Big Tech Pandemic

Patients in Wuhan, China, are being saved with high-dose vitamin C. In the U.S., you can get your Twitter or Facebook account deleted or your video scrubbed for even talking about it.

American Association of Physicians and Surgeons

The Statistics

Strikingly, the 10 countries with the highest COVID-19 mortality rates are large Western countries, including the US, UK, France, Spain, and Italy. The non-Western country with the highest mortality rate is Ecuador, ranked at #13. Ecuador only has 195 deaths/million, however, compared with the median of around 450 deaths/million in the “top 10”. No Asian countries make the top-20 list despite being close to the epicenter of the epidemic and having high population densities. No African country makes the list despite many having much traffic from China.

Table 1. The 20 countries with the highest COVID-19 mortalities (2020-06-03)

10Channel Islands3,223265173,737

Worldometers, 06/03/2020, 9:30 am CT

*Eliminated from the comparison are countries with less than 100k population (San Marino, Sint Maarten, Montserrat, Monaco, Bermuda, Isle of Man, and Andorra).

Possible Explanations

The popular hypotheses, such as the use of anti-malarial drugs in some countries and anti-tuberculosis vaccination of children in others, do not explain these differences.

Chloroquine and similar drugs are not widely used for malaria prevention in India and other malaria-affected countries. Travelers do take anti-malarials for prophylaxis, but locals acquire some immunity from exposure to it in childhood. If they do contract malaria, they are treated with chloroquine or artemisinin combo for a few days. India uses less HCQ per million population than the US.

One observational hypothesis posits that full national anti-tuberculosis vaccination (BCG) correlates with lower COVID-19mortality. BCG is typically given to babies at birth, sometimes with boosters in late childhood. This hypothesis suggests that BCG provides some degree of long-term immunity to COVID-19. Even if there is correlation, however, it is not relevant here. The UK had full BCG from 1953–2005. Belgium had it from about 1953–1995 and France from 1950–2007. Ireland started mandatory BCG vaccination in the 1950s and still has it.

Other factors exist. Less developed countries might not detect and report cases and deaths from COVID-19 as completely as more developed countries. They also have lower ratios of older people and have low urbanization.

Amplifying Factors

On the other hand, population density in the cities of non-Western countries is typically higher than in Western ones. Mumbai has 32 thousand persons per km2, while New York City has just 10,000 persons per km2. People in non-Western countries also tend to have less physical distance between them. There are more persons per area at work and home, and multiple generations often live together in the same households. Even in developed Russia and Ukraine, the typical physical distance between persons is about three times less than in the US, which should translate to a much higher transmission speed, and exponentially higher rates of cases and deaths.

Many non-Western countries also have low hygienic standards. Many suffer from bad nutrition, cold weather, lack of UVB sunlight, and other immunity-compromising factors. Less developed countries also have much lower capacities to hospitalize and treat those who are severely ill.

Google, Facebook, Twitter, etc.

The top dozen Western countries share another distinguishing factor: information flow dominated by Google, Facebook, Twitter, and their accomplices (here, Masters of the Universe or “MOTUs”). The media are downstream of them, depending on information, clicks, and even cash handouts from them. These companies collaborated with the WHO, spread panic (like Google’s SOS Alert), misled government health agencies and the public about coronavirus mortality (e.g., calling COVID-19 a pandemic was wrong). They have been removing helpful medical advice and even opinions simply because they were not endorsed by the WHO or confused government agencies. Notice that this debate ban prevents scientists and clinicians from communicating helpful information to government agencies, and even communicating among themselves. Many governments censor information, such as the Soviet Union. With all the inferiority of such a model, the Soviet government developed and possessed all the anti-epidemic expertise and capacities it wanted. In the US, most expertise and capacity in this and other fields is with its citizens, from whom the government can receive help and advice when needed. Citizens do provide such help and advice, but the MOTU use their physical control of the communications channels to block and remove information helpful to fight the epidemic. For example, Google blocked access to the scientific paper An Effective Treatment for Coronavirus (COVID-19) by James Todaro and Gregory Rigano, which made a case for CQ and HCQ on March 13–15.

Effects of COVID-19 Misinformation in the US

In the US, most COVID-19 deaths happened in the New York cluster. NYC also spread COVID-19 nationally and internationally. These are some main mistakes made by NYC in handling the epidemic:

  • It blocked early HCQ treatment of COVID-19 victims.
  • It failed to recommend and, where relevant, implement nutritional and environmental mitigation measures to slow the epidemic.
  • It allowed COVID-19 patients to mix with other patients and unprotected healthcare personnel in hospitals.
  • It sent young COVID-19 patients to nursing homes.

None of these mistakes was caused by material factors or a lack of knowledge in the public domain. None of these are obvious only in hindsight. All were caused by incorrect assumptions about COVID-19 and/or by panic, both of which were spread by the MOTUs (General incompetence and the politics of NYC have just aggravated these mistakes, I hope).

The resistance to recommending vitamin C, which was caused by misinformation spread by the MOTU directly and through their proxy “fact-checkers,” is an example of how much damage they inflicted.

Vitamin C

Vitamin C has always been recommended as safe and helpful for many health conditions, including the prevention and treatment of respiratory infections. An abundance of evidence and studies supports the use of vitamin C to prevent and alleviate respiratory diseases.

Despite this, in February, the WHO published a Q&A on COVID-19 advising against taking vitamin C, even comparing taking vitamin C to smoking:

The following measures ARE NOT specifically recommended as 2019-nCoV remedies as they are not effective to protect yourself and can be even harmful:
* Taking vitamin C
* Smoking
* Drinking tradition herbal teas
* Wearing multiple masks to maximize protection
* Taking self-medication such as antibiotics

With all the incompetence and power hunger of the WHO, this is bad copywriting rather than bad judgment. An ordinary person can easily recognize that. However, the MOTU “fact-checkers” interpreted it in the worst conceivable way.

Apparently, it started in the article “These are false cures and fake preventative measures against coronavirus. Help fact-checkers spread the word” (February 13) published by the Poynter Institute (the entity that certifies the fact-checkers used by Google, Facebook, and Microsoft):

Aos Fatos reported that the World Health Organization says on its website that taking vitamin C is not recommended as a way to prevent coronavirus. It is actually dangerous, just like smoking and taking antibiotics without a prescription.

The linked Aos Fatos article did not say that. The Poynter Institute omitted the “not specifically recommended” clause. “Fact-checkers” are in the clickbait business, too. This “advice” went beyond Google and Facebook: the New York Times (NYT) article “Coronavirus Myths” (March 17) said:

You might be tempted to bulk order vitamin C or other supposedly immune-boosting supplements, but their effectiveness is a long-standing fallacy. Even in the cases of colds or flus, vitamin C hasn’t shown a consistent benefit.

Unlike Google, the NYT is supposed to have human editors. Where were they? Its other article with the strange title “Supplements for Coronavirus Probably Won’t Help, and May Harm” (March 23) called vitamin C “a purported immune booster.”USA Today  was even worse: “We rate the claim that vitamin C can help cure or prevent the novel coronavirus FALSE because it is not supported by our research”—as if it conducted research.

It seems that Google and Facebook forgot that these fact-checkers were intended as proxies to justify their politically motivated editorializing by pretending it was third-party information. They started using them as authoritative sources. By May 20, it was easier to find “stabilized oxygen” than vitamin C in Google searches including the word COVID-19.

The MOTU financially benefited from their misdeeds. More people were forced to use Facebook, Twitter, Google Docs, YouTube, and Microsoft Skype instead of meeting face-to-face.

Facebook and Twitter Examples

The MOTU have been collaborating and colluding with the WHO to misinform the public and government in the US and other countries since early February. The NYT article “W.H.O. Fights a Pandemic Besides Coronavirus: an ‘Infodemic’” (Feb 6) wrote

Google launched what it calls an “SOS Alert,” which directs people who search for “coronavirus” to news and other information from the W.H.O., including to the organization’s Twitter account . . .

The health agency has worked especially closely with Facebook. The company has used human fact-checkers to flag misinformation, which can come to their attention through computer programs that identify suspicious keywords and trends. Such posts can then be moved down in news feeds, or, in rare cases, removed altogether.

These are some results of this close work. “Coronavirus: World leaders’ posts deleted over fake news” (BBC, 2020-03-31),

Facebook and Twitter have deleted posts from world leaders for spreading misinformation about the coronavirus. Facebook deleted a video from Brazilian President Jair Bolsonaro that claimed hydroxychloroquine was totally effective in treating the virus.

Brazil is the sixth-largest country of the world by population. By that time, the use of CQ or HCQ for COVID-19 had been endorsed to some degree by the governments of China, India, and the US. Did Facebook and Twitter executives think they knew better?

Facebook: Combatting COVID-19 Misinformation

We regularly update the claims that we remove based on guidance from the WHO and other health authorities.

Once a post is rated false by a fact-checker, we reduce its distribution so fewer people see it, and we show strong warning labels and notifications to people who still come across it, try to share it or already have. 

Facebook: An Update on Our Work

Informing People Who Interacted With Harmful COVID-19 Claims

We’re going to start showing messages in News Feed to people who have liked, reacted or commented on harmful misinformation about COVID-19 that we have since removed. These messages will connect people to COVID-19 myths debunked by the WHO …

Twitter: An update on our continuity strategy during COVID-19

Broadening our definition of harm to address content that goes directly against guidance from authoritative sources of global and local public health information. . . . [W]e will require people to remove tweets that include:

* Denial of global or local health authority recommendations to decrease someone’s likelihood of exposure to COVID-19 . . .

* Description of alleged cures for COVID-19, which are not immediately harmful but are known to be ineffective . . .

* Denial of established scientific facts . . .

* [The list is going on and on]

It is incredible: denial of recommendations … global health authority … alleged cures … denial of established scientific facts. “Require people to remove tweets” means temporary disabling their accounts until they remove the tweets that Twitter dislikes.

The global conversation about COVID-19 and ongoing product improvements are driving up total monetizable DAU (mDAU), with quarter-to-date average total mDAU reaching approximately 164 million, up 23% from 134 million in Q1 2019 . . .

… manufacturing delays in China have compromised the supply chain, resulting in delays in deliveries to our data centers.

Have they de-platformed critics of the Chinese government to avoid “manufacturing delays” or something else?

Most people would think that if Google, Facebook, or Twitter deleted information related to treatment or prevention of the pandemic, they were 100% sure it was false and harmful. Few would believe that they did that on a whim or based on the opinion of entities like Snopes. And they would be branded “conspiracy theorists.”


Other Possible Factors

Anti-tuberculosis vaccines and their administration schedules vary by country, and some countries might have COVID-19 protective effects from them.

Another hypothesis is put forward in the following papers:

“Have the malaria eradication measures been behind the COVID-19 pandemic?” Elnady Hassan M., Sohag Medical Journal, opinion article

“Parasites and their protection against COVID-19—Ecology or Immunology?” Ssebambulidde et al., preprint:

One plausible hypothesis for the comparatively low COVID-19 cases/deaths in parasite-endemic areas is immunomodulation induced by parasites.

I consider these hypotheses too exotic to discuss here and just mention them. Many confounding factors remain when comparison among countries is done.


  • Another commonality among the highest-mortality countries is climate alarmism taking over the scientific community.
  • The “fact-checkers” seem to be the original sources of some of the worst hoaxes on the Internet.
  • Yes, the MOTUs used artificial intelligence to misinform the public and governments about COVID-19.
  • Besides the direct effects of bans, removals, and the deplatforming of information and speakers who knew more about COVID-19 than the WHO, these actions had chilling effects on discussions related to COVID-19.
  • Coughing into one’s elbow is outright harmful advice because it makes the sleeve a virus-spreader.
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Javert Chip
June 8, 2020 10:15 am

I’m betting all my money on this explanation in the US:

o Covid-19 expenses are paid by the government

o Hospital reimbursement for Covid-19 deaths is significantly higher than non C-19

Our miserable government officials have us locked down, we’re ruining or economy, and the government cannot accurately tell us how many have died of C-19, nor can they tell us what the mortality rate is.

Reply to  Javert Chip
June 8, 2020 1:47 pm

The lockdown was originally a strategy to stop the spread of cvd-19, now it’s a strategy to stop Trump.

Don Perry
Reply to  Klem
June 8, 2020 3:46 pm

The lockdown was originally a strategy to “flatten the curve” to prevent an overwhelming of hospital admissions. That was accomplished. It then evolved into what it is now — a strategy to destroy the economy and exert unconstitutional control over individual rights.

Adrian Mann
Reply to  Klem
June 8, 2020 4:59 pm

… and that’s a Bad Thing? Rapist, misogynist, lying, ignorant, populist, fascist One-Term-Trump? Gaslighting, sh•t-fer-brains, redneck, 2nd Amendment supporting, shoot to kill, bandwagon jumping, Bible thumping, Space Force, “It’s going to disappear” Fake President Trump?
Stop Trump?
You seriously have an issue with that? What’s the matter with you? Get a fecking grip, Klemtard! Do they not allow books without pictures on your trailer park?
Trump… “Who will rid us of this troublesome President?”

[can you tone it down a little? -mod]

Jeff Alberts
Reply to  Adrian Mann
June 8, 2020 8:01 pm

Unfortunately for you, Mann (well there’s yer problem!), TDS isn’t cured with Vitamin C. Unless you overdose on it.

Krudd Gillard of the Commondebt of Australia
Reply to  Adrian Mann
June 8, 2020 8:04 pm


Javert Chip
Reply to  Adrian Mann
June 8, 2020 8:36 pm


You come across as a self-selected, virtue-signaling drama-queen. I doubt you’re any smarter or more accomplished, and, certainly, no higher power has gifted you with ethical or moral superiority. With no self-awareness, you revel in inflicting your personal, bigoted and judgmental ad hominems on others. Stripped of ideological PC drivel, I’m guessing the concept of “tolerance” is a heavy lift for you.

My recommendation: buy a 6-pac of STFU, and drink deeply.

Reply to  Javert Chip
June 9, 2020 6:23 am


John Tillman
Reply to  Adrian Mann
June 9, 2020 1:43 pm

You appear to advocate the Canterbury Cathedral solution. What’s stopping you from doing the ridding you advocate, besides the Secret Service?

Tombstone Gabby
Reply to  Adrian Mann
June 9, 2020 10:04 pm

Americans are interesting people. During prohibition (1920’s) they praised bootlegging gangsters because those individuals, as immoral as they were, were providing what the public wanted. More recently when it comes to electing leaders, the cry has been “It’s the economy, stupid”. After eight years of slow growth under the previous administration, American voters had a businessman promise economic growth. They gave him a chance. For three years the economy improved – lowest unemployment in a long time.

I don’t believe that anyone considers President to be a paragon of virtue, but he delivered on his promise. What with climate change and the virus crisis diverting taxpayer monies from rebuilding the economy, the President has his work cut out for him. Having the media virtually 100% against him isn’t going to help. And for the average working American it’s still “The economy, stupid”.

Michael Jankowski
Reply to  Javert Chip
June 8, 2020 3:36 pm

For every person who claims COVID-19 deaths are intentionally exaggerated, there’s a person who claims they are intentionally under-reported.

John Tillman
Reply to  Michael Jankowski
June 8, 2020 4:34 pm

Both happen. Whatever the politics require.

Reply to  Michael Jankowski
June 9, 2020 7:57 am

We can go full blown conspiracy by saying that evidence outside of worst in US and Western Europe show it was engineered to effect one race more.
About article, “unclean” living boosts immune system. And, this quote made me believe author just likes to be contary to popular opinion “Coughing into one’s elbow is outright harmful advice because it makes the sleeve a virus-spreader.”

Reply to  Javert Chip
June 8, 2020 6:28 pm

..and who would have thought a black porn star would single handed end a world wide pandemic

June 8, 2020 10:17 am
June 8, 2020 10:21 am

So what is the purpose of these entities in disseminating inaccurate and ultimately harmful information? What outcome are they hoping to achieve?

Javert Chip
Reply to  alexei
June 8, 2020 10:38 am

For most of humanity, having significant power over other people is literally a stronger motive than sex or money.

I certainly saw this in my career as a CFO in a large corporation.

Samuel C Cogar
Reply to  alexei
June 8, 2020 11:17 am

They are all anti-Trump, …….. are they not?

As the November election gets closer, all the per se Covoid-19 deaths that they caused, plus the looting, burning and murders, police brutality against blacks, etc., will be blamed on Trump in hopes that it will result in Hillary being elected POTUS.

John Tillman
Reply to  Samuel C Cogar
June 8, 2020 2:08 pm

Do you think that Hillary will steal the nomination from Biden?

Reply to  John Tillman
June 8, 2020 2:52 pm

No. Biden is only being used to clear the table and wait until after the convention then he will step down for “health” reasons and the DNC will usher in the “Unity Ticket”. Kerry / Romney will be their choice.

A true “Hail Mary” play if there ever was one but they are desperate to stop a second term any way they can.

John Tillman
Reply to  TRM
June 8, 2020 3:29 pm

Anything is possible, but right now that looks so February.

If Hillary wants the nomination, then Biden’s health is indeed in danger, not just from dementia.

DNC may think the election’s in the bag now, so why not go with what they’ve got, ie Biden and a black female Veep of their, not his choice. Rep. Val Demings (FL) would probably have the inside track but for OPD abuses when she was Chief.

Michelle Obama reportedly isn’t interested, and why would she be, raking in the big bucks?

Reply to  TRM
June 8, 2020 3:46 pm

Wow, at least we’ll get 150 IQ points. (70 for Kerry and 80 for Romney)

Reply to  TRM
June 8, 2020 4:03 pm

kerry/romney lose a lot of racist minority voters…

seems biden/anybody would get more popular votes than romney,

but I can’t guess which would garner more electoral votes.

michigan & as always florida?

John Tillman
Reply to  TRM
June 8, 2020 4:32 pm

Romney lost both his home state MI and the state of which he was governor, MA.

David blackall
Reply to  John Tillman
June 8, 2020 6:50 pm


Adrian Mann
Reply to  Samuel C Cogar
June 8, 2020 5:00 pm

You have a problem with being anti-Trump? Seriously?

Tom Abbott
Reply to  Adrian Mann
June 8, 2020 5:58 pm

“You have a problem with being anti-Trump?”


Never-Trumpers are idiots.

Samuel C Cogar
Reply to  Tom Abbott
June 9, 2020 3:55 am

And there are a lot of idiots out there that will believe most anything, such as:

6’ of stupidity

Unless one is standing still and no breeze is blowing, ….. the “6 feet distance Rule” believing people are to stupid to realize that in less than 2 seconds and 3 steps they will be occupying the same space that the highly contagious coronavirus infected person just stepped away from.

John Endicott
Reply to  Tom Abbott
June 9, 2020 9:58 am

Never-Trumpers are idiots.

Exhibit A being: Adrian Mann

Reply to  Tom Abbott
June 9, 2020 6:18 pm

Remember, half of everybody is below average in intelligence and as George Carlin liked to say, the average person is really stupid! 🙂

Reply to  Adrian Mann
June 8, 2020 7:04 pm

You have a problem with being anti-Trump?

No, I’m not anti-Trump.

Javert Chip
Reply to  Adrian Mann
June 8, 2020 9:02 pm


Being anti-trump is one thing. Being a bomb-throwing millennial versed only in communicating as a rabid, frothing at the mouth, intolerant fool is something else.

You’re probably comfortable with that emotional diarrhea, but I suspect few on this site want to wade thru your personality disorder.

I strongly supports mods keeping this thread on-track.

D. Boss
Reply to  Javert Chip
June 9, 2020 6:06 am

Adrian and all those afflicted with this rabid form of Trump Derangement Syndrome, are of course entitled to their opinions…

However, there are 2 salient points they should consider:

1) lies to discredit Trump have likely caused thousands or more deaths by fabricating the false paper on hydroxychloriqine – now retracted from the Lancet, but which halted trials and treatments. Ask yourself – is my hatred of Donald Trump really worth harming others to get my wish?

2) In every single case so far of the deranged anti Trumpers using fabrications and lies to try to bring him down – has backfired and increased his standing.

If you really want to change leadership, using lies and false narratives is only going to guarantee the orange monster’s re-election, you poor TDS sufferers out there!

Oh I can’t wait for the morning after when he wins again – the wails of grief, the tooth gnashing, the tearful screams to the sky gods and hopefully all those woke dilettantes threatening to leave the country will make good on their promises….

And a cautionary note to all the rest of the sane persons reading here – Adrian’s sickness is only one – but as the article points out all of the big tech platforms, almost all media and the online social media mobs – are populated with millions of equally sick perspectives who believe the end(s) justify the means!

Whether you like him or not; whether you agree with him or not – our main focus on this website – to counter the hijacking of Science for political means, as in the Climate Fiasco, and now the Pandemic Circus – he may be the only last best hope to make a course correction on the issues we hold as important. The ogre of big tech suppressing truth for their narrative will never be checked if a Demonrat gets elected!

AK in VT
Reply to  Javert Chip
June 9, 2020 2:52 pm


Why the vitriol? You make yourself look the fool. Reason with us as I am about to do:

1. I was not a Trump supporter (though I was never a never Trumper), I supported Scott Walker of Wisconsin.
2. Truth is important and so is giving someone a chance even if he is not likeable. I call it loving your neighbour and loving your enemy (though Trump was never my enemy)
3. Over time I began to think Trump was making himself to be a good President, so I began to support him.
4. Unfortunately, he lost my vote for 2020 because of what I believe is his mishandling of “covid” in so much as once we knew this was overblown, he did not tell us so — perhaps for political reasons?– despite that there is no way he could have been duped for this long by the technocrats and politically motivated medical officers.
5. Unless he does something before the election advising the people how overblown this was, I will be sitting out this election.

Remember, reason rather than spewing vitriol will get your point across better. I could have spewed like you did (though I am not like that) and my point would have been lost. There is no place for hatred on this site much less in all parts of life.

I await the hated responses I will be getting from the many readers of this post.

Regards in peace

AK in VT

p.s. The “shutdown” has actually benefitted my business financially, so my beef over the President is not personal.

Tom Abbott
Reply to  Javert Chip
June 9, 2020 6:00 pm

“4. Unfortunately, he lost my vote for 2020 because of what I believe is his mishandling of “covid” in so much as once we knew this was overblown, he did not tell us so — perhaps for political reasons?– despite that there is no way he could have been duped for this long by the technocrats and politically motivated medical officers.
5. Unless he does something before the election advising the people how overblown this was, I will be sitting out this election.”

I think you are being a little too critical of Trump’s handling of the Wuhan virus. It’s not over yet, for one thing, and nobody wants the economy back up and running more than President Trump, so he is not delaying the opening for political reasons. That’s the last thing he would do.

If you still can’t vote for Trump for the virus handling, then think about what your sitting it out might mean: You might end up electing the group of Democrat criminals who tried to steal the 2016 election and the same ones who have kept the whole nation in turmoil throughout Trump’s first term, deliberately.

There is only one rational choice and it’s not Joe China.

John Endicott
Reply to  Javert Chip
June 10, 2020 2:46 am

Indeed Tom, Much like 2016, you have to look at the choices available and pick the best option even if you think both options are poor.

Trump wasn’t my first choice. When he entered, I thought he was a clown and didn’t initially take him seriously. But as much of a clown as I thought he was, there was no way I was ever going to vote for Hillary – I’m much rather a clown than her. Never mind the decades of shady Clinton shenanigans going all the way back to whitewater, the private server alone was enough to disqualify her in my book (anyone who has ever had to get a security clearance knows just how serious a problem that was. If you or I had done that, we’d be sitting in jail right now, or at the very least fired from our jobs with our clearances revoked and thus unable to take any job that required handling classified material!).

Trump, thankfully, ended up being much better than I thought he’d be, and unlike most politicians, he actually attempted to follow through with his campaign promises (and succeeded at many of them – despite vicious opposition at every turn, some of it from his own party, that no other president has ever had to face). Even If he hadn’t, just his court picks alone would be enough to justify giving him more time in the job, IMO.

Again, Trump is faced with a candidate that is completely out of the question (that’s before we even get to the shady stuff, such as that involving his son Hunter or the just plain creepy stuff – what happened to believe all women?) this time due to his deteriorating mental abilities (just listen to him ramble incoherently when interviewed, He can’t even form complete sentences at times and goes off on odd tangents. The man is not mentally well. He thinks he’s running for the senate, doesn’t know what day of the week it is, and mistakes his sister for his wife, and more – yeah, each of those gaffs can be explained away individually, but the sheer volume of them doesn’t paint a very good picture of his mental abilities!). If Joe has any marbles left, he’s going to want to avoid debating Trump at all costs, because if he does, people will see how poor his mental condition is – debates can only hurt Joe’s chances of winning the election. And the sad thing is, out of a couple of dozen candidates, he was pretty much the best the Dems were offering this time around (the rest being mostly all too far out there on the radical left-wing of the party).

Samuel C Cogar
Reply to  Javert Chip
June 10, 2020 7:12 am

AK in VT – June 9, 2020 at 2:52 pm

4. Unfortunately, he lost my vote for 2020 because of what I believe is his mishandling of “covid” in so much as once we knew this was overblown, he did not tell us so — perhaps for political reasons?– despite that there is no way he could have been duped for this long by the technocrats and politically motivated medical officers.

AK in VT …… if Trump had went against his own Health experts and claimed that Covoid-19 wasn’t as dangerous as the Democrats and Media were claiming, ……. then when the following, including Gov Cuomo’s 5K+ pseudo-murders were committed, to wit:

At least 28,100 residents and workers have died from the coronavirus at nursing homes and other long-term care facilities for older adults in the United States, according to a New York Times database. The virus so far has infected more than 153,000 at some 7,700 facilities.

The Democrats and Media would have beaten Trump severely about his head and shoulders, BLAMING Trump for all those deaths.

Tom Abbott
Reply to  Javert Chip
June 10, 2020 7:48 am

John Endicott wrote: “If Joe has any marbles left, he’s going to want to avoid debating Trump at all costs, because if he does, people will see how poor his mental condition is – debates can only hurt Joe’s chances of winning the election.”

I think that is exactly right, John. Biden’s handlers must be dreading the day of the debate. I can’t imagine them pushing such a weak candidate, but as you say, they don’t have a lot of choices, but at least they could get someone who can say more that three sentences before he has an episode.

Trump is going to start holding public rallies again in about two weeks. Joe China will still be in his basement.

Reply to  Javert Chip
June 11, 2020 8:43 am

Boss – Well said on all points.

I plan to be watching and recording CNN/MSNBC/CBS/NBC that night. Last pres election night was a hoot watching the meltdowns at those stations.

Reply to  alexei
June 8, 2020 2:46 pm

To force everyone to get the one true and ONLY allowed treatment that they can make tens of billions of dollars on …. their precious vaccine.

Of course they would also need a way to track who has had the vaccine so they will just insert a marker that can be scanned. All in a database that will be managed by Baal Gates.

Seriously. Look at what they are saying in their own words. It is out in the open about what they want. If they can get away with that then we all become “livestock”. No thanks.

David blackall
Reply to  TRM
June 8, 2020 6:57 pm

Thanks, you are right. And thanks for the article. I would like to take the opportunity to write about my own case study as a study in its own right – of me getting data from an expensive pharmaceutical drug trial, where I am a subject, with solid lab testing to back up what I am saying. The virus I had last year looks very similar to COVID 19, it really is identical,with the spikes and all, it is a SARS virus, and how it plays out after
infection will be dependent on the individual immune system and other
factors. So it was last year in July, I tested positive for Coronavirus 229E, a virus found on bats. “Human CoVs (hCoVs)-229E, -NL63, -OC43, and -HKU1 are endemic worldwide and cause mainly
respiratory infections in children and adults.” Like the corona virus COVID 19, this virus can get very nasty in humans when the immune system is compromised. I had the0 flu shot last year, and despite that, I still got the Coronavirus 229E. Recent medical research with US military personnel shows that flu shots can open the pathway to SARS-like infections, the opposite
of what we might expect when your doctor says your resistance will improve. I quote from the paper on the military personnel study:
“Receiving influenza vaccination may increase the risk of other respiratory viruses, a phenomenon known as virus interference.” How I came to have a virus lab test analysis was because I was a subject in medical research and the test on my nasal sample when I was still quite sick, was conducted, and the sample couriered to the US. My point is multifaceted: the test was available and very accurate last year, no doubt expensive (in the US). The infection I had last year could have gone very badly, with hospitalization, even death, had my
immune system been compromised, as bad as COVID-19 version of SARS. I
am 68 years old, ehr young, but I am reasonably fit. My point again:
the infection last year was from a virus closely related to SARS,
which can cause SARS and can be severe, yet I overcame the infection
with the sun, vitamin C, etc, which I believe is the case for this
latest ‘Plandemic’. CoV SARS 19 virus and coronavirus 229E are almost
identical. This means that we can overcome, have no fear, except for
those WHO orchestrated the Plandemic, and the result of the Lockdown
on food supplies and jobs. There are papers that discuss the
particular cousin of the Covid-19 causing virus, my one, 229E. A
search on Google Scholar reveals many papers on the Coronavirus 229E.
Google these words: ‘Distant Relatives of Severe Acute Respiratory
Syndrome Coronavirus and Close Relatives of Human Coronavirus 229E in
Bats, Ghana’. Coronavirus is very common in humans.

John Tillman
Reply to  David blackall
June 9, 2020 10:11 am

Glad your treatment worked.

CoV 229 E is an alpha coronavirus; SARS, MERS and ChiCom-19 are caused by beta CoVs. It’s one of the CoVs which cause colds, and in your case, a more serious respiratory infection.

As an alpha CoV, it’s less likely to immunize you against ChiCom-19, but there is evidence that the beta CoVs can or do.

Reply to  TRM
June 8, 2020 7:42 pm

Take your meds, TRM.

Reply to  TRM
June 9, 2020 4:34 am

and nevr used mRna vax that may have”unintended permanent consequences”
I hear chat about how theyd need to “protect” themost at risk
ie look out senior cits
in Aus your in aged care etc you really do NOThave a choice when they want to give you ANY vaccines,
hard enough if not nea impossibleto get conflicting meds etc looked at /withdrawn. once prescribed they just keep filling the scripts and adding more to cover side effects etc
dementia/alzheimers dont stand a chance at all.

Reply to  alexei
June 8, 2020 6:59 pm

So what is the purpose of these entities in disseminating inaccurate and ultimately harmful information? What outcome are they hoping to achieve?

It’s a result of TDS.

Nick Schroeder
June 8, 2020 10:24 am

New York City all by itself is responsible for 20% of the US Covid-19 deaths.
Add the states of New York, New Jersey and Massachusetts and together they are accountable for as many Covid-19 deaths as the ENTIRE rest of the country combined.
Just what is their special talent??
Besides being BLUE.
Over 80% of the Covid-19 deaths occurred in the 65+ population.
Japan leads the globe with 65+ at 27% yet has not accumulated even 1,000 Covid-19 deaths.
What do the Japanese know and do that the rest of the world does not?

And as long as the lying, fact free, fake news MSM chooses to lie about how contagious Covid-19 is (Data says it isn’t!!) and lethal (Data says it isn’t.) and hang it all on Trump instead of looking behind NYC’s BLUE incompetent curtain the country’s economic misery will continue.

But then screwing over the country to get Trump is the MSM’s narrative.

Javert Chip
Reply to  Nick Schroeder
June 8, 2020 10:41 am

Nick Schroeder

One of the things Japan knew that New York didn’t was don’t send Covid-19 patients back to the old folks home.

But then almost everybody except Gov Cuomo knew that.

Reply to  Javert Chip
June 8, 2020 2:30 pm

If 94% of fatalities are concentrated in one demographic, those over 67 (especially with preexisting conditions — who are often in nursing homes), it’s impossible to reduce fatalities significantly without protecting those vulnerable people. Obvious.

Protecting the other 6% of the population would have a lower cost/benefit quotient. Within that 6% *most* were those with preexisting conditions. Those individuals should be motivated to protect themselves.

That leaves rare events. We don’t shut down economies to mitigate against rare events. For those, we do the best we can with the resources at hand.

We knew all of these basics way back in early March.

Did the States do the obvious things? Only a few including Florida and Texas, and even their performance was sketchy at first (learning curve).

Several States did the opposite. They relocated actively infected people to nursing homes where the most vulnerable people were.

What the heck were the transport personnel thinking when they were bringing live viruses into the nursing homes?

Only government agents could do something that criminally incompetent. Based on the obvious job at hand, they should have built an impenetrable shield around those vulnerable people…keeping the virus away. Ask any third grader.

Task management is rarely this easy and obvious. Almost the whole problem is in one place…top priority is to fix problems there. Simple. And it goes without saying (one would think) never make that place worse.

Then *in parallel* with doing job 1, take on other mitigation efforts based on cost/benefit estimates.

Reply to  DocSiders
June 8, 2020 3:54 pm

Shouldn’t this have been obvious to trained healthcare professionals/epidemiologists? I think it should have, that’s why I’m so skeptical against Cuomo and others.

Tom Abbott
Reply to  Scissor
June 8, 2020 6:19 pm

“Shouldn’t this have been obvious to trained healthcare professionals/epidemiologists?”

It should have been obvious because it was written down. The CDC put out guidelines for Nursing Homes and had Governor Cuomo followed those guidelines, most of those people in the Nursing Homes would not have died.

But he didn’t follow the guidelines. And I guess, that applies to several other Democrat governors who did practically the same thing as Cuomo, such as Illinois.

Nick Schroeder
Reply to  Scissor
June 8, 2020 7:15 pm

It was to the two California ER docs who YouTubed their comments – and then disappeared.

Javert Chip
Reply to  Scissor
June 8, 2020 9:04 pm


Presumably you mean Chinese doctors?

Reply to  Scissor
June 9, 2020 12:34 am

Javert – this is the same Youtube-banned video by California Drs Erickson and Massihi, re-posted.

John Endicott
Reply to  Scissor
June 10, 2020 2:57 am

Javert, I believe nick is refereeing to the American doctors whose youtube video (a press conference filmed by their local TV station) was taken down because it went against the official line regarding Chicom-19. This being the internet, you can still find the video elsewhere if you know where to look. I believe Allan’s link is to one such place.

William Astley
Reply to  Nick Schroeder
June 8, 2020 10:58 am

In reply to: What do the Japanese know and do that the rest of the world does not?

Here is one possibility.

42% of the US general population and 82% of the US Black Population is ‘Vitamin’ D deficient. Vitamin D deficiency increases with age and obesity.

An Indonesian Study has found regardless of sex or age that…

….‘Vitamin’ D deficient people (same definitions for Vitamin D deficient and normal) are 19 times more likely to die from Covid or have serious Covid symptoms than Vitamin D normal people.

Patterns of COVID-19 Mortality and Vitamin D: An Indonesian Study

Vitamin D Insufficient Patients 12.55 times more likely to die

Vitamin D Deficient Patients 19.12 times more likely to die

The ‘Vitamin’ D deficiency is the cause of Covid serious hypothesis explains why there Black people in the US and the UK are twice as likely as dying from Covid as the general population,

Prevalence and correlates of vitamin D deficiency in US adults.

4000 UI/day of Vitamin D supplements is required to raise the serum 25(OH)D above 30 ng/ml.

For Vitamin D status, cases were classified based on their blood’s measured Vitamin D serum, 25(OH)D levels:

(1) normal – serum 25(OH)D of > 30 ng/ml,

(2) insufficient – serum 25(OH)D of 21-29 ng/ml, and

(3) deficient – serum 25(OH)D of < 20 ng/ml.

Reply to  William Astley
June 8, 2020 11:33 am

Vitamin D deficiency is not a good explanation for Japan. They take abstaining from sun exposure to great lengths. You could say seafood consumption was the key, but according to FAO, China and Japan are both in the 40-some kg/person/year.

John Tillman
Reply to  FranBC
June 8, 2020 12:06 pm

Fatty fish are common in sushi. Cooking can degrade vitamin D.

Clyde Spencer
Reply to  John Tillman
June 8, 2020 3:38 pm

Raw fish is called “sashimi.” Sushi covers a multitude of rice-based preparations, with or without sashimi.

John Tillman
Reply to  John Tillman
June 8, 2020 8:48 pm

Good point. Anyway, raw fish better than cooked for vitamin D.

John Tillman
Reply to  John Tillman
June 8, 2020 9:01 pm

But then, sashimi is a form of sushi, so it’s all good.

William Astley
Reply to  FranBC
June 8, 2020 4:01 pm


Think of it as everything was an explanation. And Vitamin D deficiency has been shown to result in a 19 times greater chance of having serious Covid complications or dying from Covid.

This study finds the same thing. “Vitamin’ D, the protohormone that turns things on and off in our cells, deficiency is very common in nursing homes and among the Elderly and it provides a mechanism to explain the reason for the Vitamin D deficiency patients significantly worse outcomes than Vitamin D normal people.

Vitamin D supplements of roughly 4000 UI/day, is required to correct the Vitamin D deficiency of the US general population. There is 100 UI/day in a cup of milk.

The role of Vitamin D in the prevention of Coronavirus Disease 2019 infection and mortality


Background/Aims: WHO declared SARS-Cov-2 a global pandemic. The aims of this paper are to assess if there is any association between mean levels of vitamin D in various countries and cases respectively mortality caused by COVID-19.

Methods: We have identified the mean levels of vitamin D for 20 Europeans Countries for which we have also got the data regarding the morbidity and mortality caused by COVID-19.

Results: The mean level of vitamin D (average 56mmol/L, STDEV 10.61) in each country was strongly associated with the number of cases/1M (mean 295.95, STDEV 298.73 p=0.004, respectively with the mortality/1M (mean 5.96, STDEV 15.13, p < 0.00001).

Discussion: Vitamin D levels are severely low in the aging population especially in Spain, Italy and Switzerland. This is also the most vulnerable group of population for COVID-19.

Conclusions: We believe, that we can advise Vitamin D supplementation to protect against SARS-CoV2 infection.

Reply to  William Astley
June 8, 2020 5:38 pm

You’ve got to be kidding. Did you look at the graphs? Drawing a line through fly specs on a window has a reasonable chance of a higher correlation coefficient.

Reply to  FranBC
June 9, 2020 4:51 am

their Iodine and copper levels would be very good Id bet
both also protective

Adrian Mann
Reply to  Nick Schroeder
June 8, 2020 5:14 pm

Oh dear Nick, you probably will have to have this pointed out to you, but MSN (sic) isn’t running your country – Trump is. MSN can pass no law, sign no executive order, order no troops onto the streets, can set no budget or taxes… It’s Trump and his acolytes that are screwing over your country, and you, and millions or other Americans, including the 110,000 dead Americans, killed by the virus that Trump had totally under control. It’s your fault for putting him into power and supporting him.
It’ll take 10 years to undo what Trump has done, but you’ll probably blame it on Obama, or the Chinese, or reptiloids from Zeta 2 Reticuli. It’ll be too late by then, of course, and the US era will be over.
Well done Nick.

Reply to  Adrian Mann
June 8, 2020 6:58 pm

Democrats are willing to burn down the country so that they can rule over the ashes.

Reply to  Scissor
June 9, 2020 4:53 am


Reply to  Adrian Mann
June 8, 2020 7:13 pm

C’mon, fess up. You’re really Mickey Mann, aren’t you. I knew it…..

Javert Chip
Reply to  Adrian Mann
June 8, 2020 9:19 pm


You wrote “MSN(sic)”, seeming to indicate you determined Nick mis-typed MSM. Go read his post again; both uses of the abbreviation for Main Street Media (ie: MSM) were correct. I won’t even bother to point out elections matter.

This probably isn’t the best site to be demonstrating your editorial skills, but you do get style points for practicing adulting.

John Tillman
Reply to  Javert Chip
June 9, 2020 1:55 pm

Main Stream Media.

Aka, Lame Stream and Downstream Media.

Nick Schroeder
Reply to  Adrian Mann
June 9, 2020 6:28 am

“Sherman, set the way back machine for fifth grade civics class.”
“OK, Mr. Peabody.”
“Today we will review how our tricameral representative republic is supposed to function.”

The people themselves “run” the country through their elected representatives.
The Legislative branch writes the laws.
The Judicial branch interprets the laws.
The Executive branch enforces the laws.

Our current national dysfunction is due to a bought-and-paid-for Congressional clown show of 535 squabbling second graders.

And the lying, fact free, fake news fourth estate with its freshly minted, juvenile twit and twat, woke journalism majors who know all ultimate truths and what is best for all mankind is brain washing the electorate.

June 8, 2020 10:26 am

It’s starting to look like factional fighting in Syria and Libya at this point.

I’m just glad I did my own research on supplements before COVID-19 and connected a few new dots during. Hint: Keep up on your zinc and assorted ionophores for protection.

Reply to  ResourceGuy
June 8, 2020 1:00 pm

Excellent comment

Reply to  ResourceGuy
June 8, 2020 2:07 pm

I boosted my use of supplements almost 2.5 years ago when I was told that I needed to immediately start dialysis. First on the list was vit D as I was told that I was deficient in that. I have taken vit D every day since then. Shortly after that I became aware that I might be having an iodine deficiency. So I looked up sources and settled on a Puritan Pride Atlantic sea kelp pill which I have used every day for the last 2+ years. I could feel the positive results from the sea kelp iodine boosting my metabolism. Vit C was always something which I get regularly from my Rangpur limes.

Then at the beginning of this year I started taking several India herbal remedies for the heart/liver/kidney function, and those items provided amazing results. My body has been reinvigorated with the usage of them.

Reply to  goldminor
June 8, 2020 4:00 pm

Strong like bull? What herbs (and spices)?

Gary Pearse
Reply to  ResourceGuy
June 8, 2020 2:21 pm

I also took Vitamin D, tonic water, and fresh lemon juice (with tonic). Red meat and chocolate are the highest foods in Zn. 100g of red meat contains 44% of bodily Zn needs a day. Hey one 8oz steak is all you need. And the Totality folk want to take it away from us.

From Leo’s article, I would hazard a guess that more Democrat/lefty woke folk/100,000 were covid19 sick than per 100k sceptics, although it seems some days there may not be enough sceptics to get to 100k!

I have had thoughts that John Cook could be right about sceptics numbering only 3%, the other 97 being on board with the madness. The Soviet Union probably had less than 3% dissenters, although maybe they were there but silent. It would be interesting to see what percentage of people transcend the now completely leftyy education system.

The Covid lockdown showed among other things, how circumscribed and at risk we are, even healthwise, under totalitarian state conditions. No thanks sportsfans.

June 8, 2020 10:43 am

Don’t forget we sent union firefighter, first responders, and fire trucks to the nursing home facility in Washington state. What other country did that in the name of union pay and benefits?

Paul Johnson
June 8, 2020 10:46 am

Two thoughts –
Vitamin D (not C) deficiency – Do Africans and Asians simply spend more time outside in the sun?
Proximity – Non-European cities may have higher population densities, but did they confine their residents in apartments virtually sealed for energy-efficiency?

John Tillman
Reply to  Paul Johnson
June 8, 2020 11:48 am

Melanin-rich skin evolved to protect humans against the damaging effect of UV light once our African ancestors lost most of their body hair as part of our cooling system. Early H. erectus-grade people were still able to get all the vitamin D they needed, since they lived in the tropics or lower subtropics, and were largely or completely naked.

However, when humans migrated into temperate zones, where UV is low for much of the year, lived in shelters for long stretches and wore more clothes for warmth, vitamin D deficiency became a powerful selective force in favor of lower melanin levels. European, North African and West Asian populations solved this problem genetically in a different way from East Asians, but both methods work to lighten complexions.

People migrating out of Africa into tropical regions retained their higher melanin count.

But for the past 400 years, large numbers of melanin-rich people have lived in temperate regions, so can’t naturally make enough vitamin D in winter.

John Tillman
Reply to  Paul Johnson
June 8, 2020 11:55 am

PS: The European/West/South Asian method of skin lightening is probably inherited from Neanderthals. It presumably spread to North Africa and South Asia. Whether the East Asian genetic adaptation is a novel evolutionary event or inherited from some other older, temperate zone human group is unclear. The Denisovan genome from the eponymous cave has variants of genes which, in modern humans, are associated with dark skin, brown hair and brown eyes, so East Asians probably didn’t inherit skin color from them.

Reply to  Paul Johnson
June 8, 2020 12:27 pm

The number of people attending BLM rallys should show us a CoVid spike in the next few days. If that doesn’t occur, it means outdoors and sunshine is good, social distancing is a scam, probably people with sneezes not going to crowded locations unless they wear a mask is good, probably if you are healthy enough to walk a mile or two, you are at low risk.

Tom Abbott
Reply to  DMacKenzie
June 8, 2020 6:32 pm

“The number of people attending BLM rallys should show us a CoVid spike in the next few days.”

I just listened to Dr. Seigel, the Fox News Channel medical consultant tonight (the one who says his 95-year-old Dad was saved by HCQ) and he said that the demonstrators have been together for long enough that infections should be showing up, but he said, infections, so far, as of today, are still falling.

Dr. Seigel said yesterday that the Wuhan virus appears to be turning into a less dangerous virus.

And the WHO just announced that asymptomatic spread of the Wuhan virus was very small. Seigel clarified by saying it looks like the people to watch out for are those actively coughing and sneezing.

Tom Abbott
Reply to  Tom Abbott
June 9, 2020 6:16 pm

Well, I just listened to Dr. Seigel again on Fox News and he was pretty upset. The WHO completely reversed themselves from saying asymptomatic people were “rare”, to saying asymptomatic people were not rare.

And Dr. Seigel said last night that Wuhan virus infections were still going down even though we had a week of demonstrations. Tonight Dr. Seigel said it appears the reason the infection count is going down is because about 70 testing centers around the nation had been kept from operating because of the demonstrations. So we really don’t know if the infections are declining or not.

Dr. Seigel is not very happy with the WHO. He says we have to have information we can count on and we aren’t getting it from the WHO.

Reply to  Paul Johnson
June 8, 2020 4:08 pm

I just want to make this comment one more time. The median age in Africa is low. Even in South Africa it’s 26 years. Some countries there have median ages in the teens. It’s 15 years in Niger.

COVID-19 will just not do much in Africa for a variety of reasons, but mostly because of favorable demographics for resistance to the disease.

Krudd Gillard of the Commondebt of Australia
Reply to  Scissor
June 8, 2020 8:17 pm

yeah, but in almost all other respects, people who live in Africa would conform to the characteristics of many of the groups here we term as being of compromised health and therefore would be even more vulnerable to the virus.

Sorry mate, the real answer is that the virus is a dud and the western world just over reacted to some vague reports of a lock down of one city in China.

Reply to  Krudd Gillard of the Commondebt of Australia
June 9, 2020 5:18 am

I don’t disagree with you about it being an overreaction, which seems to be standard operating procedure these days.

Reply to  Paul Johnson
June 9, 2020 4:57 am

double glazing reduces any chance of useful sunshine as well as stopping fresh air

June 8, 2020 10:49 am

Anyone that believes we aren’t being mushroomed by the MSM and Social Media outlets is naive. Videos showing the anarchy, damage, and violence by the rioters have been banned citing “hate speech” …. now they are controlling the internet along with TV and newpapers. This is a full court press by the Marxist/Socialists to take down America by divide and conquer through propaganda. “Big Tech” thinks, and I’m sure promised, they will have a seat at the table when the downfall happens but they are nothing more than useful idiots and will be the first to go because their power is too great to be allowed control by anyone but the state.

Tom Abbott
Reply to  markl
June 8, 2020 6:40 pm

“This is a full court press by the Marxist/Socialists to take down America by divide and conquer through propaganda.”

Yes, it is. Fortunately, they have chosen to try to do away with the police and very few people support such an idea. I saw a poll tonight that said 64 percent of those polled did not support defunding the police, while about 16 percent supported it. And of the 64 percent, it included equal numbers of Democrats and Republicans saying they did not support defunding the police.

Most Americans are not stupid. They understand what would happen if we had no police. It’s a crazy idea to most people. It’s not a crazy idea to those who want to overthrow the nation.

As I said before, doing away with the police is the first thing done in a marxist revolution. That’s what the communists leading Black Lives Matter are up to. They are hijacking the racial equality movement for their communist puposes.

We should start calling them what they are: Communists. Society wreckers. Hijackers.

June 8, 2020 10:53 am

This headline seems to me click-bait. I doubt that taking large doses of vitamin C has helped anyone.

More than half of COVID fatalities in New York are nursing home patients and staff who caught it as a direct result of Governor Cuomo forcing the homes to accept COVID positive patients. This was not a mere mistake, he certainly knew better, so he needs to go on trial for murder. Note that New York state has fudged this number after May 1 by no longer counting as a nursing home fatality anyone who is transferred from a nursing home to a hospital before dying.

Now that a large number of people have in effect broken quarantine by going to protests and riots over the death of George Floyd, we’ll see if there is any resurgence of COVID resulting in more deaths. I doubt it, but I’m sure that state governments that want to remain “closed” (New York, Michigan, California) will look for ways to fudge the numbers so it will look like the answer to that is yes.

Reply to  jdgalt
June 8, 2020 11:23 am

Surely the governments of the states you mention will not want the BLM demonstrators to be blamed for a resurgence in infections and therefore are more likely to try and make it look as if the epidemic is rapidly coming to an end.

Reply to  jdgalt
June 8, 2020 11:44 am

“This headline seems to me click-bait. I doubt that taking large doses of vitamin C has helped anyone.”

What is your doubt based on? I have read numerous reports of high dose vit C IV helping lots of people. I have no reason to doubt those reports are false.

Reply to  jdgalt
June 8, 2020 12:04 pm

I get the impression (speaking as one from offshore) that the states that want to remain closed are also those most vociferous in supporting the protests and associated looting. So if there is an upsurge in cv cases/ deaths as a result of the turbulent protests then the governors , senators and mayors who supported or failed to stop those protests are surely morally if not legally guilty of manslaughter. But I doubt that they will lose any sleep over that possibiity.

J Mac
Reply to  mikewaite
June 8, 2020 12:41 pm

At the same time, if there is no new upsurge in Chinese virus cases after the mass protests that made a mockery of ‘socialist distancing’, the politicians and medical ‘experts’ that advocated the economy destroying lock downs will be shown to be complete charlatans at best and the cause of an unnecessary 100,000 deaths at worst.

Tom Abbott
Reply to  J Mac
June 8, 2020 6:47 pm

Dr. Seigel recommended tonight that based on the latest evidence, i.e., that asymptomatic Wuhan virus spreaders are no longer considered a factor; and that the Wuhan virus appears to be mutating to a more benign form, so the American people should go back to work right now and carry on their usual activities and children and students should be allowed to go back to school now.

Dr. Seigel did say that the older, most vulnerable people should still practice social distancing.

Tom Abbott
Reply to  Tom Abbott
June 9, 2020 6:19 pm

Never mind. The WHO misled us again about the Wuhan virus and asymptomatic people.

Gary Pearse
Reply to  jdgalt
June 8, 2020 2:37 pm

jd: did you miss that this is a quote from the US Physicians and Surgeons?

Click this it is very informative on other things Covid also.

John Tillman
Reply to  Gary Pearse
June 8, 2020 5:43 pm

The AAPS is a conservative activist group with perhaps 5000 members, but probably fewer. I happen to agree with them in this as in so many cases, but its opinion might not reflect any medical consensus. Not that science is based upon consensus, of course. But you can’t use it in an appeal to authority.

Reply to  jdgalt
June 8, 2020 8:14 pm

Have you ever heard of the 40 orange cure? And how about receiving disabled virus from people and surfaces, just like a vaccine.( Just my two cents)

John Endicott
Reply to  jdgalt
June 10, 2020 3:16 am

This headline seems to me click-bait. I doubt that taking large doses of vitamin C has helped anyone.

Nor does taking Doctor recommended doses of vitamin C harm (note the article did not suggest “large doses”, that’s your editorializing). Even if it doesn’t do anything in regard to COVID specifically, there’s nothing wrong with recommending people have sufficient vitamin C (preferably through diet) as it’s a vital nutrient in our bodies.

June 8, 2020 10:53 am

Strikingly, the 10 countries with the highest COVID-19 mortality rates are large Western countries, including the US, UK, France, Spain, and Italy.

That’s assuming you believe the numbers out of China, Iran, and as I’ve heard it, Bangladesh and Indonesia have high rates as well.

The poor efforts at getting good statistical data on this leads me to believe that those charged with saving people from the pandemic are not all that worried about the pandemic.

Reply to  max
June 8, 2020 2:05 pm

NY is giving up trying to find more patients to scare the populace

Reply to  max
June 8, 2020 2:14 pm

Yes, and Brazil and India are still in relatively early stages of their rapid growth phases in cases and deaths.

In the end, Brazil’s numbers could come close to those of the U.S. and India has a low fatality rate but also a high population. India will probably end up with the highest number of cases but probably not deaths.

Ecuador may replace Sweden in the top 25 this week or next.

Gary Pearse
Reply to  Scissor
June 8, 2020 2:45 pm

Maybe warmer climates and use of HCQ. Africans take this med now (few did when I was first working there in the 1960s). Equatorial Africa is very lightly infected by Covid. The climate zones will turn out to be recognizable in the Covid Stats.

Reply to  Gary Pearse
June 8, 2020 3:51 pm

Many African countries, if not most, have very young demographics with a few countries having medians in the teens. South Africa with the most cases in Africa has a median age of 26 years. It’s nothing but a cold there in most cases.

John Endicott
Reply to  Scissor
June 10, 2020 3:21 am

India will probably end up with the highest number of cases but probably not deaths.

That’s because they need to learn how to count anybody who died with covid as dying from covid. Die in a car accident and test positive – Covid death. Break your neck falling down stairs and test positive – Covid death. Commit suicide and test positive – covid death. etc. I’d like to think that’s an exaggeration, but if so it’s not by much.

Reply to  max
June 8, 2020 2:57 pm

The lack of good statistical data is more due to the corruption, waste and gutting of Public Health systems globally. The WHO and CDC are shining examples at the top of the heap.

June 8, 2020 10:54 am

The terror of the moment is miss-information. You can see it in Climate Change, George Floyd’s unfortunate death, Politics, the economy, HQC, and masks. It is interesting that China tried to ban masks in Hong Kong to facilitate facial recognition.
Have you noticed the almost absolute lack of “debate” as skill taught in secondary and advanced education? Debate trains one to clarify his/her thinking and speaking skills, and is invaluable for an advanced civilization.
Every fact checker should be required by law to do as Willis Eschenbach requests, state the ENTIRE text being fact-checked, state exactly what is objected to, and assign a score (0-5) to their opinion of the offending passage or conclusion. Everyone quoting this fact check must do the same. I do not care if the WHO tells a lie if I can read opposing views. The score will evaluated as to it’ source.

Reply to  Enginer01
June 8, 2020 3:56 pm

I wish there were something like that in existence.

Tom Abbott
Reply to  Enginer01
June 8, 2020 6:58 pm

“Have you noticed the almost absolute lack of “debate” as skill taught in secondary and advanced education? Debate trains one to clarify his/her thinking and speaking skills, and is invaluable for an advanced civilization.”

I have noticed. this is a tactic of extremists. Only one line of thought is permitted, the one the extremists support. If you don’t go along, then you get attacked and silenced. Lots of lilly-livered people go along to get along, even if it’s a crazy idea like defunding the police or claiming that all white Americans are racists. The fearful will go along with anything as long as it gets them out of the spotlight. Witness the NFL Commissioner today pandering to the “America is racist” meme.

We should not accept any premise put out by the radical left. That’s the problem with fighting this kind of dight, too many conservatives accept the premise that the radicals lay down. So instead of saying, “America is not racist”, they accept the premise and say, “We have to do something about this”. This lets them escape the attack from the Left that would come with any other answer. Their basically cowards.

Tucker Carlson said something tonight that I thought is worth mentioning: Truth is a defense.

The truth about the situaton will solve the situation. Currenly, all we have are the Lies from the Radical Left as a narrative. It’s time to put out the Truth and stop the insanity.

Tom Abbott
Reply to  Tom Abbott
June 8, 2020 7:02 pm


I hate doing that. 🙂

Reply to  Tom Abbott
June 9, 2020 5:23 am

We could be in the early stages of a cultural revolution. What happens if police departments really are disbanded? And what are they replaced with?

I’m hoping that some meaningful fraction of the population prevents this from progressing.

Tom Abbott
Reply to  Scissor
June 10, 2020 7:59 am

I don’t think any police departments will be disbanded. The American people overwhelmingly support police departments.

The idiots in charge in Minneapolis have voted to disband their police department, so they are the crash-test dummy for this experiment, whose outcome is already known: More violence, and crime.

I would be surprised if this insane movement goes much beyond that.

Maybe the citizens should sue the mayor and city council of Minneapolis for damages when the citizens become victims of crimes.

That, or move to some other place that does have police protection. I imagine a lot of that will be happening, too. Not everyone is a crazy, radical leftist bent on self-destruction.

Steve Keppel-Jones
Reply to  Tom Abbott
June 10, 2020 2:05 pm

I have read that “defund the police” does not mean “get rid of the police”, just “reduce the amount of money spent on them”. How much they are *over*funded by currently is a matter of some debate, and locale-specific certainly.

My source for this may be misinformed, and it may be a deliberate misinformation tactic like pretending that “democratic socialism” is somehow different from “regular socialism”.

Ed Zuiderwijk
June 8, 2020 10:55 am

The interesting correlation that countries with high covid impact are liksly to be countries with high climate change alarmism is completely understandable when you realise that both are the result of an unwarranted belief in the validity of models.

Mike McHenry
June 8, 2020 10:58 am

The variability across Europe is amazing. How can Germany’s rate be so low compared to it’s neighbors? These are all highly developed countries.

John Tillman
Reply to  Mike McHenry
June 8, 2020 11:35 am

Germany doesn’t test the dead.

Reply to  Mike McHenry
June 8, 2020 11:40 am

I don’t have the data, but I suspect the countries with the highest mortalities practice the most aggressive, harmful medical treatments, like early intubation and toxic antiviral drugs.

Reply to  Mike McHenry
June 8, 2020 11:44 am

All European countries with high mortality rate are ex-colonial powers with high percentage of Afro-Caribbean population. Ireland and Sweden allowed high level of immigration of African refugees, while Germany immigrants are mostly from Turkey and Balkan countries. China has strong influence in many African countries, weaker the governments there more control China has over their natural resources. (…. No, I’m not saying that, even if CV was result of bat-woman’s experiments) /sarc

Mr. Jones
June 8, 2020 11:37 am

Anthem for The Useful Idiot:

We’re on the road to Neverland, vote Dumbocrat today!
In Neverland there is no work, and no poverty by the way
Prisons there are empty, the Cop Shops went away!
No Dealers, overdoses, Leftist religion all the day
We’re on the road to Neverland – you must not read Orwell’s book!
If ever you should read it, Neverland is effing cooked
Ice Cream and Cookies everywhere, and never any school!
Where you can be a boy or girl, it’s simply up to you
We’re on our way to Neverland, where all you need is free!
Bought with Federal Pixie Dust, and One-Percenter’s Pee
Vote Dumbocrat for Neverland and we’ll be on our way!
By mail they’ll do it for, you while you go out and play
Neverland Elitists write rules for you and me!
Rules that we must follow, but never them, you’ll see
Virtue-signalling pols and celebrities, will rule us from their book!
And we’ll be safe and happy, ignoring they’re Fools and Crooks
In Neverland all are nice, and do just what you say!
And if they don’t, a bloody stump, is how they’ll end their day
In Neverland Black Lives Matter, and so you know the score
If you say “All Lives Matter”, you’re RACIST to the core!
Neverland fear is under your bed, Grownups warn you every day!
Everyday it has a different name, and never goes away
The Climate Monster’s coming! A horrible, evil beast!
They’ve told me he just got here, for thirty years at least
To Neverland we must flee, drop your logic, drop that book!
Alas, we’re cocked!, we’re being blocked, by the evil Captain Hook!

Vote Dombocrat! Vote Dumbocrat! Media Slavemasters command
Vote Dumbocrat and Peter Pan! He’ll banish Hook from Neverland!

Lee L
Reply to  Mr. Jones
June 8, 2020 2:35 pm

An entertaining followup to your post out of Norway (thanks to Netflix)…

at — >

Izaak Walton
June 8, 2020 11:41 am

It is worth noting that Leo completely discounts the effectiveness of public health measures. Many asian countries had well developed test and trace systems, encouraged
people to wear masks etc. NZ went into lockdown when there were about 100 cases in
the country and kept strict social distancing rules in place and is now free of the disease.
All without taking large does of vitamin C, HCQ or any other supposed treatment. Stopping the spread of COVID-19 does not require magic just common sense and well established public health measures.

Ian W
Reply to  Izaak Walton
June 8, 2020 12:32 pm

That unfortunately also means that New Zealand is still full of susceptible people. When the cage door is eventually opened they will have the cases that they have avoided now.

A C Osborn
Reply to  Ian W
June 8, 2020 2:07 pm

Then they will just do the same thing again and will never get anywhere near themortality rates of countries that reacted too slowly.

Ian W
Reply to  A C Osborn
June 9, 2020 6:05 am

True – not too good for the tourist industry though

Reply to  Izaak Walton
June 8, 2020 12:59 pm

Stopping the spread of COVID-19 does not require magic just common sense and well established public health measures.

Speaking of common (non)sense with well established progressive public health measures:

ALBANY, NY—New York Governor Andrew Cuomo has ordered nursing homes to admit violent rioters and protesters throughout the state.

“If we are going to be compassionate, caring, and pro-science, we need to admit these oppressed individuals into every care facility available,” he said at a press conference this morning. “I don’t want to hear any talk of how this might hurt old people. This isn’t the Dark Ages — we listen to SCIENCE in this state!”

The order forced nursing homes to admit anyone carrying a brick, Molotov cocktail, baseball bat, or bike lock and house them until they recover. Scientists agree this is the best possible move and say that anyone who has concerns about how it might affect the elderly is an anti-science bigot.

“What a nice young man!” Ethel Carver said as one protester burst in with a Molotov cocktail. “Ooooh! He brought a fun toy to play with too! Come over here and let me pinch your cheek!”

There has been considerable violence in the nursing homes since this occurred, though these deaths are being counted as COVID-19-related.

D. J. Hawkins
Reply to  sycomputing
June 8, 2020 2:01 pm


Be a sport and use the /sarc tag. Some folks might read a little too quickly and miss the dry wit.

John F. Hultquist
Reply to  D. J. Hawkins
June 8, 2020 8:30 pm

If not a sarc tag, at least a winking smiley face – – Poe’s Law

Reply to  Izaak Walton
June 8, 2020 2:09 pm

But don’t take HCQ with zinc that is a no no 😉

Reply to  Izaak Walton
June 8, 2020 4:17 pm

Vitamin C has been a well established public health measure for more than 80 years.

Reply to  Izaak Walton
June 8, 2020 4:46 pm

“It is worth noting that Leo completely discounts the effectiveness of public health measures. Many asian countries had well developed test and trace systems, encouraged
people to wear masks etc. ”

Vietnam is a shining example.


hardly any cases.

John Tillman
Reply to  Steven Mosher
June 8, 2020 8:53 pm

Vietnam regime are shameless liars.

June 8, 2020 11:48 am

Ggraph is showing hospital traffic in Wuhan. The first dotted line represents when traffic and internet searches for Covid-19 symptoms began to rise, the second shows December, when the region was suffering the peak number of coronavirus cases and the third shows February when the pandemic was largely under control and lockdown also restricted people from using their cars.
comment image

Reply to  Vuk
June 8, 2020 12:39 pm

Vuk, regarding the daily mail graph….
Drawing lines on that mass of random dots doesn’t mean anything.

Reply to  DMacKenzie
June 8, 2020 2:00 pm

The time vector on the horz axix is odd too.

Reply to  DMacKenzie
June 8, 2020 2:45 pm

Referring to the same graph Telegraph said following:
quote:\ “Something was happening in October,” Dr Brownstein told ABC News. “Clearly, there was some level of social disruption taking place well before what was previously identified as the start of the novel coronavirus pandemic.”
Dr Brownstein argued that the number of cars parked at a hospital was an indication of how busy the hospital was at that point in time.
Therefore a car park considerably busier than the year before – sometimes twice as full according to the research – suggests illness in the area could be spiking.
The study has been submitted for the journal Nature Digital Medicine and is under peer review. One academic warned ABC News about over-interpreting the results. It is possible there are other reasons for the more full car parks./ end quote

Kent Noonan
June 8, 2020 11:55 am

A tremendously effective COVID19 treatment has been thoroughly suppressed – ozone. All references in the MOTU domain will get banned or flagged, referring to fringe references months ago that breathing ozone will protect you. While that may not be true, putting ozone in the blood in standard medical procedures will induce recovery in a few hours, dying patients walked out in a few days. This was clearly demonstrated in Wuhan and Italy, yet not a word in the MSM.
Much has been written about the blood no longer carrying oxygen in infected people. This procedure reverses that and stops the damage to the rest of the organs. Nearly instantaneous cure in almost all cases. It costs a few cents. While I’m sure some would find this controversial, doesn’t it deserve a little research? If you are dying, I’m sure it matters quite a lot.

Reply to  Kent Noonan
June 8, 2020 12:55 pm

Ozone treatment sounds good, but chlorine dioxide treatment sounds better because it is administered via IV, whereas ozone requires withdrawing blood, ozonating it and then re-injecting it.

Reply to  icisil
June 8, 2020 4:22 pm

Sounds awful to me but it doesn’t matter if it works. The problem is that it has hardly any patients have been studied.

Here are the trials that can be search with terms like ozone.

June 8, 2020 12:11 pm

If any of these marginal, OK let’s be honest, probable quack, cures Goldstein comes up with were true, we would know by now, testing having been undertaken for 5 months in many hospitals around the world grasping at straws, showing high and inconclusive recovery rates for both quack cures and medical best efforts, with antibiotics for secondary infections showing that they improve outcomes, but aren’t very quacky. We should all be glad these hospitals tried, so that others can quit working on false claims. Of course, if tests show dietary shortage of vitamins and minerals, they are more susceptible to bad outcomes when ill.
Search “xxQuackCureOfYourChoiceHerexxx ineffective” for a listing. If you search “effective” instead of “ineffective”, then especially check results listings for patient comorbidities to see subject selection bias at work.

Reply to  DMacKenzie
June 8, 2020 12:57 pm

The quack cures are antivirals and unnecessary intubation.

June 8, 2020 12:21 pm

Vitamin C at least staves off the worst complication, sure. One hypothesis was that avitaminosis D makes things worse (because black guys die more). But this doesn’t promote Gilead’s solution, nor the half-baked “vaccine” (sponsored by Gates and the rest of “population reduction” enthusiasts) to follow.

The top dozen Western countries share another distinguishing factor: information flow dominated by Google, Facebook, Twitter, and their accomplices

Which offers a perfect opportunity to turn the mob politics against its usual peddlers and crush the most dangerous base of corporate socialism once and for all. But can even Trump manage this?

June 8, 2020 12:46 pm

The U.S. death rate would be half this if idiots had just protected nursing homes.

John F. Hultquist
Reply to  Dennis Wingo
June 8, 2020 8:42 pm

Much could have and should have been done years ago.
The sad and tragic case of Life Care Center of Kirkland (Seattle area)
ought to be on everyone’s reading list.

There are many to blame, but I’ll guess only the Company will pay.

J. Seifert
June 8, 2020 12:49 pm

Missing is that smoking prevents Corona death. The studies in China and France showed that only 5% of the dead were smokers. In France there is an ongoing study with nicotine stickers to see if nicotine helps. But this is not the same as the microdust smoke which seems to inhibit the attachment of the virus within the lungs.

It would be an odd lesson that corona death could be prevented with one cigarrette before leaving the house.

Reply to  J. Seifert
June 9, 2020 5:08 am

another new and large study on that at dailymail yesterday
the anti smoking lobby is frothing at themouth
not only less smokers with it but the deaths arent higher either

Reply to  J. Seifert
June 9, 2020 6:56 am

I’m finding cannabis smoke works better than tobacco smoke. Cannabis itself is an antibacterial and it also acts as an expectorant. I’ve also been treating my coronav with Vit C, Vit D and Zinc and tonic water. I’m a high risk patient (Ischaemic Heart Disease) but I trusted self-treatment over going to a hospital. I’ve also been on Aspirin since my triple bypass but my doctor says that doesn’t really do much for covid clotting.

John Baxter
June 8, 2020 1:21 pm

My posted message about Vitamin C and COVID was taken down. Someone said it was because too much Vitamin C causes kidney stones. However, a friend, who contracted COVID in early May, told me her doctor told her to take 1000 units of Vitamin C per hour as part of her recovery. She has since recovered.

Reply to  John Baxter
June 8, 2020 2:16 pm

What Really Causes Kidney Stones (And Why Vitamin C Does Not)

Reply to  icisil
June 8, 2020 3:58 pm

They didn’t mention cacao es oxalat source in the study.
If all these mentioned sources of oxalic acid will be eaten with a milky product like cheese, cream or a milky pudding, you neutralise the acid, combines with Ca of the milk and can’t be absorbed by the intestine. No kidney stones on the base of oxalate as I had in younger years.
Just because I liked cacao *) more with less milk, spinach with cream or with frech sheep cheese wasn’t usual at this time and rhubarb I preferred often uncooked as child.

*) The pure frech cacao powder

Reply to  Krishna Gans
June 9, 2020 7:09 am

I’m some what of an expert on Kidney Stones. I’ve passed 38 and currently have my 39th sitting in the lower portion of ,y left kidney. Every single one of my stones has been calcium oxalate – my renalogist said that it was dietary and caused by drinking tea and taking vitamin C. His solution was basically stop consuming both and drink plenty of water. Water of course is standard treatment. I have found through my own research that magnesium supplements displace the Ca+ ions so the stones simply don’t form – or if they do are much much smaller.

Reply to  DP
June 9, 2020 9:33 am

I have written down my experiences with kidney stones as I was 22.
Since then, knowing the background, I never had stones again. And I take vitamin C since years.
But it may be possible to suffer of a predisposition, my father too suffered from kidney stones.

June 8, 2020 1:37 pm

The numbers should be falling now, after the successful assault on the nursing homes in NY.

June 8, 2020 2:09 pm

Are we sure there’s not more than one strain?

Reply to  Waza
June 8, 2020 4:34 pm

There are a couple of supertypes it’s believed, one being more virulent than the other. The more virulent one was predominant in Italy and Eastern U.S. In Asia countries the mild type was predominant.

If China planned and carried this out as a deliberate attack, they could have first released the milder strain in China, or even release a more mild strain that acted as a vaccine and seeded the West with the more virulent strain.

John Tillman
Reply to  Scissor
June 8, 2020 5:13 pm

The milder strain infected the US West Coast.

The virus now appears to be doing what pathogens generally do and evolving to be less fatal.

Single-stranded, positive-sense RNA viruses are particularly easily evolvable.

Smart Rock
June 8, 2020 2:09 pm

If Linus Pauling were alive today, he’d be turning over in his grave.

He said “the only side effect of Vitamin C is chronic good health” (from memory so the wording may not be exact)

June 8, 2020 2:11 pm

Great write up. Thanks.

Got to laugh when they put vitamin C and herbal teas next to smoking. What were they thinking? Were they thinking?

June 8, 2020 2:20 pm

“The “fact-checkers” seem to be the original sources of some of the worst hoaxes on the Internet.”

We may as well get 4chan to do the fact checking. At least we could all get a laugh out of it.

Mike Fletcher
June 8, 2020 3:17 pm

So I’m gonna bet that none if these “fact checkers” have a medical degree. So if they were deleting posts from doctors calling them false, then would that not constitute giving medical advice without a license? That’s a pretty damn serious crime here.

Mike Dubrasich
Reply to  Mike Fletcher
June 8, 2020 5:28 pm

I back your bet and raise the probability that the “fact checkers” are card-carrying Marxists and in the paid employ of Red China. They are not “honesty brokers”; they are propaganda merchants.

Fact checkers my a$$. Isn’t that what they have at Wikipedia policing the climate “facts”?

The Left lies. They exist on lies. Lying is their thing. It’s the New Speak Syndrome where the truth is hidden and truth-tellers are silenced so the Big Lie can prevail.

Google, Facebook, and Twitter are subversive organizations. Their shared goal is to destroy freedom, cripple the USA, and install “global governance” — their word for international authoritarian control of economies, information, speech, and thought.

June 8, 2020 3:38 pm

“Strikingly, the 10 countries with the highest COVID-19 mortality rates are large Western countries, including the US, UK, France, Spain, and Italy. ”

I wonder if it was a planned attack on the west…

Reply to  Kramer
June 8, 2020 4:29 pm

At the very least, China was negligent and deceitful. Perhaps it was a kind of cold war attack. I also wonder about Chinese allies or actors within the Western countries.

Tom Abbott
Reply to  Scissor
June 8, 2020 7:15 pm

“At the very least, China was negligent”

No, this was not negligence, this was deliberate.

I don’t know if they released it to the world in an effort to level the playing field after the infection developed in China, or if they deliberately planned to release a milder version in China and a more lethal version to the Western World, but the bottom line is they deliberately released it to the world.

Reply to  Scissor
June 10, 2020 1:30 pm

‘China was negligent’….and ‘deceitful’…..well, so was Dr Fauci, President Trumps key advisor, who appears not to have told his President that he personally authorised funding to the Wuhan lab – for corona virus ‘gain of function’ research, previously banned under Obama. This funding was withdrawn in September 2019 on the advice of US scientists and diplomats in Beijing, who reported poor biosecurity at Wuhan. Ever heard of the disgruntled employee syndrome? Think US anthrax case. But then, why would anyone deliberately infect their own people? More likely to have been an employee who couldn’t care less about protocols – went for lunch at the seafood markets after handling the up-rated bat virus that the Fauci-funded batwoman has engineered. Several science papers now exist showing unusual ‘insertions’ in the bat virus genome – with some senior scientists – eg Luc Montagnier who discovered HIV, maintaining that the inserts could come from HIV genome. China Inc is not the source of all this – it is a global network of nut-jobs, which many of us in the science world have been warning about and Obama listened. Time to talk straight to your President.

June 8, 2020 3:56 pm

It’s my understanding that the suggestion of coughing (or sneezing) into one’s elbow arose as a better alternative to coughing into one’s hand IF you don’t have a tissue.

Here is another study that seems to have been “neglected” by the powers that be, published May 13 2020:

“A study on infectivity of asymptomatic SARS-CoV-2 carriers”

The researchers studied the 455 people an asymptomatic carrier came in contact with, and found ZERO infections. This indicates that asymptomatic carriers of CV-19 are a threat to no one. That should put an end to this “you might infect someone even if you don’t know you’re infected!” nonsense.

Reply to  PaulH
June 8, 2020 4:24 pm


Tom Abbott
Reply to  PaulH
June 8, 2020 8:43 pm

“This indicates that asymptomatic carriers of CV-19 are a threat to no one.”

Yes, Dr. Seigel said as much tonight.

Tom Abbott
Reply to  PaulH
June 8, 2020 8:46 pm

“This indicates that asymptomatic carriers of CV-19 are a threat to no one.”

That also means grandparents can now visit with their grandchildren without fear the children will infect them asymptomatically. Just make sure the children are not coughing or sneezing with a symtomatic case of Wuhan virus. And that is much easier to discern.

Reply to  PaulH
June 9, 2020 5:13 am

Another report this morning:

“Asymptomatic spread of coronavirus is ‘very rare,’ WHO says”

“From the data we have, it still seems to be rare that an asymptomatic person actually transmits onward to a secondary individual,” Dr. Maria Van Kerkhove, head of WHO’s emerging diseases and zoonosis unit, said at a news briefing from the United Nations agency’s Geneva headquarters. “It’s very rare.”

Of course, “very rare” isn’t “never” – but they acknowledge the real risk is elsewhere.

Rud Istvan
June 8, 2020 5:02 pm

Three observations.
1. Asymptotic spread was proven in Feb by the UK guy from the Singapore conference. Data provided previously: 9:1. How common, dunno. Trust in WHO pronouncements now, zero.
2. Asymptotic surge is NOT evident in the social distancing failure of George Floyd riots—yet. Lets give it another week, since incubation is 3-5 days.
3. The possible therapeutic stuff is off the generic truth scale.

John Tillman
Reply to  Rud Istvan
June 8, 2020 5:38 pm

Inferable Mortality

The news here is not good. We have mostly very poor data; both Hubei incidence and mortality were now provably severely under reported. But we do have one piece of usable comparable information. 1300 mortalities and 5000 recoveries amongst those who tested positive from the false negative test kits used until yesterday (the majority of cases have not yet resolved one way of the other). In the end, when the disease has run its course, there are only two outcomes: recovery or death. On the test kit basis, the mortality could be as high as 26%. That is horrible but not impossible since MERS was almost 36%.

My own ‘hunch’ is that Wuhan in the end will come in about 10% mortality; the mechanism is lower respiratory tract viral pneumonia just like 2003 SARS and the 1918 ‘Spanish flu’. There is no reason to think the mortality outcome would differ greatly from a very similar clinical mechanism.

Reply to  John Tillman
June 8, 2020 8:04 pm

Your hunch is a very high outlier. More likely, the overall case fatality rate will be many times lower, possibly much lower than 1% even.

John Tillman
Reply to  Scissor
June 8, 2020 8:54 pm

Not my hunch. Rud’s.

Reply to  John Tillman
June 9, 2020 5:16 am

Sorry, I expected quotation marks or attribution.

So, Rud’s hunch on 14 Feb appears to be incorrect.

John Tillman
Reply to  John Tillman
June 9, 2020 10:25 am

You’re right. To make it clear, I should have noted it was by Rud or put it in quotation marks, rather than rely on my prior reply to clarify authorship.

John Tillman
Reply to  John Tillman
June 9, 2020 2:03 pm

My first reply, pointing out Rud’s guess at 10% IFR, didn’t take, so no wonder my comment was confusing. I guess it’s permanently lost in cyberspace.

John Endicott
Reply to  John Tillman
June 10, 2020 3:32 am

Heh, that hunch didn’t age well.

John Tillman
Reply to  Rud Istvan
June 8, 2020 5:51 pm

It’s unclear if attendees at the Singapore conference were infected by a single asympotmatic case. You might be right, but at this time we can’t know for sure, and will probably never know.

John Tillman
Reply to  Rud Istvan
June 8, 2020 5:53 pm

Nor if the UK guy were indeed the sole source for subsequent infections. Tracing has its limits, when a virus is already on the loose in a population.

Reply to  Rud Istvan
June 8, 2020 7:46 pm

Some people might say they had no symptoms to avoid embarrassment or other negative repercussions.

Anyway, protests and riots have been going on for 13 days now. So far so good about a lack of surges.

Terry Bixler
June 8, 2020 6:52 pm

Here we are 6 months into a ” pandemic” and we have no approved treatment plan from our health agencies.
Only “anecdotal” thoughts with censorship being applied. One would not expect this in our “modern” society.
I must admit the best source of information has been WUWT. Thank you Anthony.

June 8, 2020 9:51 pm

Turkey is following the treatment protocol of hcq + azithromycin + zinc on all positive tested people regardless of symptom state. Their death rate per reported case is 1/2 that of the US and 1/5 that of UK.
The stats are overwhelming.

Reply to  David-ct
June 9, 2020 8:37 am

The death rates in many states and provinces is 1/2 that of the US, without HCQ , and with antibiotics for secondary infections. Get over it, HCQ is a good treatment for malaria, not CoVid…..

Reply to  David-ct
June 9, 2020 8:41 am

If one can believe their numbers, it does appear that Turkey is relatively far out of the tail past the peak in cases and deaths. But also keep in mind that Turkey also has a relatively young demographic. It would be interesting to compare stats for specific age groups.

June 8, 2020 10:03 pm

“The non-Western country with the highest mortality rate is Ecuador,”

This is the Ecuador that lies between Laos and Thailand, isn’t it?

Not the one in South America, in what is often called “The Western Hemisphere”.

Reply to  RoHa
June 8, 2020 10:49 pm

The concept of western and non western is now irrelevant

John Endicott
Reply to  RoHa
June 10, 2020 3:35 am

East? West? try Southern Hemisphere 😉

June 8, 2020 11:48 pm

Interesting read:
Salicylates and Pandemic Influenza Mortality, 1918–1919 Pharmacology, Pathology, and Historic Evidence
By Karen M. Starko

June 9, 2020 12:04 am

“Lockdowns in Europe saved millions of lives” – it seems the BBC prefers simulated results to real live data.

“That meant lockdown saved around 3.1 million lives, including 470,000 in the UK”

From the table above we have real data: Sweeden, no lockdown, 450 deaths/M; UK, lockdown, 580 deaths/M. Of course this simulation comes from our old friends at Imperial, who gave us the lockdown in the first place.

June 9, 2020 12:26 am

“Many non-Western countries also have low hygienic standards. Many suffer from bad nutrition, cold weather, lack of UVB sunlight, and other immunity-compromising factors” What utter rubbish. In fact many of the poorer countries are closer to the equator, and get more sunlight. And you cant for one second suggest the far east is malnourished. Africa has issues, but that is about it.

What you are forgetting is we are obese in the west, and thats a big factor in dying from this virus.

And secondly we have healthcare that keeps weak, fat, ill people around for longer. They are natural targets for this virus. A country where life is by nature harder will have less weak people.

Reply to  Matt_S
June 9, 2020 4:54 am

“And secondly we have healthcare that keeps weak, fat, ill people around for longer.”

In which countries?

Reply to  Matt_S
June 9, 2020 5:31 am

A health system for the healthy, that is the financiers dream!
Other lives not worthy to live, sorry, too expensive.

Now I wonder where we saw that before?

Climate believer
June 9, 2020 2:18 am

Here in France we have had for a long time our own Stasi thought police, and our love of “Liberté, Égalité, Fraternité” is but a joke.

One of our most distinguished microbiologists, Prof Didier Raoult, has been vilified as a charlatan by the media for his stance on HCQ , presumably because he doesn’t conform to the “group think” of these blinkered pestilent media types.

Here’s one example of why he’s obviously not the right sort of scientist:
Taken from an interview in the Express newspaper (French not UK ,translated by google)

Professor Raoult is once again being talked about for his very clear positions. This time, the infectious disease specialist questioned the effects of climate change in an interview with L’Express. He justifies his opinion by declaring that the subject ceased to be science and finally became a cult.
“You can accuse me of climate skepticism like all skepticisms, and I agree, because if not, I would stop being a scientist, and I’d become a priest”, explains Didier Raoult. “If you want to challenge certain points, you are a heretic, and if they could burn you, they would do it.”
The infectiologist continued his argument by indicating that the causation of global warming is not known. He admits, however, that there are “climatic variations that we can observe”, but that they have “nothing to do with the drama we have been told”.

………off to the guillotine with you sir

Reply to  Climate believer
June 9, 2020 4:58 am

Remember Lavoisier, leading Paris scientist, was the first sent to the guillotine for “wasting state property”. He actually demonstrated diamond burned as carbon.
Still, today’s Robespierre’s, Marat’s, Danton’s should remember their fates.

Reply to  Climate believer
June 9, 2020 9:46 am

I like the Raoult argumentation, very reasonable in all points, he knows about what he is talking.
The Asterix of the medical scientists 😀

June 9, 2020 4:49 am

NYC, formerly New York City, now New York Cluster, is the result of Felix Rohatyn’s Big MAC (the Municipal Assistance Corporation) which threw the Constitution aside to turn over the control of the city’s finances from its elected officials to the private banks, to ensure all debt payments, at the expense of wages, services, or maintenance of the city’s industries. Bloomberg pushed a Global Big MAC.
So we see the direct effect of Felix Rohatyn’s finance.
There is a humorous side: Rohatyn, the Godfather of Mergers and Acquisitions and hedge fund speculation generally, complains that the U.S. image has been tarnished by the fact that “Today, we do not project an image of serious investors, but an image of gamblers enticed by profits. That’s very bad.”

Time to quarantine Wall Street!

John Endicott
Reply to  bonbon
June 10, 2020 3:41 am

Wall street went into quarantine from March to May – they close the floor of the stock exchange to go full electronic trading after some on the floor tested positive – where have you been?

Michael Arko
June 9, 2020 5:19 am

Too much fuss about a problem we see too often: just a handful of sources dominating the information chain. There used to be only 3 TV news networks and a couple of newspapers that controlled virtually every bit of news consumed by Americans. Cable upended that when it introduced new competitors (CNN) that began to reveal the inadequacy and bias of information coming from the networks. Then the internet smashed the TV oligopoly by flooding the world with information we never even imagined. TV reacted by segregating into competing camps that would filter the internet flood on behalf of their viewers’ preferences. It was just a matter of time before the internet “MOTUs” would reorganize to manage the information feed ahead of the news filters. So now we are back where we were in the 1950s and 1960s, except wiser having lived the experience of unlimited information access. As long as we keep the State out of the business of information control (China!), relax: information will strike back and circumvent the MOTUs’ dominance yet again.

Brooks Hurd
Reply to  Michael Arko
June 9, 2020 7:45 am

I would love to see adds on the tube with a script presenting the case that “you may entitled to compensation” from the MOTUs and their “fact checking” minions if you lost loved ones through the removal or shadow banning of scientific studies by the MOTUs.

June 9, 2020 7:46 am

Just don’t send fire trucks to a health emergency during a pandemic like the U.S. does.

June 9, 2020 11:50 am

Take your vitamins D3, K2, and C with a bioavailable Mg. Then take CoQ10, EGCG, and Quercetin. Look them up for yourself.

Roger Knights
June 9, 2020 5:39 pm

“By that time, the use of CQ or HCQ for COVID-19 had been endorsed to some degree by the governments of China, India, and the US.”

And Turkey, IIRC.

John Tillman
June 9, 2020 9:40 pm

Sage words from Korean-American virologist and director of the IVI, Jerome Kim:

AK in VT
June 10, 2020 8:13 am

For Tom Abbott, Samuel Cogar and John Endicott

As the thread ended about my sitting out this election because of “covid” mishandling, I have to respond here. Thank you all three for being gentlemen in your responses. I , yet firm in your beliefs. would hope this would give “Adrian” a lesson in civility that he might be kinder and more thoughtful in his posts so the responses might be intelligent and civil, like yours to me.

So, thank you. I have read your words (and ruminated over them) and though not yet convinced to come back to the President, there may still be time. Unfortunately, in Vermont my vote has not really mattered in the past 25 years here as this state has become extremely one-sided; it may matter, yet.

And, thank you moderator for all the work you do, too.


AK in VT

Reply to  AK in VT
June 10, 2020 4:46 pm

Thank you AK. I am out in commiefornia and might as well just not vote (as many of my friends have chosen.) However, I make it a point to read through and vote for the best available outcome for each office, proposition, bond, etc. A friend describes it as griping rights. I voted for the best but was outvoted, therefore I may legitimately complain when the person/thing that won fails. Those that don’t vote, can’t complain.

At present, a pet peeve is looking at bond issues and realizing that at all levels, {city, county, state}, the annual debt service on existing bonds would cover the new bond principal. In other words, we could get everything now without future debt if we would stop going into debt first. Do the Dave Ramsey thing, cut up the credit cards, pay off the debt, and live within our means. Create capital improvement funds and buy things when we have the cash.

John Endicott
Reply to  AK in VT
June 11, 2020 3:38 am

As a fellow blue stater, I feel your pain re: having your vote not count

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