Vaccine in vial with syringe

Three Countries Suspend Astra Zeneca Covid Vaccine Over Blood Clot / Brain Haemorrhage Concerns

Guest essay by Eric Worrall

Several nations have suspended rollout of the AstraZeneca Covid-19 vaccine, after multiple reports emerged in Europe of vaccine recipients suffering brain haemorrhages, though AstraZeneca denies any link.

Norway reports three more ‘severe blood clots or brain haemorrhages’ after AstraZeneca jab

AFPnews@thelocal.no
@thelocalnorway
14 March 2021
07:45 CET

Norwegian health officials reported three more cases of blood clots or brain haemorrhages in younger people who received the AstraZeneca Covid-19 jab, but said they could not yet say they were vaccine-related.

The Norwegian Medicines Agency said similar incidents had been reported in other European countries. While there was no proof of a link to the vaccine, anyone under 50 who felt unwell and developed large blue patches after vaccination should seek medical attention.

The World Health Organization said no causal link had been established between the vaccine and blood clotting after Denmark, Norway and Iceland on Thursday temporarily suspended the use of the vaccine over concerns about patients developing post-jab blood clots.

A number of other countries have also suspended use of vaccines from one batch.

The manufacturer and Europe’s medicines watchdog have meanwhile insisted that the vaccine is safe.

Read more: https://www.thelocal.no/20210314/norway-reports-three-more-severe-blood-clots-or-brain-haemorrhages-after-astrazeneca-jab/

The response from AstraZeneca;

AstraZeneca says there is ‘no evidence’ its COVID-19 vaccine increases risk of blood clots

AstraZeneca says a review of safety data of people vaccinated with its COVID-19 vaccine has shown no evidence of an increased risk of blood clots.

An analysis of 17 million people vaccinated in the European Union and the United Kingdom found no evidence of an increased risk in blood clot conditions, an AstraZeneca spokesperson said on Sunday.

“A careful review of all available safety data of more than 17 million people vaccinated in the European Union and UK with COVID-19 Vaccine AstraZeneca has shown no evidence of an increased risk of pulmonary embolism, deep vein thrombosis or thrombocytopenia, in any defined age group, gender, batch or in any particular country,” the company said.

“In fact, the reported numbers of these types of events for COVID-19 Vaccine AstraZeneca are lower than the number that would have occurred naturally in the unvaccinated population.”

Read more: https://www.sbs.com.au/news/astrazeneca-says-there-is-no-evidence-its-covid-19-vaccine-increases-risk-of-blood-clots

There is substantial evidence infection with Covid-19 causes blood clotting disorders in some patients, so there is obvious concern about claims the vaccine might cause similar symptoms. From the Heart Research Institute;

People with coronavirus are at risk of blood clots and strokes

As well as causing severe respiratory problems, there is mounting evidence COVID-19 causes abnormalities in blood clotting. Patients with severe COVID-19 infection appear to be at greater risk of developing blood clots in the veins and arteries.

Recent data from the Netherlands and France suggest that of the patients with coronavirus who are admitted to intensive care units (ICU), 30-70% develop blood clots in the deep veins of the legs, or in the lungs.

Around one in four coronavirus patients admitted to ICU will develop a pulmonary embolism.

These rates are much higher than we would usually see in patients requiring admission to ICU for reasons other than COVID-19.

Read more: https://www.hri.org.au/health/your-health/lifestyle/people-with-coronavirus-are-at-risk-of-blood-clots-and-strokes

What can I say? The risk of side effects from the vaccine, if any, have to be weighed against the risk of contracting Covid. Even if there is a risk, which AstraZeneca denies, whatever the vaccine does to recipients, infection with the actual disease would likely be far worse.

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TEWS_Pilot
March 14, 2021 10:46 pm

Good thing they are immune from liability. /sarc>

Bryan A
Reply to  TEWS_Pilot
March 15, 2021 6:36 am

I wonder if some Anti-Vaxer has tampered with some of the vials so as to make the Vaccine far less desirable

Drake
Reply to  Bryan A
March 15, 2021 9:19 am

Sounds like a reasonable conspiracy theory, NOT.

Xinnie the Pooh
Reply to  Bryan A
March 15, 2021 5:58 pm

honest question – are you all there?

Leo Smith
Reply to  Bryan A
March 15, 2021 7:09 pm

No, the anti-vaxxer EU needs an excuse to:
(a) explain why it hasn’t managed to vaccinate nearly enough people yet
(b) justify a for profit vaccine at ten times the price, made in the USA and Germany.
In short as with Climate Change, its not about science, its about power, politics and profit.

The EU failed to note that nearly 2000 people have died after drinking water, and to ban it as a precaution.

Reply to  Bryan A
March 16, 2021 10:32 am

How long have the people below been around? Sorry, but Bryan A is NOT nuts.

Although it does only take one garden variety sociopath with the wrong access – not necessarily one “motivated” by anti-vax ideology.

Sparko
Reply to  writing observer
March 17, 2021 5:27 am

they would have to be pretty good at understanding how the jab works in order to produce such an effect. Just saying

TEWS_Pilot
March 14, 2021 10:50 pm

infection with the actual disease would likely be far worse….it has a better than 99% survival rate for all but the oldest and obese and diabetics and those with serious underlying conditions, so I question the necessity of risking the 47 pages of side effects against a FLU with a 99% survival rate…but that ‘s just me.

Reply to  TEWS_Pilot
March 14, 2021 11:09 pm

I agree TEWS.

USA Covid-10 stats are worthless – Covid-19 hopelessly exaggerated. .

To December 1 2020 the Covid-19 death rate in Alberta was 1 in 300,000 for under-65’s. That is 13 deaths of under-65’s in a population of over 4 million. Be very afraid.

Throw out tried-and tested emergency response plans that worked well in the past.

Lock down the entire low-risk population, destroy the economy, bankrupt businesses large and small and their owners and employees, cancel schools and universities, double drug overdose deaths, increase alcoholism, family violence, suicides, etc. Attaboys all around!

How is it that almost every state except Sweden and South Dakota did the same incredibly stupid and destructive lockdown? Who is pulling the strings?

Editor
Reply to  ALLAN MACRAE
March 15, 2021 12:02 am

Allan

Its called panic and hysteria and unfortunately ‘follow my leader.’ Italy locked down and that became the norm.

I wrote about it here exactly a year ago in a different context but included a reference to the virus

The ‘Climate Emergency’ -Running with the crowds? – Watts Up With That?

tonyb

Ron Long
Reply to  tonyb
March 15, 2021 2:41 am

Allan and tonyb, the mainstream media was complicit in pushing along the hysteria, both to hurt Trump and because of the saying “if it bleeds-it leads”. The media can’t sell good news, sot pile on the panic whenever they can. Some politicians took advantage of this also, and found willing assistance from mainstream media. What a mess!

Reply to  tonyb
March 15, 2021 2:55 am

Thank you Tony – I missed your article of one year ago – a good read.

Based on quality data, I concluded by about 1March2020 that Covid-19 was NOT a dangerous flu, except to the very elderly and infirm. I was reluctant to publish because I could not understand what I might be missing – when governments everywhere were panicking and locking down. Then my friend, a specialist physician, told me his 600-bed hospital had been emptied to make room for the “tsunami of Covid cases” that NEVER arrived, and I published on 21&22March2020 as follows:

https://wattsupwiththat.com/2020/03/21/to-save-our-economy-roll-out-antibody-testing-alongside-the-active-virus-testing/#comment-2943724
21March2020 – Allan MacRae
LET’S CONSIDER AN ALTERNATIVE APPROACH:
Isolate people over sixty-five and those with poor immune systems and return to business-as-usual for people under sixty-five.
This will allow “herd immunity” to develop much sooner and older people will thus be more protected AND THE ECONOMY WON’T CRASH.
 
https://rosebyanyothernameblog.wordpress.com/2020/03/21/end-the-american-lockdown/comment-page-1/#comment-12253
22March2020 – Allan MacRae
This full-lockdown scenario is especially hurting service sector businesses and their minimum-wage employees – young people are telling me they are “financially under the bus”. The young are being destroyed to protect us over-65’s. A far better solution is to get them back to work and let us oldies keep our distance, and get “herd immunity” established ASAP – in months not years. Then we will all be safe again.
 
Completely independently, Willis Eschenbach also published the same conclusion on the same day: 
https://rosebyanyothernameblog.wordpress.com/2020/03/21/end-the-american-lockdown/
21March2020 – Willis Eschenbach
The economic damage from the current insane “shelter-in-place” regulations designed to thwart the coronavirus is going to be huge—lost jobs, shuttered businesses, economic downturn, stock market losses. This doesn’t count the personal cost in things like increased suicides and domestic and other violence.

I don’t regard this as a difficult technical call – the hard part was finding quality data in a morass of falsehoods, and then publishing a correct contrary opinion against the flood of prevailing government and media false hysteria.

Even today, the Covid-19 mortality stats in the USA are vastly overstated – five-to-ten times too high. The good news is nobody dies of old age anymore (sarc).

I do not regard the Covid-19 “vaccines” as justified – they are high-risk solutions to a low-risk problem. I fear that, like the full-Gulag lockdowns, the Covid-19 vaccines will do more harm than good – I won’t take them, even though I take the flu shot every year. The Covid-19 vaccines look like a rush-job to me – experimental and dangerous.

Editor
Reply to  ALLAN MACRAE
March 15, 2021 4:44 am

All;an

Thanks. I was shocked to see it was a year ago! Doesn’t time fly when you’re not having fun and how similar this hysteria is to the Dam breaking .

I am watching re-runs of Frasier and The Big bang theory and the obsessive cleanliness of Niles and Sheldon no longer looks out of place!

I will read your links this afternoon but I think I agree with what you say.

Did you ever see the excess death stats for the UK?. Every single year prior to 2011 had greater mortality than 2020 when taking into account population etc. Makes you think.

tonyb

goracle
Reply to  tonyb
March 15, 2021 11:49 am

common core math

a + b = c

a = 15 days to flatten the curve
c = 1 year
b = whatever lie we’ve been told during this scamdemic… there are tons so this, just like common core, b can be anything and the formula will still be true

Last edited 7 months ago by goracle
badEnglish
Reply to  ALLAN MACRAE
March 17, 2021 9:45 pm

Other than reading comments from people on forums such as WUWT, Allan, I so far only know one person here in BC who took the vaccine: my brother-in-law who happens to be a doctor. Even his wife won’t take it!

To the blood clot issue (and the quote below relates to the mRNA type ‘vaccine’, not the DNA AZ one) I thought the following from a Dr. Hooman Noorchashm, MD, PhD, was interesting:

“… when viral antigens are present in the vascular endothelium or other layers of the blood vessel, and especially in elderly and frail with cardiovascular disease, the antigen specific immune response incited by the vaccine is almost certain to do damage to the vascular endothelium. Such vaccine directed endothelial damage is certain to cause blood clot formation with the potential for major thromboembolic complications.”

Full open letter here: https://noorchashm.medium.com/a-letter-of-warning-to-fda-and-pfizer-on-the-immunological-danger-of-covid-19-vaccination-in-the-7d17d037982d

Yes, it’s on Medium, and not everyone will agree with the author’s opening appeal to vaccinate everyone but his thesis on potential vaccine risk is well presented, nonetheless.

badEnglish

George Tetley
Reply to  ALLAN MACRAE
March 15, 2021 3:06 am

WHO IS PULLING THE STRINGS
Corruption
Ignorant idiots
Political mental deficiency
Billionaires making billions

Simon
Reply to  ALLAN MACRAE
March 15, 2021 12:08 pm

USA Covid-10 stats are worthless”
I heard that too. Figures far worse than the Trump Whitehouse would allow to be released.

William Astley
Reply to  ALLAN MACRAE
March 15, 2021 1:11 pm

Rather than isolate the entire Alberta/Canadian population…
It would be more effective to correct the Canadian population’s Vitamin D deficiency.
Statistics Canada finds, that 40% of the Canadian population, in the Winter and 25% in the summer, are severely Vitamin D deficient with Vitamin D blood serum levels less than 20 ng/mL (50 nmol/L).
The summer/winter change the Canada population’s Vitamin D level explains why flu and covid kills more people in the winter than in the summer.
Correcting the Canada population’s Vitamin D deficiency (increase from average 26 ng/ml to roughly average 45 ng/ml) requires Vitamin D supplements of 4000 UI/day per person.
Vitamin D is required by every cell in our body to access a copy of DNA which every cell has inside of the cell, to get the DNA ‘blue prints’ to produce specialized biochemicals to protect the cells and organs from virus attacks, common cancers, chronic disease like diabetes, in addition to normal body functions such as build and maintain muscle cells.
As the Vitamin D level rises in the body to optimum which is above 60 ng/ml (150 nmol/L) …. Every cell in the body is now able to have all of the biochemicals and apparatus. When Vitamin D is low the body’s systems do not work optimally and the body is forced to use the limited Vitamin D to for the most important body function such as calcium control in the blood stream.
https://papers.ssrn.com/sol3/papers.cfm?abstract_id=3585561
Regardless of sex or age, Vit. D deficient  (Vit D blood serum level less than 20 ng/ml (50 nmol/L) people are 10 times more likely to die from covid or have serious organ damage than those who are Vit. D normal (Vitamin D blood serum level greater than 30 ng/ml (75 nmol/L). For Vitamin D status, cases were classified based on their serum 25(OH)D levels:(1) normal – serum 25(OH)D of > 30 ng/ml, (2) insufficient – serum 25(OH)D of 21-29 ng/ml, and (3) deficient – serum 25(OH)D of < 20 ng/ml. This classification was based on existing literature. Canadians: Statistics Canada

Highlights

  • Just over two-thirds of Canadians (68%) had blood concentrations of vitamin D over 50 nmol/L (above 20 ng/ml)—a level that is sufficient for healthy bones for most people. About 32% of Canadians were below the cut-off.
  • Children aged 3 to 5 had the highest rates above the cut-off (89%), while the 20- to 39-year-olds had the lowest (59%).
  • A minority of Canadians (34%) took a supplement containing vitamin D, but a larger percentage of those taking supplements were above the cut-off (85%), compared with non-supplement users (59%).
  • About 40% of Canadians were below the cut-off in winter, compared with 25% in the summer.
  • On average, females had a higher concentration of vitamin D in their blood than males.

The US population is also VItamin D deficient as is almost every country in the world.

82% of the US ‘black’ population, 68% of the US Hispanic population, and 42% of the US general population and (roughly 30% of the US white population) is deficient in ‘Vitamin’ D which in this study is defined as a Blood serum level of active ‘Vitamin D’ of less than 20 ng/ml.
Prevalence and correlates of vitamin D deficiency in US adults.https://tahomaclinic.com/Private/Articles4/WellMan/Forrest%202011%20-%20Prevalence%20and%20correlates%20of%20vitamin%20D%20deficiency%20in%20US%20adults.pdf
 

Reply to  William Astley
March 15, 2021 4:34 pm

I agree, thank you William.
 
I do take 4000IU of Vitamin D3 daily. I believe if every adult took 4000IU of D3 per day, Covid-19 deaths would be even lower.
 
How is it that our governments did not strongly recommend D3, and instead imposed the extremely costly, harmful and ineffective full-Gulag lockdown?
 
Such incredible failures cannot be simply waived away as remarkable stupidity – it appears that something more covert and sinister is at work.
 
No rational person or group can be this stupid, this wrong, for this long.

Gerald Machnee
Reply to  William Astley
March 15, 2021 4:36 pm

Correct William.
However, in Canada the TV “medical experts” are ignorant or suffering from Trump Derangement Syndrome or both. They have done nothing about it. I have only seen one or two interviews on TV where the interviewer asked about Vitamin D. Dr. Isaac Bogoch from Toronto indicated that there are no studies supporting Vitamin D. FALSE.
I sent him and many other doctors the following:
There are now over 200 studies showing the efficacy of HCQ, Vitamin D, Zinc, and Ivermectin: https://c19study.com/

I have sent many letters since last April to medical people, politicians, and media about the lack of treatment and the lack of prevention advice re Vitamins. Most do not even reply. My member even suggested that too much Vitamin D can be bad. I told him to look at the daily death toll compared to Vitamin D reactions.

I was already on Vitamin D so I made sure my mother was on it as well. Her doctor actually did suggest it, but she was already on it from a previous doctor.

Here is part of a letter I just received in reply to my letter. Note that it does not say they will take any action:
———————————–
We have read your comments regarding Vitamin D, Zinc and alternative drugs for COVID-19 treatment and we appreciate your concerns and recommendations. 
 
Actions taken by ——— are carefully assessed and informed by expert advice and input from the public. Thank you for taking the time to share your concerns. Please be assured that provincial public health officials are constantly monitoring the risks and threats to ———— posed by COVID-19, and will continue to do so to inform ——— response to the pandemic.  
————————————–

otropogo
Reply to  William Astley
March 15, 2021 8:19 pm

Your first link above goes to”

SSRN Abstract Database Search Results

The abstract you requested was not found.

David Guy-Johnson
Reply to  TEWS_Pilot
March 15, 2021 12:46 am

But you can still kill people who are unable to take the vaccine, Mr Selfish

Reply to  David Guy-Johnson
March 15, 2021 3:00 am

DGJ: Don’t be ridiculous.

goracle
Reply to  David Guy-Johnson
March 15, 2021 2:37 pm

guy, you wanna take the vaccine, go ahead, I’m not going to stop you or saying you’re crazy for taking it… it’s up to you.

what I don’t want is to normalize the vaccine and whether you take or not will determine whether you get on a plane, go into the DMV to renew your driver’s license, or register you child for school…

fact is, this scamdemic has shown me how sissified the “men” have become at my workplace… sure, they talk a good game and say masks suck, but they keep following the Saint Dr Fauci… I wager most of them would applaud (or at least stand and say nothing) when a guy with family jewels intact that feels pretty beats their daughters in a state championship 100m race or basketball game or wrestling… pathetic…

Gerald Machnee
Reply to  David Guy-Johnson
March 15, 2021 4:20 pm

The governments killed hundreds of thousands by ignoring the Vitamins that William Astley wrote about above. I have written letters about it since last April and they have been ignored by the politicians, medical people and media. Even on Canada the worst disease was actuall Trump Derangement Syndrome. Hydroxychloroquine was ignored in Canada because of it. I suspect that Ivermectin is being ignored in Canada because of it as well as it is not even being tested and is one of the safest drugs around having been used for decades.

griff
Reply to  TEWS_Pilot
March 15, 2021 1:26 am

Yes, but hundreds of thousands only survive after treatment in ICUs, sometimes for weeks and are severely ill. In Brazil the latest strain has seen 50% of those in hospital being in younger age groups. And over half a million dead in a year n the US is worse than the flu…

M Courtney
Reply to  griff
March 15, 2021 2:54 am

Ironically, the economic damage of coping with Long Covid is going to exceed the economic damage of the lockdowns.

The debt will whittle away through inflation over a century and the lost jobs (in retail) were going anyway. And maybe the furlough has let people plan starting their dream business – some of which will work.

But the costs of ill health in a large number of people affect productivity over the long-term.

Yet the objections to lockdowns have been largely economic. Ironic.

Tom Abbott
Reply to  M Courtney
March 15, 2021 8:27 am

“Ironically, the economic damage of coping with Long Covid is going to exceed the economic damage of the lockdowns.”

The after-effects of the Wuhan virus may prove to be a very big deal. Depending on what study you cite, there are between 30 percent and 50 percent of recovered Wuhan virus patients, including those with only mild symptoms, who are still experiencing health problems months after the disease is gone from their bodies.

Will these after-effects be temporary or will they last a lifetime? We don’t know the anwser to this question.

I did read where a very small percentage of NFL football players had developed heart inflammation after being infected with the Wuhan virus. It was something like seven athletes with inflamation serious enough to be a problem.

Let’s hope the after effects are only temporary because they affect a large number of people (millions), and so many different areas of the human body.

The Wuhan virus story definitely has not all been written.

Drake
Reply to  Tom Abbott
March 15, 2021 9:40 am

I had shingles 4 years ago this spring. Luckily it was at my waist so did not effect my eyes. I still have discomfort on my left side on occasion, sometimes for days at a time.

Viruses have those types of effects. It is the China virus. what effect did the lockdowns have in reducing cases? Miniscule at best.

So those who got it have residual symptoms. Herd immunity is the only solution to the virus.

Now, what will be the residual effects of the different vaccines? Way to soon to tell, and, as to conspiracy theories, I don’t think the truth will ever be told.

If in the spring of 2020, billions of doses of hydroxychloroquine had been produced and distributed, we may have been done with this “pandemic” by July.

But of course then TRUMP! would have won the election and the pharmaceutical industry would not have made the BILLIONS that they have, much of which was passed on the democrat politicians, and those few reliable republicans. And don’t forget, they will be creating a new vaccine for new strains every China “flu” season FOREVER.

Reply to  griff
March 15, 2021 3:03 am

griff – By now you should understand that your claims have negative credibility – you have posted so many unsubstantiated falsehoods that even If you walked on water, it would be written off as surface tension.
Provide quality references or continue to be dis-believed.

Reply to  griff
March 15, 2021 6:51 am

Compare f.e. the numbers of Germany and Turkey.
Turkey has higher population, more cases and only around one third of death.
What is different in Turkey ?
They use from the first day of pandemy HCQ + AZ. – ’til now.
Following the data of Worldometer.

Editor
Reply to  Krishna Gans
March 15, 2021 8:09 am

Krishna

The average age of Turks is 32 the average age of Germs is 46. Life expectancy in Germany is also greater, so there are an awful lot more vulnerable elderly people in Germany, which is the exact category most susceptible to the virus

tonyb

Reply to  tonyb
March 15, 2021 8:54 am

Germany had several days with more than 1000 deaths / day, maximum was 1,254 on Dec 29th. – 2. wave

Turkeys highest rate was 259 on Dec 28th.
That’s a difference not only due to average age, even under consideration that the real deathrate maybe up to 25% higher, what widely is suspected, why ever.
What they do in Turkey, is to protect the old people, due to the structures of their families.

Also if you have a look at the numbers of “serious / critical” – the percentage is much lower (0.9%) than in Germany. (2-3%) but with a higher number of in total active cases, base of the percentage,.

Last edited 7 months ago by Krishna Gans
Drake
Reply to  tonyb
March 15, 2021 9:49 am

And what was the purpose of the lockdown? To protect the elderly and those with comorbities? No, it was to gain more power. If it was to protect the FEW, it would have been implemented in a totally different manner.

The lockdowns in Germany should have protected EVERYONE according to the “SCIENCE” but of course did not.

The “science” of the China virus response and the “science” of AGW response are the same type of “science”. Phony as hell.

Reply to  Drake
March 15, 2021 10:26 am

What will your answer tell me ?

Reply to  Krishna Gans
March 15, 2021 10:47 am

Forget my question, didn’t pay attention, sorry

Jeff in Calgary
Reply to  Krishna Gans
March 15, 2021 8:59 am

Turkey is also a warmer climate without a “flu season”.

Reply to  Jeff in Calgary
March 15, 2021 9:21 am

Brasil is known for it’s overall cold climate, isn’t it ? 😀

Peter
Reply to  Krishna Gans
March 17, 2021 5:57 am

It is about sun, not temperature. Check Manaus Brazil:
https://www.meteoblue.com/en/weather/historyclimate/climatemodelled/manaus_brazil_3663517
From December to May zero sunny days.
And it is correlating with Covid spread.

Drake
Reply to  Jeff in Calgary
March 15, 2021 9:52 am

Google, or DDG flu in Turkey, then repost when you have a clue.

Thank you for playing.

Reply to  Jeff in Calgary
March 15, 2021 11:08 am

Depending on the region you are looking Turkey isn’t only Mediterranean, in Eastern Turkey it’s Montainous with temperatures down to -43°C and snow cover, Anatolias temps go down to -25°C.with lot of snow too.

Gerald Machnee
Reply to  griff
March 15, 2021 4:22 pm

Once you are in ICU your chances are poor in many cases. Hydroxychloroquine and Ivermectin would have prevented that. The Vitamins noted by William Astley would have prevented many more illnesses and deaths.

michel
Reply to  TEWS_Pilot
March 15, 2021 2:56 am

No, this is quite wrong. Look at the UK hospitalization numbers for a clear view of the problem. This is the most useful indicator.

Daily summary | Coronavirus in the UK

Scissor
Reply to  michel
March 15, 2021 11:09 am

Patients admitted in the past week down 27%, good news.

Tests administered in the last 7 days up 62% and positives down 2%, that’s also a good trend (not the testing, the positives).

Cephus0
Reply to  Scissor
March 16, 2021 6:59 am

You are perhaps aware that the NH is now coming out of respiratory illness season?

George Tetley
Reply to  TEWS_Pilot
March 15, 2021 3:00 am

Tews
With idiots outnumbering sensibility what chance is there for a “normal existence” Oh , we also have;
Chit Not News

Fred Dombrise
Reply to  TEWS_Pilot
March 15, 2021 4:25 am

Good to see the knowledge and understanding of highly complex epidemiological statistics on this topic. https://ourworldindata.org/mortality-risk-covid#what-do-we-know-about-the-risk-of-dying-from-covid-19

It doesn't add up...
Reply to  TEWS_Pilot
March 15, 2021 5:10 am

It’s a rich country disease mostly.

https://datawrapper.dwcdn.net/9WwxR/2/

Drake
Reply to  It doesn't add up...
March 15, 2021 10:10 am

You are correct, it does not ad up.

Something is wrong with that chart. It shows over 1600 deaths per million for the US but 328 million divided by 534 thousand is around 630 per million. That would be below Germany, where it is shown as over twice Germany. and almost as high as the UK, a true disaster zone.

What’s up? Worldometer? I really don’t trust these bastards. A quick check of other countries shows whoever created that chart was full of chit.

Scissor
Reply to  Drake
March 15, 2021 11:23 am

You’re mixing up numerator and denominator.

328 m x 1600 deaths/m = 525,000 deaths and 534,000 deaths / 328 m = 1630 deaths / m, using 3 sig figs.

Richard Barraclough
Reply to  Drake
March 15, 2021 3:23 pm

No. It’s you who can’t add up.

534,000 divided by 328 (or 332 according to Worldometer) is just over 1600.

You’ve obviously got your long division upside down.

Denis
March 14, 2021 10:54 pm

“What can I say? The risk of side effects from the vaccine, if any, have to be weighed against the risk of contracting Covid. Even if there is a risk, which AstraZeneca denies, whatever the vaccine does to recipients, infection with the actual disease would likely be far worse. ”

How can you say that? You don’t know and no-one does. In fact all these vaccines are experimental with possible serious risks. My understanding is that normally it takes years to develop a vaccine known to be safe and that is not happening here. So what are we doing? Vaccinating an entire population against a virus that is no worse than the flu! Why?

I suggest you do more research as should everyone who may have concerns.

Derg
Reply to  Eric Worrall
March 15, 2021 3:26 am

Is Pfizer the only company working with Israel?

Cephus0
Reply to  Derg
March 15, 2021 4:14 am

Yes, pretty much I believe. The Israeli government did a “jabs for data” deal with Pfizer, thereby submitting their entire population to be lab rats in a huge experiment. I still cannot believe this stuff of nightmares is actually happening.

Reply to  Cephus0
March 15, 2021 6:55 am

There are juridical problems for Israel, as I read here in Germany.

Anshei Emet (People of Truth), a group against coronavirus vaccination, filed a suit against the Israeli government with the International Criminal Court (ICC) earlier this month, arguing that Israel’s administration of the coronavirus vaccine and policies to encourage vaccination are considered “crimes against humanity” according to the Nuremberg Code.

Source

Alex
Reply to  Derg
March 15, 2021 8:53 am

Pfizer has an exclusive contract with IL:
No other vaccines in IL
No negative information about Pfizer
All information from IL goes directly to Pfizer and only there
March 23 is the election day in IL

Scissor
Reply to  Eric Worrall
March 15, 2021 7:23 am

There seems to be some concern that the vaccines are driving emergence of mutant strains via viral escape. This guy’s argument sounds reasonable but perhaps premises and assumptions are not fully correct. His open letter is here: https://www.linkedin.com/feed/update/urn:li:activity:6776565863899242496/

David Guy-Johnson
Reply to  Denis
March 15, 2021 12:47 am

I suggest you do more research on the development of vaccines today and not 50 years ago

Derg
Reply to  David Guy-Johnson
March 15, 2021 3:27 am

50?

Are you sure about that number and no vaccines have been pulled since?

ozspeaksup
Reply to  Derg
March 15, 2021 4:51 am

swine flu vax in 70s? killed n harmed n was pulled
hand foot n mouth vax- kids get it instead
shingles vax giving it to people
measles vax giving it to kids(yes typed AS vax strain)
and polio vax caused huge numbers of serious adverse events sth africa india canada and usa in the last few yrs
need more examples?
bet theres more
oh yeah the HPV vax deaths paralysis and other nasties ongoing
hhm
and a supposed anti gut bug rotavirus type one given to homeless n poor in EU that killed as well
theres a reason they love trials in poor nations with lousy laws and open access

Last edited 7 months ago by ozspeaksup
It doesn't add up...
Reply to  Denis
March 15, 2021 5:33 am

There is a pretty massive medical trial in progress with tens of millions of volunteers – the sort of trial that is never otherwise conducted. So far the evidence is that the incidence of short term effects is limited mainly to short periods of feeling under the weather that are typical of many inoculations, and the incidence of more severe reactions is limited. Longer term reactions remain unknown.

Showing that the vaccine is responsible for an observed condition entails showing the pathway of cause. Which ingredients react with what elements in the body to cause the problem? What else causes that type of problem, and can it be eliminated from blame? Such proper enquiry may reveal that some people should not have the vaccine, while it remains perfectly safe for the rest of us.

It should be remembered that there is a lot of vaccine politics, designed to cover up dubious government decisions ranging from failure to procure supplies through granting immunity from liability. Also, the modern anti vaxx movement owes a lot to the forged paper published by The Lancet on the alleged link between MMR and autism – a fraud to rank alongside hockey sticks..

mcswelll
Reply to  Denis
March 15, 2021 6:32 am

“My understanding is that normally it used to take years to develop a vaccine known to be safe, before all the developments in biology, medicine and genetics over the last 30 years.” There, I fixed it for you!

Drake
Reply to  mcswelll
March 15, 2021 10:16 am

Don’t forget computer modeling!

Alex
March 14, 2021 11:22 pm

Looks like a vaccine war against each other.
AZ is not very efficient (just 60%) and apparently causes the blood clots.
The reports from Austria and Norway are quite trustworthy.
Young nurses from the same clinics get pneumoembolie just 10 days after AZ vaccination.
Are mRNA vaccines really better?
Just check the VAERS report here:
https://www.cdc.gov/vaccinesafety/ensuringsafety/monitoring/vaers/index.html
by far not all side effects are reported there, but still.
“death” stays in about 2% of side effects reported for Moderna/Pfizer

David Guy-Johnson
Reply to  Alex
March 15, 2021 12:47 am

UK info where 17 million have had the vaccine show no more cases of blood clots than what you’d expect to see in the population.

M Courtney
Reply to  David Guy-Johnson
March 15, 2021 2:57 am

Do you really think 17 million recorded examples are more persuasive than a rumour on the internet?
Don’t you realise that this is the post-enlightenment era?

Editor
Reply to  M Courtney
March 15, 2021 4:46 am

Its 23 million now of course and I did hear someone’s brothers Uncles postman say he had heard there were problems with the vaccine so it must be true.

tonyb

griff
Reply to  tonyb
March 15, 2021 8:01 am

Ah, that’s 23 million in UK vaccinated, but then some got the Pfizer vaccine… so 17 million AZ vaccinations

james Fosser
Reply to  tonyb
March 15, 2021 2:59 pm

One saw, two heard, many reacted.

Leo Smith
Reply to  David Guy-Johnson
March 15, 2021 7:16 pm

Indeed and the case and death rate is plummeting.
AZ is 85% effective at decreasing need for hospitalization and seems about 85% effective at stopping people dying.

Certainly hasn’t killed me.

Leo Smith
Reply to  David Guy-Johnson
March 15, 2021 7:18 pm

when you cant even type d e a t h in a thread about disease, you know the moderation algos have rebdered the site unusable

michel
Reply to  Alex
March 15, 2021 3:17 am

More like 80%+ effective. And no evidence of causing clots. There are 3,000 clots a month in the UK without any vaccine.

The Norwegians have found three cases after the shot and people think this is a reason for stopping the rollout!

Just look at the UK numbers. They clearly show that a combination of vaccination starting with the oldest, and also lockdown, will lower incidence, hospitalizations and deaths.

And there is no evidence of any ill effects.

Derg
Reply to  michel
March 15, 2021 3:28 am

None 😉

Alex
Reply to  michel
March 15, 2021 3:32 am

And there is no evidence of any ill effects.”
How you want to know that?
Any negative info about the vaccines is censored sharply.
The worldwide only reliable source about the side effects is the U.S. VAERS site.
You can easiliy search it.
There are 1,578 deaths after vaccination reported up to March 5th.
As a “side effect”.

Editor
Reply to  Alex
March 15, 2021 4:48 am

Alex

Our area has a lot of retirees and its a close community. We would certainly know on the rumour mill-quicker than the internet-if the tens of thousands vaccinated here had a problem

tonyb

dennisambler
Reply to  tonyb
March 15, 2021 5:07 am

Similar in my neck of the woods. No adverse reactions. Re Norway, correlation is not causation.

Alex
Reply to  tonyb
March 15, 2021 7:42 am

Well, the rate of severe adverse reactions is small, somewhere around 1/100,000
do you know 100,000 pals in your woods?
You might say, this is a small rate, but these are lives.

Editor
Reply to  Alex
March 15, 2021 8:58 am

So, you would advocate dropping the speed limit by 20mph to save lives? To close down fast food outlets to save lives from obesity and heart disease and put a tax on unhealthy foods. Ban alcohol?. The list goes on forever as to how lives could be saved..

It is a matter of the risk over the benefit

Our economy has been trashed and the life chances of our youngsters reduced , there are enormous mental health problems , millions unemployed, peoples finances destroyed, our freedoms trashed.

It is a matter of the risk over the benefit-vaccinations will save many lives and the side effects are completely unproven but fall within this notion of risk

tonyb

Leo Smith
Reply to  Alex
March 15, 2021 7:20 pm

Because I live in the UK, and know people in the medical profession. We dont all get our news off conspiracy blog sites and the MSM.

M Courtney
Reply to  Leo Smith
March 16, 2021 4:15 pm

Once upon a time WUWT was a sceptic site, not a conspiracy blog.
As you see from these comments, the sceptics are a small minority these days.
At least below the line.

Jeff in Calgary
Reply to  michel
March 15, 2021 9:08 am

As with many things, it could well be the case that the vaccine negatively reacts to existing undiagnosed untreated blood disorders. But that could also be said about broccoli. In medical biology, there are always so many unknowns it is very difficult to fully understand the data.

Drake
Reply to  Jeff in Calgary
March 15, 2021 10:32 am

But you can prioritize parameters in a model to get the answer you want. Dr. Mann can show you how. Understand, schmunderstand, we don’t need no stinking understanding!

Leo Smith
Reply to  Drake
March 15, 2021 7:27 pm

Indeed not, and the motive in all cases is the same. Power, politics and profit.

Leo Smith
Reply to  Jeff in Calgary
March 15, 2021 7:26 pm

It is very easy to compare blood clot case rates of those who have had the jab with those that haven’t. There is in fact a slight reduction in blood clot risk for those who have had the jab.

More people develop blood clots on long haul flights. Why have those not been banned?

Reply to  Alex
March 15, 2021 7:03 am

That may be a question of the vector used.
AZ use a virus causing apes common cold

Sputik, the Russian vaccine usesas vector two different human known adenovirus at first and second vaccination.

Gerald Machnee
Reply to  Alex
March 15, 2021 4:44 pm

From nofrakkingconsensus.com:

Who Died After Receiving COVID Vaccines? 966 post-vaccine deaths have been reported to the CDC.

comment image?resize=372%2C264&ssl=1
The United States began administering “emergency use” COVID-19 vaccines to its citizens in mid-December. The Centers for Disease Control (CDC) have an online database in which people are encouraged to report adverse vaccine reactions.
The database is updated every Friday, but lags by a week. Currently, therefore, it includes reports processed as of February 19th. During these first 10 weeks, the CDC has been advised of 966 post-vaccine deaths.

Geoff Larsen
March 14, 2021 11:28 pm

https://youtu.be/7rMvPe_FsDg

Watch the UK’s Dr John Campbell video from 7.45 on this issue with AstraZenca vaccine.

From a research paper, Epidemiology of Venous Thromboembolism..

Incident rate, per 100,000, per year 
Men: 130
Women: 120

So per month, in the general population we would expect around 10 incidents of thromboembolism, per 100,000

Or 300 instances per month in a population of 3,000,000.

The AstraZenica vaccine was approved by the EU on 29 Jan 21. Up to a few days ago ~ 3,000,000 in the EU had been vaccinated, in a little over 1 month, with 1 dose of the AstraZenica vaccine and 30 cases of Thromboembolism have been reported by individuals given the AstraZenica vaccine in the EU.

Far, far lower than what would have been expected, from a population of 3,000,000, based on the data above.

Editor
Reply to  Geoff Larsen
March 14, 2021 11:57 pm

“The Norwegian Medicines Agency said similar incidents had been reported in other European countries. While there was no proof of a link to the vaccine, anyone under 50 who felt unwell and developed large blue patches after vaccination should seek medical attention.”

In any population, especially the more vulnerable and the elderly, in the normal course of events there will be blood clots . There is no evidence that the ones experienced are anything to do with the vaccine or are anything out of the normal.

Its another wave of hysteria in the apparent belief that before covid no one ever died of anything

tonyb

Jeff in Calgary
Reply to  tonyb
March 15, 2021 9:11 am

Good point. The vaccinate the elderly first approach is vaccinating those already susceptible to clotting. This could fool an observer into thinking the clotting rate in those vaccinated is much higher than in the general population.

Everything is so nuanced.

John McCabe
Reply to  Geoff Larsen
March 15, 2021 1:49 am

Also AZ’s latest report claims the information shows the incidence of these side-effects following AZ vaccination is comparable to the other vaccines in circulation (no pun intended). Who else is looking at those comparisons? Seems like a load of mostly EU sheep following each other with no evidence.

Editor
Reply to  John McCabe
March 15, 2021 2:37 am

john

we saw that with the lockdown last March. Italy did so and everyone else followed. Now of course govts have to defend lockdowns as our salvation otherwise they are shown up for what they are-fear mongers who didn’t think it through.

We have painted ourselves into a corner and vaccinations are probably the only way out

tonyb

Jeff in Calgary
Reply to  tonyb
March 15, 2021 9:13 am

Because I am not concerned about my heath if I were to get COVID-19, I view the vaccine more as a “get back to normal” vaccine than anything else. However, it is now appearing like governments are wanting us to still wear masks and stuff even after being vaccinated; so not sure WTF is going on.

TonyG
Reply to  Jeff in Calgary
March 15, 2021 9:24 am

Kinda suggests it’s not all about the virus, doesn’t it?

Brian Jackson
Reply to  Geoff Larsen
March 15, 2021 2:59 am

brian.jackson10@talktalk.net
What about the incidence of blood clots on long haul flights that caused a panic a few years ago? Are they included? Or have they disappeared? Or was that another MSM induced panic?
Bj in UK.

Reply to  Brian Jackson
March 15, 2021 3:21 am

We’ve solved the problem of blood clots on long haul flights – nobody flies anymore.

Another success from the panic-mongers who brought you the Covid-19 full-Gulag lockdown and global warming / climate change hysteria.

Last edited 7 months ago by ALLAN MACRAE
Derg
Reply to  Brian Jackson
March 15, 2021 3:30 am

Oh great, a talk from someone who has hysteria over global warming…climate change…I mean climate extinction.

Carlo, Monte
Reply to  Brian Jackson
March 15, 2021 7:15 am

What about them, Brainiac?

Alex
Reply to  Geoff Larsen
March 15, 2021 10:28 pm

It is not some clot.
It is a very rare clot of sinus.
Plus heavily reduced number of blood platelets.
This happens one in a million per year.
Here, we have dozens of cases a few days after jab in young healthy persons.

gary
March 15, 2021 12:05 am

I’m deeply suspicious the the anti-AZ vaccine drive is to push is to the far worse mRNA gene therapies…..

David Guy-Johnson
Reply to  gary
March 15, 2021 12:48 am

You’re a prat then

Derg
Reply to  David Guy-Johnson
March 15, 2021 3:31 am

Pot?

John McCabe
Reply to  gary
March 15, 2021 1:59 am

I’m not sure I’d claim mRNA is “far worse” but, when you consider AZ’s vaccine:

1. will be not-for-profit until the end of the pandemic,
2. is easily transported and handled (Pfizer one has to be handled carefully as being even slightly rough with it can damage it)
3. can be kept in a normal fridge (Pfizer and Moderna need to be kept at -70°C)
4. shows comparable efficacy in “real-life” to other vaccines (who’ve claimed much higher efficacy rates)
5. Costs around $4 a dose (compared to the $25-$30 for Pfizer/Moderna)

You have to recognise that there is a lot at stake for Pfizer, Moderna and other manufacturers of expensive vaccines if AZ’s cheap one gets a strong and reliable foothold in the market.

ozspeaksup
Reply to  John McCabe
March 15, 2021 5:02 am

not for profit till june end 2021 or maybe later with discussions…
and goverments pretty much totally paid FOR it anyway so free my ass!!!

ozspeaksup
Reply to  gary
March 15, 2021 5:00 am

there sure is a huge rush to now promote those heavily
billygates is right in for it
of course the massive profits from them arent at all of interest to him…ha ha
a swag of “new vax made in 10 days” was the quote
another unmet need of cures for problems we DONT HAVE!

Vincent Causey
March 15, 2021 12:31 am

Everyone is missing the real problem. the Dutch vaccine expert Geert Vanden Bossche has just warned that mass vaccination during a pandemic is leading to more dangerous variants. The vaccine applies evolutionary selection pressure on the virus to escape the specific anti bodies.

But this process doesn’t end, as the more dangerous variants cycle back into other vaccinated hosts and mutate into yet more dangerous forms, and so on. It wasn’t a coincidence, for example, that the first three variants of concern came from the three countries where the original vaccine trials were held. Now more are coming out, primarily in countries which have had the largest vaccine roll outs. These strains could end up with the virulence of original SARS but with the infectiousness of SARS2, a truly terrifying prospect.

Josie
Reply to  Vincent Causey
March 15, 2021 1:57 am

Agree, TPTB just shoot from the hip. Sic.

M Courtney
Reply to  Vincent Causey
March 15, 2021 3:02 am

Or it could evolve to be less harmful and less virulent. All viruses evolve.

The vaccine provides a new pressure that the evolution must overcome – resistance to the vaccine. Without that the pressure will be to make the virus more contagious, as that is the most likely to replicate.

Vaccines aren’t new. We know what they do. And they have saved millions of lives.
These new vaccines are not proven to be more risky than any other approved vaccines.

Cephus0
Reply to  M Courtney
March 15, 2021 4:26 am

They are fundamentally different in nature and operation than traditional vaccines and are still in the experimental phase. And they are being literally forced or aggressively coerced on the entire population of the world. For a flu. I stand in frank astonishment that people are actually lining up for this.

mcswelll
Reply to  Cephus0
March 15, 2021 6:46 am
Leo Smith
Reply to  Cephus0
March 15, 2021 7:48 pm

Well that’s ignorance bigotry and anti-science for you isn’t it?

The problem is the little boy who cried wolf. They conned people over climate change so everyone thinks COVID is a con too. It isn’t.

Real scientists have worked on these vaccines, and good scientists.
These are genuine best efforts vaccines. They have not been shown to be unsafe in any way. They do not contain government chips to control your brain. They use the MSM and the conspiracy blog sites for that .

The trouble is if you don’t have a scientific education, when it comes to science it becomes a matter of who you believe.

I have a scientific education. I read the literature. I understand enough about vaccines and genetics to make a reasonably informed decision.

I took the AZ vaccine. I think I was a bit sleepy for a day or so. Overall I felt much better – probably because it meant an end to lockdown. UK case rates seem to be down and falling further.

There will always be ignorant selfish people who wont take any given vaccination, and who thereby provide a vector to spread disease.
Mass vaccination for polio, TB and small pox in the 1950s had eliminated smallpox, world wide, had reduced polio instances in the UK to approximately zero and had knocked TB out until rising 3rd world immigration re-introduced it.

Measles, mumps and rubella inceidences are way down, despite a claim that the MMR vaccine caused autism – another 3rd rate doctor with a book to sell and a conspiracy axe to grind.

‘fears about vaccination’ are in the same class as ‘fears about climate change’ In both cases the real underlying issue is not the science, its about profit power and politics.

But unless you learn the science, you wont be able to tell.

niceguy
Reply to  Leo Smith
March 17, 2021 6:10 pm

Which vaccine could reduce polio contaminations?

Vincent Causey
Reply to  M Courtney
March 15, 2021 7:30 am

Geert is pro vaccine. He said this vaccine is great – as a prophylaxis. In other words, it should be given before the pandemic arrives. Once in the midst of a pandemic however, he is saying without equivocation, that it selects for more dangerous variants. This is the difference between “this” time and all other times. All other times, when people are routinely vaccinated, whether for polio, mumps, rubella, diptheria, or when they go abroad and have a yellow fever jab, there is NOT a pandemic raging on. It is this fact that turns the vaccine from something that saves lives to being a weapon of mass destruction.

He is so concerned that he has written to heads of governments to stop the mass vaccine program. He has not said “this is what might happen,” he is saying this is what will happen, and in fact is happening now. In his own words, it is turning the world into “a gigantic laboratory for gain of function.”

Leo Smith
Reply to  Vincent Causey
March 15, 2021 7:56 pm

yeah, that’s how smallpox grew and mutated and became…extinct.
The optimal vector for a disease that wants to live is that it doesn’t kill people – it becomes less severe.
We know that if the R rate drops below 1, the disease will die out. All the vaccines have to do is to do that one thing.
Lots of people can construct scary scenarios and get themselves twitter time and be famous for fifty seconds.
All that matters is how many people are dying and the rate of infection. The vaccine is working at both.The risk of anything else is a risk we simply have to take anyway.
Risk free safe spaces for the snoflake generation only exist in the imaginations of those who sold you ‘clean renewable energy’ and ‘social justice’

Reply to  Vincent Causey
March 15, 2021 4:30 am

https://dryburgh.com/geert-vanden-bossche-open-letter-to-who-halt-all-covid-19-mass-vaccination/
 
·        Vanden Bossche – Vaccine Summit Ohio, March 2nd), keynote slides PDF, ‘Why should current Covid-19 vaccines not be used for mass vaccination during a pandemic?’
 
·        Vanden Bossche – ‘We must halt all ongoing Covid-19 mass vaccination campaigns as a temporary health benefit to the most vulnerable groups does not justify a public health disaster of international concern’, summary of the manuscript PDF, February 26th. Note “In our naïve and simplistic attempt to prevent the pandemic from running its natural course, we are in fact providing the beast with an even much better opportunity to escape host immunity than natural infection does.”
 
There is more in this link that is worth reading. My very accomplished physician friend made
a similar point to me in recent weeks – that the lockdown and masking actually encourages the development of virus variants, not just by extending the life of the virus (aka “flattening the curve”) but by killing off the less virulent forms of the virus through acquired immunity, thus applying evolutionary pressure towards the more virulent strains.
 
He and I get together a few times during the week and solve all the world’s problems, but then while we sleep the scoundrels and imbeciles who rule our societies go and screw it all up again.
 
Some think this government dysfunction is accidental, the result of colossal incompetence and stupidity. I submit that nobody, not even the Justin Trudeau’s and BloJo’s of this world can be that stupid for that long – and, like the fearless leaders of Zimbabwe and Venezuela, it is there intent to ruin our economies and then live like kings, looking down at all the poor peasants – the rest of us.

Reply to  ALLAN MACRAE
March 15, 2021 4:07 pm

typo: their intent

mcswelll
Reply to  Vincent Causey
March 15, 2021 6:43 am

The vaccine applies evolutionary selection pressure on the virus to escape the specific anti bodies.” No, vaccines don’t apply anything; they’re dumber than a bacteria, and that’s saying a lot.

As pointed out by others here, viruses mutate regardless of whether there are antibodies around, and at the same rate. And the mutated forms are not necessarily any more dangerous than the original, in fact some of them will be less dangerous, in the sense of causing milder symptoms. Other mutated forms will indeed be more dangerous, because they spread more easily, or because they’re more resistant to vaccine-caused immunity, or because they cause worse symptoms (or worse, some combination of these).

What the vaccine does is to reduce the *number* of viruses. Fewer viruses, fewer mutations, and therefore fewer dangerous strains. It’s that simple.

Vincent Causey
Reply to  mcswelll
March 15, 2021 7:41 am

Evolution = mutation + selection, not mutation alone. If you apply specific antibodies the virus will mutate to escape the antibodies – this is known as immune escape. The mutations will therefore be of a form which endows the virus with more resistance. If you look at the three main variants of concern that are said to be more dangerous than the original strain, they all come from the countries where the vaccine trials were originally carried out – UK, Brazil and South Africa. And that was when only about 100,000 people were given the vaccine.

It is likely within a couple of months there will be reports of more strains – likely from Israel, the US and UK – that are found to be spreading more rapidly, and that are not being stopped by the original vaccines.

mcswelll
Reply to  Vincent Causey
March 15, 2021 2:37 pm

Antibodies do NOT cause more mutations, their ONLY effect is via selection. My point was that if the incidence of the disease is greatly reduced by vaccination, then there is far less virus that can potentially mutate, and therefore selection has nothing to work with.

As for where the vaccine trials were carried out: Pfizer trials were also done in the US, Germany, Turkey and Argentina; the Moderna trials were (afaict, see https://clinicaltrials.gov/ct2/show/NCT04470427) carried out in the US; the J&J vaccine trials were conducted in the US, Brazil and South Africa. Add to these the trials of the Russian Sputnik V and the Chinese vaccines, which I’m guessing were carried out in those countries.

Will more variants come from the US and the UK? Doubtless, and also other countries that have had high rates of infection (Europe or Ecuador, for example). I would doubt Israel will be among those sources, but let’s come back in a couple months and find out.

GeoffM
Reply to  mcswelll
March 19, 2021 9:51 am

The new variants were from UK, Brazil, S Africa. AstraZeneca did it’s initial trials in the same countries. It started later trials in the US, Colombia, France and maybe 1 or 2 others. Fauci announced yesterday that there are new US variants.

Scissor
Reply to  mcswelll
March 15, 2021 7:47 am

It’s not as simple as you suggest. You’re correct that viruses mutate anyway, but the vaccines lead to different evolutionary pressures.

Typically, viruses mutate to become less virulent but apparently Dr. Bossche believes that the vaccines (he terms them prophylactic vaccines) being used now are not appropriate at this time.

Are his concerns valid? Fauci would say no just as you would apparently. Others are not so sure.

mcswelll
Reply to  Scissor
March 15, 2021 2:41 pm

It is not true that viruses mutate so as to become less virulent. They mutate *randomly*. The idea that widespread diseases or parasites tend to be less virulent (in animals and in humans) is due to the fact that a disease or parasite that wipes out, or nearly wipes out, its host no longer has any host, and therefore dies out. That is nowhere near happening with covid.

Another virus that has been infecting mammals for a long time is rabies, and it does not appear to be any less virulent today than it was a century or even a millennium ago.

Scissor
Reply to  Vincent Causey
March 15, 2021 7:28 am
David Guy-Johnson
March 15, 2021 12:44 am

UK info where 17 million have had the vaccine show no more cases of blood clots than what you’d expect to see in the population.

fretslider
March 15, 2021 1:00 am

Well it didn’t kill me

M Courtney
Reply to  fretslider
March 15, 2021 6:16 am

You say that but it’s just anecdotal evidence.
It’s not peer reviewed.
You might be dead really.

fretslider
Reply to  M Courtney
March 15, 2021 6:26 am

Ya think?

But can you persuade HMRC? (what the US might know as IRS)

That’s the real test.

Last edited 7 months ago by fretslider
Scissor
Reply to  fretslider
March 15, 2021 7:51 am

I find it disturbing that the possible role of CV vaccination on the death of Marvin Hagler is being scrubbed and omitted by news agencies.

M Courtney
Reply to  Scissor
March 15, 2021 9:16 am

Do you have any evidence of a link between CV vaccination and the death of Marvin Hagler?

Because if there is no evidence it is reasonable for respectable outlets to not report it.

Scissor
Reply to  M Courtney
March 15, 2021 10:14 am

I am not an investigative journalist. I have only heard the story of his friend linking his hospitalization to a CV vaccination.

If I were an investigative journalist, I would not denigrate those seeking answers. It seems that reporters now are labeling those who question the story as anti-vaxxers.

Instead, I would find out was is the truth. If he really had recently taken a vaccine and, if there seemed to be some association, I would report on details, such as what vaccine he had taken and what symptoms he had. I would not hide the fact that he had taken a vaccine if that were the case.

Doonman
Reply to  Scissor
March 15, 2021 11:39 am

No, you won’t. Because as you’ve already stated, you are not an investigative journalist. So stop saying what you would do because you already told us you won’t.

Scissor
Reply to  Doonman
March 15, 2021 12:45 pm

In making this hypothetical statement, I’m trying to convey that journalists today are less about discovering truth than they are about constructing a narrative. In addition, they even engage in hiding the truth against the narrative that they obviously promote.

Gerald Machnee
Reply to  Scissor
March 15, 2021 4:54 pm

Agreed. In Canada all the journalists want to do is report statistics. Not one that I wrote to asked any questions about Vitamin D, Zinc, or treatments that worked, i.e. HCQ and Ivermectin.

DonM
Reply to  M Courtney
March 15, 2021 2:57 pm

“Because if there is no evidence it is reasonable for respectable outlets to not report it.”

Is the converse true? If they report on stuff without evidence are they disrespectable?

Respectable outlets…? I guess they will be cease reporting on the connection between atmospheric CO2 and ‘extreme’ weather, CO2 as THE control knob, and and that Mann has a clue.

Respectable outlets … where?

As Scissor stated below, it is about the slant and the narrative that they can create. Pluses and thumbs up rule.

(Had Hagler died with COVID it would have been, and stayed, a top news story weather he died FROM it or not.)

Gerald Machnee
Reply to  DonM
March 15, 2021 4:56 pm

RE CO2. The problem is not about reporting about the “connection”, it is about asking serious questions about PROVING that CO2 causes warming. Ask about MEASUREMENTS.

Robert Bissett
Reply to  Scissor
March 15, 2021 11:57 am

Searching now ~noon PDT, seems he was vaccinated recently, was hospitalized and died of “natural causes”. No indication what exactly the cause was. Uniform chorus of denials that the vax could have had anything to do with his death. This is unlikely to change, I suspect.

Scissor
Reply to  Robert Bissett
March 15, 2021 1:16 pm

Good comment! Thanks.

DonM
Reply to  Scissor
March 17, 2021 3:52 pm

I hadn’t decided about being vaccinated up until yesterday.

I figured that Hagler & Hank Arron & others may have just been old anomalies, and problems with the vaccine reactions were few and far between.

But at this point in time I personally know (friends, relatives, acquaintances, relatives of friends/acquaintances) only 5 people that contracted Covid (one died).

I now personally know of 2 people that died with 24 hours of getting the second shot. The first was elderly and had a series of strokes. The second was in his early 40’s, felt crappy after the second shot (as per standard), got up in the middle of the night and sat on the couch and was found that way in the morning (no autopsy yet).

When 40 somethings,in good health, are affected like this I think I will pass for now.

NOTE: There were no news reports of these events …. As such, nothing to scrub (like Hagler).

Cherith
March 15, 2021 1:37 am

GERMANY: REINER FUELLMICH INTERVIEWING THE ISRAELI LAWYER TAMIR TURGAL ABOUT VACCINATING ISRAEL
video – 13 mins 34 secs

Alexy Scherbakoff
March 15, 2021 2:13 am

Maybe it’s just me, but I’m more interested in nailing the skirting in my wife’s study. Then I can think about either fixing the foundations or getting on with my project of making a toroidal (Toric) mirror from a piece of aluminium.

griff
Reply to  Alexy Scherbakoff
March 15, 2021 7:59 am

It would be nice not to be dead of a virus or seriously ill for weeks though, wouldn’t it?

Alexy Scherbakoff
Reply to  griff
March 15, 2021 2:23 pm

I live in a small town in Tasmania with a retirement village. No-one wears masks. No-one has had corona or died from it. No-one is in a panic about it. Life goes on. One has to have priorities and get on with life.

Gerald Machnee
Reply to  Alexy Scherbakoff
March 15, 2021 4:58 pm

Take 2,000 units of Vitamin D and some zinc.

Alexy Scherbakoff
Reply to  Gerald Machnee
March 15, 2021 6:16 pm

I do that. I don’t have comorbidities, either. I don’t worry myself about Arctic ice or climate change.

Jphn
March 15, 2021 2:31 am

The AstraZeneca vaccine was dubbed unreliable by its coomercial competitors, even before it was used.

Drug regulation is strange, to get approval you need scientific double blind rigour, to get banned you just need a bad press.

Derg
Reply to  Jphn
March 15, 2021 3:34 am

Hey you can have bad science too. Remember HCQ doesn’t work because they sprinkled HCQ on nearly dead patients.

niceguy
Reply to  Derg
March 17, 2021 5:53 pm

Then in UK they tried to mudrer people with 2.4 g of HCQ.
(paid for by Bill Gates)
And called that a national pride.

ozspeaksup
Reply to  Jphn
March 15, 2021 5:04 am

not double blind when the other vax is NOT for covid anyway is it
should be saline n vax

Pamela Matlack-Klein
March 15, 2021 2:46 am

I just finished watching this video, worth spending 20 minutes of your time. This doctor is pointing out to the Texas Senate that Covid is NOT being treated! Patients get sick and lay at home until they require hospitalization and only then are they admitted and treated. The goal of doctors should be to treat the patient before they are get to this point but it is not happening. He points out that there are numerous drugs available to treat the early symptoms and saying there is no cure is just wrong.

Scissor
Reply to  Pamela Matlack-Klein
March 15, 2021 8:46 am

Dr. Mullough is an unsung hero. The message he delivers is extremely important.

It’s infuriating that governments and media are not taking steps to promote treatments and worse are suppressing those which would save lives and reduce suffering. Governments and media, especially YouTube are complicit in this travesty.

Tom Abbott
Reply to  Pamela Matlack-Klein
March 15, 2021 8:50 am

Yes, we now have about a dozen different therapeutic drugs that can treat the Wuhan virus to one degree or another, and it is obvious that the sooner they are treated the better the outcome, yet our offical medical community leaders will not publicy recommend early treatment for the Wuhan virus.

It’s a scandal. A deadly scandal.

Scissor
Reply to  Tom Abbott
March 15, 2021 8:53 am

As you say, this is a scandal. They don’t even encourage people that are vitamin D deficient to take steps to remedy this.

Scissor
Reply to  Pamela Matlack-Klein
March 15, 2021 11:57 am

Here’s one article that is mentioned.

https://www.amjmed.com/article/S0002-9343(20)30673-2/fulltext

DaveW
Reply to  Pamela Matlack-Klein
March 15, 2021 2:08 pm

We live in interesting times don’t we? I see that tonyb’s hypothesis is a sort of avalanche of incompetence starting with a few early mistakes and now a giant snowball of CYA with irreversible momentum (sorry if I am misinterpreting you tonyb).

If you read much military history, you would know that aggressive and oblivious incompetence is not uncommon. I was recently reading how the US Navy refused to recognise torpedo failures early in WWII in the Pacific in spite of overwhelming evidence, until they failed to scuttle a damaged ship with numerous dud torpedos. Duh, even an admiral couldn’t ignore that. A rigidly inflexible hierarchy staffed with careerists who care more about cultivating higher-ups than wining battles seems to be a chronic problem in militaries and now we seem to have government medical bureaucracies similarly afflicted.

Maybe, but the monolithic suppression of any attempt to treat people for the disease in the West seems too orchestrated to be just incompetence.

Gerald Machnee
Reply to  Pamela Matlack-Klein
March 15, 2021 5:02 pm

Send them the following:
There are now over 200 studies mostly peer reviewed on HCQ, Ivermectin, Vitamin D, and Zinc:
https://c19study.com/
https://hcqmeta.com/

March 15, 2021 2:47 am

Anglophobes are all coming out of the woodwork.
Now the Netherlands joins the “Brits-are-the-new-Jews” club.
They daren’t kick the US so the kick the UK.

M Courtney
Reply to  Hatter Eggburn
March 15, 2021 3:06 am

Simpler than that.
The EU failed to organise their supply of vaccines. This is politically very unpopular.

The Netherlands is about to have an election. Failing to provide the vaccine is very bad for the Government.

So claiming that the vaccine isn’t worth having anyway is now very useful to the Government.

It’s all about domestic politics. Because that is what keeps politicians in their posts.

Cephus0
Reply to  Hatter Eggburn
March 15, 2021 4:32 am

The Jew are the new Jews. Their “government” is goose-stepping over the Nuremberg Code in their nice shiny new jack boots and the millions of Israelis who do not want or have serious concerns about this experimental “vaccine” are getting the yellow star treatment once again. It is appalling beyond belief.

Reply to  Cephus0
March 15, 2021 6:22 am

Well pretty much all of Israel and half of Britain have been vaccinated already. So if your horror stories about vaccines are even 1% real, we can expect Israelis and Brits to start dropping like flies. Pleasant thought, I’ll admit, but sadly I doubt it will happen.

This mass vaccination is a very good scientific test of how safe and effective vaccines are. Stay tuned. So far they’re looking very good. And the antivaxxers are looking stupider every passing day.

When the vaxxed are sunning themselves on the beaches and you’re still stuck sweating in your apartment, maybe rethink your grand theory of vaccines?

Tom Abbott
Reply to  Hatter Eggburn
March 15, 2021 8:52 am

“So if your horror stories about vaccines are even 1% real, we can expect Israelis and Brits to start dropping like flies. Pleasant thought, I’ll admit, but sadly I doubt it will happen.”

That’s a pleasant thought to you?

fretslider
Reply to  Tom Abbott
March 15, 2021 9:16 am

Must be the Mad Hatter.

John Dilks
Reply to  Hatter Eggburn
March 15, 2021 11:58 am

Who’s staying in their apartment? I’ve been going out where I want the whole time. I only wear my mask when I go to my Doctor, Pharmacist or the Casino. The Doctor and Pharmacist because I want to be treated. The Casino because I want to play. Any store that enforces the mask, does not get my business. I have no intention of taking a vaccine for a disease that has a 98%+ survival rate. I have taken a flu shot in years and have not had the Flu in 40 years.

niceguy
Reply to  Hatter Eggburn
March 17, 2021 5:48 pm

Do you somehow deny the explosion of MS in France following mass hep B vaccination?

michel
March 15, 2021 2:53 am

Yes, it is the corruption of public policy by the Precautionary Principle – actually invoked explicitly by one of the countries suspending AZ.

The argument is (as with climate) if there is even the slightest risk, we should immediately stop. In the case of climate, stop emitting.

As with Pascal. If there is even the slightest risk of eternal damnation from disbelief, we should believe.

As in all cases of application of the PP, its necessary to maintain that in this case for some reason standard cost benefit analysis illegitimate. In this particular case the only thing that matters is possible (not proven) risk.

On the scale that the UK has rolled this one out, if there were any problems of this sort there would be evidence by now. What have they done, something like 23 million in total, of which about 18 million or so must have been AZ?

This is public policy by hysteria. The PP is used to justify action whose effects are totally out of proportion either with

— the cost of the risks they eliminate
— the consequences of taking those actions
— the alternatives that could be taken to remedy those risks.

In the case of climate the argument goes, if the risk is the end of human civilization then stop now. In the case of clotting, the scale and cost of the risk is not mentioned because the evidence obviously would not justify the action being demanded.

Notice the extraordinary irrationality in the EU on this subject. First try and close the Irish border with the UK in the effort to prevent the UK getting what it had bought, and to keep if for use within the EU.

Then reverse this attempt.

Then declare that the vaccine they were trying to get is not effective, particularly not in over 65s.

Then reverse themselves on that, take huge shipments of it, and fail to use them.

Then find their member states are desperately trying to get the stuff from the US (as Italy is). Why they do not give Italy the huge German and French stockpiles that are just sitting there unused? There is probably some Precautionary reason, maybe crossing the Alps might end European civilization?

There is one nonsense factory on the Left Bank. There’s a much more dangerous infection of hysteria in Brussels, France and Germany, and its spread to Holland now.

Gerald the Mole
Reply to  michel
March 15, 2021 4:21 am

There are tow ways of handling the Covid-19 problem. One is to develop vaccines to reduce the risk of infection. The other is to improve treatment of those who have the disease. One method will sell more drugs than the other.

Reply to  Gerald the Mole
March 15, 2021 4:17 pm

There are several medications known, but not introduced everywhere. HCQ, Ivermectin to name 2 well known. And they are cheep.

Tired Old Nurse
March 15, 2021 3:24 am

‘ Even if there is a risk, which AstraZeneca denies, whatever the vaccine does to recipients, infection with the actual disease would likely be far worse.‘

I apologize that I don’t have the writing ability to describe his grotesque I feel that last sentence is. I work on Covid units. Covid kills people. I have had patients lose limbs and suffer strokes due to the disease. If ALL the vaccine does is cause people to stroke then that is acceptable to you?

Leo Smith
Reply to  Eric Worrall
March 15, 2021 8:04 pm

But there is no elevated risk. The incidence of blood cots is less in post vax patients than in the general population.
This is a commercial piece of FUD presumably linked to brown envelopes being passed from Pfizer to politicians.

niceguy
Reply to  Eric Worrall
March 17, 2021 5:46 pm

Rubella like measles is/was a common minor childhood disease.

Peta of Newark
March 15, 2021 4:04 am

A long time ago, I was railroaded into becoming a UK Blood Donor.
Once every 6 months, the donation service would arrive at my place of work at the time and ‘take blood’

They could see I had/have a phobia of needles/blood and for the first 2 or 3 times, a senior, very experienced nurse ‘did the biz’
Fine.

Then, on the fateful 4th occasion, a young nurse set upon me.
She couldn’t find my vein to save her life, no matter how much she prodded and poked in my arm.

Eventually she got a result

But over the next week half of my left arm, centred on the elbow, went black/blue and hurt like he11.
I never donated blood ever again.

Much later in life, occasioned by a TIA stroke, it was discovered that I have a blood clotting disorder. My blood, in common with about 1 or 2% of the population, clots MUCH more readily than it should.
Hence my stroke, a TIA caused by a blood clot, at age 45

There you have it..
Unskilled nurses stabbing people with very sharp needles where maybe 1 in 50 of those people have this clotting disorder

If I’d been 15 years older – that young nurse stood a very good chance of killing me.

When I was diagnosed via the new and expensive gene DNA test of the time, I was told that I was maybe in a group comprising 1% of the population
Depends where you look, some places now say 33% of people have it.

Does it explain healthy young folks dropping down dead after long-haul flights?

Crazy crazy thing though with me when they say ‘genetic’ or ‘inherited’
Despite being from a large family (my maternal grandma was one of 13 children), not one single ‘blood relative’ of mine had fallen foul of stroke, prior to when I ‘fell over one day’ without any obvious reason.

They broke the mould when they made me
😀

edit:
How to stop it, maybe.
Every day for at least a week prior to vaccination, take a shot-glass full of Omega 3 fish oil

Last edited 7 months ago by Peta of Newark
ozspeaksup
March 15, 2021 4:46 am

how did Aus manage to get the few thousand supposed covid cases?
try running the pcr at FORTY to FORTY FIVE cycles
why on gods green earth theyd run it so high when even 35 is pulling dodgy positives..
oh yeah fearmongering and control to shutdown etc

Ed Zuiderwijk
March 15, 2021 5:00 am

When many millions are being vaccinated you would expect rare side effects to show up. If this case of blood clotting is such connected with the vaccin that would suggest that somehow the viral surface protein which the vaccin emulates has an effect on clotting. There are medicines aplenty that can deal with it, as is done in IC patients. Good monitoring after getting the jab is at least part of the solution.

griff
Reply to  Ed Zuiderwijk
March 15, 2021 7:58 am

35 clotting cases in 17 million astra zeneca doses in over 8 weeks…

Leo Smith
Reply to  griff
March 15, 2021 8:06 pm

somewhat less than the rest of the population. Hey this vaccine reduces blood clots!

Derge
March 15, 2021 5:09 am

There is no SARS-CoV-2

It’s a regular season strain being rebranded as “Covid-19”.

More people in the U.S have died this year from the “Covid” vaccine than from firearms.

And my god would I not trust a single thing from CDC & WHO or anyone tasked and funded by them.

Big Pharma makes the MIC and Big Oil look like college start up NGOs. These people commit assassinations. And I am not being hyperbolic.
Christine Massey did some work trying to obtain records of SARS-CoV-2.

As of January 22, 2021 46 institutions and offices have responded to said requests. Every institution has failed to provide, or cite, even 1 record describing the actual isolation of any ‘SARS-COV-2’ from a patient sample by anyone, anywhere on the planet, ever.”

Here is a typical response to a Massey request, from the Ontario Ministry of Health. The response arrived after four months: “This is to inform you that no responsive records were located. A reasonable search of the ministry was conducted, and no responsive records were found. Dr. David C. Williams, Chief Medical Officer of Health, is responsible for this decision.”
Source: https://tinyurl.com/wuvmx9zu

The sheer propaganda and brainwashing through every levels of society frightens me more than as a 6yo watching Roddy Piper struggle in They Live after putting on the glasses.

Lastly- where’s all the dead homeless, eh?

fretslider
Reply to  Derge
March 15, 2021 5:37 am

More people in the U.S have died this year from the “Covid” vaccine than from firearms.

That I find hard to believe. In fact, it’s hilarious.

M Courtney
Reply to  fretslider
March 15, 2021 6:18 am

You would have thought people would have noticed, wouldn’t you?

fretslider
Reply to  M Courtney
March 15, 2021 6:23 am

Even now some people still amaze me with the ludicrous claims they make.

Probably as dense as a neutron star.

Last edited 7 months ago by fretslider
DonM
Reply to  M Courtney
March 17, 2021 4:03 pm

He’s exaggerating (for now).

But just wait six months & use the same logic as Covid cases to assign the death numbers.

Died with covid => Covid death

Died with vaccination => Vaccine death

Just have to wait six or eight months for the logic to kick in.

mcswelll
Reply to  Derge
March 15, 2021 6:59 am

I have not seen firearms deaths in the US for the months so far in 2021, but the number for the year of 2020 was over 41,000, or about 3400/ month. Assuming that rate continued for the first two and a half months of 2021, that would be about 8500. The number of deaths of vaccinated people in the US as of 8 March (including those vaccinated in 2020) is 1637 (https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2021-01-18/what-to-know-about-vaccine-related-deaths-allergies-quicktake, or see https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/vaccines/safety/adverse-events.html), which appears to be about the number of deaths that would be expected in that demographic without any vaccination (and without covid, I think).

So no, your own propaganda and brainwashing are the problem.

Gerald Machnee
Reply to  mcswelll
March 15, 2021 5:07 pm

Have you checked Chicago? It was ignored even when they had the “peaceful marches” last year.

griff
Reply to  Derge
March 15, 2021 7:57 am

That is utterly untrue.

There is almost no flu in the UK this winter… because of the roll out of record levels of a vaccine effective against current flu strains. The excess death rate in the UK – deaths over the 5 year average went up 12% in 2020 and the excess matches the reported covid deaths

Editor
Reply to  griff
March 15, 2021 9:08 am

griff

In the UK according to the ONS, the excess deaths in every year prior to 2011 to the start of records in 1854, was greater than 2020, when adjusted for population size etc.

tonyb

M Courtney
Reply to  griff
March 15, 2021 9:20 am

The low level of flu is also because the Covid rules (handwashing, isolation, masks) help prevent spread of flu too.

niceguy
Reply to  griff
March 17, 2021 5:44 pm

Please provide evidence the flu vaccine is ever effective.

Jeff Meyer
Reply to  Derge
March 15, 2021 8:15 am

Not allowed to up vote this??? Same with some other post….. Could not up or down vote?
What gives???

Reply to  Derge
March 15, 2021 10:52 am

There is no SARS-CoV-2

It’s a regular season strain being rebranded as “Covid-19”.

This antivaxxer flat-earth nonsense is an embarrassment to WUWT and maybe that’s your false flag mission. Or maybe not.

If this is a flu season like any other then why the unprecedented demand for respirators and intensive care beds? Denying that is the same as denying the curvature of the earth.

Covid is similar to flu in some respects but the “sharp tail” of very severe and prolonged illness in a small percent of sufferers is unique to covid19. A small percentage multiplied by a large population is sufficient to overwhelm hospital ICU capacity. That doesn’t happen with seasonal flu. And you know it.

Leo Smith
Reply to  Hatter Eggburn
March 15, 2021 8:17 pm

This antivaxxer flat-earth nonsense is an embarrassment to WUWT and maybe that’s your false flag mission. Or maybe not.

#Yeah, I am amazed, saddened and disappointed by the level of anti-science displayed here. griff – who is wrong about everything to do with climate change is making reasonable points and is being downvoted.
When my own doctor tells me how many people in my own village have died and or been hospitalized with this, when my nephew in london tells me of his wifes parents having lost three friends to this disease, i get a bit angry when I am assured by people here that ist ‘just the flu’ – it isnt of course, its nearer a cold in nature. But a potentially lethal one.

And then when we get a nice bit of FUD that is identical to climate change FUD, because its ‘anti science’ people here immediately believe it.

What happened to scepticism? Why would people be dissing a vaccine, at government level? Why do governments love climate science?

In both case the dame issues are in play. Power, politics and profit.

And WUWT has fallen for it.

niceguy
Reply to  Leo Smith
March 17, 2021 5:43 pm

These dead people, how were they treated?

niceguy
Reply to  Hatter Eggburn
March 17, 2021 5:42 pm

why the unprecedented demand for respirators and intensive care beds?”

Because for the first time in history, doctors who treat patients are condemned and threatened and the State tells people to not be treated.
Duh.

You really suck at medicine. Stay with looking at the curvature of the Earth.

Sebastian Magee
March 15, 2021 5:33 am

Far worse than what, a mild flu that is to be expected if you are under 50?

No, the side effects, whether the blood clods are part of them or not, are almost certainly worse than the illness if you are under 50. Other issue is for the elder.

griff
Reply to  Sebastian Magee
March 15, 2021 7:55 am

Far, far worse than even serious flu. It is more than twice as infectious and has 3 times the mortality rate. There are tens of thousands in the UK only alive thanks to younger immune systems and weeks of hospital care.

Reply to  griff
March 15, 2021 8:10 am

Different treatments, differen outcomes. Look at Turky, see my comment above.

Leo Smith
Reply to  griff
March 15, 2021 8:19 pm

Griff in this case is telling the truth.
Don’t downvote him just because he is wrong on climate change

john K. Sutherland.
March 15, 2021 6:10 am

You mean, that perhaps my prime minister’s bumbling ineptitude may have benefitted us poor Canadians?

PaulH
March 15, 2021 6:29 am

This article in the Epoch Times documents the surprisingly high percentage of frontline healthcare workers who are declining the vaccine. (Not paywalled, but free email registration is required to read the entire article.)

“Opinion: The Biggest COVID-19 Vaccine Skeptics? Frontline Health Care Workers”

https://www.theepochtimes.com/the-biggest-covid-19-vaccine-skeptics-frontline-health-care-workers_3724145.html

Perhaps the frontline workers have a better understanding of the real impact of CV-19 than the politicians and healthcare bureaucrats?

griff
Reply to  PaulH
March 15, 2021 7:54 am

The Epoch Times is a far-right international multi-language newspaper and media company affiliated with the Falun Gong new religious movement… it is utterly unreliable and a purveyor of fake news.

Reply to  griff
March 15, 2021 8:08 am

Read the message or the source ?

Gerald Machnee
Reply to  griff
March 15, 2021 5:11 pm

It cannot be worse than CNN.

Leo Smith
Reply to  PaulH
March 15, 2021 8:21 pm

Statistics show that the number of healthcare workers declining the vaccine in he UK is the same as in the general population and indeed is confined to te non-medical staff – admin and secretarial staff – not the nurses and doctors and clinical technicians. Its another piece of spin.

Enginer01
March 15, 2021 6:36 am

There is a strong undercurrent in the alternative media that the current vaccines are leading to an increase in SARS-CoV2 variants because they protect (???) the user but allow the patient to spread the virus further, increasing the risk of un-treatable variants.

India, which has a much lower Covid-19 case rate and death rate than the smaller US, actively promotes alternatie treatments like HCQ and ivermectin.

https://lmtribune.com/opinion/what-you-don-t-know-about-covid-19-vaccines-can-hurt-you/article_75816030-7561-11eb-8f56-73f898a170d7.html

Reply to  Enginer01
March 15, 2021 7:27 am

Eng
Covid new variants can emerge during long Covid19 infections as the result of a ee were protracted “fight” between the immune system and the evolving virus. In the UK they found that up to 50 strains of covid19 appeared with a single patient during a months-long illness. This is the scenario that created the “Kent” B117 covid19 strain that as the fastest-spreading is steadily becoming the dominant strain worldwide (e.g. responsible for Italy’s new peak and lockdown)..

Peter
Reply to  Hatter Eggburn
March 17, 2021 9:03 am

Yep front seat from Slovakia and Czech Republic, currently we are getting off the peak. “British” strain is around 2 times more infectious and 2 times more deadly than previous “Wuhan” strain. This strain jettisoned us to first places in deaths per million per week.
Prevalence of “British” strain was tested as 90%.
Other European countries as Germany, Austria, Hungary, Poland, Italy are just taking off, so let’s see.
Worldwide countries can expect new, stronger wave coming with “British” strain spread.

JEHILL
March 15, 2021 8:26 am

What can I say? The risk of side effects from the vaccine, if any, have to be weighed against the risk of contracting Covid. Even if there is a risk, which AstraZeneca denies, whatever the vaccine does to recipients, infection with the actual disease would likely be far worse.

I had CCP. I lived through it. My brother lived through. We have so far not had any of these issues. We also did not go to the ICU. Perhaps that is the common denominator; POC protocols.

Both are unknowns. But likely have some % mortality rates. But I will leave yaal with this..

Just because all these organizations say the AZ “vaccine” is safe and does not cause hemorrhaging brain or otherwise…

For starters it is new injectionable formulation – they cannot possibly know that with verifiable certainty.

2nd – did any of these people have hemorrhaging/clotting episodes prior to the injection? If you make one change a person and get a new outcome then the new thing must be under scrutiny…

What do all these particular humans have in common at the biochemical, Physiological and genetic level?

To dismiss without invesigation the occurrences is immoral, unethical and borders on evilness. Also not legal.

Now the actual requirements per the FDA guidelines is that all drug complaints are to be investigated as if the thing you just injected was the cause. I know this because I have fielded customer and patient complaints directly, had to be involved in reporting and investigation. I have made, directly human injectable products. Radioactive sugar water FDG – sugar a molecule that your has body has had millions of years evolutionary experience processing. Your body even knows how to make glucose from your dietary fat and protein intake. There are new molecules in these “vaccines” that your body may have no evolutionarily experience in processing. Or the mRNA is rewriting a different line of DNA for these particular humans.

To blindly follow and accept a drug company’s or governmental agency’s word is special kind of stupid, confirmation Bias, confirmation prejudice, Cognitive Dissonance.

How often have they been wrong? How many drugs has the FDA approved and found to be not only bad but, mass murderlying bad? The US FDA has been better at killing people than the US Military through most of the 20th century.

Alba
March 15, 2021 8:27 am

As Germany becomes the ninth country to suspend use of the AstraZeneca jab, the Deputy Chair of the Joint Committee on Vaccination and Immunisation (JCVI), Professor Anthony Harden, has hit back at claims that the vaccine increases risk of blood clotting today, saying ‘We’ve given 11 million doses here and there’s no evidence of increased risk of blood clots’. 

The World Health Organisation (WHO), the European Medicines Agency (EMA) and the Medicines and Healthcare products Regulatory Agency (MHRA) have all made it clear there is no link between the vaccine and blood clotting, and there is no credible reason to withhold the jab. 

 Of course, this isn’t the first time other countries have invented problems with the Oxford jab out of thin air.

https://order-order.com/2021/03/15/jcvi-dismisses-baseless-vaccine-blood-clot-claims/

michel
Reply to  Alba
March 15, 2021 9:18 am

It seems really crazy. None of them have given any evidence to show that there is any higher incidence among those who have got the vaccine than yu would expect if they had not. The only numbers given are tiny numbers of individual cases out of the millions vaccinated.

Its like we have thrown out the concept of evidence and people are just making policy on the hoof in the form of gut feels.

There are lots of other examples where this same kind of thing is going on – conclusions and actions which are not justified by any kind of evidential reasoning. Very worrying.

Leo Smith
Reply to  michel
March 15, 2021 8:37 pm

This is nothing to do with science. The EU has completely failed to arrive at a coherent vaccine policy, and its looking for a face save. The ‘precautionary principle’ that says ‘in any doubt do nothing’ is ingrained in EU law. The German/American Pfizer vaccine is ten times the price, and is fragile and difficult to use, And there isn’t enough of it.
What can they do? tell their citizens they have made an utter mess? No. find a ‘problem’ with the AZ vaccine. To justify not giving it, so to hide the fact they haven’t got enough people or shots to do the program anyway.
As Jean Claude Juncker. ex-president of the EU famously said…”When you are in trouble, you just have to lie”.
You cannot understand what is going on here unless you understand EU politics, Brexit, and the power of Big Pharma to control a part of the medical profession to get it to say what it wants…

British vaccine Bad. German vaccine Good.
British government stopping people in EU getting vaccine. British government letting people in EU get British vaccine, but it’s dangerous.
Or it doesn’t work.

Meanwhile Britain is the highest vaccinated country in Europe, and it seems to be working. Boris Johnson’s party high in the polls.

In Europe, political parties against the EU are gaining ground.

Go figure.

March 15, 2021 8:58 am

Germany just suspended the vaccination with AZ.

PaulH
Reply to  Krishna Gans
March 15, 2021 9:10 am

Add France and Italy to the list of countries suspending use of the AZ vaccine.

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/global-health/science-and-disease/coronavirus-uk-cases-news-update-deaths-vaccine-latest-test/

M Courtney
Reply to  Krishna Gans
March 15, 2021 9:24 am

They have to wait for the EU regulator to make the ruling. So many other countries have stopped already. Lack of understanding of statistics combined with a superstitious dread of the new.
It is not the EU’s finest hour.

Robert of Texas
March 15, 2021 9:01 am

I can see four possibilities:
1) It is a newly identified risk of the specific vaccine
2) It is a newly identified risk of any of the vaccines (or at least more than one)
3) It is a problem with a batch of the vaccine
4) It is unrelated to the vaccine

It would seem likely that an increase in brain hemorrhage would have been observed by now if it were all the vaccines. It seems likely it should have been observed it it were only the Astra Zeneca vaccine itself.

It could be something wrong with a batch given all the pressure to produce the vaccine. Or possibly something specific people are taking already that interacts with the vaccine.

It is most likely unrelated. Just like matching up certain kinds of cancer to the proximity of power lines turned out to be bad use of statistical methods, this could also just be seeing what people are already biased against.

I however have no problem with a short suspension – it’s important to get this right so taking time to look closely at the issue is prudent.

Reply to  Robert of Texas
March 15, 2021 9:25 am

Not asked ’til now is the production source of the vaccine, as there are several.

Richard M
March 15, 2021 9:17 am

Side effects are a risk factor that everyone should consider before getting the vaccine. I had some unusual side effects after getting my first shot of the Pfizer vaccine. As a result I have canceled my 2nd dose. Will wait and see if the side effect goes away.

I suspect I developed a mild case of myocarditis. This problem has also been reported among those who have contracted covid 19. My evidence is a very slight pressure in my chest along with some strange changes in my smartwatch fitness parameters.

My already low resting heart rate dropped even more (52 to 47) and my oxygen volume maximum during a workout dropped from above average (39) to below average (27) right after the shot.

mcswelll
Reply to  Richard M
March 16, 2021 2:57 pm

If we’re into anecdotes here, I got my first Pfizer shot yesterday, about 1 PM, and at 1 PM today went on an hour and a half trail run. Felt as well as I ever do during this run (apart from slight tenderness in the shoulder they injected).

M Courtney
Reply to  Richard M
March 16, 2021 4:27 pm

Antibodies take about a week at least to be formed.
By “right after” do you mean ” a weeks or so later”?

michel
March 15, 2021 9:30 am

Good piece by Spiegelhalter here:

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2021/mar/15/evidence-oxford-vaccine-blood-clots-data-causal-links

Show us the numbers!

Now the claim is apparently that they are seeing more cases of an unusual kind of clotting syndrome than would be expected normally. Maybe that is true, lets see the numbers though. How unusually high is this sydrome, considering the target population?

Reply to  michel
March 15, 2021 10:49 am

It’s the usual way to spread fear for easy and “better” gouvernement.

March 15, 2021 10:58 am

I have to say that I’m on the side of Griff in this argument. Covid and it’s severe pneumonia make it very much distinct from regular flu. The occupancy of hospital intensive care beds shows this clearly.

Do you think that hundreds of thousands of hospital staff worldwide are just pretending to be overwhelmed by an unprecedented demand for respiratory intensive care?

Did I miss the memo that if you’re sceptical about climate alarmism, you have to be an antivaxxer as well? Well count me out.

michel
Reply to  Hatter Eggburn
March 15, 2021 1:35 pm

Yes, the hospital admission and ICU numbers are indeed the key indicator. And what they are showing is obvious.

Notanacademic
Reply to  Hatter Eggburn
March 15, 2021 4:42 pm

“The occupancy of hospital intensive care beds shows this clearly”

What does the lack of occupancy of the nightingale intensive care beds show?

M Courtney
Reply to  Notanacademic
March 16, 2021 4:33 pm

What does the lack of occupancy of the nightingale intensive care beds show?

In the UK it shows that we have not recruited enough nurses to staff them.

So we shipped the sick back to nursing homes instead. And got the highest death rate in Europe.

Last edited 7 months ago by M Courtney
JEHILL
Reply to  Hatter Eggburn
March 15, 2021 5:53 pm

You should never be with Griff on anything….

Notwithstanding that both myself and brother had it. He brought it home. The 13 people we know directly none were hospitalized. The POC protocols matter. We know from several States in the USA POC protocols they seemingly damn near had a protocol by designed to produce a specific outcome.

niceguy
Reply to  Hatter Eggburn
March 16, 2021 3:25 pm

Covid and it’s severe pneumonia make it very much distinct from regular flu”

Yes and the diff is political – mostly anti populism.
Populism apparently means

  • treat infectious diseases before it’s too late,
  • don’t stop treating just to enroll everybody in a trial,
  • don’t stop treating because there is no official protocol,
  • don’t wait for a PCR test,
  • don’t stop medical care until you have perfect data (which will be irrelevant anyway due to “variants”,
  • don’t focus only on RCT,
  • do what medicine did for centuries
  • do what was proven to work before mass vaccination and before pro-vaxxers stole the merit of regular care against infectious diseases, pretending vaccines have an effect decades before they are invented
michel
March 15, 2021 10:59 am

This is what the Telegraph says today:

_______________________________

According to the charity Thrombosis UK, up to one in 1,000 people each year will experience a dangerous blood clot in a vein, known as a venous thrombosis. That means about 66,000 people in Britain might be expected to suffer a blood clot annually – or 1,269 a week.

According to AstraZeneca, there have been 15 events of deep vein thrombosis (DVT) and 22 events of pulmonary embolism (PE) reported among those given the vaccine so far across the EU and UK, based cases up to March 8. 

The company estimates that 17 million AstraZeneca vaccines have been delivered in that time. That means that the risk of suffering from DVT or a PE after vaccination is 37 in 17 million, or roughly one in 460,000. 

At the current prevalence rate, in a population of 17 million we might expect 326 cases to naturally show up in the week following a vaccine, so 37 starts to look very low. 

The National Institute for Health and Care Excellence (Nice) estimates the risk of a blood clot is even higher – around one in 500 – meaning that even more cases would be expected. 

Even if all 37 cases were linked to the vaccine – which is highly unlikely – the risk is still far lower than that of dying from coronavirus, which has an infection fatality rate of between 0.5 and one per cent.

Reply to  michel
March 15, 2021 11:42 am

So they’ve proved that the AZ vaccine is a cure for thrombosis.

michel
Reply to  Hatter Eggburn
March 15, 2021 1:31 pm

Well, the numbers speak for themselves. There have only been 37 post vaccine cases recorded. The usual incidence would lead to over 300 with no vaccine. So something does not add up.

Is there miscounting or mis-estimating?

I cannot believe the estimates of one per 500 or 1,000 are wrong – they predate the pandemic, they come from two independent sources, one a specialist charity, one which is the UK national adviser on clinical practice and drug purchases for the nationalized health service.

I also find it hard to believe that the Europeans are failing to report or catch all the clotting problems in their vaccinated group, so I assume there really have been only 37 cases.

I find it hard to believe the vaccine prevents clotting disorders, there’s no obvious mechanism this might happen.

But what we can conclude is that there is at the very least no evidence that it raises the risk, and that what needs investigation is whether it lowers it, unlikely as that may seem a priori.

As to policy, we are left with only one explanation of the policy decisions: hysterical incompetence. Maybe someone can think of some other way this makes any kind of sense. I cannot.

Its what you get when the people occupying your policy making positions are unelected Enarques. They have selected people to run the government of the EU whose only qualification is having passed competitive examinations, and got along with their superiors, and who have never been accountable, either to a Board of Directors, an electorate or customers.

Johnson, say what you like about him, found a woman who knew venture capital and the drug industry, and despite her having zero political experience he appointed her, turned her loose, and backed her all the way, and she delivered. The contrast with von der Leyen is striking.

The results again speak for themselves. In the UK 30% of the population are vaccinated versus 8-10% in the EU, deaths, UK hospitalizations and infections are falling. Thanks to the above lady they have vaccine supplies coming out of their ears and are actually talking about giving the old a third booster in the Fall. Meanwhile Brussels only seems to reverse itself every couple of days and do anything but focus on solving the problem.

M Courtney
Reply to  michel
March 16, 2021 4:38 pm

Evidence shows you are100% right.

Sadly Dido Harding and Dom ‘Eye-Test’ Cummings shows that this was luck, not judgement.

GeoffM
Reply to  michel
March 18, 2021 5:23 am

The lack of people flying may have an impact on thrombosis numbers, or maybe not.

Leo Smith
Reply to  Hatter Eggburn
March 15, 2021 8:40 pm

Well they certainly have shown no correlation between it and thrombosis.

Stevek
Reply to  michel
March 15, 2021 3:05 pm

At some point the risk of dying from an auto accident while driving to get the vaccine outweighs the risk of death from the vaccine itself.

Notanacademic
March 15, 2021 1:09 pm

I am just an average Joe. I am trying to make sense of this pandemic. My wife has an autoimmune disorder. She has had covid (apparently) got over it without to much trouble. Headlines from various outlets said don’t have the vaccine if you have autoimmune disorders, then our GP contacts her saying she should have the vaccine because she has an autoimmune disorder? The PCR tests with a CT of 45 are useless. A survival rate of 99.97%, no distinction between those who die of covid and those who die with it, effective treatments used in India, Peru and other countries but not allowed in others. In 2008 (I think) the WHO changed the criteria for what is considered a pandemic. I am not an anti vaxxer but with all this confusion I don’t want to be part of a global experiment and I certainly don’t want my wife to be. It seems an awful lot of NHS worker’s agree with me and have refused the vaccine I presume they for the most part would know better than me.

Last edited 7 months ago by Notanacademic
Leo Smith
Reply to  Notanacademic
March 15, 2021 8:43 pm

well I have autoimmune disorders. Asthma principally. I had the jab – AZ. My asthma seems better…I had less side effects than I got from last years flu jab.
Anyway I take aspirin as an anti-clot anyway because of heart artery operations.

whiten
March 15, 2021 1:09 pm

Eric Worrall.

You are not simply just a man, you are a grownup man, even more, an old man,
with experience and knowledge, also very much to be considered as a smart intelligent learned man, in the old age… of your age… Eric.

But still Eric, Eric Worrall, do you remember, really remember your own mother telling you when you were just a young “pappy”,
that you shall never ever play with fire?!

Do you remember or not that advice of your own mother, Eric?

I do not think you actually do!
do you!!!

Not expecting much of a reply, old smart failed Eric…
As you specifically just a smart intelligible learned flexible old provocatuer…

Please make my day and try to prove me wrong in your case,
old dog whistler!

cheers

DaveW
March 15, 2021 1:12 pm

Call me skeptical (or cynical, or both), but these questions come up when I see reports like this:

How many competing vaccine companies are out there?

How many legacy media organisations are interested reporting objective information without a political or paid-for spin?

Are there any western health authorities that are not controlled by pharmacological interests?

With or without covid, laying around in a hospital for weeks or months is conducive to developing blood clots. That is why (and I say this from a non-covid experience) such patients are stabbed with heparin needles daily. That didn’t save me from a subsequent pulmonary embolism, but it was a small one and I survived.

As an Australian who has had a pulmonary embolism in the past and is seemingly doomed to AstraZeneca in the future, I can not help but be interested in these reports. I would like to believe that the Scandinavian health authorities in this report are reliable (and I know that no one should trust WHO), but I do wonder how these reports relate to recent blockages of shipping the AZ vaccine to Australia.

Anyway, interesting, very interesting.

March 15, 2021 2:02 pm

In a discussion with my physician I pointed out that the weighing of risks was not the dire consequences of Covid vs potential damage from the vaccine. It was the risk of contracting the virus. At age 90 I want to see more data on the experiences of superannuated folks who take the various vaccines. I see some concern wrt blood clots with AstraZenica vaccine.

Leo Smith
Reply to  JimB
March 15, 2021 8:47 pm

The chief concern is that the AZ vaccine is damaging Big Pharma profits, and the EU’s war on Britain’s audacity in giving them the finger.

niceguy
March 15, 2021 4:15 pm

More provax propaganda even a 11 years old wouldn’t accept…

michel
March 16, 2021 2:44 am

I can hardly believe what I am reading today. The Italians appear to be contemplating a manslaughter prosecution following the death of one person after they received a vaccination.

You can imagine that if he was in a super high risk group, made it clear to the staff, and they went ahead regardless without taking any precaution, that might be a case of reckless misconduct. If for instance he had a history of extreme allergy, told them, they went ahead contrary to manufacturer’s guidelines, and he went into massive shock immediately.

But there is no suggestion of anything like this in the press accounts I have seen. Its just, here is a death, lets look at manslaughter. Not, we have to investigate every possible bad outcome, which of course we should. No, prosecute at once.

This is real craziness. EU governments along with Brussels seem to have lost all connection to evidence and reality.

Steven hartles
March 16, 2021 3:42 am

Interesting how European countries, with a completely failed vaccine program is finding all these issues with a vaccine they have very little of. Meanwhile the EU in Brussels that has taken most of the flak say it’s safe. Political carreers are on the line here, why not blame the vaccine that you don’t have to cover your failings and lock down Europe for the third time.

March 16, 2021 5:27 am

At least one thing is clear from this whole AZ vaccine episode. For Europe and much of the rest of the world, the British are the new Jews. The proxies to kick when they can’t kick America. Britain justifiably today announced a 40% increase in its nuclear warhead stockpile. Maybe those will cause blood clots?

Alba
March 16, 2021 8:03 am

From The Spectator:
Far from subsiding, as it seemed to be doing last week, the European war over the AstraZeneca vaccine has intensified. Over the past few weeks EU leaders have swung from accusing the company – and Britain – of hoarding the vaccine and failing to supply it to EU countries, to claiming that it is ineffective, back to accusing us of hoarding it again. But the decision by several European countries to suspend rollout of the vaccine over fears of blood clots is the most serious challenge yet.
  
This time, however, the blame cannot be laid at the door of the EU, as the European Medicines Agency continues to declare the vaccine to be safe and has said that any negative side-effects are outweighed by the benefits. Individual European countries (and non-EU Norway and Iceland) have made the decision themselves.
 
The fears over blood clots have been largely dismissed in Britain – according to Professor Anthony Harnden of the Joint Committee on Vaccination and Immunisation there has been no higher incidence of the condition among people who have been vaccinated than among the general population (allowing for such things as age and health conditions). However, Anders Tegnell, head of Sweden’s Public Health Agency, has suggested it isn’t so much fears of blood clots which have caused his country to suspend use of the AstraZeneca vaccine but another blood condition. His comments reported in the Swedish newspaper Svenska Dagbladet reveal the agency is more worried about a condition which causes bleeding – and which has been detected in ten to 20 cases across Europe, with a temporal link to the AstraZeneca vaccine.

Should we be worried? Many millions have been vaccinated in Britain alone and only a handful of cases have come to light, which suggests that if there are any real risks, they must be tiny compared with the threat that Covid-19 poses to the population. Given that the EU has so far administered 6.9 million doses of the AstraZeneca vaccine, Tegnell’s figures suggest that the harmful side-effect he describes is not more prevalent than around three in every million vaccinations. By contrast, Sweden has so far suffered 1,300 deaths per million from Covid-19.

But if it does turn out there are potentially fatal side effects from the AstraZeneca vaccine in a small number of cases, that information must not be suppressed. Over the past few weeks there has been a great intolerance shown towards anyone who expresses concerns about vaccines, and social media sites have acted to delete anything which they feel contradicts scientific consensus. This week’s war of words over AstraZeneca shows just how foolish it is to pretend there is a scientific consensus on the safety of vaccines, or indeed anything else. If we want people to have faith in vaccines – and Britons have shown great faith so far – it will be necessary to be open about any risks which emerge, however small those risks may be.
Lunchtime Briefing 16 March 2021

michel
Reply to  Alba
March 16, 2021 12:14 pm

Yes, a French spokesperson said that the concern in France was not that there is an increase in clotting incidents in general (which there is not) but that there have been several incidents of a very rare sort that have followed a vaccination.

It would be more plausible if there were some numbers on how often this very rare condition occurred before the pandemic, showing that incidence post vaccination was higher than expected.

Without numbers on that its just winging it, and if they have numbers, they are not giving them out. One would want to have the Pfizer and AZ numbers both, I think.

It must be possible that if it happens with both, its an artifact of changed reporting. Or even if it doesn’t. We are paying attention to all kinds of conditions in the vaccinated in a different way than we did to the general population before the pandemic.

michel
March 16, 2021 1:31 pm

From the Daily Mail (yes, I know….)
__________________________
Germany sought to justify its move by saying that one particular kind of blood clot, a ‘sinus vein thrombosis’, had occurred seven times among the 1.6million people vaccinated when only around one case would be expected. 
By contrast, only four such cases have been identified in the UK out of 11million doses administered.
__________________________

The UK seems to have a pretty decent recording system – easier when you have socialized medicine and there is one giant service provider.

The Swedes are saying that the risk seems to be 3 in a million.