by James Delingpole 8 Mar 2020
Wikipedia has deleted its ‘List of Scientists Who Disagree with the Scientific Consensus on Global Warming’.
Stalin — who set the template for airbrushing inconvenient people out of history — would no doubt have heartily approved of this wanton act of censorship.
But what would probably have pleased him more is the magnificently twisted justification offered by the editor responsible.
“The result was delete. This is because I see a consensus here that there is no value in having a list that combines the qualities of a) being a scientist, in the general sense of that word, and b) disagreeing with the scientific consensus on global warming.”
What this Wikipedia editor is saying, in other words, is that if you’re a scientist who doesn’t believe in global warming then that automatically makes you not a scientist.
In fact many tens of thousands of scientists are sceptical of catastrophic man-made global warming theory, including some of the most eminent experts in the field, among them physicists Dr Richard Lindzen of MIT and Dr Will Happer of Princeton.
But the kind of intolerant leftists who tend to edit Wikipedia pages don’t want you to know this.
Their archived debate as to whether the ‘List of Scientists Who Disagree with the Scientific Consensus on Global Warming’ offers a fascinating, if not exactly surprising, insight into their mindset.
The editors variously refer to these often eminent scientists as “cranks” and “a club of fools”.
One says:
Cranks are well-known to maintain such lists of authoritative-sounding people to bolster their own legitimacy, and this list is just another in this genre. Long past time to kill it.
Another says:
The list is synthesis to mislead the reader into thinking there is significant doubt about the reality of global warming.
This one really, really fancies himself. His contribution is probably best read in the voice of Comic Book Guy from The Simpsons, whom I’d also guess he physically resembles:
Even ten years ago it was clear to me and others that this article had become a badly written nexus of non-notable fringe theories and advocacy for religious points of view. Ten years on, a dozen scientists formerly denying climate change have died. Outside of another dozen die-hards in the United States, virtually no credentialed scientist does not think that climate change is man-made and will, on the whole, have deleterious effects on us and our world. As a scientific community, we also have much more information and data, and the consensus has gotten stronger (close to 99.9 % of scientists agree) as the obituary pages continue to publish the memorials to those who disagree with scientific consensus. Everyone has moved on with their lives. In the meanwhile, I’ve earned a master’s of art in teaching secondary science. I still find students who don’t believe in evolution, and in some quarters, natural selection remains controversial, but absolutely nobody — not teachers, not students, not scholars — seriously denies climate change any more. A list that purports to list the dozen or so people who still deny it to their grave is shrinking each day, and is an example of fraudulently spreading doubt and uncertainty, as noted by Johnuniq. At some time in the past ten years, climate change denial-ism has become the next alchemy, ether, and astronomy. Sure there are a handful of believers in this, Area 51, cold fusion, Occultism in Nazism, AIDS denialism, and the Age of Aquarius, but it’s so few that to list them in an article is to give extreme undue weight to that side. The list also is written as a Gish gallop – a whole series of illogical arguments with their own adherents designed to obfuscate the lack of evidence of the other side. Bearian (talk) 18:13, 14 November 2019 (UTC)
A few brave contrarian voices try to argue against censorship.
One makes the point that the scientists on the list aren’t exactly cranks:
Let’s take a look at the list of people responsible for your so called “fringe theories advanced for religious purposes,” shall we?
Patrick Moore, one of the founders of Greenpeace;
Ivan Giaver, who won the Nobel Peace Prize;
Judith Curry, retired head of the Atmospheric Sciences Department of the Georgia Institute of Technology;
Richard Lindzen, retired head of the Atmospheric Sciences Department of the Massachusetts Institute of Technology, and member of the National Academy of Sciences (you know, that thing Einstein was a member of);
Vincent Courtillot, a member of the French Academy of Sciences;
Khabibullo Abdussamatov, a member of the Russian Academy of Sciences;
John Christy, who is a professor at the University of Alabama at Huntsville, who keeps the temperature data used by NOAA and NASSA, and who contributes to the IPCC reports;
Roy Spencer, who keeps the data with John Christy;
Frederich Seitz, former President of the National Academy of Sciences.
Another has to point out that one of the purposes of Wikipedia is to help people research stuff:
This is a valid list article since it helps people find scientists of this type.
But the best response is this one:
With apologies to people who have been conned into believing that the WP climate area is sound … Who are we kidding here? This is an important, long standing article that gives a tiny sliver of balance to grotesquely POV, essentially permanently vandalized, articles on Climate
HT/Latitude and a bunch of others I’m missing.
Discover more from Watts Up With That?
Subscribe to get the latest posts sent to your email.
I think the Stalinist Comic Book Guy Voice censor meant “astrology”, not “astronomy”.
Now this article was written by people who support the Consensus vies of Climate Change. If they wrote Astronomy, they obviously meant Astronomy. It is the Stalinist Comic Book Guy after all…
To pick on Valid Scientists is to pick on Valid Sciences
The guy recently “earned a master’s of art in teaching secondary science”.
And he still can’t tell his Astrology from a hole in the ground.
And he may be paid, with public tax dollars, to teach the kids as he deems appropriate, given his level of knowledge.
Whoever gave him the Masters, that he paid for, should be questioned.
Cracker Jack
“Whoever gave him the Masters, that he paid for, should be questioned.”
Most every College and University has morphed into money making businesses that their Administrators sell Diplomas “for profit”.
Interestingly enough, WIKI appears to ONLY be silencing Climate views counter to the “Consensus” and not false science.
As is evidenced by this article
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flat_Earth
I found it (the world) was not round . . . but pear shaped, round where it has a nipple, for there it is taller, or as if one had a round ball and, on one side, it should be like a woman’s breast, and this nipple part is the highest and closest to Heaven
Columbus
Gallileo did not go along with the consensus!
re: “Gallileo did not go along with the consensus!”
Neither has Dr. Randell L. Mills (of BrLP), and that drives the likes of more than just a few here (I COULD mention names) insane.
The Wikipedia should publish the list of 87 “consensus scientists”, also known as 97%.
I think this Wikipedia guy who regularly asks for money because he does not believe in Capitalism, but is happy to impose his own warped thinking, needs some sort of boycott.
Any Suggestions?
Cheers
Roger
Thisnis why I never give them money when they come begging.
Wikipedia actually has some good articles. They have a pretty complete one on Maurice Strong, a Canadian oil baron, head of UNEP, the UN group that started the global warming scandal. He had lots of good and bad press for being both in the oil industry, the climate industry, and the United Nations, often at the same time.
If by ‘astronomy’ they meant the holy trinity of Big Bang, Black Holes and Dark Matter, they are probably correct.
This is dangerous beyond belief and another step towards totalitarian rule with the ministry of truth editing out history so as to poison the minds of the masses. The Internet Gulag is in full swing.
There will be no dissenting voices!
So the guys who claim that they are right because most scientists agree with them, now proclaim that anyone who keeps a list of scientists who agree with them are cranks and discredit themselves.
Oh don’t worry, they are still keeping a list. These are the type of people that burn books, they definitely keep lists of people who wrote those books. For when they run out of books to burn.
And they are checking it twice…
I am looking forward to meeting all WUWT contributors in the Gulag. Bernie Sanders tells me that gulags aren’t so bad!
THose who believe they will be the ones running the gulags never mind setting them up.
well maybe he meant astrology ? So much for his alleged MA in secondary teaching.
Oh Dwell
Is he smarter than a 5th grader??
Ah well, we’ll all be toast in 10 (or 12, depending upon who you read) years anyway, so it doesn’t really matter…
That is exactly what scares these zealots most, that someone may actually find some real, useful information on WonkyPedia.
Wikipedia, where objective reality can indeed become a sociological construct 🙂
When you choose “truth over facts” (as Joe Biden recently stated), you are free to believe or reject anything. Truth that is devoid of fact can be anything you want it to be. But usually it takes the form of the latest fad because fads always lay claim to consensus for authority, at least until the fad fades. When you build your scientific house on sand, eventually the sand shifts or washes away and your house falls because it is not anchored to the bedrock of facts. The same fate will eventually overtake the current fad of radical, alarmist climate-change.
So true.
Now, we’re supposed to accept that, since the days of Copernicus and Kepler, science has been merely a tool of Western, white male privilege.
“Help! Help! We’re being oppressed!”🤣
“At some time in the past ten years, climate change denial-ism has become the next alchemy, ether, and astronomy. ” So it this writer an astronomy denier? I hope he meant astrology.
But seriously, this may simply be an effort to avoid litigation over what is clearly intended to be a blacklist for climate scientists. Ask Judith Curry.
Well that is the end of my donations to Wikipedia. I never thought that James would allow the thought police to take over.
I shall keep on sending them $10 every couple of years. This does not change the value of Wikipedia. It is, and always was, completely and utterly useless on any contemporary, controversial subjects. It should only ever be used to search for historical facts, objective explanations of any issue and the like.
It is disappointing, though, that they do not stand up for free speech and free thought today. But sadly, here they are not alone.
Even their “historical facts” are heavily Leftist filtered, and get rewritten regularly as the Party Line shifts.
I am a doctor and use Wiki for many medical details and find it useful.
But beware of learning your history from Wiki. History is a subject long subjected to revisionism….just ask the Armenians…or the Turks…whichever side you favour. And all nations and peoples have their self-illusions. Ask yourself….how is Wiki going to report on the NY Times 1619 Project….the greatest example of politically-correct historic revisionism in recent history? Do you think Wiki will stand athwart progress as defined by the Editors of the NYT and yell “Stop!”? Or will they go along with the program to teach us what a debased, evil nation the United States is with all its wealth and goodness grown out of slavery (ignoring the millions of the world who still risk death, rape, and a hundred difficulties to come to this terrible, benighted racist land (as the NYT sees America)?
Beware of Wiki wherever politics or pet peeves could be involved. Otherwise, a pretty good site for info.
Wow, kwinterkorn. What a bagful of miserable prejudices you are. You studied medicine – obviously not history.
Andy Esperseen – I suggest that you either read, or carefully re re re read what kwinterkorn wrote.
– Is there good reason that your analyses of what “data sources” are reliable or not definitively superior to those of others who may have a different perspective to yours? Which is the main theme of this thread.
Kwinterkorn gave THREE specific examples. You refer to “a bagful of miserable prejudices”.
– Are you suggesting all three examples – when two are counterexamples to each other on the same subject?
– Or are you suggesting the Turks version of the Armenian “events” correct?
Or the Turkish version.
– Or do you feel that his suggestion that reports of historical events should be viewed with due caution constitutes a bagful of whatever.
– Or does his desire to see the 1619 project (which I in far off NZ was not aware of) in a different light to you (seem to you to) merit your “bagful” inclusion of all his other material?
Russell McMahon
Auckland, New Zealand.
PS: Ad hominem responses the expected norm to such ‘challenges’, but not recommended.
Kwinterkorn – I wish to withdraw my little comment about you. I misread you. You are really on the side of the angels!
Sorry.
@Andy Espersen: Well done, Sir!
I agree with Kwinterkorn on the difficulty of evaluating history. And I’m looking forward to learn more about our (mankind’s) astonishing 400 years of slavery (and counting). Greetings.-
yes Im angry that I have donated a small amt in the past
is this that nasty chappie William whatever? behind this?
is an email complaint bombing overdue to wiki?
Because I had to look:
Wiki search for ‘freedom if speech’. (Sigh)
It’s pretty clear to me that Wales *IS* the thought police. I haven’t found anything at Wikipedia to value or admire for many years, possibly it is now time to act against it.
Jimbo had no involvement in the decision.
Ivan Giaver didn’t win the Nobel Peace Prize! He won the Nobel Prize in Physics.
Wouldn’t surprise me if most leftists didn’t realize there was more than one Nobel Prize.
Mike Mann won them both … he has the plaque on his wall.
His Teeth too
and his name is actually Ivar Giaever.
It seems that a Nobel Peace Prize, or belief in a mann’s own heart that he won such, clearly trumps any dumb, old Physics Prize when it comes to AGW. Besides, we can see the catastophic effects of global warming all around us, while no one has EVER observed quantum tunneling with their own eyes!
/sarc
We must respect the fact that Dr Mann “self-identifies” as a Nobel Laureate.
Just hope he doesn’t start running in girl’s track meets.
I liked Michael Mann much better when he played that fat slob dweeb Dennis Nedry in the first Jurassic Park movie…
As long as we are correcting the record, not only did he not win the Nobel Peace Prize, his first name is Ivar and not Ivan and we should spell his last name correctly as well….Giaever. I also think NASA and NOAA are better known for ignoring the satellite data from Christy and Spencer than they are for using it. I could be wrong.
Ivar Giaever having won the Nobel Prize in physics – that wouldn’t do to mention would it? It’s good physics above all that can topple the warmist fake science. AND he’s still alive!
Here’s the first paragraph of Dr. Susan Crockford’s Wikipedia entry:
“Susan Janet Crockford (born 1954) is a Canadian author and blogger who writes about zoology and climate science, specializing in Holocene mammals. From 2004 to 2019 she was an adjunct professor in Anthropology at the University of Victoria.[1] She is best known for her blog posts on polar bear biology, which oppose the scientific consensus[2] that polar bears are threatened by ongoing climate change.[3]”
She opposes the “scientific consensus that polar bears are threatened by ongoing climate change” because the facts show they are not.
At Wikipedia, “we don’t need no stinking facts” when discussing “climate science consensus”.
Much against my better judgement, I donated £3 to this subversive organisation some time ago.
No idea why I did it, the constant bleating when one visit’s the site probably had much to do with it.
I’ll never donate another bean, and am inclined to demand the return of my £3, but I know it would be a waste of time.
There is only one reference I have ever used from it, the article on John Tyndall’s radiant heat apparatus, linked to directly from The Royal Institution https://tinyurl.com/tfs9sop which states:
“He [Tyndall] was the first to correctly measure the relative infrared absorptive powers of the gases nitrogen, oxygen, water vapour, carbon dioxide, ozone, methane, and other trace gases and vapours. He concluded that water vapour is the strongest absorber of radiant heat in the atmosphere and is the principal gas controlling air temperature. Absorption by the other gases is not negligible but relatively small.”
I think that’s fairly clear, and as The Royal Institution endorse it, credible to use in any discussion of atmospheric CO2.
Direct link to the Wikipedia article here: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Tyndall
“Much against my better judgement, I donated £3 to this subversive organisation some time ago.”
HotScot: I too notice Wikipedia’s fundraising campaigns from time to time. I realized from the beginning that they pretty much toed the climate alarmist party line and do not generally give any respect or credibility to climate skeptics and their science. Thus, it is always an easy decision for me to pass on donating any money to their effort.
While I admit to going to Wikipedia sometimes when I want to look something up, this post regarding the deletion of skeptic scientists from that list only serves to reinforce my justification for withholding donations. They don’t want to know what they can do with their request for money from me.
“I too notice Wikipedia’s fundraising campaigns from time to time. ”
I’ve read that Wikipedia doesn’t need those individual donations, but it maintains asking for them, in order to look like a crowd-funded organization that is just scraping by. In fact (I’ve read), it gets $30 million annually from some big leftist NGO.
re: “This one really, really fancies himself. ”
Reminds me of this scene in the movie “Devil’s Advocate” (with Al Pacino):
” Vanity – definitely my favorite sin. ”
https://youtu.be/j6wWGtQjsq0?t=395
The book The Deniers – an excellent introduction to who’s who in the climate world and written by somebody curious to learn – the author was surprised by all the eminent people he found having views contrary to the global warming consensus. He initially expected – given the media coverage – to find a small number of smalltime people, but here were some of the top in their fields with Nobel prizes and achievements behind them. The final chapter is quite telling as he then looks at those behind the global warming scam and the IPCC reports. He finds a small lacklustre clique of under-achievers. No wonder they cling to fame, fortune and spotlight of global warming so hard.
“I see a consensus here.” What could go wrong with that kind of objective decision making?
Testing 1 2 3
Testing 1 2 3 hey
The thing that will most surely destroy us all, in the end, is bad information.
Censorship inevitably results in bad information.
This could get very ugly, very soon.
Could that be the plan?
Still quoting the “consensus” as though it has a place in science. All of which proves the very point that these alarmists are using tactics from all the greats -Stalin, Hitler (Greta), Pol Pot etc.
Unbelievable that this can keep on…
“Still quoting the “consensus” as though it has a place in science.”
What else do alarmists have to use to bolster their arguments other than citing a fraudulent consensus report? Alarmists have nothing. So they are reduced to pretending that just about everyone agrees with their point of view.
Alarmists wouldn’t have to cite consensus if they had any evidence to show people. They don’t have any evidence, so they lie.
If Climate Crisis Science actually did have the power of 97% of the entire Climate Science community in solid agreement (crisis certain), that consensus would have nearly immovable power.
But nowhere near 97% believe that we are headed for toward a certain calamity.
A true consensus in science DOES have significant power but that is alwats HARD WON in real science…won after addressing all serious adversarial positions (not tossing them off with ad hominems) and resolving those arguments to the satisfaction of the vast majority.
But also in real Science, one bit of irrefutable evidence will reset the tables.
Alas, the Science and the Politics has gotten too messy and it’s always been too complicated. There won’t be that one bit of evidence that will be able to close the books on this fraud. Probably not even a 1 C drop in GAT’s over the next few decades (though that would certainly help resolve the political side of things). I hope I live long enough to see Real Science reign supreme.
Sorry to disagree, and I know I’m likely going to p1$$ off people on both sides of the question, but:
“Real Science” is exclusively a matter of the construction of a falsifiable hypothesis, followed by attempts to prove it incorrect, which either fail or succeed. All else is ledger maintenance…
Was Lubos Motl on the “evil denier“ list?
Without a sufficient and falsifiable hypothesis, there is no science. “Climate Science” has failed utterly to articulate one, and the consensus’s protestations that such an hypothesis is not required should be treated with disdain and contempt.
Wikipedia is where truth goes to die! Actually Wikipedia is for persons with short attention spans to check out the politically correct view. Cross-checking not allowed for these fools in a hurry.
Slightly off topic, but the social media socialist with 150,000 followers who spends all his time bashing rich people, turns out to be quite wealthy himself.
https://nypost.com/2020/03/07/youtube-socialist-carlos-maza-slams-the-wealthy-but-lives-in-luxury/
Slightly??
We are talking about nut case leftists who don’t live up to the standards they preach for others.
No, the post is about Wikipedia.
It’s about how nut case leftists use Wikipedia to silence dissent.
Wikipedia sucks….always has, always will.
It is not just climate science the is under threat. It is any challenge to certain theories. In a book titled Darwin’s Doubt, a Chinese scientist says that in China you can’t criticize the government, but you can criticize Darwin. In America you can criticize the government, but you can’t criticize Darwin. In other words criticizing certain Scientific theories in America in like criticizing a totalitarian government.
Of course you can criticize Darwin. Tens of millions freely do. That doesn’t change the fact of evolution by means of natural selection and other processes observed daily.
I like how he writes out “masters of arts” trying to make it sound prestigious.
In short, the guy is now allowed to teach in public HS, ergo he can decide who is a credentialed scientist.
The article only existed for about two years according to the Wayback Machine, web.archive.org.
http://web.archive.org/web/20191001000000*/https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_scientists_who_disagree_with_the_scientific_consensus_on_global_warming
If you want the list, you can find it through:
https://infogalactic.com/info/List_of_scientists_who_disagree_with_the_scientific_consensus_on_global_warming
Infogalactic was set up specifically to combat the lies and distortions of Wikipedia. Still a work in progress, but increasingly good.