Let’s start with a quote from an op ed last month in the NY Daily News
Because of the medication’s politicization, and the pernicious tendency for dissenting perspectives to be silenced during the pandemic, data supporting hydroxychloroquine’s effectiveness have been almost inaudible. But a recent analysis pooling together results of randomized clinical trials testing hydroxychloroquine’s use in early COVID-19 infection should substantially raise the volume.
The hydroxychloroquine saga cannot be fully appreciated without first considering the unusual circumstances under which it arose. While the medical profession has always sustained debate over which treatments are best, the tenor of the hydroxychloroquine controversy is unique. Physicians who have advocated for its effectiveness have remained steadfast in their support of the medication, despite unsupportive clinical trials enrolling hospitalized patients, social media blackouts of their opinions, and a chorus of politicians and health officials telling them — and the country — that they’re not only wrong but reckless.
While physicians who hold marginalized or unpopular positions about treatments are often considered by peers to be motivated by profit or other self-serving interests, these physicians were unnoteworthy in that regard, and would largely have been considered “mainstream” prior to the pandemic. Their clinical experiences were dismissed as anecdotal, but consistently achieving patient outcomes that were markedly better than those reported around the country fueled their confidence and tenacity. The nation and the world may now benefit from their steadfastness.
Here’s a couple of papers which establish the life saving value in early hydroxychloroquine treatment. The first is the one referred to in the op-ed.
Randomized Controlled Trials of Early Ambulatory Hydroxychloroquine in the Prevention of COVID-19 Infection, Hospitalization, and Death: Meta-Analysis
Abstract
Objective–To determine if hydroxychloroquine (HCQ) reduces the incidence of new illness, hospitalization or death among outpatients at risk for or infected with SARS-CoV-2 (COVID-19). Design–Systematic review and meta-analysis of randomized clinical trials. Data sources–Search of MEDLINE, EMBASE, PubMed, medRxiv, PROSPERO, and the Cochrane Central Register of Controlled Trials. Also review of reference lists from recent meta-analyses. Study selection–Randomized clinical trials in which participants were treated with HCQ or placebo/standard-of-care for pre-exposure prophylaxis, post-exposure prophylaxis, or outpatient therapy for COVID-19. Methods–Two investigators independently extracted data on trial design and outcomes. Medication side effects and adverse reactions were also assessed. The primary outcome was COVID-19 hospitalization or death. When unavailable, new COVID-19 infection was used. We calculated random effects meta-analysis according to the method of DerSimonian and Laird. Heterogeneity between the studies was evaluated by calculation of Cochran Q and I2 parameters. An Egger funnel plot was drawn to investigate publication bias. We also calculated the fixed effects meta-analysis summary of the five studies. All calculations were done in Excel, and results were considered to be statistically significant at a two-sided threshold of P=.05. Results–Five randomized controlled clinical trials enrolling 5,577 patients were included. HCQ was associated with a 24% reduction in COVID-19 infection, hospitalization or death, P=.025 (RR, 0.76 [95% CI, 0.59 to 0.97]). No serious adverse cardiac events were reported. The most common side effects were gastrointestinal. Conclusion–Hydroxychloroquine use in outpatients reduces the incidence of the composite outcome of COVID-19 infection, hospitalization, and death. Serious adverse events were not reported and cardiac arrhythmia was rare. Systematic review registration–This review was not registered.
https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/2020.09.30.20204693v1
And
Pathophysiological Basis and Rationale for Early Outpatient Treatment of SARS-CoV-2 (COVID-19) Infection
Abstract
Approximately 9 months of the severe acute respiratory syndrome coronavius-2 (SARS-CoV-2 [COVID-19]) spreading across the globe has led to widespread COVID-19 acute hospitalizations and death. The rapidity and highly communicable nature of the SARS-CoV-2 outbreak has hampered the design and execution of definitive randomized, controlled trials of therapy outside of the clinic or hospital. In the absence of clinical trial results, physicians must use what has been learned about the pathophysiology of SARS-CoV-2 infection in determining early outpatient treatment of the illness with the aim of preventing hospitalization or death. This article outlines key pathophysiological principles that relate to the patient with early infection treated at home.
Therapeutic approaches based on these principles include 1) reduction of reinoculation, 2) combination antiviral therapy, 3) immunomodulation, 4) antiplatelet/antithrombotic therapy, and 5) administration of oxygen, monitoring, and telemedicine. Future randomized trials testing the principles and agents discussed will undoubtedly refine and clarify their individual roles; however, we emphasize the immediate need for management guidance in the setting of widespread hospital resource consumption, morbidity, and mortality.
https://www.amjmed.com/article/S0002-9343(20)30673-2/fulltext
Covid is so over. Hundreds of thousands (my guess) came out to protest/celebrate the election. No prophylactic masks in sight. No chiding about super spreader events, no chastising attendees about their selfish, irresponsible behavior killing grandma, etc.
I was blocked by Facebook when making that observation in a very civil manner.
Similarly yesterday when an article was posted about a favorable US employment rate, Facebook added a WARNING . When I simply asked why a plain economic report warranted a label, I was blocked again.
My guess is THIS article would get a FB warning also.
In my opinion they have reached a tipping point and either the government or users (find an alternate site) need to rein them in.
My daughter was one of the very FIRST adopters of Fackebook while in college. It proved to be a useful means of connecting with her friends, and she spoke glowingly of it. Despite her encouragement, I have never once been “on” or signed-up for a Fackebook acct. Why? Call it “instinct”. I don’t think much of social media sites such as Fackebook and Twitter as a general rule … but something appeared even creepier about Fackebook. Thankfully … trusting my instincts has always served me well … and I will never give Fackebook the time of day (lest they ban me for biased comments … particular to my own timezone).
The first and foremost truth about Facebook is
You are the product.
…or rather, you are the prisoner and a poorly-fed one at that.
Unfortunately, the only way to rein in the GooFace Twits and Yahoos is to let their advertisers know that you won’t be buying their products until they stop censoring content.
Their advertisers want them to censor content, that leaves only THEIR content to generate income.
Just be prepared for a sudden reduction in CoVID-19 cases, hospitalizations and deaths starting on January 21.
No the reduction in the pandemic will only come after the UN/WEF Great Reset meeting in Davos n January.
It’ll be put down to the Pfizer Vaccine. Provisional results of there tests were somewhat problematic since they say they didn`t get enough people to have the virus.
Out of a test of 48,000 ony half of which received the vaccine, there were 96 cases. I expect Pfizer was a little more careful and accurate than the governent zealots in testing for the virus, after all, law suites could hang on their diligence. That`s 0,4%. Wuhoo Flu anyone
That is 96 out of 24,000
That is actually a spectacular win for Pfizer:
https://blogs.sciencemag.org/pipeline/archives/2020/11/09/vaccine-efficacy-data#comment-332266
And for the rest of us, too.
It is quite important for the vaccine producers that there be no effective treatment available at low cost. The US government rules about funding a vaccine mean that a low cost reasonably effective treatment will get funded, not a vaccine costing billions.
In March it was important to vilify HQC in order to rush Remdesivir through emergency permission – which was done in 4 weeks. It is about half as effective as HCQ and only when given early. Now it is the turn for vaccines – they need time and they have to be worth the vast additional cost. Lives have a $ value, that is a fact.
Some formula exists to rate the cost of the mass vaccination campaign measured against the losses of life it the HQC combination treatment isn’t totally effective. Then triggers will be pulled. Big Pharma would prefer the vaccination route. Is anyone surprised?
I find the Oxford Vaccine announcements more persuasive than Pfizer’s announcements:
YouTube shows Sir John Bell, Regius Professor of Medicine at Oxford, describing their vaccine work in Spring 2020. At that time Oxford was moving into Phase 2 trials. [by the way, when he says “Glandular Fever” he means what we used to call “Mononucleosis.”] Oxford is now teamed with Astrazeneca. A report on Oxford’s research indicates that Phase 3 was underway by August 31 and has enrolled 30,000 volunteers. Oxford’s vaccine is called AZD1222.
Oxford reports better results that Pfizer: “Neutralizing activity [of AZD1222] against SAR=CoV-2 was seen in . . . 100% of participants who received a second dose.”
Oxford reports that “Under the new agreement, as well as providing UK access as early as possible if the vaccine candidate is successful, AstraZeneca will work with global partners on the international distribution of the vaccine, particularly working to make it available and accessible for low and medium income countries.”
“Both partners (Oxford and AstraZeneca) have agreed to operate on a not-for-profit basis for the duration of the coronavirus pandemic, with only the costs of production and distribution being covered. Oxford University and its spin-out company Vaccitech, who jointly have the rights to the platform technology used to develop the vaccine candidate, will receive no royalties from the vaccine during the pandemic. Any royalties the University subsequently receives from the vaccine will be reinvested directly back into medical research, including a new Pandemic Preparedness and Vaccine Research Centre. The center is being developed in collaboration with AstraZeneca.”
Two weeks ago, ABC News showed six companies in Phase 3 trials), including Oxford and Pfizer. Pfizer is certainly grabbing all the headlines today, but Oxford started Phase 3 before Pfizer. The Pfizer website indicates that two weeks ago (Oct 22) they were carrying out “a Phase 2b/3 clinical trial for BioNTech’s mRNA-based vaccine candidate BNT162b2.” They report their vaccine has an efficiency of only 90% after the second vaccination.
Id rather take the Ivomec thanks.
see here listen OR transcript
I enjoyed hearing it cos Norman Swan was dissing the Ivermectin as risky due to high doses…except? they arent required;-) moderate levels near zero side effects
https://www.abc.net.au/radionational/programs/healthreport/ivermectin-and-monoclonal-antibodies-coronavirus-treatments/12839508
WaPo:
No, Pfizer’s apparent vaccine success is not a function of Trump’s ‘Operation Warp Speed’
https://www.hhs.gov/coronavirus/explaining-operation-warp-speed/index.html
HHS web site:
Fact Sheet: Explaining Operation Warp Speed
July 22: HHS announced up to $1.95 billion in funds to Pfizer for the large-scale manufacturing and nationwide distribution of 100 million doses of their vaccine candidate. The federal government will own the 100 million doses of vaccine initially produced as a result of this agreement, and Pfizer will deliver the doses in the United States if the product successfully receives FDA EUA or licensure, as outlined in FDA guidance, after completing demonstration of safety and efficacy in a large Phase 3 clinical trial, which began July 27th.
May be sooner: https://e-catworld.com/2020/11/09/covid-19-press-release-pfizer-and-biontech-announce-vaccine-candidate-against-covid-19-achieved-success-in-first-interim-analysis-from-phase-3-study/
Looks like a vaccine might be just around the corner after all.
just don’t go near any mink!!!
I’ve read that Pfizer’s vaccine must be stored at a much lower temperature than hospitals’ refrigeration units can handle, that only a few research centers have such low-temperature storage units, and that they are expensive.
I’ve also heard that the vaccine won’t be available in volume until the middle of next year.
From what level Jim. “Cases” are rising by about 10,000 per day. per: https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/#countries
The more tests are done the more”cases” will be found. It is the flu, people have to get it and get over it, those with multiple comorbidities need to be quarantined and steps to protect them taken. Period. Full stop.
George Daddio
Facebook is trying to give you a hint: SUPPORT THEIR LEFTIST AGENDA or STOP USING FACEBOOK (Stop using Twitter too. And Google).
I never started using Facebook and Twitter in the first place, and I avoid Google at least 95% of the time for searches. Try DuckDuckGo == not quite as good as Google but works as well
95% of the time
Don’t support organizations that hate Republicans, conservatives and libertarians, and made such as effort at censorship to get hidin’ Biden elected.
George.
What happened to you is terrifying, as it is part of evil plan.
What is happening is the very end of thoughtful speech. Why now? Why are all of the internet companies working instep?
At some point in time we need to at least state the obvious.
What has just happened? We are fighting an evil paradigm change. In the US, there is evidence of a election fraud, coinciding with a strange step change in almost of the internet companies and media companies in the world. Independent companies look as if they are now all puppets.
Ten years ago. No one would have believed what just happened, could happen or could be allowed to happen.
And it is a fact that there is peer reviewed evidence that supports the assertion that the covid virus, is man-made. It anesthetizes the throat cells to stop pain when it attacks, That ‘feature’ enables it to spread as the person does not feel sick. The virus then moves on to other organs where it causes blood clots. In a small number of people the virus triggers an auto-immune attack where the body attacks itself so there are weird dangerous long term side effects.
This is a virus that is design to make us isolate. And China just happens to have some protection. And China is the only country in the world that has positive GDP growth. That is a great deal of coincidences.
I do not believe that a massive number of weird, evil things all suddenly happen in the last year, naturally.
I believe in scientific explanations. It takes lots and lots of money and paid minions to make all the evil things that have happened in the last year to happen,
We are the last Free informed people, before the Dems pass laws to shutdown any communication that is anti whatever they deem to be a threat to their plan to destroy our countries. Simple as uncontrolled spending and political madness.
This weird country killing, Left-wing ideology is not random madness. This stuff was created to destroy our countries. The Left now have weaponized fake caring like ideas, created to make chaos, not to solve problems.
What does open borders create? Massive shanty towns. Does it help failing countries? No, it helps our country fail. What do the Green scams create? Expensive and unreliable electricity and more damage to the environment.
The so called green stuff wears out in 15 years and needs to be replaced. There is almost no real reduction in CO2 emissions if all of the energy inputs are taken into account. Fake problem, fake solutions.
TwitGooBook all feel emboldereed now they`ve been told Trump is gone. We shall see; I look forward to the next 4 weeks and it would be a joy to see Trump return with a vengence.
Set up an account on Parler. It might be a bit slow for a day or two, there were 2 million new downloads of the app yesterday!
Seems like the Facebook, with their billions of dollars, is in a prime lawsuit zone.
If my grandma died because she wasn’t given an over the counter, inexpensive, easily obtained otherwise, drug, with a hundred year safety record, because mention of it as an option was banned by a public utility like Facebook, I’d be pissed.
George consider CloutHub.
https://www.clouthub.com/home
…and their argument for mail in ballots was liberals are too smart to spread it
Not sure where you’re seeing that. I was sitting at an outdoors restaurant table in DC on Saturday afternoon, and everyone I saw celebrating was wearing a mask. And when I looked at images on-line just now (searched for “crowds cheering Biden”), virtually everyone was wearing a mask over mouth and nose. Do you have pics of these non-mask wearing Biden supporters?
They were all over the news in videos
Then it should be easy to provide lots of clips via links. Fox News via youtube should ave plenty to pick from.
Maybe or maybe not. They have announced a new mutation called CoVid 19 minks
Denmark is set to lose mink businesses that are generational. I spoke to a friend a few days ago who said that someone he knew well had his entire stock slaughtered and destroyed by a government order, he is as you would expect devastated.
Businesses that have been affected by the mutated Covid-19 virus have been successfully separating and quarantining sick animals, and destroying the dead. I believe that the government have decided that it’s not enough, that it’s necessary to cull the entire mink population accross the country. Some of the breeding stock have taken generations to perfect. This will be an entire industry lost.
I don’t believe that there have been humans infected by the mink.
Mad Dane Disease – similar to the Mad Cow Disease that affected the Brits a few years back: hysteria is the scientific term I believe.
7 mink farm workers apparently got the mink mutated version
not a word if they died though
odd isnt it?
I wont be surprised to read later some very clever lil minks did a runner to a safe haven
hope so
the entire pop cull is as stupid n needless as the UK foot n mouth murderspree was.
Yes its so over with 11.3 million cases and rising exponentially, 251,000+ deaths and the world’s greatest non-socialized healthcare system buckling under the strain, while the President ignores it all (hasn’t been to a meeting of the Taskforce in more than five months) and focusses on the non-existent voter fraud that caused him to lose re-election.
Were the crowds celebrating Trump’s loss taking the coronavirus seriously? I mean you claim that they did not wear masks, so how about some reality? A few pictures from many thousands:
https://images.app.goo.gl/QnsLDcqsDawcGhdt7 (Deutsche Welt)
https://images.app.goo.gl/h8zzvqk94D8WANiGA (Times of Israel)
https://images.app.goo.gl/hDq1H99fwDwydoUy9 (Boston Globe)
https://images.app.goo.gl/v7Pkz2fApAiSG3Km8 (NY Post)
https://images.app.goo.gl/iiXuLvV1VqbxReYw5 (San Francisco Examiner)
Answer: Yes
Meanwhile at the Million MAGA Tears March (about 5000-6000, tops), they were taking their President’s attitude to the coronavirus:
https://images.app.goo.gl/ycMBcbZJzZEcyAZd7
https://images.app.goo.gl/jPNyBH9tRH5UehSE9 (UPI)
https://images.app.goo.gl/nWocMjCY612ehkxo7 (MPR)
If only they had access to the free public healthcare their President had but didn’t pay for in taxes.
Want fewer “cases”? Stop testing everyone. Why? We have all had it and got over it. Thats what happens with the flu, Johnnie.
And no mention of zinc in the first study. Nevertheless, the results are positive.
Precisely.
https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/21079686/
dated Nov 2010
The requirement is for intracellular zinc to be at a particular level where it BLOCKS replication of RNA viruses. HCQ was just a good zinc ionophore. Quercetin is another. The clinical trials were all deliberately set for severely ill patients not outpatients and almost all deliberately excluded zinc supplementation. Why would they do that? Well the sentence I have highlighted in the abstract shows why. Intracellular zinc blocks replication of RNA viruses – including influenza and polio. In other words some of the highest grossing vaccination programs are threatened by diet supplementation with zinc and a zinc ionophore. There are many ‘immunity vitamins’ for sale that are just this a mix of zinc plus quercetin another zinc ionophore. The zinc/zinc ionophore increase the body’s INNATE immunity by increasing intracellular zinc.
This pandemic could have been stopped if in January the medical community could have used existing ten year old research and proposed zinc/zinc ionophore supplementation plus perhaps vitamin D3 and selenium.
This is old research, the ‘front line doctors’ used this approach and saved thousands of patients. But the medical bureaucrats tied to vaccination programs called these thousands of cured patients ‘anecdotal’.
See the Zelenko protocol.
It is probable that there are other reasons than the purely venal that a cheap available and successful outpatient treatment was not allowed by the medical bureaucracy but none of those reasons were to do with stopping the pandemic or reducing loss of life.
How many people have died because of this vaccination vs cheap non-patentable cure?
History should one day recognize the intentional coverup of Zinc / HCQ against COVID as a crime against humanity.
I’m not holding my breath.
History is written by the victors. We will never know the truth of anything that happened this last decade, or more.
re quercitin: It’s available online from Amazon from a dozen suppliers. Below is the one I’ve ordered for myself & relatives, preventatively and “just in case.”
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B086ZFC6JL/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_asin_title_o00_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1
Well, normally your natural body levels of zinc are sufficient I expect; enhancing them makes it more effective. But I am not medically trained.
There is significant zinc deficiency in many diets for example China has problems with zinc deficiency https://crops.zinc.org/china/
There is a tendency to become zinc deficient with age – which seems to correlate with the severity of COVID-19 with age. https://bestpractice.bmj.com/topics/en-gb/1195
So an older person in a care home with perhaps not the best diet is likely to be less resistant to SARS-CoV-2 than someone active eating a well balanced diet – again this is what is seen.
It could almost be said that COVID_19 is a disease of the zinc deficient.
Vitamin D deficiency in the care home was also significant in the fatalities.
Or targeted to zinc deficient individuals. China is heavily involved in the nursing home/long term care facility industries in America and Europe. Monitoring such information and applying it would not be difficult for a tech savvy entity like CCP. They routinely show that they have no problem with killing huge numbers of people simply over ideology, much less profit and mass control of people.
and vitamin D
About four years ago I started supplementing zinc, magnesium, and vitamin D. I was undergoing regular tests at the time due to a health issue. The effect of doing so was pretty dramatic (blood work and other test results).
An added benefit is I stopped getting severe colds. I would always catch it from someone at the office like twice per year. Most I get now is the sniffles for a day, then its gone.
in Aus we used galvanised iron rainwater tanks in most houses until town water got good enough,
so aussies got trace zinc easily
as we did with copper from pipes and water heater liners
now theyre glass lined tanks for HWS and damned polypipe in homes and plastic tanks;-((
a tablespoon of coppersulphate in the plastic tanks keeps slime n bugs down and restores OUR levels of copper at least
the zinc we now need to supplement(or buy a tin tank again, they dont melt in bushfires as fast either.)
Supposedly Zinc is more effective when taken with a Zinc ionophore (aids cell uptake) of which Hydroxychloroquine is one. But there are others such as epigallocatechin gallate (EGCG in green tea), CO-Q10, and molybdenum. In addition those with low Vitamin D levels were much more susceptible in an Italian study. Also recommended by some doctors is an over the counter steroidal anti-histamine nose spray if symptoms occur. India has had a much lower fatality rate possibly because Hydroxychloroquine was available over the counter.
Because the Democrats are ones that have provided strong opposition to any treatments that Trump has suggested might work, contrary to MSM propaganda the Dems are actually the ones responsible for excess deaths for which they will never be held accountable.
From the article Burden of Malaria in India, (https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/books/NBK1720/ I find:
“The salient features of the national drug policy that has been modified and approved in January 2007 by the NVB-DCP are as follows:
All efforts should be made to confirm the diagnosis of malaria. If it is not possible, chloroquine in full therapeutic dose of 25 mg/kg body weight over 3 days should be given to all cases of clinical malaria including confirmed cases at all levels, irrespective of high- or low-risk malaria status of district/block. In high-risk areas, in addition to chloro-quine, primaquine (single dose) should be given. Practice of presumptive treatment with 600 mg chloroquine will be discontinued.”
So there are a large number of people who take chloroquine in India as a cure/treatment for Malaria. As a result there would be a corresponding large number who are protected against Covid-19. This may be why where Malaria is present in India and Africa, cases are lower than in Europe and the USA. Of course it is possible that cases are just not reported? or confused with the Flu?
Trump’s rapid recovery may possibly be explained by the fact he was taking HCQ regularly (unknown is whether he continued to take it right up to contracting it). Such a recovery would be hard to fake given the exhausting campaign schedule that he was on after one week. Biden was exhausted without having been inffected.
I have HCQ left over from a trip to Minas Gerais where I was evaluating mining projects in 2018. These I kept handy!
Awesome, Gary, Minas Gerais is one place I’ve never been. I took chloroquine as anti-malarial in Vietnam, but there wasn’t any interesting geology to go with it.
Hi Ron, yeah I enjoyed it very much. The temperatures are moderated in mountainous terrain and they had a bit more seasonal rain than usual in late 2017 so it was (according to locals) a lot greener than usual. I was looking at deposits in an extensive lithium pegmatite field in the NE, centered on the small city of Araçuai and along the Jequitahonha River which was the the source of the first discovery of diamonds in Brazil in the 18th Century by alluvial gold miners.
Brazil has had only modest Lithium production as most of it is artisanally mined. The potential is huge however as local miners picked away at what turned out to be the edges of large deposits.
I wound up taking HCQ for only a few days, hence my stash I have on hand.
“Trump’s rapid recovery may possibly be explained by the fact he was taking HCQ regularly”
Here is a statement from Trump’s doctor, October 3, on the medications Trump had been taking at the time of his treatment for Covid. No mention anywhere of HCQ.
My guess is that Trump himself may have been scared off HCQ by all the negative press reports and backlash from the medical establishment. Yes, it would be helpful to know if Trump was on HCQ prophylaxis and got sick, or if he stopped the HCQ some time ago and then got sick.
Nick:
The precise chronology of what Trump took and when is not clear from this:
The phrase “… has been taking …” could very well mean it was started after the PCR confirmation and continued, unlike the polyclonal antibody cocktail which was taken exactly once.
It does make pretty clear that Trump was not taking HQC as part of the treatment following the diagnosis, but the wording does not exclude the possibility Trump was taking HQC as a preventative measure prior to the diagnosis.
Which would be nice to know. It would also be nice to know whether he had also been taking Vitamin D all along and how much.
“It does make pretty clear that Trump was not taking HQC as part of the treatment following the diagnosis”
Yes. But it does say what he “has been taking” and lists aspirin and melatonin, for example. Not things they would have started up in response to the diagnosis. Nor would they have discontinued HCQ if he had been taking it as preventive.
I was under the impression that he was given a steroid as part of the treatment.
ABC News, not known for its support of Trump or his presidency, reported on May 19, that he had been taking HCQ, an “unproven drug he’s touted for COVID-19.”
“He said he asked the White House doctor if he could take the unproven treatment despite having no symptoms, adding he’s been taking a pill a day for about a week and a half.”
The rest of the story is framed to imply that Trump is dangerously foolish.
“I was under the impression that he was given a steroid”
Yes, that came later. But at no stage of his illness was he treated with HCQ.
Being an avid watcher of political TV and talk radio, I can’t remember who asked Trump if he was still taking HCQ but his answer was he took it for a couple of weeks and on his doctors advice discontinued. Without adding zinc it probably wouldn’t have prevented him from catching the China virus.
“HCQ has a long half-life (about one month) and takes about half a year to achieve full elimination from the body;” From https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/books/NBK537086/
…except Trump said he was taking HCQ prior to getting the disease, Nick.
Trump was only taking HCQ for a brief amount of time, months ago. Days after he announced he was taking it he said he only had a few more days to go for taking it..
Smart. Nice place, that area of Brasil
Gary,
You remarked, “(unknown is whether he continued to take it right up to contracting it)”
That is a pretty important piece of missing information because all along the push for HCQ was for its prophylactic effect, and ability to abort the infection if used early.
If Trump was using it all along, then it didn’t serve its prophylactic role. The physician who promptly cured him didn’t have faith in its ability to enact an early cure and relied on other things that demonstrably worked.
The interesting thing about COVID-19 is the ‘bigly’ number of drugs that supposedly have efficacy, ranging from malaria drugs, to sheep dip, and aspirin. Actually, a study I previously posted a link for showed that a placebo was more effective than HCQ. There is a good reason why ‘witch doctors’ are still turned to in many cultures. It is because people who think they will be cured often are, and snake oil salesmen continue to take money from desperate and gullible people.
Yes, he stopped. Just search “trump stops taking hydroxychloroquine” – looks like about the end of May.
he may have developed the vision issues it gave me…took me 22days to get blurry vision halos around lights and cranial oedema. remember he had that glitch walking down a ramp?
reckon that might have been about then
I’ve been drinking gin and tonic every day since the Wuhan flu started. Not that I really need it at my age for something with a 99% survival rate.
Frank(hic)DeMaris
“An ounce of prevention is worth a pound of cure.”
Benjamin Franklin, 1736
I imagine several ounces a day is even better.
“ I imagine several ounces a day is even better.”
Of Gin?
Yeah, I was drinking tonic water, too! I ‘prescribed’ tonic water for one of my daughter’s family in UK after her husband and daughter contracted Cov2. She and her son didnt get Cov2 and happily the other two recovered okay. Another daughter and her husband also drank gin (for the first time) and tonic and were fine. Maybe the tonic wasn’t effective, but, like HCQ, it is essentially a no regrets option.
The egregious magnification of terrible HCQ side effects by political forces to scare people about this medication, and worse, having Lancet and the New England Journal of Medicine publishing this stuff which they later had to retract is criminal. I’ve taken HCQ like hundreds of millions of people in Africa and South America for years at a time since 1965 and never knew of an incident of heart problems etc. among many, many acquaintances.
“… publishing this stuff which they later had to retract is criminal”
It was also ill advice in France: few people would have had a strong opinion on the claims of ineffectiveness of HCQ. But saying that it became a poison last year, after being available over the counter for decades… that was too much for anybody who isn’t a Macron and Academy of medicine apologist (we have a lot of these).
It shows that the propagandists are simply very dumb.
They had an obvious argument against HCQ, presenting it as potentially risky against a virus, yet didn’t used it. They would just explain that HCQ can reduce immunity so it isn’t always dangerous but in the first phase of the infection it might delay immune response when the response is essential. It would be wrong, but less obviously wrong.
Only Doctor Michel Cymes suggested that idea on TV. Yes, I watched a LOT of TV and it wasn’t pleasant.)
They couldn’t even think of it because they are ignorant. Even the experts. Even the epidemiologists. All of them. They have “knowledge” but it’s so disorganized, it’s like the Web without a search engine. Their “knowledge” is about as useful for making intelligent decisions as the fat of a super-obese is for survival in difficult condition. It’s knowledge fat.
My theory is that many people get “knowledge fat” in school, and then they accumulate even more: a mix of relevant, correct and irrelevant information and plainly wrong stuff accumulated without even the understanding of the basics and without any structure.
I looked into that. Schweppes Tonic Water contains 15% HCQ (it`s the Tonic) but I figured the sugar would beworse for me.
Trump+Golf+Sun = Vitamin D
The thousands upon thousands of people who use HQC in one form or another could have told everyone this, all without pissing away my tax dollars.
Make that millions!
I called my ENT specialist and got a prescrip for HQC 2 months ago, I have not exploded nor evaporated, the pain in my knees,ankles and hips is noticeably reduced without taking pain killers. I used some form of HQC many years ago for malaria, never had any problems. Seems it is time to start ripping these liespewers in media and politics out of their cozy offices and punish the f***k out of them.
The HCQ debacle was fall out from applying hate as a weapon of mass destruction in the left’s civil war against freedom. While some 70 million hearts and minds were hollowed out by this weapon, the denigration of HCQ spilled the blood of 10’s of thousands of people who didn’t have to succumb to the virus.
Do you now see it is past time for Americans to drag these enemies of the human race into the streets and give them the rewards they have so justly earned?
and f you overbook twats and goog and amazone….ALL banned info on it and other opinons and all trump stuff they could
mrz donated millions to the dems etc
all sorta coming together when you consider the slooow creep of it by all of them over the preceeding 6 or more months
far too convenient for them and stinks of an agenda/agreed actions/ie conspiring to divert redirect misinform Disinfo campaign
Malawi has had a total of 250deaths when tens of thousand were predicted in an often undernourished population. It is an endemic area whose inhabitants reach for hydroxychloroquine, cheap and available without prescription at the onset of any fever, myalgia, headache…
Endemic plasmodium falciparum malaria(omitted from above post)
Trouble is most of the population is too young to be taken by covid, so ? remains.
There are many nations in the world with high malaria rates, where HCQ is taken regularly, in small doses, to prevent malaria. In early 2020 those nations, as a group, had a very low rate of COVID-19 infections. A short analysis was presented by Roy Spencer, Ph.D, on his climate science website, but there was never a follow up analysis later in 2020. It should be easy to take the 40 nations that had the highest malaria rates before 2020, which implies high HCQ use per capita, and see if they also had very low COVID019 infections, hospitalizations and deaths, as of October 2020.
The original report is here:
http://www.drroyspencer.com/2020/03/some-covid-19-vs-malaria-numbers-countries-with-malaria-have-virtually-no-coronavirus-cases-reported/
Worldometer data for Africa shows a universally low incidence of cases and deaths among all African nations – all much lower than the incidence in Europe or the US. They must be doing something right.
Which is interesting when compared to the UK which has or had higher death rate in the BAME (Black Asian and Minority Ethnic) community. Most of the MSM attribute this to their deprived (when compared with the majority community) background but this has never seemed reasonable to me. I have always thought it more likely that the major reason would be lack of Vitamin D. In the UK someone whose genetic make up needs high levels of sunshine to produce Vitamin D is going to struggle without supplements. In Africa levels of sunshine are high enough for normal levels of Vitamin D and coupled HCQ means that there’s a simple explanation for the high death rates in the UK.
because dark skins block absorption of the amount of uv that kickstarts melanin/vit D in whiter skins i gather?
so they were vit D( and everything else probably) deficient
The reverse is possible in Australia where the sunshine and UV results in our having the highest rate of Melanoma in the world. But Covid-19 has been virtually wiped out – almost all cases in Australia are from people returning to the country – they go straight into quarantine and are only let out after a fortnight if they have not developed it.
But I thought that people of color were more inclined to contract the disease?
Or is the low incidence in Africa merely a result of poor reporting and poor record keeping?
Jim as Ben said above it is the insufficiency in vitamin D. In UK all dark skinned and even some fair skinned people are significantly insufficient in Vitamin D.
The government could have given advice early on – take Vitamin D3, zinc, quercetin (another zinc ionophore often sold with zinc supplements) and selenium (a brazil nut a day) – The pandemic would not have happened. They are STILL not advising everyone to take these supplements. The pandemic would stop in a couple of weeks if they did. The obvious deduction from that is the government do NOT want the pandemic to stop.
I have sent three letters to the government and health minister since April. In one response they said too much Vitamin D can be bad!!!. Do you know how many units you need for it to be bad? Thousands.
I just sent another re D and HCQ.Curious what they will say this time. I included the following site: https://hcqmeta.com/
I believe TDS is rampant in Canada. I know there are many sufferers in my area.
REJ
People of Color in mid-latitudes, not in the latitudes where they evolved the high melanin content in their skin. The presumption is that isolated populations evolved a melanin density optimal for their particular climate. Europeans moving south risk sunburn, Africans moving north risk low vitamin D levels.
Africans also have different demographics, with much lower average age. Also, the endemic diseases and poor sanitation results in their immune systems being challenged regularly. The high death rate among children means that surviving adults tend to be more resistant to disease.
Richard, this country by country study compares nations who use HCQ with those who didn’t.
?w=1000
https://rclutz.wordpress.com/2020/09/06/positive-hcq-treatment-outcomes-in-88-international-studies/
RonClutz
Thanks for the help but that chart is not what I was talking about. I was not talking about all nations, or only nations that used HCQ, among other drugs, to fight COVID. I was talking about the 40 nations with the highest malaria rates before COVID struck in 2020.
People in those nations should tend to have higher per capita usage of HCQ, taken in regular small does to prevent malaria. The open question was whether taking regular small does of HCQ to prevent malaria was associated with low rates of COVID infections, hospitalizations and deaths. The number of infections would probably be more accurate, because hospitalizations and deaths are so closely linked to the percentage of older people in a nation.
I used to be prescribed Quinine for severe leg cramps. Then FDA took it off the market. My leg cramps continue with little relief.
Quinine is still used for the prevention of malaria. We have the means to stop COVID. But there is no money to be made in comparison to the profit of a new drug yet to be sanctioned. Meanwhile we die. Our Freedom taken away.
I also took Quinine for leg cramps. After it was pretty much taken off the market I was given HCQ. Can’t prescribe a cheap drug when a more expensive one is available.
Hyland’s Leg cramps tablets available on Amazon.ca. https://www.amazon.ca/s?k=leg+cramps&ref=nb_sb_noss_1
“a new drug yet to be sanctioned”
The FDA approved Remdesivir on October 22nd.
This post is for information only, relative to the quoted comment I have no comment on relative efficacies when compared with HCQ and other older, cheaper drugs.
But Remdesivir is only approved for hospital use.
And, on top of that, you have to be pretty sick to get it. It is not administered routinely.
It is a very successful drug.
Oops! almost forgot – financially as it costs 100 times as much as HCQ.
Jude,
Like many others here, you fail to take into account that there are two competing, powerful corporate interests. While ‘Big Pharma’ might like to see expensive drugs, the health care insurance industry would like to see cheap drugs to minimize their costs. How about looking at the big picture instead of just jumping on the Band Wagon?
The “health care insurance industry” is allowed a maximum profit … a percentage.
A percentage of a bigger number is bigger.
A percentage of a smaller number is smaller.
They are now like bookies … they take a cut … up to a point … so the bigger the volume the better for them. I would think that you are smart enough to know this, so I would also think that you know the point you are making is crap.
(The “health care insurance industry” is recording very high gains right now. If they don’t have to make some payouts then they are going to give rebates … and then there won’t be an excuse to raise the rates next year.)
I have the same problem. Magnesium citrate 200mg once a day works for me. Without it I can’t go out on an evening bike ride without foot cramps, and night calf cramps are a certainty. None of that happens when I take it.
My dad used to drink Tonic water, and got instant relief from cramping
https://duckduckgo.com/?q=pickle+juice+for+cramps&t=h_&ia=web
What can you do when society decides that black is white – or that blue is grey, to use a less dangerous example?
If you do not go with the flow you will be marginalised, and punished if you do not conform. This is the same built-in instinct which operates during a cattle stampede. The herd may be running towards some cliffs, but if a steer in the middle decides to avoid these by stopping it wil just die earlier….
Good point Dodgy. I tend to think of these braindead public school educated and college brainwashed masses as more like the Children from the Pied Piper fable. They are happily skipping along following the music and one day soon the Piper is going to leave them in the deep dark cold forest to die from starvation and the elements.
I am angry enough to happily accept $20.15 an hour to stand continuous guard around the edges of that deep dark cold forest and insure none of them escape.
And there are at least 2 other treatments that cure it as well. We are talking over 95% effective. If you doubt that statement please point out where the doctors promoting them wrong.
1) Ivermectin + Doxycycline + Zinc
Professor Thomas Borody developer of the triple therapy treatment for peptic ulcers in 1987.
“It’s easier than treating the flu now”. “You can actually eradicate it”. “We know it’s curable”
http://covexit.com/we-know-its-curable-its-easier-than-treating-the-flu-professor-thomas-borody/
2) Inhaled steroids like Budesonide
The interview with Dr. Richard Bartlett has been BANNED BY YOUTUBE:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eDSDdwN2Xcg&feature=emb_logo
But you can still see it here starting around the 4 minute mark:
https://banned.video/watch?id=5f06524a672706002f481047
Cheap and can be used on very sick people with serious existing health conditions.
So we have the FDA lowering the effectiveness requirement for vaccines to 30-50% and ignoring cures that are over 95% effective. Why?
https://childrenshealthdefense.org/child-health-topics/exposing-truth/fda-director-peter-marks-and-the-ever-shifting-covid-vaccine-narrative/
“In its guidance, FDA said it expected sponsors to demonstrate a vaccine is at least 50% effective in a placebo-controlled trial, with an adjusted lower bound of >30%.”
Of course it couldn’t be due to a blatant conflict of interest and money could it?
“It’s completely correct to say that NIAID will reap a profit on the Moderna/NIAID vaccine. There are 6 NIAID scientists who work for Dr. Fauci, each of whom would get $150,000/year indefinitely as their reward. So that’s $900,000 to his subordinates every year in perpetuity.” – Mary Holland, General Counsel, RFK Jr’s “Children’s Health Defense”
Given the protocol of no recommended early treatment (only treatments for severe cases) it almost looks like they WANT people to die. It’s sickening that even the medical profession has become so politicized that they oppose viable treatment options.
Hit very hard (bodies in the streets) after Easter festivities, and panic, brought many Ecuadorians home from Europe, the city of Guayaquil established a treatment protocol of HCQ and azithromycin, and the antiparasitic, nitazoxanide. Nitazoxanide was prescribe for more advanced cases, as HCQ was seen as more effective as a prophylactic and in early stages of the disease. They saw morbidity and mortality rates fall dramatically after implementation of that protocol. I never saw any mention of Zinc or Vitamin D in the articles I read.
So if the medical community had used HCQ *as Trump crowed about* it would have lowered the death rate?
The politicization of HCQ use because Trump said it has cost thousands of lives. THOUSANDS. More than 9/11. More than the number of soldiers lost in the Middle East.
+1
The drug HCQ is the only drug now or ever that has been politically controlled,
as far as I know.
In democratic controlled states it is impossible
to obtain even today. I first became aware of chloroquine and HCQ on this
board and passed that info to others around the country which was then used to
help several people. The Med-Cram 34 link which I first saw on this board was
used by many docs to do the triple therapy.
https://www.realclearpolicy.com/articles/2020/08/25/the_tragic_hydroxychloroquine_debate_and_why_dr_fauci_is_like_a_scientist_who_denied_smoking_causes_lung_cancer_575139.html
FauXi is a life-long bureaucrat who apart from completing his residency has never practiced medicine. He torpedoed Bactrim for treating pneumocystis pneumonia, one of the AIDS diseases, just like he’s doing now with HCQ. Doctors like this one acted as a firewall against his evil and incompetence, just as doctor’s treating with HCQ and other reportedly successful treatments are doing today for covid.
https://twitter.com/richardursomd/status/1322687939671920640
Dan-O
You said, “HCQ is the only drug now or ever that has been politically controlled” Really? How about morphine, LSD, and cannabis? How about every drug that requires a prescription from a physician?
Add Sudafed to that list. My sinus headaches are another reason to hate the bureaucracy.
Haven’t those lives been sacrificed for a good cause? 🙂
Yes, and Joe should take note that this is a good way to reduce personal “carbon” emissions and lead by example.
Those black helicopters circling over your house – send them this way.
The dislike of Trump caused the press to vilify anyone and anything positive toward HCQ. This probably led to people dying.
But very little money can be made on $1.00 per pill medication that is safe and effective.
It helped to have Trump support it as ‘showing promise’ which is what he actually said. Not exactly ‘touting’. But the real reason is that zinc/zinc ionophore increases intracellular zinc and stops viral hijacking of the RNA transcription and blocks RNA virus replication – not just SARS-CoV-2 but influenza, polio and others. These are bread and butter income for the vaccine community. [See my other post above for references DOI: 10.1371/journal.ppat.1001176 ]
So as stated above thousands have died to allow the vaccination industry to continue
Wholesale cost HCQ 60 200mg tablets, $8.00. :
I prefer 5mg and 10mg, myself.
I first found out about chloroquine from Dr, Roy Spencer’s Blog back in March. I think President Trump brought up the topic soon thereafter, and that night, or maybe the next day our wonderful objective mainstream media was pooh pooing it.
More deaths, more headlines. Win-win for the MSM.
Over 1900 covid patients treated early with HCQ + zinc, age 1 – 90, 1 hospitalization, zero deaths. Possibly the most treated by any doctor in the US.
Dr. Brian Tyson’s First-Person Account of Treating COVID-19 with Hydroxychloroquine
https://theeconomicstandard.com/dr-brian-tysons-first-person-account-of-treating-covid-19-with-hydroxychloroquine/
Per the IFR, 9 deaths would be expected in the 70+ y/o group consisting of 100 patients, but there were zero deaths.
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Elb_XgPWkAA4fbO?format=jpg
yea given the number of positive papers on HCQ with an estimated 60ish percent fatality reduction there is definitely blood on the hands of the public health community/media here in the US.
The problem is that sampling stats aren’t conclusive….if 1000 people have CoVid19 and 15% go to ICU and 15% of those die, that’s 23 deaths….but thats not a given, some hospitals will have 45 deaths and some will have 2….rendering the “lives saved” by HCQ or any other treatment very difficult to ascertain, and very easy to draw a mistaken conclusion. In any event, the often stated improvement of 25% by using HCQ from 23 deaths to 17 deaths is of the same order as sampling noise. No different than field hospital survival rates of wounded soldiers in a war zone….not a function of the meds….
If it was the same as sampling noise the results would show it going both ways, but they are not. Therefore I am tired of the “noise”.
See this for less noise: https://hcqmeta.com/
See Ron C comment Link above.
Nations that used HCQ early and throughout most of the pandemic, had 76 percent fewer fatalities per infected.
I think this study covered about 30 percent of the global population.
“MaxedOutMama” commented yesterday on the Seeking Alpha financial site:
“What convinced me that it [HCQ] does work is the O2 monitoring – used in the early days of when a person has reported the first O2 drop, you can see the O2 levels come right back up within hours of the first dose. That’s solid clinical evidence.”
Too many rats in the cage and they’re eating sh1t, nutrient-free food
It destroys minds with as much facility as bodies
and there’s nothing else to eat…
Yes Hydroxychloroquine is effective on COVID-19.
Lower mortality in HCQ-treated patients as compared to supportive care.
Compared to supportive care only, low-dose HCQ monotherapy was independently associated with lower mortality in hospitalized patients with COVID-19 diagnosed and treated early or later after symptom onset.
https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0924857920303423
You can see a lot more studies here:
https://c19study.com/
163 so far, many showing HCQ efficiency against CoViD19
HCQ used in Korea since day 1 :
http://www.koreabiomed.com/news/articleView.html?idxno=7428
and mandatory in India for healthcare and other frontline workers :
“Based on the findings of the studies, the government has decided to administer the drug as a ‘prophylaxis’ or preventive therapy to asymptomatic healthcare workers working in non-Covid hospitals as well as non-Covid blocks of hospitals earmarked for Covid treatment.
Asymptomatic frontline workers, such as surveillance workers deployed in containment zones, as well as paramilitary and police personnel involved in Covid-related activities will be asked to pop HCQ pills.”
“With available evidence for its safety and beneficial effect as a prophylactic drug against SARS-CoV-2 during the earlier recommended 8 weeks period, the experts further recommended for its use beyond 8 weeks on weekly dosage with strict monitoring of clinical and ECG parameters, which would also ensure that the therapy is given under supervision,”
https://theprint.in/health/hcq-breakthrough-icmr-finds-its-effective-in-preventing-coronavirus-expands-its-use/427583/
Really you need to consider that it might be just virtue signalling on the part of management, to show heath care workers that they are doing the best they can to protect workers. Doctors are doing the same with patients. A placebo to reduce stress levels….cheap too..
….and a positive attitude is often good for recovery rates.
Most of those who prescribed HCQ did it despite all the political mob against HCQ, so I doubt they did it with virtue signalling in mind.
If someone did virtue signalling it was – for instance – the French government that banned the HCQ with no scientific basis at all while this drug has been over the counter for decades without any issue in France.
1) The first “study” is a meta-analysis, not a double blind randomized trial. Additionally it’s been published as a pre-print, and has not been peer-reviewed.
..
2) The second “study” admits: “In the absence of clinical trial results, physicians must use what has been learned about the pathophysiology of SARS-CoV-2 infection in determining early outpatient treatment of the illness with the aim of preventing hospitalization or death” NO CLINICAL TRIALS.
…
WUWT should stop beating the dead HCQ horse.
Only researchers and incompetent doctors think clinical trials are the only valid evidence.
Bleach kills the virus in vitro. Guess you don’t need a clinical trial for it right? Get a hypodermic needle and try it.
You first.
There is too much evidence that HCQ plus the zpack works when given early after diagnosis.
I laugh at the studies that only discuss pieces of the treatment like we gave HCQ to patients on ventilators or we just gave them HCQ…they never discuss the complete protocol and timing.
Yeah actually, the big Raoult study didn’t include zinc for some inexplicable (to me) reason. Especially since they showed that (in thousands of patients), low zinc and vitamin D levels led to increased mortality.
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7315163/
Apologies, I misspoke since I didn’t read the paper in a while. It wasn’t low vitamin D levels, it was increased D-dimers although I think low vitamin D levels are implicated in other papers.
60% of Americans “drink bleach” on a daily basis because the active ingredient in bleach, sodium hypochlorite, is used as the disinfectant in municipal water systems that protect people by chlorinating their water supply.
I bet you didn”t know that, did you?
It’s obviously not a dead horse, based on actual data and there are billions of people in the world who can neither afford, nor have access to remdesivir. The dead horse being beaten is your own.
The horse is in fact dead, because HCQ does not work. The virus has spread all over the world, and has not been stopped in countries that use HCQ as in India (which is also the world largest manufacturer of HCQ).
No one who knows what they’re talking about says HCQ stops the virus from spreading. Clinical evidence from all over the world suggests that it keeps patients from progressing to serious illness. That’s all that really matters. It’s cheap, it’s safe, and with clinical evidence like that there is no reason not to use it everywhere as early treatment. Better than anything the US medical establishment offers for early treatment, which is nothing.
244,000 dead in America. If HCQ worked the death toll would be much lower. Most doctors like to save their patients lives.
The US medical establishment along with political hacks and bureaucrats discourage early treatment with HCQ, HCQ has been restricted by most State Governors. The NIH just issued policy guidance against early treatments. HCQ is not universally available, so your point doesn’t stand against reality.
https://www.americasfrontlinedoctors.com/hcq/
When your hero tested positive for the virus, and started to show symptoms, they did not give him HCQ. They flew him to Walter Reed on Marine One, and gave him the best known treatments available.
The treatments he got are only available to hospital inpatients; they are not early outpatient treatments.
Hope this shows up in correct place for response….
When Trump showed up with an o2 drop he was in the later stages. At this point the antivirals did no good and were more for show. He was most likely around day 12 and had caught it on a earlier visit to a covid treatment center in Charlottsville.
If you want to understand the desease phases, download EVMS stuff. No going thru again.
In all likely hood it was the steroids, vit d, melatonin, and aspirin that kept him from the third phase
You forgot to show your math(s) bethan.
Devils_tower
He also got an experimental antibody treatment made by Regeneron. That had to help …. and was a bit risky too.
What a hero …. well at least he must be my hero, apparently because I read papers on HCQ. How do those people’s brains work and I thank my lucky stars that I didn’t get those genes and/or upbringing.
At my yearly checkup, my Dr of 25yrs told me it works but he could not prescribe so gave me name of Dr in another state. Decided to by from India pharmacy. Listening to him not you. The CDC should have there ass handed to them for not providing recomendation for early care at home that mean something.
bethan, clinical trials are not done by voices in a single persons head, i.e. yours. Show us ALL the studies and the accompanying mathematical treatment of such. I’m sure the voices in loydo’s head will help you (see below). Do you need help finding the back of an envelope and a pencil for starters? I bet you do. loydo (and griff) have shown that they surely do.
ethan456@gmail.com
November 9, 2020 at 2:38 pm
244,000 dead in America. If HCQ worked the death toll would be much lower. Most doctors like to save their patients lives.
244k from 330 Million
whats the normal death toll?
and then earliest tretments prob killed as many as they sort of saved
Iatrogenic death count per yr USA is around? 100k or so a year or suchlike Ive read mentioned before
Believing that RCT is the only way to do science is pseudo-science.
Some insight on the subject, in French :
https://www.europeanscientist.com/fr/redactions-choice-fr/la-querelle-raoult-serie-a-la-recherche-de-la-raison-dans-la-controverse-sur-lhydroxychloroquine/
Well explained the problems, thanks for the link !
bethan456@gmail.com is right its fake news spread by an ignorant leader when people least needed it.
So much for your “science” Charles. This sort of rubbish is the opposite.
Coming from the biggest faker himself.
Dem run states had the highest death rates. How sinistral is that? This is definitely a research project begging to be done! What did Dem managers do differently under the crisis. I suppose its possible people run to Dem states to die and that may be the go to explanation that comes out of lackademia.
Me, I voted for liberals in the early days but they are nowhere to be found now. One suggestion for ordinary citizens to better survive the next pandemic is to ask your doctors who they voted for before choosing one.
Now don’t bring logic to Lyodo….it upsets its world view.
NY and NJ were among the first to be hit in a major way and had to learn how to deal with it on the fly and were able to get it under good control. Now it is some of the republican run states that are in trouble, TX, ND & SD for example, there are filled morgues in Texas now with refrigerated trucks in their parking lots.
You do understand that rural counties have limited morgue facilities as well as limited hospital capacity, right? Where I live we are close to Pittsburgh although still rural, our local hospitals have small ICU facilities so many go directly to AGH Northside, UPMC Mercy, Pittsburgh VA MC, MaGee Women’s, Presbyterian etc etc. Out in real flyover major hospitals are widely scattered. This situation is much more pronounced in areas of Texas, the Dakotas, Montana, Utah, Kansas, and these areas have very limited capacity for holding corpses for any extended period of time. Same happens after hurricanes along Gulf Coast and Eastern seaboard. Several of our regional “news” outlets have been contacting hospitals directly and are getting quite different answers than what national “journalists” are screeching constantly. We need a national moratorium on the 24/7 “news” industry and strict, harshly enforced standards for “journalists” who are fanning the flames of hysteria in America.
Phil. NY and NJ are currently experiencing a bad spike in COVID cases (and issuing new restrictions because of it). so much for “under good control”. Maybe they need to go back to their “good control” of sending more COVID cases to nursing homes again. That worked out so well the first time /sarc.
Something tells me that both Loydo & Bethan456 want people to e-mail to Bethan.
Something tells me that they are fishing for e-mails and identities from people that don’t agree with them.
Something tells me that they are not doing this for altruistic purposes.
Don’t e-mail the scumbags. Don’t encourage the scumbags.
I nailed it as an identity theft scam from the first comment.
Here’s what that second study says about randomized clinical trials: they infeasible:
“As in all areas of medicine, the large randomized, placebo-controlled, parallel group clinical trial in appropriate patients at risk with meaningful outcomes is the theoretical gold standard for recommending therapy. These standards are not sufficiently rapid or responsive to the COVID-19 pandemic.4 One could argue the results of definitive trials were needed at the outset of the pandemic, and certainly are needed now with more than 1 million cases and 500,000 deaths worldwide.5 Because COVID-19 is highly communicable, many ambulatory clinics do not care for patients in face-to-face visits, and these patients are commonly declined by pharmacies, laboratories, and imaging centers. On May 14, 2020, after about 1 million cases and 90,000 deaths in the United States had already occurred, the National Institutes of Health (NIH) announced it was launching an outpatient trial of hydroxychloroquine (HCQ) and azithromycin in the treatment ofCOVID-19.6 A month later, the agency announced it was closing the trial because of the lack of enrollment with only 20 of 2000 patients recruited.7 No safety concerns were associated with the trial. This effort serves as the best current working example of the lack of feasibility of outpatient trials for COVID-19. It is also a strong signal that future ambulatory trial results are not imminent or likely to report soon enough to have a significant public health impact on clinical outcomes.8”
At my yearly checkup, my doctor said hcq worked but he could not prescribe. Long story….
In mar/apr even the east european pharmacys said they could not get.
In aug I procured plenty from India pharmacy with no prescription.
Would it be possible to include an option to share on Parler (not only for this story but for ALL of your great content?
A little hcq, a glass of sparkling water, a wedge of lime and a shot of Tanqueray (sp?) would make a hell of a good therapeutic G and T.
I predict that soon after the Electoral College officially elects Presidents Biden/Harris that much of the research mentioned will magically be “discovered.” Dr. Fauci (an immunologist, not an epidemiologist or virologist) whose name the news media consistently lengthened to Fauci-the-country’s-leading-infectious-disease-expert (so we won’t forget), can be allowed to retire gracefully at age 80 next month. The Biden “plan” for tackling COVID-19 has in it the concept of fast-tracking a vaccine. You know, like the many that are in development now, and specifically the Pfizer vaccine much in the news today. It would be funny if it wasn’t so serious.
The suppression of the scientific research, reporting and simple discussion of COVID-19 by the likes of FB, YT, Twitter and the alphabet news outlets is indicative of what is coming to the climate discussion. Big Tech smothered serious people coherently discussing an important topic, and governments cheered them on. Lord help us once President Harris is in charge.
Lord help us from letting them steal this election. It’s far from over. For example, with just a 10,000 vote margin in GA, 132,000 ballots were just red-flagged as potentially invalid because they are CoE (change of address) ballots. In other words ballots sent to addresses where the addressee no longer lives, but were filled out and mailed back by someone.
Fortunately, the President did not mention Zn or vitamin D early on or those would be politicized and pulled from shelves and mocked.
This site summarizes all COVID-19 related research, not just HCQ:
https://c19study.com/
With 98 peer reviewed studies showing a median 64% improvement with early treatment, HCQ is not to be sneezed at.
HCQ has been effectively banned, but there are some other available nutrient supplements that work in a similar fashion (ionophores). Specifically, epigallocatechin gallate (EGCG) and quercetin. Here is what we take for general health and to prevent or decrease the effect of Covid-19:
n-acetylcysteine (NAC)
reduced glutathione (RG)
green tea extract (ECGC)
fresh fruits and vegtables, esp. apples and blueberries (quercetin)
Vitamin D3 (cholecalciferol) (2,500 IU)
multivitamin
mineral tablet (calcium, magnesium, zinc)
Calcium and Vitamine D3 together may be problematic.
Doesn’t vitamin K2 take care of that?
I read here in earlier threads people take up to 10.000 IE Vitamine D3, than, together with calcium, your kidneys may suffer of a calcification.
They come in the same tablet. Citracal. Ca, Zn, Cu, Mg, Na, & D3. Bayer. Wippany, NJ. Millions of people take this stuff.
No problems here. I’m not pregnant.
tell that to the companies making it
calcitriol is a huge seller for women in Aus and promoted BY gps here as well as rheumatologists