Yeah, that’s gonna work

By Bruno Waterfield, Brussels 4:16PM BST 28 Mar 2011

The European Commission on Monday unveiled a “single European transport area” aimed at enforcing “a profound shift in transport patterns for passengers” by 2050.

The plan also envisages an end to cheap holiday flights from Britain to southern Europe with a target that over 50 per cent of all journeys above 186 miles should be by rail.

Top of the EU’s list to cut climate change emissions is a target of “zero” for the number of petrol and diesel-driven cars and lorries in the EU’s future cities.

Siim Kallas, the EU transport commission, insisted that Brussels directives and new taxation of fuel would be used to force people out of their cars and onto “alternative” means of transport.

“That means no more conventionally fuelled cars in our city centres,” he said. “Action will follow, legislation, real action to change behaviour.”

The Association of British Drivers rejected the proposal to ban cars as economically disastrous and as a “crazy” restriction on mobility.

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Gee, ya think? And the greens/labor wonder why they just got booted out of power in Australia and why the American public no longer gives a rodents posterior about global warming.

I think it will the EU that’s banned by 2050, not the automobile. Why? The automobile actually provides a useful function for people.

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Here’s the plan:

A new European transport plan aims to increase mobility and further integrate the EU’s transport networks – while reducing greenhouse gas emissions and the bloc’s dependence on imported oil.

Measures to encourage major infrastructure investments, change the way freight moves and people travel would boost economic competitiveness and create jobs.

The plan – with goals to be met by 2050 – focuses on travel within cities and between cities, and on long distance journeys. It includes calls for:

  • cities to completely phase out petrol cars
  • shifting to rail or water 50% of all passenger and freight road transport currently making intercity journeys of more than 300km
  • airlines to increase their use of sustainable low-carbon fuels to 40%
  • shipping to cut 40% off its carbon emissions.

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UPDATE: Per my comment above:

I think it will the EU that’s banned by 2050, not the automobile. Why? The automobile actually provides a useful function for people.

It seems to mirror the thinking of many:

A MASSIVE wave of public support was last night surging behind the Daily Express’s crusade to liberate Britain from the stranglehold of Brussels.

An exclusive poll conducted on the first day of our crusade showed an astonishing 99 per cent of people agree we should quit the European Union.

In an indication of the strength of public feeling on the issue, the poll saw the biggest ever response to a Daily Express phone survey, with tens of thousands of people swamping our switchboards.

Read more and sign the petition: http://www.express.co.uk/posts/view/213821/21382199-of-you-say-Get-us-out-of-Europe#ixzz1HztMDhJN

h/t to Fred Berple for the update

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204 thoughts on “Yeah, that’s gonna work

  1. I don’t think this is going to work so well. And were are they going to get all of those horses that they will need? That and the cities are bigger than can easily be supported by horse transport.

  2. Comrades!

    Behold the many villages and towns being constructed as we speak.

    We will call them the Потёмкинские деревни.

    Sincerely, Grigory Potemkin.

  3. Ah, I’m so excited to see next year’s electric car models, especially the ones powered by rainbows and unicorns.

    Seriously, the mere thought that ANYONE in this world thinks that this sounds like a good idea is frightening. Next up: banning breathing in public places!

  4. Harrods, Fortnum and Mason, and other posh stores will have to move out to the suburbs. I can’t imaging wealthy elderly Ladies riding public transport and walking to Harrods. And how will they get their packages home? Not going to be good for downtown business. Maybe horse drawn carriages? And how about the sick getting to their docs? Musicians? How about catching public transport with a ‘cello or a bass viol and a case of music? Maybe that will be enough to start the revolt against the EU!

  5. Arabian horses instead of Arabian oil.
    After a few years they could even bring back the plague, well manured streets and cold, cold winters. It’ll be just like a Dickens novel, like living in a Christmas card.
    The old hand-pump fire trucks, the whiskey wagons, the street corner bobbies walking around armed with whistles, steam engines to Southampton to catch the liner over to the Americas.
    Feed the birds, tupence a bag…
    It will be wonderful

  6. So if you want to get from point A to point B, the government has to allow it or you have to walk. No going where you want, when you want. You go where the train goes, when the train goes. So once a train departs City A, it is now a “route assisted target” and you know exactly where each individual who got on the train is. No buzzing off for an unaccounted for side trip.

    My guess is what they really mean is that the “masses” will not be allowed to have cars. The ruling elite will likely keep theirs. I doubt you would see anyone “important” milling around rubbing elbows with the riffraff.

  7. Currently the way our Glorious Leaders are attempting to enact these ludicrous EU Targets is by stealth, via the local Town Hall who have powers to raise and implement local town and city “congestion” charges, e.g. London City , Durham, Oxford. But there are gleams of sense in all the for of EU madness where the majority of UK Councils are putting said “rules” to the people in referenda and are getting a resounding “NO!” back from the populace.

    Democracy in action. Australian Labor seeing it in Real Time. ;->

    who’s next…..?

  8. All those objecting to the proposed High Speed 2 rail link between London and Birmingham have just lost the battle before the hearings even start. I wonder if they know that the result has already been mandated by the Eurocrats.

    Finally, a stupid rule that will affect the average-man-in-the-street and hopefully mobilize the population to see this sham for what it is.

  9. And where pray tell will the funds for the additional infratructure come from? After we spend it on useless windmills and other equally useless power sources and people are unemployed because all the jobs have gone to Chindia what will be left? A Europe and Gillard’s Australia will be using hose and carts just like the old days. Can we put the pollies who led us to this in the stocks just like the old days too?

  10. First we have the UK declaring to the citizens that they should not assume that power will always be available in the future.

    Then we have Germany’s knee-jerk reaction to the accident in Fukushima, declaring that they will dismantle their nuclear power plants, leaving everyone to rely upon wind and solar power, like the Brits.

    Now we have this declaration from from the EU. I’m sure all of the lazy overpaid bureaucrats will continue flying first class, staying at 5 star hotels and enjoying fine food and premier cru bordeaux, but all of the regular people can take the train.

    This will be a good test for the people of Europe. Are you sheep or men? If you’re men, then throw these lunatics out of office now before they ruin your lives.

  11. This kind of madness was well depicted in Paul Tabori’s book of the 50s, “The Natural Science of Stupidity”, were he tells about sheer idiots in the British and American bureaucracies, as the war amputee that in 1943 was allowed an extra ration of soap in London –but had to check every week with the official for showing he had’nt grow a leg!

    Or the guy who worked in the Ministry of Defense and asked for extra gasoline coupons because the train to London passing by his city near London would arrive too late for him to punch his card on time at the job. He was given just half the coupons asked with the final ruling: “You will come to London in your car, but you must return home by train.”

  12. The EU does not have the power to enforce unpopular laws in practice. To pass the laws the officials, national governments, and the directly elected MEP have to support it. Then in practice the people or elected national governments can just not execute it in practice. The EU is just too close to various countries seeding from the union for it be heavy handed. For example the UK has increasing strong border controls – see Eborders, and various countries has retained visa/work permit requirements for some other EU countries’s nationals. If you want to see athe EU fudging to avoid confrontation look at personnally importing cigarettes in to the UK for your own use.

  13. How about a “high speed rail” system that uses individual vehicles rather than long trains of cars? You have one track in one direction, one track in the other direction. You want to go somewhere, you go to the station, hop into the next available “pod” on the track in the direction in which you want to go, and it takes off down the rails at 200+ MPH. Want to get off at the next station? Push a button and off you go to the station siding and the car waits for someone else needing a ride down the line. Instead of having these large trains, have “caravans” of individual vehicles, electric powered of course, but with individuals themselves deciding where they will stop or if they will take a branch off the track to get onto a different track. People can then go where they please, when they please and you only have as many pods on the road as needed to actually move people around. No hauling of mostly empty cars around all day.

  14. Actually, the vision of only electric cars in inner cities doesn’t disturb me that much (Americans should remember that there are no European cities that are anything like LA ;)). I’m much more worried about “low-carbon sustainable fuels in aviation” which I guess means that they’re going to force airlines to burn more food…

  15. The EU has pEUtrid ideas. The UK must ignore any EU directive [France and Germany have been for years] and disengage from the EU as soon as David Cameron has the guts to allow us a referendum on the subject.

  16. Ok, petrol and diesel is bad, so lets have cars that get their energy from the power grid. Brilliant idea, however despite the well known foibles of the electric car there’s a huge problem here.

    Coal, Gas and Nuclear is apparently bad too. Where are we supposed to get all this energy to run these cars as well as the rest of the country runs on? Power need will be greater in 40 years. Do they really think they can supply enough electricity for everything from bloody wind power?

    I suspect this is their way of making sure energy is a lot more expensive than it need be. All them rich Al Gore and EU beurocrat types will be able to afford it, but what about the common man?

    They keep going on about our children and granchildren lives in their AGW propaganda, but it looks like they’re the ones threatning next generations’ futures.

  17. This is normal fare from our rulers in the EU. Worse is to come.

    If we had a vote on this (which won’t happen) the vast majority of UK citizens would vote leave the EU immediately.

    We don’t need their single currency or their overbearing, undemocratic political institutions.

    We want to return to the days when we use to trade mostly with the English speaking world, with which we have far more in common.

  18. I wonder how long it will take all those 20-something activists to work out that it is their generation they are shafting – it is them who will have to walk to the city or queue interminably if they’re lucky enough to live near a rail link when they are 50-something years old. Those of us closer to 50 now won’t want to drive our car into the city by 2050.

  19. This kind of idiot thinking is just the leg-up America needs to scoot ahead of the global pack. I can see hordes of flat-footed Brits late to work, massaging bunions and reaching for the Ben-Gay after hiking half way across London to get to work at the local government office while the Yanks, seizing the opportunity, dance past this nonsense and grab the ring. How do we get Oz to buy into this kind of stupid without tipping our hand? We should probably also hang up a sign: “Brits and other Euro thinking losers need not apply”.

    The motto, as always: ‘We’re the government – we’re here to help!

    I wonder if I’ll live long enough to witness an EU declaration of independence and a grass roots recovery of their lost liberty. I hope the Chinese are benevolent overlords and tolerant of Sharia law else there will never be peace. Remember when the biggest problem they faced was just a thousand year Reich? Life seemed so simple, then. Now it seems almost preferable.

  20. This being forced upon the UK by their EU masters, I don’t think the UK public will have any of it. But what it does remind me of years ago, in the 80’s, a great British TV show call “Not the 9 O’Clock News” was on once a week. There was a skit where an announcer made a comment about the area of rainforrst burnt in the Amazon every year was the size of Belgium, to which the reply was “Why don’t we just burn Belgium?”

    Actually I lived and schooled in Belgium, it was fine apart from the EU.

  21. Yup, meet Siim Kallas, hero of the Soviet Socialist Republic, part of the great Soviet Estonian Socialist Finance Ministry in the glory days of the ’70’s and NOW, WAIT FOR IT, in charge of the EU’s transport system. No, really, you can’t make this up. They aren’t even trying to hide it anymore. THEY’RE ACTUALLY PROUD OF IT AND BOASTING OF IT ON THEIR WEBSITE’S AND THEIR RESUMES.

    EUSSR is no longer a term of abuse, it’s a badge of honor to be worn with PRIDE.

    http://ec.europa.eu/commission_2010-2014/kallas/about/profile/index_en.htm

    http://blogs.telegraph.co.uk/news/nilegardiner/100081610/the-eu%E2%80%99s-tyrannical-transport-plan-will-stifle-economic-growth-and-cost-british-and-european-taxpayers-trillions/

  22. America has already seen this future. Nobody in their right mind works in downtown Houston or downtown Los Angeles. It’s all about satellite office districts and shopping centers. A few US cities have the confined geography necessary to funnel rail traffic to points of interest, but not many. London is already distributed despite the handy rail systems. Paris is growing away from city center with La Defense and the move of the newer museums to the suburbs. In many cases, the best place to be is near the airports.

    This is likely the biggest boon to the law of unintended consequences ever conceived by any politician. Ban away. Be prepared for the rail systems to fall into disrepair for lack of riders.

  23. I suggest that this idea needs a pilot study to thrash out the detail prior to implementation. How about Brussels take the lead to ban all carbon sourced forms of transport by 2020, no chauferred limousines, no short haul flights and all EU ministers to have reduced their personal carbon budget by 60%. That is if they would like to lead by example!

  24. If one believes the folks that hang out at the Oildrum ( http://www.theoildrum.com ), no government intervention will be needed. Very high petroleum costs caused by running out of cheap oil will do all the things the EU desires and more. While I think TOD is a bit single minded and often premature, I expect they are basically correct on this. (They have outstanding technical articles on various aspects of energy production and use BTW)

  25. Cities to phase out petrol cars. Problem is that when you make it impossible for the productive people to get to and from their jobs, customers, suppliers, entertainment, restaurants… They (and the tourists too) just go somewhere else. Pretty soon all you’ve got left is a city emptied of productive people and businesses and “urban decay” left behind. Let the hand wringing begin. How can we solve urban decay and renew our failed cities? I know! Relax tax laws, allows cars back in, attract some businesses to build here and bring jobs with them…

    And can someone tell me what kind of jet fuel is “low carbon”? and renewable to boot?

  26. As far as we Brits are concerned, we, the people of Britain have never signed up for this quango, and so the EU is an unconstitutional and therefore illegal union.

    So no British Jury will ever convict under these stupid rules.

    Which is why the EU’s next target for “reform” is to “harmonise” courts across Europe doing away with what I think it was Jefferson said: “I think of no other institution other than a jury by which a government can be held to its constitution”. (From memory)

  27. David Cameron keeps telling us he has his reasons for keeping the UK in the EU so he isn’t going to give us the chance to decide the issue for ourselves. When I see proposals like this I have to question not only his competence as a Prime Minister but also his sanity.

  28. Yeah, no more lorries in out cities.

    No more food suppliers in cities, no more DHL, UPS and other suppliers in the cities.

    I gonna love that thoughts, when EU ar*es cry for their daily breakfast eggs, while there is none available.

    EU is clearly devil’s work and absolutely hyperfluid.
    The EU should be disbanded… NOW.

  29. Gotta love these pointy-headed bureaucratic nincompoops: enthralled with their own superior intelligence. The brainiacs in Berkeley concocted a traffic management scheme decades ago that blocks most streets in an attempt to funnel all traffic to major thoroughfares; what they created are huge labyrinths that force angry motorists to wander all over town trying to find the way out – oh bytheway…wasting time, money, serenity – and FUEL, thereby causing MORE pollution than necessary. This type of thinker finds the reliable laws of unintended consequences to be ever beyond their grasps.

  30. “John Tofflemire says:
    March 28, 2011 at 10:47 pm

    “Backwards to the future . . .”

    I wish. Backwards to a time when progress was not a dirty word, when we had supersonic passenger jets, fewer restrictive laws and lower overall taxes? Hell yeah!

    I guess now we are going future to the backwards!

  31. Russell says:
    March 28, 2011 at 11:43 pm
    I wonder how long it will take all those 20-something activists to work out that it is their generation they are shafting

    20-something? Isn’t it rather 60-something? I.e. all those “68-ers” whose value set and political attitudes are still deeply rooted in the Malthusian miserable world view of the early seventies? As more of a “gen x” I used to admire them and share their views – but fortunately I didn’t share their complete inability to change.

  32. Why does Brussels have some of the finest restaurants in the world? Because we pay for our Euro MPs to dine in utter luxury while they work out how to claim expenses for their ‘work’ they do on our behalf!

  33. Commie scumbags. Vote UKIP. Watch Nigel Farage on youtube as he demolishes the commie scumbags.

  34. I did hear that traffic in London moved faster when it was horsedrawn at the turn of the last century but one so there is a sense that the wheel has turned a full circle.
    However, the emissions from horse digestion, faeces as well as the coal fired heating systems can’t have been markedly different in terms of contribution to climate change to what they are today.
    Even when you add it all up, I think more hot air comes from Brussels…….

  35. I suspect that I may be preaching to the converted here, but if you live in the UK, then please sign the pledge to only vote for a candidate which promises to grant a referendum on EU membership.

    This is the only way we can peaceably extract ourselves from this EU climate fascism. We have up to four years to recruit as many people as possible to this cause. The cause being democratic accountability and self-determination. Please tell your friends and family about this too.

    http://www.peoplespledge.org/

  36. Maybe the politicians can show us how it will be done, let them park their cars at the city limits and catch public transport to the House of Parliament or whatever you have in your city. The local council could do the same thing. In Brisbane Australia our Mayor introduced a bike hire scheme that no one uses, I suggested the council workers had to use it for a week to get to work. That will show them for backing Campbell Newman who is now trying to run Queensland.

  37. Roger: “OK lets go to Bill in the Rabobank Chopper for a traffic report.”

    Bill: “All roads leading into London are clear at the moment, there is only some pushbikes slowly making their way in. Public transport is at a standstill but Roads Management Authority said they will be up and running as soon as the wind starts blowing. This has been another traffic report thanks to Rabobank, your green bank with the cheapest electricity loans in the market.”

    Roger: “And here is Jenny with the weather report. Jenny can we expect the wind to pick up so the windmills can start cranking up the power supply?”

    Jenny: “Thanks Mike, well the Met Office says there is a 30% chance that the wind will pick up, a 30% chance that it will die down further still and a 40% chance of the status quo for much of the day.”

    Roger: “Thanks Jenny. On the economic front, the Chancellor of the Exchequer said today that the british Economy had taken a further hit with growth expected to shrink by a further 1.5% for the quarter and unemployment up to 19%. He said though the tiger economies of China and India were doing very very well, Britain is unable to trade with these monster economies because we have nothing to sell them and no money to buy anything from them.”

    “On a bright note, the endangered yellow bellied three toed mouse, a creature about the size of a penny, has been saved with the announcement that the 5 billion euro gas fired power plant has been axed by the developers Xiang Zi Power. Minister for the environment Redman Myass said this was a wonderful example of Britain leading the world in environmental management. “This has been a win for everybody” said Myass.”

  38. Not for nothing is the EU becoming known as the Fourth Reich.

    Oh, and Brian Johnson uk (The UK must … disengage from the EU as soon as David Cameron has the guts to allow us a referendum on the subject), that’ll be no time soon then. The moron is as closely wedded to the concept of EU superiority over every aspect of British life as any EU Commissioner. With every major party firmly captivated by the EU (and CAGW) we have little choice over most aspects of our lives nowadays.

  39. “The plan also envisages an end to cheap holiday flights from Britain to southern Europe”

    You’re all forgetting climate change, because by 2050 we’ll be living in a tropical, balmy (barmy) paradise and won’t need such flights. Our coral reefs will be florishing, the champagne region of Ilkley moor will be world famous, Britain will be a net exporter of bananas and the streets of London will be paved with solar cells which will power our electric personal transportation units and mag lev shoes.

    Balmy and bananas will be our national slogan.

  40. Interesting.

    How high do they plan to raise the price of gas? $37.50 per gallon?

    What are they trying to do, turn the movie, Atlas Shrugged-Part I into a documentary even before its release in the U.S. on April 15?

  41. If I remember correctly I read somewhere that in many European countries serfs were not allowed to travel outside the area where they lived and worked without permission from the local authorities. (Someone please correct me if I’m wrong).

    It looks as if the EU (or the EUSSR as some people say it should be called) want to reintroduce serfdom.

  42. Some of my friends give me funny looks when I start talking about the great wars that were eventually won without firing a shot; Napolean fell short, thanks in large part to the brilliant soldiering of the Duke of Wellington, in imposing his ‘Systeme Napoleanique’ on the UK, the Low Countries and the Iberian Peninsula, but the EU is now carrying out the fulfilment of Napolean’s visions. The climate cancelled his designs on Russia.
    The fall of the Berlin Wall was supposed to lead to freedom and democracy for East Europeans; instead, we have former Soviet-era aparatchiks inflicting their totilatarian forms of social control on the Western European nations.
    At least the Australians in New South Wales have cried ‘enough!’ and dumped the ALP and its mad Marxist blueprint for impoverishment and social control disguised as environmentalism in the recent elections there. Now all we need is for the citizens of the UK to revolt and throw off the yoke of the EU, Aussie style.

  43. Don’t Panic Captain Mainwaring !

    The UK government has already said this won’t fly. The chances of getting the French to do this are significantly worse than zero. And I’m sure they won’t be alone. Gallic shrug is the order of the day.

  44. Crosspatch: “How about a “high speed rail” system that uses individual vehicles rather than long trains of cars? ”
    ——————–

    I see where you are coming from on this and it is an improvement over long trains, but it by no means replaces the convenience of the motor car.

    I know when I get in my car that it will not have vomit, beer cans, used condoms or any other waste in it before I get in. I know that it will not have been occupied minutes earlier by someone with an easily communicable infections disease. I know that I can get to my car far sooner than I could get to one of these pods, and I know that I would be far more likely to be able to park my car closer to my intended destination than I could one of these pods.

    Banning petrol cars from cities would require me to have two cars and an extra garage outside the city. This is less green than just owning one petrol car.

    I would not consider owning an electric car, until they are a cheap as a petrol to buy, have a range comparable to a petrol from one charge, and can be charged up in an equivalent amount of time as it takes to fill a petrol tank and when batteries are available and cheap.

    As I understand it, it is currently far cheaper to charge an electric car than pay petrol for the equivalent mileage. However this does not take into account the astronomical cost of replacing all the batteries every two or three years. This means that owning an electric is considerably more costly than a petrol at the moment.

    There currently is no alternative to running a petrol/diesel/natural gas/LPG car at the moment. I would be delighted if a breakthrough could be made with Hydrogen powered cars, and there are some fascinating and exciting things happening in that field. I just hope that innovations in that area are allowed to continue and are not snubbed out by battery car fanatics.

    Cella Energy are pioneering a new hydrogen based fuel which is cheap, environmentally friendly and does not require expensive hydrocarbon use to extract the hydrogen. This artificial petrol consists of tiny nano-beads which contain the hydrogen and so can be poured like conventional petrol and used in conventional petrol engines with a small modification. They could produce this fuel for 19p per litre (approximately 90 cents a gallon).

    I would rate this kind of breakthrough as being a far more exciting development of green energy than any technological development of batteries.

    This would allow petrol-heads to keep enjoying the roar of a throaty V12, or the scream of a V6 as they drive, whilst being more green than any Prius driver!

  45. I’m pretty sure the total ban will actually be either postponed, modified or both. There might for example be a penalty for driving a gas/diesel car in certain areas.

    There is about zero possibility of this happening if we have failed to make electric cars a majority by that time. I see this as an promise to car manufacturers that there will be a big market for “greener” products.

    Do not like the totalitarian way of pushing the message though.

  46. By the way EU will be forgotten by 2050, I give it a few more years and then the financial catastrophes on the southern side of the mountain ranges is in full swing, resulting in a northern and more loose european union.

  47. Siim Kallas, the EU transport commission, insisted that Brussels directives and new taxation of fuel would be used to force people out of their cars

    That is the real story. They will make us so poor that we won’t be able to drive a car, not even to buy one. Only those in power, the masters. It’s like going back to the Middle Ages. But I don’t think we have to wait for so long to see this happen. My calculations are 1 or 2 years
    and
    Holidays
    don’t even think about it.

    It is all about power (control) You remember the movie ‘Soylent Green ‘ with Charlton Heston? That is our future!!

    Let us use the “free” internet as long as we can to make this not happen.

  48. If you are worried about GHG’s then horses are not a great idea, they fart a lot.
    Victorian London was under so much horse crap that when, eventually, the motor car came along people cheered because it meant that the horse crap would go.

    This EU idea is typical of the socialist mantra that comes from Brussels. Ill thought out prognostications with unknown consequences which will be worse that the imagined disease. Another system to control the so called voters ( if a vote comes out ‘wrong’ then we will vote again until we get the result we want!)!

  49. I hope this will signal the beginning of the end for this dictatorship, but I doubt it. I can remember an era when so many politicians were so incompetent and stupid [when was that?]. They have become so used to not being challenged that they feel they can do whatever they wish.

  50. Rail? In Britain?

    British trains are a national disgrace. The regular fares are outrageous, and the “cheap tickets” are a sham (near impossible to get one when you actually need it.) The policies are draconian, and they’ll happily charge tourists huge penalties for not reading the fine print on the ticket re. which times of day the ticket is invalid, or that you have to present the useless “seat booking stub,” even if there’s no actual seat, otherwise your actual ticket, which has everything printed on it, becomes invalidated, and they charge you full price, which is often a hundred quid or more. If you are a tourist, DO NOT USE UK TRAINS. They don’t deserve your business. Frankly, just don’t come to the UK, period. And did I mention that the outrageous prices are actually already subsidised by the government???

    There are long term systemic problems with our trains and it has only been getting more and more expensive. There are already problems with lack of capacity and overcrowding, and the idea that they can just legislate us into relying on the trains is absurd — the existing capacity shortfall won’t be met for a decade, as we await new rolling stock, so god knows when it’ll be increased any further.

    Let them legislate that all companies have to allow office staff to work from home over fast broadband. I see no other way to “reduce” travel.

  51. “And can someone tell me what kind of jet fuel is “low carbon”? and renewable to boot?”

    According to Obama natural gas is a renewable. He said so in hiw speech about Libya. How about that for knowledge. I didn’t know that!!

  52. Wucash says:
    March 28, 2011 at 11:34 pm
    Ok, petrol and diesel is bad, so lets have cars that get their energy from the power grid. Brilliant idea, however despite the well known foibles of the electric car there’s a huge problem here.

    Coal, Gas and Nuclear is apparently bad too. Where are we supposed to get all this energy to run these cars as well as the rest of the country runs on? Power need will be greater in 40 years. Do they really think they can supply enough electricity for everything from bloody wind power?

    I suspect this is their way of making sure energy is a lot more expensive than it need be. All them rich Al Gore and EU beurocrat types will be able to afford it, but what about the common man?

    They keep going on about our children and granchildren lives in their AGW propaganda, but it looks like they’re the ones threatning next generations’ futures.

    —————–

    You’ve got to bare in mind that in 40 years time there won’t be much oil left so we really have little choice on the matter anyway.

    They’ll still be gas for a few more decades after that though and plenty of coal to put into power stations.

  53. It’s 1910.
    Who in 1910 would have predicted WWI let alone WWII
    I look in old books for future predictions e.g. 1930’s Popular Mechanics had a future prediction section. None of it ever came to fruition.
    The EURO currency will be lucky to survive in the next couple of years let alone the E.U. Commission.

  54. It kind of shows how far detached from reality these people have become. I suppose that is what happens when the people making the laws no longer have electoral oversight. The middle of a recession with huge risks still left in the financial centres and their most pressing priority? Uncosted and untested ways of reducing a tiny proportion of the co2 emissions – without any mechanism of ensuring it does actually reduce co2 emissions.

  55. EU to ban all cars from cities by 2050! Yeah, they lived through the dark ages for hundreds of years in the muck and used horses and buggies and wagons, guess they are going backwards to that. What a bunch of retrograde-humans-acting-on-bad-information setting back human civilization a thousand years.

  56. I think I got this figured.

    First we build enough space ships to transport the entire human populations.
    Then we announce the planet is self destructing because of CAGW.
    The people who agree get on the Red space ships.
    The people who are skeptical get on the Blue space ships.
    As the Red space ships blast off to safety, they might look our a part hole and notice all the people filing out of the Blue space ships and waving goodbye whilst laughing themselves silly.

    Reply: I’m a little tipsy right now, so I totally understand what “look our a part hole” means. ~ ctm

  57. Apparently the Times of London in 1894 estimated that every street in the city would be nine feet deep in horse manure by 1950.

    So they were only out by 100 years.

  58. As a British citizen all I hope for is a Political Party with the will to take us out of this corrupt union.
    Why the hell we are letting unelected and unaccountable Communists rule our lives is beyond comprehension.
    For [snip] sake their accounts haven’t been signed off for 16 yeas because of all the corrupt dealings, vote UKIP

  59. Volt Aire is right. The Euro is a busted flush – I’d give it another five years tops before Germany pulls the plug and abandons the Southern European states to their respective fates. I wouldn’t give the smaller Benelux countries much of a chance of surviving in the new financial era either, for that matter… Bye-bye EU!

  60. Ah, but of course the inner city habitants cheers for it is much nicer to have above ground railroad system perforating the city streets rather than petrol cars and buss’. The screeching noise is more enjoyable than the occasional honking horn. The iron dust is more healthier than the nasty CO2. And just imagine nobody needing to do their hairs, step outside and get buzzed and fuzzed and really use all that static electricity.

    Not to forget that the rubber particulates from the tires of electrical vehicle is so much more tastier than the rubber particulates from the nasty old petrol machinery.

    Of course, gas powered vehicles will be allowed along side the nice electrical self inflammable hydrogen poppers in these new inner “static electrical” cities.

    Then comes the tax collector to collect extra tax on energy used and spent and most importantly the new tax’s on rare earth metals, because we will need to save the planet and the future generations from rare earth metal scarcity.

    And soon, in a town near you, streets will be filled with hippie communists running around screaming about the new plague of static electricity induced rash’, or what not, and demanding, yet again, the end of civilization, or else . . . they go really really bonkers . . . again!

  61. I refuse to get worked up about a proposal so far ahead into the future that the chances of it coming to pass are virtually nil. The EU (we pray) may not even exist by then.

  62. Rick Bradford says:
    March 28, 2011 at 11:07 pm

    Where do these people get off from constantly telling other people what to do?

    They want to heel the planet.

  63. “Stefan says:
    March 29, 2011 at 2:12 am”

    There was a time when rail in Britain was great, unfortunately Beaching, a politician, came along and ruined it forever.

    Talking about “working from home”. When I worked in the late 80’s early 90’s in the UK I used to run, as part of my job, a “Telecommuting” system (Called “Horatius”)which enabled people to “work from home” simply by connecting standard 1200/2400 baud modems to a VM mainframe virtual “teletype” device among others. It worked very well and enabled one user, who suffered from MS to work and not drive to an office, not to save the planet from deadly CO2 emissions, but simply, he was unsafe to drive because of his MS. I had to set the system up his PC for voice activation.

    Today working from home, or as my leaders like to call it “Desk Free Days”, is a lot easier and so I do, 5 days per week. No travelling, no spending on fuel and can wite off all my expenses aganist tax. And the Ausrtalian ATO is one of our clients.

  64. Train? What train? How come, when we live quite a few miles from the nearest station which is itself several miles on the far side of our nearest small town? There are three buses per day into that town from our village, and only two back out…the bus stop is way down the hill from our house and I am, let us say, somewhat senior! I have never bothered with the free bus pass as those buses do not go where I want to go when I want to go, nor do they come back at suitable times, AND I cannot drag a trolley of heavy shopping up that hill. Great idea, EU. I can’t wait to get rid of the EUSSR. Our distant train ‘service’ is such a hassle that I never even try to use it.

    Some years ago we drove to Reading and took a train up to London. It was a complete nightmare. Endless intrusive announcements; other passengers intruding into one’s personal space (nothing like having someone’s tatty old jeans-clad backside in your face!), tinny over-loud personal ‘music’ systems, a girl deliberately coughing over one, (the expression on the face of the offender giving the game away as to the intended action) despite there being a ‘flu panic at the time, etc., etc. I decided there and then that London could go jump into the sea.

  65. Volt Aire says:
    March 29, 2011 at 1:43 am
    I’m pretty sure the total ban will actually be either postponed, modified or both. There might for example be a penalty for driving a gas/diesel car in certain areas.

    There is about zero possibility of this happening if we have failed to make electric cars a majority by that time. I see this as an promise to car manufacturers that there will be a big market for “greener” products.

    Do not like the totalitarian way of pushing the message though.

    ————–

    There’s about 54 years of oil left from our proven reserves at current rates, so by 2050 there is unlikely to be any left.

    What method of transport will we use when there’s on petrol to put in our cars?

  66. And why ever not? I fail to understand the mind set that refuses to accept and change to established patterns. As someone not wedded to single occupancy large engined metal cans, I say “Go EU” … you get my vote!!!

  67. The year, 2050: The place, Northern Hemesphere, PDREU, Sector:- UK. The time, Gaia Rebirth Season, (I think my grandparents used to call it Springtime in the bad old days) Hello, commrades in Colonia! Greetings, I have saved up my allowances for five months now, & have been given permission by my village commissar to use the interweb thingy & Youface/Facetube! I have an amasing 20 minutes useage allowed before the power grid shuts down for the week, except of course in Downing Street where the mighty powerful diesel generators run constantly with donated fuel from the glorious people to the Beautiful Leader! He promised in his last “What a State we are in” address to combat the rape gangs & murderous drug crazed criminals who roam the towns & countryside in the darkness stealing everything & anything, sadly we are powerless to stop such actions ever since the last person to defend himself with his legally held 12 bore was arrested, imprisoned, & “dissappeared” by the Glorious Forces of State Security, (well he did shoot one of the thieving murderous villains for raping his wife, killing his children, stealing his property, which under UK PC/Socialist laws was a jolly naughty thing to do as the criminal’s family were very upset, shocked, & traumatised about his sad demise, & they would be forced to claim the benefits directly instead of relying on him to claim them! (Apparently he should been have spoken to very firmly, that would do the trick they said!). Anyway, the News, many people were found frozen to death in their homes earlier this year, but official sources said the good thing was that they were slightly fewer than last year, & some of the deaths were attributed to the deadly Fukushima radiation disaster 40 years ago, (which is still circling the Earth, officials say, one of the many reasons we are not allowed out of our hovels very often, had a real treat last week end, my new neighbour has an electric oven & we had a two course hot meal, first in weeks, but he’s lucky, he works for the Beautiful Leader’s minions), but that the sacrifce to save Gaia was worth it as the temperatures were definitely coming down worldwide, & the people were certainly making lots of those……………sacrifices that is! Whoops, time is up, the lights are flickering, speak to you next August when the power comes back on & I have saved enough allowances! PS, I have been offered a chance in a lifetime holiday next year to the far East, where they enjoy free everything, care of the old west!
    :-) Sarc off! Enjoy the interglacial.

  68. It’s all true, alas. You know, I wish, I really, really wish that, just once in a while, the powers that be would do something which does not conform quite so perfectly to the predictions of the more outré conspiratorial sites on the WWW. Meanwhile, all I can say is to ask our friends in the US, Oz, Canada and so on to remember one important thing: the brutes wrecking our society no more represent us than the brutes wrecking your societies represent you.

    More cheery {/sarc} UK news: in today’s Independent we read that the presence at Saturday’s protest of the usual “anarchists” in their balaclavas and police boots just might be used as an excuse to introduce tough new security measures aimed at public rallies ahead of the royal wedding on Apr 29th: expect hasty legislation soon.

    Is there a climate connection in all this? Yes, but unfortunately only to a climate of repression.

  69. I assume the people that thought this up are leading by example as we speak, and have already given up their cars, chauffeaur driven limos. and won’t be flying anywhere ever again … yeah THAT’LL BE RIGHT!!!

  70. For those that love history and living in the past, how the Romans lived will be another amazing EU project. I’d be all for it if the North Africans invade Italy on elephants with Qadsafi leading the way. Almost seems real, somehow.

  71. Daryl M says:
    March 28, 2011 at 11:16 pm
    First we have the UK declaring to the citizens that they should not assume that power will always be available in the future.

    Then we have Germany’s knee-jerk reaction to the accident in Fukushima, declaring that they will dismantle their nuclear power plants, leaving everyone to rely upon wind and solar power, like the Brits.

    Now we have this declaration from from the EU. I’m sure all of the lazy overpaid bureaucrats will continue flying first class, staying at 5 star hotels and enjoying fine food and premier cru bordeaux, but all of the regular people can take the train.

    This will be a good test for the people of Europe. Are you sheep or men? If you’re men, then throw these lunatics out of office now before they ruin your lives.

    Unfortunately, your last point is not possible. The people in the European Commission who run the EU are unelected they are appointed. So they cannot be ‘thrown out of office’. The European Parliament is elected, but powerless to reign in the EC and is full of people there for the expenses and the free travel.

    The best approach would be to insist that these bureaucrats and their staffs and parliamentary members are first to only use 100% electric vehicles in and around towns, they only travel by train between towns and only fly on aircraft that are powered by at least 40% low carbon fuel. In fact this rule should be implemented immediately.

    This may make it difficult for an organization whose entire toothless talking-shop parliament shuttles monthly between EU Parliaments in Brussels and Strasbourg together with wagon-loads of papers.

  72. I think that all you good people are being far too negative and stick in the mud.
    My recommendation is that you should all embrace the change.
    This proposal tops it all – it is real progress.

    Let’s hope good Queen Green-Julia embraces this marvelous plan for us down under.
    It will work so well in Sydney with our excellent train system that must cover at least the central 10% of the metropolis – ok, perhaps 2% might be more realistic.

    My only quibble is – why wait for 2050?
    Do it now – bring it on!
    Yum Yum.

  73. Roy says:
    March 29, 2011 at 1:05 am
    If I remember correctly I read somewhere that in many European countries serfs were not allowed to travel outside the area where they lived and worked without permission from the local authorities. (Someone please correct me if I’m wrong).

    It looks as if the EU (or the EUSSR as some people say it should be called) want to reintroduce serfdom.

    In some places in Europe it is required that if you move into an area after between 10 days and 30 days you are required to report to the local police and identify who you are and where you are staying.
    In Belgium if you move into an apartment the landlord is required to put your name on the apartment post box; the local authorities check these names weekly and any new names are reported to local and national tax authorities.

  74. Oakden Wolf at the top says:
    March 28, 2011 at 10:29 pm

    “To dream, the impossible dream…”

    Oakden,

    I hope folks realize this was not a frivolous comment:

    The Impossible Dream ( The Quest ) is from Man of LaMancha,
    with lyrics by Joe Darion.

    The tune is sung by Don Quixote… who, for a lack of better
    opponents, was occasionally found tilting at windmills.

  75. We shall all be on foot but instead of banging coconuts together like in Python’s Holy Grail we’ll be making engine noises as we walk down the streets of this new paradise.

  76. “Gee, ya think? And the greens/labor wonder why they just got booted out of power in Australia ”

    Anthony; Australia is a democracy; the EU is not. We cannot boot comrade Kallas out of office. This, of course, only means that it will not be an election that puts an end to these schemes, but something else. My personal guess would be eruption of violence in various member states, followed by half-hearted attemps of violent suppression, followed by a mass exodus of entire nations from the stinking cadaver of what was once the EU.

  77. 1DandyTroll says:
    March 29, 2011 at 2:57 am
    “And soon, in a town near you, streets will be filled with hippie communists running around screaming about the new plague of static electricity induced rash’, or what not, and demanding, yet again, the end of civilization, or else . . . they go really really bonkers . . . again!”

    No; the enviros in the EU are paid by the EU itself to protest for even more draconian restrictions of personal freedom – so the EU commission can look benevolent compared to what the enviros want.

  78. Scottish Sceptic says:
    March 29, 2011 at 12:12 am

    “…we, the people of Britain have never signed up for this quango, and so the EU is an unconstitutional and therefore illegal union.”

    It only took the PM and the Monarch to sign the various “Treaties”. It is law all right. Watertight, even if treasonous. Revolution is the only way out but Jeremy Kyle, soap operas and sports programs keep a drugged populace “happy”.

    As to, no more cars in cities – Mercedes, etc will have a “van” out in a jiffy. Looks like a utility vehicle from the outside. Feels just like a luxury limo on the inside. Costs a fortune. Complete with flat panel screens to simulate windows, bulletproofing and a “Return to Vendor” clause in the lease.

  79. stephen richards says:
    March 29, 2011 at 2:16 am

    According to Obama natural gas is a renewable.

    =//=//=//=//=

    But it requires a heavy subsidy for bean farmers.

  80. They wont be happy till we all return to the existence that was the lot of our forefathers, where people didnt travel further than they could walk from the confines of their village

    Makes it a lot easier to implement control too

  81. I would love to see these eurocrats leading by example: getting rid of all their limos; using internet conferencing rather than flying to exotic venues for meetings; flying cattle-class, where the per capita CO2 cost is far less (if there is no alternative to flying); abandoning centralised parliamentary sessions which means dragging thousands of staff and officials hundreds, and in some cases thousands, of miles from their home countries to Brussels.

    Add to this the cost and inconvenience of vastly increased travel times. My experience in the UK is that public transport adds significantly to travel times , compared to car travel, even at peak times. The trouble with the ruling classes is that they are essentially town based. They simply do not understand the problems of public transport travel in rural areas.

  82. By 2050 there won’t be ICE cars in Europe’s cities simply because oil won’t be affordable.

  83. When I was a kid and played with toy trains I enjoyed arranging tracks, switches, and little groups of buildings, loading docks, water towers, etc. Ditto when I played with blocks and designed buildings and hamlets. I was a little king.

    But I put away childish things. Those who don’t hanker after playing toy-soldier and/or dollhouse with humanity. That’s what underlies the dirigiste impulse–infantile power trips.

  84. “I think it will be the EU that’s banned by 2050…” – No way can we wait that long, the damage will be far too great….

  85. EUrotic, adj.
    1. A psychological condition characterized by episodes of complete divorcement from reality;
    2. A strong sexual attraction to political power.

  86. I don’t know, this isn’t a bad idea just for towns. Electric cars will work on shortish journeys, which is what most journeys in towns are.

    So long as there family-friendly access modes for out-of-town folks, this isn’t as mad as it seems you know…….

  87. “Sustainable low carbon fuels” puzzles me, but this looks like my own ignorance. Does that mean fuels in which the molecules’ backbone has less carbon atoms???

  88. I’ve said for years that one of the major reasons why the alarmists are going after air travel is because they want to stop people from going on vacation to resort locations. Leaving the resorts less crowded for them.

  89. I don’t see any problem with this, as by 2050 we’ll all either have personal jet-packs or Star Trek transporters to get to the grocery store and back. ;->

  90. Luís says:
    March 29, 2011 at 5:04 am

    By 2050 there won’t be ICE cars in Europe’s cities simply because oil won’t be affordable.

    Most of the price of petrol in Europe is due to taxes, right? So a doubling in the price of oil won’t double the price of petrol, unless taxes rise proportionately–which they needn’t do.

    Anyway, petrol can be made from coal and natural gas if oil becomes too costly.

  91. Ted Seay says:
    March 29, 2011 at 5:27 am

    EUrotic, adj.
    1. A psychological condition characterized by episodes of complete divorcement from reality;
    2. A strong sexual attraction to political power.

    3. An infantile omnipotence-fantasy.

  92. And how many new cars will be put on the road in China, India, and other developing countries during that period? Will any difference be noticed other than the economic decline of Europe?

    MikeEE

  93. I’m not giving up my Freelander for anyone.With winters growing colder and snowier and the roads where I live (in the sticks) tending to flood there one way I’ll ever use a tiny, low wheel base electric car.

  94. Socialist A Hitler would be proud of the EU. Socialists can recognize one other across centuries. Why do Europeans allow themselves to crawl like this?

    Keep it over there Lord, keep it over there.

  95. Imagine it’s 1911. Imagine the European Governments of the day planning for what their cities would look like in 1950. I’m betting that they wouldn’t have taken into account the possibility that most of their cities were going to be burned to the ground by that time.

    It can happen again.

  96. dp says:
    March 28, 2011 at 11:43 pm
    Remember when the biggest problem they faced was just a thousand year Reich?

    And what, dear dp, do you think this is?

  97. @ crosspatch says:
    March 28, 2011 at 11:33 pm

    How about a “high speed rail” system that uses individual vehicles rather than long trains of cars? You have one track in one direction, one track in the other direction. You want to go somewhere, you go to the station, hop into the next available “pod” on the track in the direction in which you want to go, and it takes off down the rails at 200+ MPH. Want to get off at the next station? Push a button and off you go to the station siding and the car waits for someone else needing a ride down the line. Instead of having these large trains, have “caravans” of individual vehicles, electric powered of course, but with individuals themselves deciding where they will stop or if they will take a branch off the track to get onto a different track. People can then go where they please, when they please and you only have as many pods on the road as needed to actually move people around. No hauling of mostly empty cars around all day.

    You should bone up on logistics and queuing theory.

  98. There are a range of sensible travel options. My main ones in order of my current use are walking, electric cycle, ferry, car, train and air.

    Its horses for courses, naturally I don’t take a plane to travel to the town over the estuary-thats where one of the other options come in according to circumstances (am I in a hurry, do I need to carry anything, what’s the weather like?)

    I can understand that journeys UNDER 186 miles should be by rail, but long rail journeys to say the south of Europe, will take forever and mean numerous changes at a variety of stations, with every chance of missing a connection. Long distance rail journeys will only work if you live next to a railway station and can take a high speed train direct to your final destination.

    I would have thought trying to get people out of their cars for short journeys, which can easily be done by other forms of transport, is a more sensible aspiration.

    tonyb

  99. Rhys Jaggar says:
    March 29, 2011 at 5:32 am

    ‘So long as there family-friendly access modes for out-of-town folks, this isn’t as mad as it seems you know…….’

    Oh yes it is. It’s barking, even by EU standards. Though I suppose there may be ‘green’ jobs for the horses**t shovellers.

  100. I am quite surprised you are all so sarcastic about this measure. Are you all anti-EU nationalist British or average Murrikans ? “EU said X, so X might be extremely bad, or worse: communist.”

    1) I do not really believe in Global Warming but I do think city air pollution really matters.

    2) I do not know if you noticed, but 2050 is in 40 years. 40 years ago, technologies were different. As they will be in 40 years. The big thing said in this report is banning cars with current oil technology. Even though there will be a huge cataclysm when we’ll discover no temperature increase,bad air in populated cities would still be of policy matter. No one likes black pulmons as well as noone likes traffic jams. Since there is more walking way in my city center I discovered the joy of wandering around.

  101. Actually, the scheme isn’t as totally crazy as it seems viewed from an EU perspective.
    Most cities in Europe are high density with good mass transit. Think NYC on smaller scales.
    I lived in Madrid and would have considered having a car to be a hassle just like when I lived in NYC.

    Re. high speed rail (HSR) , I would love to have that option in Texas.

    I’ve traveled with HSR in Spain, France and Germany and it is much less hassle than flying and usually faster when factoring in security and baggage check.

    So these restrictions would have less impact in most of Europe than they would have in the US. In the US it would be a disaster.

    I think it’s crazy to mandate this behavior. It is bureaucracy gone wild and fortunately has little chance of success.

  102. Easy to see why these idiots are not elected, Yep, the European Government is an employment boondoggle for the boys and girls, now if this was to become law it would put plus minus, 50-60 million people out of work, then think of the sweat and tears that that new car cost, and the mountains of trucks and cars that litter the countryside, etc, etc,

  103. It’s all part of the Master Plan that Schellnhuber will soon reveal, see my site if you wish.
    The population is being reduced to herds of cattle – to be driven here, away from there, into this, out of that…
    For the skeptic cattle, they are probably getting railroad boxcars ready – to take us to the soap factories.
    Anybody that denies this is central planning and authoritarianism is in for a big surprise – and much sooner than 2050.

  104. “Sustainable low carbon fuels” puzzles me

    Ethanol/Methanol/Soylent – it is “sustainable” because it is made from living organisms. You kill the current organisms and convert them to fuel. New organisms then grow in their place, making the process “sustainable”.

  105. Annei says:
    March 29, 2011 at 3:09 am

    Train? What train? How come, when we live quite a few miles from the nearest station which is itself several miles on the far side of our nearest small town? There are three buses per day into that town from our village, and only two back out…

    Interesting. Now that you mention it, I notice that the nearest working train station from where I am (in Portugal) is 36 km from where I live, that via autobahn with tolls. The nearest bus station is 2 km from here, but there are only 2 buses a day to the nearest city, where one can get a long-distance bus.

    Finally, they’re phasing out trains — too costly to maintain, they say. This is getting medieval in a different sense.

    DirkH says:
    March 29, 2011 at 4:18 am

    Anthony; Australia is a democracy; the EU is not.

    Precisely. No longer part of the so-called free world.

    UK Sceptic says:
    March 29, 2011 at 5:54 am

    [...]the roads where I live (in the sticks) tending to flood there one way I’ll ever use a tiny, low wheel base electric car.

    I looked into electric cars too, and that was the argument out of them. Today I hardly made it back home with a Polo.

  106. ferd berple says:
    March 29, 2011 at 6:28 am

    “Sustainable low carbon fuels” puzzles me

    Ethanol/Methanol/Soylent – it is “sustainable” because it is made from living organisms. You kill the current organisms and convert them to fuel. New organisms then grow in their place, making the process “sustainable”.

    Now about the low carbon part?

  107. “This, of course, only means that it will not be an election that puts an end to these schemes, but something else. ”

    Uneconomical policies always solve themselves. Long before 2050. The cost of EU policies is already being seen in the bailout programs sweeping EU economies. That program is clearly not sustainable. The current concerns over CO2 will be a distant memory long before 2050. Everyone will be asking “what were they thinking”?

  108. The euro-green-nuts surprise us everyday. This is not a consequence of science whatsoever but of the fantastic “spread” between paying Euros 2 per hectare to the amazon tribes and forcefully selling it to 1st.world “polluters” at Euros 137,500 (at a 5,500 tons of “carbon capture” per hectare). What it is still in question is if the real owners of the amazon basin :Brazil, Peru, Venezuela, Ecuador will submit its sovereignty to the “Global Governance” UN scheme….

  109. Friday November 26,2010
    UK NEWS
    99% OF YOU SAY: GET US OUT OF EUROPE

    A MASSIVE wave of public support was last night surging behind the Daily Express’s crusade to liberate Britain from the stranglehold of Brussels.

    An exclusive poll conducted on the first day of our crusade showed an astonishing 99 per cent of people agree we should quit the European Union.

    http://www.express.co.uk/posts/view/213821/213821

  110. There’s always the rickshaw.

    A warning though, don’t take your rickshaw puller onto the freeway, not unless you’ve got a steady supply of illicit stimulants available.

  111. As a proud GW denier I have to say it is an excellent idea. I hope they can pull it off.

    Just because I deny Global Warming does not mean I am going to automatically attack progressive thinking when it comes to the environment in general. FF powered vehicles must and will be removed from our culture. The sooner the better.

    With ideas like this taking root perhaps they will tackle the way we grow food next and instead of mass transport from all over the world everything is grown locally in hydroponic towers.

    Discrediting good ideas on this site, simply because they pertain to improving the environment, is a discredit to WUWT, which is supposed to support logic not defy it purely out of spite.

  112. I wonder how long it would take after this went into effect to require those wanting to use the rails to “show ze papers” to the brown shirts in order to board.

    How to Control the Population 101:
    1. take their guns
    2. take their money
    3. restrict their movement
    4. restrict their information
    5. ration their food
    6. incarcerate those who do not comply

  113. But how is this going to work? Didn’t they also say that electricity on demand was going to become a thing of the past – brownouts, blackouts, appliances remotely shut off. If we also ban fossil fuel driven cars we will likely more than double the demand for electricity and it will be a pretty jerky trip to work each day. Watching a movie may take 5 hours, your eggs may be softer than you like them ….oh but then you may have more time to walk through the coast to coast windmill forest. This is not funny anymore. These Luddites are on automatic pilot and even an ice age can’t stop them now.

  114. TMJ says:
    March 29, 2011 at 6:17 am

    Travis B says:
    March 29, 2011 at 7:04 am

    Don’t leave the thinking cap behind that makes you a skeptic. The idea has a nice clean futuristic look, but don’t forget that they are also shutting down coal and nuke fired plants and if they also ban fossil fuel transportation then it is even going to be worse than the UK Transport Commissioner recently stated where he envisages brownouts, blackouts, etc. Think! Are they gong to make this happen with windmills? Europe will look like a hedgehog from space with these contraptions. Fortunately something has got to give here. I’ll go for the futuristic city, too, if their plans to retire all reliable energy generation gets dropped. Don’t get too comfortable and complacent as a skeptic in these crazy times.

  115. P Gosselin says:
    March 29, 2011 at 6:26 am
    That´s the “Brave New World”, the dream of the left, an anatropic society as a beehive or an ant-hill; really a dictatorship of a small elite who imagine themselves as the most intelligent, as they call themselves “the white brotherhood”, a self defined quasi angelical kind of people who only by accident, inheritance or by the hard work of their predecessors, happen to have much more than it is necessary to survive and, while really being “rich fools” allucinate they can manage humanity, and by doing so, will remove the most precious values we have: individuality, individual freedom and the corner stone of society: family. This is why they, so fanatically, promote everything which goes against it.

  116. “I think it will the EU that’s banned by 2050, not the automobile. Why? The automobile actually provides a useful function for people.”

    lol Anthony. 2050!!!!!!!!!! 2013 is nearer! Portugal has now gone t/ts up with more to follow! The Euro is in terminal decline and the only way Brussels bureaucrats can operate is with financial clout. The problem is that they are bent cheats that could not run a piggy bank!

  117. The really good reason to ban cars from cities is nothing to do with carbon emissions – it is to get rid of the gridlock traffic jams that ensure that the average car speed in e.g. central London is about 8 mph. For this reason I would say, go for it. But what London needs is effective park and ride schemes that link up with an efficient and non-overcrowded tube and rail network. At the moment the tube is worse than cattle trucks in the rush hour – you literally would not be able to transport animals under those conditions – so investment in infrastructure will be needed if more people are going to leave their cars behind.

  118. What’s truly frightening to me is the overall tone of comments in support of this idea, and the complete lack of grounding in reality they all share.

  119. I agree with travis B.
    One can be a climate sceptic and find this idea interessing.

    In centers of cities like London or Paris, individual cars are no longer a convenient and efficient mean of transport.
    I lived in Paris for a long time where I experienced more than once the “joy” of being trapped in my car for hours just for going /coming back for / from the WE.
    Needless to say that I never took my car during the week. Always the subway.
    I could say the same for London : transiting by car from the Heathrow airport to the center of London is a nightmare.
    In high density centers, individual car is non longer a mean of freedom; it’s a… “network contention problem”. Hence, as in internet networking, you have to put in place strong “throughput management policies” :-)

  120. The auto industry is rubbings its greasy sweating palms together with glee because the government is going to force everyone to buy new cars instead of letting them upgrade in their own time. Millenium bug scam all over again.

  121. It must be nice to be able to make arbitrary decisions which get enacted into law without any of those tedious obstacles like feasiblity, practicality or reality.

    Where are Jorj X. McKie and
    BuSab when we need them?

  122. Restriction from freedom of movement and mobility is against European Human Rights legislation. They will probably just amend the legislation

    /Mango

    I don’t deny climate change, I know climate changes

  123. @ Thierry says:
    March 29, 2011 at 9:19 am

    I agree with travis B.
    One can be a climate sceptic and find this idea interessing.

    In centers of cities like London or Paris, individual cars are no longer a convenient and efficient mean of transport.
    I lived in Paris for a long time where I experienced more than once the “joy” of being trapped in my car for hours just for going /coming back for / from the WE.
    Needless to say that I never took my car during the week. Always the subway.
    I could say the same for London : transiting by car from the Heathrow airport to the center of London is a nightmare.
    In high density centers, individual car is non longer a mean of freedom; it’s a… “network contention problem”. Hence, as in internet networking, you have to put in place strong “throughput management policies” :-)

    Perhaps they are looking at this from the wrong end of the telescope. Could it be that large metropolitan areas/super cities are the problem, instead of transportation?

  124. Travis B:
    March 29, 2011 at 7:04 am

    … Discrediting good ideas on this site, simply because they pertain to improving the environment, is a discredit to WUWT, which is supposed to support logic not defy it purely out of spite.

    I am all for developing clean and renewable energy technologies – the sooner the better. But there is a basic problem in the bigger picture that I believe you’re not seeing. I call it the Tarzan Principal.

    The Tarzan Principal – When swinging from tree to tree high above the jungle floor it is vitally important to make sure you have the next vine firmly in grasp before letting go of your current vine that is carrying you. Failure to follow this very basic concept will result in tragic consequences.

    This is fallacy of thought that I see being espoused by these green ideologues (as opposed to green realists whom I believe most WUWT visitors to be). They think it a good idea to force humanity to completely let go of the energy that has supported us before clean and renewable energy is firmly in grasp. It’s not a good idea.

    It is a good idea to create free market incentives to pursue clean and renewable energy development and transition as it becomes both economically viable and sufficiently capable of supporting the world’s energy needs. Right now it is not and cannot. Championing disincentivizing taxing schemes and draconian laws now to force humanity off FF without real energy alternatives is blind and foolish ideology that ignores the Tarzan Principal to disastrous consequences.

    I don’t automatically attack progressive thinking. I automatically attack ignorant, idealistic, and narrow minded thinking that is masqueraded as progressivism.

  125. Hank Hancock says:
    March 29, 2011 at 10:18 am

    The Tarzan Principal – When swinging from tree to tree high above the jungle floor it is vitally important to make sure you have the next vine firmly in grasp before letting go of your current vine that is carrying you. Failure to follow this very basic concept will result in tragic consequences.

    @@@

    Of course. Not sure where anyone said “banning cars tomorrow”. Pretty sure the article said in 2050, close to 4 decades away.

    Most of the people on this planet are entirely ignorant as to what exactly, “technology” can do for us today, let alone 40 years from now.

    Inner city transport is conducted today via FF vehicles not because there are not alternatives but because the status quo is easier to follow than change. Change is expensive, status quo is cheap. It is about “will”, both personal and political. And of course it is about money. But what it is not about, is technology and alternatives, those already exist today.

    Your Tarzan Principal is entertaining but hardly all encompassing. There is always the “Courageous Tarzan Principal”, which states that as long as you can “see the next vine” you don’t always have to have it firmly in your grasp. You could always let go and hope you catch it.

    No one ever accomplished or changed anything without first setting a goal.

  126. You don’t drive in the middle of London unless you REALLY need to! Whenever I go there I have a place I park in the suburbs and take the Underground (Tube, Subway, whatever). Anyway, this is never going to happen for the very good reason that, as many have pointed out, oil may well be a lot more expensive and in much shorter supply in forty years. Put that together with what forty more years of battery (and superconductivity) technology might bring and it’s fairly certain that electric vehicles may well be the norm by then and if I’m still around I hope I’ll be driving one. Just to give one recent example, I heard on the radio just yesterday that MIT (I believe) are working on a battery that can be charged in SECONDS. But more recent news:-

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-12879566

    This whole idea is ‘no more likely than square bananas’, according to the UK govt, so file this under ‘EU nobodies sounding off just to make it look like they actually DO something for their zillions’ and forget it.

  127. 1DandyTroll says:
    March 29, 2011 at 2:57 am

    And soon, in a town near you, streets will be filled with hippie communists running around screaming about the new plague of static electricity induced rash’, or what not, and demanding, yet again, the end of civilization, or else . . . they go really really bonkers . . . again!

    I’m finally going to call bs on your constant whining about “hippies”. I call you out because I see that you have absolutely no idea what you’re talking about. The “hippies” I’m comfortable around care nothing for communism (or consumerism come to think of it). They will happily accept electricity from sensible sources which are at best harmony with (for want of a better expression) nature. So, difficult though it may be for you to understand, that means that such things as bird mincers don’t do it – the cleanest practical way of making the stuff that helps generate the heat and light (not to mention the music) which we all need, is what we want and when there is a better way of doing that than now, then we will embrace that. Until then, we’re stuck with what we have. Oh, and, by the way, we are all in favour of saving as much power as possible – think what else we can buy with the money we save ;-).

    Mind you, clean is good, it’s simply not good enough to foul your own nest – just look at the birds in your garden, or have you killed them all to demonstrate your “non-hippy” credentials?

    By the way, don’t think I’m particularly vexed with you dear boy – I do look forward to your posts as I think that even the No. 1 Science Blog needs a comedy poster from time to time. Maybe it’s you going “really really bonkers again”!

  128. @Thierry says:

    “In centers of cities like London or Paris, individual cars are no longer a convenient and efficient mean of transport.”

    How very authoritarian of you. So because you think it is not a convenient way of transportation for you you are to decide it is not convenient for everyone else too?

    What does the inner city center folks think is convenient you think? I know one thing it is not very convenient for them to have outsiders running around however they bloody please. :p

  129. UK Sceptic says:
    March 29, 2011 at 5:54 am

    I’m not giving up my Freelander for anyone.With winters growing colder and snowier and the roads where I live (in the sticks) tending to flood there no (corrected) way I’ll ever use a tiny, low wheel base electric car.

    Hah! I see your Freelander and raise my Defender!

    For certain times over the last 2 years in my Wiltshire village, I and a similarly endowed (!) friend have been about the only people able to move about.

    It’s funny how we FWD owners stop being public enemies on occasion, isn’t it.

  130. malcolm says:
    March 29, 2011 at 10:07 am

    It must be nice to be able to make arbitrary decisions which get enacted into law without any of those tedious obstacles like feasiblity, practicality or reality.

    Where are Jorj X. McKie and
    BuSab when we need them?

    Does this make the Europe the new Dosadi?

  131. At the rate the EU is going, by 2050 they likely won’t have an economy to speak of to buy cars in any event.

  132. UK Rejects first ever sensible EU proposal:

    http://canspeccy.blogspot.com/2011/03/uk-rejects-first-ever-sensible-eu.html

    “The idea that it requires a noisy, pollution-creating, ton-and-a-half mobile living room with leather arm-chairs and a 200-horse-power motor to haul some commuter’s arse across town at an average speed of about eight miles an hour is simply insane.

    “It is time for the developed nations to redesign and rebuild their cities and transportation infrastructure to provide a safer, healthier, more beautiful, and vastly more energy efficient human habitat. …

    REPLY: Traffic troll, ignore, Anthony

  133. malcolm says:
    March 29, 2011 at 10:07 am

    Where are Jorj X. McKie and BuSab when we need them?

    Thank you for your interesting link. When I read (on Wiki):

    In Herbert’s fiction, government becomes terrifyingly efficient. Red tape no longer exists: laws are conceived of, passed, funded, and executed within hours, rather than months. The bureaucratic machinery becomes a juggernaut, rolling over human concerns and welfare with terrible speed, jerking the universe of sentients one way, then another, threatening to destroy everything in a fit of spastic reactions.

    I immediately thought of the Blair/Brown era of knee-jerk reaction lawmaking in Britain.

  134. Didn’t the IPCC tell us that most of Europe would be under water by 2050 because of melting ice caps due to runaway global warming? So that would eliminate the need for automobiles! Now lets see, where did I put my row boat… ;->

  135. This IS the logical outcome of this CO2 nonsense. Get ready to bow down to the “Green God”, more slavery is coming…

  136. I met a man from Tito’s Yugoslavia. He talked about the papers that were necessary to go from town to town. Often, even if you had the right papers, one would be met with “what do you want to go there for?” and a big refusal stamped on it.
    First, take away thier vehicles, then deny thier pass to travel.
    No need to go out tonight, just call the EU for pizza.
    The UK needs to get out from under the heel of the EU before the concertina wire and the guard posts go up.

  137. Where’s my hat tip?

    And you should change Australia to NSW in ther comment about labor and grens losing power – it was only in one state so far

  138. @Don K re The Oil Drum

    I spent years following TOD – and yes they are utterly obsessed with peak oil. I learnt a lot from that site, but I would be cautious about believing most of it anymore. The commenters and editors are mainly uber-greens, disciples of James Hansen and Jim Kunstler, and firm believers in the notion of Powerdown. If you ever look at dieoff.org, there’s all this stuff about peak oil / rolling blackouts and basically the end of civilisation. It’s all thoroughly depressing stuff. It was only with the advent of climategate and my happening across WUWT, that I managed to shake myself free of all that nonsense! Look at the gigantic volume of the earth’s crust – compared with the meagre amount of resources we extract from it – 1 cubic mile of oil per year. Note that on TOD, they hate the abiotic theory of oil production – they will not countenance it or speak of it. And yet it seems to me to be far more plausible than the dead dinosaur theory of oil formation. Yes the oil price is very volatile, but that appears to be mainly a function of political instability and general weakness of the world economies.

  139. I don’t agree with this line of argument, which is why I posted a link to a comment on the same story that I had made elsewhere. I further quoted a paragraph:

    “The idea that it requires a noisy, pollution-creating, ton-and-a-half mobile living room with leather arm-chairs and a 200-horse-power motor to haul some commuter’s arse across town at an average speed of about eight miles an hour is simply insane.”

    This, Anthony Watts, you call troll traffic. Why? Are you employed by the oil industry or the automobile industry, or is it that you simply cannot brook disagreement? Your intolerance is revealing.

  140. Mikael Ros says:
    March 28, 2011 at 11:13 pm

    A prerelease of a April Fool’s prank?

    Right! That is most likely what it is. Such a crazy scheme could only be implemented by a totalitarian regime, not in a democratically elected one.

  141. The EU will be lucky to survive the next five years – let alone the next 40.

    Consumed by imploding Credit bombs ticking away in Ireland, Portugal, Spain, etc…

  142. And with reference to your postscript: “I think it will the EU that’s banned by 2050, not the automobile.” Why do you consider the EU and automobiles in cities to be mutually exclusive?

    You say “The automobile actually provides a useful function for people,” but in what way does that eliminate the possibility that that function could be fulfilled with greater energy efficiency and overall utility without automobiles, at least of the kind we have today, in cities?

    It seems that you wish to damn the proposal to eventually eliminate cars from cities on the grounds that it’s a top-down bureaucratic solution. But the fact that we have cities full of cars is entirely the result of an accumulation of public policy decisions made over the last 100 years. Why, then, is it intolerable to you to consider public policies that would have a different tendency?

    Energy efficiency, efficiency in the use of road space, improvement in urban air quality and traffic safety are all desirable ends. But to advance those objectives will take coordinated public policy — its the same with sewage disposal and street lighting. The free market, however splendid in some circumstances, won’t do it.

  143. Over the last 20 years, I’ve spent out 3 years working in Europe, mainly in Germany and Netherlands and mainly for 3 to 15 months at a time. I never bought a car, nor missted having one and did all of my traveling by train, bus and bicycle. The average people in these countries do their grocery shopping by bicycle. I never missed having a car and you would be surprised to see the average 70 year old is quite happy to travel by bicycle. In The Netherlands, typical people ride a bike to the train station, take the train to work and then ride a bike the last mile or two to the work place. The option is to fight traffic jams on the highways. It will be much easier to get cars out of Europeans cities than American ones.

  144. Let’s look at the matter from the EU Commission’s point of view:

    >>
    By 2050, most of the commenters o WUWT will be dead, senile or otherwise irrelevant. By then, the people-sheeple will have been exposed all their lives to propaganda in schools, on television and at home, because by then their parents and their grandparents will have been thoroughly indoctrinated by the same media.

    Bear in mind that it is customary in Europe for parents to dump their children into the care bureaucrats (“teachers”) from anywhere between age two and age six until they’re between eighteen to twenty-four years old. In the evenings and on holidays, they dump them in front of television sets, where the youngsters can absorb the politically correct views of the day while deluding themselves with the thought that they are enjoying “free time”. And then, when the children have left home, the parents vote to tax them to death to make them pay for their pensions and ever-rising healthcare costs (“intergenerational solidarity”).

    Here are some numbers from OESO about the time parents spend with their children (minutes per day):

    (Working fathers)(Non-working fathers)(Working mothers)(Non-working mothers)
    EUROPE
    Belgium 28 31 58 99
    France 26 48 62 114
    Germany 37 48 66 182
    Italy 40 49 85 124
    Spain 43 60 85 135
    U.K. 43 63 81 155
    NON-EUROPEAN WEST
    Australia 69 105 137 236
    U.S. 60 95 94 155

    Get it? Europeans are already the most systematically indoctrinated, brainwashed “children of the state” that ever existed. They’ll believe literally anything they’re taught in school, especially if it is confirmed daily in the media — or so we (their “educators”) hope.
    <<

    That is essentially the basis for the "We are going to control the future"-politics which the EU specializes in. As Edward Bernays never tired of telling Western elites: systematic, scientific manipulation of public opinion is necessary to make democracy work. (And have they learned their lesson!)

    Does it matter? No! By 2050, the present EU commissars will be dead, senile or otherwise irrelevant. Nobody will give a damn about the 2011 grandstanding of some shameless idiots ("political authorities") that earned loads of money promising "change we can believe in". One might as well believe that in 2100 any survivor of the Great Yosemite Park Blow-Up will give a damn about 100-year old computer models predicting higher global temperatures and shorter shorelines.

    Is that good news? Not necessarily. One generation of shameless idiots that earn loads of money promising "change we can believe in" is usually followed by another, more sophisticated, even more idiotic lot. That goes on and on until, as they say, the money runs out — when too few people can still afford to be suckers — and reality kicks in.

  145. People want freedom. We’re not drones. Automobiles provide us with such freedom to travel anywhere we like at anytime. This is contrary to the ideology of the insane people in charge of most governments on this planet. Liberty will always win, thankfully the United States exists, i just hope the American people haven’t forgotten how they their country was founded.

  146. I think this is just an evil plot by the latest EU migrants to corner the Rickshaw market? ;-)
    What about that guy who made a human powered flight across the Channel? Are all the summer holidaying English going to have to fly themselves to Spain now?

  147. “Automobiles provide us with such freedom to travel anywhere we like at anytime.”

    Freedom’s good, for sure. But the freedom to travel “anywhere we like anytime” by car comes at considerable cost — including the costs of noise, of particulate emissions and smog, of traffic-clogged thoroughfares and of massive infrastructure expenditure. Moreover, it is subject to many inconveniences and limitations. For instance, in London, cars travel at an average speed only ten miles an hour (http://www.thisislocallondon.co.uk/news/topstories/804876.london_cars_move_no_faster_than_chickens/) — that’s after the imposition of the “congestion charge” sped things up from 8.5 mph — and an hour’s parking costs five quid, if you can find a spot.

    And then there is the enormous personal cost of gas, depreciation, etc., which means that many people spend much of their working lives to earn what it takes merely to pay for their car.

    The automobile was an extraordinary development and a great improvement on the horse-draw carriage. But today, we can surely come up with something vastly more efficient, more compact, faster and with with a much smaller environmental impact. This is not about green politics, its about good engineering and a better quality of life for a global population of seven billion and rising.

    The politics of devising better transportation solutions will be contentious and complex, but with this initiative, the EU seems to have made one of its few if not its only useful contribution to European life. At least they have put the issue on the table. Who knows, something good may come of it.

  148. Travis B says:
    March 29, 2011 at 7:04 am
    ______

    And how do you suggest those of us living miles out in the country, with rotten, pot-holed roads, no nearby railway station, hardly a bus to be seen, are supposed to cope? Just die of starvation? Never see our families and friends? Too tall to use mini electric cars (never mind failing supplies of power)? We’ll stick to our larger car, with winter tyres in season, thank you very much.

  149. David S says:
    March 29, 2011 at 8:33 am
    When are the Europeans going to wise up and kick these psychopaths out?

    ________

    The EUSSR is awash with unelected bureaucrats. We have three main political parties (well, if you count the LibDems as a main party, that is!) who all kowtow to the EU, so there is nobody sensible for whom to vote. They have all broken their promises on giving us referenda on the EU. I’d kick it out if I could. I fear revolution might be the only way to free ourselves, but the English don’t do revolution. I just wonder how much further they can press us before there is a character change and we do, finally, do revolution. It wouldn’t be before time.

  150. BillD says:
    March 29, 2011 at 5:21 pm

    _______

    BillD:

    The Netherlands is largely flat. I live in a hilly village 3 miles from the nearest town. I live up a steep hill from where the nearest bus infrequently appears and I am senior in years. Using a bike for shopping, along a dangerous, narrow, pot-hole bedevilled road is not safe, nor within my energy capabilities; neither is dragging a large amount of shopping up said steep hill. You know not of what you speak.

  151. No more cars in the city? Will they allow horse and buggy? I think cities already had this: 100 years ago.

  152. Alfred Burdett says:
    March 29, 2011 at 5:16 pm

    It seems that you wish to damn the proposal to eventually eliminate cars from cities on the grounds that it’s a top-down bureaucratic solution.

    That’d be a good enough reason for me.

  153. “And how do you suggest those of us living miles out in the country, with rotten, pot-holed roads, no nearby railway station, hardly a bus to be seen, are supposed to cope? Just die of starvation?”

    Drive a truck. That’s fine with me. Just don’t drive it through town every day, without paying the costs that you impose on residents of the city.

    Those who object to top-down solutions to transportation problems will no doubt be happy to confine there automobile use to toll roads and live without street lighting.

    “but the English don’t do revolution.”

    Rubbish. Did you never hear of the War of the Roses? Or the civil war that ended with the execution of Charles I and the dictatorship of Oliver Cromwell? Or the Glorious Revolution that resulted in the flight of James II and the system of constitutional monarchy and parliamentary democracy, which in degraded form, you enjoy in Britain today?

  154. At current fertility rates, almost all of the major cities in Europe will have population half of what they are now. And if one considers the flight of younger people from Europe as a whole (to escape high taxes and high unemployment of a rapidly aging continent), the Alarmists may just get thier wish. London, Paris, Berlin and Vienna will be ghost towns and/or museums in 2050.

  155. Alfred , you obviously have not seriously examined the costs of running a car in the UK, even though you write about the high costs. We pay a £50-plus fee every year for a very cursory MOT inspection, over 80% of our fuel costs are government-imposed taxes, insurance costs will shortly be rocketing upwards due to the mad EU directive for insurers to charge the long-suffering insured the top whack regardless of gender in the dubious cause of ‘equality’, the exhorbitant sales tax on motor parts including tyres cannot be avoided. Armies of otherwise unemployable parking wardens enforce the high charges for parking and the annual vehicle tax demand is yet another charge against the vehicle owner.
    Successive governments have regarded motor vehicles and everything pertaining to them as a wonderful golden goose; a senior exec of a multinational oil company once told me “If oil companies were truly greedy they would opt out of the oil business and into the government business.”
    I pay what I consider to be an exhorbitant Council Tax for the privelege of occupying a very modest but wildly overvalued terrace house; this tax should be suficient to pay for the space my car occupies anywhere in the borough but no, I must pay again and again, wherever I need to go.
    To add insult to injury and to the general motorists’ burden, Kamikaze pedestrians who ignore pedestrian crossings and traffic signals and suicidal cyclists who think a bit of bright Lycra, a plastic hat and a twinkling Christmas light on the rear of their cycle renderss them immortal and even bulletproof all combine to ensure my constant high state of alertness wherever and whenever I drive.
    And you think we wander casually about town in our ton-and-a-half of machinery with leather armchairs using 200 horsepower for this. You forget that most who own cars choose the style or configuration because of a combination of factors important in and to their lives that only the individual owner can know, factors which are beyond the ken (and rightly so) of civic busybodies such as remote planners employed by the EU.
    The freedom of the individual is one of the rights and priveleges our forefathers fought and died for, including the right to participate fully in a technologically-enabled society. IMHO you are not just a traffic troll, sir, you are a very ignorant anti-liberties traffic troll.

  156. “At current fertility rates, almost all of the major cities in Europe will have population half of what they are now. ”

    No, the fertility rate has nothing to do with the population in Europe, which is expanding through mass immigration from Asia, Africa and the ME — same is true in America and Canada.

    The Liberal-lefties in Europe are conducting a program of autogenocide. But Europe will remain crowded, just not with Europeans.

    http://www.google.com/publicdata?ds=wb-wdi&met=sp_pop_grow&idim=country:GBR&dl=en&hl=en&q=british+population+growth#met=sp_pop_grow&idim=country:GBR:ITA:FRA:USA:CAN

  157. “Alfred , you obviously have not seriously examined the costs of running a car in the UK”

    On the contrary, Alexander, as I have written here (may I mention where without rebuke, Anthony?) :

    http://theinexactscientist.wordpress.com/2011/03/30/the-uk-rejects-first-ever-sensible-eu-proposal/

    “As suburbs sprawled further from downtown areas, the vast majority of the working population spent an ever increasing proportion of their time either driving their cars or working to pay for them. ”

    The fact is, the automobile, at least in it’s present form, represents a huge misallocation of resources. Individually, we are compelled to make this misallocation because a city can have only one transportation system at a time, and currently most cities rely on the automobile of the type I described. Sooner or later, Western nations will likely be forced to switch to an alternative, if only because they are now going bankrupt. The UK I believe is running a government deficit equal to ten % of GDP, and real incomes are falling as is the GDP. The US might be in even worse shape were it not able to go on buying oil and vast quantities of manufactured goods with pieces of paper so helpfully printed by Mr. Bernanke.

    Whether your taxes actually cover the external costs of your automobile use might be difficult to determine. However, the external costs are certainly very large as is evident from the effect of traffic volume on property values, the reduction in life expectancy due to urban air pollution, mostly of it from automobiles, etc.

  158. RE: “The plan also envisages an end to cheap holiday flights from Britain to southern Europe”

    The blokes will be in the streets. And you thought football hooliganism was bad. Send in the riot police! ;-)

  159. Alfred Burdett says:
    March 30, 2011 at 8:34 am

    ____

    I don’t drive a truck and I don’t go near a town more than I have to for basic supplies; on the other hand, townies fly through our village to the detriment of the villagers, which makes it very dangerous for walking, cycling, horse-riding, or even driving. The Townies also like the trade we give them when we do have to visit to shop. We don’t have much choice actually, as we lack shops, schools or pubs.

    As to the English and revolution: the examples you quote are not from recent history. In recent times the English have NOT gone in for revolution, and it’s certainly time they did once more.

    Now I think about it…you do seem to be a bit troll-ish; so I’ll not be responding to you any further.

  160. Alfred, you are repeating nonsense. London is a city and it has a number of transport systems, not just the one you state it can have. I can choose to use the excellent bus service, I can choose to take the bus to an Underground station to go into the City or to other destinations, or I can walk to our suburban above-ground railway station to access the same or another wide list of destinations. I could walk, run or cycle. Or use my 200 horsepower car with leather armchairs. Or call a cab, which we do to travel to and from Heathrow.
    I lived for decades in rural New Zealand. Cars were absolutely essential to go anywhere for us there – too far to walk, no bus service off the main roads with the exception of School buses that only school children could ride on and we were at least 20 miles from a railway.

  161. “I can choose to use the excellent bus service… Underground…”

    Yes, and the last time I travelled on the “excellent?” Tube it was jam packed and was stalled in a tunnel for 20 minutes. And if everyone else decided to travel the same way, the system would break down. So cars are, at present, essential to personal transportation in London.

    When you say cars were “absolutely essential” in rural New Zealand, I can believe it. But here we’re talking about urban transportation, which accounts for maybe 90% of automobile use.

    What I am saying is that the automobile as it exists today is a highly inefficient, very expensive means of getting one or two people around a city at an average of about eight miles an hour, and it has horrendous environmental costs. I don’t see how that can be disputed.

    But if everybody likes spending half their working day earning the money to buy and operate an automobile then I guess that’s what deluded humanity will continue to do!

  162. Alfred, the only transport system in London I described as excellent is the bus service. You have serious reading comprehension problems and you are an anti-car troll, so I won’t respond to your contrary nonsense again.

Comments are closed.