Gavin Newsom. By Gage Skidmore, CC BY-SA 3.0, link. Lawn mower DuffDudeX1 at English Wikipedia, Public domain, via Wikimedia Commons. Generator, source Wikimedia. Water pump Santeri Viinamäki, CC BY-SA 4.0, via Wikimedia Commons

Net Zero California Governor Just Banned Backup Generators and Fire Pumps

Guest essay by Eric Worrall

California just banned the sale of gasoline powered backup generators, lawn mowers, small gas powered fire fighting pumps, and other small stationary engines, as part of their drive to reduce CO2 emissions.

Newsom signs law to eventually ban gas-powered lawn equipment in California

by: Associated Press
Posted: Oct 10, 2021 / 07:08 AM PDT / Updated: Oct 10, 2021 / 07:08 AM PDT

California will soon ban the sale of new gas-powered leaf blowers and lawn mowers, a move aimed at curbing emissions from a category of small engines on pace to produce more pollution each year than passenger vehicles.

Gov. Gavin Newsom signed a new law on Saturday that orders state regulators to ban the sale of new gas-powered equipment using small off-road engines, a broad category that includes generators, lawn equipment and pressure washers.

The California Air Resources Board has already started working on a rule to do this, a lengthy process scheduled to conclude early next year. But the law Newsom signed on Saturday removes any doubt, ordering the agency to apply the new rule by Jan. 1, 2024, or as soon as regulators determine is “feasible,” whichever date is later.

“Gov. .Newsom signing (this law) really sets a strong course to not only his commitment to transitioning to zero emissions but also to cleaner air and healthier lungs,” said Will Barrett, director of clean air advocacy for the American Lung Association in California.

Read more: https://ktla.com/news/local-news/newsom-signs-law-to-eventually-ban-gas-powered-lawn-equipment-in-california/

A ban on gas powered lawn equipment would just be a serious inconvenience for most people, unless you have a very large lawn.

But the law bans a lot more than that.

AB-1346 Air pollution: small off-road engines.(2021-2022)

An act to add Section 43018.11 to the Health and Safety Code, relating to air pollution.

LEGISLATIVE COUNSEL’S DIGEST

AB 1346, Berman. Air pollution: small off-road engines.Existing law imposes various limitations on the emissions of air contaminants for the control of air pollution from vehicular and nonvehicular sources. Existing law assigns the responsibility for controlling vehicular sources of air pollution to the State Air Resources Board. This bill would require the state board, by July 1, 2022, consistent with federal law, to adopt cost-effective and technologically feasible regulations to prohibit engine exhaust and evaporative emissions from new small off-road engines, as defined by the state board. The bill would require the state board to identify and, to the extent feasible, make available funding for commercial rebates or similar incentive funding as part of any updates to existing applicable funding program guidelines to local air pollution control districts and air quality management districts to implement to support the transition to zero-emission small off-road equipment operations.

Read more: https://leginfo.legislature.ca.gov/faces/billNavClient.xhtml?bill_id=202120220AB1346

The text requires regulators to consider “… (E) Expected availability of zero-emission generators and emergency response equipment. …”, so there is no doubt they plan to cover backup generators and emergency fire fighting equipment if they can.

This is beyond serious. Imagine trying to fight the fire approaching your house, only to have a low battery light start flashing on your fire fighting water pump. Or someone who requires powered medical equipment, like oxygen generators or sleep apnea devices, struggling through an extended power outage without proper treatment for their health condition.

Gasoline powered equipment, barring a mechanical failure, works as long as you can keep it supplied with gasoline. But battery equipment needs power to recharge it. Where do you get more power, if the sky is covered with smoke or clouds, or the solar panels are covered in dust, snow or ash, and the power lines are down?

Obviously it is possible that regulators will embrace sanity on these issues, and provide sensible exceptions – but at this stage an outbreak of common sense is far from guaranteed.

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Derg
October 11, 2021 2:09 pm

Well that should drive out more people from CA…how will people get reliable power if their government keeps effn it up?

Let’s go Brandon

Bryan A
Reply to  Derg
October 11, 2021 2:28 pm

I guess Now so the time for all Old Pull Start mowers, edgers, leaf blowers, air compressors, power washers and weed eaters to be replaced with new pull start versions while you can still get them. And get that Honda Pull State Genny you’ve been salivating over soon too.

The Saint
Reply to  Bryan A
October 11, 2021 8:37 pm

Can’t wait until next years fire season. It should be fun watching California burn to the ground.

Editor
Reply to  The Saint
October 12, 2021 3:37 am

Californians watching their house burn because they cant pump water will hopefully have something meaningful to say when told that climate change did it.

judy
Reply to  The Saint
October 12, 2021 10:01 pm

That is EXACTLY what I posted on Face Book….

Bryan A
Reply to  Bryan A
October 11, 2021 9:34 pm

I wonder if this would apply to small back-up generation for 10hp or less domestic or agricultural well pumps?

roaddog
Reply to  Bryan A
October 12, 2021 12:17 am

If it doesn’t already it will soon. Many of the machines they are outlawing are used in order to survive at times when the electrical grid has failed.(Maybe one will soon be able to purchase an electrically powered backup generator to deploy at times when there is no electricity available.I’m certain that would make sense to someone in California, particularly Sacramento.)

Essentially they are threatening the lives of citizens.

D. J. Hawkins
Reply to  roaddog
October 12, 2021 7:29 am

Patients in hospitals that have diesel backup generators will, I’m sure, rest easy. Or rest in peace.

whatlanguageisthis
Reply to  roaddog
October 12, 2021 8:51 am

Isn’t that kind of like plugging a power strip into itself so you can plug something else into it?

roaddog
Reply to  whatlanguageisthis
October 13, 2021 12:07 am

What part of this would challenge the woke electorate?

David A
Reply to  roaddog
October 13, 2021 4:21 pm

Yet these generators are “on pace” to put out more CO2 then automobiles?
What? ??
That must mean they are planning far more worse blackouts.
Bullets
Gasoline
Diesel
Generators
Tomorrow’s gold

walt
Reply to  Bryan A
October 11, 2021 10:49 pm

The next climate and air quality protection will be ration cards for gasoline purchases.

Michael S. Kelly
Reply to  Bryan A
October 12, 2021 2:23 am

Oh, come on, man! griff can tell you authoritatively that battery-powered electric generators (where a battery-powered motor drives a generator) are already in widespread use in Germany, or somewhere, and are cheaper than even hand-cranked generators. And they’re just around the corner here, too!

Doonman
Reply to  Derg
October 11, 2021 2:37 pm

PG&E turned off power today in 20 counties because it got windy. Welcome to living with third world power distribution system.

Tom Abbott
Reply to  Doonman
October 12, 2021 6:06 am

Sacramento craziness. California Democrat politicians have no clue. They have a single focus: Reducing CO2, and everything else is secondary, including the health and safety of California citizens.

This mass delusion over CO2 is having serious consequences in the real world. And it’s only going to get worse until the whole enterprise crashes and burns, because it is unsustainable. The crashing and burning may not be that far in the future.

I’m sure glad I live in a State that is run by people who live in the real world. It makes things much easier.

TonyG
Reply to  Derg
October 11, 2021 2:59 pm

Well that should drive out more people from CA

If only they could learn from their mistakes and stop electing the same sort of idiots after they move!

Rocketscientist
Reply to  TonyG
October 11, 2021 4:17 pm

“The forest was shrinking but the trees kept voting for the axe, for the axe was clever and convinced the trees that because his handle was made of wood he was one of them.”

James H
Reply to  Rocketscientist
October 12, 2021 11:14 pm

You can’t convince phantom voters of anything, on account of them not actually existing, but they are reliable Democrat votes.

roaddog
Reply to  James H
October 13, 2021 12:10 am

There is not a lot of rancorous political debate in the cemetery.

roaddog
Reply to  Rocketscientist
October 13, 2021 12:10 am

Very nice.

Greg
Reply to  TonyG
October 11, 2021 5:54 pm

The urbanites don’t have back up gennies anyway. Apartment owners don’t need leaf blowers.
Such things are for practically minded rural folks. aka deplorables.

Last edited 13 days ago by Greg
roaddog
Reply to  Greg
October 12, 2021 12:19 am

Many more urban folk have generators than you would think. Since February a lot of Texans have acquired them.

Matthew Bergin
Reply to  Greg
October 12, 2021 6:07 am

I’m an urbanite and I live in a city center and I have 5 generators ranging from 1.2 to 6.5 Kw. I am an Onan generator collector though. 😉😊

James H
Reply to  Greg
October 12, 2021 11:16 pm

When I lived in an apartment, I was woken early by leaf blowers and lawn mowers every week. I guess they’ll have to pay more for someone to use garden shears to cut each blade of grass now.

DrEd
Reply to  TonyG
October 11, 2021 6:09 pm

KEEP THOSE IDIOTS IN CALIFORNIA!! Don’t let them move or breed elsewhere! People get the government they deserve. They elected those fools – let them live with the consequences.

John Endicott
Reply to  DrEd
October 13, 2021 4:45 am

The problem is there are a huge number of people in California (mostly sensible rural folk) who *DID NOT* vote for those idiots. Unfortunately for them their votes were outweighed by all the fools and morons (mostly “woke” city dwellers) who did vote for the idiots.

Fred Middleton
Reply to  TonyG
October 11, 2021 8:45 pm

As with opening any flood gate, bunch of pig crap is flushed also. Parts of Nevada today

Editor
Reply to  TonyG
October 12, 2021 3:41 am

When the ones who learn leave, the ones who don’t learn become a higher percentage of the vote.

Trying to Play Nice
Reply to  TonyG
October 12, 2021 2:55 pm

The recall election left the idiot in charge so they deserve what they get.

James H
Reply to  TonyG
October 12, 2021 11:13 pm

Do you really think they could elect anyone of their choosing? Do you really think Newsom won by a 2:1 margin in the recall? California is the prototype for the rest of the country, one place the machine is honed to guarantee a permanent hold on power (not the electrical kind).

Tyler
Reply to  TonyG
October 24, 2021 12:35 pm

Doesn’t happen Tony, how delusional are you?

TonyG
Reply to  Tyler
October 25, 2021 7:09 am

“If only,” Tyler.

Reply to  Derg
October 11, 2021 3:29 pm

#FJB

stinkerp
Reply to  Joel O'Bryan
October 11, 2021 4:00 pm

#FGN

Greg
Reply to  Joel O'Bryan
October 11, 2021 5:56 pm

Let’s go Brandon !!

Carlo, Monte
Reply to  Derg
October 11, 2021 5:54 pm

This idiot just locked out every lawn service business in the entire state. Wonder how many jobs this was.

I smell class action.

Frank from NoVA
Reply to  Carlo, Monte
October 12, 2021 3:41 am

Hence the need for increased illegal immigration. Our wealthy elites are addicted to cheap lawn service, maids, etc.

Tom Abbott
Reply to  Carlo, Monte
October 12, 2021 6:22 am

Those lawn service guys will just have to learn how to use a motorless pushmower. They work pretty good on short grass. I used to use one when I was a kid mowing the neighbors lawns for fun and profit.

I have a pushmower in my shed right now, although I haven’t used it in years. And it will cut the lawn good as long as you don’t let the grass grow too long before you start. It’s a real chore pushing it through tall grass.

I have switched over to battery-operated yard equipment for the most part. Leaf blowers and hedge trimmers and chain saws, and they work great. I have an electric pushmower (actually, it pushes itself) that my dad uses, and is very convenient for him. And I would have an interest in getting a battery-powered riding lawnmower in the future.

But cutting off the use of emergency equipment just because they use fossil fuels, as California is proposing to do, is just crazy. Battery-operated emergency equipment is not fit for the purpose.

Carlo, Monte
Reply to  Tom Abbott
October 12, 2021 12:40 pm

Using push mowers on golf courses will require an army of immigrants with questionable credentials.

Tom Abbott
Reply to  Carlo, Monte
October 13, 2021 4:24 am

We seem to be acquiring quite an army of immigrants coming across the U.S. southern border. We need to send all of them to California. There are still plenty of streets in California that don’t have tents pitched on them. There’s lots of room for more homeless, penniless people in California.

John Endicott
Reply to  Tom Abbott
October 13, 2021 4:47 am

yes, but try finding street space that isn’t already occupied by needles and feces in which to pitch those tents. 😉

D. J. Hawkins
Reply to  Carlo, Monte
October 12, 2021 7:31 am

Good luck with a class action. CARB has emerged victorious in nearly every legal challenge it has faced.

jtom
Reply to  Derg
October 11, 2021 6:51 pm

If the rest of the nation is lucky, Newsom will realize his tax base is escaping, and ban fossil-fueled moving vans.

Harry Passfield
Reply to  Derg
October 12, 2021 11:11 am

Just think: LGBGT – Let’s Go Brandon, Get Trump! (which would be a good thng)/

October 11, 2021 2:10 pm

The failure to remove California’s special exemption from nationwide standards on pollution are showing the expected result. CARB has been staffed with True Believers for a very long time, and are, with the complicity of liability lawyers, the major reason why gas cans are so dangerously awkward.
Probably, the only cure would be national standards, and disestablish CARB.

ResourceGuy
Reply to  Tom Halla
October 11, 2021 2:27 pm

Yes, these are dangerous gas can filler tubes that spill a lot of fuel on the ground and all over. I saved a few old filler tubes that work better and don’t pollute like the new ones. No thank you EPA–maybe next time watch what it does to actual consumers.

otsar
Reply to  ResourceGuy
October 11, 2021 2:53 pm

I would not beat all surprised if a friend of a friend or a relative of a relative is making a profit from these filler tubes.

Rick
Reply to  ResourceGuy
October 11, 2021 4:04 pm

Fyi you can buy replacement tubes. I got several off Amazon. No funny buttons or switches, just an open tube and a screw on cap like the old days.

Frank from NoVA
Reply to  ResourceGuy
October 12, 2021 4:05 am

Ha! Get your hands on one of those “easy pour” spout kits. Not available in all states, of course, but worth acquiring elsewhere if the opportunity arises.

Polski
Reply to  Frank from NoVA
October 12, 2021 3:03 pm

I’ve had “No spill Jill” gas cans at my golf course for many years. I don’t know many superintendents that don’t use them. Can’t buy the spout separately since they don’t fit generic cans but not too expensive and you will smile every time you use it.

Ray
Reply to  ResourceGuy
October 12, 2021 7:38 pm

The CARB sanctioned gurgle cans were problematic for filling my snowmobiles. It would take 10 minutes to empty a can. It takes two cans to fill a tank, and filling two snowmobiles made it a 40 minute chore in 10ºF weather. My answer was a one gallon funnel with a roughly 1″ diameter spout. I’d unscrew the gas can top and pour the whole 5 gallon can into the tank in under 30 seconds. For lawn equipment I use a stick style gas transfer pump. Either way is less dangerous and less polluting than the absurd CARB gurgle can spouts.

Doonman
Reply to  Tom Halla
October 11, 2021 2:45 pm

The cure is to leave California and buy nice indoor weather in other states. Since all California elections are decided by the 4 largest southern counties of Los Angeles, San Diego, Orange and Riverside, the other 54 counties voters can stay home and never vote as they cannot change the outcome anyway. Welcome to California, home to one party politics.

Last edited 14 days ago by Doonman
Roger
Reply to  Doonman
October 11, 2021 4:39 pm

Santa Barbara is crawling with Teslas with Biden stickers…would it be possible they don’t know their gardeners are using-gasp!- GASOLINE leaf blowers? Does France (70% nuclear zero CO2) have these problems?

Reply to  Doonman
October 11, 2021 6:37 pm

The cure is to split California into 2- 4 states.

jtom
Reply to  Tom Konerman
October 11, 2021 6:55 pm

The cure is to give them their independence before they must go on life support.

Kevin
Reply to  Doonman
October 11, 2021 8:12 pm

Newsom is punishing those that voted for him to be recalled.

BTW, more Riverside Co. residents voted for him to be recalled than those that didn’t want him recalled. I was a very small margin though.

https://electionresults.sos.ca.gov/returns/governor-recall/county/riverside

otsar
Reply to  Tom Halla
October 11, 2021 2:46 pm

You left out the true believersycophant fake Phd.that gave the politically correct answers desired by CARB. Last word is that he is still at CARB.

Reply to  otsar
October 11, 2021 2:57 pm

CARB was notorious for setting volatile organic compound limits in the Los Angeles basin at a rate that was exceeded by natural emissions from trees and brush. If you can smell a plant, it emits VOCs.

Gregg Eshelman
Reply to  Tom Halla
October 12, 2021 1:40 am

CARB invented an evaporative emissions test specifically designed to fail all vehicles with carburetors. It’s called the SHED test. Put the vehicle in a sealed building, lower the air pressure inside a few PSI then sample the air for gasoline vapor.

MarkW
October 11, 2021 2:10 pm

 Or someone who requires powered medical equipment, like oxygen generators or sleep apnea devices, struggling through an extended power outage without proper treatment for their health condition.

It’s part of their plan to cut down on medicare and SS costs.

ironargonaut
October 11, 2021 2:13 pm

Does this cover ATVs?

Last edited 14 days ago by ironargonaut
TonyG
Reply to  ironargonaut
October 11, 2021 3:10 pm

It says “small off-road engines” and “vehicular” so I would expect that it does cover ATVs.

lee riffee
Reply to  ironargonaut
October 11, 2021 3:11 pm

Based on what I read in a LA Times article from another source, apparently not….ATVs, snow mobiles, dirt bikes, jet skis, etc, are exempted. Apparently leisure equipment is OK when it comes to pollution but not actual tools that are necessary!

jimH in CA
Reply to  lee riffee
October 11, 2021 4:43 pm

check the CA ARB definition…
https://ww2.arb.ca.gov/our-work/programs/small-off-road-engines-sore/about

It looks like anything with an engine of 25 HP or less will be banned.
…’including lawn and garden, industrial, logging, airport ground support, and commercial utility equipment, golf carts, and specialty vehicles.’

MikeH
Reply to  jimH in CA
October 11, 2021 5:16 pm

How much do you want to bet that the ICE generator providing backup for the Governor’s mansion is 26HP or greater?

MikeH

MAL
Reply to  jimH in CA
October 11, 2021 10:08 pm

logging” you think the fires are big now, explain to me how are you to thin the forest when you cannot use a gas power chain saw, even better how are you to cut a fire break with a battery power chain saw. What a maroon.

Rick C
Reply to  MAL
October 12, 2021 8:08 am

You’ll just need one of those soon to be designed battery powered chain saws. The battery of course weighs 50 lbs and a charge is enough to make 4 complete cuts through an 18 inch log, so you’ll want to carry along a few extra charged batteries.

AGW is Not Science
Reply to  jimH in CA
October 12, 2021 6:50 am

Easy solution – make 30hp equipment. More power! Urghh! Urghh! Urghh!

Carlo, Monte
Reply to  AGW is Not Science
October 12, 2021 12:43 pm

= 23kW!!

Clyde Spencer
Reply to  lee riffee
October 11, 2021 5:02 pm

Chain saws are a pretty important tool when it comes to fighting fires.

Carlo, Monte
Reply to  Clyde Spencer
October 11, 2021 5:56 pm

Electric chain saws—now here’s great idea that will never work.

ozspeaksup
Reply to  Carlo, Monte
October 12, 2021 3:39 am

they do work and are lighter for older men and for women
but
you cant cut much wood for very long
and theyre 2 to 3x the cost

Tom Abbott
Reply to  ozspeaksup
October 12, 2021 8:06 am

Battery-powered chain saws work very well for an individual person. You can buy extra batteries, if you can’t wait for one to recharge.

I don’t think they are appropriate for fighting forest fires, though.

TonyG
Reply to  Tom Abbott
October 12, 2021 9:58 am

Battery powered chain saws, I agree. However in defense of battery-powered tools, they have come a long way. Our new batter-powered extrication tools do a great job, and are much easier to use and faster to deploy than the old gas-powered hydraulic ones. I have been quite impressed with their power, too – absolutely comparable to the old ones.

Again: it’s about fitness for purpose. Extrication tools are needed quickly and for relatively short periods (you DO NOT spend hours doing extrication). Chainsaws can be needed for extended periods, so batteries don’t make sense there.

Tom Abbott
Reply to  TonyG
October 13, 2021 4:27 am

I saw an electric-powered backhoe and a tractor being advertised the other day.

Pamela Matlack-Klein
Reply to  ozspeaksup
October 13, 2021 9:38 am

I have two chain saws I use in the garden. One is electric and plugs in to a drop cord. I used it to cut down two large nut trees that were shading the yard and not producing. The other is a battery-powered saw with a short bar, great for pruning branches too large for loppers. In the States I used Stihl gasoline-powered chain saws, heavy brutes and noisy but they sure chewed up the firewood. My last one was small and light, especially selected for me by the dealer.

Last edited 12 days ago by Pamela Matlack-Klein
DrEd
Reply to  Clyde Spencer
October 11, 2021 6:16 pm

Just drag a long extension cord for your fire-fighting chainsaw from your electric fire fighting vehicle.

Pamela Matlack-Klein
Reply to  DrEd
October 13, 2021 9:44 am

Yeah, that should work great!

Mike Dubrasich
Reply to  Clyde Spencer
October 11, 2021 10:04 pm

Not just firefighting. Chainsaws turn trees into logs which become boards which become houses. Skidders, loaders, log trucks, and scads of mill equipment, more trucks, forklifts, and more trucks are needed to get the lumber to the building site before the house is even erected. Most folks don’t live in mud huts any more.

I took stock today: I have 7 small engines: riding mower, small tractor, 2 chainsaws, a generator, a rototiller, and a cultivator. My neighbors have more than me, including outboard motors. I don’t own a boat or ATV. Judge me if you must. You can bet the bull goose loony warmunists will. The Green Stasi are restless.

roaddog
Reply to  Clyde Spencer
October 12, 2021 12:22 am

Time to let it burn.

jimH in CA
Reply to  ironargonaut
October 11, 2021 4:39 pm

If you read the CA ARB definition of a ‘small engine’, you’ll find that it’s 19kW or less…that a 25 HP engine, so goodby to a lot of off-road vehicles.
https://ww2.arb.ca.gov/our-work/programs/small-off-road-engines-sore/about

The smart manufacturers will just change the engines to 26 HP or more….which will burn more fuel and ‘pollute’ more, assuming that CO2 the other emissions really are a problem…not.!

Pamela Matlack-Klein
October 11, 2021 2:14 pm

Well, Newsome escaped the recall and now feels invincible. He is going to keep on charging down this foolish road to the destruction of California. I wonder how his good buddies in the movie business will feel about being “Green” when they don’t have any electricity at the studios. Eventually, this insane net zero stupidity will start impacting even the elites and celebrities….

ResourceGuy
Reply to  Pamela Matlack-Klein
October 11, 2021 2:23 pm

And with the Chinese movie investor and Chinese moviegoer market angle not working out for them

DrEd
Reply to  Pamela Matlack-Klein
October 11, 2021 6:17 pm

They kept Newsome in. Let those fools suffer the consequences.

Pamela Matlack-Klein
Reply to  DrEd
October 12, 2021 1:17 am

Agreed!

hermanmerivale
October 11, 2021 2:17 pm

I don’t want to hijack the comments. I’ve just received this statement on another website and am wondering whether anyone can point me in the direction of confirmation/non confirmation.

“In fact a wind turbine in a good location will produce the same amount of energy as was used to create it in only a few years.”

I don’t think this is true, but maybe?

Last edited 14 days ago by hermanmerivale
4E Douglas
Reply to  hermanmerivale
October 11, 2021 2:25 pm

Before it fails?

hermanmerivale
Reply to  4E Douglas
October 11, 2021 2:29 pm

Looking for actual figures, so that I can confirm/refute the statement, as the commenter hasn’t actually done so. But yes, before it fails.

MAL
Reply to  hermanmerivale
October 11, 2021 10:11 pm

Recovery 2 buck of energy for every buck spent is not sustainable. Do these maroons not understand this.

PaulH
Reply to  hermanmerivale
October 11, 2021 2:31 pm

Are wind turbine factories powered by wind turbines?

Timo, Not That One
Reply to  PaulH
October 12, 2021 12:49 pm

“Are wind turbine factories powered by wind turbines?”
Sure, but it will take 20 years to make all the wind turbines, so by then the entire production will be needed to replace the oldest turbines as they fail.
Then they can continue this way forever. it’s the perfect government run business. Just like in Yes Minister. The hospital with no doctors, nurses or patients.

They won the Florence Nightingale Award for the most hygienic hospital in the UK.

Derg
Reply to  hermanmerivale
October 11, 2021 3:12 pm

Producing the same is not the same. If you need power at 3 pm but the wind does blow, then where does the power come from?

Trying to Play Nice
Reply to  Derg
October 12, 2021 3:00 pm

That’s why you need a 3-shift operation.

Dave
Reply to  Derg
October 12, 2021 4:45 pm

Gather a small army of ‘undocumented workers’ and have them pedal stationary bikes connected to the windmill. Should produce about as much power as when the blades are moving, plus it gives the ‘undocumented workers’ something productive to do.

Reply to  hermanmerivale
October 11, 2021 3:31 pm

The obvious problem now for the RE scam is all the “good locations” have been used up.

hermanmerivale
Reply to  Joel O'Bryan
October 11, 2021 3:48 pm

None of these are actually answers. How much energy goes into the production of an average wind turbine (including foundations etc)? How much energy does the turbine produce (on average)? I can’t find any info from the turbine manufacturers, which is not surprising. I can do the rest, with enough googling/duckduckgoing. I just wondered if anyone had this info to hand.

Carlo, Monte
Reply to  hermanmerivale
October 11, 2021 5:59 pm

There are studies available, can’t point to one r/n.

Kevin kilty
Reply to  hermanmerivale
October 11, 2021 8:16 pm

I can’t point to a study immediately, but just take primary energy to produce the concrete and steel, nothing more than that, assume a 25% capacity factor and you have one year to pay back the energy needed to produce the steel and concrete.

Someone told you, a few years? Include all the other materials involved, plus transportation and construction, and yes 2-3 years sounds about right. No power plant can be dedicated to just returning its embedded energy however. It has to also perform its primary function and pay for its O&M…eventually it even has to pay its own subsidies.

roaddog
Reply to  Kevin kilty
October 12, 2021 12:25 am

Not if it has sufficient artificial external subsidies.

Kevin kilty
Reply to  roaddog
October 12, 2021 6:17 am

tongue was in cheek…

hermanmerivale
Reply to  Kevin kilty
October 13, 2021 1:03 pm

Thanks

dan delong
Reply to  hermanmerivale
October 11, 2021 10:09 pm

Here’s a link to an organization that appears to go down several levels to get life cycle costs of various forms of electricity generation. YMMV
https://www.world-nuclear.org/information-library/energy-and-the-environment/energy-return-on-investment.aspx

hermanmerivale
Reply to  dan delong
October 13, 2021 1:08 pm

This looks good. I think i’ll be eating a bit of humble pie, but thats alright

ozspeaksup
Reply to  hermanmerivale
October 12, 2021 3:42 am

remember reading some fairly hefty facts and figures right here on WUWT on wind n solar etc
look in the search function

TonyG
Reply to  hermanmerivale
October 12, 2021 7:21 am

Herman, best I can suggest is to go through WUWT over the past few months, I’m pretty sure I recall seeing it discussed. Sorry I can’t be more help.

stinkerp
Reply to  hermanmerivale
October 11, 2021 4:12 pm

So what? It’s a nonsensical statement. It’s true for every power plant.

Before chasing down the rabbit hole for minutiae on power generation paying back energy used to build the power plant, ask why this even matters. Consider this true statement:

In fact a (natural gas, coal fired, nuclear, solar, wind, hydro, geothermal) power plant will produce the same amount of energy as was used to create it in a few years.

Once again, so what?

Last edited 13 days ago by stinkerp
HotScot
Reply to  stinkerp
October 11, 2021 5:11 pm

It’s not true for every power plant. Most FF powered power plants produce an excess of electricity to power both electricity for the population it serves, as well as provide for it’s own replication.

This is only possible with high density energy sources like coal/gas/nuclear etc. with a reliable, constant output over a 50 year life.

Wind turbines can’t produce enough energy to replicate themselves whilst undertaking their primary function, to provide for the grid, and they are lousy at that at the best of times.

It really is hilarious that the renewables cults all make their individual claims on the electricity provided by turbines/solar etc. to satisfy their pet desires, but when you add all these claims up each turbine would have to produce multiples of it’s nameplate output, whilst operating at around 30% of that.

Gary Pearse
Reply to  stinkerp
October 11, 2021 7:58 pm

Stupid remark. Logically ask yourself. If what you say is true, where did the energy come from to build the fossil fuels plants if there is none left over to serve customers! If you ask it about windmills, the answer is the energy to make them was from fossil fuels, plants that last for fifty years compared to WM lasting 15 yrs equivalent since their output declines to half by the time they are decommissioned.

Also did you know that WM use a lot of FF plant energy for back up – that’s part of the proper accounting.

Now I know I shouldn’t take it out on you, because all your wokey betters don’t get it either. Please take this as a free education. Next time, up your game and have a real take of your own when you come to the world’s most highly awarded science site.

roaddog
Reply to  Gary Pearse
October 12, 2021 12:28 am

Realistically there is no such thing as a wind farm. There are, however, gas-fired power plants with wind turbine landscaping.

AGW is Not Science
Reply to  roaddog
October 12, 2021 6:55 am

There ARE “mandate, subsidy and tax credit farms” that happen to be festooned with windmills though. Ditto for “solar farms.”

MarkW
Reply to  stinkerp
October 12, 2021 7:20 am

If it was true for every power plant, then the output of all existing power plants would be dedicated to the creation of new power plants and nothing else.

HotScot
Reply to  hermanmerivale
October 11, 2021 4:59 pm

If a wind turbine is producing enough energy to replicate itself (perpetual motion notwithstanding) then it’s not producing electricity to do anything else.

Think about it.

Carlo, Monte
Reply to  hermanmerivale
October 11, 2021 5:58 pm

No. Coal is necessary to refine and forge the copious amounts of steel.

DrEd
Reply to  Carlo, Monte
October 11, 2021 6:23 pm

And fuel is required to produce the 25+ trucks of concrete for each turbine, plus the transportation and ground prep for each turbine.

Jim G.
Reply to  hermanmerivale
October 12, 2021 2:47 am

Just take the cost of the windmill, the energy to build it is buried in the material costs for each component. Electrical costs for the facility are often included as an “overhead” expense.
Manufacturers don’t sell at a loss.

With subsidies geared toward the point of use, such as rebates, manufacturers can charge more for the product.

On the bright side, power generated from wind speed changes is a function of speed^3.
So small increases in wind speed results in bigger increases of power.
a 25% increase in windspeed almost doubles power output. (1.95 increase)

Andy H
Reply to  hermanmerivale
October 12, 2021 5:26 am

Does that include the people who are paid to build and maintain it? Because they have a CO2 impact. At 84 trillion $ GDP and 35 Billion barrels of oil used every year you get 1 barrel of oil for $2400 of GDP. So the man paid $48000 to assemble the turbines will consume roughly 20 barrels of oil a year.

John Bell
October 11, 2021 2:19 pm

Lots of dangerous unintended consequences, par for their course.

sendergreen
October 11, 2021 2:20 pm

By fair, or by foul, Newsome survived the recall effort. Californians will pay the price of having an emboldened extremist in power for at least the next 13 months. Some were packing to leave California the night of the recall failure. More will make that choice with every new edict.

Last edited 14 days ago by sendergreen
SxyxS
Reply to  sendergreen
October 11, 2021 3:20 pm

Thanks to progressives like Newsome i start to realise how liberal H!tler was.

Now i no longer wonder why Stalin and Mao were able to kill more people in a single country (their own) while H!tler had to set the world on fire to achieve a fraction of the commie bodycount.
(and it seems that doing good and moral supremacy have become the main MO for organizedpsychopaths, or maybe it has been always that way and i was just too slow to get it)

Carlo, Monte
Reply to  SxyxS
October 11, 2021 6:01 pm

And remember that Uncle Ado1f was also a socialist, the usual “right wing” tag is erroneous.

MAL
Reply to  SxyxS
October 11, 2021 10:15 pm

I think Hitler as an Austrian in the end did do what he set up to do, that was to destroy Germany.

bigoilbob
Reply to  sendergreen
October 11, 2021 3:29 pm

By fair, or by foul, Newsome survived the recall effort.”

Would you plz expand on the “by foul”? Seeing as to how it was ~2/1, and there’s NO evidence of it, that’s a lot of “foul”. Will this become the normal chant whenever you lose? Silly ?. Apparently it already has.

“Some were packing to leave California the night of the recall failure.”

bb. Those leaving take with them are about half as likely to have an earned BS or higher degrees than those arriving. Thx for the bright sizing, Texas. The leavers can all buy McManses next to smoldering fertilizer factories, in the carcinogenic corridor. And then freeze when ERCOT fails to gird up it’s natural gas to electric infrastructure, and hook up with their neighbors…..

Reply to  bigoilbob
October 11, 2021 3:44 pm

re: “And then freeze when ERCOT fails to gird up it’s natural gas to electric infrastructure, and hook up with their neighbors”

Look in the mirror, Blob; States to the east of Texas had issues too. Such shortsighted comments are NOT what I expect of posters to this site …

bigoilbob
Reply to  _Jim
October 11, 2021 4:13 pm

Look in the mirror, Blob; States to the east of Texas had issues too.”

Uh, you mean the states with relatively little wind power? Ok.

Yes, the grid must be girded up for these (formerly) parts/ten thousand events. But another big hitter for all is to harden the natural gas to electricity infrastructure for extreme weather, and to firm up our antique natural gas storage. More volume, more deliverability. The hated Gavin Newsom (the 2/1 no recall guy) is doing just that in Cal….

observa
Reply to  bigoilbob
October 12, 2021 7:47 am

another big hitter for all is to harden the natural gas to electricity infrastructure for extreme weather, and to firm up our antique natural gas storage. More volume, more deliverability.

Why would they when the brains trust want to get rid of gas altogether? Haven’t you heard of all the climate changers wanting boycotts of financiers investing in fossil fuels? It’s working but according to them the climate is getting worse. That’s watermelon logic for you.

bigoilbob
Reply to  observa
October 12, 2021 8:08 am

Why would they when the brains trust want to get rid of gas altogether?”

Name 1 who does, immediately. Gas is the ideal bridge fuel, and I agree that any climate changers boycotting it, produced under best practices, for that use, are misguided. Now, who are they? Not rhetorical, who?

The complaint is against biz as usual, with the fossil fuelers unloading most of their external costs (environmental, safety, health, AGW, asset retirement) onto the rest of us. Interesting how the self proclaimed capitalists whine when they are subject to it’s essence – the price information that can only come from making those who produce costs pay for them, and then pass them along.

And if you want to similarly charge the renewablers, and make them give up their (relatively tiny) start up helps, OTay by me. Let’s rock…

John Endicott
Reply to  _Jim
October 13, 2021 5:01 am

While it might not be what you expect from posters to this site, it unfortunately is what you can expect from trolls like the bigoldboob.

MarkW
Reply to  bigoilbob
October 11, 2021 4:47 pm

There was that felon who was found asleep in his car, being kept company by over 300 mail in ballots.

But of course, you have it on good authority that he was the only one

bigoilbob
Reply to  MarkW
October 11, 2021 5:59 pm

A little conspiracy rumor control.

https://laist.com/news/politics/recall-fact-and-fiction-what-you-need-to-know-about-the-election-fraud-rumors-youre-seeing

FYI, we could find other such instances together. They:

  1. Represent an infinitesimal fraction of valid votes cast.
  2. Are uniformly not enough to throw any one election.
  3. Are disproportionately Repub attempts at voter fraud.
MarkW
Reply to  bigoilbob
October 11, 2021 6:34 pm

It really is sad the way Bob actually believes that it is easy to show election fraud. Then again, he’s used to seeing things that aren’t there.

MAL
Reply to  bigoilbob
October 11, 2021 10:17 pm

Excuse me the election was throw on 40,000 votes. That the case in most Presidential election, only maroons do not understand this. That the big secret the Dimm want to hide, someones drank the coolaid.

bigoilbob
Reply to  MAL
October 12, 2021 8:10 am

You should be an advocate for the true margin. Over 6MM votes. It’s actually a smaller margin than what prevailed in the EC.

John Endicott
Reply to  bigoilbob
October 13, 2021 5:08 am

You recognize the existence of the EC, yet think it’s total popular vote that counts (your 6MM vote margin). Doesn’t matter what the margin on the total popular vote is, that’s not how the election process works in this republic. Those votes need to be in the right places. Every single voter in California could have voted for the Dem candidate but if every other state in the nation narrowly chose the Republican, that margin (in the 10s of millions) would mean diddly. (or switch the scenario with every Texan and Republicans with every other state and Dems). This is civics 101 stuff. For all the waffling you did about educational degrees earlier, it seems you never passed high school level civics.

bigoilbob
Reply to  John Endicott
October 13, 2021 5:37 am

Doesn’t matter what the margin on the total popular vote is, that’s not how the election process works in this republic.”

And therein les the problem. A scheme designed to enable the continuation of slavery has endured, under the bogus guise that it is better because we are a “republic”. There is NO reason for some voters votes to count more than others.

The rest of your post does a pretty good job of making my point…

John Endicott
Reply to  bigoilbob
October 14, 2021 4:31 am

Me: “This is civics 101 stuff. For all the waffling you did about educational degrees earlier, it seems you never passed high school level civics.”

Your reply: The rest of your post does a pretty good job of making my point

Glad you can admit to your failures in high school level education. Admitting your failures it the first step to improving yourself.

Matthew Bergin
Reply to  bigoilbob
October 12, 2021 6:22 am

The fact that it was possible to see if the ballot was marked for recall or not through the punched holes in the envelope is definitely an “FOUL” issue. That also explains why the recall failed. It is not how you vote it is who “counts” the vote.😞

MarkW
Reply to  Matthew Bergin
October 12, 2021 7:22 am

I can’t help but wonder how many votes for recall, failed to be delivered by the members of the postal union.

TonyG
Reply to  bigoilbob
October 12, 2021 7:19 am

Happy to get rid of all those dumb bumpkins, right Bob? Your comment says a lot about you, but nothing surprising.

Carlo, Monte
Reply to  TonyG
October 12, 2021 12:48 pm

BOB is definitely a fly-over country snob.

jrchips
October 11, 2021 2:20 pm

The first big, extended power outage (by fire, earthquake or low generation by renewables) will demonstrate the absolute foolishness of such a blanket edict. In the meantime, the impact on construction, landscape management, etc., etc. will create a lot of very upset citizens.

ResourceGuy
October 11, 2021 2:22 pm

It’s about time to set up aid stations for fleeing Californians along major highways near the border. (Carbon) Grapes of Wrath II does not need to come with the meanness of the first one. I just hope there is not a fuel crisis at the time or a blanket shortage caused by the government program for when “children won’t know what snow is”.

TonyG
Reply to  ResourceGuy
October 11, 2021 3:12 pm

RG as long as those aid stations include voting guides…

Gary Pearse
Reply to  ResourceGuy
October 11, 2021 3:24 pm

The migrants to California in the 1930s were called OKies whether you were from Oklahoma or not. I hope the Calexit crowd don’t get called Wokies. Who is voting for this moron? Probably dominion

Tom Abbott
Reply to  Gary Pearse
October 12, 2021 8:21 am

“Wokies”

That’s funny!

I heard a report the other day saying most of those leaving California are Republicans. I don’t know if that’s true or not, but it makes sense.

bigoilbob
October 11, 2021 2:23 pm

I doubt that the ban on gas powered fire fighting equipment will stay in the law.

Mr.
Reply to  bigoilbob
October 11, 2021 2:51 pm

I lived in a remote bushfire zone property for many years.

No law would have stopped me from owning & operating the 4 gasoline & diesel fueled fire pumps and generators I relied upon for my family’s survival when nature’s wrath bore down on us.

And I’d have my vermin control farm tools (12-gauge, .410, .22) loaded & ready to use without hesitation on any government ‘regulator’ who came around to deprive me of my gas-powered self-survival equipment.

Scissor
Reply to  Mr.
October 11, 2021 3:11 pm

And gas powered leaf blowers work great for sending pepper spray back from whence it came.

Mr.
Reply to  Scissor
October 11, 2021 3:26 pm

I gave up on leaf blowers.

Wherever I blew he leaves to, the very capricious and mischievous wind would just blow it right back to where I started.

Wasted a hour of time and half a gallon of gas every time.

I found it was better exercise and more productive to just rake the little bastards up and burn ’em.

Reply to  Mr.
October 11, 2021 3:51 pm

Every fall I lived in Massachusetts I participated in the Share the Leaves” program with neighbors. That ran until November came and soon to be snow put an end to sharing, so I raked. Never used a blower. My blower was a 5 hp snow blower.

H.R.
Reply to  Mr.
October 11, 2021 5:12 pm

Hey, Mr.

Try it again on a calm day, or if there’s a breeze, blow the leaves with the wind.

When the pile gets to a certain size, yes, it’s time to put down the leaf blower and grab the rake.

💡Or…… wait until all the leaves are down, skip the raking altogether, and set all the leaves on fire. (Your lawn will come back OK next Spring… probably… maybe.)
😜

Tom Abbott
Reply to  H.R.
October 12, 2021 8:29 am

I have lots of oak trees and lots of leaves in some places, and I use a leaf blower to form the leaves into big piles (on a windless day), and then I use a lawnmower and run over the leaves and chop them up into mulch. They reduce down pretty good.

Fire works good, too, but you have to be careful. And wet leaves put out a lot of smoke. Your local fire department might be paying you a visit to see what the smoke is all about.

Around here, the county fire department requests that they be notified of any burning you do such as brush piles or leaves, and then if they get a call about smoke in that area, they will know what is going on.

Last edited 13 days ago by Tom Abbott
otsar
Reply to  Mr.
October 11, 2021 3:15 pm

That reminds me. I have to fill the tank and some jerry cans for my rolling coal portable fire pump.

Derg
Reply to  bigoilbob
October 11, 2021 3:14 pm

You might be right, but what idiot would propose it in the first place?

bigoilbob
Reply to  Derg
October 11, 2021 4:27 pm

Every major manufacturer now offers e ATV’s.

https://www.drrusa.com/adult-electric-atvs-utvs

Many brands of battery/inverter/solar units. Name me an appliance, and it has been successfully batteryfied.

More to the point, I think if you want to “live the dream” and pioneer, pioneer. Why should city mice subsidize much of the costs of utilifying country mice, and saving their ***es when they catch fire.? All the utilities get are headaches and lawsuits when a piece of equipment sparks a fire, and much of our suppression $ and manpower – and casualties – is targeted to helping out those “rugged individualists”.. If these gentry folk – neo or settled – want to be amongst their like, let them. On their own dime, and without their outsized carbon footprints adding to our well dispersed man made [CO2] additions.

jimH in CA
Reply to  bigoilbob
October 11, 2021 5:04 pm

But the ban is for 19kW and smaller engines…that’s 25HP.
I doubt that there are 20kW e-atvs , or even 10kW.!

Derg
Reply to  bigoilbob
October 11, 2021 5:34 pm

Why are you in favor limiting people’s choices?

bigoilbob
Reply to  Derg
October 11, 2021 6:07 pm

Why do you want for me to subsidize your polluting, AGW causing, carbon emissions? Why do you want city folks to subsidize the isolationist dreams of “pioneers”? Yes, both rhetorical. Because of your inherited sense of entitlement, and whiny grievance.

Actually, lose the laws and just go with an adequate, fully, regularly, equitably rebated carbon tax. Use the proceeds first to pay off the CCS projects, now scheduled to be paid out of increased debt/deficits. If you want to start with a tax equal to the $/ton now to go to the CCS honeypotters, why not.

Derg
Reply to  bigoilbob
October 11, 2021 6:29 pm

You are a sick anti human …shame on you

Last edited 13 days ago by Derg
MarkW
Reply to  bigoilbob
October 11, 2021 6:36 pm

Since CO2 is good for the environment, it should be subsidized. To bad it isn’t. ON the other hand, Bob demands that other people be forced to pay for all the stuff he wants.
Typical socialist.

Mr.
Reply to  bigoilbob
October 11, 2021 7:10 pm

Is there a perpetual full moon in your area, BoB?

lee riffee
Reply to  bigoilbob
October 11, 2021 8:20 pm

City folks?!? Wow, do you have any idea where city folks get their food? That’s right…the grocery store. NOT! Your disdain of rural people includes farmers…people who feed you city folk!

ihfan
Reply to  bigoilbob
October 11, 2021 9:59 pm

Why do you want city folks to subsidize the isolationist dreams of “pioneers”?

Perhaps the “pioneers” should stop sending electricity, water, and food to the “city folks”. The “pioneers” should also stop accepting the polluted water and solid waste as well from the “city folks”.

MAL
Reply to  bigoilbob
October 11, 2021 10:22 pm

All carbon atoms in your body come from CO2. Now explain to me why you hate yourself or do you think you body did not come from CO2. If not are you silicon based if you are forest first are still a problem since silicon will melt in the temperature created by forest fires.

aussiecol
Reply to  bigoilbob
October 11, 2021 7:09 pm

”Name me an appliance, and it has been successfully batteryfied.”

Lol. I know there are electric chainsaws, But how many batteries would you need to run the equivalent of a stihl 066 with a 36inch bar all day in the bush. A valuable item in bushfires. I doubt a battery would even run one.

MAL
Reply to  aussiecol
October 11, 2021 10:27 pm

Even if it could in the end the batteries to keep it running in the end. Their production would dwarf the CO2 it took to produce them in the CO2 gas would produce in an ICE chain saw over its lifetime.

Matthew Bergin
Reply to  aussiecol
October 12, 2021 6:28 am

Think how heavy the Chainsaw would be with a big ass battery hanging off the back of the saw. 🙄👎

Gunga Din
Reply to  bigoilbob
October 11, 2021 4:36 pm

Because it’s foolish?
Since when has that stopped the fools?

MarkW
Reply to  bigoilbob
October 11, 2021 4:48 pm

Only a total moron would have put it in, in the first place.

John Endicott
Reply to  MarkW
October 13, 2021 5:15 am

Who is the bigger moron, I wonder? The moron who put it in in the first place, or the moron who defends it? In the bigoldboob’s case, it’s definitely the later.

2hotel9
October 11, 2021 2:24 pm

Good! Let them sit in the dark and burn, f**king idiots voted for this and they f**king deserve it.

1Vote 1Day

Last edited 14 days ago by 2hotel9
RPercifield
October 11, 2021 2:32 pm

So, maybe since the Communist California has banned generators and other ICE type products, we can finally in the rest of the more normal USA get rid of the worthless CARB requirements forced onto us by these idiots. This would be a win win for us, cheaper products due to less stupidity, and only one version to be built increasing the economy of scale. One can only hope.

AGW is Not Science
Reply to  RPercifield
October 12, 2021 7:05 am

Unfortunately, other states have adopted the CARB standards lunacy as well, so the cancer has already metastasized.

Doonman
October 11, 2021 2:33 pm

Hey, the recall against Newsom failed because public employee union SEIU and Netflix Billionaire CEO Reed Hastings spent millions blaming it on the Republican Trumpers. So California gets whats coming to them.

Remember when Newsom ran for governor and promised everyone he would ban capital punishment, ban small gasoline motors and turn criminals loose? Yeah, I don’t either. So it’s no wonder California lost congressional representation due to people and businesses streaming out of the state.

ResourceGuy
October 11, 2021 2:33 pm

I’ve got a feeble electric mower that was only used a few times before realizing it was not workable in thick lawns. It was from a steeply discounted, no-returns sale at Home Depot, but I’ll let you have it in California for only $1,000 including a lithium battery and charger. If nothing else you may want the large battery as backup for when the power goes out and the fires return.

stinkerp
Reply to  ResourceGuy
October 11, 2021 4:18 pm

The battery can also serve as a source of heat when it catches on fire. A lot of heat. Twofer.

mark from the midwest
October 11, 2021 2:34 pm

This is the end of the beginning of the end for California. The end has arrived. I suspect Honda will relocate all their remaining facilities to Texas and Utah, and without backup generators the blackouts will become completely intolerable for huge number of people.

MarkW
Reply to  mark from the midwest
October 11, 2021 2:40 pm

If enough people leave the state they may be able to avoid the blackouts for another year or two.

Carlo, Monte
Reply to  MarkW
October 12, 2021 12:53 pm

Think about how many Congress seats they could lose in the next census.

John Endicott
Reply to  Carlo, Monte
October 13, 2021 5:18 am

Yeah but that’s a decade away. Lots of pain an suffering for the inmates of commiefornia in the meantime. (and not just for the morons who voted these fools in, they deserve all the pain and suffering they get. No it’s the others who are stuck there because they’re too poor or too rooted to the area to move that I feel for).

ihfan
Reply to  mark from the midwest
October 11, 2021 10:00 pm

This is the end of the beginning of the end for California.

We can hope.

Richard (the cynical one)
October 11, 2021 2:36 pm

Stupid Stupid Stupid Stupid!

And what does this say about the fine people of California who elected him?

Stupid.

Tom Abbott
Reply to  Richard (the cynical one)
October 12, 2021 9:12 am

Majority stupid, anyway.

Gregory Woods
October 11, 2021 2:55 pm

but at this stage an outbreak of common sense is far from guaranteed.

but at this stage an outbreak of common sense is far from guaranteed.

but at this stage an outbreak of common sense is far from guaranteed.

and so on

Stanny1
October 11, 2021 2:56 pm

Every year I go to Mammoth to ski. But I reserve One day to go to Carson City to buy Calif-banned Denatured Alcohol. Many travel to Yuma, Las Vegas and Stateline to buy ammo. I guess Arizona and Nevada will have to stock more gas lawnmowers, generators and such. You can’t stop us Newscum.

lee riffee
Reply to  Stanny1
October 11, 2021 3:23 pm

Yes, that’s what I was thinking…Nuisance is enriching his state’s neighbors….

AndyHce
Reply to  lee riffee
October 11, 2021 9:13 pm

Especially when CA must pay other states $millions to take its excess solar generated electricity

MAL
Reply to  Stanny1
October 11, 2021 10:29 pm

Are you and illegal after from what I understand in California said laws do not apply to them.

John Endicott
Reply to  Stanny1
October 13, 2021 5:20 am

And just think of all the CO2 emissions from all those fossil fuel powered cars crossing back an forth from the interior of commiefornia to those neighboring states and back again in order to pick up all that contraband.

Enginer01
October 11, 2021 2:58 pm

Just prt of Maurice Strong’s efforts to Block the tailpipe…”

https://www.technocracy.news/club-of-rome-the-origin-of-climate-and-population-alarmism/

Rud Istvan
October 11, 2021 3:00 pm

You missed the ‘best’ banned gas powered small engine category—chain saws. Guaranteeing CA cannot do the forest thinning needed to prevent more severe forest fires, let alone fight them by building fire breaks, while also shutting down their logging industry—there are no extension cords long enough for California’s Sierra Nevada forests. Besides which they also banned portable generators to attach them to, as you noted.

I suspect this will not stand. It merely provides vivid grounds for ridicule of abject green stupidity.

stinkerp
Reply to  Rud Istvan
October 11, 2021 4:26 pm

I’m not advocating banning gas powered chain saws but in head to head reviews consumer-grade electric chain saws are just as good or better. Except that you have to recharge them frequently or have a lot of batteries on hand which is expensive and unwieldy for loggers. And as far as I know none of the larger and longer (> 18″) chain saws used by loggers are electric. But otherwise the electric consumer-grade chain saws cut just as well, and they’re quieter and lighter.

Last edited 13 days ago by stinkerp
Clyde Spencer
Reply to  stinkerp
October 11, 2021 5:14 pm

… but in head to head reviews consumer-grade electric chain saws are just as good or better.

That hasn’t been my experience!

Rud Istvan
Reply to  stinkerp
October 11, 2021 5:44 pm

Sinkerp:
My farm was never and never will be your ‘consumer grade’. Dunno what you meant, but I can be precise about my non-consumer grade dairy farm: 260 acres, of which about 160 was steep hardwood forest with deadfall harvested by my compact 4WD 27 HP tractor and half inch logging chains cut thru (over about 10 years about 5 miles of horse/snomobile net forest trails for hunting). Base diameters up to 3 feet. Usually 18. So bigger trees, just use plunge cuts on the 20 inch bar. Now, if you are using plunge cuts, you really have to know tree felling in order not to destroy the bar and chain on a pinch.

Rick C
Reply to  Rud Istvan
October 12, 2021 9:06 am

I also live in a rural area and have several gas powered pieces of equipment that I consider essential: 2 chain saws (regular 18″ and a pole saw), rototiller, weed trimmer, leaf blower, riding mower, log splitter, brush & field mower, power washer. Now I buy one 5 gallon can of premium gasoline in the spring, make up 2 gallons of 2 stroke gas/oil mix and have enough to power all of these tools except the lawn mower (diesel) for the year. I use most of these only a couple of times per year. I use maybe 10 gallons of diesel for mowing 3 acres over the year. The California law might prevent my burning of about 5 gallons of gas/year. But it would leave me with no wood heat, no ability to clear my drive way if a tree falls, no ability to clear/reduce underbrush and invasive weeds, etc. All to save emissions from the equivalent of one tank of gas in a typical car. What lunacy.

I will be shocked if this utterly stupid law goes into effect in California without creating a huge backlash and perhaps civil unrest a la the French “green vests”.

Randle Dewees
Reply to  stinkerp
October 11, 2021 8:21 pm

I use a corded chainsaw for yard work. It’s fine for that and less hassle than an engine saw. But you wouldn’t get much work done very fast with a battery powered chainsaw.

AGW is Not Science
Reply to  Randle Dewees
October 12, 2021 7:13 am

Doesn’t work too good during blackouts though…

Tom Abbott
Reply to  Randle Dewees
October 12, 2021 9:19 am

There are some places where a battery-powered chainsaw comes in handy. Some of these hedge trimmers hang up on larger branches. A small chainsaw can overcome this.

roaddog
Reply to  stinkerp
October 12, 2021 12:36 am

I doubt firefighters use consumer-grade chainsaws. But am past caring if California burns.

MarkW
Reply to  stinkerp
October 12, 2021 7:26 am

 Except that you have to recharge them

That’s one hell of an exception, and for most people it’s enough reason to avoid battery powered whenever possible.

AndyHce
Reply to  Rud Istvan
October 11, 2021 9:16 pm

It does say “gasoline” powered. Surely green hydrogen will be available.

Reply to  Rud Istvan
October 12, 2021 9:28 am

Fire prevention is the keyword. Current CA budget proposal assigns $4 bn for a badly needed fast train Modesto to Bakersfield, $1 bn for fire prevention. In the last fiscal year, 3/4 of money budgeted for fire prevention went elsewhere.

R Taylor
October 11, 2021 3:02 pm

Arizona and Nevada retailers are cheering.

October 11, 2021 3:08 pm

The governor has clearly not been paying any attention at all to what life is like in Lebanon right now.

And this sounds like a real boon for Home Depot stores in Reno and Las Vegas.

Izaak Walton
October 11, 2021 3:12 pm

“Gasoline powered equipment, barring a mechanical failure, works as long as you can keep it supplied with gasoline. But battery equipment needs power to recharge it.”

I am not sure there is any significant difference between “power to recharge” a battery and suppling a motor with gasoline. In the UK at the moment there are a lot EV powered cars who are driving around looking smugger than usual thanks to ongoing petrol shortages.

We have had an electric lawn mower for over 10 years and it works fine. It is less noisy, lighter and less polluting than a 2 stroke engine. What is not to like?

Rud Istvan
Reply to  Izaak Walton
October 11, 2021 3:34 pm

We don’t much use anymore two stroke lawnmowers in the US. All of mine for the past 20 years are 4 stroke. Ditto almost all outboard boat motors. My last two stroke was a small 4hp for my sailboats inflatable dinghy bought in 1992.
And stuff that necessarily remains two stroke is much improved. My first heavy 20” bar chain saw at the dairy farm was 1:15 oil/gas with a 1/4 inch chain—blue smoke; my much newer 20” bar Stihl was 1:40 (no smoke) with a 3/8 inch chain plus a chain brake for safety—cut better at 2/3 the weight, while using less guide bar oil so longer between refills when cutting oak or hickory.

HotScot
Reply to  Rud Istvan
October 11, 2021 5:34 pm

Walton is talking BS. All ICE lawn mowers in the UK are now 4 stroke. And when comparing noise, it’s a bit like 80’s when two stroke racing motorcycles were condemned as noisy because of their high revving nature and high pitched noise. That is until someone had the gumption to bring a Decibel metre to a few races and discovered that the four strokes were far louder.

Electric lawn mowers are the opposite. One can hear them several gardens away but a four stroke noise just doesn’t travel that far.

There are still two stroke powered chain saws/hedge trimmers etc. but they are overkill for most tiny British gardens.

Matthew Bergin
Reply to  HotScot
October 12, 2021 6:39 am

I still use my 1973 Lawnboy to cut my lawn. Lightest lawn mower out there being a two stroke and having a magnesium deck. 30/1 mix but I use a synthetic oil with a nice scent. So I cut my lawn without smoke but in the scent of cherries. 😊

Last edited 13 days ago by Matthew Bergin
Paul of Alexandria
Reply to  Izaak Walton
October 11, 2021 3:42 pm

Whenever you compare other countries or I the U.S. always remember the scale difference! All of England is about the same size as one middle-sized U.S. state. Electric lawnmowers and chainsaws work nicely so long as you are within 30 meters of a power plug. They don’t work so well when clearing brush on the Back 40. All lawn mowing and landscaping companies rely on gas-powered equipment, as do farmers.

As for electric cars, run the numbers. The UK power grid is stretched now, and electric cars take about as much power per month as a house.

Gregg Eshelman
Reply to  Paul of Alexandria
October 12, 2021 1:52 am

An example of “green” stupidity in the UK. The Orkney Islands have wind turbines all over the place but nobody in business or government will pay to install the huge upgrade in their power line to the mainland to be able to get all that electricity to where it can be used. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8UmsfXWzvEA

Derg
Reply to  Izaak Walton
October 11, 2021 3:52 pm

Why can’t people be allowed to make their own choice?

Doonman
Reply to  Derg
October 11, 2021 5:30 pm

You can if you’re a woman and want to abort your inconvenient mass of biological bondage growing in you due to your own actions. But remember, that is your constitutional right. All other choices, forget about it, the state knows better how you should live your life.

ihfan
Reply to  Derg
October 11, 2021 10:04 pm

My yard. My Choice.

TonyG
Reply to  Derg
October 12, 2021 7:25 am

Derg, you ARE allowed to make your own choice, as long as it is an APPROVED choice.

John Endicott
Reply to  TonyG
October 13, 2021 5:27 am

Indeed, only the approved choice is allowed. Which means no real choice at all.

hermanmerivale
Reply to  Izaak Walton
October 11, 2021 3:58 pm

Living in Epsom, Surrey, UK. There are a lot of people stockpiling gas at the moment, as there were people stockpiling loo roll a few months ago. I’ve had no problems. Driven 400 miles over the last 2 weeks, filled up no problems. Having said all that, I’ll be ordering a petrol/diesel gen asap, as the same insanity is sure to appear here soon.

HotScot
Reply to  hermanmerivale
October 11, 2021 5:39 pm

I have just taken delivery of a new 8Kw generator to see us through the next 5 years of insanity. We might just avoid power cuts this winter (but I doubt it as Boris has said there won’t be any) but the coming years will be rough.

ATheoK
Reply to  Izaak Walton
October 11, 2021 4:34 pm

How many batteries have you replaced during those ten years? 4? 5? 7?

Chris geo
Reply to  Izaak Walton
October 11, 2021 4:40 pm

It’s not just a power supply required, but time. And you may be oky in your suburban home doing a small bit of mowing. But imagine you are on a back-block miles from anywhere. Your ute is full of lithium ion batteries for your electric chainsaw or whatever. What do you do when those batteries run out? Drive 2 hours to your house and wait 10 hours to recharge all your batteries? Petrol has 100x the energy density of lithium batteries, and “recharges” instantly.

I did a back of the envelope for my boat. There is idiotic talk of replacing marine engines with electric. My boat is a 16 foot fibreglass with a petrol 50hp outboard. It carries 80 litres of fuel which weighs about 60kg. This 60kg of fuel contains the same energy as 6000kg of batteries (60×100). Say my new government-mandated 50hp electric outboard is 5x more efficient than my petrol outboard. Then I only need to carry 6000/5 = 1200kg of batteries in my boat to have the same range as the petrol engine. This is obviously impossible. There is nowhere to recharge at sea (a 20l jerrycan (equivalent to a 300kg battery) of fuel is pretty simple to carry), and to recharge in a marina would take hours and hours.

There is a necessity and permanent place for petrol/diesel powered small engines. They are irreplaceable with current technology.

MarkW
Reply to  Chris geo
October 11, 2021 4:55 pm

If Izaak and the other socialists have their way, you will be rounded up, and put in an inner city high rise, whether you want to or not.
No back 40 for you.

TonyG
Reply to  MarkW
October 12, 2021 7:58 am

Not a problem, Mark. We don’t need dirty FARM vegetables, get nice clean veggies from the grocery store instead.

Mr.
Reply to  Chris geo
October 11, 2021 5:28 pm

Chris you describe one more example of where electric / battery power just does not get the job done.

I’m not against electric / battery applications per se (I use many of them, including not having to hand-crank my SUV to start it 🙂 )

But rationally, it’s a case of “horses for courses”.

I have a neighbor who just bought a small EV who was trying to sell me on the concept of “it’s the best thing to happen for personal transport”.

I agreed with him that while it suits his transport needs, it doesn’t meet mine – exploring ‘off the beaten path’ locations while towing a travel trailer rigged for boondocking.

I’d have a hybrid in a flash if it towed 4500 lbs easily for a straight 250-mile run.

Chris geo
Reply to  Mr.
October 11, 2021 5:52 pm

I fully agree with horses for courses. I own dozens of battery operated power tools, a mower, a whipper-snipper, etc, and really love them. But I do have a petrol mower and whipper-snipper too, for bigger jobs. What I object to is these governments dictating what an individual may do, where it’s plainly obvious that there are many, many applications that can only be dealt with by the internal combustion engine. I do not understand why this is not obvious to bureaucrats, mainly because I forget that they have no understanding of numeracy, physics, magnitudes, geology, science, etc.

No matter how you cook the numbers, electric vehicles cannot work en masse. They take too long to charge, are too heavy, and require a vast increase in electricity generation and grid capacity. The will only ever be feasible in niche situations, like a neighbour who just bought a small EV to drive 5km a day, and has all day at home to charge it.

The applications that require the ICE are the big jobs: long haul transport, agriculture, mining, emergency services, remote services.

I suppose I could get a sail boat.

Mr.
Reply to  Chris geo
October 11, 2021 7:38 pm

Sailboats are fantastic!
I’ve had 4 of them.
But it never occurred to me that any of them could be used as a tugboat or a ski boat.
Horses for courses.

Izaak Walton
Reply to  Chris geo
October 11, 2021 8:41 pm

Chris,
you state that the applications that require ICE are the big jobs. And while that might be true they are also niche compared to multitude of small jobs that can be done with electric motors.

Just how many fire engines are there compared to the number of cars on the road?
Also the best way forward for long haul transport is electric trains. They are much more efficient than ICEs and less polluting.

Remote services are also rapidly moving to solar since despite the problems you mention the fact that you don’t have to constantly supply them with petrol is a winner.

And yes I completely agree that for some applications ICEs are the best but with every improvement in battery life, capacity and recharging times those applications are getting fewer and fewer. Electric engines are more efficient, less polluting, have more torque, longer lifetimes etc and so are finding more and more applications as batteries improve.

Chris geo
Reply to  Izaak Walton
October 11, 2021 9:26 pm

You really must think these things through without the dreamy magic wand waving.

In Australia we use electric (overhead lines) trains in the city. Fair enough. The distances are short, they are quiet and clean.

For heavy rail – in between cities and to distant mining and agricultural regions we do not use electric trains. Why is that?

The distances are vast, and there is no infrastructure.

It is expensive and inefficient to build electric rail to many of these places.

Oh, use a battery powered train they say. Here’s an example of that:

BHP’s Mount Newman Iron Ore railway is 426km long and uses diesel-electric locomotives with a fuel capacity of around 21 000 litres. To replace that tank with a battery of equivalent energy would require that the battery weighs around 500 tonnes. The longest train ever on that line weighed 100 tonnes.


David Stone CEng
Reply to  Chris geo
October 12, 2021 8:06 am

1000 tons?

Chris geo
Reply to  David Stone CEng
October 12, 2021 2:45 pm

Yes, thank you, typo, 100 000 tonnes and eight locos.

So around 4000 tonnes of battery. 4% of the weight. Which does not seem that bad, except for the time required to charge those batteries. They would need multiple battery sets or locos being charged constantly from massive diesel generators in the middle of nowhere.

“On 21 June 2001, the line broke the world record for the heaviest train as well as the longest train when a train weighing 99,734 tons and formed of 682 wagons ran for 275 kilometres between Yandi and Port Hedland. The train was 7.3 kilometres long, carried 82,000 tons of iron ore, and was hauled by eight GE AC6000CW locomotives.” Wiki.

Elle W
Reply to  Chris geo
October 12, 2021 8:08 am

Isaak’s UK is the size of Oregon but with 60+ million people crammed in. And no mountains to speak of, nor any actual winter. It’s sort of Disneyland without the fun. As such, it probably pays them to have electric trains criss-cross their landscape or to use cute little electric chainsaws to trim a dwarf tree in a miniature yard. They have no concept of “vast” or even “harsh weather” .(Just listen to the moaning at every dusting of snow, or when the temperature goes above 24C in summer.) It irks me to have a person like Isaak living in those rarified conditions trying to tell real people doing real jobs in adverse conditions what tools to use.

Dave Andrews
Reply to  Izaak Walton
October 12, 2021 7:48 am

Network Rail that operates the UK’s rail infrastructure agrees that electrification is the main way to decarbonise UK rail travel.

There are a couple of problems though. First, only 38% of the network is currently electrified and there are some 13,000kms of unelectrified track. This will require a massive electrification programme that will take decades to deliver and there is no guarantee the Government will approve it.

Spread the problem to Europe where 46% of an obviously very much larger railway system is not electrified and you begin to realise that the mantra of electrification of everything is very much a pipedream.

David Stone CEng
Reply to  Izaak Walton
October 12, 2021 8:05 am

The trouble with electric trains Luke is beautifully illustrated by the Great Western line through Bristol. It is being electrified, It is taking years to rebuild most of the bridges and install the overhead line. It is costing £billions. It will never recover this money. An electric fast train takes at least 3MW, but also need 3MW of backup generation somewhere from Gas when there is little wind (like now). Britain is running on about 70% gas today and some solar (it’s too far North to be efficient in Autumn) which today costs much more than diesel fuel What a good idea!

Gregg Eshelman
Reply to  Chris geo
October 12, 2021 1:54 am

So whipper snipper is what they’re calling a strimmer now?

Chris geo
Reply to  Gregg Eshelman
October 12, 2021 2:46 am

Australian for weed-whacker I guess.

Peter
Reply to  Chris geo
October 11, 2021 5:34 pm

I threw together and electric powered boat about 10 years ago, aluminum hull, trolling motor, a couple of deep discharge marine batteries, and a roof with a solar panel. It would go for about an hour on one charge, top speed about 3 mph, and took a full day of summer sun to recharge. Neat for a play-toy, but not really very practical

Gregg Eshelman
Reply to  Peter
October 12, 2021 1:56 am

Solar panels and electric motors have come a long way since then. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_n-8dYlqV0s

Chris geo
Reply to  Peter
October 12, 2021 3:09 pm

Out of interest I looked up one of the companies that make full-size electric outboards – Torqeedo – and compared specs to my old 50hp two stroke.

They have a 40hp equivalent motor. With a 40 kWh battery, they claim 1.6 hours at full throttle in similar sized vessels to mine.

My 50hp two-stroke will do about about 1.0 hours on a 23 litre tank at full throttle (and much more at 2/3 throttle). The 23l tank weighs about 20kg total.

The 40 kWh battery weighs 278kg! They do not give a price for this battery, but they do for a 5 kWh battery. The 5 kWh battery costs 5000 Euros!

https://www.torqeedo.com/en/products/outboards/deep-blue/deep-blue-25-r/M-3203-00.html

HotScot
Reply to  Chris geo
October 11, 2021 5:40 pm

You won’t catch me in a battery powered boat. Electricity and water are not good bedfellows!

MarkW
Reply to  Izaak Walton
October 11, 2021 4:52 pm

Time to recharge vs time to refil is a very, very big difference.
Also, most battery powered lawn tools are toys.

Doonman
Reply to  MarkW
October 11, 2021 5:41 pm

I stopped using electric lawn tools years ago. They all overload and burn out the windings eventually. Gas engines just stall, you clear them and they are good to go again.

Clyde Spencer
Reply to  Izaak Walton
October 11, 2021 5:17 pm

It is less noisy, lighter and less polluting than a 2 stroke engine.

I’m sure that my push mower is even quieter than you electric mower.

H.R.
Reply to  Clyde Spencer
October 11, 2021 8:16 pm

I have and use a reel-type push mower that’s powered by… me. It cuts beautifully compared to rotary mowers.

I have a fenced ‘safe yard’ for our smallish dogs. There are lots of coyotes about and they will take small dogs. And yes, there are no longer any outdoor cats in the neighborhood and a few small dogs have gone missing.

The little yard is 4m X 5m and it’s tough to maneuver my gas mower for the big yard in there. The reel-type mower leaves a cut almost like a golf course fairway, so it’s easier to pooper scoop compared to the 2″ to 3″ of the main yard.

~H.R., saving the planet one small yard at a time. 😜

Clyde Spencer
Reply to  H.R.
October 11, 2021 8:29 pm

It is surprising how often people will stop and remark that they didn’t realize push mowers were still made. Now, if I owned one of the ‘grass farms’ that are so popular around here, I wouldn’t have the time or energy to mow it by hand. However, my 50′ x 20′ front lawn is actually easier to mow with a push mower than to drag out the power mower from the shed in back; the power mower is also harder to push.

Pamela Matlack-Klein
Reply to  Clyde Spencer
October 13, 2021 10:42 am

Big lawns are such a waste, lots of water, fertilizer, and labor to keep them from turning into meadows. Grass is for animals to graze on, especially cattle. I have been killing grass since moving into the Casa Nova and replacing it with flowering shrubs, trees, and perennials.

Pamela Matlack-Klein
Reply to  Izaak Walton
October 13, 2021 10:30 am

Try cutting a few acres of lawn with that puppy. They are great for tiny yards but that is about it.

lee riffee
October 11, 2021 3:27 pm

California….the Cuba of the lower 48 states! If this nonsense is allowed to stand you can bet that repair shops will do a good business. For those who don’t import equipment from other states, they will keep their antique lawn tractors, generators and chainsaws running for a long time….and (unless somehow CA regains its collective sanity) eventually this will extend to cars, trucks and SUVs….
That will be one of the few good future job prospects in CA – small engine mechanics!

MarkW
Reply to  lee riffee
October 11, 2021 4:56 pm

And those older engines will end up putting out a lot more pollution than the newer engines that would have replaced them.

October 11, 2021 3:29 pm

These Greentard idiots just pushed the sale of those things for Californians across state lines to Arizona, Nevada and Oregon.

And destroying California’s small businesses one regulation at a time.

Clyde Spencer
Reply to  Joel O'Bryan
October 11, 2021 5:22 pm

California has banned recreational gold dredging for a number of years now. This is the final nail in the coffin for anyone who was hoping that the ban might be rescinded.

Paul of Alexandria
October 11, 2021 3:29 pm

The last time I checked, few landscaping companies or lawn mowing services use electric equipment. Some pols are going to get annoyed when their lawns don’t get mowed!

Reply to  Paul of Alexandria
October 11, 2021 3:37 pm

I use a battery powered hedge clippers because just cutting my bushes every few weeks during growing season can easily be done on one charge. But a commercial landscaper going to multiple jobs everyday, such a battery-powered device would need many battieres to get through a day’s jobs. And those big Li-ion batteres are expensive. So they all use gas powered hedge clippers, just like all their other powered tools.

ATheoK
Reply to  Joel O'Bryan
October 11, 2021 5:04 pm

The last house I owned that had hedges, the hedges averaged 8 feet tall, ran 40 yards down the side of the property and 20 yards across the front.

Clipping hedges took hours and if they had been ignored for too long, more than a day.

Around the same time, 1980s, I won a silly contest at Sears where my prize was a battery powered weed whacker.
Starting with a full charge, could, maybe, trim the flower bed edging along fifteen feet of flowers in my back yard. Older tall grass stems tended to snag the weedwhacker line, stopping the weedwhacker head from spinning and draining remaining battery power rapidly.

I gave that waste of space to a friend living in an apartment with a sand box sized green spot yard.

Izaak Walton
Reply to  ATheoK
October 11, 2021 9:19 pm

Perhaps you should try and again and see the difference that 40 years of battery improvement makes. I have an electric chainsaw that does everything I need it to in the garden without needing to be recharged. Plus the battery is modular meaning that (a) it fits multiple other tools and (b) you can easily buy a spare so there is always one fully charged and ready to go.

peter schell
Reply to  Izaak Walton
October 12, 2021 4:26 am

This seems a silly comment to downvote. There really has been a change in the quality and usefulness of battery powered tools in the last ten years. They are actually practical. the maintenance department at my plant hardly ever uses corded tools anymore. Sawsalls. Drills, Grinders. So nice not to have to string a hundred feet of power cord before you can start the job. Just walk to where you need to work and do it.

Clyde Spencer
Reply to  peter schell
October 13, 2021 12:43 pm

Again, using a battery powered tool for a job where time is not of the essence is understandable. However, you don’t want to take the risk that your battery will die in the middle of the job.

Carlo, Monte
Reply to  Izaak Walton
October 12, 2021 5:48 am

Idiot.

LdB
Reply to  Izaak Walton
October 12, 2021 6:24 am

You obviously have a very small garden meaning you are an inner city dropkick and your opinion is as small and useless as your block.

Last edited 13 days ago by LdB
Clyde Spencer
Reply to  Izaak Walton
October 13, 2021 12:40 pm

I have an electric chainsaw that does everything I need it to in the garden

Battery-powered tools have their place, but using them to take down trees quickly to create a fire break when the burning front is advancing on you is NOT one of them!

Pamela Matlack-Klein
Reply to  ATheoK
October 13, 2021 10:45 am

Cut down and dug out all the hedges too. Anything that is that high-maintenance does not last long at our house.

n.n
Reply to  Joel O'Bryan
October 11, 2021 5:47 pm

Yes, people aren’t so green that they would willfully ignore fitness to purpose.

Last edited 13 days ago by n.n
Carlo, Monte
Reply to  Joel O'Bryan
October 11, 2021 6:09 pm

I remember the old corded electric trimmers—invariably sooner or later the cords would get cut.

Rud Istvan
Reply to  Paul of Alexandria
October 11, 2021 3:38 pm

There is a reason for that. Go figure.

Reply to  Paul of Alexandria
October 11, 2021 6:10 pm

An expensive home development around a golf course wanted to get rid of the noise of landscaping equipment…the answer was fuel cell powered equipment…I am sure the costs went up but they could afford it. I am for the free market deciding…if someone wants electric…pay for it….no subsidy.

Last edited 13 days ago by Anti-griff
peter schell
Reply to  Paul of Alexandria
October 12, 2021 4:23 am

Milwaukee tools has a whole line of battery powered hand-held construction equipment. Massive rechargeable batteries. They are very useful on a small scale job sight. Fourteen Inch cement saw that can cut forty feet of six inch concrete on one charge. Same battery fits in various other pcs of heavy duty construction tools.

They are great when you don’t want, or need, to set up a generator and run a half mile of extension cord. Not so good on long sustained jobs where the tool has to function for hours and hours straight.

Insufficiently Sensitive
October 11, 2021 3:39 pm

 Imagine trying to fight the fire approaching your house, only to have a low battery light start flashing on your fire fighting water pump. 

Out on our farm, the firefighting gear will all have neatly lettered signs on its gas tanks declaring ILLEGAL AND PROUD OF IT!

Deacon
Reply to  Insufficiently Sensitive
October 11, 2021 5:10 pm

“…this has everything to do with destroying Western civilization to clear the path for a global government ruled by the self-proclaimed ruling elite, “
TOTALLY Agree…
this is the real reason that the billionaires are spending $$$millions on the proraganda of man made climate change…Power and Control…they own the media and therefore control the “news” that is presented.
I can only hope the real citizens of the USA come to their senses soon enough to shut this off…but I am becomming very skeptical

Deacon
Reply to  Deacon
October 11, 2021 5:11 pm

the reply was for the Jim Clarke statement…

Jim Clarke
October 11, 2021 3:48 pm

This has zero to do with the climate or air pollution. This has everything to do with destroying Western civilization to clear the path for a global government ruled by the self-proclaimed ruling elite, with you as your slave. Imagine how lovely this world would be without these oligarchs. No imaginary climate change crisis. Now manufactured viruses. No lock downs. Very little debt. No hunger. Cures for most diseases. Freedom of speech. Freedom of travel, and so on. Almost all of our problems have been generated by a small collection of humans with a psychopathic desire for power and control. Gov. Newsome is one of them. You are not.

stinkerp
October 11, 2021 3:57 pm

Because lawnmowers, backup generators, and fire pumps are major sources of CO2 emissions.

Leftists never need rational reasons to ban things.

Last edited 13 days ago by stinkerp
Opus
October 11, 2021 4:03 pm

Interesting timing, this comes out after the recall election and will be forgotten by the next election.

Sean
October 11, 2021 4:07 pm

Remember, CA legalized and taxed (at 40%) Marijuana in the state but black market sales have never been better. They also passed a low carbon fuel tax to promote cellulosic ethanol but the technology never worked so they just collect the extra penalties in the price of gasoline.

A lot of Commenters have pointed out how easy it is to get around this but don’t be surprised when the state goes after the fuel which is less likely to be supplied by a black market vendor. I predict the state will go through with the ban, tax the fuel more aggressively and laugh all the way to the bank.

ATheoK
October 11, 2021 4:10 pm

A ban on gas powered lawn equipment would just be a serious inconvenience for most people, unless you have a very large lawn.”

In simple terms, Newsom just told citizens of California to let their grass grow long, dry out and form incendiary paths to their houses.

(E) Expected availability of zero-emission generators and emergency response equipment. …”, so there is no doubt they plan to cover backup generators and emergency fire fighting equipment if they can.”

Once again, leftist elites pass legislation that increases the burden to the lower classes.

How does California manage to elect governors that make Brown and Arnie seem almost sane.

ATheoK
Reply to  ATheoK
October 11, 2021 4:14 pm

The Nevada side of Lake Tahoe should start expanding their marinas now.
Soon, Californians will be banned from running their gasoline powered boats. So, Californians will move their boat registrations to marinas in Nevada.

Again, only people living in the lower economic tiers will be harmed.

ScienceABC123
October 11, 2021 4:50 pm

Well Californians if you have had enough of the nonsense there, there are other states that would gladly welcome you on one condition, you leave all that California nonsense behind.

Reply to  ScienceABC123
October 11, 2021 6:26 pm

Nanci Piglosi has received several special Insider Stock Offerings that the average citizen does not get…one from Master Card….the old hag has gone from being worth over 100 million to over 300 million in the last 5 years. She is kin to Newscum. Just like the Klintons and Bidenos…another demrat crime family.

Carlo, Monte
Reply to  Anti-griff
October 12, 2021 5:54 am

As a certain controversial web board poster correctly predicted:

“Soon they won’t be able to walk down the street.”

Donna
October 11, 2021 5:05 pm

Where are the impact studies on the middle class, poor & small businesses…

Wade
October 11, 2021 5:20 pm

I love my battery lawnmower. I will never go back to the gasoline mower ever again. The new ones are quite good. However, it requires electricity. Where is California going to get electricity when all their reliable sources of power are foolishly being shut down? You cannot cut your grass with an electric mower when the electric part is missing.

I suppose you could use one of those old timey rotary blades that you push around. What progress. Living like it is 1821 in 2021.

n.n
Reply to  Wade
October 11, 2021 5:44 pm

The battery powered mowers are sufficient for light to medium duty, on small to medium-sized lawns.

Progress is unqualified monotonic change: one step forward, two steps backward.

Clyde Spencer
Reply to  Wade
October 13, 2021 12:49 pm

New technology is not always better. Sometimes it is a solution in search of a problem. The only thing that can be said with certainty is that it is “new.”

ResourceGuy
October 11, 2021 5:30 pm

Yes, there are climate change refugees. But they are actually climate policy refugees in fact.

Rocketscientist
October 11, 2021 5:39 pm

Gonna be hard to fight forest fires without chainsaws

ihfan
Reply to  Rocketscientist
October 11, 2021 10:11 pm

Just wait until a Li-Ion battery pack on a chainsaw ignites and burns the forest.

n.n
October 11, 2021 5:41 pm

Antisci

ResourceGuy
October 11, 2021 5:41 pm

Just had a conversation with a friend of the family who said they were getting advising at the local college to go into geology medicine. It sounds like climate change mitigation studies. I need a ticket off this crazy planet.

THOMAS ENGLERT
Reply to  ResourceGuy
October 11, 2021 9:38 pm

I heard about that new field, but it was called Medical Geology.
Dr Stone, call your office- there’s a pet rock with covid.

peter schell
Reply to  THOMAS ENGLERT
October 12, 2021 4:19 am

Dr. Stone is a genius high school student in a Japanese Manga in an end of the world scenario where people were petrified and thousands of years passed. When he came out of his shell, literally, he has to try and use his knowledge of science to survive by building science fair type devices to generate power, move water, etc.

He’d do well in California.

AGW is Not Science
Reply to  ResourceGuy
October 12, 2021 7:47 am

When Kirk said “Beam me up, Scotty – there’s no intelligent life down here,” was he in California at the time?

Greg