Essay by Eric Worrall
NATO claims Russia has already laid explosive charges, ready to detonate when the Kremlin gives the go order.
Nato fears Russia may have laid mines on critical European undersea infrastructure points
- NATO’s intelligence chief warned Russia may seek to sabotage western nations
- Explosions devastated the Nord Stream gas pipelines in September last year
- It comes as Russia today accused Ukraine of trying to assassinate Vladimir Putin
By ELIZABETH HAIGH
PUBLISHED: 06:15 AEST, 4 May 2023 | UPDATED: 08:55 AEST, 5 May 2023
Russia may have already mined Europe’s critical underwater infrastructure, NATO representatives fear, as its intelligence chief warned on Wednesday Russia may sabotage them to punish Western nations for supporting Ukraine.
The alliance is seeking to boost efforts to protect undersea pipes and cables following attacks on the Nord Stream pipeline in September last year, which saw three of the four main lines which transports gas from Russia to Germany damaged.
Threats to undersea cables and pipelines have become a focus of public attention since the as-yet unexplained explosions crippled the Nord Stream pipelines in the Baltic Sea.
The alliance is so concerned by the threat of energy disruption it set up the Critical Undersea Infrastructure Coordination Cell in February, which seeks to monitor Russian espionage under the command of Lieutenant General Hans-Werner Wiermann, a retired German military officer.
…Read more: https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-12043535/Nato-fears-Russia-laid-mines-critical-European-undersea-infrastructure-points.html
The only question, would Russia mine undersea cables to offshore wind farms, or would they stick to mining useful energy infrastructure like undersea gas pipelines? Perhaps they plan to leave undersea wind alone, in an effort to lure Western nations into committing to more renewables.
Some times ago the trendy renewable idea was to power Europe from the Sahara. It’s a desert, it’s free, sun is free, what could go wrong?
Heat and UV damage to cells will likely force the replacement of panels before the project is even 5% complete
Nearly but not quite.
Let me introduce a Real Electronic Dance Classic
Turn the subwoofers up to maybe 8 or 9, meet the break and watch it all – its about ‘Romance’ and GSOH
Darude – Sandstorm
Otherwise our here story is one of slow and dull minds riddled by irrational fear (paranoia) , projection and propaganda.
We really are in some very deep shit here esp considering how NATO has been engineering Ukraine for well over a decade now.
One simple question: Why hasn’t Putin trashed the electricity grid in Ukraine – I read/see that Ukraine is now actually exporting power at this time
Now do you see The Problem you have in The White House?
now sort it
He spent weeks bombing the power grid during winter, to try and force capitulation. There were endless celebratory pictures of Ukraine with nearly all of its lights out at the time.
The Ukraine grid was over engineered from the Soviet era and the heavy industry they supported . A lot of that industry has gone, cut off from the Russian market and just the economics of it in global markets.
Thanks for ‘sandstorm‘ fantastic rhythms, try these …
” Medieval Rock and Roll”https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xaRNvJLKP1E
mangled mandolins and lutes in a lather
thanks that was “unique”
Wonderful! thanks . Love different mixed genera.Will also go well with the new age mid evil life style coming.
yes and also Gas via ukies
Getting rid of Dementia Joe would saddle us with Kackling Kamala. Not exactly an improvement.
The only President with dementia was Reagan. Trump is in same 80s age group as Biden and already shows signs of impairment compared to the Trump from 10-15 years back.
You can’t be serious. Reagan suffered from Alzheimers after his second term, and so it can be inferred that he may have had to adjust to some minor impacts even while in office, but it was not apparent. Even a wholly hostile press could not make that case.
Biden on the other hand demonstrates on a literally daily basis that he is multiple bricks short of a load.
Yes, there is precedent with the American/NATO invasion of Serbia, and subsequent carving of an independent Kosovo state. Also, Kiev’s invasion of Crimea following the 2014 coup (Slavic Spring), where the regime denied essential services to the people.
ты серьезно, товарищ?
It seems 100% clear now that the attacks on the electricity grid were primarily to force Ukraine to try and defend it – and use up all their air defense missiles in the process.
It has been noted by many, including me, that the very large transformers of said grid were never attacked. The attacks were on substations, transfer points, transmission lines and so forth. Since Ukraine uses Soviet standards and equipment, it would have been literally impossible to repair at all much less in a meaningful time frame. Even were these 100 ton transformers available, it takes weeks and months to get new ones in place.
Anyone who thinks Russia could not have taken down the grid anytime they wanted to by destroying the large transformers, is deluded.
Ukraine is a big country so its hard to knockout a distributed grid.
The exports are trifling ( 90GWhr in April) compared to their pre war installed capacity, as well usage has plummeted
And most of that went to Moldova which probably relies on it and is well away from the Russian -Belarussian border areas
Dont forget the Zaporizka (ZNPP), the largest nuclear power plant in Europe (6GW) is still running and supplying some power to Ukraine even under Russian control
I thought that storms would harm the glass before UV could have any measurable effect.
I think they can survive heat but efficiency would be reduced.
Of course it’s a geopolitical nightmare. If you even try to reduce immigration…
The hotter the junctions get, the more quickly they degrade.
It’s a current project called Xlinks: a 3,800km 2×1.8GW HVDC interconnector from Devon to Morocco, running offshore France, Spain and Portugal, linked to 20GWh/5GW of batteries and 10.5GW 100sq km of solar and wind farm in the desert. Current cost estimate is £18bn. They hope government will grant them a CFD to pay for it. I suspect it will look more and more like Hinkley Point with rising costs, and a need for a fancy price.
Communications cables were already long ago mined.
“Offshore Wind Anyone? NATO Claims Russia has MINED Undersea Pipes and Cables“
“The alliance is seeking to boost efforts to protect undersea pipes and cables following attacks on the Nord Stream pipeline in September last year, which saw three of the four main lines which transports gas from Russia to Germany damaged.
Threats to undersea cables and pipelines have become a focus of public attention since the as-yet unexplained explosions crippled the Nord Stream pipelines in the Baltic Sea.”
There is a problem. And it is with gas and communication cables, not wind.
You have a point, offshore wind is so useless it is possible nobody would bother attacking it.
Nuclear is looking pretty good at this point – even if someone blockades the sea lanes and blows up the undersea cables and pipelines, the plant is good for two years, and the fuel required after two years could be flown in, if all else fails.
Nuclear yes. However, not the current PWR, LWR or small modular reactors will not suffice in the long term, short term yes. Molten Salt Reactors will be the only reactors that will solve the energy needs of the world in the long term.
There will pain for humanity until the switch is made. This is the paradigm that is happening right now.
UK especially has made itself too dependant on wind, esp now Offshore wind – it is another ‘Texas’ in the making.
If a couple of large windfarms and the French interconnect went offline simultaneously. the UK would be blacked out and unable to recover itself for a week at least.
The only hope of achieving a black start (until Hinckley & Sizewell get here) is by using gas and the only supply of that comes from Norway and under the sea.
We have no storage, no reserve/redundancy, no spare capacity, no leadership (now that Labour have won so many of Thurs elections), no money and no nothing.
Except sugar, alcohol, cocaine and (for the kids) laughing gas: and they’re the last thing anyone needs, they’re what got us here.
Wake up Boris and say something – you tell them.
Remember a little few years ago: A single lightning strike set off a cascade of circuit breakers that brought UK as close to total shutdown as Texas got to (4 minutes an x seconds)
Dinorwig has black start capability
That’s a cup of tea sorted then.
Last autumn, the Dutch navy intercepted a Russian vessel “mapping” cables near a North Sea wind farm. Highlighting the sensitivity of such infrastructure, the UK last week signed a deal with the Netherlands for the LionLink connector, which will provide electricity for two million British households.
LionLInk is a crazy scheme. It seems to be designed to let the Dutch get access to any new nuclear built at Sizewell – if and when that happens, while perhaps also building a wind farm in Dutch waters linked to it. There is no settled site for landfall in the Netherlands, and thus little guarantee that it would have easy access to dispatchable power there, in contrast with BritNed, which surfaces right next door to the Maasvlakte MPP3 coal fired power station. I am waiting to hear about plans for extra transmission for export (presumably relying on wind from the North) or to supplement delivery into London and the South.
There is already interconnectors supplying power ( both ways) from Netherlands and others countries on North Sea coast
Shows operational and proposed in map
Quite, that is why security expert Professor Gwythian Prins has advised the UK government:
“In time of ‘grey war’ the only secure energy sources are firm and domestic. That means onshore oil, gas and coal – starting with fracked gas. Our national security requires us to exploit those resources to the full, while giving the armed forces the wherewithal to defend energy assets – oil and gas rigs and pipelines and the Norwegian gas pipeline first and foremost – in the North Sea”.
The leaders of the UK should listen to Professor Gwythian Prins.
The trouble is those pushing these fanatsys- which are at the single household level of supply
Still not seen your explanations why you deem CO2 to be a polluting gas – from an previous article – the gas that is one of a triumvirate of naturally occurring “effects” which enables all life on this planet to thrive; I think it behoves you to state “for the record” why you and “your ilk” continue to demonise something without which you cannot exist….and not being rude I shall ignore the very obvious sequitur.
You remind me of a certain party who inhabited TCW; he/she would constantly confirm, against mounting evidence, that mRNA SARS COV2 experimental GT drugs were effective. He/she quoted all sorts of scientific information purporting to be relevant and confirming of his/her thesis. This became and grows daily, for him/her, highly embarrassing as the death and adverse data from Government official sources became and continues to be devastatingly revealing, Pathologist doing autopsies confirming clotting damage, meta analyses of current repurposed drugs being highly effective, studies where end points were not changed midway or missed endpoints highlighting growing problems with immune system priming….not exhaustive and yet this person still persisted in pushing the narrative.
No problem with wind power? What “planet’ are you a native thereof?
Explanations still AWOL and you exhibit a slender understanding of English syntax and grammar. You and “MTF” are exactly the same deluded gaslighters – the tide is against you; put up or shut up.
WHAT??? Too off-topic for you??
In other words, you either can’t or won’t answer the question, so you will pretend that there is no reason to do so.
TCW means exactly what?
The Conservative Woman ( was also seen in passing on the Daily Sceptic )
Not off topic at all. It’s AGW propaganda in a nut shell. Emphasis on nut. And I suspect even quite a few traditional skeptic people here succumbed to the barrage of government propaganda. I am the only unvaccinated person in my family- but i did have CoVID( most likely) in late 2019 confirmed later. They said it was nt possible.
oh I dunno seems even the greenies are starting to see the dead whales appearing in offshore windfarm areas a bit of a problem…like the poor birds onshore
It’s a good thing whales can’t fly as we’d have a bloody mess on our hands.
Like the exploding whale on an Oregon beach some years ago.
Like the whale in “The HitchHikers Guide to the Galaxy”?
Maybe the problem is more fundamental.
Biden narrates the precedent in Ukraine.
You are obviously unaware of the real problems for offshore wind farm cabling, causing losses of production that run to many months – even years. Usually it’s just the cables connecting individual groups of turbines, but not infrfequently the main links to shore have been incapacitated.The Rampion wind farm has had several major cable failures. As have interconnectors. Moyle, Western Link, IFA1, BritNed, North Sea Link have all had cable failures with many months out of action in most cases.
If it comes to all out war with Russia then the efficacy or otherwise of renewables will not be the main story.
Get some perspective.
If your energy infrastructure fails it’s more difficult to resupply the front line, so security of vital economic resources is extremely important in a war.
maybe tell Bidet and co to pull their idiot heads in then?
I suspect that MCourtney has a valid point. In the case of an all out war with Russia, there will not be any front lines to resupply, unless you consider the burnt out remains of nuked cities front lines.
The good news is that all debt will be cancelled and no one will complain.
The problem with undersea infrastructure is that it can be blown up without triggering an all-out war.
Suppose the offshore wind farms were to stop delivering any power at all. How much of a disaster would that be, eg for the UK?
Look at the generation from wind, well charted here:
UK wind power is about 28GW faceplate, on- and off-shore combined. About 14GW of each. Its only the offshore part that would be at risk.
The grid has obviously coped with day long periods of under 1GW of production, and with week long periods of under 5GW production, as you can see from the charts.
Last month’s minimum was 0.438 GW, the previous months was 0.69 GW. And this is from both on and off-shore, and its only the offshore that is at risk.
Allowing for that, the UK must be used to dealing with production falls to around 0.25GW from its off-shore wind installations. I am not a power system engineer or planner. But I would really like to hear from someone in an informed role in the National Grid just how much of a disaster losing offshore wind would be. Suppose it goes to zero permanently instead of the drops of a day or a week outlined in the charts. How much effect will that have?
It looks as if it might be a bit unpleasant, as if it would raise fuel costs, maybe lead to some rationing. But the country should manage.
If the gas pipelines and the interconnect transmission lines to Europe were to be bombed, that would be different. That would be a genuine crisis. Especially the first.
The off shore turbines will not cope well being islanded. They will need to have bearings replaced before they can be recommissioned.
Stranded assets for the duration.
truth told if they got removed it would be a blessing
Ok : so – maybe Nordstream was Russia.!
We always assumed in our prior hypothesizing – cui bono and what motive…?.
This provides the answer to both questions ……..it was a “dry” run (sic) in relatively safe waters, close to base, where they could demonstrate
1 – undetected positioning of charges ✅
2 – successful remote detonation ✅
Cui bono? The Russians test and execute their demolition plans
Motive – rapid destruction of western europe power and communication grids…..
It also throws a bomb of suspicion amongst the ranks of NATO. For a long while, everyone had been pointing fingers over who bombed nordstream, to the point that it seriously delayed the actions of certain nations in supplying military aid to ukraine.
If an alliance of nations is arrayed against you, the soundest strategy is to trick them into fighting each other, instead of you.
I have no idea why Nordstream was destroyed. Theories I’ve heard:
There is some weak evidence it was Ukraine:
“… Last month, a German media investigation quoted unnamed officials as saying that five men and a woman used a yacht hired by a Ukrainian-owned company in Poland to carry out the attack. The Ukrainian government has denied involvement. …”
But this claim could be total nonsense.
that claim WAS utter nonsense and was hmm? number 3 in the book of idiot usa claims its sort of fun to sit n watch the psyops nuttery the usa cia and the rest spin, utterly impausible like most of them are
You forgot witches!
These have been the favorite go-to badies of the English-speaking world for a long time.
I’m 97% sure it was witches that done it.
The boat in question was a small yacht that would not have made a good base for diving to depth and carrying charges sufficient to blow up 3 pipelines. A story for the gullible only.
It doesn’t take much explosive to disable a pipeline. A few pounds should do it.
You need to be able to decompress if you are diving to 80m. No space or power for the decompression chambers. Too small to host an ROV. There were other vessels in the area that are much more plausible candidates. The Mir and the Sedov for instance.
In any event, the Swedish investigators say several hundred kg of explosive were used – which would take more than a couple of divers to deploy.
Nord Stream was shut down due to sanctions before the explosion. That means the only people to gain anything, and the only people with real incentive to blow it up, were Russians. They had a massive project that was returning zero on investment and the explosion gave the investors an insurance payout and gave Putin the claim that the land grab in Ukraine was just part of a defensive war against the West. Anyone that wanted to send a message to Russia or damage Purim’s ability to wage war would have gone after an operational pipeline.
Does it make sense that NATO would be aware of the underwater mines, yet, do nothing to neutralize them?
They might not be able to find them. There’s a lot of pipe to inspect, and the mines could be quite small – it doesn’t take a lot of explosive to put a substantial hole in a gas pipeline. I’m betting there are all sorts of cutting torch offcuts and pieces of broken equipment on the seafloor around the mines, and brackets and odd fixtures nobody can remember why they were attached. The mines could look like just one more piece of junk amongst the clutter.
If the Russians wanted to be really clever, the mines might not even be attached to the pipe. When the mines are triggered, a powerful electromagnet could drag the mine into contact with the pipe, just before detonation.
And if you do find the mines, what are you going to do about it? The mines are likely boobytrapped, one wrong move and they explode anyway. It might have been a failed attempt to remove a mine which led to the Nord Stream explosion.
Once perhaps – but not three times…..
It’s all a bit of a mystery!
youve seen how heavy and thick the gas pipes are? it takes a hefty and wellplaced charge to damage them and its not the sort of thing just “anyone” could do
Up to 3 inch wall thickness according to Wiki. It’s not armour plate or safe wall material, the idea is to keep the cost down. A small shaped charge would blow a big hole in it.
This is pure speculation but Nordstream was not being used to supply gas at the time it was blown up. Would it have been possible to send a robotic mine down the pipeline to blow it up?
Not really. It was a long way down the pipe – several hundred miles. Most pigs rely on pipeline flow for propulsion, especially over that sort of distance. It would have required considerable forethought to have even attempted it. There was in any case no flow on Nordstream 2 despite one of its lines being blown up. There would also have been evidence of the remains of the pigs used: none such has been produced. Overall, the answer is extremely unlikely to no.
I once triggered a pig in an oil refinery on a tour as a kid. I saw how it was done, so I walked up to the controls when nobody was looking and pressed the same combination of buttons I saw others using. Great clunking sound. Lots of excitement until they verified the pipe was dormant, and I hadn’t just sent a blast of air into an active gas pipe.
Sections of pipe were sheared clean – not just a puncture – and flung over 100 metres underwater.
Massive amounts of over kill.
Wiki says a ton of military grade explosive. That seems excessive.
Explosive is not difficult to make, making TNT was an exercise in first year university chemistry. All the chemicals for military explosive are cheap, because they had to be manufactured in bulk in WW2.
Not impossible its a non-state actor. The process for making such explosive is something which could be done in a household garage – all you have to do when cooking the explosive is make sure the temperature doesn’t exceed a key threshold, otherwise you might end up with unstable higher nitrates, and reflux the chemicals to stop them all evaporating away. The chemicals smell like paint thinners, so you could just say you were working on your boat if any neighbours asked about the smell. One of the chemicals is heavily controlled in most places, but it is not difficult to extract from other, less controlled chemicals.
Where does this leave us? No idea.
The hole doesn’t have to be that large either. At the pressure that these pipelines run at, a hole only a few inches in diameter would leak enough oil that the enviros would demand that the pipeline be shut down until it can be fixed.
Warning sounds like a NATO research grant request: <a href=”https://www.naval-technology.com/features/featurearcherfish-fishing-for-mines-4951219″>Archerfish: fishing for mines</a>
“And if you do find the mines, what are you going to do about it? The mines are likely boobytrapped, one wrong move and they explode anyway.”
That’s what I was thinking.
My guess is all the major powers have identified vulnerable undersea points of the oppostion and have targeted them for future destruction, should the need occur.
I started laughing at “NATO claims” everything after thats just the usual bulldust
True . “First casualty of war …etc”
From the article: “It comes as Russia today accused Ukraine of trying to assassinate Vladimir Putin”
Possibly the most inept assassination attempt in history, assuming that is what it was, which I don’t. The explosion of the drone was guaranteed to create the best picture and the least damage. It wasn’t done as an effort to assassinate anyone. Putin wants to give the Russian people the impression they are under attack from Ukraine. It’s psychological warfare.
Where are those 50 U.S. former defense/intelligence officials that know all about Russian disinformation? They should weigh in on this. On second thought, they have no credibilty since they have been caught lying about Trump to help Biden, so they should just remain silent. They can do their talking in front of the U.S. Congress who wants to hear what they have to say about their weaponizing the federal government to help Biden get elected. Bunch of goddamn traitors!
Trump threatened the progress and profit in the Slavic Spring, when he requested an audit and justification from Kiev. Something similar happened during the Arab Spring, when members of the military misreported compliance with his orders to standdown in Syria.
The BBC’s Moscow correspondent reported that even the Russian media said the drone was not one capable of carrying sufficient explosives to do any serious damage.
I’ve seen more dramatic fireworks over the Kremlin and Moscow as a whole on e.g. May Day, November 7th, International Women’s Day and New Year.
There is a video taken from the other side of the building. It show two guys on the roof in fire fighting gear waiting to put out the fire.
No one (so far) has pointed out that in the North Sea, because of the danger from trawlers, all pipelines and cables are buried, usually about 2-3 metres under the seabed. In those areas where it is not possible they have about a metre of rock dumped on top. This would make it somewhat difficult to damage them.
Hmm. I wonder if a world power could dig a 10-foot hole or dump enough explosives to blast a 10-foot hole. Or maybe a less than world power with a little help.
IIRC there are nuclear sea mines available.
And also – am not convinced all the lines are 100% buried/rock dumped.
In a previous life with an oil major with a job that was closely involved with pipeline operational safety, I can confirm we would certainly protect vulnerable points, put in mattresses where there were free-spans, and conduct regular ROV surveys to determine any external remediation.
But some pipe is exposed – from natural scour if nothing else. Hence it would make sense from a targeting perspective to go take a look at your enemy’s pipeline infrastructure with a suitable vessel…..
Hysteria, you are quite right that not 100% are rock-dumped or buried, but they are, or were, inspected every year or so and remedial work carried out.
Pipeline owners also maintain records of the lines. Therefore it is a fairly easy task to plot vessels’ movements and check them against your records. If they show worrying proximitry to vulnerable sections, just send an ROV (Remotely Operated Vehicle) down to check.
You have missed out the interconnectors which play a vital role in propping up the UK.
Nato fears Russia may have laid mines on critical European undersea infrastructure points… is a model of [catastrophic] [anthropogenic] climate cooling… warming… change and pretense for extreme remediation choices.
It is the old ‘we are doing it so they are probably too!’
They use mines? What happened to the nuclear powered drone that creates nuclear tsunamis to flood England with 500 m waves?
Bonus question: what happens if you try to flood England with metric?
We had the experiment. Hunga Tonga was more powerful than the Tsar Bomba, yet only produced 20m tsunamis on a nearby island, reducing to 2m across the Pacific in Peru. Of course, the Continental Shelf might make waves rise a little higher, but the 500m wave flooding the whole of the British Isles (some parts of which are above 500m) is fear porn fantasy.
Thanks for that elucidation.
It’s always good to put things in perspective.