Skeptic Strategy for Talking About Global Warming

Guest Post by Ira Glickstein

What should a responsible Skeptic say to an astute audience? When recently invited by the “Technology, Engineering, and Science Plus” group in my community to give a talk and answer questions, I knew I would have an attentive room of tech-savvy professionals. However, they might not be fully tuned in to the details of the Global Warming controversy. Furthermore, they were likely to have opinions closer to the supposed “mainsteam science” orientation than mine.

In this posting, I’ve summarized the main points I think are most likely to align people who are both intelligent and reasonable to the Skeptic side. My Powerpoint (with talking points for each chart in the Notes section under each slide) is available [click here] for you to use and adapt as you wish.

Highlight scene from former VP Al Gore's Nobel and Oscar-winning movie, An Inconvenient Truth. Dramatic correlation between temperature and CO2 over past 600,000 years. Implication that global mean temperature rise will parallel CO2 increases. But, which way does the causation go? {Annotations by ira@techie.com, TVPClub.blogspot.com}

A. Basic Climate Science – Water vapor (H2O), carbon dioxide (CO2), and other “greenhouse” gases cause the Earth Surface to be warmer than it would be if the Atmosphere was just nitrogen.

  1. Light energy from the Sun warms the Earth System, which consists of our Atmosphere and the Surface. Based on satellite measurements, the Sun provides 1366 Watts per square meter (W/m^2) at the Top of the Atmosphere. After accounting for the Earth’s spherical shape and albedo (reflectiveness), the absorbed energy averages out to about 240 W/m^2 for each square meter.
  2. To maintain a relatively constant mean temperature, Output Energy must equal Input Energy, so the Earth System must emit about 240 W/m^2 out to Space, which it does.
  3. We call the Input Energy “light” because we can see (much of) it. We call the Output Energy “heat” because we can feel it. However, whether it is “short wave” energy from the very hot Sun, or “long wave” from the more moderate Earth System, we know that energy is fungible. 240 W/m^2 of one type is equal, power-wise, to 240 W/m^2 of the other. A Watt is a Watt, no matter what :^)
  4. But, there is an “issue” – if we consider the Earth System as a “black body”, according to the laws of physics, for the Earth System to emit 240 W/m^2, it would have to be at a temperature of only 255 Kelvin, where Kelvins are degrees Celsius above absolute zero. (The Earth System is not exactly a black body, but it is close enough for our purposes here.)
  5. You may remember that anything above absolute zero emits radiant energy and that 0.0 Kelvin corresponds to -273ºC or -460ºF. The “issue” is that the Earth Surface has a mean temperature closer to 288 Kelvin, corresponding to about +15ºC or +59ºF. In other words, the Surface is about 33ºC or 58ºF warmer than the “black body” formula would indicate. How to explain this added warmth?
  6. The generally accepted explanation is the Atmospheric “greenhouse effect”. This is true science, but the name is somewhat misleading because a glass greenhouse works mostly by restricting convection while the Atmospheric effect works mostly by restricting radiation. I use “scare quotes” around “greenhouse” to acknowledge this semantic issue.
  7. The Atmosphere passes most of the “short wave” energy from the Sun and absorbs most of the “long wave” energy from the Surface. The absorbed energy warms the Atmosphere and is re-emitted in all directions at a variety of “long wave” wavelengths. A portion of radiation from the Atmosphere passes out the Top of the Atmosphere to Space. A portion is emitted in the downward direction and is absorbed by the Surface. This absorbed radiant energy accounts for most of the extra 33ºC or 58ºF.
  8. A variety of gases in the Atmosphere, primarily water vapor (H2O) and carbon dioxide (CO2), absorb and re-emit “long wave” radiation. These are called “greenhouse gases”.

B. Divergent Views – There is a valid, science-based argument between people I refer to as Warmists, Lukewarmers, and Skeptics. I distinguish their reasoned views from the far out, unscientific rantings of people I refer to as Alarmists and their equal and opposite reaction opponents, who I call Disbelievers.

  1. VP Al Gore was not the first Alarmist, but his public lectures and his Nobel and Oscar-winning movie, An “Inconvenient” Truth, probably did more than anything else to bring Global Warming Alarmism to the fore in the consciousness of the major media and the general population.
  2. The scene depicted above was the highlight of his presentation.
  3. Gore displays the Ice Core record of the past 600,000 years for CO2 (red) and Temperature (blue). He points out the undoubted correlation between the two parameters. When one goes up so does the other. When one goes down, the other does as well. He points out that the then current CO2 level is considerably higher than that of the past 600,000 years, and he projects the future levels of CO2 assuming it continues to rise at current rates. So far, this is all true.
  4. Dramatically ascending high above the stage on his motorized platform, he implies that mean temperatures will rise in proportion to the CO2. (My graphic is annotated in dashed blue to show the implied warming.) If that happens, he warns, more and more of the polar ice will melt, causing the seas to rise and flooding coastal areas. The ground under the polar ice will be exposed, further reducing the albedo of the Surface and causing further warming. We will reach a tipping point with runaway Global Warming.
  5. The villain of Gore’s story is the human race and our habit of burning ever-increasing quantities of fossil fuels (coal, oil, natural gas) that release unprecedented amounts of CO2. This scene, more than any other event, is most likely responsible for the birth of what has come to be known as Catastrophic Anthropogenic Global Warming, CAGW. In other words, catastrophe due to human-caused Global Warming. It has become the mantra of the Alarmists and an excuse for governments to regulate all fossil fuels as well as land use that affects albedo. Since all industry and agriculture and civilized life itself depends upon fossil fuels and land use, the Alarmists give suitably oriented politicos an excuse to regulate and tax and restrict virtually everything. We outdoors types will need an indulgence from the government every time we pass wind. And, we can forget about lighting a campfire :^).
  6. But, as the annotations in my graphic above show, there is a fundamental “Inconvenient” truth about the ice core data. It has absolutely nothing to say about the current Global Warming controversy! Gore was misleading the media and the public when he implied that rising CO2 levels would cause corresponding increases in mean temperatures. In particular, as any scientist who took a close look at the ice core data would see, and as I show in the inset graph in the upper left corner, Temperature always rises eight-hundred or more years before CO2 increases. The same is true in the other direction. The Temperature falls eight-hundred or more years prior to CO2 decreases. What this shows, if anything, is that TEMPERATURE CAUSES CO2, or, that something else causes both to change, with CO2 lagging by hundreds of years. Gore got the direction of causation backwards.
  7. When the falsehood of this implied causation was pointed out, Gore’s apologists claimed that it was a minor matter and, after all, despite the 800-year lag, both Temperature and CO2 were up together and down together for about 5/6ths of the record. Besides, they said, we are currently burning historically unprecedented amounts of fossil fuel, and, we know that CO2 is a “greenhouse gas”, and so on and on. But, the truth is still that the ice core record is of a time when there were no humans to burn fossil fuels, so why did Gore bring it up since it has no relationship to our current situation? Raw, unfettered Alarmism has had its effect on the media, the political class, and we common citizens who have to pay the costs of the phony CAGW panic.
  8. In politics, as in physics, every reaction has an equal and opposite reaction. In the Case of CAGW, that opposite (and equally false) reaction is what I call Disbeliever AGW or DAGW. These are people who use pseudo-scientific arguments in their claim that humans have had absolutely no hand in the mean temperature rise of the past century, or that there has been no temperature rise, or that the basic science of the Atmospheric “greenhouse effect” is untrue, and so on. I do not like to be to critical of the DAGW crowd because, when it comes to general political decisions, they are more likely than not to agree with me than my opponents, but my academic integrity and ethical duty as a licensed professional engineer require me to state what I see as the error of their arguments. (As I have in my WUWT Visualizing series [1, 2, 3, 4, 5])
  9. Having dismissed what I regard as the unscientific Alarmists and Disbelievers, that leaves us with three groups that, for the most part, use rational science-base arguments for their diverse views. Of course, every member of each group has somewhat different views, and any attempt to divide them into three distinct types is bound to cross some lines. So, please consider my grouping as approximate.
  10. Carbon sensitivity, which is the estimate of how much mean temperatures will increase if CO2 doubles from historical or current levels, is one way to determine which of the the three groups a person belongs to. The Warmists tend to accept the UN Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change (IPCC) estimate of 2.0ºC to 4.5ºC. The Skeptics tend to set carbon sensitivity much lower, perhaps 0.2ºC to 1ºC. The third group, which I call Lukewarmers, would suggest 1ºC to 3ºC.
  11. How much of the rise in CO2 is attributable to human use of fossil fuels is also estimated differently. Warmists would blame humans for nearly all of it, while Skeptics would say less than half. Similarly, the blame for the supposed 0.8ºC rise in mean temperatures since 1880 is mostly attributed to human activities, while Skeptics say that data bias “adjustments” by the official climate record keepers is responsible for about a third of the supposed warming, and that natural cycles, over which humans have no control, are responsible for about half of it, leaving only 0.1ºC (or maybe up to 0.2ºC) to human responsibility. Lukewarmers are somewhere in-between.
  12. Skeptics have well-justified suspicions that the official climate data keepers were “cooking the books” to lend whatever support they could to the highest estimates of carbon sensitivity. Around the year 2000, US Mean Temperature data was “adjusted” down by 0.1 to 0.2ºC for years prior to the 1970’s, and upwards by 0.2 to 0.3ºC for years after the 1970’s, increasing supposed warming by 0.3 to 0.5ºC.
  13. The surfacestations.org project published photos of official temperature measurement stations that were very near artificial sources of heat, with most being in the lowest two of the five quality levels established by the government. The poor quality stations were compared to nearby well-located stations. There were large temperature deltas that could only be accounted for if the the stations now poorly-located were originally well-located, but had been influenced by nearby development, such as paved parking lots, buildings, and air conditioning vents.
  14. According to a figure in the 1990 IPCC report, 1100 to 1300 AD saw temperatures in the northern hemisphere that were higher than current levels. However, the IPCC 2001 report included the infamous so-called “hockey stick” chart that managed to make the Medieval Warm Period of about 1000 years ago disappear! (My Powerpoint set includes charts with evidence of each of the aforementioned issues.)
  15. These suspicions were not fully confirmed until 2009 when someone (probably an inside whistle-blower) released emails and computer code from the Climatic Research Unit (CRU) in the UK, and, later that year, a Freedom of Information Act (FOIA) request yielded a stash from the US NASA-GISS (Goddard Institute for Space Studies).

C. Climategate – UK Climatic Research Unit (CRU) emails and the US NASA GISS FOIA emails. What they tell us about the published Global Warming data.

IPCC 1990 recognized Medieval Warm Period (MWP) temperatures were above current levels. IPCC 2001 used the "Hockey Stick" chart that makes MWP disappear.
  1. I refer to the CRU as the Climategate Research Unit or, more simply, the Fudge Factory because the words “fudge factor” appear in their computer code. Phil Jones, PhD, is the CRU Director. He confirmed suspicions about the infamous “Hockey Stick” graph when, in an email, he called it “Mike’s Nature trick” (because a version of that graph appeared in a paper by Dr. Michael Mann in the prestigious journal Nature ). He also wrote that the “trick” was designed to “hide the decline” in tree ring proxy data. The tree-ring expert associated with CRU, Keith Brifa, PhD, admits, in one of the emails that “the recent warmth was probably matched about 1,000 years ago”. (My Powerpoint set includes slides with direct quotes from the Climategate materials.)
2007 email from Sato to Hansen details seven analyses of 1934 vs 1998. 1934 starts off with a 0.5ºC lead and ends up in a dead heat.
  1. Moving on to the FOIA emails from GISS, it is interesting to note that their HQ, in New York City, happens to be in the same building as the famous restaurant where Jerry Seinfeld dined with George, Kramer, and Elaine. (It was never revealed what Kramer did for a living – perhaps he was the chief analyst at GISS :^)
  2. The most revealing email from GISS is reproduced above. It was from Makiko Sato, PhD to her Boss, GISS-Director James Hansen, PhD, detailing the seven different analyses and comparisons of US mean temperatures for 1934 and 1998. The later year was the hottest in the 1990’s, so it was, let us say “inconvenient” that 1934, according to data published by GISS in 1999, was over 0.5ºC warmer. If Global Warming was almost entirely due to recent human activities, and was accelerating, how could the 1930 have been warmer?
  3. Just as the Hockey Stick made the Medieval Warm Period disappear, GISS tried mightily to make 1934 cooler than 1998, but only succeeded in reducing the 0.5ºC lead into a dead heat. Notice that the 0.5ºC “adjustment” is more than half the supposed total warming since 1880.
  4. I would like to trust the work of taxpayer-supported science, but, it seems, we must rely on President Reagan’s advice regarding the old Soviet Union, “Trust, but verify!”

D. What We Can and Should Do – Energy policy (cap and trade scam vs carbon tax). Efficiency, conservation, “green“, and renewable sources.

  1. I am quite sure that Global Warming is REAL (i.e. the mean temperature of the Surface has increased by 0.5 to 0.6ºC since 1880) but, most of that increase is due to Natural Cycles over which we humans have no control.
  2. However, the warming is PARTLY Due to Rising CO2 Levels and human actions are PART of the Cause.
  3. There is not and never has been any real danger of catastrophe or even of serious net detriment to human life due to increased CO2 levels. Indeed, modest increases in these parameters are most likely a net benefit.
  4. However, we Skeptics have to be realistic in the current political climate. Like it or not (and I do not like it) the official climate “Team” (i.e., the “Hockey Team” :^) has convinced the political and media establishment, and much of the population that something has to be done. We cannot fight something with nothing, so we need something more than a passive policy of do nothing because nothing is necessary.
  5. Therefore, I favor reduction of the carbon footprint by efficiency, conservation, recycling, and so on, plus the introduction, if and when economically practical of so-called “Green” energy, including Nuclear, Water, Wind, Biomass and, particularly, “Clean” Coal.
  6. If nothing else, these will do minimum harm and, if successful, will reduce US dependence upon foreign oil. We have spent, and continue to sacrifice too much blood and treasure protecting our access, and that of our allies, to energy from unstable regions of the world.
  7. As for the Cap and Trade scam, it is a Politician’s Delight that rewards powerful Interests, wrecks the economy, and will NOT significantly reduce carbon emissions. It seems to me that some countries and US states that have adopted Cap and Trade have realized their folly and are backing away from it.
  8. You may be surprised that I favor some version of a straight Carbon Tax, collected at the mine, well, and port, with the proceeds returned on an equal basis to citizens and legal residents. Yes, James Hansen and (pardon the expression Ralph Nader) also favor it, but, so do conservative columnist Charles Krauthammer, the Wall Street Journal, and others on the right. My support for this tax is based on what I wrote above, “We cannot fight something with nothing” and “We have spent, and continue to sacrifice too much blood and treasure protecting our access, and that of our allies, to energy from unstable regions of the world.”

I’m interested in your critique and comments. (My Powerpoint presentation is available [click here] for you to use and adapt as you wish..)

5 1 vote
Article Rating

Discover more from Watts Up With That?

Subscribe to get the latest posts sent to your email.

557 Comments
Inline Feedbacks
View all comments
Dave
May 31, 2011 7:49 am

This presentation is way too complicated!
Three points.
1. The planet is warming well inside of natural variation and there is no proof it will continue to warm.
2. The is no real world evidence supporting manmade global warming.
3. Warming is not a danger, warming has always produced positive results.
Support each point with three simple examples. Then conclude with that is wy you are a skeptic.

MarkW
May 31, 2011 7:51 am

Even if the “lukewarmers” are right, and the earth is going to warm up 1 to 3 degrees C.
So freaking what? That’s not enough warming to make a difference in anything. So why should we impose massive taxation on energy in order to reduce what is a non-problem to begin with.

May 31, 2011 7:53 am

Thank you for your excellent clarifications, Dr Glickstein. Alas, like many here, I’m also confused over your suggestions on compromise. A “revenue-neutral carbon tax” is not only a pipe dream (when has any tax in the world remained “revenue-neutral”?), but more importantly, it’s an unnecessary concession to the key Warmist claim, that CO2 is a deletirious gas which needs to be somehow controlled. I can’t think of a single case where a concession on a core issue has done the generous party any good. Such a major give-away of a key principle with concessions to language and paradigm for political, instead of scientific reasons is not, in any way I can see, related to Machiavelli’s musings on practical statecraft, but an attempt to play clever, cynical and ultimately self-defeating “machiavellian” games with a powerful, well-funded, connected and recently, a very frightened and desperate opponent.
Since this battle now is waged primarily in the political, financial and cultural arenas, I would suggest that the simplest, most honest and straigh-forward push-back is still the only effective and principled strategy. We need to show and repeat the plain facts; that Warmist science is a pseudo-science; that Warmism represents identifiable and traceable commercial and political interests; and that adoption of Warmist solutions to a manufactured problem will undeniably result in nothing less than truly catastrophic global disruptions and levels of misery we thought we left behind in our past.

kwik
May 31, 2011 7:54 am

Dave Springer says:
May 31, 2011 at 6:21 am
Yes, that should be enough food for thaught to move Ira G. from Luke-skeptic to Disbeliever.
hehe.

Alan D McIntire
May 31, 2011 7:57 am

I suspect that as cost of oil goes up due to middle east instability, we’d NATURALLY conserve oil and gradually phase in other competitive energy sources REGARDLESS of any carbon tax. Any government intervention would tend to muck up the open market, much as government intervention in the past- urging Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac to take on more subpar mortgage loans mucked up the housing market.
I didn’t appreciate Ira Glickstein’s carbon tax proposal, but I DID appreciate his argument that the proposal is Machiavellian.

Mike from Canmore
May 31, 2011 7:58 am

Ira:
Have you read Ezra Levant’s “Ethical Oil”? Highly recommend it.
The price of crude reflects the magnitude of that risk as perceived by the market. What is the risk behind middle east oil? Essentially, the risk behind that oil is relatively low as perceived by the market. What drives the risk factor of domestic oil, (and I consider US, Canadian and Mexican oil as domestic; perhaps politically incorrect, but I bet you get my drift; I am Canadian BTW).
North America could easily be self sufficient on oil, but why would we when it is cheaper to buy the oil from the middle east?
The bigger question is why is the risk behind domestic oil greater than the political risk associated with totalitarian, right denying, woman abusing, gay hating radical Islam, regimes? Our political risk is all based on the environmental profiteers. The regulations, put in place to to appease that particular voting block, push the cost of exploration and recovery to points where it just doesn’t happen. (An outright ban is essentially pushing the cost to infinity).
The Alberta oil sands are the biggest on going toxic cleanup on the planet and Canadians are getting paid billions by oil companies to do so. Yet, they are demonized by the enviro profiteers. Why? I’m sure there are multitude of reasons but a large one is their green investments can’t economically survive without artificial costs placed on oil and coal. Look at Nat. Gas. Now that there is a glut on the market, due to technological developments, it has fallen out of favor with the enviro profiteers. Your tax at port, etc. only serves to artificially push the risk factor behind oil even higher which in turn makes the enviro profiteers waste of money projects more valid. Those ventures will not work, at least not with today’s technology, and we’ll end up paying for the coal, gas, nuclear, dams, etc in the future. Another question is what will politicians do with that revenue? They already have too much. Chances are they will toss it away on other worthless projects.
Regulations also have another hugely detrimental potential. Mark my words, one day, there will be a substitute for fossil fuels. Probably not in my lifetime which will hopefully at least another 40 – 50 years, but there will be. So the USA, due to its environmental regulations, sends all this money overseas to these unfriendly countries and essentially funds terrorism. Then along comes a substitute and voila, they have these huge expanses of oil sitting in the ground worthless. Congratulations. You financed these regimes through oil purchases and then get nothing for an asset sitting underneath your feet.
While getting off foreign oil is an excellent goal, placing a tax at port is not the answer. Reducing over burdening enviro regulations put in place only to satisfy a voting block of people, (who incidentally couldn’t shout from their metaphorical soap box if it hadn’t been built on the back of oil and coal), is the answer.
Read Ezra’s book. It is excellent.
Cheers
Mike Hodges

MarkW
May 31, 2011 7:59 am

The biggest problem with wind and solar, is not that they are uneconomical at current energy prices. It’s that they plain and simple, don’t work. Neither is reliable enough to be used for base energy production. The fact that they can and do go from 100% to levels much less in a mater of minutes means that some other form of energy production has to be available to take over from them, in a matter of minutes. The only form of energy that can do this is hydro. But hydro is only available in limited parts of the country. Other than hydro, the only other solution is some form of carbon based fuel, kept running in idle. The problem here is that these plants do not have an “idle” setting. These plants must be kept running at near their rated capacity, with the energy being produced just thrown away because it isn’t needed at this moment.
Until there is a proven method of storing terawatts worth or power at an economical price, wind and solar are nothing more than play things.

MarkW
May 31, 2011 8:01 am

Does a new paper which Mr. Watts was a part of show that these suspicions about US temperatures are mostly unfounded, that there is no known warming bias in the US temperature record?

The paper shows no such thing.

kwik
May 31, 2011 8:02 am

G. Karst says:
May 31, 2011 at 6:22 am
“Once AGWists infiltrated our schools and other social institutions, we were outflanked.”
mmmmm…..yes, but it didnt happen that way. They were already in our schools, but under another flag. The red flag. All they had to do was to add green to the red.
Then the flag is brown.

Darren Potter
May 31, 2011 8:03 am

With all due respect to Ira Glickstein, I take exception with his term of “Disbeliever”. The term, like “Deniers”, implies that man-induced Global Warming is settled science or absolute fact, and not being believed by some. Similar, using the term “Alarmist” to describe the pro-pundits of Global Warming (aka Al Gore, Michael Mann) gives them some credibility, where there should be none. One should never give the pro-pundits of Global Warming even a hundredth of a degree F., otherwise they will claim Global Warming is fact.
Given the lack of credible scientific evidence (hype don’t count) to back the claims of Global Warming, the credible scientific evidence that shows humans are not causing Global Climate Change, and the laws of physics and established science that run counter to the arguments set forth by Ira Glickstein’s so called “Alarmist”; a better description for “Alarmist” would be 419ers. In that the 419ers have promoted Global Warming to scam people and their governments out of money to pay for their unscientific non-work, and to force 419ers’ political beliefs and policies on the world.
As for Ira Glickstein’s “Disbeliever”, a better description would be ‘Down to Earth’ (as in those who didn’t fall for the 419ers scam). With the aforementioned description suggesting the term “Ungullible”.

CodeTech
May 31, 2011 8:03 am

Well, I was going to comment with a few corrections, however your document has already “DISMISSED” me out of hand as some sort of crank. So it seems only fair to do the same.

KT
May 31, 2011 8:07 am

I was enjoying what I was reading until I got to ‘D’.
Ira Glickstein, PhD says:
May 31, 2011 at 4:24 am
“Yes, it is re-distributive to some extent..”

It is not ‘to some extent’. Climate policy is all about wealth redistribution.
The Global Warming Policy Foundation posted an November 2010 interview with IPCC official Ottmar Edenhoffer who said, “(I)t’s a big mistake to discuss climate policy separately from the major themes of globalization.”
We all know the UN is trying to rule the world through its environmental governance scheme, Agenda 21, IPCC, NGOs, etc. It makes me sick to think anyone would give even 1/1000th of a breadth of hair to these evildoers.
Edenhoffer goes on to explain, “But one must say clearly that we redistribute de facto the world’s wealth by climate policy… One has to free oneself from the illusion that international climate policy is environmental policy. This has almost nothing to do with environmental policy anymore, with problems such as deforestation or the ozone hole.”
Please, free yourself from the touchy-feely world of appeasement and delete part D.
And please stop mentioning Krauthammer. He’s gotten plenty wrong and on this he is totally wrong. Remember, Krauthammer was once a staunch leftist and expounded the virtues of Marx’s ‘social justice’, and he may even still believe that, I don’t know. What I do know is that if you want some kind of carbon dioxide tax, stand on your own two feet and accept the hits should and when they befall.
No to appeasement. No to climate thugs.

Ed Scott
May 31, 2011 8:07 am

Tuesday, 31 May 2011
Professor Bob Carter
Alan Jones talks to Professor Bob Carter about climate change and a carbon tax.
http://www.2gb.com/index2.php?option=com_newsmanager&task=view&id=9032
“The public can smell a dead fish

Owen
May 31, 2011 8:12 am

You support a carbon tax?!?! Appeasement was tried by Chamberlain. And we all know where that lead. Great article, up until the point you caved into the insane demands of the ecofascists

May 31, 2011 8:14 am

“…We could go all out with Thorium…”
On this point, I wholeheartedly agree.
Anyone who knows the history of thorium reactors knows the U.S. had an early lead.
Take this exerpt from http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/comment/ambroseevans_pritchard/8393984/Safe-nuclear-does-exist-and-China-is-leading-the-way-with-thorium.html
“…US physicists in the late 1940s explored thorium fuel for power. It has a higher neutron yield than uranium, a better fission rating, longer fuel cycles, and does not require the extra cost of isotope separation.
The plans were shelved because thorium does not produce plutonium for bombs. As a happy bonus, it can burn up plutonium and toxic waste from old reactors, reducing radio-toxicity and acting as an eco-cleaner…”
This fact is still true – when seeing the current arguement with Iran. If they were only concerned with supplying their people with cheap, clean energy, they’d see thorium as the answer.
Instead, they’ve put millions into the plants needed to “enrich” the uranium (and leading to the scare of them having “weapons grade” uranium).

Theo Goodwin
May 31, 2011 8:20 am

If this little essay contains your views on Warmista and on Sceptics, then you have given away the argument to the Warmista, something that you admit when you say that Sceptics cannot have nothing so must propose a modest mitigation of CO2.
Your little essay makes the egregious error of accepting Warmista terms for the debate and then attempting to show that, within those terms, Sceptics can present a reasonable alternative set of facts. Given this position, the Warmista have only to insist that the consensus is on their side and they have won. To actually oppose the Warmista, you have to reject they way they frame the debate and recognize that the debate is not about “facts” but about theories and methods.
You point out the dishonesty of the Warmista, Climategate and 1934-gate, and it is important that you do so. However, you say nothing about what this dishonesty says about the quality of science practiced by Warmista. To be in a position where “hiding the decline” is tempting requires people who are scientific buffoons to begin with.
More Coming…

Jeremy
May 31, 2011 8:23 am

I disagree.
The skeptic strategy for talking about CAGW is asking tough questions, and it’s been working quite well so far.
You don’t need slides, you don’t need talking points. Ask people who are sure that the globe is warming and humans are the primary cause tough questions. The best one is this:
–> How many weeks/months/years of no change in temperatures or decline in temperatures would it take for you to question the presumed “consensus” view?
You are guaranteed a good discussion with that one question. That question *will* make someone think. They’re essentially trapped with that question, they must come up with a number at which they feel the consensus is disproved. Most wont want to admit this, because the “science is settled” and it “cannot be wrong.” But if they think like that, then you can nail them for not thinking scientifically, they’ve essentially conceded that they act on faith, not disprovable hypotheses.

Mike Fowle
May 31, 2011 8:26 am

I do like the reasoned and sensible tone of your article. Although I think people like Al Gore are snake oil salesmen, there are many genuinely concerned people who worry about these issues and are more likely to be persuaded by reason than vitriol. I know that for many CAGW is akin to a religion but the best way to get through to them is the quiet voice of reason.

May 31, 2011 8:44 am

Ira says: ” A Watt is a Watt, no matter what :^)”
If this were absolutely true (temperature wise) then the hottest spot on land would be the square meter underneath the 50000 W transmission towers of several radio stations.

Latitude
May 31, 2011 8:46 am

Smokey says:
May 31, 2011 at 3:35 am
Ira has a talent for writing articles that generate lots of resposnses. I like that.
====================================================
true…..
I’m amazed at the amount of people that think this is a good presentation though……

Ian W
May 31, 2011 8:48 am

steptoe fan says:
May 30, 2011 at 9:10 pm
yes, a good summary, still, it’s hard to swallow and stick to the basics when the AGW crowd seems to continually have their way with govt and media. makes a person want to repeatedly bat them with every exposed falsehood the IPCC cranked out.
in Seattle, this same group of the agenda have had their way for decades now, and the public schools have been teaching this gospel long enough that it is simply a matter of we are past the science now …
so, what’s a heated rhetoric correct comeback for … we’re past the science ?

They said something similar to Galileo when he said the Earth orbited the Sun – were they correct?
Should “we are past the science” have been said to Einstein when he showed the consensus Newtonian concepts were incorrect?
For science to advance it is almost always the consensus that is incorrect

Keith
May 31, 2011 8:54 am

New research published in the Proceedings of the National Academy of Sciences on the Norse disappearance from Greenland shows a significant temperature drop around 1100 AD as well as an earlier episode in 850 B.C. Climate variability with warming and dramatic cooling is acknowledged in this National Academy of Sciences-funded research.
http://news.brown.edu/pressreleases/2011/05/vikings

Theo Goodwin
May 31, 2011 8:54 am

You do not take up the question of theory at all. This is a most egregious error. As anyone familiar with scientific method knows, to consider facts independently of the theory that is used to specify and explain them is to consider them in a void. Also, the matter of theory is the Achilles Heel of the Warmista position because they have none. Well, of course, they use Arrhenius’ theory when they claim that atmospheric CO2 can reduce the flow of radiation from Earth to space. However, to draw conclusions about atmospheric warming from Arrhenius’ theory requires a theory of forcings. Specifically, Warmista have no physical hypotheses (no science) which can be used to explain and predict whether atmospheric CO2 will cause an increase or decrease in atmospheric temperatures. In other words, Warmista have no scientific account of warming produced by CO2.
Your constant reliance on the “facts” causes you to miss the absolutely crucial point that Warmista have no clothes. All that they have been able to present to the public are the hockey stick, Hansen’s ever-changing temperature records from the 1930s, and similar matters. Just think how little actual science went into the hockey stick.
After 1960, the tree ring data began showing a decline in temperature while thermometer data showed an increase in temperature. Briffa stated that he did not know what caused the tree ring data to decline. Do you not understand that the man admitted that he did not understand the decline. Was it a change in moisture? Who knows what it was? To this day, no one knows because Briffa did not have the scientific instinct to pursue the matter. But the one thing that can be known is that only vastly incompetent scientists will present tree ring data as a proxy for temperature when they do not know what natural features cause tree rings to change size. All of climate science is this weak and you are overlooking it. Why? Are you a Warmista?

Bob Kutz
May 31, 2011 9:02 am

Great summary and analysis of the full body of arguments surrounding AGW. Two points;
I am pretty sure in section B item 5 you meant to say anthropogenic instead of anthropomorphic.
Also; your final analysis . . . I will refrain from using the words that come to mind, but I strongly disagree with the notion we should just go along with the CAGW crowd and see where we end up. LETS BE CLEAR: A CARBON TAX IS JUST ANOTHER FORM OF CAP AND TRADE. YOUR RECOMMENDATION TO JUST GO ALONG WITH THE CAGW CROWD MAKES ME WONDER IF YOU ARE PRESENTING A TROJAN HORSE! You know; Win the argument by getting the other side to forfeit on the end game in the name of compromise. That kind of rope-a-dope stuff has no place in the world of scientific or political debate. We cannot achieve progress by solving problems that do not exist.
Conservation is a prudent strategy in all things, and doesn’t need some fairy tale about the evil air spirits to be credible.
We don’t solve our problems by putting on masks and dancing around a fire anymore, or making necklaces out of chicken bones and invoking magic spells. What you are advocating is, in effect, appeasing the CAGW crowd by allowing them to have the dance floor at night. If you do that, eventually all of the villagers will see your concession as an admission of the science, and the witches will soon be calling for an end to the blasphemers. This game has been played before.
Do not get confused here. Win it on the science and make the charlatans find a new job.

May 31, 2011 9:15 am

Mr. Glickstein, the “Disbelievers” are out in full force on this thread and are coming after you for talking about physics.

1 5 6 7 8 9 23