Dr Stella Immanuel V Dr. Fauci-TKO. HCQ Championed.

America’s Frontline Doctors traveled to Washington and gave a press conference.

UPDATE. Here’s a version that is still up

UPDATE 2. Squarespace has censored America’s Frontline Doctors website.

Give her a listen.

Several versions of this have been pulled off YouTube while I was preparing this post. I hope this FB version survives till the am. And now the FB has been pulled.

Here is a version of the complete news conference still on YouTube as of this moment. I’ve cued it to Dr Immanuel’s speaking.

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Gibby
July 28, 2020 6:05 am

Already pulled from YouTube…

TRM
Reply to  Gavin Hardy
July 28, 2020 2:33 pm

Thanks. It is down on bitchute now as well. The censors are working doubletime.

Dr Stella Immanuel, what can I say other than “You go girl” and I’m with you!

joy evans
Reply to  TRM
July 28, 2020 6:10 pm

Yes Dr Stella telling the truth. They are tr
acking her and her character to make sure nothing harms the money trail. Wish there was a site to follow her.

Mark
Reply to  TRM
July 28, 2020 8:04 pm
Mark
Reply to  TRM
July 28, 2020 8:07 pm
Peter
Reply to  Gavin Hardy
July 31, 2020 3:37 am

Here too:

ZJ
Reply to  Gibby
July 28, 2020 7:16 am

The full Summit is below, go to Menu-Summit:

AmericasFrontlineDoctors.com

It is nearly 3 hours but very much worth listening to whole thing

Reply to  ZJ
July 28, 2020 10:25 am

Page down

William Astley
Reply to  ZJ
July 28, 2020 1:27 pm

Three hours? Did you watch the 5 minute clip that Youtube just pulled?

The 5 minute clip of the angry Houston woman doctor who also is black and comes from Nigeria who’s speech will Change America…..

This is most important non political speech ever made by a doctor, to save lives at a time of a pandemic….

She and her staff used the HCQ cocktail as a prophylactic, in addition to treating 350 covid sick, high risk patients who had diabetes, ashama, who are obese, who are elderly (oldest patient 92) and so on. Her patients all got better and her staff did not get covid.

She states that she doesn’t care if she risks her career, as she knows what she is saying is the truth…

Why did youtube pull suddenly pull this video?

Why did youtube block the account of Trump Jr. for posting the 5 minute clip of the Doctor speaking about this very important subject…

Based her clinical experience she states, it is medical fact that, the HCQ cocktail is close to a cure for covid when used early.

This is consistent with the results of Michigan HCQ cocktail study, except the Michigan HCQ cocktail study waited 48 hours before using the HCQ cocktail which drastically reduced the effectiveness of the HCQ cocktail.

Americans are dying needlessly. She say that is madness. Which it is. It is also a crime to hide an effective treatment for a virus at at time of a pandemic.

You Tube, CNN, Washington Post, NYT, and so on…. are going to face company ending lawsuits whose size will depend on those companies taking immediate action to mitigate damages.

When criminal negligence has happened, logically needless dying must be stopped as soon as possible.

Or criminal negligence becomes mass murder.

The Houston doctor compares those (Media companies, fake news) who are hiding the effectiveness of the HCQ cocktails, because their care more about politics than the American people, to the evil done by the Nazis.

Is there another possible spin? I am tired of 24/7 lies.

Our country is not a political game. We need to stop this madness. This is a time for action.

She is an honest angry Houston doctor, who is on the side of her patients and who appears to have no connection to either the Republican or Democratic parties.

Rhondi
Reply to  William Astley
July 28, 2020 2:51 pm

I agree with you

ORLANDO Martin
Reply to  Rhondi
July 28, 2020 8:24 pm

I AGREE ITS SOMETHING HIDDEN

TomB
Reply to  William Astley
July 28, 2020 6:50 pm

Her comment about those who are fighting against prescribing this cure is that they’re just like the good Nazis that turned a blind eye to the holocaust. That’s what got the video pulled. Without that one line, there’s no justification to block the video.

2hotel9
Reply to  TomB
July 29, 2020 8:18 am

None of them are claiming that, they are actually giving no specific reason other than the amorphous”It violates our policy”.

JoEllen
Reply to  William Astley
August 2, 2020 11:32 pm

The family of a woman who died in Immanuel’s care do to malpractice tried to sue in another state but couldn’t find her to serve her papers. She had fled to Texas. Not the kind of doctor I would want taking care of me.

David L Hagen
Reply to  ZJ
July 28, 2020 7:55 pm

James Todaro MD has Reposted the the full 44 min Americas Frontline Doctors video at the new Omni Journal
https://omnij.org/AmericasFrontlineDoctors
Top left at https://omnij.org/Main_Page

Richard G.
Reply to  David L Hagen
July 30, 2020 11:34 pm

From Harvey A. Risch, MD, PhD , Professor of Epidemiology, Yale School of Public Health
2 peer reviewed papers in: American Journal of Epidemiology, published by Johns Hopkins Bloomberg School of Public Health.
May 27, 2020- “Early Outpatient Treatment of Symptomatic, High-Risk Covid-19 Patients that Should be Ramped-Up Immediately as Key to the Pandemic Crisis”
https://academic.oup.com/aje/article/doi/10.1093/aje/kwaa093/5847586

July 20, 2020- Response to: “Early Outpatient Treatment of Symptomatic, High-Risk Covid-19 Patients” and “Re: Early Outpatient Treatment of Symptomatic, High-Risk Covid-19 Patients that Should be Ramped-Up Immediately as Key to the Pandemic Crisis”
https://academic.oup.com/aje/article/doi/10.1093/aje/kwaa152/5873640

More from Dr. Risch:
https://www.newsweek.com/key-defeating-covid-19-already-exists-we-need-start-using-it-opinion-1519535

More COVID 19 Science journal articles Aggregated Here:
https://c19study.com/

Read the science. Check your confirmation Bias. Draw your own conclusions.

Medicine should be practiced by Trained Physicians using their knowledge, experience and the tools they have at hand, not by untrained poorly informed politicians and pundits.

“We don’t know how many people will get COVID-19 in the future, but based on deaths to date, a treatment which is x% effective could have saved:
17% effective could have saved 111,393 lives. 30% effective could have saved 196,577 lives.
49% effective could have saved 321,076 lives.”

It does not have to be 100% effective to make a difference. Remdesivir is not as effective as they had hoped. Perfect is the enemy of the good.

Laurns
Reply to  Richard G.
August 5, 2020 9:50 am

thanks for the links

Kathy
Reply to  ZJ
July 29, 2020 6:06 am

I am looking for the first part of this video, where the doctors are talking about kids and teachers and the virus

Reply to  Gibby
July 28, 2020 7:35 am

Since when is truth that disputes the Marxists agenda against against Googles terms service? As an ex-Googler who is not a radical Socialist, I was keenly aware of their far left leaning politically biased culture, but this is embarrassing.

Craig
Reply to  co2isnotevil
July 28, 2020 12:47 pm

The agenda requires fear. Scared people are easy to manipulate.

Richard G.
Reply to  co2isnotevil
July 30, 2020 10:12 pm

It is called Lysenkoism.
Trofim Lysenko led a political purge of any science, especially genetics, that threatened official party Marxist doctrine of Lamarkian evolution… The offending scientists went to the gulag.

It set soviet agriculture back decades.

oebele bruinsma
Reply to  Gibby
July 28, 2020 8:21 am

Try Breibart, it works in the Netherlands!! The simple FACT that this news item has been censured makes me mad; this will have repercussions in the coming elections world-wide, except ofcourse in China….

Robert W. Turner
Reply to  oebele bruinsma
July 28, 2020 2:48 pm

At least in China they are giving their people HCQ.

TRM
Reply to  oebele bruinsma
July 28, 2020 2:55 pm

It means they are directly over the target!!! If you have a cure you don’t need a vaccine multiple times a year. Good for us and bad for Baal & Medusa Gates, Fraudci & Co

Paul
Reply to  Gibby
July 28, 2020 9:33 am

Has no one done any background check on this “doctor”? Sorry, but she’s a nut. Doesn’t matter whether she’s right or wrong, telling the truth or lying – she’s a nut. It’s embarrassing to see her promoted on this site. 🙁

Ron Long
Reply to  Paul
July 28, 2020 10:38 am

Well, Paul, Dr. Stella tears into Dr. Sanjay Gupta and that makes her the real deal in my book. When you put “doctor” in parenthesis it suggests you don’t think she is a doctor? A little racism here?

2hotel9
Reply to  Ron Long
July 28, 2020 10:44 am

Hate to have to tell Paul this, lots of doctors are nuts. May be brilliant in their field, take them outside of it and they come off as bat poop crazy a lot of the time. And yes, over the years I have known doctors, worked for several, hunted with 4 a few years ago and have spent many an hour shooting with a few. Just being a doctor does not preclude them being a bit off.

Samuel C Cogar
Reply to  2hotel9
July 28, 2020 12:14 pm

Paul (July 28, 2020 at 9:33 am) … is the nut, …….. a “trough feeding” Trump hating nut.

Jessicalwlr
Reply to  Ron Long
July 28, 2020 11:41 am

Why would racism have anything to do with it… the Dr. has made many irrational statements pertaining to things that are not scientific. I don’t believe Paul was referring to anything but that. I don’t even see why you would bring that up.

Nicholas McGinley
Reply to  Jessicalwlr
July 28, 2020 4:42 pm

Because he is a race baiting POS.

Bulldust
Reply to  Jessicalwlr
July 28, 2020 5:18 pm

Supporting this doctor because she has a narrative that is convenient is like supporting Alex Jones because he says climate change is a crock. Her other videos do very little to make her credible, even if she is 100% correct on this issue. Sorry, but it’s true. I’d rather take my medical advice from MedCram, thanks. This has nothing to do with the identity of the doctors in question, and everything with their credibility.

Alex
Reply to  Ron Long
July 28, 2020 6:17 pm

Good point!

wadelightly
Reply to  Paul
July 28, 2020 10:50 am

What did you find in your background check of her to establish that she’s a nut? I know that what she is claiming is also claimed by many other medical professionals. It is also supported by a recent study (Published in the Journal of Infectious Disease) conducted in Michigan. I don’t know, so I can only rely on the science and not what I hear on the news or opinion discussions.

Rich Davis
Reply to  Birdog357
July 28, 2020 5:36 pm

I don’t know if she’s telling the truth about her covid patients’ results using HCQ-Zn-Azithromicin, but she’s not saying that her covid treatments depend on anything related to her religious beliefs. Have we reached the point where religious belief is a disqualification for practicing medicine?

She believes in demons, is it? Ok, well I’m actually not finding that so far-fetched anymore, having had a quick look around!

WTF is this country coming to when censorship is being so openly and sanctimoniously implemented?

Alex
Reply to  Birdog357
July 29, 2020 2:32 am

“The Supernatural world is as real as the physical. What takes place in the spiritual realm affects us physically in our day to day lives.
The subject of the evil spiritual marriage has been grossly mis- understood by many people. While some hold erroneous views, others demonstrate partial knowledge of this all- important subject. The problem of evil marriage goes beyond dilettantish purposes.”

LMAO

Nicholas McGinley
Reply to  Birdog357
July 29, 2020 5:47 am

The country is in a health emergency, and there is every reason and many laws backing up decisions to prevent people from spreading unsupported medical claims.

She is giving medical advice contrary to what evidence based medicine has determined the facts to be re HCQ and covid.
We are no longer in an information vacuum.
She is making claims that a cure is known.
This is a false statement of medical efficacy.

beng135
Reply to  Birdog357
July 29, 2020 9:51 am

Birdog, I’d automatically assume that’s a fabrication.

Quilter
Reply to  wadelightly
July 28, 2020 7:20 pm

The Lancet and the New England Journal of medicine have both withdrawn papers that states HCQ does not work. Big market growing for lawyers to go after Fauci et al . What are his links to Gilead again?

Nicholas McGinley
Reply to  Quilter
July 29, 2020 10:57 am

The reason for the withdrawal was because the source of the data is not allowed to make the data public.
Health care data is highly private data and is in many places protected from public disclosure, or disclosure to anyone not specifically authorized by each patient.
In the US it is a ironclad set of protections, many of which are contained in what are called the HIPAA.

So that being retracted is no indication one way or the other of whether the results reported in the study were accurate or true.

Lorne Newell
Reply to  Quilter
August 1, 2020 8:38 pm

One of the rules of the scientific method is that the data has to released so that the hypothesis can be tested. If it cannot be tested it is not peer reviewed.

Michael Jankowski
Reply to  Paul
July 28, 2020 10:53 am

She’s still more plausible than Michael Mann, though.

M Seward
Reply to  Michael Jankowski
July 28, 2020 9:45 pm

That is not saying much MJ. I think she is a nut, I mean alien DNA and stuff? There are people who think ‘climate change’ is a load of crap but for quite irrational, hairbrained reasons as distinct from the massive flaws in the so called science and the financial and political incentives to get on the green bandwagon. You don’t need the interference of aliens or such like to make the argument.

She sounds like a nut, talks like a nut….. conclusion…?

Redge
Reply to  M Seward
July 29, 2020 1:36 am

She’s a duck?

Nicholas McGinley
Reply to  M Seward
July 29, 2020 10:59 am

Ergo she will float, but if she sinks and dies, she is not a witch.

Nicholas McGinley
Reply to  M Seward
July 29, 2020 11:12 am

Ergo she will float, but if she sinks and dies, she is not a witch.
Who she is is basically irrelevant to the question at hand, which is whether these drugs work and if her statement constitutes evidence, or is it something else?
An opinion? A set of personal observations?
Her report of what she says is her experience?
This is what is called anecdotal information in the world of medicine, and for good reason.
That is all it is.
It is something said by someone.
It matters no one bit who said it, or what was said, when it some to the value of her assertion as scientific evidence.
If one wants to get around that, I do not see how one would, but one way someone might claim is it is possible to do so is to examine credibility.
Which becomes highly subjective.
Which is why such information was long ago deemed un-useful for the purpose of evaluating the efficacy of a drug or a treatment

Right here on this thread is a guy who states outright that to criticize or question her veracity or how much weight to give it is de facto proof of racist intent, but in a separate comment denounces leftists and touts his own conservative bona fides.

It is downright embarrassing how well some people have learned and adopted the mentality and tactics of the left in general, and warmistas (but not only them) in particular, when it suits them, and yet are in all probability blind to what they are themselves doing.
Such is cognitive dissonance.

This is incredibly dangerous.
I for one am imagining the left winning the elections here in the US this fall because of this one single issue.
And all that could result from that…a actual calamity that can never be undone.
Anyone saying we need to even further politicize this issue and make the political Right the champions of HCQ, are being mind-bogglingly irrational.

Crispin in Waterloo
Reply to  Paul
July 28, 2020 10:53 am

A “nut” who saves lives – especially mine – is welcome into my world. You have no need of including that treatment set. She didn’t invent it, it was a doctor in NYC whose personal score is better than anyone else in that city.

For me the simple evaluation is this: If Fauci or CDC claims that no one should use HCQ because of side effect dangers, or only in a monitored setting inside a hospital, and I know full well that this medicine has been used for three generations outside hospitals with the full blessing of the medical establishment, then I know they are lying. I do not know why they are lying, but it is obvious they are, because they are contradicting well-established medical science and millions of successfully treated people, otherwise known as “evidence”.

This lady is pointing out what she found works. Same as in NYC (with one doctor) and Florida generally where (I hear) everyone gets HCQ. According the updates at MedCram (now with 100 updates on file – see them) Vitamin D3 and Ivermectin are also providing immense benefit.

Paul Penrose
Reply to  Paul
July 28, 2020 10:58 am

So we are supposed to believe an anonymous person who cites no evidence, but just throws out smears? I don’t think so.

Joe Camel
Reply to  Paul Penrose
July 28, 2020 2:38 pm

What about all the doctors standing in back of her who support her? Not one hit piece bothered to interview the many men and women doctors seen in the background. Bernie, Fauci, and Feely Joe have made some of the whakiest comments imaginable, but they are not roundly comdemned.

Henry Pool
Reply to  Joe Camel
July 28, 2020 4:43 pm

“Doctors in the background.” Sorry, wearing a white coat doesn’t make you a “doctor.”

John Simon Burnett
Reply to  Paul
July 28, 2020 11:03 am

If she’s right, how is she a nut? What does that mean?

Reply to  Paul
July 28, 2020 11:03 am

Define… “a nut”. And why would I disregard a nut who was right? Right is right, nut or otherwise.

Scissor
Reply to  Robert Kernodle
July 28, 2020 6:34 pm

Apparently, she also believes there are only two sexes, male and female.

Gene Selkov
Reply to  Robert Kernodle
July 29, 2020 12:25 am

It’s easy to be right about trivialities, especially if the purpose is to distract.

Right is right, but being partially right about some elements of the message doesn’t count for much.

This whole affair looks like an “anti” psy-op. The message they are putting out is that there is this terrible deadly virus and that there is a wonderful cure that bad people are hiding from us. While you are busy processing that dramatic message and reacting to it, you might forget to question the existence of the deadly virus, or its deadliness — which I presume was the purpose of this performance.

Besides the partial truthfulness of the message, another sign of it being controlled is that the governors did not shut it down until it had reached 20 million people. Cutting it at that point guaranteed that it would eventually reach 200 million.

In a similar case not long ago, people were fiercely debating whether Epstein was killed in jail or was suicided. No one cared to ask whether both hypotheses were false.

Nicholas McGinley
Reply to  Gene Selkov
July 29, 2020 1:15 pm

Gene,
I have been trying to figure out how to raise a possibility that has occurred to me that I have no idea how to evaluate as to likelihood or plausibility.
I had not considered the phrase psy-op, but this is the exact concept I had in mind.
I was wondering whether it is possible, perhaps likely, or just looking for an explanation of something that has no good explanation…if the reason this HCQ thing keeps popping up again and again, and keeps doing so in ways that seem contrived and almost hokey, but that a lot of people are seeming to latch onto as confirmation of many of their darkest suspicions?
How likely it is just random chance?
How likely is it that the only people who have claimed to have found anything like what this doctor in Texas is saying, are sketchy individual characters who nonetheless have the credentials to be called medical professionals?
No ER doctors or people working in or running large hospitals that have a treatment nightmare on their hands.
This miraculous result doe not show up anytime a clinical trial is conducted, and we now have results from many, with a whole lot more in the pipeline.
One hospital after another has discontinued using this drug and it’s various combinations, after treating large numbers of patients with it early in the outbreak.
One hospital system after another.
One whole state after another.
One whole country after another has stopped using it except in ongoing clinical trials, and even many of those have closed down the treatment arms that used it.
Tens of thousands of people at this point have been given the drug in scientifically contacted clinical trials. Not one single randomized trials of HCQ alone or in combination has found any benefit to the drug, and certainly nothing close to 100% efficacy with any treatment or combination of treatments that has looked at enough people to rise to statistical significance.
Not.
One.
And there are a lot of them, many of which have used this specific combination.
At least one very large one tested this combo in patients who were not hospitalized but treated on an outpatients basis, and took place in teh US and Canada in a wide geographic spread.

Decades of testing on a variety of viruses, including corona virus, have been found to show the drug ineffective. It only works on cells in a culture.

But even most critics of this drug all seem to miss the fact that the 2005 study was done using chloroquine, not HCQ, and did not use zinc, and did not use z pak.

The left are dirty tricksters, and they know that many on the right have for one reason or another latched onto this drug and will not let go no matter how much evidence accumulates that it is worthless for this purpose.

Chuck Wiese
Reply to  Gene Selkov
August 2, 2020 11:22 pm

Nicholas McGinley:

You are grossly in error about hydroxychloroquine. The drug has proven efficacy in treating Covid-19 and is precisely why these front line physicians have been using it for their patients and it is far more than “wild guessing” treatment options for Covid-19 that is causing these doctors to get onboard with its use.

The studies you reference are dead wrong, seriously flawed, because zinc sulphate was not used in conjunction with hydroxy nor was “Z-Pack” antibiotic to stop developing pneumonia from occurring which often happens as a second infection from the virus. Further, in many studies, hydroxy was only used in a late stage of progression of the disease in a hospital setting, where results will be less satisfactory.

The established treatment regimen is to use hydroxy and zinc sulphate at disease onset, NOT when you have advanced disease and need hospitalization. In these cases, success has been defined with >95% recovery.

To better educate yourself, below is a link to a Microbiologist who discusses five different ways hydroxychloroquine attacks and neuters viral production of Covid-19 in your body that significantly reduces viral loading and wards off a cytokine storm, which is the immune response that often leads to fatal destruction of the lungs and other organs.

There is no excuse for Dr. Fauci, the CDC or NIH to continue their ridiculous attacks on doctors and the use of this drug to treat Covid-19. The injection of politics into all of this to promote more expensive and less satisfactory drugs like remdisivir and incorrectly claiming more economic shutdowns and isolation is necessary causing irreparable economic damage to this country is fast becoming criminally negligent.

This is especially so when state medical boards are stepping between a physician and patient and harassing and threatening physicians who want this treatment for their patients, and in some states, governors have actually developed the audacity to order pharmacy’s not to dispense hydroxychloroquine to a patient even with a prescription order from a practicing physician. This is outrageous!

As these physicians have warned, many more will needlessly die if this political crap doesn’t stop, which is being aimed squarely at hurting President Trump. Dr. Fauci is right square in the middle of it all, as he promoted the use of hydroxychloroquine to treat SARS1-Covid in 2003, which is in the same family of viruses that SARS2-Covid-19 is in. That is a damning contradiction that Fauci has not explained.

https://www.prageru.com/video/10-minutes-of-science-how-does-hydroxychloroquine-treat-covid-19/

Reply to  Chuck Wiese
August 3, 2020 12:24 am

Chuck,

Awesome video.
10 minutes of genius education.
I too like mechanism 5 (check it out).

Here is the portfolio of Dr Mobeen Syed:
https://www.drbeen.com/team/
https://members.drbeen.com/browse

Nicholas McGinley
Reply to  Gene Selkov
August 3, 2020 9:17 am

Chuck,
There are few laypeople who have more knowledge than I do, of every aspect of this entire saga.
You link to a video from a microbiologist.
Is a microbiologist a doctor?
And you scoff at the notion of a state medical board having authority for treatment protocols in a public health emergency.

Should we just “educate ourselves” via you tube videos and ignore what thousands of doctors, entire hospital systems, and the vast majority of health care professionals have found to be the case, all over the world?
Amazing how you can curtly dismiss with some trite and shallow criticisms, a long list of scientifically conducted clinical trials, but point to a video from a person who is not even a health care professional as if it was some sort of over riding proof of anything…anything except one persons uninformed opinion.
Medical science uses evidence to decide such matters, not speculative and imagined “mechanisms”, which once enunciated, are taken to be the gospel truth, evidence to the contrary be damned.
Pharmaceutical and biotech companies test thousands of new drugs every year, and every one has a strong rationale for theoretical efficacy…all have a well described mechanism.
Then they are tested in cell cultures, then in animals if the seem to work in vitro.
Only after careful evaluation in animal models are any of them given to human volunteers.
After several phases of testing, they are given to large numbers of people to see if they actually work, and if they are safe.
About one in 5000 ever gets approved after being found to be both safe and effective.

All 5000 have a “mechanism”/
So what?
Clinical trials are what actually happens when actual sick people were given the drugs.
Very few drugs have ever been given to so many sick people by so many doctors with no proof they would work. Maybe none.
But hey, a microbiologist with a video!

Tom in Florida
Reply to  Paul
July 28, 2020 11:08 am

It doesn’t matter if she is right or wrong? Perhaps it is you who should be embarrassed for posting such a statement on this site.

Bill in Florida
Reply to  Tom in Florida
July 28, 2020 2:32 pm

Google this lady and she what else she believes and preaches. “Demon sperm”. She is a nut. The good thing is all the believers here can go to her clinic in Houston and be treated. Good luck!

Robert W. Turner
Reply to  Bill in Florida
July 28, 2020 2:49 pm

And you just stick with your $2,500 per dose drug that has never once cured anything it was promoted to cure. Good luck with that

Henry Pool
Reply to  Bill in Florida
July 28, 2020 4:49 pm

Turner, dexamethasone does not cost $2500 per dose.

John Endicott
Reply to  Bill in Florida
July 29, 2020 1:53 am

Remdesivir does

Nicholas McGinley
Reply to  Bill in Florida
July 29, 2020 6:03 am

So the rationale for choosing a treatment is now to ignore evidence of efficacy and choose based on what drug has the best low low price?
Governments are subsidizing treatment, clinical trials are free, and everyone is supposed to have insurance.
For me, “it works” trumps “it’s dirt cheap” when it comes to treating a potentially fatal disease.
The only times cheaper is better is when two options are known to be medically equivalent.

niceguy
Reply to  Bill in Florida
July 29, 2020 12:47 pm

Well, maybe nutty “Demon sperm” doctor(*) makes more sense than superstars like “Doctor” Fauci and “David Gorski, MD, PhD”(**)…

(*) yet she seems to be a real registered MD not a witch “doctor”
(**) “Surgeon, scientist, skeptic promoting science and exposing quackery, and editor of Science-Based Medicine.” according to his Twitter bio

Nicholas McGinley
Reply to  Bill in Florida
July 29, 2020 1:20 pm
2hotel9
Reply to  Nicholas McGinley
July 29, 2020 5:37 pm

You really are desperate. How much money you loosing on this remdesivir crap, buddy?

John Endicott
Reply to  Bill in Florida
July 30, 2020 2:30 am

So the rationale for choosing a treatment is now to ignore evidence of efficacy and choose based on what drug has the best low low price?

These doctors (it’s not just this one doctor whose religious/cultural beliefs you don’t share but are willing to attack as a substitute for actually looking into her claims) are telling you that they’ve seen the lower price drug is effective and you are choosing to ignore that because the bad orange man said nice things about their choice of treatment. By all means choose the more pricy drug because the orange man likes the cheaper one and so does one doctor whose religious/cultural beliefs sound bizarre to you. Just don’t expect everyone else to follow your unscientific lead.

Nicholas McGinley
Reply to  Bill in Florida
July 30, 2020 7:13 am

I am not ignoring it. I am discussing it.
The only people ignoring anything are all the ones who refuse to look at the total weight of the evidence.
To you, this one person who is a proven liar by her own words and videos and FB page, outweighs all of the medical community around the world who have tried this drug, and moved on when it was found not to work.
Many thousands of people in many clinical trials conducted by doctors and using rigorous protocols to treat and keep track of patients.
Not one word in any of those trials needs to be taken on faith or trust.

I am not at all desperate, and why would I be?
I would be as happy as anyone if that drug or combo had proven to be a magic bullet against this virus.
It is all of the HCQ faithful who have no explanation for why it should work on this virus and this one alone, and only when it is given by people who offer no documentation.

niceguy
Reply to  Bill in Florida
July 30, 2020 4:54 pm

“many clinical trials conducted by doctors and using rigorous protocols to treat and keep track of patients”

Like those trials in Brasil first and UK recently designed to overdose patients, that is, a conspiracy to commit murder directly and indirectly, with which the whole Medical Establishment is complicit by its silence?

Or the trials where patients did not all had confirmed Kung Flu?

You really are desperate.

Nicholas McGinley
Reply to  Bill in Florida
August 2, 2020 7:30 am

No, I think desperation is attacking someone with ad hominem remarks instead of sticking to the issues at hand.
She plainly said she thinks no one needs to wear a mask.
Her own actions prove she does not really think that.
She claims she and her staff only ever use surgical masks, but in the Facebook video I just posted a link to, she is covered head to toe in a full body suit, rubber gloves, goggles, and an N95 surgical respirator.
She warns anyone coming to her clinic to avoid all contact with anyone not in their immediate household, and to be sure to wear a face covering before they enter her office.
As recently as April (and I think I saw one in which she was still saying that much more recently) she was an outspoken advocate of everyone wearing a mask.
These are points of factual variance of her past actions with her recent statement.

In this statement, she says that anyone who speaks of double blind clinical trials is a Nazi.
But the scientific standards we have developed for how to evaluate new drugs is exactly why we have effective and safe treatments for anything.
She states that doctors that speak of having evidence for the efficacy of the drugs they prescribe are not real doctors, and she says that she is a real doctor, implicitly saying this is because she requires no such proof of efficacy or standard of evidence.
Without objective standards, everyone would be at risk anytime they took any medicine for any condition…because all we would have is someone’s belief that the drugs is either safe OR effective.
In short, we would not have in place the system that has allowed life expectancies to grow ever longer, and for people to be on average far healthier than even in the time of our parents’ generation.

Reply to  Paul
July 28, 2020 11:14 am

She seems to have a good reputation among patients, but relative to her bizarre beliefs that seem to be related to her religious bias, why would that discredit her as a physician? We have many health professionals who think that de-funding the police is a good idea, that systemic, hate based racism against any identity group other than white male Presidents exists, that open borders are a good idea, that CO2 is destroying the planet, and so on and so forth, all justified by their political bias alone. Why is this any better?

Reply to  co2isnotevil
July 28, 2020 3:09 pm

Yes, she is also an evangelical preacher, and that makes her an easy target for cancellation, though not as easy as if the spokesman were a white male like Harvey Risch. Her speech is an emotional rant, with almost Greta-like intensity, but based on clinical caregiving. Here is a post with a transcript of the main points, along with reports of HCQ saving lives elsewhere in Africa.
https://rclutz.wordpress.com/2020/07/28/hcq-works-she-knows-and-wont-shut-up/

niceguy
Reply to  co2isnotevil
July 30, 2020 4:58 pm

Not as bizarre as promoting Recovery, the UK trial as an example of good science and something UK should be proud of, when it’s a conspiracy to k*ll paid for by Bill and Melinda Gates’s GAVI (the crazy vaccines promoters).

The whole world is bizarre.

Nicholas McGinley
Reply to  niceguy
August 3, 2020 9:30 am

Golly, son…it must suck to be you.
No such thing as doctors helping people…it is all conspiracies to kill people?

Joel Snider
Reply to  Paul
July 28, 2020 11:39 am

Gee, Dr. Fauci’s been wrong on major issues – the ‘experts’ seem to have done everything they can to worsen and prolong the effects of Covid – the least effective and most economically damaging policies possible.

But of course, HE’S not a nut.

Aristotle was big into Revelations, Einstein believed in God – I’m sure most modern progressives would reject them out of hand.

2hotel9
Reply to  Joel Snider
July 28, 2020 12:01 pm

Almost as if it were a concerted, well planned effort to do exactly what it has done.

Joel Snider
Reply to  2hotel9
July 28, 2020 12:17 pm

And during this particular election season, I don’t believe coincidence.

2hotel9
Reply to  Joel Snider
July 29, 2020 7:48 am

Once is happenstance, twice is operator error, 3rd time is enemy action.

Robert W. Turner
Reply to  Joel Snider
July 28, 2020 2:54 pm

We should be marching on Atlanta and the CDC to demand an investigation.

Joel Snider
Reply to  Robert W. Turner
July 28, 2020 3:13 pm

I would love it if someone besides progressive radicals started marching.

Reply to  Paul
July 28, 2020 11:40 am

There seems to be a huge effort to destroy her, and that makes me suspicious. What’s embarrassing is accepting this massive reputation-destruction effort at face value. On a side note, I’m going to start referring to Facebook as “Fakebook”, and Twitter as simply “Twit”.

Reply to  Robert Kernodle
July 28, 2020 4:16 pm

How about “In-Your-Facebook” since it has become an anti-social media platform.

Timo, Not That One
Reply to  Ron Clutz
July 30, 2020 6:35 am

Ron Clutz- How about combining Facebook and Twitter with Youtube.
“YouTwitFace”

Nicholas McGinley
Reply to  Robert Kernodle
July 29, 2020 6:07 am

Probably doing her a favor.
Medical malpractice lawsuit get expensive.
At This point she is ignoring best practice and established standard of care treatement.
That is malpractice in the world of medicine.
Making false claims about cures is illegal for several reasons and many statutes support preventing people from saying anything they want about medical efficacy.

Catcracking
Reply to  Nicholas McGinley
July 30, 2020 6:18 am

It appears that many have never watched the entire presentation as I have including the second indoor session where many other Drs and scientists gave other presentations including one complicated scientific describing how the combination works, you need all three.
You need to spend 3 or more hours otherwise you are ignorant and uninformed as demonstrated by only making comments on one Doctor. Did you listen to all the presentations?

Another point, they only claim good results when administered early not when patients are in advanced stages like the VA and CDC feeble attempts. Numerous other doctors have reported good results with early treatment
The Drs involved are all front line treating patients day in and day out that are upset that bureaucrats are preventing them from using what they have found to work only if used early because they are saving lives
Part of the concern is the lies and distortions claiming side reactions that are totally false for a medication widely used for over 65 years without problems.
They fail to mention that this was widely given to our troops in Vietnam to avoid Malaria.
Why would they lie about side effects?

B McCune
Reply to  Nicholas McGinley
July 30, 2020 8:02 am

@ Nicolas. Lots of opinion here and an attempt to shoot the messenger. One more fact is that of over 60,000 Italian folks with RA that that regularly take HCQ for that condition, none of them died from Wuhan during the pandemic and only 20 of them were positive to Wuhan. Don’t believe any of the studies and don’t even believe this “anecdotal” evidence but all others but “Nicolas” should once they acquire this virus check with your doctor on any viable treatments. Ignoring an early treatment for some especially older folks is a death sentence. Once a cytokine storm occurs things really get difficult. And the likelihood of side effects other than diarrhea and upset stomach from the French protocol are small. Chloroquine has been around for decades and Hydroxychloroquine is the preferred drug for this and has also been used by large numbers of people for a long time. My doctor knows my medical history and is quite willing to prescribe this protocol. He treats his RA patients with this drug and knows quite well what the effects might be.

Nicholas McGinley
Reply to  Nicholas McGinley
August 2, 2020 3:56 am

“One more fact is that of over 60,000 Italian folks with RA that that regularly take HCQ for that condition, none of them died from Wuhan during the pandemic and only 20 of them were positive to Wuhan.”

This is false.
Assertions are not evidence, and this assertion, moreover, has been shown to be a complete fabrication.
There is a registry of people with rheumatoid diseases, and includes a large number of patients, some of whom were and some of whom were not taking HCQ prior to the outbreak.
A careful study has documented the disease progression in these patients, and found no benefit to having taken the malaria drug.

Here is the link to a registry of 600 patients with rheumatic disease who are infected.
45% wound up hospitalized, so far, and 9% are dead…so far.
There was no protective effect from being on HCQ when they got sick.
There were two groups that had a protective effect…those taking biologics, as they are called.

Anti-TNF drugs worked the best, they were protected, but only partially.
People taking anti-IL-6 drugs were also protected, but not as much.
https://ard.bmj.com/content/annrheumdis/79/7/859.full.pdf

Sally Nicholl
Reply to  Paul
July 28, 2020 11:50 am

Well of course it matters if she is right !! Don’t attack her personality. If she is correct, this is a life saving game changer. We need the patients she has cured, to speak up.

Robert W. Turner
Reply to  Sally Nicholl
July 28, 2020 3:09 pm

This is no secret, many doctors around the world are using this treatment. It’s western governments that are propagandizing a drug safely used for 50 years and rushing out now retracted studies about how it’s dangerous. One doctor in the UK even confused it with another drug and poisoned people with a misdose and then proceeded to get THAT paper published about how it was dangerous.

But in the post truth world there are no repercussions for being on the side of the truth over fact gang.

Dorothy Harrison
Reply to  Paul
July 28, 2020 12:46 pm

Agree

Joel Snider
Reply to  Paul
July 28, 2020 2:09 pm

Actually it matters a LOT whether she’s right.

Beliefs on other subjects make no difference.

William Astley
Reply to  Paul
July 28, 2020 2:37 pm

‘Paul’,
Are you calling this doctor a Liar? This is not a joke.

This Doctor is stood on the Congressional steps and stated that it is afact that people are dying in the US ….

Because the HCQ cocktail works and people are scared to use it or doctors cannot even use it because it is not available in their state or country because of Left Wing Lie or the Democratic Governor in their has told the doctors ….

Any doctor who uses the HCQ cocktail risks losing their license to practice medicine.

The lady Doctor who is standing on the Congressional steps, and has stated it is a clinical medical fact that the HCQ cocktail is both effective as a prophylactic and is effective to treat high risk covid patients.

She and her staff treated 350 high risk covid patients who were diabetic, obese, ashamatic, and so on and used the HCQ as a prophylactic to protect her staff.

Do you have a single fact, evidence, that supports you accusation? Do you?

If you do not then you are a liar. There can only be one liar.

Please immediately provide proof for you accusation.

It is a fact that are there Peer reviewed results, of a US test of the HCQ cocktail, with 2541 patients, in six Michigan hospitals..

The Michigan peer reviewed study supports what must logically be true. Medical science is logical and repeatable. The HCQ cocktail worked.

HCQ with azithromycin reduced deaths by 71% compared to no treatment.

The Michigan results could have been much better, as they waited no less than 48 hours before starting the HCQ cocktail treatment.

2500 patients treated with the HCQ cocktail no heart attacks. 6 Michigan hospitals.

https://www.ijidonline.com/article/S1201-9712(20)30534-8/fulltext

Treatment with Hydroxychloroquine, Azithromycin, and Combination in Patients Hospitalized with COVID-19

Results
Of 2,541 patients, with a median total hospitalization time of 6 days (IQR: 4-10 days), median age was 64 years (IQR:53-76 years), 51% male, 56% African American, with median time to follow-up of 28.5 days (IQR:3-53).

Lancet study which alleged HCQ is not effective against covid and kills people which CNN quoted on and on and on, was been removed.

The data base the Lancet ‘study’ was ‘based’ on is not accessible. Fake data is worse than a ‘mistake’ analyzing real data.

There should be a criminal investigation of both Lancet and the issues of the ‘Fake’ HCQ paper.

Bernie McCune
Reply to  William Astley
July 28, 2020 4:24 pm

Look up Dr. Didier Raoult who also did an careful patient study using HCQ with very good results. Unless Youtube has removed his interview as well. Numerous US Doctors have used this treatment. It is a safe proven treatment for rheumatoid arthritis and lupus so it is not like it cannot be used very widely and safely. Talk to your doctor about it of course, but don’t let Dr. Fauci and the FDA stop an honest look at this “proven” (at least by a standard of success) drug.

Bernie McCune
Reply to  William Astley
July 28, 2020 4:32 pm

Look up Dr. Didier Raoult who did a study with about 1500 patients with Wuhan. If he is still up on the web. Numerous US Dr.s have used the HCQ protocol successfully. Since HCQ is a well known and safely used drug for rheumatoid arthritis and lupus your Dr. can safely prescribe it for about anything. This lady Dr. successfully used it on 350 patients. In a crisis my only criteria is safety and success. This is it IMO.

Nicholas McGinley
Reply to  Bernie McCune
July 29, 2020 7:52 am

Here is a new peer review of the original paper that started all of this.
It is about the most complete repudiation I have ever seen in my life:
The conclusion about Raoult’s original study?
“Conclusion
This is a non-informative manuscript with gross methodological shortcomings. The results do not justify the far-reaching conclusions about the efficacy of hydroxychloroquine in Covid-19, and in the view of this reviewer do not justify any conclusion at all.”

https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0924857920302338#!

Paul
Reply to  William Astley
July 30, 2020 8:26 am

Thank you.
The Lancet and New England Journal rushed to publish that totally fake so-called study because it appeared to be a rebuke to Trump.The study was entirely bogus and fictional data presented by non-medical charlatans.
That is bad enough but the fact that these 2 so-called prestigious journals published the paper is even more scandalous and severely dented the reputation of those journals.They abused the basic principles of medical science in an egregious way.
There are ongoing studies into HCQ around the world.The jury is still out on its efficacy but it is a very safe drug compared to the vast numbers of other drugs in common use.

Bob boder
Reply to  Paul
July 28, 2020 3:06 pm

Her beliefs are cultural, there for you are attacking her culture for your own political purposes. Your attacks are racist and unacceptable, you can’t stand a women of color having a powerful message.

Mindi Eden
Reply to  Paul
July 28, 2020 5:58 pm

Totally agree! She is BATSHIT crazy! Here is some things she believes: “s
She claims that certain medical issues like endometriosis, cysts, infertility and impotence are the result of sex with “spirit husbands” and “spirit wives,” which Immanuel described as having sex in dreams with witches and demons.

“We call them all kinds of names —endometriosis, we call them molar pregnancies, we call them fibroids, we call them cysts, but most of them are evil deposits from the spirit husband,” she said.

William Astley
Reply to  Mindi Eden
July 28, 2020 7:16 pm

Sorry this is junk comment. No link. Just make up hate.

The HCQ cocktail works. See Michigan study. Please get back to us.

HCQ with azithromycin reduced deaths by 71% compared to no treatment.

The Michigan results could have been much better, as they waited no less than 48 hours before starting the HCQ cocktail treatment.

2541 patients treated with the HCQ cocktail no heart attacks. 6 Michigan hospitals.

https://www.ijidonline.com/article/S1201-9712(20)30534-8/fulltext

Treatment with Hydroxychloroquine, Azithromycin, and Combination in Patients Hospitalized with COVID-19

Nicholas McGinley
Reply to  William Astley
July 29, 2020 6:10 am

How is it hate to pass along quotes from her, and to call crazy what it is?
You pass along plenty of your opinions while disparaging others who disagree.

That crap that was quoted is crazy talk.

Editor
Reply to  Paul
July 28, 2020 7:13 pm

Paul – Provide evidence!! Anyone can just say “she’s a nut” and it can be any level of baloney they choose. Provide evidence!! Without it, your statement is just a vile ad hominem. Now I don’t know the lady, but her statement deserves legitimate discussion no matter what, and the simple fact is that what she says has already been supported from a number of other sources (eg. https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/2020.05.02.20080036v1, https://docs.google.com/document/d/1SesxgaPnpT6OfCYuaFSwXzDK4cDKMbivoALprcVFj48/mobilebasic). So your evidence had better be good. And BTW, don’t bother telling me that these people are nuts too, just argue the case.

Steven
Reply to  Paul
July 28, 2020 8:01 pm

True, but if she says what people want to hear, that’s good enough…I did read some of her other medical opinions…how some “diseases” are causes by evil spirits…Part Physician, part faith healer and part witch doctor…

Charles Ellison
Reply to  Paul
July 29, 2020 3:45 pm

What a crappy attitude you have. Some one presents a solution and you want to bad mouth them. That’s typical democratic way of handling something they have no negative facts they attack the person. Call her names and attack her character but what she said was right on. 500 we’re saved in Albany Ga. more would have been saved if they had more HCQ. There were 2034 affected. If fraudci hadn’t caused the non-use with his lies.
Dr. Rault of France saved 1061 before Europe shut it down.

Joel Snider
Reply to  Gibby
July 28, 2020 10:36 am

And the press is already running hit pieces on her.

Trumplethinskin
Reply to  Gibby
July 28, 2020 11:38 am

In that video Dr. Stella Immanuel touts treating COVID with hydroxychloroquine. We should also know she claims that endometriosis, impotence, and infertility are the result of having sex with “spirit husbands” or “spirit wives.” We should be skeptical of any of her medical claims.

Jo
Reply to  Trumplethinskin
July 28, 2020 2:41 pm

What about all the doctors standing in back of her who support her? Not one hit piece bothered to interview the many men and women doctors seen in the background. Bernie, Fauci, and Feely Joe have made some of the whackiest comments imaginable, but they are not roundly comdemned.

Joel Snider
Reply to  Jo
July 28, 2020 3:28 pm

That’s because the condemners are the ones controlling the narrative, and THOSE nuts are the ones supporting it.

M Seward
Reply to  Jo
July 29, 2020 12:06 am

What about all the ‘scientists’ whi stand with Michael Mann and co? Does that make Mann anything but the craven piece of work/nutjob catasrophist that many think he is?

A proposition using the uncertainty principle as a metaphor where instead of postion and truth being the uncertainty related parameters it is truth and broadcast quantity. i.e. if so called ‘social media’ can broadcast some Tweet, video or still picture to millions and millions, even billions, in minutes or hours then it is almost impossible for a community to form an accurate assessment of the truth or otherwise of the content. In reality such a mechanism is the perfect vector for ‘fake news’ whichever way it may be slanted. Do not kid yourself that fake news is a phenomenon confined to the left.

AllanK
Reply to  Trumplethinskin
July 29, 2020 3:31 am

Yes, be skeptical. But also don’t fall for this modern day practice whereby if you find someone’s statement as disagreeable, then troll through their social media statements and find something else and use it out of context to attack the person and not the argument.
1. She’s a licensed doctor so she’s not stupid.
2. Hydroxychloroquine is $1.50/dose roughly and has side effects no worse than many OTC drugs.
3. Hydroxychloroquine treatment has enough evidence to indicate that it’s beneficial especially in the early stages of CoVid-19 infection.
4. Currently, even if an infected patient is treated with Hydroxychloroquine, they have to get the symptoms, get tested, get an appointment with a doctor and get a prescription. This takes days and can negate the effects of Hydroxychloroquine on the early stages of infection.
5. If the drug was available OTC, it’s side effects are less severe than other OTC medications like Paracetamol and Aspirin, what harm is there if it doesn’t work as well as anticipated? A person is out of pocket $30. On the upside, early treatment saves lives.
$2500/treatment with Remdesivir and the potential billions to be made from a possible vaccine buy a lot of influence, media persuasion and PR compared to an easily available drug costing $1.50 per dose.

Poems of Our Climate
Reply to  AllanK
July 29, 2020 10:30 am

Price of hydrocloraquin is
30 cents a dose. I use GoodRX, app has best price.

Richard G.
Reply to  Poems of Our Climate
July 31, 2020 1:11 am

Price in India 3 Rupee (= $0.04US) per 200 mg tablet.

Alex
Reply to  Gibby
July 29, 2020 2:29 am

Absolutely cheap HCQ promotion.
Who are these Charlatans in white?
Just step out on an empty street in front of a few passants and play a “Press Conference”
LMAO

https://www.bbc.com/pidgin/tori-53574144

Norman Baillie
Reply to  Gibby
July 30, 2020 10:17 am

Also on OAN as of 7.30.20 am
https://www.oann.com/hydroxychloroquine/

Steve
July 28, 2020 6:05 am

Still available at Breibart https://www.breitbart.com

VicV
Reply to  Steve
July 28, 2020 6:38 am

That video is not of the conference.

BertK
July 28, 2020 6:08 am

“Here is a version of the complete news conference still on YouTube as of this moment. I’ve cued it to Dr Immanuel’s speaking.”

Well that didn’t last long, clicked on the play button 1 minute after the posting on WUWT and it was pulled already.

Tom Abbott
Reply to  BertK
July 28, 2020 7:23 am

Youtube and Facebook must have people there who are primed to jump on anything concerning the Wuhan virus. An alarm must go off in their office at any mention of the Chinese viirus.

In another office, sirens go off at the mention of Human-caused climate change.

They don’t want to waste any time in their censorship.

The arrogance of these people!

Mr.
Reply to  Tom Abbott
July 28, 2020 10:41 am

YouTube and Twitter tell us that “fake news” is real.
But I can’t see it.
(yuk, yuk)

My observation fits perfectly with my contention that YT, Twitter etc are avid adherents to the principles of that ancient Chinese philosopher –
Confuse-us

badEnglish
Reply to  BertK
July 28, 2020 10:33 am

BertK,
FYI, it’s 10:28 am, Pacific, in my location and I was just able to see the entire segment cued up for viewing. Hope you are able to link to it elsewhere; the good doctor’s passion also makes this worth viewing. I especially love her reference to ‘if this is the hill I die on, so be it’ (paraphrased from my less than perfect memory.)

badEnglish

Jean Parisot
July 28, 2020 6:10 am

Gone, has anyone posted it to video or liveleak?

John Hardy
July 28, 2020 6:12 am

Pulled already.

Never expected to live to see the day that the US was controlled by Thought Police.

Tom Abbott
Reply to  John Hardy
July 28, 2020 7:28 am

Policing Thought is the main preoccupation of the Left. They have to police the thought, otherwise their political ideology could not survive the Light of Truth.

The Left is just one Big Lie. To succeed, they have to fool people into believing in False Realities and the way to do that is to control Thought by attacking anyone who does not adhere to their radical ideology..

Adrian Mann
Reply to  Tom Abbott
July 28, 2020 1:59 pm

“Policing Thought is the main preoccupation of the Right. They have to police the thought, otherwise their political ideology could not survive the Light of Truth.

The Right is just one Big Lie. To succeed, they have to fool people into believing in False Realities and the way to do that is to control Thought by attacking anyone who does not adhere to their radical ideology.”

“The broad masses of population are more amenable to the appeal of rhetoric than to any other force.”
“Make the lie big, make it simple, keep saying it and eventually they’ll believe.”
“All propaganda has to be popular and has to accommodate itself to the comprehension of the least intelligent of those whom it seeks to reach.”

Joe Camel
Reply to  Adrian Mann
July 28, 2020 2:49 pm

“Policing Thought is the main preoccupation of the Right. They have to police the thought, otherwise their political ideology could not survive the Light of Truth. –Adolph Hitler: Socialist

“The broad masses of population are more amenable to the appeal of rhetoric than to any other force.” –Adolph Hitler: Socialist

“Make the lie big, make it simple, keep saying it and eventually they’ll believe.” –Joseph Goebbels: Socialist

“All propaganda has to be popular and has to accommodate itself to the comprehension of the least intelligent of those whom it seeks to reach.” –Adolph Hitler: Socialist

Joe Camel
Reply to  Adrian Mann
July 28, 2020 2:59 pm

“The broad masses of population are more amenable to the appeal of rhetoric than to any other force.” -Adolph Hitler, Socialist
“Make the lie big, make it simple, keep saying it and eventually they’ll believe.”-Adolph Hitler, Socialist
“All propaganda has to be popular and has to accommodate itself to the comprehension of the least intelligent of those whom it seeks to reach.” -Joseph Goebbels, Socialist

Jack Dale
Reply to  Joe Camel
July 28, 2020 3:04 pm

You epitomize your own posts.

https://www.britannica.com/story/were-the-nazis-socialists

I will bet you think that Democratic Republic of Korea is both a democracy and a republic.

Joel Snider
Reply to  Joe Camel
July 28, 2020 4:03 pm

I’ll bet you think the democrat party is democratic.

Joel Snider
Reply to  Joe Camel
July 28, 2020 4:08 pm

At least the Devil’s second-greatest trick was convincing the world HItler was right-wing – but academia helped a LOT.

Jack Dale
Reply to  Joel Snider
July 28, 2020 4:24 pm

The first ones sent to the camps were socialists.

First they came for the socialists, and I did not speak out—because I was not a socialist.

Then they came for the trade unionists, and I did not speak out— because I was not a trade unionist.

Then they came for the Jews, and I did not speak out—because I was not a Jew.

Then they came for me—and there was no one left to speak for me.

Martin Niemöller

Joel Snider
Reply to  Joe Camel
July 28, 2020 5:11 pm

No – they came for potential rivals once they acquired power.

Krudd Gillard of the Commondebt of Australia
Reply to  Joe Camel
July 28, 2020 5:12 pm

Jack, that was the Internationalist Socialists that the Nationalist Socialists came for first.

🙂

Jack Dale
Reply to  Krudd Gillard of the Commondebt of Australia
July 28, 2020 6:53 pm

Does your head hurt when you do that Linda Blair imitation?

Joel Snider
Reply to  Joe Camel
July 28, 2020 5:14 pm

I wonder how many political rivals Xi Jinping has left?

Joel Snider
Reply to  Joe Camel
July 28, 2020 5:21 pm

And by the way – your Martin Niemöller quote is exactly the procedure the progressive/socialist left is following to a ‘t’.

Jack Dale
Reply to  Joel Snider
July 28, 2020 6:47 pm

Nice narrative.

BTW – You would have problems getting your Grade 12 diploma in Canada.

comment image

Joel Snider
Reply to  Joe Camel
July 28, 2020 5:37 pm

And since apparently everyone needs links to something these days:

https://mises.org/library/why-nazism-was-socialism-and-why-socialism-totalitarian

Bob boder
Reply to  Joe Camel
July 29, 2020 5:38 am

Socialist/progressive were the eugenics party. Margret Sanger was trying to eliminate black people, Woodrow Willson too. Until about 3 years ago both were still Hero’s of the progressive movement. Many of Hilters ideas about the races and eugenics came from the American left and weirdly also from Native American beleifs.

The American right believed in limited government and individual liberty. To claim Hilter has any connections To those beleif’s is ridiculous. Hilter’s economic ideals were much more aligned with ObAma’s, mega corporations controlled by elites that report to the dear leader, who makes sure they stay on top nice and rich and comfortable. Why do you think all the big elites pour money into the Democratic Party?
By the by the Nazi’s were also huge environmentalist, why do you think that was?
Nazi’s were all about control, as are socialist.
In a free market you can band together with a bunch of like minded people and have a mini socialist society, but in a socialist society you can not have a free market. Yet socialist can not stand for anyone to not live their way, why. Because they are frauds they are about power and only power. Everything is bent on maintaining that power. Nazi’s, communist’s, socialist’s and progressives all the same. You don’t matter, your free will doesn’t matter, the only thing that matters is their power and status.

Nicholas McGinley
Reply to  Joe Camel
July 29, 2020 6:24 am

It is illegal to make false claims about a drug or treatment.
Anyone with a belief cannot just get in front of a camera and say anything they want because they believe it.
She is claiming a cure.
That is not backed up by evidence.
If we allowed that sort of thing, anyone could make videos claiming ground up rhino horn or the toenails of virgin girls will cure cancer.
One cannot make such claim willy nilly.
People that do so are shut down every day.

Nicholas McGinley
Reply to  Joe Camel
July 29, 2020 6:56 am

The evidence from clinical trials is overwhelming.
HCQ does not help at any stage of infection, or as a prophylactic drug.

https://medcitynews.com/2020/07/hydroxychloroquine-flunks-phase-iii-trial-in-mild-to-moderate-covid-19/

https://www.recoverytrial.net/news/low-cost-dexamethasone-reduces-death-by-up-to-one-third-in-hospitalised-patients-with-severe-respiratory-complications-of-covid-19

At this point there is a long and growing list of clinical trial data showing complete lack of efficacy.
Many results show it is harmful.

There are trials which used the z pak antibiotic and HCQ.
https://www.nejm.org/medical-articles/original-article

https://relief.unboundmedicine.com/relief/view/Coronavirus-Guidelines/2355000/all/Coronavirus_Disease_2019__COVID_19_

No efficacy.
There are ones using zinc and HCQ. Also vitamin C and HCQ…and zinc.
In patients with mild disease, who were not in a hospital setting:

https://www.acpjournals.org/doi/10.7326/M20-4207

No efficacy

For post exposure prophylaxis:

https://rheumnow.com/news/hydroxychloroquine-fails-postexposure-prophylaxis-covid-19
No efficacy.

There are many many studies with results published now…more every day for the past few weeks

If being hard headed would cure viral illnesses, we would have this one licked.

Mary
July 28, 2020 6:14 am

Transcript from rev.com
https://www.rev.com/blog/transcripts/americas-frontline-doctors-scotus-press-conference-transcript

Partial transcript from press conference – Dr. Stella –
Dr. Stella Immanuel: (05:27)
Hello, I’m Dr. Stella Immanuel. I’m a primary care physician in Houston, Texas. I actually went to medical school in West Africa, Nigeria, where I took care of malaria patients, treated them with hydroxychloroquine and stuff like that. So I’m actually used to these medications. I’m here because I have personally treated over 350 patients with COVID. Patients that have diabetes, patients that have high blood pressure, patients that have asthma, old people … I think my oldest patient is 92 … 87 year olds. And the result has been the same. I put them on hydroxychloroquine, I put them on zinc, I put them on Zithromax, and they’re all well.
Dr. Stella Immanuel: (06:12)
For the past few months, after taking care of over 350 patients, we’ve not lost one. Not a diabetic, not a somebody with high blood pressure, not somebody who asthma, not an old person. We’ve not lost one patient. And on top of that, I’ve put myself, my staff, and many doctors that I know on hydroxychloroquine for prevention, because by the very mechanism of action, it works early and as a prophylaxis. We see patients, 10 to 15 COVID patients, everyday. We give them breathing treatments. We only wear surgical mask. None of us has gotten sick. It works.
Dr. Stella Immanuel: (06:46)
So right now, I came here to Washington DC to say, America, nobody needs to die. The study that made me start using hydroxychloroquine was a study that they did under the NIH in 2005 that say it works. Recently, I was doing some research about a patient that had hiccups and I found out that they even did a recent study in the NIH, which is our National Institute … that is the National … NIH, what? National Institute of Health. They actually had a study and go look it up. Type hiccups and COVID, you will see it. They treated a patient that had hiccups with hydroxychloroquine and it proved that hiccups is a symptom of COVID. So if the NIH knows that treating the patient would hydroxychloroquine proves that hiccup is a symptom of COVID, then they definitely know the hydroxychloroquine works.
Dr. Stella Immanuel: (07:42)
I’m upset. Why I’m upset is that I see people that cannot breathe. I see parents walk in, I see diabetic sit in my office knowing that this is a death sentence and they can’t breathe. And I hug them and I tell them, “It’s going to be okay. You’re going to live.” And we treat them and they leave. None has died. So if some fake science, some person sponsored by all these fake pharma companies comes out say, “We’ve done studies and they found out that it doesn’t work.” I can tell you categorically it’s fixed science. I want to know who is sponsoring that study. I want to know who is behind it because there is no way I can treat 350 patients and counting and nobody is dead and they all did better.
Dr. Stella Immanuel: (08:21)
I know you’re going to tell me that you treated 20 people, 40 people, and it didn’t work. I’m a true testimony. So I came here to Washington DC to tell America nobody needs to get sick. This virus has a cure. It is called hydroxychloroquine, zinc, and Zithromax. I know you people want to talk about a mask. Hello? You don’t need mask. There is a cure. I know they don’t want to open schools. No, you don’t need people to be locked down. There is prevention and there is a cure.
Dr. Stella Immanuel: (08:48)
And let me tell you something, all you fake doctors out there that tell me, “Yeah. I want a double blinded study.” I just tell you, quit sounding like a computer, double blinded, double blinded. I don’t know whether your chips are malfunctioning, but I’m a real doctor. I have radiologists, we have plastic surgeons, we have neurosurgeons, like Sanjay Gupta saying, “Yeah, it doesn’t work and it causes heart disease.” Let me ask you Dr. Sanjay Gupta. Hear me. Have you ever seen a COVID patient? Have you ever treated anybody with hydroxychloroquine and they died from heart disease? When you do, come and talk to me because I sit down in my clinic every day and I see these patients walk in everyday scared to death. I see people driving two, three hours to my clinic because some ER doctor is scared of the Texas board or they’re scared of something, and they will not prescribe medication to these people.
Dr. Stella Immanuel: (09:35)
I tell all of you doctors that are sitting down and watching Americans die. You’re like the good Nazi … the good one, the good Germans that watched Jews get killed and you did not speak up. If they come after me, they threaten me. They’ve threatened to … I mean, I’ve gotten all kinds of threats. Or they’re going to report me to the bots. I say, you know what? I don’t care. I’m not going to let Americans die. And if this is the hill where I get nailed on, I will get nailed on it. I don’t care. You can report me to the bots, you can kill me, you can do whatever, but I’m not going to let Americans die.
Dr. Stella Immanuel: (10:09)
And today I’m here to say it, that America, there is a cure for COVID. All this foolishness does not need to happen. There is a cure for COVID. There is a cure for COVID is called hydroxychloroquine. It’s called zinc. It’s called Zithromax. And it is time for the grassroots to wake up and say, “No, we’re not going to take this any longer. We’re not going to die.” Because let me tell you something, when somebody is dead, they are dead. They’re not coming back tomorrow to have an argument. They are not come back tomorrow to discuss the double blinded study and the data. All of you doctors that are waiting for data, if six months down the line you actually found out that this data shows that this medication works, how about your patients that have died? You want a double blinded study where people are dying? It’s unethical. So guys, we don’t need to die. There is a cure for COVID.
Simone Gold: (11:02)
My gosh. Dr. Immanuelle also known as warrior. Before I introduce the next guest, I just want to say that I wish all doctors that are listening to this bring that kind of passion to their patients. And the study that Dr. Immanuel was referring to is in Virology, which talks about a SARS viral epidemic that affects the lungs that came from China. And they didn’t know what would work. The study showed that chloroquine would work. It sounds exactly like it could have been written three months ago, but in fact, that’s study in Virology, which was published by the NIH, the National Institute of Health when Dr. Anthony Fauci was the director. Again, the official publication of the NIH, Virology, 15 years ago showed that chloroquine … we use hydroxychloroquine, it’s the same … little safer … works. They proved this 15 years ago when we got this novel coronavirus, which is not that novel, it’s 78% similar to the prior-
Simone Gold: (12:03)
… coronavirus, which is not that novel. It’s 78% similar to the prior version. The COV-1, not surprisingly. It works. I’m now going to introduce our next speaker. Sorry. I forgot to say your name. Sorry.
Dr. Dan Erickson: (12:12)
That’s all right. Dr. Dan Erickson, Dr. Gold asked me to talk about the lockdown, how effective they were and do that cause anything nonfinancial? They always talk about the financial, but you have to realize that lockdown, we haven’t taken a $21 trillion economy and locked it down. So when you lock it down, it causes public health issues. Our suicide hotlines are up 600%, our spousal abuse. Different areas of alcoholism are all on the rise. These are public health problems from a financial lockdown. So we have to be clear on that fact that there is, it’s not like you just lock it down and have consequences to people’s jobs. They also have consequences, health consequences at home. So we’re talking about having a little more of a measured approach, a consistent approach. If we have another spike coming in cold and flu season, let’s do something that’s sustainable.

Tom Abbott
Reply to  Mary
July 28, 2020 7:35 am

I’m upset. Why I’m upset is that I see people that cannot breathe. I see parents walk in, I see diabetic sit in my office knowing that this is a death sentence and they can’t breathe. And I hug them and I tell them, “It’s going to be okay. You’re going to live.” And we treat them and they leave. None has died.”

Thank you, Dr. Immanuel, for being there, and thinking clearly.. “It’s going to be okay” is just what one wants to hear in the doctor’s office.

I wonder how many people have had HCQ deliberately withheld from them for one reason or another? It’s a crime what the Left and the Leftwing Media have done to demonize this drug.

Joel Snider
Reply to  Tom Abbott
July 28, 2020 10:35 am

If that truly turns out to be the case – more than a hundred thousand dead…

I don’t think ‘upset’ is the word for it

commieBob
Reply to  Mary
July 28, 2020 7:55 am

God bless you Mary. Now it’s on WUWT in writing and the social media censors can’t take it down.

Dr. Stella Immanuel has made claims about what happened in her practice. She has records and they can be checked. Until someone proves otherwise, we have to assume she’s telling the truth. If the authorities want to call her a quack and a liar, the onus is on them to subpoena her records and interview the patients. I’d bet next month’s coffee money that’s not going to happen. They’re even not going to try because they know she’s telling the truth.

350 patients are hard to ignore, kinda like the bodies piled on the streets in Ecuador or the overwhelmed undertakers in Brazil. Some facts just shine through all the BS.

Mary
Reply to  commieBob
July 28, 2020 9:06 am

I saved the entire transcript from the 45 minute press conference, in case it is also censored from rev.com. Very informative to read what all the doctors had to say.
We seek out second and even third opinions on diagnosis, prognosis and treatment from doctors, when faced with other life changing health issues. My question is why is Covid any different? Why are these professional ‘second opinions’ on treatment being censored? I digress…

Per doctors, Only 200 mg twice a week for HCQ and daily zinc as prophylactic. This sounds like a game changer to me…. but FEAR IS POWER… just saying.

https://www.rev.com/blog/transcripts/americas-frontline-doctors-scotus-press-conference-transcript

Transcript portion Where Dr. Gold and another speak to dosage of HCQ for prophylaxis-

Speaker 8: (27:27)
And you guys also said that previous doctors have used it, but they’ve used it in the wrong dosage. So I keep hearing the drug, but then what is the right dosage. What is the right mixture?
Dr. Stella Immanuel: (27:39)
That you’re going to discuss with your doctor, but let [inaudible 00:03:43] take that.
Speaker 9: (27:45)
Yeah, that’s a great question. Because the whole political situation has driven the fear towards this drug. So let’s address that. This drug is super safe. It’s safer than aspirin, Motrin, Tylenol. It’s super safe. All right. So what the problem is in a lot of those studies, they did very, very high doses, massive doses all through the country. They did the remaps study, the solidarity trial. That was the world health organization trial, and also the recovery trial. They use 2,400 milligrams in the first day. ———-—All you need is 200 twice a week for prophylaxis. ———-They used massive toxic doses. And guess what they found out? When you use massive toxic doses, you get toxic results. The drug doesn’t work when you give toxic doses. It’s a very safe drug. It concentrates in the lungs, 200 to 700 times higher in the lungs.

Simone Gold: (29:15)
Yeah. I want to emphasize on something that Dr. [inaudible 00:29:20] just said, because I love the question. This is a treatment regimen that’s very simple, and it should be in the hands of the American people. The difficult aspect of this is that at the moment, because of politics, it’s being blocked from doctors prescribing it, and it’s being blocked from pharmacists releasing it. They’ve been empowered to overrule the doctor’s opinion. Why is this not over the counter? As you can get it in much of the world and almost all of Latin America, in Iran, in Indonesia, in Subsaharan Africa, you can just go and buy it yourself. ———-And the dose, my friends is 200 milligrams twice in a week and zinc daily. ———-That’s the dose. I’m in favor of it being over the counter. Give it to the people. Give it to the people.

Reply to  Mary
July 28, 2020 10:46 am

Thanks for the transcript !

Dantheman
Reply to  Mary
July 28, 2020 3:33 pm

You mean she (the so-called nut) wasn’t the only frontline doctor recommending HCQ? Why does the media want people to die?

Norma Anne Wooters
Reply to  Mary
August 3, 2020 5:25 am

I just saw an interview with Dr. Simone Gold and she is quite believable. She is also a Lawyer and she does talk about how Dr. Fauci has known about the use of this medication since 2005 with the treatment for Sars 2, which is Covid 19. I know if I start feeling any of these symptoms of Covid 19, I will be asking for this treatment! They don’t want this used because we will not be as sick or need a vaccine! It’s all about the money!

DMacKenzie
Reply to  commieBob
July 28, 2020 10:04 am

Refer to Dr. Stella’s other inspiring vids, (/s) example:
https://youtu.be/RYwjA8ZDyCE

Todd
Reply to  DMacKenzie
July 28, 2020 1:18 pm

DMacKenzie: nice character assassination attempt. It would be far more refreshing if you refuted her evidence. But even then, notice that she wasn’t quoted in the posts above; these were other doctors addressing questions from journalists.

Joel Snider
Reply to  Todd
July 28, 2020 4:48 pm

Not ONE troll here today has done anything else.

DMacKenzie
Reply to  Todd
July 28, 2020 5:28 pm

Todd, presenting perspective is not character assassination. I left the assessment up to those who wish to check themselves.
I don’t need to refute her claimed evidence, double blind studies have already done that, should you care to search.

Nicholas McGinley
Reply to  Todd
July 29, 2020 6:16 am

How is linking to other videos she made in anyway a character assassination?
That would seem to be an admission that other things she said are a discredit to her.
He called them inspiring.
Is that an attack on character?

How about explain why those others do not matter and skip the ad homs aimed at the messenger?

Nicholas McGinley
Reply to  Todd
July 29, 2020 1:24 pm

She said she does not believe in masks.
But she is a mask advocate.
She and her staff wear n95 respirators, and in this video, she warns anyone coming to see her to wear a face covering, and stay away from anyone not part of that persons immediate household:
https://www.facebook.com/100321995001608/videos/711397332961734/?__cft__%5B0%5D=AZXDlnipBlUmczxs04pQfW3QsnhRieftXW5NPRtr6SSeW969Cafx9qzDLgS01d1Ew74WyQRy-wuFFnNL7eqUrLjeCWvsg4VmjNxbuRchzL_r9DFwNkYshD909zkfsWmxoPmypZMSfcCYokXoLQl4ePDeLTV8D-LFTwjr44SlmCS1yg

Bob boder
Reply to  DMacKenzie
July 28, 2020 3:22 pm

Dan
Do you have a problem with powerful women of color? Why do you resort to attacking her cultural beliefs to try and discredit her?

John Endicott
Reply to  Bob boder
July 29, 2020 2:00 am

Attacking the messenger when you can’t attack the message is a tactic that is as old as debate itself.

Nicholas McGinley
Reply to  Bob boder
July 29, 2020 9:32 am

Bob,
Are you a leftist proponent of intersectional theory, white fragility, and/or equity theory?
Are you employed by the grievance industry?
Are you an anti-racism lecturer hauling down the big bucks for telling white people that everything wrong with the world is, always has been, and always will be, the fault of whiteness?
Or do you just admire their tactics and specific langauge and so adopt them when it suits you?

John Endicott
Reply to  Bob boder
July 30, 2020 2:11 am

Or perhaps, Nicholas , he’s using their (your?) own tactics against them (you?) Hoist by their own petard.

Ian W
Reply to  Mary
July 28, 2020 9:19 am

“Dr. Stella Immanuel: (09:35)
I tell all of you doctors that are sitting down and watching Americans die. You’re like the good Nazi … the good one, the good Germans that watched Jews get killed and you did not speak up. If they come after me, they threaten me. They’ve threatened to … I mean, I’ve gotten all kinds of threats. Or they’re going to report me to the bots. I say, you know what? I don’t care. I’m not going to let Americans die. And if this is the hill where I get nailed on, I will get nailed on it. I don’t care. You can report me to the bots, you can kill me, you can do whatever, but I’m not going to let Americans die.”

What kind of person threatens a doctor who is successfully treating patients and saving their lives, just because they don’t want people to know that a particular drug regimen works?

Why are the social media companies supporting these threats by acting in concert to remove from their internet services reports and evidence that a drug regimen works. Not only removing but removing with unusual alacrity. I will emphasize that ALL of the social media companies in concert removing the reports in minutes: On whose bidding is this action being taken?

Gary
Reply to  Ian W
July 29, 2020 6:14 pm

Follow the money. The big Dem contributors. Big Pharma.

mario lento
Reply to  Ian W
July 29, 2020 7:22 pm

Amen that. There is something EVIL going on. I took a few courses in psychology in college… one thing I never forgot was that “anger” is a strong motivating force. The MSM peddles in stoking hate and gaslighting. It’s a source of power for them. They and the Dem’s have mastered this power to sell out America for power. The Dem’s use the force of government to take from the coffers, promise it to good voters, by taking money from bad voters. The level of evil is at perhaps an all time high.

Daniel B
July 28, 2020 6:15 am

The fear attached to watching this video makes it feel like forbidden knowledge.

You can still find this in some places.
https://www.breitbart.com/tech/2020/07/27/facebook-censors-viral-video-of-doctors-capitol-hill-coronavirus-press-conference/

Neo
Reply to  Daniel B
July 28, 2020 7:13 am

The Facebook is no forum for science .. just Luddites

Todd
Reply to  Neo
July 28, 2020 1:27 pm

Not Luddites; they’re far worse than that. First, they are censoring information that opposes their own agenda. Second, the consequences are, literally, life and death.

John Dawson
July 28, 2020 6:16 am

Too late – it’s gone 🙁

Pat Frank
July 28, 2020 6:18 am

As of 8 am Central Time, the link to the 2 hr presentation works, but Youtube has pulled the headpost video.

The couple of minutes I’ve watched so far at the link looks to be the lead-in to a factual presentation by working physicians about hydroxychloroquine, it’s efficacy, and its use.

If such a video violates Youtube’s terms of service, then Youtube’s TOS are prejudicially biased. If the physicians’ presentations about HCQ efficacy are correct, then one may surmise that Youtube’s TOS will be in service to negligent homicide.

rickk
July 28, 2020 6:18 am

Why leave it on FB or YT – is there no alternative space in the cloud where the piece can reside without fear of it being pulled down? We know what kind of actors FB and YT are so why do people continue to patronize them – ie. Daily Wire, PragerU, Breitbart, TheBlaze, Crowder, Project Veritas, WUWT – is there no Conservative billionaire with wedding tackle large enough to step up and create a platform?

Gary
Reply to  rickk
July 29, 2020 6:16 pm

Bitchute

DHR
July 28, 2020 6:19 am

Its gone from utube

No Name Guy
July 28, 2020 6:21 am

Censored by You Tube. They need to put it on BitChute.

Reply to  No Name Guy
July 28, 2020 7:19 am
LetsGoViking
July 28, 2020 6:21 am

All ready pulled. 🙁

Derg
July 28, 2020 6:21 am

Cue Henry in 3,2,1

Where are the double blind tests….

Scott W Bennett
July 28, 2020 6:22 am

The video is here currently: https://youtu.be/bbmJOvXRtAA

And here: https://youtu.be/b-xVAT5ZCtM

YouTube actually purged it from my viewing history on mobile and desktop!

YouTube are also removing comments these days, even comments that simply state that YouTube has removed a comment!
This is very bad for social cohesion;-(

VicV
Reply to  Scott W Bennett
July 28, 2020 6:37 am

Those videos are not of the conference. The conference was indoors and lasted about 3 hours.

Pameldragon
July 28, 2020 6:26 am

Removed by Youtube for violating their terms of service….

Rick
July 28, 2020 6:28 am

Well that was quick. They must have seek and destroy robots all primed to eliminate these ASAP. I found one and it quit midstream. Makes me double curious what’s so scary about these videos.

VicV
July 28, 2020 6:29 am

LOL. It’s been censored.

🤬 Bastards.

2hotel9
July 28, 2020 6:29 am

Wow, censorship ROCKS!!!! Remove everything that disagrees with leftist dogma. Next she will be attacked by media and Democrat politicians. I wonder how fast she will be fired from her current job?

2hotel9
July 28, 2020 6:32 am

It is still up on their own website, for the moment.

Gibby
July 28, 2020 6:34 am

Full 3 hour video still available from the Americas Frontline Doctors link. It is worth the watch from the beginning since, as mentioned above, it lays out their argument quite nicely.

Tim.
July 28, 2020 6:35 am
Grumpy Bill
July 28, 2020 6:36 am

YT has also pulled the video.
Using DuckDuckGo, I was able to find it at archive.org

Jimmy Haigh
July 28, 2020 6:36 am

I guess black Doctors’ lives don’t matter much to You Tube ..

fretslider
July 28, 2020 6:45 am

This video has been removed for violating YouTube’s Terms of Service.

Speed of Service
What an excellent example for Twitter, who couldn’t be bothered to take down Wiley’s racist tweets until pressured.

fretslider
July 28, 2020 6:48 am
steve black
July 28, 2020 6:49 am

The video has some debatable points (should schools reopen? Maybe. There is an argument worth having). But it deserves to be banned as the doctors advocating HCQ display a catastrophic misunderstanding of how scientific evidence needs to be gathered that puts them squarely alongside advocated for anti-vaccine views and homeopathy.

The only way to know for sure whether HCQ is effective for covid is to conduct careful trials. “I gave it to hundreds of my patients and none of them died” is not a careful trial.

There have been plenty of published trials of HCQ that are extraordinarily poor (on both sides of the argument). And the advocates for HCQ quote the ones with the results they like whether conducted well or not. The best trials currently say it doesn’t work. More, and better, trials are still being done. Anyone who claims to know it is effective is either ignoring the trials they don’t like or acting prematurely. Worse, their very actions in prescribing HCQ in an uncontrolled way make finding out whether it works much harder.

Science is not about weight of opinion: it is about weight of evidence (as global warming critics often point out). Those contrarian pro-HCQ opinions are not worth anything in the debate about truth.

Unfortunately, banning the video just reinforces the ridiculous conspiracy that the truth is being suppressed.

richardw
Reply to  steve black
July 28, 2020 7:33 am

This drug has been widely used for decades, and is formally assessed as being safer than aspirin. Both the science behind it’s effectiveness and practical clinical tests and experience have shown that it should not be prescribed as a cure in the late stage of the disease when the body’s immune response is creating havoc. It should be used prophylactically and as an early stage treatment.

You could buy it over the counter before the pandemic!

I would support your comments if we were dealing with an unknown drug, but we are not.

icisil
Reply to  richardw
July 28, 2020 8:26 am

HCQ should be available OTC. Acetaminophen is OTC and it’s far more dangerous.

DMacKenzie
Reply to  richardw
July 28, 2020 8:58 am

point by point….
So would you treat CoVid with Aspirin ? You could have all your neighbours take aspirin and they likely will all recover from CoVid…..
So you think HCQ is a prophylactic when different studies show it is/isn’t ?
It’s now not-over-the-counter to thwart a black market in counterfeit drugs, with the result that you can get it by prescription instead of only on the dark web.
I support your right to buy it if you want it, but not your belief that it is a magic bullet. You can believe Vitamin C is a prophylactic for the common cold too, but it isn’t…..and people still believe after dozens of studies….

Pat Frank
Reply to  DMacKenzie
July 28, 2020 10:31 am

Yours is an incoherent reply, DMacK.

The video presents the considered views of front-line professional physicians with real-life experience using HCQ to treat covid. They uniformly report success.

You are in no position to dispute or discount their credible reports.

Jack Dale
Reply to  Pat Frank
July 28, 2020 10:37 am

“credible” Really?

“In general, America’s Frontline Doctors lack credibility as none of the Doctors are specialized in the field of infectious diseases. Further, much of the information they present is not supported by the scientific consensus regarding Covid-19. Lastly, the group appears to be connected to the Tea Party Patriots, which is owned by the Tea Party Patriots Fund that lobbies for small government and conservative causes.

Overall, we rate America’s Frontline Doctors a quackery level pseudoscience website based on the promotion of false or misleading information regarding Coronavirus that does not align with the consensus of science. We also rate them Low for factual reporting due to a lack of transparency as well as using known pseudoscience sources to draw their conclusions. ”

https://mediabiasfactcheck.com/americas-frontline-doctors/

The first A is the CRAAP Test

Authority Authority lets us know that someone with expertise or experience in the topic is sharing their knowledge. Remember, though, that authority is contextual. Having a Ph.D. in Astronomy would not give someone authority to write about the impact of music therapy on children who have autism. The expertise or experience needs to be relevant to the topic.
What credentials related to the topic at hand does the author have?

Does the author have any relevant affiliations with a respected university or organization?

What can you find about the author online?

Has the author published on this subject before?

Is the publication reputable?

sycomputing
Reply to  Pat Frank
July 28, 2020 12:09 pm

Lastly, the group appears to be connected to the Tea Party Patriots, which is owned by the Tea Party Patriots Fund that lobbies for small government and conservative causes.

Oops, Jack, your sloppy thinking is showing again.

Your logical fallacy is?

https://tinyurl.com/bvfmw4k

Jack Dale
Reply to  sycomputing
July 28, 2020 12:29 pm

Sorry I forgot that that logical fallacy is the domain of the regulars on WUWT. It will not happen again.

sycomputing
Reply to  Pat Frank
July 28, 2020 12:48 pm

Sorry I forgot that that logical fallacy is the domain of the regulars on WUWT. It will not happen again.

Oops, Jack, you’ve already broken your pledge, and this at the EXACT MOMENT you made it! Now THAT’S progressivism in a nutshell!

Your logical fallacy is?

https://tinyurl.com/k4tp28a

Wanna go for a hat trick?

Joel Snider
Reply to  Pat Frank
July 28, 2020 12:50 pm

You’re a regular, aren’t you, Jack?

Pat Frank
Reply to  Pat Frank
July 28, 2020 2:14 pm

What makes you think mediabiasfactcheck.com is a reliable checker of fact, Jack?

I found both Statista and Factcheck.org to be lying by omission when I checked their claims against the FBI uniform crime report.

Jack Dale
Reply to  Pat Frank
July 28, 2020 3:01 pm

I also check other sources.

None of those associated with America’s Frontline Doctors have any expertise in epidemiology or infectious diseases.

https://gizmodo.com/who-are-americas-frontline-doctors-the-pro-trump-pro-1844528900

Here is another factchecker’s take:

https://www.politifact.com/factchecks/2020/jul/28/stella-immanuel/dont-fall-video-hydroxychloroquine-not-covid-19-cu/

Then there is peer-reviewed science.

https://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJMoa2016638

Frontline also fails the CRAAP Test.

https://guides.library.duq.edu/informationevaluation/CRAAP

And I have a very sensitive crap detector.

sycomputing
Reply to  Pat Frank
July 28, 2020 4:00 pm

And I have a very sensitive crap detector.

That’s to be expected, when a great deal of what you’re detecting is yourself.

See the (un)redolent thinking examples above.

🙂

DonM
Reply to  Pat Frank
July 28, 2020 4:18 pm

You have a sensitive crap detector???

So you sense crap, then put in a lot of effort to find crap so as to verify your initial crap sense???

Do yourself a favor. Go stand in front of the mirror, make eye contact, say “I have a sensitive crap detector; I have a sensitive crap detector; I have a sensitive crap detector. I can sense crap; I know when I see it”

(don’t lose eye contact, or you have to start over again … see you in a few days.)

Jack Dale
Reply to  DonM
July 28, 2020 4:21 pm

Yes, you just posted crap. You seem to be like a dung beetle, who looks for crap, rolls it back home and posts it.

Joel Snider
Reply to  Pat Frank
July 28, 2020 4:42 pm

Gee, I wonder if this is all pulled from the same well.

Joel Snider
Reply to  Pat Frank
July 28, 2020 5:07 pm

‘YYou seem to be like a dung beetle, who looks for crap, rolls it back home and posts it’

Wow – talk about lack of self awareness.

Jack Dale
Reply to  Joel Snider
July 28, 2020 7:00 pm

DonM really does lack a sense of self-awareness. But he does have a sense of small.

sycomputing
Reply to  Pat Frank
July 28, 2020 5:14 pm

You seem to be like a dung beetle, who looks for crap, rolls it back home and posts it.

Hmm, don’t you contradict yourself Jack?

There’s the hat trick I knew was coming!

Jack Dale
Reply to  sycomputing
July 28, 2020 6:52 pm

All of your comments meet this logical fallacy.

https://tinyurl.com/ke2gw3r

sycomputing
Reply to  Pat Frank
July 28, 2020 7:52 pm

All of your comments meet this logical fallacy.

Ad hominem, Jack? Are you sure?

I mean, are you REALLY sure you have a clue?

“Ad hominem attacks can take the form of overtly attacking somebody, or more subtly casting doubt on their character or personal attributes as a way to discredit their argument.”

Oh come now Jack . . . you’re not REALLY going to make this argument are you? Can you cite for me ONE example where I “subtly cast doubt on” your “character or personal attributes”? Can you do that Jack?

No?

Because if you can’t, then not only are you a Trifecta of Sloppy Thinking, but you’ve now graduated to a Quadrophenia:

Your logical fallacy is?

https://tinyurl.com/k4tp28a

Gratz buddy. I’m pretty sure you’re Quadrophenia is a first.

I for one, am impressed!

DMacKenzie
Reply to  Pat Frank
July 28, 2020 10:15 pm

Pat,
it was a point by point coherent reply to RichardW, not you.
Now on to your comment about “considered view of frontline…”..
This is the view of some front line physicians, but a number of studies have found HCQ to be ineffective. So who to believe? Front line un-corroborated un-reviewed opinions or real studies done in real hospitals by equally competent doctors focused on the study effort.
The studies DON’T uniformly report success as you say.
For the record, HCQ is statistically a safe enough medication to consume. Take it if you want.

Nicholas McGinley
Reply to  Pat Frank
July 29, 2020 7:11 am

Pat,
Here are the scientific findings of thousands of doctors in hundreds of hospital treating many thousands of patients in controlled settings, with randomization, double blinding, independent review board evaluating individual patient data, and clearly tabulated results published with concise and complete data.
IOW…science.
Not someone saying that they did something.
There are engineers who claim that particle beams and nanothermite brought down the towers.
Other engineers claim you can double gas mileage with a water fueled hydrogen generator powered by the alternator on your car.
Raoult is discreditted and no longer stands behind his earlier claims.
Zelenko has been shown to be a fraud and a liar and no longer will give info on his hundreds of so called patients, none of who he ever had any follow up with, to see if they even filled his telemedicine prescribed treatment prescriptions. He never saw anyone.
He is under investigation by the FBI. His community told him to leave because he is a liar.
It is now the case he reports results in line with SoC.

Scientists cannot ignore information they find inconvenient and claim to be scientific.
A scientist cannot choose to believe a spoken assertion with no evidence to back it up, while ignoring a mountain of carefully collected actual evidence from a large number of doctors not engaging in self promotion or inserting politics into the treatment of patients. Not while having a credible claim to being objective

Here is a small fraction of the clinical trials showing lack of efficacy of HCQ alone or in combination with anything, including zinc, including z pak, including taken before symptoms even occur. I will post a longer list with many many more once I have the time to compose a comprehensive list and comment:

The evidence from clinical trials is overwhelming.
HCQ does not help at any stage of infection, or as a prophylactic drug.

https://medcitynews.com/2020/07/hydroxychloroquine-flunks-phase-iii-trial-in-mild-to-moderate-covid-19/

https://www.recoverytrial.net/news/low-cost-dexamethasone-reduces-death-by-up-to-one-third-in-hospitalised-patients-with-severe-respiratory-complications-of-covid-19

At this point there is a long and growing list of clinical trial data showing complete lack of efficacy.
Many results show it is harmful.

There are trials which used the z pak antibiotic and HCQ.
https://www.nejm.org/medical-articles/original-article

https://relief.unboundmedicine.com/relief/view/Coronavirus-Guidelines/2355000/all/Coronavirus_Disease_2019__COVID_19_

No efficacy.
There are ones using zinc and HCQ. Also vitamin C and HCQ…and zinc.
In patients with mild disease, who were not in a hospital setting:

https://www.acpjournals.org/doi/10.7326/M20-4207

No efficacy

For post exposure prophylaxis:

https://rheumnow.com/news/hydroxychloroquine-fails-postexposure-prophylaxis-covid-19
No efficacy.

There are many many studies with results published now…more every day for the past few weeks

If being hard headed would cure viral illnesses, we would have this one licked.

Old.George
Reply to  Nicholas McGinley
July 29, 2020 7:29 am

“Global HCQ studies. PrEP, PEP, and early treatment studies show high effectiveness, while late treatment shows mixed results.” <– from C19study.com has worldwide trials.
It shows the negative and positive results; it does not confine itself to just positive nor negative.

ripshin
Editor
Reply to  Pat Frank
July 29, 2020 7:37 am

Jack,

Thanks for posting the NEJM study. It’s interesting, but consider that you should do the same thing there that you do here. Namely, read the comments. Additional information and counterpoints can be educational.

I’ve taken the liberty of excerpting one such that offered a statistical check to the study. The comment’s authors noted:

…Therefore, in accordance with the guidelines of the Journal and the American Statistical Association, it is critical to not view results in a dichotomized manner on the basis of P values, especially when the results are fragile, the trial is underpowered, and other statistical measures suggest a possible benefit with no signal for harm.3,4

Muhammad-Shahzeb Khan, M.D.
Cook County Hospital, Chicago, IL

Javed Butler, M.D., M.P.H.
University of Mississippi, Jackson, MS
jbutler4@umc.edu

rip

Nicholas McGinley
Reply to  Pat Frank
July 29, 2020 7:38 am

Has anyone noticed what we are NOT talking about here on this thread?
We are not talking about her evidence.
Why?
Because she presents none.
All she did was make assertions.
And people here are calling those assertions facts.
She does not say how long her follow up period is, or if she tested anyone, or if she had any way to know if her patients have COVID, or how she could known how 350 people she treated out of her strip mall clinic (possibly by telemedicine) are doing at every poiint in the future after she treated them.
Primary care physicians are not in constant contact with patients.
They do not call them all every day to see how they are doing.
Few ever call anyone.
Any no patient is obligated to call a clinic doctor if their condition worsens and they go to a hospital.
We simply have no info on any of that.
Why?
Because she gave none!
Raoult claimed 100% success, but it was found out he got that result by eliminating the people who died or got worse, of which there were several.
Zelenko claimed such success, but it was found out he lied, and had never followed up on anyone, and in any case he claimed to have cured people he never tested for the virus, and his announcement came 10 days after he treated his first patient.
A meaninglessly short time for people who were only concerned enough to see a regular doctor via a telehealth appointment. At the time he made his report, it was not even possible to get his prescriptions filled in the state he was practicing in.

Evidence.
All of these claims that so many people are rapidly certain of are based on nothing more than assertions, and as far as can be seen, they are made by people who are not credible and who site either no data or downright disingenuous lies.

Bob boder
Reply to  DMacKenzie
July 28, 2020 11:19 am

So because you believe it doesn’t work I should not be allowed to take it? Even though it’s safe? And many doctors are saying it may work? And there is mechanism that describes how it may work? And there is lots of anecdotal evidence that it may work? And of course any that doesn’t agree with your view is nuts.
Thought process of a group think fanatic, the sickness of today’s progress world.

richardw
Reply to  DMacKenzie
July 28, 2020 1:19 pm

1. No I wouldn’t treat Covid with aspirin. What a daft statement.
2. Many studies show it is effective in early stage treatment. The studies showing it didn’t work have been pulled; they looked at its effectiveness as a late stage treatment, which it is not.
3. Withdrawing a drug from OTC availability is exactly what you do if you want to create a black market.
4. It is not a magic bullet but is is better than anything that has so far been tried.

Fred Middleton
Reply to  DMacKenzie
July 28, 2020 5:43 pm

Many places in the world HCQ is over the counter

Michael S. Kelly
Reply to  DMacKenzie
July 28, 2020 7:05 pm

“None of those associated with America’s Frontline Doctors have any expertise in epidemiology or infectious diseases.”

Why on Earth would any of America’s Frontline Doctors need “expertise in epidemiology”? They are physicians treating sick people, many, or even most of whom suffer from infectious diseases. The latter gives them first-hand expertise in infectious diseases. They have developed a course of treatment that works for a particular infectious disease. That is the way that medicine evolved since the beginning.

The requirement of proving out effectiveness of a new treatment via double-blind study is, in my view, often inhuman. If something shows promise, even anecdotally, it should be given to someone likely to die of the disease for which it could provide a cure. Requiring vast studies to prove that it’s “safe and effective” before anyone can receive it sounds to me like something a sick, sadistic psychopath would do if he or she ever acquired the power to do it.

A colleague and dear friend of mine was diagnosed with breast cancer on her 30th birthday. It was an aggressive type, but with chemotherapy and surgery, they thought they had gotten it. They were wrong. About four years later, they found that it had metastasized to her bone marrow.

She was then put into a clinical trial of a drug that had shown great promise against this particular cancer. It was double-blind, but there were known side-effects every time it was used. After a few weeks, she and the clinicians in the study knew that she was in the placebo group.

She died shortly before her 35th birthday.

I will never forgive the sadists at the FDA for this. Never.

Old.George
Reply to  Michael S. Kelly
July 28, 2020 7:12 pm

Again, see C19study.com. Really. There are 65 trials. Yes, late use is negative, early and prophylactic use is positive.
In addition the below shows what stopping HCQ (after Lancet) and restarting HCQ did.
https://pjmedia.com/news-and-politics/stacey-lennox/2020/07/15/media-should-do-a-mea-culpa-as-french-analysis-offers-a-stunning-observation-about-hydroxychloroquine-use-n643181

P.S. It doesn’t matter who says it if it happens to be right. Trump (who doesn’t understand virology at all. Zilch, Nada.) or a random Nigerian doctor (who is mistaken about other things), or me (a computer modeling expert).

Nicholas McGinley
Reply to  Michael S. Kelly
July 29, 2020 10:33 am

The C 19 “study” is no study, it is an opinion article.
They list trials as having 100% positive results by looking at studies that showed no clinical efficacy and even ones that showed less chance of a favorable outcome, then claimed to have found some positive way to interpret the fact that there was no benefit from taking the drugs.

IOW, whoever wrote it is just making stuff up.

Lets look at the Boulware et al study as an example:
The difference in people taking HCQ and those not taking HCQ was not statistically significant, but the HCQ group were almost three times more likely to have side effects from the treatment.
It is factually incorrect to call a result with no statistically significance a positive finding.
Claiming otherwise is simply unscientific.
Not to mention, all of the results from other sources of information showed some people in even small cohorts of patients at any stage of infection had some fatalism, and most of the studies ended with some patients still having unresolved status. IOW…some people still in the hospital.
There was one guy that got sick on the Japan cruise ship that just got out of the hospital a few weeks ago.
There was a guy stuck in an airport for three months because no country would let him enter until he had two negative tests in a row, and it took three months for that to happen in his case!

To summerize, this C-19 site takes studies in which sometimes as many as thousands of patients take part, and there is no benefit, and finds some way to claim that really there was some benefit, then calls them collectively 100% positive studies. The reports that incredibly tendentious assertion as, “…treatment studies show high effectiveness…”

He uses “studies” from countries such as Cuba and Morocco, and some others, which are preprints of almost laughable quality or credibility, and lumps them in with peer reviewed studies from the US and EU.
Example: The Khurana et al “study”.
First off, lead author is an an assistant professor of orthopedics. Oh well, maybe that is no indication.

They sent out questionnaires to health care workers, and of the ones they came back, they separated out ones that self reported as positive and ones that self reported as negative. Then after whatever they did, they had the gall to call this a clinical trial of pre exposure prophylaxis!
A questionnaire is no study, and it sure aint a clinical trial. And looking retroactively at some people who were positive and some who were negative, less than 100 of each, and calling this pre exposure prophylaxis testing?
GMAFB.

Nicholas McGinley
Reply to  Michael S. Kelly
July 29, 2020 10:40 am

Just to restate simply.
Some of these “trials” were nothing like a actual clinical trial.
Some were, for example, such things as questionnaires sent out to people and then examined for statistical significance of self reported answers to some questions, then called a clinical trial or pre exposure prophylaxis.

Other results C19 calls a positive results were studies that found no efficacy, but which C19 decided did have some detail that could be interpreted as positive, then called all those imagined positive results to be studies that show “high effectiveness”.

It could not be more full of crap if that was their goal.

Philo
Reply to  Michael S. Kelly
July 30, 2020 7:48 pm

I think you’re right on Michael Kelly.
Double blind placebo controlled tests the FDA and HHS require are unethical. It is particularly evil for diseases with a high death rate or other severe consequences.
Your friend’s case is a highlight example. If either the drug under test or the placebo have any obvious effects there simply can’t be a valid double blind test. This was particularly egregious in your friend’s case. You have my sympathy.

Even with open control tests there are many problems. I take a number of drugs for multiple problems. I’ve found that most come with a clinical sheet in addition to directions for the patient. It is very useful for evaluating the drugs. In a typical example the sheet shows a trial with a placebo, a control drug, and a couple treatment levels for the trial drug.

In most cases the placebo is 30-50% effective. The control may or may not be better than the placebo. The trial drug may be better anywhere from 40 to 60% effective. Depending on the trial results the drug has been approved but obviously that doesn’t guarantee a cure in any specific case.

I had a practical experience with one newer drug. The doctor wanted me to try a $6000/dose drug which needed a hospital visit for intravenous administration. I looked at the clinical trials. The placebo was 30-35% effective. My current treatment was 40-50% effective. The new drug was 50-60% effective.
Since the current treatment is reasonably effective and relatively cheap spending some $25,000 to find out for the pharma company that for at least one patient their drug was ineffective or no better than the current treatment did not seem attractive!

For Covid the hydroxychloroquine/zinc/+ treatment has a non-zero effect in trials and is very cheap as drugs go. It ought to be the first treatment tried on any new patient as early as possible. It’s clearly up to the clinical judgement of the treating doctors how to handle individual cases. There is lots of evidence the Covid virus does not behave in a reliable manner. The counter example is measles- very infectious, very uniform symptoms in children, and variable but dangerous for adults. Fortunately the best treatment for measles is a quite effective vaccine so most people don’t have to worry about it.

Mikgen
Reply to  DMacKenzie
July 29, 2020 12:24 pm

@DMacKenzie

Sorry, but you don’t know what your are talking about. At least 5 studies have shown HCQ to have a prophylactic effect against COVID-19. Only two small studies (Macias et al and Gendelman et al) did not show a protective effect.

Chatterjee et al showed a significant dose-related prophylactic effect.

Khurana et al., medRxiv, doi:10.1101/2020.07.21.20159301 (Preprint)
Prevalence and clinical correlates of COVID-19 outbreak among healthcare workers in a tertiary level hospital

Zhong et al., Lancent Rheumatology, 10.1016/S2665-9913(20)30227-7 (Peer Reviewed)
COVID-19 in patients with rheumatic disease in Hubei province, China: a multicentre retrospective observational study

Ferreira et al., J. Medical Virology, July 9, 2020, doi:10.1002/jmv.26286 (preprint 6/29) (Peer Reviewed)
Chronic treatment with hydroxych loroquine and SARS-CoV-2 infection

Bhattacharya et al., medRxix, doi:10.1101/2020.06.09.20116806 (Preprint)
Pre exposure Hydroxych loroquine use is associated with reduced COVID19 risk in healthcare workers

Chatterjee et al., Indian J. Med. Res., June 20, 2020, doi:10.4103/ijmr.IJMR_2234_20 (Peer Reviewed)
Healthcare workers & SARS-CoV-2 infection in India: A case-control investigation in the time of COVID-19

Macias et al., medRxiv, 10.1101/2020.05.16.20104141 (Preprint)
Similar incidence of Coronavirus Disease 2019 (COVID-19) in patients with rheumatic diseases with and without hydroxychloroquine therapy

Gendelman et al., Autoimmunity Reviews, 19:7, July 2020, doi:10.1016/j.autrev.2020.102566 (Peer Reviewed)
Continuous Hydroxychloroquine or Colchicine Therapy Does Not Prevent Infection With SARS-CoV-2: Insights From a Large Healthcare Database Analysis

Bruce Cobb
Reply to  steve black
July 28, 2020 7:36 am

So you would rather see thousands die, and many more suffer needlessly based on the idiotic notion that maybe it doesn’t work, or maybe not in all cases and circumstances.
That’s an asinine, and frankly morally-depraved position.

Kevin T Kilty
Reply to  steve black
July 28, 2020 7:36 am

I agree, but in the current atmosphere can you imagine any IRB giving the green light to a clinical trial of any design? Politics destroys whatever it touches.

JimW
Reply to  steve black
July 28, 2020 7:37 am

”The best trials currently say it doesn’t work.”
Who is defining ‘best’? The only published trials I have seen do not use zinc, do not use the HCQ/zinc combo at an early stage, do not use HCQ in the correct safe quantities.
However there a literally thousands of doctors around the world using HCQ/zinc combo and are ( anecdotaly) reporting success.
Given at an early stage with zinc in the correct quantities is not dangerous. If it doesn’t work then given the lack of alternatives it does no harm.
The excessive negative pressure on doctors not to use it in this manner is of itself of great concern. People are right to ask, why?

David A
Reply to  JimW
July 29, 2020 5:27 am

And Jack has ZERO reply to your correct assertion…
“The only published trials I have seen do not use zinc, and or do not use the HCQ/zinc combo at an early stage, and it do not use HCQ in the correct safe quantities.”

Jack???????

Nicholas McGinley
Reply to  David A
July 30, 2020 7:49 am

She claims her patients have advanced to a stage of not being able to breathe. That does not sound like she is only treating people early.
She runs a clinic.
She sees people who walk in her door of her strip mall office.
Really sick people who cannot breathe go to hospitals, not a strip mall to grab a prescription.
What has happened is, anyone who just automatically believes what she says has suspended disbelief.
Except when it comes to published results from doctors who systematically treat and keep track of their patients in an organized way.
For all of those doctors, the standard seems to be that they do not exist…or something.

Sparko
Reply to  steve black
July 28, 2020 7:50 am

It’s quite a well established and safe drug which has been in use for quite some time for treating Malaria. The Doctor in question has considerable expertise in admininstering it to patients for Malaria. if it helps by (I assume) reducing the severity of the symptoms in the early stages , so the immune system can fight the virus, then good.
seems to me like you are trying to shoot the messenger

Ian W
Reply to  Sparko
July 28, 2020 9:17 am

HCQ works as an Ionophore to shuttle zinc across the cell membranes into the cells. Zinc interferes with RNA virus hijacking of the RNA transcription process so that the virus cannot replicate. HCQ also has the effect of reducing inflammation. The antibiotic prevents opportunist bacterial infections.

It is not as if the NIH doesn’t know all this. I got the information from NIH papers some as is said in the video, written in 2005 about the SARS epidemic.

Stuart Nachman
Reply to  Ian W
July 28, 2020 2:59 pm

The molecular biologist who spoke early in the three hour presentation explained the five different ways the drug interferes with or stops the replication process within the cell. Only one of those mechanisms involves the Zinc, for which the drug acts as an ionophore.

https://www.americasfrontlinedoctors.com/

Nicholas McGinley
Reply to  Ian W
July 30, 2020 8:14 am

There is no evidence HCQ is a zinc ionophore.
Chloroquine has been claimed to be and that claim is backed up by a ref research studies from years back.
Everyone who asserts HCQ is one is just assuming it is one.
And they are assuming that this is an actual mechanism that occurs inside the body of a person who has a virus.
There is zero evidence that this is the case.

ozspeaksup
Reply to  steve black
July 28, 2020 7:58 am

yeah science…
so why did the trials usehuge dangerous dosesof HQ? leave out the zinc? not use azithromycin or again big doses?
like all other meds that might be cheap and not manage huge fundingas theyre off patent
FDA wont get its multimil payola pay to play?
how many mil handed to modena already andmore th other day…hmm?

theres a few thousand patients now who are alive and used HQ
far exceeding the vaccine start trials
sfe old drugs not fiddled mRna never used at all..
science?
yes we’d like to see some

Charles Atisele
Reply to  steve black
July 28, 2020 8:01 am

Why we make truth or facts so complicated is mind boggling. Agreed her treatment regimen was not approved by CDC/WHO or big pharmaceutical companies, she believes over 350 was treated successfully of covid-19 — this can be verified by WHO/CDC.
I believe in science and data, but a 100% success rate of treating any disease shouldn’t be wished away. Yes, her English or articulation may be poor, but those 350 plus lives saved is more crucial. The truth is, the dead have no say, and living who are in perpetual fear and hopelessness, are increasing in number. This is not okay.

Ian W
Reply to  Charles Atisele
July 28, 2020 9:31 am

And importantly she is not the only doctor successfully treating COVID-19 patients. There are many many more. But perhaps the USA will listen to a doctor from Nigeria looking in and saying what are you panicking about there is a cure!

There is a huge gulf in attitude between the doctors (front line) that are hands on treating real patients and trying to save their lives; and the medical bureaucrats and researchers in the FDA/NIH etc who are more concerned with funding streams and the next orbit of the revolving door into big pharma.

There’s nothing to gain in funding from a 50 year old generic drug with zinc and a generic antibiotic indeed it is the enemy of the huge riches from a worldwide vaccination program which will only happen IF politicians can be convinced that the only way out of lock-down is a vaccine.

It seems that the front line doctors are the only ones concerned about saving patient’s lives.

KT66
Reply to  steve black
July 28, 2020 8:03 am

I believe nothing “deserves to be banned.”

damp
Reply to  steve black
July 28, 2020 8:27 am

“The only way to know for sure whether HCQ is effective for covid is to conduct careful trials. ‘I gave it to hundreds of my patients and none of them died’ is not a careful trial.”

Mr. black, you’re not familiar with current leftist thought, it seems. What we used to call “anecdotal evidence” is now “lived experience,” and “your truth.” Lived experience trumps white inventions like statistics.

paul courtney
Reply to  steve black
July 28, 2020 8:37 am

Mr. Black: “But it deserves to be banned….” When “science” trumps free speech, then fascists march with banners that say “science”. Better than banning, let’s let you see it and you can tell us what’s wrong with it. Oh, wait, we just did that! Talk of “banning” is a slippery slope, Mr. black.

commieBob
Reply to  steve black
July 28, 2020 8:49 am

You can dismiss Dr Stella Immanuel’s evidence as anecdotal but that’s 350 anecdotes.

Double blind testing is the gold standard but it produces false results most of the time because of small sample sizes and small <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Effect_size"effect sizes.

When you have data that exhibits a huge effect size, it is disingenuous to carp that no double blind testing was involved.

Sommer
Reply to  commieBob
July 28, 2020 9:05 am

There will come a day when we will look back on the standard of refusing to accept anecdotal evidence as a time when soulless people were in command.

Another Ian
Reply to  Sommer
July 28, 2020 2:50 pm

Good anecdotal evidence beats the hell out of junk science from what I;ve seen so far

Tim Gorman
Reply to  steve black
July 28, 2020 9:01 am

The accumulation of personal experience *is* a weight of direct evidence. It can’t be waved away as merely anecdotal. 350 samples is not insubstantial. You are implying that statistical evidence is the only acceptable type of evidence. That just isn’t true. For literally centuries acupuncture has been classed as voodoo by the medical establishment. Yet over the past 50 years acupuncture has gained significantly in acceptance by Western medicine based on vast personal experience and an accumulation of direct evidence.

Do you believe in acupuncture as an acceptable treatment for pain even though it has no double-blind statistical study proving anything?

Reply to  Tim Gorman
July 28, 2020 3:18 pm

I just search for the placebo needle 😀
(“imagine a needle piercing your left earlap”)

Gerald Machnee
Reply to  steve black
July 28, 2020 9:02 am

**The best trials currently say it doesn’t work.**
What best trials?
Some of those trials are designed to failure.
The successful ones are the ones that give the combination of the drugs EARLY.
Some of the failures used only HCQ.
Fauci & co do not want to see it wok if it makes Trump look good.
Remdesivir has been shown to affect the liver, it is much more expensive and some of the top drug people have invested in it.

Charles Elllison
Reply to  Gerald Machnee
July 29, 2020 4:06 pm

You are a loser. Another attacker of character who is excessively ignorant. Be very careful of your accusations, they may happen to you.

Charles Ellison
Reply to  Gerald Machnee
July 29, 2020 4:09 pm

There was no investment in Rendesivir. It was an orphan drug. Gilda’s got it for nothing.

2hotel9
Reply to  Charles Ellison
July 29, 2020 5:29 pm

It has been publicly announced to be $3000 or more per dose, and a treatment sched lists 30 or more doses. Yea, no one gonna make money off that failed Ebola treatment.

Gordon A. Dressler
Reply to  steve black
July 28, 2020 9:45 am

steve black, how can you expect to be taken seriously when you post a statement like “The only way to know for sure whether HCQ is effective for covid is to conduct careful trials.”?

Do you really discount the PRACTICAL EXPERIENCE of working physicians that HCQ (in combination with zinc and azithromycin) is effective, just because “careful trails” (conveniently left undefined by you) have not been conducted? Seriously???

steve black
Reply to  Gordon A. Dressler
July 29, 2020 12:00 pm

Since many physicians also report the drug doesn’t work, which group is right? “Practical experience” is clearly not the same for all and the point of proper trials is to produce trustworthy evidence that does tell us which group is right.

If you can’t show why the practical experience of these particular doctors is better than the doctors who disagree with them, then you have no argument at all.

Charles Ellison
Reply to  steve black
July 29, 2020 4:17 pm

There has been no active physician reporting that HCQ w/AZ and zinc didn’t work. Those reporting failures were the scientific pawns following orders of fraudci and company. When people die from improper medication, what’s it called?

T
Reply to  steve black
July 28, 2020 12:59 pm

How dum are you exactly?
So you mean fake corrupted science weigh more then a doctor’s results of treating 350 people?

Reply to  steve black
July 28, 2020 2:05 pm

I love (i.e., really hate) how people are demanding double blind controlled studies and sky high statistical certainty in randomized controlled trials to get near absolute perfect evidence to justify HCQ, yet these same people maniacally and slavishly accept mass lockdowns and mass masking using simple cloth as gospel, when that very level of evidence is MISSING there. F&@&ing, sub-human, anti-human hypocrits!

William Astley
Reply to  steve black
July 28, 2020 7:50 pm

In reply to ‘steve black’ lots of talk. No links to fake studies? The HCQ cocktail worked in a random test.

So 71% of those in the ‘test’ of the HCQ cocktail randomized study….

… either died or suffered serious organ damage because they did not get the HCQ cocktail treatment.

Is that immoral?

Here is the link to the Michigan study 2541 patients, all covid positive, all at risk patients …

Older than 60 or those with diabetes or those who were obese and so on.

The Michigan results could have been much better, as they waited no less than 48 hours before starting the HCQ cocktail treatment.

2541 patients treated with the HCQ cocktail no heart attacks. 6 Michigan hospitals.

Results: A 71% reduction in deaths and serious covid organ damage for those treated with HCQ cocktail, as compared to no treatment.

https://www.ijidonline.com/article/S1201-9712(20)30534-8/fulltext

Treatment with Hydroxychloroquine, Azithromycin, and Combination in Patients Hospitalized with COVID-19

steve black
Reply to  William Astley
July 29, 2020 12:13 pm

That trial wasn’t neither random nor prospective. And it didn’t lead to a 71% reduction in deaths. And 71% of those not treated didn’t die. And it couldn’t account for many confounders that would skew the sample.

This is why we need to not just quote the results we like but look at the other studies that report different results. And check the methods used so they get high quality, reliable results.

One of the largest and best conducted studies so far tested several drugs including HCQ. They found that dexamethasone worked but HCQ didn’t. See this reference for why small, poorly conducted studies are useless in comparison and what the Recovery trial demonstrated: https://www.sciencemag.org/news/2020/07/one-uk-trial-transforming-covid-19-treatment-why-haven-t-others-delivered-more-results

If you do a badly controlled study on a small scale, random chance alone will frequently give you the result you want. Which is why Dr Emmanuels’s experience is irrelevant to reliable knowledge (in addition to the fact that her data and protocols haven’t been published).

Brian
July 28, 2020 6:57 am

Hmm… who is Congress interviewing today?

It’s time to cancel the Cancel Culture.
And speaking of relevance to the 1st amendment..

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-twitter-trump/trump-administration-petitions-fcc-on-social-media-content-rules-idUSKCN24S2QM

Samuel Saunders McAllister
July 28, 2020 7:16 am

You can see entire video with Dr Stella Emmanuel Physician and the other doctors on http://WWW.BITCHUTE.COM
This is very important as these Doctors are curing their patients and declaring the HYDROXYCHLOROQUINE DRUG a cure and a PREVENTITIVE.against COVID-19. please check it out. President Trump needs to welcome her and these other good doctors who are saving lives to his media press conference urgently.

Tom Abbott
Reply to  Samuel Saunders McAllister
July 28, 2020 3:35 pm

” President Trump needs to welcome her and these other good doctors who are saving lives to his media press conference urgently.”

I didn’t hear it personally, but a reporter just said that Trump was talking about HCQ today.

Trump’s son, Donald Jr. tweeted out the video that is the subject of this article and his Twitter account was promptly frozen, so that might have been why Trump used the forbidden word, or maybe Trump was impressed with the what the doctors said in the video.

I agree, Trump should collect testimonials from all the doctors who have had success treating the Wuhan virus with the HCQ treatment, since he can’t accomodate all of them at the White House, and then choose a representative group of the doctors to hold the public conference, with the comments of the doctors not at the news conference to be made available online.

Hundreds of doctor testimonials to the effectiveness of HCQ. That’s the ticket!

Dr. Seigel, Fox News Medical consultant, claims HCQ saved his 95-year-old father’s life when he got the Wuhan virus, and the HCQ was given to him when he was far along with the disease, not at the start of his infection. It was a last resort. It looks like HCQ can help even the very ill if administered properly. Of course, at some time there is a point of no return, but we don’t know for sure where that is when it comes to HCQ.

I also recall that one of the studies that showed a 50 percent reduction in deaths used HCQ alone, without the antibiotic.

Jack Dale
Reply to  Tom Abbott
July 28, 2020 3:39 pm

You last comment clearly much not be this study.

“‘A total of 1542 patients were randomised to hydroxychloroquine and compared with 3132 patients randomised to usual care alone. There was no significant difference in the primary endpoint of 28-day mortality (25.7% hydroxychloroquine vs. 23.5% usual care; hazard ratio 1.11 [95% confidence interval 0.98-1.26]; p=0.10). There was also no evidence of beneficial effects on hospital stay duration or other outcomes. ”

https://www.recoverytrial.net/news/statement-from-the-chief-investigators-of-the-randomised-evaluation-of-covid-19-therapy-recovery-trial-on-hydroxychloroquine-5-june-2020-no-clinical-benefit-from-use-of-hydroxychloroquine-in-hospitalised-patients-with-covid-19

Scissor
Reply to  Jack Dale
July 28, 2020 6:42 pm

Not used early. Not used with zinc.

Studies appear to have been designed to fail.

Reply to  Jack Dale
July 28, 2020 6:58 pm

The HCQ dosing regimen used in the Recovery trial was 12 tablets during the first 24 hours (800mg initial dose, 800 mg six hours later, 400 mg 6 hrs later, 400 mg 6 hours later), then 400 mg every 12 hours for 9 more days. This is 2.4 grams during the first 24 hours, and a cumulative dose of 9.2 grams over 10 days.

Co-Principal Investigators of the Recovery trial, Drs. Peter Horby and Martin Landray, said they followed the WHO dosing. This is what their trial document says as well, on page 23. Landray also claimed in an interview with Paris Soir that the maximum allowed HCQ dose was “6 or 10 times” the dose used in Recovery, and that he was using the hydroxychloroquine dose that is used for amebic dysentery. However, the accepted use for HCQ in amebiasis is only for a liver abscess and only then in pregnancy, when other drugs cannot be used. That dose is 600 mg per day for 2 days, then 300 mg per day, considerably less than half the Recovery dose. Co-Principal Investigator Peter Horby said that Paris Soir misinterpreted Landray’s comments, but Paris Soir said Landray had confirmed what he told them in an email prior to publication. Landray is a very busy man, too busy, apparently, to look up the proper dose of a drug he gave to over 1500 subjects, who were randomized to the treatment and had no say in the matter.

William Astley
Reply to  Jack Dale
July 28, 2020 7:22 pm

Or the data is a lie. Medical science is absolutely repeatable or there are criminal acts by some players.

The HCQ cocktail works. It worked in Michigan. 71% reduction in deaths or serious organ damage as compared to untreated patients.

Evidence based. What option is the best for Americans? Odd that Medical science appears to be not repeatable. This is criminal.

he Michigan results could have been much better, as they waited no less than 48 hours before starting the HCQ cocktail treatment.

2541 patients treated with the HCQ cocktail no heart attacks. 6 Michigan hospitals.

https://www.ijidonline.com/article/S1201-9712(20)30534-8/fulltext

Treatment with Hydroxychloroquine, Azithromycin, and Combination in Patients Hospitalized with COVID-19

Results
Of 2,541 patients, with a median total hospitalization time of 6 days (IQR: 4-10 days), median age was 64 years (IQR:53-76 years), 51% male, 56% African American, with median time to follow-up of 28.5 days (IQR:3-53).

Lancet study which alleged HCQ is not effective against covid and kills people which CNN quoted on and on and on, was been removed.

Drew45.8
Reply to  Tom Abbott
July 28, 2020 8:12 pm

Funny that you should mention Dr Siegel, who was on Tucker tonight saying that this bunch of White Coat doctors was “using last week’s science”, while “this week’s science” is showing that HCQ doesn’t work. Yet Dr. Siegel himself was using the FDA’s HCQ EUA paradigm, canceled by the FDA itself more than 5 weeks ago, which limited the medicine to hospitalized patients who weren’t in clinical studies. So Siegel ran with the status quo, HCQ for the hospitalized severely ill, ignoring that the drug works best when used early. Which has been known for ages by everyone. And Tucker didn’t say a thing, nor ask which study he was talking about, or ask about zinc, vitamin D, or dosing levels in these studies, when Tucker himself has gone off at length on those very topics. He let Dr Siegel impugn these White Coat doctors with misdirection. Boo hiss.

2hotel9
Reply to  Tom Abbott
July 29, 2020 7:17 am

“collect testimonials from all the doctors” And patients. Should not be difficult to have them come forward, flood the zone with so many targets the leftists start attacking each other out of frustration.

Terry Bixler
July 28, 2020 7:26 am

So Twitter is banning the video as well.
https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/news/twitter-partially-suspends-donald-trump-jr-for-sharing-hydroxychloroquine-video

So social media must have a bunch of expert doctors reviewing treatments, NOT A CHANCE! Political action to harm patients by hiding information.

Reply to  Terry Bixler
July 28, 2020 9:42 am

Their standard is “anything that contradicts the word of WHO – i.e., the Chinese Communist Party.”

I would dearly love to see them prosecuted as unregistered foreign agents. Complete with highly publicized dawn raids by SWAT teams in MRAPs, a la Roger Stone.

Doug Huffman
July 28, 2020 7:27 am

at VIMEO

Carl Friis-Hansen
Reply to  Doug Huffman
July 28, 2020 8:07 am

I searched, but could not find it.
If I upload it to my Vimeo account, does it get closed then?

P.S.: I have it on my hard disk.

Marilyn Reed
July 28, 2020 7:33 am

The last thing Facebook, YouTube, Twitter, MSM and any Liberal wants is to have a Black, conservative, legal immigrant, professional woman speak the truth about this safe drug that could save lives. They are taking these videos down everywhere.

Alan M
July 28, 2020 7:34 am

The Key to Defeating COVID-19 Already Exists. We Need to Start Using It | Opinion
HARVEY A. RISCH, MD, PHD , PROFESSOR OF EPIDEMIOLOGY, YALE SCHOOL OF PUBLIC HEALTH
ON 7/23/20 AT 7:00 AM EDT

This is an article in Newsweek from a weighty source. It might help break down the stone wall against Trump-endorsed effective treatments.

July 28, 2020 7:38 am

Dr. Stella may not be the post anyone who wants to be credible should be hitching their horse to.

https://www.thedailybeast.com/stella-immanuel-trumps-new-covid-doctor-believes-in-alien-dna-demon-sperm-and-hydroxychloroquine

Bruce Cobb
Reply to  Gord
July 28, 2020 8:00 am

Ad hominem much?

Henry Pool
Reply to  Gord
July 28, 2020 8:30 am

+1 Gord

icisil
Reply to  Gord
July 28, 2020 8:46 am

I’d rather be treated by a whack-job who knows how to heal people than a “respectable” doctor who is unable to think outside of protocols.

Reply to  icisil
July 28, 2020 8:58 am

icisil

Said by a doctor
“I was never one for protocols as they end up tablets of stone.”

old engineer
Reply to  Philip Mulholland
July 28, 2020 12:48 pm

It occurred to me the other day exactly what medical protocols are for. They are the “CYA” to keep doctors from being sued.

“Dr. X your patient died.” “Yes, but I followed the protocol to the letter.”

GrayCat
Reply to  Gord
July 28, 2020 9:12 am

So . . . because someone has other, fanciful beliefs, means, ipso facto, that a witnessed, true belief in scientific facts she demonstrates positively every day must be suspect?

How about the fact that every patient of hers — and the rest of the doctors there to testify to this — demonstrating early symptoms of COVID-19 who was given HCQ and zinc did not die, did not even continue on ill? That’s quantifiable. Anyone bothering to look into those facts? There is testing for COVID-19 antibodies and at least temporary serum immunity, isn’t there?

Because someone may believe in aliens delivering groceries to his/her local grocery store every night means her/his belief that he/she can go to that grocery store every day and buy whatever she/he wants, factually, demonstrably, every day, that the groceries she/he buys are really only his/her imagination, and that other people who also do that, and witness him/her do it, are not to be believed?

Is everything unconventional everyone believes in one degree or another always wrong, false, and therefore should not be trusted? Doesn’t everyone hold some beliefs regarded by some others as factually incorrect, fanciful, even preposterous? Does that cancel out factual demonstrations and practices with quantifiable results?

How did the practice of medicine and science ever get started in the first place, if unconventional beliefs should cancel out all other demonstrable, quantifiable facts?

It’s neither here nor there what ELSE any of these doctors believe. What matters is the demonstrated facts of what they are saying and doing regarding COVID-19 and HCQ with zinc, and the living results of that.

Reply to  GrayCat
July 28, 2020 9:50 am

“because someone has other, fanciful beliefs, means…”

“How about the fact that every patient of hers — and the rest of the doctors there to testify to this — demonstrating early symptoms of COVID-19 who was given HCQ and zinc did not die, did not even continue on ill?”

Your only knowledge of that “fact” comes from someone who has those “other fanciful beliefs”.

Whatever happened to scepticism?

Reply to  Nick Stokes
July 28, 2020 11:12 am

A) She wasn’t alone.
B) Ad Hominem is a proxy for well done work.

GrayCat
Reply to  Nick Stokes
July 28, 2020 12:31 pm

If you would please re-read what I wrote, you’d see I DO advocate looking at the records of those patients.

And, the fact is, regardless of her particular other beliefs, she’s giving her testimony among how many others who testify to the same thing, without her particular beliefs?

All of that should count. All of that is verifiable facts and evidence.

Mike Takacs
Reply to  Nick Stokes
July 28, 2020 2:10 pm

Nick – my father-in-law is Dr Ananda Prasad (google him) the worlds foremost expert on zinc. He is involved in the study in Detroit using the hydrochloroquine with zinc protocol. When started early enough there is essentially zero mortality and statistically significant improved outcomes even in very sick patients. The truth will eventually come out but since no one gets rich with this protocol it is not being touted. He is 92 and cured both himself and his wife at home – the key is zinc. Hydrocloroquine alone has only a marginal effect.

Joel Snider
Reply to  Mike Takacs
July 28, 2020 3:26 pm

There you go, Nick – I’d say you got your answer.

Nicholas McGinley
Reply to  Mike Takacs
July 29, 2020 6:36 am

The world’s foremost expert on zinc?
That is an extraordinary claim.
Got any extraordinary evidence?
Michael Mann claims to be the world’s foremost expert on tree rings.

And when is early enough?
Studies that started HCQ and zinc as a overexposure prophylaxis show no benefit.e
Those are double blind and placebo controlled.

Claims of 100% efficacy are not backed up with any evidence.
The ones who have made such claims in the past have been exposed as liars.

Nicholas McGinley
Reply to  Mike Takacs
July 29, 2020 7:25 am

That should be pre exposure prophylaxis.
Dang autocorrect