. Only Greens are allowed to have opinions – only Greens have discovered the duplicity.
The villains are massive Green NGOs who are not only funded by the oil industry but also invest their funds in oil, banking etc.
Apart from a cultural shift to species extinction if you don’t put everything in their omniscient hands they’re not going to break with their old climate dooming habit easily-
https://www.msn.com/en-au/news/world/flooding-will-affect-double-the-number-of-people-worldwide-by-2030/ar-BB135K4h
We need to understand it’s pretty hard to go cold turkey so we’ll have to put up with the mythadrone for some time while they kick the habit.
I finished watching Moore’s video ten minutes ago. I thought it was excellent for exposing what people here already knew. Renewable energy is useless and expensive and we would be better off financially and environmentally just sticking to fossil fuels.
It also showed that the whole scam is driven by the greed of hugely wealthy individuals and their corporations while pretending to invest in green initiatives. Hopefully it will be a reality check for the millions of people who have been taken in by the hype.
Sadly, Gibbs and Moore failed to follow the trail right back to its origin. The exaggeration and propaganda about climate change paved the way for, and justified, the whole renewable energy scam. Hopefully the public will join the dots and realise that they have been witnessing delusion on a global scale.
Who red pilled Michael Moore ?
How did Michael Moore produce better and more skeptical documentary than the skeptics ever could ?
Is this The Tipping Point ? or are we living in the Bizarro World ?
I just watched Planet of the Humans.
2/5 maybe.
Not really scientific of course, anecdotal impressions outweighed considered rational analysis with a quantitative aspect.
Yes the central point is correct and important – wind and solar are not going to significantly change CO2 emission.
Despite the millions of green idealists who believe this – they need to be disabused of such illusion, hopefully Moore’s film will just about succeed in this despite its failings.
The biggest problem with the film is that its conclusion was to try to resurrect Paul Ehrlich.
All the Ehrlich falsehoods of infinite consumption of finite resources and exponential growth, make a ghastly zombie return.
“Infinite human consumption on a finite planet spells disaster”.
There was a population control message, potentially more dangerous than any green energy message, however illusory.
Here Moore and Gibbs parted company with the facts.
Check up on Hans Rosling – population is not increasing exponentially, its levelling off and will do so more quickly if economies are not interfered with.
The human race actually passed “peak stuff” a decade ago. Total raw material consumption is no longer increasing globally.
And Mike – please do some research on forestry, trees are not fossil fuels.
THEY REGROW.
The film portrayed all tree cutting as destructive leaving behind only blasted Tolkenian wasteland.
NO – properly managed forestry does not decrease the area of forest or degrade the environment, it’s like a field of wheat. Its harvested, it grows, its harvested again.
Production quality was very poor and amateurish but this was perhaps deliberate.