China Accuses Italy of Being the Source of Covid-19

Coronavirus disease cells, 3D rendering. new 2019 Novel Coronavirus (COVID-19) infection outbreak occurs from Wuhan, China

Guest essay by Eric Worrall

China still has not accepted that shortcomings of their system of government, such as their mistreatment of whistleblowers, decision paralysis in times of crisis, and lack of a free press to expose the mistakes of incompetent officials and politicians, are the main reasons the world was infected with Covid-19.

Chinese Communist Party Accuses Italy of Being Origin of Wuhan Virus

The Chinese Communist Party (CCP) has jumped on a medical study that suggested the Wuhan virus was present in Italy as early as September to claim that the European nation was the epicentre of the virus rather than China.

A study published in the Italian cancer medical paper, the Tumori Journal, claimed coronavirus antibodies were found in blood samples from cancer screenings carried out in September of last year in Italy, indicating that there may have been coronavirus contact earlier than first believed.

The dictatorship in Beijing was quick to seize upon the study, however, with Foreign Ministry spokesman Zhao Lijian, suggesting that the virus may have originated outside of China.

“This once again shows that tracing the virus’s source is a complex scientific question that should be left to scientists. [It] is a developing process that can involve multiple countries,” Mr Zhao said.

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This is not the first time the Chinese Government’s apparent inability to accept responsibility or tell the truth about internal problems has led to deaths.

China also allegedly attempted to cover up the SARS outbreak in 2003. Thankfully in that case the disease outbreak was rapidly contained, despite the Chinese Government’s foolishness. The deadly 2003 strain was much easier to detect than Covid-19, because the infectious period was accompanied by an easily detected low grade fever.

136 thoughts on “China Accuses Italy of Being the Source of Covid-19

    • Maybe Elmhurst hospital in Queens, although the timeline doesn’t seem to fit. But if ballots can be returned before they are even mailed to voters, then I suppose it’s possible.

    • It is clear that this virus moved in sync with the flu season, behaved just like a member of the flu season and left for the summer. Now, a new salad of viruses has arrived and, with a crappy PCR test that is not fit for purpose and detects just about anything, we have lots of new false positive “cases.” You are not ac”case” unless you are ill and not a Covid-19 case unless the specific virus can be tested for—as no such test exists, no one has Covid-19. It’s a myth.

      Sure, there were one or more viruses out there that caused a variety of symptoms that were cobbled together to be the C-19 syndrome, but no one anywhere has identified a single virus that has been isolated, cultured, and shown to cause these symptoms. This is why it is a myth.

      • Charles, are there “lots of false positives” or are they all false because “no such test exists”?

        Are you saying it is impossible to test specifically for Covid-19 because PCR tests are always flawed or are you saying PCR tests per se are ok, its just impossible in this case because there is no such thing as Covid-19 Rna to have a test for?
        You’re making some brave calls there. It would be easy to accuse you of making this stuff up, but before I do, do you have any training or experience in virology or epidemiology? Can you point me towards a credible source of supporting evidence for your claim – “no such test exists”?

      • Was Lewandowsky right after all? Are all climate skeptics conspiracists? Reading all US voting and covid comments, it certainly appears so.

        • Conspiracies like the leaked emails from the University of East Anglia’s Climatic Research Unit?

          The FBI, Russia, and the Trump circus?….. no?… all legit?

          Live in your world of Unicorns and Rainbows and take your dose of Soma if you like, but I prefer to remain skeptical of all governments and associated institutions diktats.

          • Climate believer, It has become too hard to distinguish the “Media Matters” Soros funded Tools from the Public School indoctrinated Fools.

            Loydo is definitely the former but Hans strikes me as the latter. Either way you have to marvel at how proficient these safe zone “Campus Curriculum Clowns” have become at projection.

            I’ll take Left wing conspiracy theories for 100 Alex.

      • Some researchers ran the base sequences used for the PCR tests in several countries through a database search application, and found they matched sequences found in about 100 other microbes.

  1. A question of course is how reliable is the identification of the antibodies discovered in Italy. Are they specific to Cov-19 or are they generic?

    • Genetic drift in some components of SARS-CoV-2 has already been noted, particularly in high density breeding mammal populations. More than 100 Million mink have been extirpated, 15 Million in Montana alone.

  2. Right. The efficacy of the PLA PLANdemic is well documented. The PLA steps up for another serving enabled by their legacy media fellow travelers – wannabe tyrants. The conspiracy of ignorance masquerades as common sense.

  3. My hunch is CCP a global disinformation campaign will ramp up through January, including with real internet offensive botnets activated to run DDS and virus attacks as the planned date of PLA-Taiwan Invasion approaches.

    • WHO admits China never reported the existence of coronavirus outbreak

      The World Health Organization backtracked on its assertion that the Chinese government alerted the United Nations agency about the coronavirus outbreak.

      The WHO quietly updated its “Timeline of WHO’s response to COVID-19” on Tuesday following the House Foreign Affairs Committee Republicans’ mid-June Interim Report on Origins of COVID-19 Pandemic (led by ranking member and China task force Chairman Rep. Michael McCaul of Texas), which concluded that “despite public reporting to the contrary … China never notified the WHO about the outbreak in Wuhan.” The change was spotted by McCaul and first reported by the Washington Free Beacon.

      “I’m glad to see the WHO and the Chinese Communist Party have both read my interim report on the origins of the pandemic and are finally admitting to the world the truth — the CCP never reported the virus outbreak to the WHO in violation of WHO regulations,”

  4. Interesting how many of those deadly respiratory diseases come from China? Is someone attacking the Chinese with bioweapons, or are they playing with them? Or both?

    • The Chinese character for family contains a pig inside a house. It wasn’t just symbolic. People and animals there often live together in congested conditions.

      It’s very modern in the cities and not like that now, but the countryside is still very much the same as it was. Also, yes bioweapons are studied like just about in every major country.

      • The Chinese also have a cultural bias for very freshly prepared foods. Walk down any large city food market and there will be rows of living creatures waiting to be eaten with the barest possible preparation. Anything from scorpions to a host of sea creatures, and these in the tourist-trodden areas, not the Hutong back alleys which cater to natives with more exotic tastes.

    • I don’t see how Covid is really that deadly. Deadly for some of advanced age with underlying health issues, but a very high survival rate for those with no underlying health issues. For example, the survival rate for a 70-79 y/o with no underlying health issues is 99.5%. So it seems to me it’s more about a person’s health than viral pathogenesis.

      • As someone with multiple substantial health conditions but a reasonable life expectancy providing I don’t catch Covid I’m a bit less reassured by this ;-).

      • I see it as being an opportunistic little creation that gets its virulence from its incredibly compact and durable packaging. It needs a pre-existing malady and/or weak immune response to be life-threatening, just like pneumonia or seasonal flu.
        I can remember several times that I have lost my olfactory sense due to severe sinus infections and therefore couldn’t taste normally. I don’t find that symptom to be new or surprising given that the sinuses are the primary infection site. The chronic headache symptoms are also associated with having had a severe infection and persistent swelling, or so my ENT doctor tells me.

      • Exactly . . . nobody knows how the radiation from nuclear weapon explosions will mutate COVID-XX and whatever other biological weapons are being developed in those BSL-4 “research” labs in China. 🙂

        If the Wuhan Institute of Virology’s BSL-4 lab was conducting dangerous gain-of-function work to engineer a vaccine against a possible future NATURAL outbreak of COVID-like virus, it has been an utter failure . . . if, instead, its purpose was to develop a biological weapon to use against humans, it has been shown to be an outstanding success.

    • General MacArthur wanted to. Truman sacked him in response. What preiscence! Sigh. We would have had a much better world. Although, hindsight is only to be remembered.

  5. Is China or Italy the cause or effect? Italy does have a large Chinese immigrant population. What is the epidemiological analysis of socially… physically proximate populations? That said, if nothing else, there seems to be a consensus that this virus is not naturally sourced. Perhaps a precursor to a vaccine that escaped prematurely into the environment.

    • No. That is the Chinese government’s point. Italy has now found evidence it existed in Italy before it was found to exist in China.

      • “No. That is the Chinese government’s point. Italy has now found evidence it existed in Italy before it was found to exist in China.”
        There were round trip flights between Wuhan and Florence I believe daily. And, about 300,000 Chinese residing in the Florence region alone. That virus in some form could have circulated China to Italy and back in a less malevolent form before anyone knew it existed. Italy has the largest population of Chinese residents in all Europe. I believe that CIA has satellite pictures of Wuhan’s main hospital’s parking lot go from quarter occupied as a rule to full in October 2019.

        Italy has no open “wet markets” slaughtering forest animals, but I bet lots of undeclared forest meats came back from Chinese residents of Italy visiting home. Watch a few “Customs” youtube videos, they come in U.K., Aussie, Canadian, et cetera versions. What undeclared food gets caught by the officers would turn your gut for three days.

  6. Open question – is China under lockdown?

    My understanding is they are not and most of the ‘Second Wave’ seems to be in the West.

    Strange that.

    Almost as if someone on the global stage was quite happy to see their geo-political rivals weakened under a sustained economic attack.

    • Actually overweight and obese people are much more at risk than thin people. 70% of adult Americans have a BMI over 25 which is the bottom number for being overweight. Asians are far thinner than Americans and Western Europeans. Asians living in America have a substantially lower number of people with a BMI over 25 than the rest of us.

      It is shocking how there is such a difference between their weight and the rest of Americans.

      It could be that weight is the number one reason the west has fared far worse than the people of Asia.

  7. Huh, china blames italy, the WHO and fauci say china is the best, Dopy Joe and sleep around Harris, Love china and say “they ain’t bad folks”…

    Makes you wonder why such vile people are elected to office, the WHO spend 190+ million on hotels and air travel last year, they do absolutely NOTHING, apart from sitting at a table and say “wear masks” take a vaccine 😐 Why do they need over a billion to state the obvious

  8. EW,

    Be careful of accusing China of “no free press”. It is quite apparent that we in the US do not have one either. Living in a glass house should preclude stone throwing.


        • Freedom also includes the right to be a freedom hating watermelon. So long as it is possible to to set up your own website with minimal fear of official persecution I think you still have to call it free, even if many media organisations choose an odd way to exercise that freedom.

          • By that argument, samizdat means that the Soviet Union had a free press.

            The reality is that the press in the US, and many other Western nations, runs in lockstep with the ‘green’ communist agenda. The only reason we’re not living in a communist hellhole right now is because the Internet provides a way to work around them.

          • My point is they do so by the free choice of the editors and to a lesser extent the journalists who work for them. Freedom includes the right to choose to oppose freedom.

            As far as I know there is no official sanction preventing someone setting up a new Breitbart or WUWT.

          • Lets just hope that Freedom continues if Biden, Harris, AOC etc assume the mantle of power in the USA. That they don’t set the state after “climate denial” sites like WUWT.

            It might not be a direct assault, but could be indirect pressure to close it down. Perhaps in exchange for continuing Section 230 immunity for Google, Facebook, Twitter etc…..

            History shows people, organisations and movements with extremist, ideological messages don’t want platforms around from which they can be criticised or questioned.

        • yes and also being suppressed by omission on certain search engine parameters.
          and antisocial medias
          Id expect that to get worse as/if? Bidet n co do get into that white building

    • Correct – see the grilling of Facebook, Twitter, and Google at a senate hearing recently. Collusion among all three, disclosed tools not known before, and blatant refusal to deliver audits of modified content under oath.
      These 3, never mind the New York Slimes (all the lies fit to print) really do believe the government and 3 constitutional amendments are “nice to have”!

      And elections? A bad joke.

    • I visited Taipei during a SARS outbreak, flying from Gatwick to Amsterdam to Hong Kong to Taiwan.

      On the way back;

      Taiwan were going all out to contain the outbreak, thermal imagers everywhere, big posters in multiple languages, a doctor in the lobby of the hotel every morning to test whether guests had a fever. I’ve never drunk so much citrus juice in my life.

      Hong Kong had a few disinterested looking people wandering about with handheld thermometers. Nobody bothered me, because as a Westerner I didn’t look like someone who had just flown in from Taipei.

      Amsterdam had no medical precautions whatsoever.

      Gatwick wasn’t even checking passports – there was one incredibly annoyed looking guy reading a newspaper and ignoring the passengers.

      It doesn’t surprise me Taiwan contained the outbreak very quickly.

    • Taiwan doesn’t tolerate a constant flow of CCP Chinese in and out of their country for a very good reason.

      The rest of the world hasn’t caught on yet.

      • Doesn’t have to be CCP Chinese. I have read that lot’s of Taiwanese Chinese work in mainland China. They were traveling back and forth before an outbreak was detected.

  9. In northern Italy the fashion manufacturing center is and was populated by thousands of Chinese seamstresses who regularly travelled back and forth from China.

    • You will not have to worry about Biden much longer

      Trump campaign lawyer Sidney Powell:
      “Georgia is probably going to be the first state I’m going to blow up … [the filing in the state] will be Biblical”

      When she hits the courts with a communist plot had been engineered by Venezuela, Cuba, China, Hugo Chavez, George Soros and the Clinton Foundation to rig the election. She also alleged that Dominion “can set and run an algorithm that probably ran all over the country to take a certain percentage of votes from President Trump and flip them to President Biden.

      Biden does not stand a chance

        • apologies i misunderstood this trump tweet on 14th Nov
          I look forward to Mayor Giuliani spearheading the legal effort Rudy Giuliani, Joseph diGenova, Victoria Toensing, Sidney Powell, and Jenna Ellis, a truly great team, added to our other wonderful lawyers and representatives!
          10:11 PM · Nov 14,

          • Ghalfrunt
            Best you read the latest. Trump and “hands down his pants” Giuliani have dumped her. Maybe they thought she was just a tad bonkers. Her enthusiasm for QAnon was a giveaway I would have thought.

      • you do realise that Hugo Chavez died several years ago. His plotting to overturn a US election from the grave is up there with Hermain Cain tweeting from the grave about how COVID was not as dangerous as people thought.

      • The Georgia case just got tossed by the trial judge because the Plaintiff was not Trump and the court found that the Plaintiff did not have standing to bring the suit. Lacking standing is what makes these cases DOA. It is a bitch in election lawsuits. Extremely hard to get unless you are the candidate suing. Lots of legal authority on this.

        Sidney Powell will have the same problem as the Plaintiff in the GA case, if Trump is not the Plaintiff. And she is no longer on the Trump team so she has no authority to bring a case on his behalf no matter how meritorious it may be.

  10. Of course the Wuflu originated outside China. The Chinese stole it from Canada. link 🙂

    There is so much male bovine excrement …

    In the face of a very high noise to signal ratio, I look for salient facts that shine through said noise.

    Taiwan began restricting flights on Dec. 31 (2019), when the first news of an unknown virus in Wuhan broke. link

    The Taiwanese jumped on the problem before it even had a name. I joke that Taiwan knows more about China than the Chinese. I’m only half kidding.

    Given the timing, I would need very solid evidence that the virus originated anywhere else but China.

    • Could have been due to the wicked air pollution in Wuhan then. I think a lot of the illness was due to that rather than the virus.

      • Were you in Wuhan in August 2019? Your answer is not the one the CCP would use – the photos are doctored would be the CCP answer. The CCP are criminals…they lie cheat steal murder. Who knows now exactly what happened?

    • They don’t operate like the west. Most medical things are done in hospitals. They don’t really have GPs and medical clinics like the west. Most hospital carparks are full all the time.

      • That’s what I’ve read. GPs are stigmatized and everyone wants to see specialists in hospitals, even for things like the flu.

        • So the Chinese were treating the CCP Wuhan virus in hospitals despite it being highly contagious? I remember the highly publicized building of a new hospital in Wuhan in weeks. I have read that there is a lot of traditional Chinese medicine involving stuff like powdered rhino horn and bear parts mixed with herbs and stuff.

  11. One thing is for sure: The Chicoms knew they had a very infectious virus on their hands in Wuhan, in November of 2019, and they shut down travel from Wuhan to the rest of China, but allowed travel to continue into the rest of the world from Wuhan, after knowing this.

    The Chicoms deliberately allowed the Wuhan virus to spread all over the world by their actions.

    Now, the next thing to figure out is exactly where the Wuhan virus originated, and whether it has been artificially modified by humans in any way.

  12. I’d say the Chinese also have a quality problem, from using lead paint on children’s toys, to poorly manufactured tools and other items, it’s pervasive.

    • Uhhh . . . Confucius was much smarter than that: only three fingers on the pointing hand would “point back”.

      Maybe you are referring to a statement made under a Confucius disinformation-campaign being run by the currently ruling ChiComs?

    • How is it no one ever realized Confucius apparently had a deformity that resulting in him having 11 fingers (and no thumbs)? 😉

      • Confucius also say; “He who pokes fun of others pokes his own eye out in process”.
        Confucius was a master of the one-liner.

        • That was a mistranslation, the proper translation of what Confucius said is “He who pokes fun of others makes their eyes tear up in the process”. Confucius was a keen observer of how thin skinned some can be. 😉

  13. China is throwing red herrings around, because they know they caused the distribution of Covid.

    I’m thinking they did it on purpose, and funded the riots, in order to get their puppet Biden elected. And if it works, Biden activates the Great Reset and we’re all hosed, with China in charge.

    I also believe these were acts of war and we should respond appropriately.

  14. Showing their Belt and Road buddies their true face. They are a toxic partner in many ways, which the world is being continually informed of by their bellicose stomping aound the globe.

  15. The Russians did it
    The Russians did it
    The Russians do everything bad
    Trump colluded with Russia
    Trump colluded with Russia
    Trumo does everything bad
    Trump the Colluder
    Vladimir the Impaler
    Trump the Colluder
    Vladimir the Impaler
    Orange man bad
    Orange man really bad
    Orange man even worse than we thought

  16. ”The dictatorship in Beijing was quick to seize upon the study, however, with Foreign Ministry spokesman Zhao Lijian, suggesting that the virus may have originated outside of China.

    “This once again shows that tracing the virus’s source is a complex scientific question that should be left to scientists. [It] is a developing process that can involve multiple countries,” Mr Zhao said.”

  17. Believe NOTHING that comes from the ChiComs. NOTHING. Truly, today’s “Evil Empire”.
    Don’t buy anything that’s “made in china”, if you can avoid it. The world has to oppose and squeeze these B..stds!

    • Yes, the Chicoms are definitely today’s Evil Empire.

      Trump was building up an alliance with other victims of Chicom aggression, and it could be an effective association, but if Biden takes over, this association will evaporate, and our allies will be seeking to accomodate the Chicoms rather than confront them because they know Biden will be in the pocket of the Chicoms and will not confront China.

      A Biden presidency will bring in the Era of Chicom Ascendance.

      It looks like there are just too many ignorant people in the Western Democracies to govern ourselves properly. Too many people have been fooled into thinking socialist policies are a good idea.

      Let’s hope we can prevent One-Party rule in the United States by at least keeping the U.S. Senate in Republican hands. That will setback the socialist agenda in a big way. If that happens, then Repubicans may be able to take control of the U.S. House of Representatives in the elections of 2022. Might do so even if Republicans don’t hold the Senate. Don’t worry, if Republcians lose control of Senate, we can always count on Joe Manchin to fill the gap and vote against the socialist agenda. Or so he says. He did vote to impeach Trump, so I wouldn’t put much faith in him.

      Republicans almost have a majority now in the House, and there are a lot of vulnerable Democrats up for election in two years. Republicans have so many representatives in the House that they could possibly get together with a few disgruntled Democrats and bring bills to the House floor despite Nancy Pelosi opposing them.

      The Republicans can bypass Pelosi with just a few Democrat votes, and there are more than a few Democrats (about 25) that are anxious to pass a bill to help people who have lost their jobs and businesses, so there is a lot of pressure to put a clean relief bill on the House floor. Currently, Pelosi is using the need for relief to try to blackmail Republicans into bailing out bankrupt Union pension systems in bankrupt Blue States.

      If the Republicans keep control of the U.S. Senate, should they launch an all-out effort to resist the Biden administration, like the Democrats did to Trump? I think Trump still has appointees to his various government agencies that have not received a hearing in the Senate because of Democrat stonewalling and slowwalking of the process. Imagine that, the Democrats are still holding up Trump appointees he needs to run his government. And they are complaining about a few weeks delay in a transition. Can you say “Hypocrit”? That’s the Democrats’ middle name.

      The answer to the question is no, the Republicans will not stonewall Biden’s appointments, unless it is truly an agregious one. That is the weakness of the Republicans: They follow the rules while the other side happily breaks the rules at every opportunity, and Republicans let them get away with it. Republicans try to play by the rules, while ruthless Democrats couldn’t care less about any rules. All they care about is acquiring and keeping political power. Whatever that takes, is what they will do, and it doesn’t matter if it is legal or not.

      That’s the kind of people who may be governing us in the near future.

  18. The Chinese are just spinning their propaganda. We are waiting for our ‘team’ to present their results.

    Covid is a big deal. The origin of Covid is a big deal and will be a big deal when we find out.

    I heard the US Military determined the covid virus’ origin this summer and decided they would wait until after the US election to make their announcements concerning the origin of the covid.

    I heard the US Military decided when they captured the CIA Frankfort server, that they would explain the origin of covid along with the Frankfort server investigation’s finding, this January.

  19. Nice try China. Told ya. Deflect and create uncertainty. Not that there is anything certain about any of this except total/excess deaths.

    My first pick remains an accidental escape from the Wuhan lab as the most likely.

  20. There is exactly one (1), count’em 1, BSL4 laboratory in China doing virology research, likely including “gain of function” research. It is in Wuhan.
    There are tens of thousands cities, towns and villages in the world. The virus originated in just one, Wuhan.
    Coincidence? Wet markets? No way.
    China unleashed this thing on the world from their lab. My only question is whether it was an accident or an act of war. I lean toward the latter. In either case, when will the world demand reparations for the damages that it caused?

    • In my experience, never ascribe to malice that which is adequately explained by incompetence or stupidity.

      Hanlon’s Razor

    • Pflashgordon posted: “There is exactly one (1), count’em 1, BSL4 laboratory in China doing virology research . . .”

      Not true. According to Wikipedia ( ), as of 2018 there were two BSL-4 laboratories in China doing virology research: one in Wuhan, Hubei Province and another in Harbin, Heilongjiang Province.

  21. It seems to me, to be a pointless concern where Covid 19 originated. What is more concerning is where did the bizarre overreaction to it originate and why?
    Virus come and exist all the time. They change their outer clothes almost as often as we change our underwear. That new look the virus like to have, can take place whenever and wherever.
    Why we have trashed Western society and its economy due to the latest virus fashion, is the big puzzle.
    If you are old and weak and suffering from a physical condition that is reducing your ability to fight off infections, then something is going to get you. Very often it is a virus, usually the flu sometimes just a cold.
    Covid 19 is another cold virus that has been over hyped. I still do not know of a single person in my contacts that has succumbed to Covid 19? It is coming up to a year since Sars Cov-2 arrived. If it was going to be a pandemic it would have exhibited its deadly characteristics by now……wouldn’t it?

    • Over 250,000 deaths in the US alone attributed to COVID-19, with admission that most of these may have had comorbidity factors . . . and you have the gall to say “Covid 19 is another cold virus that has been over hyped.”

      Cold viruses very rarely cause human deaths . . . most often death results for being infected with a strain of the flu virus.

      So, Rod, when was the last time that a flu virus (or combination of flu viruses) together with comorbidity factors killed over one-quarter million US citizens in the span of less than one year? (Hint for you: over the last 79 years, US annual deaths ascribed to the flu have only vary rarely exceeded 50,000 . . . ref: )

      You see, Rod, objective facts matter, independent of your personal experiences or opinions.

  22. That’s a pretty bold allegation!
    The virus probably escaped from the Wuhan virus laboratory through biohazard? and is likely optimized to attack human cells.
    “In 2008, Dr. Zhengli Shi’s group [Wuhan Institute of Virology] swapped a SARS RBM [Receptor Binding Motif] into the Spike proteins of several SARS-like bat coronaviruses after introducing a restriction site into a codon-optimized spike gene. They then validated the binding of the resulted chimeric Spike proteins with hACE2 [human ACE2]. Furthermore, in a recent publication, the RBM of SARS-CoV-2 was swapped into the receptor-binding domain (RBD) of SARS-CoV, resulting in a chimeric RBD fully functional in binding hACE2.”

  23. China is saying Italy was the origin of COVID. But wait, weren’t they blaming the US military just a few months ago? Who will they blame next? You can bet that it won’t be the actual source of the outbreak: China itself.

  24. China says that their total death toll from Covid is 4,600. That is less deaths than Connecticut.

    I only have one question about China’s numbers. WTF?

  25. Strange no mention of this Milan, Italy, Report :

    Scientists of the Italian Fondazione IRCCS Istituto Nazionale dei Tumori have responded to criticism by
    epidemiologists challenging their study reporting the presence of SARS-CoV-2 in patients tested for a cancer prevention program back in September 2019. The study found antibodies to the SARS-CoV-2 virus in some of the blood samples, supporting the notion that those people had contracted the virus and developed antibodies against it at the time the samples were taken.
    There was definitely a version of this virus present in Europe well before 2020. Serious work needs to be done to see if that virus “mutated” from some precursor.

    It looks like China has seen the report. NYC was hit with the Italian variant.


    Unexpected detection of SARS-CoV-2 antibodies in the prepandemic period in Italy

    So instead of “Armageddon” Mike Pompeo’s jingoism, how about some serious science?

  26. Well, the virus originated in the US late June 2019.
    But the source is not so important anymore.
    Important is to fight the dicease.

  27. Now here is the mystery I am trying to solve. I would like to compare COVID 19 total mortality as a subset of total Viral Pneumonia mortality so that a true surplus/deficit of COVID 19 mortality would emerge. Makes sense that surplus/deficit deaths should determined based on comparison of apples to apples. It would be expected that the COVID -19 mortality would have driven the total viral pneumonia mortality above it’s average for the pandemic time period. I don’t think we should assume anything about the relationship of COVID-19 mortality with Viral Pneumonia mortality. The frustrating thing for me is no one has made the comparison.

  28. Viral Pneumonia was surging on the East Coast in Fall 2019…. in some cases a coronavirus was the culprit (I assume one of the 3 non-SARS coronavirus that are attributed to the common cold). I have not seen one study that proves yes or no that SARS CoV-2 (COVID-19) hit the East Coast in Fall of 2019. I do know for sure that a coronavirus was contributing to the surge Fall 2019 viral pneumonia surge but have no idea to what degree since there are many viruses that can precipitate viral pneumonia. In December 2019 I had all the symptoms of COVID…all including the GI symptoms….and prednisone prevented a hospital admission….but I get that sort of thing every 5-6 years cause I am old.

  29. Dear Mr Worral

    “In 1999, two colonels in the Chinese Army, Qiao Liang and Wang Xiangsui, published a treatise that would heavily influence Chinese military planning for the following decades. The book was called
    Unrestricted Warfare. Its central theses were these:

    1 Future wars would be fought across the entire spectrum of human affairs, down to the individual level.
    2 The United States would be China’s principal adversary in any future conflict.
    3 Alternative methods of “fighting,” such as international law, economic warfare, disruption, trade conflict, currency manipulation, cyber war, terrorism, and population movements, could be just as effective as traditional engagements with military weaponry.
    4 American military planners take too narrow a view of the possibilities of future conflicts. They place too much emphasis on hardware and technology, and not enough on social, moral, political, and economic factors.”

    How many aspects of the side-principal rule are evident today?


    • DP

      I must say, the lack of both self and geopolitical-awareness displayed on these pages is breathtaking at times. Sorry, but where have “y’all” been since 1990?

      Why is the thought that nations other than the US (and its hand-picked vassals) ought to run their countries, and organize their strategic affairs, for your ultimate benefit?

      For the record: I am not a particular fan of how the Chinese order their society. That said, I’ve criss-crossed the territory, and read enough, to conclude that a) their history and culture differ significantly enough to – mostly – resist generally shallow Western analysis and b) they have legitimate concerns about the end-goals of aforementioned US/Atlantic Full Spectrum Dominance.


  30. Dont forget China banned domestic flights but kept its’ international flights, ensuring locals were protected but not people from other nations.

    • Thingadonta: “Dont forget China banned domestic flights but kept its’ international flights, ensuring locals were protected but not people from other nations”.

      There is a difference between Ockham’s Razor and the vastly underutilized version by Mr Hanlon. Are you sure that’s going to be a profitable line of reasoning? I suspect – no, I am certain – that once we place EVERY country’s responses under the microscope, on a day-by-day timeline, we’re going to find all sorts of nasty critters scurrying about in the petri.

      Ah…but I get it: your deeper point is that this would be irrelevant because “our” critters and foibles trump Chinese critters and foibles. Because they’re Chinese.

      These are very complex issues, and I suspect (true) historians and (true) scientists will still be poring over the evidence years from now. Unless we all trudge off to a nice, cathartic Global War first – which would render these details irrelevant.

      Prove that China did it, with intent and not through stupidity, and I say make them pay. Till then, let’s hold the matches far away from the detonator fuse. And children.

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