Another case of “The ends justify the means”
Submitted by Eric Worrall
Rod Lamberts, director of the Australian National Centre for Public Awareness of Science at the Australian National University, claims facts won’t win the climate debate.
Source: https://theconversation.com/facts-wont-beat-the-climate-deniers-using-their-tactics-will-24074
Rod Lamberts starts by criticising Tim Flannery, former chief of the now abolished Australian Climate Commission, for recently suggesting
“An opinion is useless, what we need are more facts.”.
(Link from Rod Lambert’s article)
https://www.facebook.com/climatecouncil/posts/10151956752276603?stream_ref=10
Rod Lamberts then works his way up to the following passage:
“What we need now is to become comfortable with the idea that the ends will justify the means. We actually need more opinions, appearing more often and expressed more noisily than ever before.”
Tim Flannery once famously gave an opinion, on air, that Australian dams and river systems would never fill again. In the wake of severe flooding on the Australian East Coast, Flannery claimed he had been misquoted – a claim which Andrew Bolt refutes.
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If you have no facts, you have nothing else but opinions.
Australia has a government that rejects the Warmista scare and is gradually dismantalling the state apparatus that propagates it. Hence the hysterical squeals of the Warmista pigs (those at the public trough)
My first thought was that my colleague was taking the piss.
I have no idea what that means.
“What we need now is to become comfortable with the idea that the ends will justify the means.
Consequentialism is a favorite refuge of despots throughout history. “It’s for their own good!”
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_ends_justify_the_means
I didn’t know we skeptics had “tactics.” Hmmm . . . maybe posting a chart of actual data vs. model predictions is a tactic. Ain’t we slimy.
of course they can’t win it with facts…….
“taking the piss”…australian for “having someone on”, or “making a joke of them”, or “pulling your leg”
‘Opinions’ are the biggest weakness the alarmist movement has. It’s a primary reason people looking at the facts have lost trust. So this guy wants more opinions….. Genius!
Sorry folks, nothing to be alarmed about. Rod Lambert is just another phsychologist with some sort or relevence disorder a la Lewandowsky.
From his ANU bioblurb:-
“He has been providing science communication consultation and evaluation advice for than 15 years to organisations including UNESCO, the CSIRO, and to ANU science and research bodies. He also has a background in psychology and corporate communication consultancy and facilitation.
Rod’s professional and research interests include: science in society; science and public policy; perceptions of expertise in science; and risk and crisis perception/ communication.”
His quals are a BA(hons) (psych major I assume) at ANU, Post Grad Diploma ( U Canberra), Applied Psychology then a PhD at ANU. For non Aussies that is about as inside the beltway as it gets.
This is not a serious human being it seems but some sort of beltway bureauclone, an experimant in deconstructionism gone feral. Sadly he seems destined to be an object of utter ridicule like some crazy puppy farm cross breeding experiment gone horribly wrong. I feel for his parents. No sympathy for his clientele though, they are obviously fools.
How typical of the AGW crowd – why tell the truth when lies serve your corrupt, perverse purposes better?
I’m beginning to think we should focus as much on the lying, deception, mean-spiritedness, contempt for rights, sharp practices, unconcern for human well-being and greed of the alarmists, as much as on their message. Point out every example of falsehood, hypocrisy, personal attack, and money grab by these people we can muster. And point out specifically how the policies they advocate do harm, and hurt poor people first and worst – and attribute that harm directly to the individuals. For example, if someone proposes a carbon tax, make sure we say that what they are advocating kills people, describe in detail exactly how it does it, and provide the documentation to prove it.
What, they want to use our tactics? That’s great! That means they will validate their climate models and show the results!
“What we need now is to become comfortable with the idea that the ends will justify the means. We actually need more opinions, appearing more often and expressed more noisily than ever before.”
Oh, I misunderstood him. What he means is, every warmist will now have to choose between being honest or being efficient. Now that’s a whole new approach. (sarc)
Chris4692, that’s what I was going to say.
The call to abandon facts (which never were) comes at the stage when the facts are becoming most enlightening.
As it has been said before: “If you have the facts on your side, pound the facts. If you have the law on your side, pound the law. If you have neither on your side, pound the table.”
Why am I hearing the song “Give them ol Razzle Dazzle” from the musical Chicago?
“Give ’em the old flim flam flummox
Fool and fracture ’em,
How can they hear the truth above the roar?
Throw ’em a fake and a finagle
They’ll never know you’re just a bagel,
Razzle dazzle ’em
And they’ll beg you for more!”
AFAIK, the message is to stop believing facts and your own senses. To say the warming continues when their own records show no warming for 17.5 years, almost as long as it had warmed and cost us all those trillions. Yes, you could have a cold winter here in a warming world. But this winter, froze three Egyptians on a trek in the Sinai:
http://english.ahram.org.eg/NewsContent/1/64/94505/Egypt/Politics-/UPDATE–At-least-three-Egyptian-hikers-dead-after-.aspx
And the SH last winter in South America, millions of fish and other creatures died of cold.
http://www.iceagenow.com/6_million_dead_fish_floating_down_Bolivian_rivers.htm
And of course the “Ship of Fools” from Aussie National U (no wonder they want to forget the facts and go with opinions) got iced in and pelted by cold and blizzards last Antarctic summer on a expedition to chronicle global warming and ice loss. The leader was so humiliated worldwide that they gave him an award for his work!!
http://wattsupwiththat.com/2014/01/21/spiritofmawson-fiasco-leader-gets-award-for-excellence/
Rather than getting messages out to the populace, they should be lying low, particularly at ANU, where their antics have entertained the world.
It looks like every state and territory has now given the green/labor parties the boot in favour of liberal (Conservative) govn’ts. At federal, state and territory level with the exception to, surprise surprise, the ACT, Canberra (Could be considered the Washington DC of Australia). Tasmania was not a surprise result, that’s been on the cards for a while. Green/labor ecoloons have been destroying Tasmanian industry since the 80’s, with large thanks going to former Greens leader Bob Brown who refers to everyone as “…my fellow earthians…”, no more need be said.
To paraphrase the old law joke if the data goes against you pound on the science, of the science goes against you pound on the data and if they both go against you pound on the table.
Ok…couldn’t resist…
Give em the old, climate clap trap,
Shame and shatter em,
How can they see the truth behind the stick?
Don’t let them speak unless you sue em,
Don’t publish methods, they’ll see right thru em,
Razzle Dazzle em, use the hidden decline trick!
It looks like the broad is screaming BS and the poor guy is not listening. Been there, done that. I’m a guy if it needs to be noted.
Hippie girls are fun for the weekend!
What he is actually saying is, ” Our version of the facts,(which are of course, lies) will not defeat the Climate Deniers.” I suspect the truth will give him some problems too.
The problem with “consensus” climate science from the beginning is that it has been mostly opinions– i.e. speculation and conjecture– and not facts–i.e. solid data and verifiable hypotheses arrived at with scrupulous statistical methods.
Gary Pearse,
The Ship of Fools was from UNSW not ANU, though ANU is just as big a hot-bed of warmists.
DirkH,
I Agree, if they are using our tactics then they should debate, stick to the facts, avoid deferring to Authority, Ad-Homs and other tricks. Of course they should also be open to changing their mind, a tried and true sceptic tactic, and willing to consider the cons of so called “Climate Action”. Perhaps we should challenge him to a debate.
“What we need now is to become comfortable with the idea that the ends will justify the means.”
— Showing contempt for people who disagree with your position is not persuasive, but I guess you have to play the hand that you’re dealt.
@ur momisugly Michael Palmer
Your last sentence should read , If you have neither on your side PUT pounds or $’s on the table.