Essay by Eric Worrall
City based greens, like the Lord Mayor of Sydney, think Australia is electric vehicle ready, that all people need is a little help to make the transition. The reality is very different.
EVs will not stop climate change, but we must help motorists make the shift
Clover Moore
Lord mayor of Sydney
February 20, 2023 — 5.00amIf we are to stop dangerous runaway climate change, we need to reach net zero emissions as soon as possible. Lowering transport emissions – currently around 20 per cent of all our emissions – will be crucial to this task.
We can’t expect electrification of vehicles to be the silver bullet. If we simply swap internal combustion vehicles for EVs we’ll have done more to save the car industry than the planet.
That’s why our first priority is creating a city for walking, cycling and public transport – this is the most effective way to reduce emissions from transport. We must improve accessibility while reducing the amount of driving that is necessary.
Of course, some people are not able to walk, ride a bike or use public transport easily, and we will continue to need service and delivery vehicles. Electrification of high-impact fleets and private vehicles will help complete the journey to net zero transport.
There are obvious barriers to this, not least of which is the sheer cost of electric vehicles. We need federal and state governments to introduce more stringent fuel and emissions standards for vehicles to facilitate the increased availability, affordability and diversity of electric vehicles in Australia. Costs will also go down as technology and scale of production improves
…
Read more: https://www.smh.com.au/business/consumer-affairs/evs-will-not-stop-climate-change-but-we-must-help-motorists-make-the-shift-20230219-p5clmu.html
The picture at the top of the page was taken a few days ago by my dash cam. Last weekend, on a whim, I decided to do a big country drive, and visit the town of Biggenden.
Biggenden is well worth a visit – one of the friendliest places in Australia.
But getting there is a real challenge. The roads I had to drive to reach this friendly town were an absolute disgrace.
Maryborough, the town featured at the start of the video, is a tourist town, the birthplace of P.L.Travers, author of Mary Poppins. One of Australia’s showpiece country towns.
Unfortunately the dash cam erased some of my best clips. I encountered far worse roads than the video above.
My point is, I was driving a heavy off-road vehicle, but I still had to slow down, to avoid damaging the vehicle suspension – the roads were that bad. And there is nothing especially bad about the roads I happened to use. I wasn’t looking for bad roads. Outside cities and heavily populated rural regions, and a handful of major motorways connecting the cities, most of the roads are bad.
Imagine trying to drive an EV along such roads?
Batteries don’t like being jolted and shaken. At the very least, I suspect you could look forward to a significant reduction in battery life, and some major repair bills.
These are not the worst roads Australia has to offer. Biggenden is only 40 miles from the East Coast. Out West, the roads get really bad.
I could imagine grudgingly accepting an EV, if I never wanted to drive outside of big cities like Sydney. But the idea of driving an EV along typical Australian country roads is a joke. Even if there was a charging station on every corner, the ongoing maintenance and repair cost for that low slung weight bearing suspension, and those fragile battery packs, would be unsustainable.
“”EVs will not stop climate change””
Indeed nothing can stop it. It was happening long before we got here and only a buffoon would think such action possible
And only a buffoon or a liar would say it.
“and” is still a possibility
Recommendations to Sydney Mayor to “Help motorists make the shift to EVs”
1) Make them AFFORDABLE
2) Give then an identical range to IC counterparts
3) Enable them to be “Refueled” in the same time as their counterparts
4) Create Fuel dispensing sites in equal number to their counterparts
5) Placed no farther apart than their least effective model can drive on 80% charge or while towing 10,000 lbs.
6) Make them so they don’t spontaneously combust
7) Make them to be easily extinguished if when they do spontaneously combust
OR
Let market and demand drive a gradual changeover to a better product if when one is ever produced
They don’t want us to buy EVs for traveling. They want us to give up travel. Stay home in the city, pay for public transit but also just travel less. That’s how you reduce CO2 emissions, need less power transmission services and energy overall.
The goal is to change Western behavior and expectations, not make them “sustainable”. The elite know the 1st World lifestyle is not possible for 7 billion people. They have to make it only possible for the 0.1% at the top; the other 99.9% have to be put in a position of simply not being able to live like that 0.1%.
Maybe if all the men cut off their ****ers and the women cut off their b******s and moved bits of flesh around to certain places, then we could have equity and we could tackle climate change once and for all.
Climate Change (Global Warming) is affected by the sun predominantly. The minute amount of carbon dioxide created by man has a negligible effect. Man cannot appreciably alter the climate. We must adapt to what we have as we always have done.
Even on best roads I wouldn’t drive an EV as I’m very happy with my old 1994 Volvo 850 with gasoline engine.
“We need federal and state governments to introduce more stringent fuel and emissions standards for vehicles to facilitate the increased availability, affordability and diversity of electric vehicles”
The citizens of Sydney are so lucky to a intellect of this calibre running the show 🤡
Why can’t a city government do this? Lord Mayor seems to think that Sydney is ready for EVs, and, therefore, the rest of the state, of the country, of the world, of the Universe…
Making every other option unaffordable is the best way to make electrics affordable?
That’s the only way they can make anybody “want” EVs. Remove access to the superior alternatives.
“diversity of electric vehicles””
I guess that means they come in colors other than white.
In the UK many models are on a waiting list of a year or more. IC engined models are delivered this week. There has to be a problem there somewhere?
“We need federal and state governments…”
Aha, there’s your problem. In fact, you don’t.
Can it be that our conceptual framework of the climate system has been polluted by our instrumentation? Whereby pointing radiometers at things tells us nothing of the mechanisms involved….
When we can’t measure easily what we want (or should), we wind up measuring what we can. Our instrumentation has resulted in a reductionism of heat transfer discourse to radiation. This conceptual framework has colored our expectations and interpretation of the system. Importantly, it has colored the policy recommendation.
The atmosphere blackened in our imagination. Our mental constructs blackened for real.
For the field of climatology, I think this emerged from the excitement of spaceborne radiometers in the 1960s and 70s and the accompanying advancement of radiation codes. This conceptual framework has deeply influenced the field ever since.
Seminal influential works in modern climate concepts emerged during this radiometer craze. Perhaps it has led us astray, where we render the factors difficult to measure as secondary in importance. The focus of climates exclusively on trace gas.
This madness permeates now into the politics of environment, where the solutions proposed are perfectly absurd. However, the emergence of the $100 trillion climate industrial complex will result in winners, for sure.
The climate field definitely went off the rails back in the 50s and 60s when they decided that all energy transfer was due to radiation. Some scientists warned us about the consequences of over-attributing radiative causes (Plass etc.) But nevertheless they went ahead and invented fake radiation power adjustments (see “pyrgeometer equation”) in order to make it look like everything was due to radiation. This fed nicely into making CO2 a radiative boogeyman, with associated wealth transfers and destruction of healthy and efficient civilization. Could be coincidence, could be planned… I’m leaning towards planned…
I could imagine grudgingly accepting…
Never. Buy only what you are willing to buy.
Only under duress should you “grudgingly accept” ANYTHING.
FREE MARKETS FOREVER!
I might grudgingly accept ten million dollars … in pennies
This is the reality of what owning an EV is like.
Gotta love the blarney.
Yeah, I saw a headline yesterday claiming UK citizens were giving up their electric vehicles and going back to internal combustion.
I see where the Ford F-150 all-electric truck is having major problems.
if the author thinks those roads are bad, visit michigan.
If it’s “runaway”, then by definition, it can’t be stopped.
“You peons do not need to drive anywhere, anyway” The Lord Mayor?
Perhaps someone should tell Clover that public transport uses more fuel/energy per passenger kilometer than tha average private ICE car. Where the hell she thinks the energy is going to come from to charge all these electric public transport things from once a couple more coal power stations are closed I really can’t imagine.
Eric, if you’re needing a smoother ride on rough roads, maybe you should get behind the wheel of one of these beauties –
We’re all in this together:Hunt urged to scrap ‘grossly unfair’ electric car tax as driver fury erupts over 20% VAT
(Jeez, after all the tax-breaks they’ve had so far. Errr ‘scuse me, what about The Children?)
Express UK
Here’s to the bright new future of smart everything: Smart motorway safety system fails after ‘unplanned outage
(Did anyone really expect anything else to happen. Smart meters and smart grids wont do that.)
Here
Re Aus roads: From a long lonnnggggng time ago was a story of some particular cars, BMWs in Australia, and their ‘wheels kept breaking‘
BMW had to admit fault and defeat – the alloy wheels fitted to their cars simply couldn’t handle Australian roads/drivers and randomly collapsed as they were being motored along.
From whichever moment on, all BMW sold in Aus came with standard boring steel wheels
Poofter cars anyway.
BMW had to admit fault and defeat – the alloy wheels fitted to their cars simply couldn’t handle Australian roads/drivers
Back a decade or so back when I was involved in a vehicle project where we were using a German company for the power pack solution the running joke was “We do not have that problem in Germany”.
Germany is not Australia. German things broke in Australian service. The German engineers were utterly bewildered.
Mayor of Sydney: “If we are to stop dangerous runaway climate change, we need to reach net zero emissions as soon as possible.”
‘If we are to stop Whakaari from dangerous runaway explosions, we will need to actually toss the tourists into the crater’
Same logic.
That reminds me of the song titled: Who will stop the rain?
Imagine trying to drive an EV along such roads?
Batteries don’t like being jolted and shaken. At the very least, I suspect you could look forward to a significant reduction in battery life, and some major repair bills.
Or an unexpected fire possibly leading to Sudden Immolation Syndrome (SIS).
Eric suggests that you “Imagine trying to drive an EV along such roads?”
however he seems unaware of EVs specifically designed for being taken off road like the Rivian R1S. See:
https://www.theverge.com/23195814/rivian-r1s-suv-ev-hands-on-impressions
Of course there are plenty of ICE cars that wouldn’t be able to cope with Australian roads. I doubt you could drive a McLaren P1 on such roads for example. But that doesn’t mean that all ICE cars are useless similarly if you can’t drive specific EVs on rough roads that does mean that you can’t drive all EVs on such roads.
US $78-90,000 entry price for an EV which can handle country roads. Yep, that sure solves the transport problems of country folk.
That is not the question you asked. You made a general comment that EVs were incapable of driving on bad roads. Which is clearly nonsense since people can design EVs that can and do work extremely well on rough terrain.
It would also seem likely that the fewer moving parts a vehicle has the better it would function on rough ground since there is less to be shaken apart. EVs in that case would last longer and be able to go faster than an ICE vehicle since they have significantly fewer moving parts (20 for an EV versus 2000 in an ICE vehicle).
EVs are heavier because of the enormous mass of the batteries, but there is also a need to keep the overall weight down, to boost their pathetic range. So its going to be interesting to see whether structural failure is an issue in coming years, even in EVs which have allegedly been hardened against our decrepit, poorly maintained roads.
The heat of the Outback will make short work of most battery packs.
Tyres for EVs are a con too.
Bad roads account for lots of side-wall fractures.
That means chucking the tyre away, not just a puncture repair.
And not only do EV tyres cost more, but –
https://mycarvoice.com/news/are-ev-tires-more-expensive/
Again you are changing the topic. You asked whether or not an EV could be driven along such roads. The answer is clearly yes. There are off road EVs that could manage it with ease.
As for range the average distance driven by a car in Australia per day is about 37km. So any EV would have the range for a typical Australian commute. Similarly in the UK for instance the average trip length is 8.4 miles again easily within the range of every EV or even the battery of most plug-in hybrids.
I never said it would be impossible to drive an EV along such roads. I invited people to imagine driving an EV along such roads.
An EV road vehicle could be driven on such roads, but given the pounding my 4WD was receiving, you would have to drive slowly, to avoid damage, at a speed well below the speed limit.
Maybe the unaffordable EV SUV would do better – but how many people can afford US $78,000? For a vehicle which would almost instantly become scratched and damaged by rocks and debris on the road?
The choices you would inflict on ordinary people, an unaffordable electric SUV, or creeping along roads at a snails pace to avoid damage, are either of these options really an acceptable solution?
Do you have so little respect for people’s time, that you think it would be OK for them to creep along the roads, wasting hours of their lives because they were forced to drive vehicles which are utterly inappropriate to the driving conditions?
This is what I was inviting people to imagine.
I am not inflicting any choices on anyone. The point is that whether or not you can drive a car along a particular roads depends on its suspension and not on what type of motor is has.
There are plenty of cars with ICEs which would be forced to creep along such roads at a snail’s pace because they were designed for city driving. No doubt the fraction of EV’s that are suitable for such roads is smaller than the fraction of ICEs but that is not a fundamental limitation.
And anyway the obvious solution is to more efficiently use tax revenue to maintain the road network. Unless you think roads should all be privatised and only the rich would be able to pay the toll to drive on smooth tarmac.
Of course seeing as it fuel taxes supposedly paying for road maintenance, EV’s get off scott free. Imagine the screams if registration and insurance were weight based.
Using averages loses a lot of information. Most of the population of Australia lives in the major cities, and because of the limited bus and train coverage, most of their driving will be commuting to work, or at least to the local railway station for the rest of the trip to work.
If that average only covers cars, and it probably does, it excludes the most popular vehicle in Australia, the tradie’s ute. (mostly Toyota Hi-Lux, some Mazda BT50 and Nissan Navara). These tend to be driven a lot further than that on a daily basis, and carrying bloody great tool boxes, cement mixers, sand, timber, steel, etc. I think your equivalent is the white van.
You also have people in country towns, who have to travel to larger centres for many medical services, specialty shops, etc. Also people on farms, travelling to the nearest town for shopping. These trips obviously aren’t daily, but are often a couple of hundred miles each way.
In some ways I agree with Clover Moore. Better and more frequent bus services would help cut down on driving in the Greater Sydney area (the City of Sydney is only a minute portion of that), as would more parking at suburban railway stations. Any railway car park upgrade seems to last at most 6 months before it runs out of room.
Actually, the increase in working from home left a lot of railway car parks half empty, so that helps as well, but only where a physical presence isn’t necessary. Do you know if those averages are current, or pre-Pandemic?
Yes averages do lose a lot of information but it also shows that most people in many countries could use an EV to go about their usual routine without every having to worry about running out of power. This is not to say that there aren’t exceptions and it doesn’t mean that an EV is the right choice for everyone but for most people it is a valid choice.
So, basically the “Most People” EV would wind up being an Overweight
Underutilized
Range Limited
Unaffordable
Second car…Guilded Golf Cart for driving no more than 37K per day that could spontaneously ignite into an External Combustion Vehicle at a moments notice.
well that seems like a fairly good description of almost every SUV sold. EVs aren’t any different. What is needed is to get people out of cars and onto other forms of transport. The average speed in central London is about 14 km/hr. EVs don’t solve that issue and will not make it quicker for people to get from A to B. They do do a great job of reducing air pollution though.
I have a 1998 Dodge Durango and It took me from Sonoma County up to Seattle Wa. on 2.5 tanks of gas (refuelled 3 times in a total of 20 minutes) and took 15 hours total drive time.
Show me an EV designed to go 37K per day that can make that trip in the same timeframe
For that matter, show me an EV that can achieve that trip and still cost less than $22,000 (what I paid in 2000)
Then show me an EV that can still make the trip when it’s 25 years old. My 1998 Durango is 25 years old and the gas tank still holds 22 Gal and delivers 300 miles per fill up (like it did when it was new)
Mum’s Taxi?
The history of that phenomenon in Australia is interesting. Most sedans are flat-out holding 5 people, so not really sufficient for taking the kids (and a couple of their mates) to sport on the weekend, or dropping them off at school (goodness only know why they can’t catch the bus), and there weren’t many 7-seat “people movers”.
In addition, there was a blanket import duty reduction on 4WDs rather than a refund for those who needed them for business, so 4WD station wagons were cheaper than sedans.
The reduced import duty may have partially been because there was no local 4WD manufacture.
That’s not the case now, but there seem to be a lot of 4WD station wagons in town. It’s still mostly single-cab and dual-cab utes in the bush.
That requires much better public transport and station parking.
And it really only covers the “average”, which is the daily commute and sending the kids to school. How about 3 kids who play different sports at different venues on the weekend? Are you going to send a 10-year-old off on public transport with a full cricket kit bag every Saturday in the summer?
What about the weekly shopping? Or do you propose shopping daily?
Wow driving in Australia is like driving in central London?
A slight aside.
Yesterday I was in the centre of Bristol UK, complete with clean air zone (££). I needed to go 300m to my destination but this road now had a bus gate, ie no cars. The detour to get 300m not through the bus gate was 4 MILES. Even when I arrived I could not park anywhere as most parking has been banned.
This is the GREEN future and is nothing to do with emissions, clean air or anything except money!
Isaac,
Reduce air pollution? How?
The electricity is still 80+% hydrocarbon fuelled, on global average.
.
Can you quote an experiment where ICE cars were compared with leccy, like similar towns close together? How do you define and how do you measure pollution?
.
What about the different pollutions from getting the raw materials for makingeach class of car?
,
Have you included in you analysis any CO2 benefits like agriculture fertilization?
.
Oh, how easy it is to rattle off short, glib bits of propaganda, wrong as it often is.
Geoff S
Based on the average age of a US citizen it is clear we could scuttle Medicare tomorrow!
Izaak, you said Eric asked a different question. How is that different to your perpetual answering alternative points?
Sigh.
Watching the dash camera video, it’s obvious all the ruts are on the left side of the road. So drive on the other side.
He’s mad
As usual with these little sermons it is written in the majestic plural, when Ms Moore uses “we” and “our’ she means “you” and “your”.
To Ms Moore Australia is Ultimo and immediate surrounds.
Aha. The “Lord Mayor” is female?
No more questions.
“runaway climate change”
What’s that?
There wasn’t any “runaway climate change” when atmospheric CO2 was 7000 ppm; when it was 4000 ppm not only couldn’t that much CO2 trigger the aforementioned “runaway climate change, it couldn’t stop temperatures from plummeting into an ice age that lasted millions of years; now 420 ppm is going to do it?! Don’t make me laugh.
Tomorrow’s Sun rise is as likely to trigger a “runaway climate change.”
Sales o f EVs will continue to languish until the manufacturers start dropping prices so that they are competitive with gas/diesel types and far more public recharging stations are built. End of story. As for the peculiar belief that fewer cars on the road would generate more enthusiasm for cycling, a survey in Germany found that 47% of people that owned cars used them every day, while only 18% who owned bicycles could say the same. The latter might be good for short trips in good weather carrying nothing or very light loads. Change the temperature and/or increase the loads and let’s see how enthusiastic about their bikes people are,
In Denmark 44% of commuting trips are by bike and over 80% of people continue to cycle in winter. Holland is similar. But you need both the culture and the infrastructure to make it possible.
Denmark’s geography is characterised by flat arable land with low elevation. Not that many hills in Denmark. Same largely true of The Netherlands.
You need a specific lack of infrastructure to make it possible; either that, or you need to Force the culture.
Even IF they could get the prices down for a decently appointed one (unlikely given increases in the material costs going on already), they still suck compared with ICE cars, so their sales will continue to languish.
As for those who are gullible enough to buy into their advertising claims, real world performance, particularly in terms of range, will result in lots of buyers remorse and few repeat sales.
Any manufacturer that abandons ICE models will quickly see its sales and business crater.
Net zero and mass EVs not anytime soon.
https://www.lifesitenews.com/opinion/new-geological-study-proves-that-the-green-energy-movement-is-impossible-to-achieve/
There is no crisis therefore there is no need for net zero. These knuckleheads need to stop saying things like that.
That’s why our first priority is creating a city for walking, cycling and public transport
And the “15 Minute City” is a massive Alt-Right Conspiracy Theory?
Are you a conspiracy theorist if there really is a conspiracy?
Ms Moore must not use ‘public transport’ such as buses…Since the governments bus service was privatised the service has gradually been cut back, the impacts of which will very likely result in more cars traffic…Thinking people can walk better if you cut off their feet is queer thinking…
I’ve seen the same idea – “creating a city for walking, cycling and public transport” – in many articles, as if everyone had been given the same script. So what does one do with the existing cities?
We must help climate alarmist politicians make the move to useful occupations.
As soon as possible!
Are Macdonalds still hiring?
They may have a technical name, but i call them road chokes (as in ‘chokeholds’)…
Along the main access road into Bondi Junction, from Sydney, kerbing juts out from footpaths reducing a previously wider street to just two lanes…The traffic congestion caused results in recently privatised government buses taking 10 minutes to crawl a mile…That’s progress…
And of the privatised public bus service, the service has been gutted. Crowds now gather, often there’s standing room only on board, as efficiencies have been imposed to generate profit…
It’s often a wait of from 15 to over 20 minutes for the scheduled every-ten-minute bus service to the other eastern suburbs, Maroubra Jct and Randwick Jct; gone are the convoys of busses into and from the city at peak periods…Efficiencies for profit have replaced efficient services for commuters…
The longer waits will only encourage more people to rely on private cars…
The road chokes have been built on other inner city access roads…One cant but wonder whether if “15 minute cities” are being implemented by stealth…
The Gold coast is pretty congested, that’s for sure. I considered living there, I like the restaurants, but I’m enjoying a quieter life away from the big cities.
Hi Eric, I was born in Biggenden, have 3 generations of ancestors in the local cemetery, but haven’t lived there for 50 years, though I visit or pass through now and then. The roads haven’t improved much in 50 years. EVs are of no practical use outside metropolitan areas.
Ken
Agreed, EVs are only good for city driving, unless you pay for a crazy expensive EV SUV.
Biggenden is a nice place, had a few friendly beers in the Commercial Hotel chatting to a couple of locals about Pizza ovens and growing citrus. I think I’ll call in again sometime.
EVs are of no practical use, period.
Unless perhaps your “hobby” is sitting around at “charging stations” or lighting fires.
From the article: “If we are to stop dangerous runaway climate change, we need to reach net zero emissions as soon as possible.”
He says, with absolutely no scientific backing of his claims. There is no evidence humans can stop the climate from changing, nor is there evidence that it is necessary to change the climate from what it is now, and there is no evidence that reaching Net Zero will have any effect at all on the Earth’s climate.
The man is regugitating climate alarmist talking points. He probably believes what he is saying, but as we know, he is completely off base in his thinking, just like all the other climate change alarmists.
..and there is no evidence that “climate change” [whether global temps or extreme “dangerous” weather] is in a “runaway” mode.
Are all alarmists equipped with a random pejorative word generator?
What is the basis for the extra adjective in the declaration: “If we are to stop dangerous runaway climate change…”
My guess is the intent is to insert new negative descriptors with no evidence and repeat until the public assumes the allegation (e.g. extreme weather is in a runaway mode) is true.
“If we are to stop dangerous runaway climate change…”
You are not. End of argument.
EV promotion is recognized by the elites as a way to keep people at home, reduce movement by the less than rich.
From the high initial cost of an EV to its low battery life – which many people won’t be able to afford – to the difficulties of charging, the net effect is to reduce travel outside cities. Force municipal transit usage and accept its limitations. In theory, rent a car: in practice, stay home.
Dense urban communities is what the political world wants, places dependent on government services and handouts. It’s a way to stay in power. If the rural areas decay and become simply resource procurement areas, so much the better.
Governments understand how hard it is to control and manage a hundred areas with differing needs and wants. Its easier if there are only 20 large areas with similar needs and desires. Which is why they also suppress small businesses in favor of corporate franchises and conglomerates.
The ultimate goal is a world government not of 192 individual countries but a dozen who indirectly control the decision making of the other 180. The WEF wants to be part of the overriding bureaucracy that would manage the 12. It is the “federalization” of all human organizations and activities. A movement restricted populace makes this easier.
EV travel is not the future. The future is no travel, that is, except for the rich who, as Gates and Kerry have said explicitly, they need to do because of the importance of their work ….. er lives.
‘Costs will also go down as technology and scale of production improves.’
Yeah, good luck with that. The rise in the cost of the raw materials for the battery and the motors will wipe out any volume cost saving many times over.