America’s Frontline Doctors traveled to Washington and gave a press conference.
UPDATE. Here’s a version that is still up
UPDATE 2. Squarespace has censored America’s Frontline Doctors website.
Give her a listen.
Several versions of this have been pulled off YouTube while I was preparing this post. I hope this FB version survives till the am. And now the FB has been pulled.
Here is a version of the complete news conference still on YouTube as of this moment. I’ve cued it to Dr Immanuel’s speaking.
Not sure you want to throw in with the lady who believes that Alien DNA is currently used in medical treatments and that vaccines will be used to prevent people from being religious.
loony tunes attacks RCT
Ad hominem.
Everybody has the same idea about what alien means ? 😀
An outlander may be an alien, as any stranger may be one 😀
Steven, you may explain if I’m wrong,
but if I’m vaccinated with antibodies of an other persons blood, is there alien DNA in the vaccine ??
😀
PHWEEET! Ad hominem (wohominem?) argument, five yards and loss of down.
If you don’t like her, you might be more inclined to take the word of a proper white male Yale epidemiology professor instead. Search for Harvey A. Risch article in American Journal of Epidemiology, “Early Outpatient Treatment of Symptomatic, High-Risk COVID-19 Patients”. He makes essentially the same points. Early use at lower doses. If you wait until the patient hits the ICU, it’s too late.
Is this the study?
“Five studies, including two controlled clinical trials, have demonstrated significant major outpatient treatment efficacy.”
https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/32458969/
(I wonder how long before PubMed is censored…)
The only really important thing is ‘is she right about this?”
I notice none of the trolls are going there – instead proceeding with the Daily Beast’s pseudo- if-then statement.
Moshed – she may be looney but she is right. See my response to Stokes and if you would like to bet me that zinc and hydrocloroquine is highy effective just tell me how much you want to wager.
Just another fraud who can’t handle women of color having a voice. Resort to attacking her cultural beliefs to shut her up. Good job Mosh!
Mosher, ngai sabai dee iue ppaao
Attacking someone because of their background, unrelated to the subject matter is rude.
Not sure anyone wants to throw in with a drive-by English Major’s ad hominem. How about trying to attack the message and not the messengers sometime Steven.
The FDA is a revolving door between Big Pharma and government. I don’t trust them on anything.
LOL Rotter is “censoring” someone (me) who embarrasses himself. Immanuel is a quack, and you’ve endorsed the quackery. FaceBook, Twitter, etc. recognize the quackery.
You haven’t been censored. Here you are.
My prior post on this has not been posted. Is that censorship?
Sometimes have to reload page to see new comments, its a wordpress thang.
Oh wait, it finally appeared.
Old.George: That clicking sound you’re hearing is because your turn signal is still on.
He censored you because you embarrassed yourself? Naw, he put your idiocy up top for everyone to laugh at.
Are you the one or the other Henry Pool ?
He is the real Henry Pool doing double blind studies 😉
It appears that he is the ‘other’ Henry Pool because there is no link associated with his name.
Tiens, tiens, no idea about deleting the line with the link before posting ? 😀
Nothing easier than that. 😀
PS
If you click on my name., you find a link, proof for use my PC
If you click on my name and find no link, proof for typing on my phone.
And Jack has ZERO reply to your correct assertion…
“The only published trials I have seen do not use zinc, and or do not use the HCQ/zinc combo at an early stage, and it do not use HCQ in the correct safe quantities.”
Jack???????
There’s more than one?
Tom
The HP with a link to his name disavowed a comment by an HP with no link in another thread.
Additional evidence from Ford Hospitals in Detroit
https://www.henryford.com/news/2020/07/hydro-treatment-study
Lots of opinions on this site today some seem to be based on some CNN or MSNBC talking head reports.
In the following link papers are listed showing both positive and negative results. Note the negative results seem to be with late usage of HCQ. The results are categorized in pre-exposure, post-exposure prophylaxis, early treatment, and late treatment. 65 studies are included (so far) with 39 peer reviewed.
https://c19study.com/
The only negative published trials I have seen do not use zinc, and or do not use the HCQ/zinc combo at an early stage, and or do not use HCQ in the correct safe quantities.
This group of Doctors, one of whom has some irrelevant weird religious beliefs, avoided all the errors in the negative studies and are getting very positive results.
Is there even one negative study that avoided the common errors described?
David
Her beliefs in what cause certain diseases is very relevant to how she treats someone who presents with symptoms. But, even a blind squirrel get lucky once in awhile.
LOL. Moron.
You know Nils Axel Mörner, expert in ocean research ?
Rahmstorf, a “climate expert”, not able to discuss about NAM’s reseach, that’s certainly not questionable tried of course to discredit him as wishbone follower.
You know Theodor Landscheidt, expert in solar and planet constellation research and predictor of several El Niños by research ?
Rahmstorf, a “climate expert”, not able to discuss about Landscheidts research tried of course to discredit him as adviser for astrologers.
You know Dr. Roy Spencer, no further infos needed, was discredited as creationist since years, because by his research and work, he was / is incontrovertible.
You recognise the schema ?
Incontrovertible by their work, look for something out of the subject for descrediting the person as noncredible.
In so far, what she is thinking in private about what ever, religious reasons, background etc doesn’t match the work for ill people.
You’re kind of an embarrassment to yourself, aren’t you, Henry?
It’s all a bit Zed and Two Noughts, but a lot of good people have weird superstitious ideas.
Maybe an anti-religion vaccine might stop people believing all sorts of illogical sh!t and doing harm because of it, illibertarian or not.
Religion is a moral philosophy. Everyone has a religion. The weirdest religions are typically secular, selective, opportunistic (e.g. Pro-Choice). A twilight faith (i.e. conflation of logical domains). A liberal (i.e. divergent, generational) ideology.
As Immanuel describes, her patients come to her in a flat panic, scared they are in for a painful death. Regardless of the efficacy of HQ, her confidence and lack of fear (putting arm around patients) is a very powerful placebo. Here the local clinic says come to the back door and ring if you have symptoms. The doc and nurses will see you in the storeroom, fully garbed in PPE. This reinforces fear and fear is not good for the immune system. Sure Immanuel may be a quack, but she is treating her patients the right way in this case.
Why is she a quack?
For those seeking Dr Stella E Immanuel videos:
https://www.youtube.com/user/firpowerministries
It is up.
She’s religious, that’s her private pleasure, but as far as her work she’s payed for is ok, she’s free to do what she likes, in US and elsewhere you have religious liberty, isn’t it ?
You may like it or not, it’s out of everyones interest.
The only negative published trials I have seen do not use zinc, and or do not use the HCQ/zinc combo at an early stage, and or do not use HCQ in the correct safe quantities.
This group of Doctors, one of whom has some irrelevant weird religious beliefs, avoided all the errors in the negative studies and are getting very positive results.
Is there even one negative study that avoided the common errors described?
Jack?????
This post seems to have been censored. The “E” is a typo.
Jack Dale July 28, 2020 at 9:14 am
For those seeking Dr Stella E Immanuel videos:
https://www.youtube.com/user/firpowerministries
It is up. I apologize for the duplicate post.
No, even the first isn’t to apologize, becaus of attac on religious liberty 😀
They now appear to have pulled the website of America’s Frontline Doctors.
Serious shit going on.
I thought those doctors coats odd (why are they so starched and why are they wearing them in the street) when first seen but then I saw those names on the pockets “America’s Frontline Doctors” so it seemed to add legitimacy.
Then a quick search brings up this page
https://mediabiasfactcheck.com/americas-frontline-doctors/
Why would legitimate doctors tie in with this group?
STRANGE
It is strange too that you think people should drink bleach…was that your claim?
Why would you believe self-styled fact-checkers at face value?
What makes you think I do? Check my other posts. I have been to her Immanuel’s ministries web site.They support the assessment.
Why do you assume the Front line Doctors with a 12 day old website are credible? Now their website is expired. A flash in the pan.
Mr. Dale: Above, you leap to conclusion that your own “operator error” was censorship; here, unless you are the half runt, Pat Frank was not talking to you. So what’s worse, a Nigerian doctor with some views that may seem weird to white privileged folks (to coin a phrase), or a commentor on a blog who can’t keep his posts straight?
Exactly – THERE’s the elitism – another primary necessary to be a modern progressive.
My comment was directed to Ghalfrunt, Jack.
This new flash: professional competence among physicians is not indicated by a functioning website.
RE Ghalfrunt:
The following is from your quoted website:
**Overall, we rate America’s Frontline Doctors a quackery level pseudoscience website based on the promotion of false or misleading information regarding Coronavirus that does not align with the consensus of science. We also rate them Low for factual reporting due to a lack of transparency as well as using known pseudoscience sources to draw their conclusions.**
The above quote is a quack site in my opinion. It is the one giving false information. They suggest that HCQ is not effective. More and more studies are showing the effectiveness of HCQ when given early with zinc. Here is one more:
https://wattsupwiththat.com/2020/07/03/good-quality-paper-demonstrates-strong-efficacy-of-hydroxychloroquine-mortality-rate-cut-in-half/
That site give no proof, just their opposing political opinion.
There is nothing in the Henry Ford paper that you linked to that suggests they gave anyone zinc.
They looked at people who got HCQ, those who got Z-Pak, and those who got both, and those who got neither.
It is a retrospective study.
It has several identified confounding factors.
The groups treated were not equivalent, and there were other drugs use on the patients, which were not even among the different study groups.
Besides for that…the Henry Ford retrospective found that people that got HCQ and Zpak did about as well as people that got neither.
People that got HCQ only did the best…but were also far more like to have gotten steroids, which have been separately shown to be highly effective in preventing deaths.
Also not mentioned in the study data at all are several drugs and treatments known to have been used in that time period at these hospitals. Remdesivir was coming into increasingly widespread usage over the study period, and yet no where is it listed as being given to anyone.
What is known is that the four groups of people may have been culled from a consecutive set of patients, but the groups were all treated as distinct time periods within the study interval. Those getting neither of the drugs were most likely the earliest patients, and they were the sickest. they were treated when doctors had little ideas of the particulars of this new disease.
Those who got both were likely treated in late march and early April, while those getting just HCQ were probably treated last, in late April…which is why they were more likely to have gotten steroids, and probably prone positioning, and probably plasma, and almost surely remdesivir.
“”Like most health systems, Saint Joseph Mercy Health System tried hydroxychloroquine initially given the lack of effective treatment,” the Catholichealth system said in a statement to The News. “However, with increased data and published literature, we determined there was no benefit as well as an increased risk of harmful side effects, and discontinued use.”
Henry Ford Health System has continued its multiple clinical trials of hydroxychloroquine, including one that is testing whether the drug can prevent COVID-19 infections in first responders who work with coronavirus patients. The first responder clinical trial was trumpeted by Trump administration officials early in the pandemic.
But the top infectious disease doctor at Henry Ford Macomb Hospital said he only treats COVID-19 patients with hydroxychloroquine if families insist. ”
https://www.detroitnews.com/story/news/local/michigan/2020/06/10/health-systems-mixed-use-hydroxychloroquine-covid-19/5328358002/
And this rebuttal found many problems with the retrospective:
https://www.ijidonline.com/article/S1201-9712(20)30599-3/fulltext
This article references a study from the same hospital group in March, and details how the protocol for treating patients was evolving, with patients treated later doing far better than those treated early in the pandemic:
https://www.clickondetroit.com/news/local/2020/06/18/henry-ford-study-indicates-early-use-of-steroids-for-covid-19-prevents-need-for-ventilator/
Why has the more recent paper left out important details, such as the timing of the treatment groups, and the use of medications like remdesivir that they did not even mention?
AFAIK, I am the only person who has made note of this detail regarding remdesivir, and that there was an earlier study published in May that overlapped with eh time period and patient list of this later retrospective?
It appears to me that there are people that have some sort of presupposed conclusion that they are willing to support with phony info if need be.
I have no idea why anyone would want to do that…unless it is to gaslight supporters of Trump into getting behind something which will in all likelihood be discredited with many results of many large trials that will be published long before November.
Or else they are just hardheaded and/or blind to any evidence which does not support what they have wanted to find.
[snip, play nice-mod] Zinc was added to Henry Ford protocol but not in time for publication. Just wait til Dr. Prasad has enough results to publish. Then you will finally learn something. His zinc and HCQ protocol kicks ass. The NY Times interviewed him but nixed the story as they believed people would see HCQ and think Trump. The key is the right amount if zinc administered properly … the HCQ just helps zinc get into the cells.
America’s Frontline Doctors webpage has expired:
https://www.americasfrontlinedoctors.com/
On the Wayback Machine:
https://web.archive.org/web/20200728160437/https://www.americasfrontlinedoctors.com/
References are still on Google Drive:
White Paper on Hydroxychloroquine
https://drive.google.com/file/d/1-gsn_Ye2EYDDkV_79Ag1tgUqZLNCMSt-/view
This is the culmination of months-long research from all sources. It explains how Americans have come to be in the grip of fear. All the myths and all the misconceptions about a safe, generic drug that has been FDA approved for 65 years, given to pregnant women, breastfeeding women, children, the elderly and the immune-compromised for years and decades without complication, are finally put in the trash heap where they belong. You will have the indisputable proof that you have been massively lied to, often very intentionally. At first you will first be heartbroken. And then you will be furious. Good. Because then you will demand change.
Compendium of HCQ Studies
https://drive.google.com/file/d/1l6y3L_KGb1ilMW0FaP4VZsd7WvX2IU3z/view
The safety of HCQ is irrefutable. The evidence supporting HCQ efficacy against Covid-19 is also overwhelming. All negative HCQ studies have used either: too much, used it alone (it needs Zinc), or used it late (it should be early.) The treatment dose is 200 mg HCQ twice a day for five days + Zinc 50 (elemental) daily. The prophylactic dose is 400 mg HCQ weekly + Zinc 50 (elemental) daily. (There are studies right now to see if HCQ 200 mg. weekly is sufficient.) This is very low dose. (The usual dose of HCQ in Lupus, Rheumatoid Arthritis is 400 mg. daily for years.) There are telemedicine physicians who are aware of the facts and if you are concerned about this, please see one. It is also over the counter in many places in the world including Indonesia and most of South America.
Registry Expiry Date: 2021-07-16T01:27:49Z
This is outright war
About 8 hours ago the website https://www.americasfrontlinedoctors.com/ was perfectly in order. From there I watched the 3h video.
Reflecting on Roy Martin’s announcement, I took a screen shot of the still open tab and made a whois on their domain, which is valid another year. Then I refreshed the page and and saw Roy Martin was correct.
Normally if your hosting account is about to run out, you will be emailed several warning and I tend not to believe the site owners have ignored this.
It is no coincidence it is blistering battle, it is the new KGB in full action.
In an earlier comment, I saw someone writing that President DJT’s Twitter account was closed too. If true, that is inviting to civil general unrest (or way worse).
“In an earlier comment, I saw someone writing that President DJT’s Twitter account was closed too”
It was Trump’s son, Donald Jr., who had his Twitter account frozen for posting these doctors’ video.
Trump takes HCQ, still not ill.
Bolsanero takes HCQ, got only a mild illness.
Boris Johnson took no HCQ, ended up in IC on oxygen.
Ed
But Bolsanero DID get sick. Your standards of evidence are quite thin.
its a cure not an immunization … are you that ignorant or just dense …
Dark Matter
It isn’t clear who you are directing your “ignorant” remark to. Let me point out that Zuiderwijk said “Trump takes HCQ, still not ill.” The implication is that he believes HCQ behaves as an “immunization.”
Not as sick as Boris by a long way. That’s the point you are so keen not to see.
But Bolsanero already had COVID-19 when he started taking HCQ, therefore he would be “sick” wouldn’t he.
Your argument is very thin.
Infection, disease? HCQ is not a magical elixir, but its active properties complement normal body functions to reduce viral viability and disease progression.
Not according to Henry. To Henry, HCQ is tantamount to using leeches.
Clyde, both Bolsanero & Boris got sick before taking any treatment. Only one of them took HCQ and it wasn’t the one that ended up so bad that he had to be put in IC on oxygen. That’s the point you are deliberately trying to miss/distract from.
The implication is that he believes HCQ behaves as an “immunization.”
Nonsense, that’s the implication that you wish to read into it, not the one that is there. He specifically mentioned people that did get sick (one that took HCQ implying the result was their case being mild and one that didn’t implying the result was their case being severe) , so clearly wasn’t talking about “immunization”. So if you are going to disagree with his points, try to do so honestly instead of making up “implications” that are not there.
https://www.americasfrontlinedoctors.com/ has apparently gone dead as well.
The memory hole is working overtime today…
Please tell me it is not this insane person:
Plenty of competent people are religious nutcases, Matt. There were some in my class in graduate school. Very smart, very competent at math and science, very very religious.
Religion is one of the progressive left’s biggest knee-jerk bigotries.
Her question “Has Dr Gupta ever treated a COVID patient?” is an excellent one. Has DR Fauci treated a patient either? Nope. Yet they are first and loudest to throw out the use due to ivory tower excuses.
https://www.thedailybeast.com/stella-immanuel-trumps-new-covid-doctor-believes-in-alien-dna-demon-sperm-and-hydroxychloroquine
So???
Afraid of powerful women of color? Attack their cultural beleifs to discredit them.
boder
I expect a graduate MD to treat me based on what (s)he was taught in medical school. If I want to be treated based on cultural beliefs, I’ll call a Witch Doctor. There is a very good reason that the world has turned its back on potions and spells and insisted on drugs shown to have efficacy.
🙂
Clyde
Than don’t go see her, that’s is your choice. But those that have seen her are apparently happy they did, but in your world she needs to be censored because you don’t like her. She’s an accredited physician who works in a hospital not a witch doctor, you are the one who beliefs are getting in the way of science and debate. You have no answer to her assertions so you have to attack the messenger.
boder
You are putting words in my mouth. I have never asked that she be “censored.” I’m pointing out that many gullible people are accepting what she has said as being ‘gospel,’ without insisting on verification of her claims and analyzing her treatment protocol.
It has been a long time since traveling medicine shows came to town and sold snake oil to the gullible who were desperate for a cure to their ails. I’m afraid many people have become careless with their objectivity.
There are so many things that have been claimed to help COVID-19 (including the ubiquitous cannabis oil) that one should wonder just why there are so many similar claims! It is probably, in part, from experiments that are poorly designed and a populous that is desperate for something akin to a diet pill or a pill to cure ED. Americans, especially, have little patience for difficult solutions.
And yet you support censoring her simply because you don’t like her. See how simple it is?
I support investigating her claims and taking away her medical license if she is a lying.
Which she is using. Why does that upset you?
I expect a graduate MD to treat me based on what (s)he was taught in medical school
Which, as far as is currently known, she has been doing for her patients. it’s you, who has been bringing up her unrelated cultural/religious beliefs as a means of “censoring” her on what she has seen in her medical practice while using what she was taught in medical school. If you have evidence that she isn’t using what she was taught in medical school but instead is treating COVID patients based on her cultural beliefs show us that evidence. I suspect you don’t have any such evidence otherwise you’d have already brought it forward.
There is a very good reason that the world has turned its back on potions and spells and insisted on drugs shown to have efficacy.
HCQ isn’t a potion or spell. And many Doctors that have prescribed it for their patients (not all of them from the same cultural/religious background as the one you’ve gotten your panties in a twist over) has spoken to it’s efficacy for their patients. It seems (based on your postings so far) you just don’t want to listen because the orange man had nice things to say about it, so you look for anything (like religious/cultural beliefs) to attack the messenger rather than the message. And that’s just sad.
Dr Emmanuel was giving anecdotal clinical experience. It may have been that each of her patients were going to recover regardless of treatment. It may have been that all of them had a low viral load and would have recovered anyway. That is indeed a problem when the disease, untreated, has a very high recovery rate. Even the most severely compromised have a recovery rate exceeding 80%. Absent a randomized controlled study, sacrificing a number of participants, Plaquenil has not been proven to be effective for preventing COVID19 after SARS-CoV-2 infection. Nor has it been proven effective as a prophylactic.
Nevertheless, absent likelihood of harm (it is approved and has been used by many at higher doses for, say, Lupus) I would ask the doctor for the prescription should I get symptoms. I already take a different zinc-ionophore (OTC Quercetin), harmless at recommended dosages and it _might_ work.
No harm. Might work.
Why not?
May be, Covid19 doesn’t exist ?
What ever drug you give, it works 😀
Except when someone conducting a clinical trial gives it.
Then the effect mysteriously disappears.
I suggest this site should champion HCQ, promote this strange doctor, and defend the Trump administration in all matters. Eventually, the virus will pass, the world will settle down, and climate will be among the headlines again. WUWT will have great credibility in climate science and be a respected source for information.
I want HCQ, azithromycin and zinc if I get Covid-19. It”s effective and each dose is small change. Remdesivir is ~$3100 according to NPR.
Gee, I wonder if the price difference is the reason HCQ is out of favor? No way to make money on it.
Yes, and that is also why Dr. Bartlett’s steroid treatment will be knocked especially if Trump likes it.
Enrico
What I find incongruous is that there are at least 21 other drugs that have been approved for use with humans, which appear to show efficacy. Yet, many commenters here focus on HCQ and ignore the other drugs, based on some weak conspiracy theory about Big Pharma making more money. Why then acknowledge that there are other useful drugs besides remdesivir?
https://scitechdaily.com/researchers-identify-21-existing-drugs-that-could-treat-covid-19/
If everyone had agreed that HCQ was all that we need, then there would have been no incentive to explore other options. Personally, I’d like to see other options, if for no other reason than to have an alternative to HCQ for those who are unusually sensitive to it. Just as there are many antibiotics in physician’s arsenal of drugs, to treat different strains of bacteria or accommodate those who are allergic to the antibiotic of choice, I think that the world would be better off of doctors had a wider choice than just HCQ.
Not so Clyde. People come in this site claiming HCQ does not work at all.
And some claim that unless there is a double blind study any further claims of it’s effectiveness is bunk.
“If everyone had agreed that HCQ was all that we need” What happened is Trump said something good about it and the leftards immediately attacked it, all the while suppressing information about other existing drugs and pushing the failed Ebola drug remdesivir. I have taken HCQ in the past and after my appointment with immunology/ENT specialist Friday I will be taking it again for persistent inflammatory conditions from Sjogren’s Syndrome and early stage RA, that it helps against Chinese Disease is just gravy on top.
Quite a few commenters here jumping on Dr Immanuel’s support for “out there” beliefs in other fields of study.
Do these same commenters take their log-handled shovels in the same way to all the climate “scientists” who also hold a brief for the Gaia notion?
(Or their belief that CO2 is the “control knob” for atmospheric behaviors)
“Whacko ideas” in one topic area don’t always mean that the proponents have no usable contributions in other areas.
For example, Samuel Langley, a university professor and secretary of the Smithsonian Institution designed & developed an airplane in competition with the Wright Bros. Langley’s was a dud that rolled straight into the Potomac River.
But that didn’t overshadow his award-winning legacy achievements in air and sea craft, facilities, a unit of solar radiation and infrared discoveries.
How much effort went into hiding Obama’s ‘nutty’ radical beliefs?
Exactly, perhaps not independent, but separable nonetheless. We should be wary of indulging diversity dogma (i.e. color judgments). That said, medicine is both engineering and science, and her experience and patient outcomes matter (i.e. anecdotal, observation, limited frame of reference). While the ideal is to heal, the goal is to do mitigate harm and minimize injury (i.e. risk management) relative to the default state. HCQ has a well-established risk profile, and a clinical understanding of its active antiviral properties, but it is not a magical elixir, and its efficacy is to complement normal body functions to reduce viral viability and disease progression.
Langley’s plane snagged on launch which crashed it. Curtis retrieved it out of the Potomac restored it and made it fly, which is how he broke the Wright Brothers Patent on the airfoil.
Good to know.
Can I use this info next time I’m playing Trivial Pursuit?
Might get me a piece of cheese 🙂
Hydroxychloroquine needs to be given to people early in the course of a Covid-19 infection and the earlier the better. That is how it should be used and the evidence that we have suggests that it could save many lives if it is used appropriately.
Unfortunately nobody is doing those studies.
Instead we have this pseudoscience, this fake scientific research, where researchers that full well know that this is the case, or at least know that others are alleging that this is the case, give hydroxychloroquine to people that are hospitalized, either on a ventilator or close to it, and then observe that it doesn’t do much good.
Well guess what we already knew that. We already basically knew that this would be the case before the first study was done.
And then these pretentious, lying, incompetent researchers, editors and reviewers pretend that that is the appropriate question.
And that is the essential point that they are lying about. This is what current studies that purport to disprove the use of hydroxychloroquine to treat Covid-19 are doing.
We know through many years of experience and literally millions and millions of people that this drug or very similar drugs that have been given to people that when given appropriately hydroxychloroquine is safe. But part of using it appropriately is not giving to people that are quite seriously ill because then there is a significant risk of a heart complication and in particularly when azithromycin is being given at the same time.
And zinc is also part of this story because we have good evidence that the combination of zinc plus hydroxychloroquine given to people early in an infection and that have been screened for hydroxychloroquine use (not everybody can use this) is better than hydroxychloroquine alone.
Now I say probably because we need more evidence. But who is doing the studies?
Given the evidence we do have, this safe drug (when used appropriately) could save a lot of lives.
So is that hearsay or actual medical evidence. Sounds like CNN.
So those bad “studies” is what Fauci would be using. On CNN this morning they said Trump was accusing Fauci of misinformation. So they asked Fauci. He said that HCQ does not help. So that is the idiots on CNN.
I’m not sure I understand your point.
We have a hypothesis. I doubt Fauci bothers to explain his reasoning. But we don’t need Fauci. Any person that understands the subject can speak up and explain their reasoning.
So where is this evidence against the hypothesis?
Many of the HCQ studies were totally useless. They were giving patients the drug long after the virus got a foothold. That’s like giving anti-venom to a snake bite victim after the organs are shutting down and then claiming anti-venom does not work. Who exactly were behind these studies ? Why did FDA reference such ridiculous studies ? Why to this day have not more studies been done on giving the drug immediately at the very first sign of illness ?
Stevek
The other side of the coin is that the recovery rate is so high with COVID-19 that if those with early onset of symptoms were given table salt, one could make similar claims of its magical curative power. The problem is exacerbated when there aren’t strict controls on who is treated and who is turned away because they are too sick. Those with co-morbidities are likely to get very sick rapidly and not be good candidates for a physician who claims that HCQ only works with those who show early, mild symptoms. However, it is the very sick who are most in need of medical intervention, and they are turned away by those promoting HCQ.
I listened to the live feed Monday morning. Very powerful.
A big piece of it was the alarming Medical Cancel Culture that is occurring. Medical boards can take away your right to practice for life. So Doctors are silenced.
Yeah, Social media doesn’t want that to get out
During an office visit with my rheumatologist today, I asked about her personal views on the HCQ/COVID controversy.
Her reply, in a nutshell, is that she thinks the reason for contradictory outcomes is that HCQ only works for people with underlying, possibly undiagnosed, autoimmune conditions.
I found that interesting, as I’d never heard or read anything to that effect.
I fall into that category, well, diagnosed, Sjogren’s Syndrome and early RA indications.
On c19study.com they list 65 studies (39 peer reviewed). All the “negative” ones have something in common: “Late stage”, “Late treatment” etc. Why are they waiting until late in the treatment cycle to administer it?
President of El Salvador Nayib Bukele has announced that he is taking hydroxychloroquine as a preventative measure against the coronavirus. Bukele told reporters on Tuesday that “most world leaders” are doing the same and has questioned why world leaders are being advised to use it while the public is not.
TRM
You asked, “Why are they waiting until late in the treatment cycle to administer it?” The answer is because by then the doctors are desperate. There was no standard of treatment and intubation often made the situation worse. It is the sickest who are most in need of treatment!
No it isn’t. These studies could have been setup to give it to patients as soon as they are diagnosed. Instead they can’t or won’t give it to people early on.
If you want to try something on late term patients then what about a study of intravenous vitamin C or the steroid treatment?
http://www.doctoryourself.com/klennerbio.html
No, they will just try the HCQ without zinc and then say “see it doesn’t work”. Forgive my cynicism
but these studies were setup to fail (IMHO) and the FDA cites only these and not the positive studies? Sorry but the corruption runs way to deep for me to give any government agency the benefit of the doubt.
Why all this worry about HCQ not being prescribed- Trump has said covid19 is no worse than flu, and it will disappear like magic (more witchcraft?)
Too bad there’s no drug for TDS or for idiocy – you could be the first one in line for it…
Gosh – I don’t remember him saying a thing about magic. I’m only seeing you.
I wonder, if you really, really tried, could you come up with comparable statements from the likes of Fauci, Cuomo, Smarmy Chuck, or Nasty Nancy?
At the beginning Trump was too optimistic – on the other hand, this as been a pure rat-f*ck – after four years of the same – it’s not too out of line for him to start to doubt the boy crying wolf.
dont expect logic to work
Or data, right MoshManster?
https://wattsupwiththat.com/2020/07/27/why-herd-immunity-to-covid-19-is-reached-much-earlier-than-thought-update/#comment-3042779
texans still dropping like flies
not pretty
Uh huh, yeah you mean like 2 deaths reported on the 30th?
https://txdshs.maps.arcgis.com/apps/opsdashboard/index.html#/ed483ecd702b4298ab01e8b9cafc8b83
smackdaddy moshtard alarmist backtracking sprache if you ask me.
🙂
Yes how dare Trump say “the overall clinical consequences of Covid-19 may ultimately be more akin to those of a severe seasonal influenza”. Oh, wait. that wasn’t Trump. That was Dr Fauci.
Are you the one claiming that people should drink bleach?