The BBC is Wrong, Individuals’ Sacrifices Will Not Save a Planet That Doesn’t Need Saving Anyway

From ClimateREALISM

By Linnea Lueken

A recent post at the BBC, titled “Seven proven ways to help the planet in 2025,” claims that the planet is threatened by global climate change due to human activity, and lists seven changes people can make in their lives save the planet by curbing emissions. The suggestions include: giving up meat; stopping flying; buying fewer clothes; reducing the carbon footprint of keeping a pet, if you keep one at all; using alternative home heating technologies; supporting fossil fuel divestment; and reducing plastic use. While none of these suggestions are novel, they are also not going to accomplish what the BBC claims, both because human activity is not threatening the planet via carbon dioxide emissions, and because many of these suggestions actually do not reduce emissions or are targeting areas that won’t have any measurable impact even if emissions reductions were desirable. For reasons of brevity, this post will only a address a few of the BBC’s suggestions in detail.

Right out of the gate, the BBC fearmongers with the claim that 2024 saw the first ever time that the “critical 1.5°C threshold was breached for a full year,” which according to the writers reinforces an “urgent need to rapidly cut global emissions.” As Climate Realism has discussed several times, including here, here, and here, the 1.5°C threshold is arbitrary and meaningless as a scientific measurement, it is merely a political tool. The planet has been much warmer in the past, and parts of the world have surpassed that measure for decades already with no catastrophic results. Now that the global threshold has been passed, when the media previously promised catastrophic events would follow, nothing has happened. There was no increase in extreme weather, and other forecasted tipping points have not materialized.

Even with the political threshold surpassed, the BBC says it is not too late, insisting there is still time to make the rapid emissions reductions necessary to save the planet. BBC admits that most of the high-level emissions reductions they want to see happen are beyond the scope of individuals, consigned to the realm of big-government policymaking, but says individual efforts still matter.

First on the list of suggestions is one Climate Realism has covered extensively before: “Eat a plant-based diet.” The BBC claims that “it’s widely agreed among the scientific community that to rescue the global climate from ever-warming temperatures, one of the most impactful ways our species can change its behaviour is to eat less meat.” They claim that vegetarian diets produce less carbon dioxide. Available real-world data refutes this claim.

For instance, regarding the emissions claims, Environmental Protection Agency data indicate that livestock actually represent just 3.9 percent of U.S. greenhouse gas emissions, compared to crop agriculture’s 10.2 percent. (See graphic below)

Cattle-GHG
Figure 1. Greenhouse gas emissions by sector in the United States. Note that beef production is less than half of the entire livestock sector, at just 2 percent. Source: Data from U.S. Environmental Protection Agency. Graphic by Anthony Watts. Artwork icons in graphic licensed from 123rf.com.

Notice also that agriculture in general make up a very low percentage overall of Americans’ contributions to greenhouse gas emissions.

Next, the BBC recommends people take public transportation, trains, and cars, instead of flying when they go on trips. As an added bonus, according to alarmists, “reducing flying will also likely mean you travel closer to home, reducing carbon even further.” If that wasn’t presumptuous enough, suggesting that people should not go on trips far from home, the BBC highlights an individual who biked from London to Sweden, which BBC acknowledges “cost more and took far longer than the plane would have,” as an exemplar for the rest of us. This is, again, totally impossible for most people who need to take a business trip or want to take a well-earned vacation. Most people do not have the luxury of time or funds to take extended trips.

The BBC also recommends buying fewer clothes, reducing plastic use, and reducing one’s carbon footprint of owning a pet by either eschewing pet ownership entirely or, hilariously, feeding them “sustainable” foods like fish and insects. With many global fish stocks being overfished, putting more pressure on global fisheries to feed pets seems environmentally questionable, at the very least. Concerning the suggestion to feed pets insects, Climate Realism has previously discussed the possible dangers of insect-based diets that climate alarmists have proposed.

Changing the way people heat their homes is the next recommendation from the BBC, but most of their suggestions are either expensive, or something that requires major civil infrastructure changes like using heat generated by sewers to warm homes. Obviously, that is not something the average person can actually do on his or her own, despite this allegedly being an article about individual efforts to reduce emissions. Heat pumps, predictably, are among the suggested replacements for traditional boilers, but heat pumps do not work well everywhere at all times. They lose efficiency and effectiveness in colder weather and some companies ironically recommend installing a gas furnace as backup to avoid spiking electricity bills. They are also an expensive option, once again pricing out people who are not well off.

The sixth suggestion from the BBC is leaning into the Environment, Social, and Governance (ESG) and fossil fuel divestment schemes for pensions and investment. The BBC points out that banks invest in fossil fuel companies, “and while the money you put in the bank doesn’t directly go towards this, experts say that it can make a difference to their social license.” The BBC is effectively saying that people should pressure banks and other institutions to quit supporting fossil fuel companies. All this would achieve is raising the cost of necessary fuels, which will greatly increase costs across the board, accomplishing nothing more than hurting average folks in the process. Countries that don’t care about emissions, meanwhile, like China, will continue to produce just as much and the benefit in the end will be nil, as discussed in the guest post “The SEC’s Risky Plan to Decarbonize the U.S. Financial Markets.”

Finally, the last suggestion is to reduce plastic use. While reducing waste in general is a good thing, single-use plastics have undoubtedly been a benefit for sanitation. In healthcare settings, single use plastics reduce the risk of contamination and help hospitals stay sterile environments. Plastic films used in grocery stores for food packaging reduce food waste by preventing spoilage of meats in particular. The BBC does not make much of an argument related to emissions in this section but rather trash and oil use in general, so we will not dig in too deep.

The bulk of the BBC’s arguments lean on emissions reductions, calling for actions that are unnecessary and more painful than helpful; human emissions of carbon dioxide are not endangering the planet or making Earth unlivable. The amount of carbon dioxide in the atmosphere has increased and decreased over the millennia, and human contributions today account for just 3.4 percent of annual emissions. The rest comes from natural sources. Crunching the numbers finds that human emissions of carbon dioxide may produce about 0.28 percent of the atmospheric gas related warming effect on Earth. That is hardly alarming. Since the alleged catastrophic impacts have not come to pass despite more than a hundred years of modest warming, accompanied by a steady increase in carbon dioxide, all of the efforts promoted by the BBC article –where they pertain to emissions—are more likely to reduce humans enjoyment of life, comfort, and freedom, than benefit them or the planet.

Looking at how many of the most prominent and elite climate scolds actually live their lives as opposed to what they preach for others, one suspects that they will keep eating their meat heavy four star meals, filling their room-sized walk-in closets with expensive haute couture clothes and shoes seasonally. They will continue to drive powerful fossil fuel cars while keeping an electric vehicle as a backup status symbol to trot out at green virtue signaling publicity events, and take their private jets to luxurious locations around the world, while paying pet sitters to feed their pure bred “animal companions” the most expensive, trendy pet food or even human cuisine. They will do all this while advising average working folk to buy second hand clothes, eat bugs, live in densely packed locations near rail lines, and not take vacation. After all, the elites know what’s best, the hoi polloi must sacrifice to save the planet.

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John Hall
January 7, 2025 6:27 am

“Reducing plastic use” highlights the fact that this is a virtue-signaling catechism for the technologically clueless. Before plastics most things that we now use plastic for were made from metal, leather, and wood. They used more energy to make, more energy to move because heavier, and ultimately rusted and rotted, requiring replacement.

Scissor
Reply to  John Hall
January 7, 2025 6:43 am

Yes, for example, hardly anyone wears glasses having glass lenses anymore.

In any case, most are unlikely to voluntarily reduce the quality of their lives. We are to become more like slaves, forced to submit, to work more and harder for less. Ultimately, we are the carbon to be forcefully eliminated as the prevailing psyops can persuade only so many to give up their freedoms and lives.

Reply to  Scissor
January 7, 2025 2:25 pm

I have recently switched back to glass lenses. They are now fantastically better than plastic, especially for high prescriptions like mine. They are thinner, lighter, and don’t scratch.

I’ve been conned by opticians (actually sales people for frames & lenses, who ‘rent’ actual opticians merely to test eyes) for decades. The best glasses shops are those actually owned by the opticians, not sales shills for high-priced frames and lenses. These people give you the real deal, not what is ‘trending’ today.

Reply to  John Hall
January 7, 2025 7:16 am

and, generally, plastic is lower cost- important for lower income folks

strativarius
January 7, 2025 6:53 am

The BBC is a premier organisation for the promotion of approved narrative [verified] propaganda – for adults, and especially children.

The science is settled. As they say.

J Boles
January 7, 2025 7:00 am

We peasants must sacrifice more, so the elites have more, as they know what is best for the Earth and us peasants.

MarkW
Reply to  J Boles
January 7, 2025 2:13 pm

I’ve been saying for years that the primary reason why the elite want the polloi to travel less, is that they want smaller crowds at their favorite vacation destinations.

January 7, 2025 7:14 am

“an individual who biked from London to Sweden”

duh! 🙂

Scissor
Reply to  Joseph Zorzin
January 7, 2025 7:44 am

Google calculates a route that involves car transport and or a train and ferry.

strativarius
Reply to  Scissor
January 7, 2025 8:38 am

Calais is a 20 odd mile swim…

Scissor
Reply to  strativarius
January 7, 2025 9:41 am

I guess big knobby tires might help one to float.

Tony Cole
Reply to  strativarius
January 7, 2025 11:04 am

difficult with a bicycle

Reply to  Scissor
January 7, 2025 10:44 am

It cost more than a flight. As costs reflact energy use to a certain degree then one can assume that the CO2 footprint was fairly large. Google reckons that’s a four day bike ride so three nights sleeping under a hedge if you want to avoid the greenhouse gas emmissions of an overnight stay in a hostel/hotel.

Reply to  Joseph Zorzin
January 7, 2025 8:49 am

Well, if they can build castles in the air why not bicycle paths on the sea?

Reply to  ballynally
January 7, 2025 8:51 am

Come to think of it..maybe they had one of those water bicycles. They are fun although a tad tricky on the choppy North Sea..

Scissor
Reply to  ballynally
January 7, 2025 9:41 am

AOC wants a high speed train to Hawaii.

0perator
January 7, 2025 7:37 am

Beware collective salvation schemes. It’s always a cult.

January 7, 2025 7:46 am

Remember, people who want to lower your standard of living are not your friends.

Bill Toland
Reply to  doonman
January 7, 2025 9:43 am

Especially when they have absolutely no intention of reducing their own standard of living.

January 7, 2025 8:09 am

No phone, no lights no motor cars,
Not a single luxury,
Like Robinson Crusoe,
As primitive as can be.

Scissor
Reply to  Fraizer
January 7, 2025 9:42 am

Mary Ann.

KevinM
Reply to  Fraizer
January 7, 2025 1:03 pm

Thanks for spelling Robinson Crusoe correctly

John Hultquist
January 7, 2025 8:17 am

The BBC’s advice is how to feel good about being poor.
If the entire Corporation were to vanish from Earth, there
would be a multitude of benefits.

taxed
January 7, 2025 8:43 am

I think the BBC should be reminded of the claims from the past that the climate lobby have made.
I mean for example how has the claim that the Arctic ice sheets will have disappeared during the summer by 2025 has worked out for them.
If there claims in the past have proved to be utterly rubbish, why on earth should we take their claims about the future seriously.

January 7, 2025 8:47 am

I am ok with the BBC suggests..Virtue signalling and suggesting. If it only halted there..!

January 7, 2025 8:49 am

CV checks:

Zaria Gorvett; MPhil, veterinary medicine
Martha Henriques; MSci, History and philosophy of science
Katherine Latham; MA, Interactive journalism (after music and modern languages)
Lucy Sherriff; (I couldn’t find any educational attainments)
Jocelyn Timperley; MA, Journalism, following MSc chemistry (!)

So…no relevant expertise between them, although one of them does have a degree in chemistry.

Not very authoritative, but with only one music major in the team they are stronger than most BBC climate writing teams.

Coeur de Lion
January 7, 2025 9:12 am

Makes me sick. Why should I pay for my TV licence to have it spent on this rubbish?

Reply to  Coeur de Lion
January 7, 2025 2:29 pm

Be glad that you live in one of the few developed countries that allow you to choose. Most just make you pay in taxes.

I’ve never paid for a TV licence in the uk. In Australia I was forced to, but now I’m retired I don’t pay income tax any more, so don’t have to support the ABC.

January 7, 2025 9:12 am

A rare occasion when I can agree with the bulk of the content of a WUWT post.

The idea of a personal ‘carbon footprint’ was misdirection originated by the fossil fuel lobby.

It was invented by a PR company working for BP in an attempt to displace responsibility for climate change away from corporate polluters and onto the individual.

Personal ‘carbon footprints’ are like a drop of rain in a hurricane compared to the carbon pollution generated by the fossil fuel industry.

Anthony Banton
Reply to  TheFinalNail
January 7, 2025 9:20 am

Very good comment

Reply to  Anthony Banton
January 7, 2025 1:27 pm

No it isn’t. It’s blatant misinformation.

The footprint idea was “invented” by Mathis Wackernagel and professor William Rees in the 90’s, they have nothing to do with the fossil fuel industry.

Mr Wackernagel is now in fact the President of the Global Footprint Network.

Their work is used in countless reports by organizations like:

World-Wide Fund for Nature (WWF),
World Economic Forum,
International Union for Conservation of Nature (IUCN),
UN Environment,
European Environment Agency.

Reply to  Alpha
January 7, 2025 1:46 pm

Seems Wackernagel has made a very lucrative income for himself from that piece of anti-science nonsense !!

Bet he has a huge “carbon footprint” of his own, and his company has the “carbon footprint” of a medium sized town.

Reply to  Alpha
January 7, 2025 3:41 pm

1990’s…. That agrees with the following link

The Evolution of GHG Accounting and Corporate Climate Disclosures | World Resources Institute

Also found the below.. LCA’s date back to 1974.

Early commercial software… 2000 or before

Reply to  Alpha
January 7, 2025 3:43 pm

Image didn’t attach..

accounting
MarkW
Reply to  Anthony Banton
January 7, 2025 2:17 pm

No matter how blatant the lie, so long as it supports the narrative, the usual trolls will cheer for it.

Anthony Banton
Reply to  MarkW
January 7, 2025 10:59 pm

My sentiments precisely !

Reply to  Anthony Banton
January 8, 2025 1:38 am

Then why do it !! ??

Anthony Banton
Reply to  bnice2000
January 8, 2025 8:15 am

Because it is what the science says.
Wheras what you say is not, and just your opinion.
Which matters not a jot.
I know which my money is on.

Reply to  Anthony Banton
January 8, 2025 11:09 am

The measured science says there is no warming by atmospheric CO2.

You keep proving that, buy not producing any

Reply to  Anthony Banton
January 10, 2025 12:33 am

Yes only a charlatan like you would come out with a statement “the science says”.

There is no such thing as “THE SCIENCE”.

Take lesson or two from Feynmann to enhance your understanding of what constitutes science really is about.

Derg
Reply to  Anthony Banton
January 8, 2025 3:07 am

Hey you are the one who thinks CO2 is the control knob

Anthony Banton
Reply to  Derg
January 8, 2025 6:12 am

No.
The climate science community thinks it does.
By employing empirical science – which you and many others on here reject, as you know better, of course.

It is on geological time-scales, yes. Because it does not condense out.
Without it Earth’s temp would depend on WV content solely for it’s GHE, which keeps it’s average temp 33 degs above it’s BB temp of 255K. In which case there is nothing to stop a runaway cooling feedback.
Say if all CO2 were to be ridded (magically and hypothetically) from the atmosphere this winter. There would be no floor at which the non-condensing GHGs (CO2/CH4/N2O) would prevent the surface temp from falling in the long NH nights as the land cools strongly over time, and successive winters’ WV content and therefore it’s GHE diminishes.
So more snow falls and the icesheets linger and thicken … and so it goes on with WV content (it being dependent on air temp) falls further…less WV …. colder … less WV … colder etc etc.

https://web.archive.org/web/20170705110851id_/http://www.atmos-dynamics.damtp.cam.ac.uk/people/mem/co2-main-ct-knob-lacis-sci10.pdf

comment image

“Ample physical evidence shows that carbon dioxide (CO2) is the single most important climate-relevant greenhouse gas in Earth’s atmosphere. This is because CO2, like ozone, N2O, CH4, and chlorofluorocarbons, does not condense and precipitate from the atmosphere at current climate temperatures, whereas water vapor can and does. Noncondensing greenhouse gases, which account for 25% of the total terrestrial greenhouse effect, thus serve to provide the stable temperature structure that sustains the current levels of atmospheric water vapor and clouds via feedback processes that account for the remaining 75% of the greenhouse effect. Without the radiative forcing supplied by CO2 and the other noncondensing greenhouse gases, the terrestrial greenhouse would collapse, plunging the global climate into an icebound Earth state.”

Yes, yes, I know peeps here don’t accept the above, else, of course CO2 would indeed be the climate control knob and your stance would be demolished.

Reply to  Anthony Banton
January 8, 2025 11:10 am

Experiments with GISS model E.. Oh ok… That’s funny ! 🙂

All the assumptions and errors from Arrhenius built in.

Ignoring the actions of thermalisation, convection, conduction , and bulk air movement.

Reply to  Anthony Banton
January 7, 2025 3:01 pm

What’s your carbon footprint, blanton?

Anthony Banton
Reply to  karlomonte
January 7, 2025 11:03 pm

I am currently caring for my dementia afflicted Mum.
I have a 2 lt diesel in which I do ~ 5k ml/yr.
When I finally get back to my house, when Mum is put in a home, I have the benefit of Solar panels.
I also have a log burner.
And yours?

Anthony Banton
Reply to  Anthony Banton
January 7, 2025 11:05 pm

Oh and my surname is Banton, without the l (sarc).
And what would yours be?
Is there a reason why you are anonymous?

Reply to  Anthony Banton
January 8, 2025 7:13 am

What’s your carbon footprint?

I also have a log burner.

So pretty big, then.

Anthony Banton
Reply to  Tony_G
January 8, 2025 8:17 am

No it’s quite a small one actually. as I only have a bungalow.
Also the wood is locally sourced – well was 6 years ago when I was able to use it.

Reply to  Anthony Banton
January 8, 2025 10:22 am

How much “carbon” (and other pollution) does that log burner produce per BTU vs. other heat sources? It seems to me that if you’re really concerned about carbon pollution, you would choose a cleaner heat source.

Reply to  Anthony Banton
January 10, 2025 12:40 am

So you are looking for sympathy now on here with your nonsense posts?

You are suffering the usual ME ME ME syndrome.
Is that the legacy of a state funded office of propaganda the MO??

You seem to be unaware, the dementia plague is not confined just to you or the outsize ego you project.

What you fail to understand is we take issue with your propagandising and antiscientific argumentations.

Frankly I don’t give a monkey about your family or wood burning, and I don’t expect to provide you with details of our heating either.

Reply to  TheFinalNail
January 7, 2025 9:30 am

Carbon Credits, another scam..

Reply to  TheFinalNail
January 7, 2025 9:35 am

You would not be the person distinguishing between Climate Change and Carbon pollution or make any distinction at all. Because you use..mmm..Big Words.
So, in order to give you a chance here, start with answering what kind of ‘carbon pollution’ you mean..

Reply to  ballynally
January 7, 2025 9:38 am

And just to point out: ‘carbon’ and ‘pollution’ do not logically go together and you seem to think they do..

Reply to  ballynally
January 7, 2025 10:56 am

CO2 itself isn’t a pollutant. It’s a natural component of the air – one of the ‘trace gases’.

However, it becomes a pollutant (in that it now harms us) above a certain level of concentration, as we now plainly see in our current era of CO2 (and CH4, and NOX, etc) man-made climate change.

By the way, way ‘big words’ did I use??

Reply to  TheFinalNail
January 7, 2025 11:38 am

CO2 is not pollution at any reachable level in the atmosphere.

It is a highly beneficial gas that provides for all life on Earth.

It is currently at very low level compared to optimum plant needs.

Reply to  TheFinalNail
January 7, 2025 11:53 am

(in that it now harms us)”

There is absolutely zero evidence that CO2 is causing any harm, anywhere, to anything, at current or any future possible atmospheric level.

MarkW
Reply to  bnice2000
January 7, 2025 2:22 pm

In fact, CO2 at the current levels greatly benefits us, and will continue to benefit us as levels continue to increase.

Reply to  TheFinalNail
January 7, 2025 12:36 pm

Seeing your reply it is not worth my time responding..

Reply to  TheFinalNail
January 7, 2025 12:53 pm

There is also zero evidence that CO2 has any effect on the climate.

MarkW
Reply to  TheFinalNail
January 7, 2025 2:19 pm

For almost the entire history of life on Earth, CO2 levels have been higher than they are today. For most of that time, CO2 levels were above 5000ppm. The pre-industrial level of 280ppm, was getting dangerously close to the point where plants start dying.

PS: Where’s this climate change that you whine about? When you check the full record, nothing that’s happening now, hasn’t happened before.

Anthony Banton
Reply to  MarkW
January 7, 2025 11:12 pm

It happened “before” when the Earth was a very different planet. When The sun’s output was weaker and at times when it’s orbit meant that icesheets could form over northern high latitudes.
If there had been major volcanism then the aerosol load in the atmosphere could have lasted decades and allowed an ice-ball Earth to form … which we think did happen.
Also need to be considered is the configuration of the continents, in being able to allow ocean currents to transport heat to the poles.
The colder the planet then greater it can support high atmospheric CO2 content.
Not comparable.

Reply to  Anthony Banton
January 8, 2025 1:23 am

There is no evidence that CO2 causes warming.

You have shown that time and time again.

Current levels of atmospheric CO2 are very low compared to plant requirements

“The colder the planet then greater it can support high atmospheric CO2 content”

That is a “complete nonsense” sentence.

Vostok data shows that the cold periods have far less atmospheric CO2.

Derg
Reply to  Anthony Banton
January 8, 2025 3:10 am

The colder the planet then greater it can support high atmospheric CO2 content.
Not comparable.”

science 😉

Anthony Banton
Reply to  Derg
January 8, 2025 6:16 am

Thankyou.
It is.

Reply to  TheFinalNail
January 7, 2025 2:36 pm

Oxygen is a pollutant by that logic

Reply to  Zig Zag Wanderer
January 7, 2025 6:13 pm

The entire periodic table of the elements are pollutants by that logic.

Anthony Banton
Reply to  doonman
January 7, 2025 11:29 pm

Err, we are talking of Earths atmosphere, that is supporting it’s biosphere!
That logic comes from its existence in the atmosphere and not some sort of artificial environment, and is not applicable to “Oxygen” or “The entire periodic table of the elements”. By dint of the simple fact that mankind cannot and does not manufacture and eject 400+ millions of tons of the stuff (whatever) into the atmosphere every year.

Reply to  Anthony Banton
January 8, 2025 1:25 am

we are talking of Earths atmosphere, that is supporting it’s biosphere!”

Yes, and CO2 is the main substance that does that.!

Current levels are far lower than optimum for plant growth.

Enhanced atmospheric CO2 is totally beneficial.

ZERO harm.

Anthony Banton
Reply to  bnice2000
January 8, 2025 6:21 am

Current levels are far lower than optimum for plant growth.”

Our concern should be for the stability of the biosphere.
It was stable pre-industrial, so mankind has been able to develop an complex society and grow to 8bn +.

That some plants grow better with higher CO2 is irrelevant to that as they had quite sufficient to meet our needs.

Reply to  Anthony Banton
January 8, 2025 11:14 am

Plants feed the world.. of course plant growth is relevant.

It is CO2 and modern fertilisers that enable us to feed the world’s expanding human population.. mostly.

Reply to  Anthony Banton
January 10, 2025 12:50 am

“the stability of the biosphere.
It was stable pre-industrial”

you are writing utter bollox all over again.

STABLE???
Presumably you want to live in the dickensian era of the Thames freezing over, or in the 18th century when there was mass famine.

You ignore the facts, land mass is a small minority of the earth’s surface, and the fact the MWP and 1st century AD were much warmer than today.
+
of course the fact CO2 levels FOLLOW temperature and always have, NOT CAUSED IT!

Reply to  TheFinalNail
January 7, 2025 6:11 pm

Plants already evolved to make use of 4X the current level of Atmospheric CO2. They evolved first and are the only reason you are here.

Once again, you fail to denote the “proper” level of atmospheric CO2 or how that’s been derived by humans.

The hubris you demonstrate in your postings is always laughable.

Anthony Banton
Reply to  doonman
January 7, 2025 11:40 pm

If CO2 where to be maintained at such high levels during its recent past then mankind’s history would have been very different.

The proper level can only be gauged by how CO2 balances the Earth’s temperature such that it maintains a stable environment for us.
At present it is 280 ppm (now – 425ppm), which was the level at which mankind was able to have an environment that was stable enough for long enough to build our current civilisation.
Stability in temp to balance ice formation/melt.

Reply to  Anthony Banton
January 8, 2025 1:27 am

The proper level is way more than there currently is.

There is no evidence that CO2 has any effect whatsoever on the global temperature

Arctic sea ice has been stable since 2007, after recovering from a dangerously high extent in the LIA and late 1970s.

Still a lot higher than it has been for most of the last 10,000 years.

“maintains a stable environment”

Stable, as in lowest level for plant survival ?? wow !!

Is that really what you want ??

There is nothing happening to the environment except enhanced plant growth… and a slight but unrelated beneficial warming.

… unless you consider the wholesale devastation of huge areas of usable or environmentally sensitive land to install wind turbines and solar panels.

But that is because of the anti-CO2 nonsense that you like to push.

The damages inflicted on the environment by wind and solar are horrendous.

Anthony Banton
Reply to  bnice2000
January 8, 2025 6:24 am

bnice

You keep repeating these incorrect concepts of yours as though by so doing they magically are true.
You need to show that the science community has been wrong for well over a century, instead of hand-waving bollocks.
Which, of course, you canot do.

Reply to  Anthony Banton
January 8, 2025 11:17 am

The crop and plant growing community are well aware that it is the enhanced CO2 levels, combined with modern fertilisers that allows them to produce the food for the expanding human population.

Why do you think so much food is grown in CO2 enhanced greenhouses.

You seem particularly badly inform on this subject.

Reply to  Anthony Banton
January 8, 2025 7:10 am

So to be clear, you are saying that 280ppm is the right amount of CO2?

Anthony Banton
Reply to  Tony_G
January 8, 2025 8:22 am

Yes.
It was the level at which the Earth was maintaining an equilibrium between CO2 sources and sinks.
This governed by the Earth’s MST setting CO2 levels.
We have now pushed it beyond equilibrium.
Note a future orbital configuration will create a different equlibrium level.

Sparta Nova 4
Reply to  Anthony Banton
January 8, 2025 10:44 am

BS Alert

There is absolutely no evidence of a CO2 equilibrium.

Reply to  Anthony Banton
January 10, 2025 12:53 am

What an idiot!
CO2 levels follow temperature not cause it.

Any kid with a flat bottle of warm coca cola will tell you that.

Reply to  TheFinalNail
January 10, 2025 12:44 am

“becomes a pollutant (in that it now harms us) above a certain level of concentration”….

May I suggest you put a plastic bag over your head to figure out what is that appropriate level of CO2″… above a certain level of concentration”.

Preferably you keep it on there until you figure out that 0.04% of the gas in the atmosphere won’t lead to suffocation.

Reply to  TheFinalNail
January 7, 2025 10:11 am

The commercial production of hydrocarbons, from exploration, development, transportation, refining, etc. has been a monumental undertaking and an unambiguous blessing for humanity. It requires a high degree of professional integrity to do so safely, and therefore should never be undertaken by any entity that considers itself ‘beyond petroleum’.

Reply to  TheFinalNail
January 7, 2025 11:10 am

1) The fossil fuel industry would go away … if it was beat down and forced out of existence by govt (& minority edict); at such time my ‘personal carbon footprint’ would drop to nothing.

2) If I, and everyone else, choose drop our ‘personal carbon footprint’ to nothing to eliminate fossil fuels (and the spin-offs of plastics, medical, etc), the fossil fuel industry would go away.

Individual ‘personal carbon footprint’ for the masses ends up the same for both of the above options.

Only one of the above options revolves around personal choice & individual freedom.

Sparta Nova 4
Reply to  DonM
January 8, 2025 10:45 am

No one can get their CO2 footprint to zero. We exhale CO2 with each breath we take.

Reply to  Sparta Nova 4
January 8, 2025 4:33 pm

well, I guess (1) if being killed off from lack of energy, or (2) killing oneself through choice, one could indeed get their breath down to zero CO2.

so, I stand by it 🙂

Reply to  TheFinalNail
January 7, 2025 11:33 am

There is no such thing as “carbon pollution”.

Certainly not from cows, or residential or commercial or the fossil fuel industry.

Reply to  bnice2000
January 7, 2025 12:44 pm

In fairness, there is of course carbon polution in many forms like any carbon buildup through combustion. Flyash used to be a big problem. The west has managed to filter most of the stuff out. Industrial processes cleaned up, catalytic converters in cars etc. ( i remember the 70s).Other elements like sulphur etc have also been tackled. Both the air and water are in much healthier state these days. Another reason to keep those industries here btw instead of far more polluting countries like India and China.

It was the reason i asked what he exactly meant by ‘carbon pollution’. He answered w Co2. That of course is not a pollutant but the focus of the warm- mongers.
It indicates ignorance. Further engagement is then futile..

Reply to  ballynally
January 7, 2025 1:11 pm

Fly-ash is a very useful by-product of electricity generation.

There are numerous products all around you that use it as a component.

The plaster sheets on your walls for example, also many cement and other construction products use it.

Road-base, asphalt and many civil engineering projects use large amounts of fly ash.

Some 50% of concrete placed in the USA uses fly-ash to some degree, often up to 40% of content.

Paint fillers, adhesives, metal and plastic composites also use it.

The uses are highly varied.

Some even makes its way into personal products like toothpaste and cosmetics.

Reply to  ballynally
January 7, 2025 2:38 pm

Fly ash has some wonderful properties.

While can contain some unburnt carbon, it is mostly oxides of silicon, magnesium etc etc

Firstly is its pozzalonic properties, meaning that it reacts with lime to form cementitious compounds.

Secondly is the near spherical nature of its finer particles which makes it so good as a “filler” agent.

If we stop producing it as a by-product, it will be difficult, and likely very expensive, to find a good cheap replacement.

It would be interesting to figure out how much is used in a wind turbine construction…
… in the foundations, the tower, and as filler for the epoxy etc in the blades.

The amount of fossil fuels that go into making and installing a wind turbine is large, to say the least… They could not be manufactured or installed without fossil fuels.

Same with solar, totally reliant on fossil fuels for their manufacture and installation.

Reply to  bnice2000
January 8, 2025 1:16 am

I wasnt saying it wasnt useful but smog is still terrible in certain cities. Again, i remember the 70s. If im not mistaken, that is flyash.
I mean, lots of elements are useful but i wouldnt want it in the air, like fine asbestos. This distinction needs to be made and coupled. Leaving that out feels a tad disingenious..

Sparta Nova 4
Reply to  ballynally
January 8, 2025 10:46 am

SMOG = smoke and fog.
smoke is not CO2. It is particulate carbon.

Reply to  bnice2000
January 10, 2025 1:19 am

Flyash has one serious problem.
It concentrates radioactive isotopes into a largely amorphous form at levels we never really know.

I once tested the radiation levels down on the ground in an aircraft at Warsaw airport.
The result was rather astonishing.

The concrete had clearly been made of flyash, as evidenced by the clicking from the G-M tube at levels normally found only at FL5+.
It is thought, there is more energy in the uranium than actually in the coal.

The same thing was detectable from bricks and tiles from a factory in Estonia which had been made with clay loaded with radioisotopes from the local clint.

That particular region has known high radon gas levels in apartment blocks.

Reply to  TheFinalNail
January 7, 2025 12:02 pm

The end user is always the one ultimately responsible for fossil fuel use.

Fossil fuel use exists because it is the very best and cheapest way of providing every facet of energy needed by society.

Western civilisation exists and thrives because of fossil fuel and all the products that are manufactured and delivered using it.

Get rid of fossil fuel… western civilisation would collapse.

We know that is one of the stated aims of the anti-CO2 agenda.

Reply to  bnice2000
January 7, 2025 3:04 pm

Get rid of fossil fuel… western civilisation would collapse.

We know that is one of the stated aims of the anti-CO2 agenda.

And the reason I despise these AGW hoaxers, trolls, and shills like blanton, nit pick, and the nail gun.

Reply to  karlomonte
January 7, 2025 3:49 pm

I can’t understand why any member of western society would want to support a faked agenda, that wants to get rid of the very energy supply that supports their whole existence.

It is totally irrational… complete insanity. !!

Not only that , but not one of the AGW trollettes would ever try to live a “carbon free” lifestyle (whatever that means).

So it is also the height of hypocrisy.

KevinM
Reply to  TheFinalNail
January 7, 2025 1:07 pm

in an attempt to displace responsibility for climate change away from corporate polluters and onto the individual.

Do individuals buy anything from corporations?

Reply to  TheFinalNail
January 7, 2025 1:28 pm

responsibility for climate change”

The idea that fossil fuel producers are in any way responsible for “climate change“, is pure scientifically-unsupportable nonsense.

Reply to  TheFinalNail
January 7, 2025 2:04 pm

CO2 is currently around 420 parts per million, increased, they tell us, from 280 ppm in 1850 (estimated). That’s a difference of 140 ppm, or in terms more readily understood by the layman, the composition of the atmosphere has changed by 0.014% (14 thousandths of 1%) in the last 170 years. Less than 1 thousandth of 1% per decade. That’s it. That’s the TOTAL ‘carbon footprint’ for the entire planet, and human activity is only responsible for a small part of that increase. This measurement is averaged annually from much higher and lower daily figures. All the development that has occurred in this timeframe, everything we have built, all industry and every drop of fuel burned is included in that calculation. Every life form on this planet; on the land, in the sea and in the air is composed of carbon compounds that were once in the air as CO2, and every living thing that has come and gone in 170 years is incorporated in a figure that doesn’t fall outside of a reasonable margin of error. Our annual emissions equate to no more than a couple of extra CO2 molecules per tree leaf on the planet. The claim that it is only our “emissions” that remain in the air and accumulate year on year, nature cannot cope with our contribution or that the carbon cycle was somehow magically in perfect equilibrium before we started to burn coal and oil is a complete fairy tale designed to fool the gullible. And here you are.

Anthony Banton
Reply to  Right-Handed Shark
January 8, 2025 2:15 am

“the composition of the atmosphere has changed by 0.014% (14 thousandths of 1%) in the last 170 years. Less than 1 thousandth of 1% per decade.”

You omit the inconvenient truth that 90% of the atmosphere is transparent to LWIR.
And the increase of 50% in the major GHG is highly significant.

“the carbon cycle was somehow magically in perfect equilibrium before we started to burn coal and oil is a complete fairy tale”

You seem to have no concept of the ages that changes (normally) play out on the planet. Over millenia. It is bizarre that you think that slow process does not arrive at an equilbrium.

Reply to  Anthony Banton
January 8, 2025 2:47 am

And the increase of 50% in the major GHG is highly significant.

CO2 is a radiatively active gas. It is a tiny trace gas in the atmosphere.

If it has any warming effect, it is totally insignificant and has never been measured anywhere on the planet…

The only significance is its enhanced effect on plant growth.

Anthony Banton
Reply to  bnice2000
January 8, 2025 6:29 am

“CO2 is a radiatively active gas. It is a tiny trace gas in the atmosphere.”

Yes to LWIR at the wavelengths around Earth’s average temp.
It is a trace gas but makes up ~ 90% of the GHE producing gases in the atmospere. Both O2 and N2 are transparent to LWIR.
So, like I said, it’s increase by 50% in higly significant.

And then the usual dogmatic evidence-less hand-wave.

Reply to  Anthony Banton
January 8, 2025 11:22 am

That is just nonsense.

CO2 has zero measurable warming effect in the atmosphere.

Your understanding of the action of CO2 in the atmosphere is based on AGW mantra and fake models.

You need to listen to the following video and unlearn all the anti-science you have been brain-washed with..

Tom Shula and Markus Ott : The “Missing Link” in the Greenhouse Effect | Tom Nelson Pod #232

Sparta Nova 4
Reply to  Anthony Banton
January 8, 2025 10:49 am

90% of the atmosphere is transparent to LWIR.
False statement. H2O covers orders of magnitude more of the spectrum than CO2, which has a miniscule effect at 14.77 um.

Reply to  Anthony Banton
January 10, 2025 1:26 am

yes and you have no concept of what is meant by the name “GREENLAND”…..

I have no idea why Trump want to own a country covered in ice and snow, when 1000 years ago the vikings lived in a country green with grass, or why wine grapes grew near Scotland 2000 years ago.

CO2 levels FOLLOW temperature, but you keep your propaganda campaign running claiming the complete reverse.

That makes you look an ex-MO shilling fool.

MarkW
Reply to  TheFinalNail
January 7, 2025 2:16 pm

And yet another bogus claim that anything bad can somehow be traced to an oil company.
No data needed, or wanted.

Reply to  TheFinalNail
January 7, 2025 2:31 pm

Not even wrong…

And following the link, it leads to the Gruaniad, and a few broken links from there, and doesn’t actually claim what TFN claims anyway. Why am I not surprised?

Reply to  TheFinalNail
January 7, 2025 3:41 pm

Where’s AlanJ to complete the trifecta?

Reply to  Phil R
January 8, 2025 4:36 pm

M Mann did not enter the conversation, so AlanJ did not feel the need to remove his nose from his(own?) rear end and move over to the keyboard.

Sparta Nova 4
Reply to  TheFinalNail
January 8, 2025 10:35 am

A drop of rain times 8 billion people is not insignificant.

taxed
January 7, 2025 9:44 am

Recently the BBC weather Web site has tried to claim that the decline in the number of days of snow annually in the UK since the 1960’s has been caused by human induced climate change. Utterly rubbish claim with zero evidence to back it up.

Jim Turner
January 7, 2025 10:02 am

Some years ago I received a leaflet from the local town council suggesting ways that I could reduce the amount of domestic rubbish that was collected and disposed of by them. One idea was to make a compost heap rather than put food waste in the bin, because apparently organic matter turns to CO2 in landfill. I am not sure what they thought happened to it in a compost heap.

Reply to  Jim Turner
January 7, 2025 10:27 am

In my neck of the woods, that would create a bear problem.

Reply to  Frank from NoVA
January 7, 2025 11:22 am

The nutria have tunneled/moved into my heap (99% brush, grass, and ash). I never see them, but they keep the grass/weeds down to putting green height in the general vicinity of the brush pile. They are even making a dent in the blackberry density.

If my neighbor knew they were there, he would characterize it as a problem.

derbrix
January 7, 2025 10:04 am

Quite the fantasy that the BBC is promoting, however there are many difficulties with achieving most of them.

With roughly 8 billion people worldwide now, just over 52% live in cities where they may have public transportation. One has never lived until they ride on a public bus in an urban area going to work and the schools let the little darlings out.

One would think that having a plant based diet you would like more of the food for those plants readily available.

While I do have a heat pump to both cool & heat my house, I live in a climate where it is more cost effective than having a separate appliance for each. That and out in the boonies here, the only gas is propane trucked to the house and stored onsite.

Sure, riding a bicycle is great fun commuting to work & back. Did that in Denver for 15 years. Even rode a recumbent tricycle from Colorado to Florida, only took 3 months. But the weather plays an even greater challenge doing that safely. Bicycling in a blizzard or thunderstorm poses some real challenges.

January 7, 2025 11:32 am

Something very odd with Figure 1.

Ag-crops 10.8% has a smaller column than Residential at 5.8% and commercial at 6.9%

Reply to  bnice2000
January 7, 2025 4:24 pm

note.. The total on the graph is 104.9%…. so I suspect that 10.2% is a typo on the chart..

Should probably be 5.3%

You might want to check the source.

KevinM
January 7, 2025 11:50 am

“help the planet” do what? Is the planet trying to do something?

Reply to  KevinM
January 7, 2025 12:57 pm

It goes like this: the Earth is taken as always in balance> we have caused imbalance> we have to pay for our sins by re- balancing by giving up hydrocarbons to let the Earth ‘heal’. It is the modern version of the ancient human guilt complex which has a real basis in crop failures, famine, starvation, draughts, floods etc. Because humans are pattern seeking animals we need a cause for all the mayhem. The weather simply wont do. Better sacrifice an animal, a person, a group or ‘unwanted’ elements to please the Gods.
Nowadays the postmodernists do not believe in a God but hold on to the concept of sin. Sin not within ourselves/ themselves but performed by evil hydrocarbon burning destructors..ie, most people. So we, the majority have to be sacrificed to maintain the ‘clean’ minority, the complete opposite of its original idea..

Sparta Nova 4
Reply to  ballynally
January 8, 2025 10:51 am

We need a cause…. a simple, single, easy to speak answer.

Unfortunately a complex question rarely has a simple, single, easy to speak answer.

Ill Tempered Klavier
Reply to  KevinM
January 7, 2025 7:37 pm

“Save the PLANET!?!? The planet doesn’t need saving. Some people are (beep) but the planet’s doing just fine.” George Carlin

KevinM
January 7, 2025 11:52 am

reducing the carbon footprint of keeping a pet
They chickened out – did not want to pick a fight with pet owners.

Reply to  KevinM
January 7, 2025 11:56 am

I have never seen a pet that leaves a carbon footprint. ! 😉

Reply to  bnice2000
January 7, 2025 2:50 pm

I do recall that a friend down the south coast used to have a dog that often came in with black pawprints…

Seems it had found magnetite or basalt sand patch it liked.

The local beach also had a lot of dark coloured sand grains.. But it was not “carbon”

Reply to  bnice2000
January 8, 2025 1:20 am

I have a coal burner. The cat leaves a carbon footprint all over the floor rug after been behind it.

Sparta Nova 4
Reply to  bnice2000
January 8, 2025 10:52 am

I recall a dog that walked across freshly paved driveway left a carbon footprint…

KevinM
January 7, 2025 12:07 pm

Chart graphic is bad – “Note that beef production is less than half of the entire livestock sector, at just 2 percent.
Is it 2% of the 3.5% (=0.07%) or 2% of the total counted among the 3.5% (=57% of bar to be shaded if showed as one shared bar), or… The black sharing on the chart seems to be 2% of the total from which 3.5% is also derived shown as stacked bar with total height 3.5% + 2% =5.5%.

The thesis might be “its a small number whatever way you calculate or display it”, in which case there are easier ways to say it.

KevinM
Reply to  KevinM
January 7, 2025 12:10 pm

Ugh, going back to check that my own words make sense, I now see the yellow bar for 5.8% is taller than the green bar for 10.2% and positioned to its left. Whatever. Argument to/versus infographic is like argument to analogy. It breaks down if you think it through.

Alan M
January 7, 2025 12:23 pm

I’ve said many times that “saving the planet” is the most fatuous statement ever. The planet is 4.5 billion years old and has in its time seen 5 mass-extinction events to my knowledge plus a lot worse in terms of temperature variations both high and low (snowball Earth is one I’ve read about), it is still here and will be for another several billion years until the sun expands and swallows it. Nothing we can do will change that

0perator
Reply to  Alan M
January 7, 2025 12:31 pm

Cue the George Carlin bit on Saving the Planet….

Reply to  Alan M
January 7, 2025 1:00 pm

Yes but…that is natural. We have disturbed the natural balance which is by its very..mm..nature, good.
See how this works?

Reply to  ballynally
January 7, 2025 6:25 pm

In order for humans to be unnatural, Divine Intervention had to take place.

Lots of people believe that, but environmentalists usually are not preaching that sermon.

Something about having dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over the cattle, and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth rubs them the wrong way.

Editor
January 7, 2025 12:35 pm

All of my grandchildren are a plane trip away, and I’m going to keep eating meat too.

The meat argument is daft – all meat is carbon neutral, all of its carbon has come from the atmosphere. But then, all their arguments are daft. Dangerously daft.

January 7, 2025 2:17 pm

The BBC is effectively saying that people should pressure banks and other institutions to quit supporting fossil fuel companies. All this would achieve is raising the cost of necessary fuels, which will greatly increase costs across the board, accomplishing nothing more than hurting average folks in the process.

I disagree. All it will do is allow sensible people, like myself (and the majority of investors), to buy shares in good, reliable, energy-producing companies at slightly lower prices, and make slightly more profit.

Reply to  Zig Zag Wanderer
January 7, 2025 4:00 pm

I wonder what the “carbon footprint” of the BBC is ! 😉

Reply to  bnice2000
January 8, 2025 4:42 pm

look at that B, you gots yerself an infatuated hater.

Edward Katz
January 7, 2025 2:24 pm

Outfits like the BBC, The Guardian, the CBC and all the mainstream left-leaning media still haven’t grasped one crucial fact: neither governments themselves, businesses, industries, nor consumers intend to make the supposedly necessary changes to their operations or lifestyles in order to fight climate change. The best they’ll do is pay them lip-service while continuing to do what’s most profitable and convenient. It’s amazing that the above facts haven’t sunk into the minds of those that run those established entities.

Bob
January 7, 2025 2:54 pm

Very nice Linnea. I can’t think of an organization I would be less inclined to look to for advice than the BBC. The individuals writing this nonsense need to be personally called out to justify what they write. Just calling out the BBC is useless. Make the individual squirm.