Green New Deal: ‘This isn’t just radical socialism, this is madness’

Comments on ‘Green New Deal’

‘This isn’t just radical socialism, this is madness’

ARLINGTON HEIGHTS, IL (February 7, 2019) – Today, Rep. Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez (D-NY) and Sen. Ed Markey (D-MA) released the outline of the “Green New Deal.” The resolution calls for the United States to embark on a 10-year “economic mobilization” with the goal to “achieve net-zero greenhouse gas emissions through a fair and just transition for all communities and workers.” The plan would shut down virtually all coal, oil, and natural gas electric plants, eliminating millions of jobs in the process; spend unspecified billions on new “zero-emission vehicle infrastructure and manufacturing” and green public transit projects, and it would eliminate as many gasoline-powered vehicles “as is technologically feasible.”

The plan would also require “upgrading all existing buildings in the United States and building new buildings to achieve maximal energy efficiency,” the creation of a federal universal college education program, and it would guarantee “a job with a family-sustaining wage, adequate family and medical leave, paid vacations, and retirement security to all people of the United States.”

The following statements from energy and environment experts at The Heartland Institute — a free-market think tank — may be used for attribution.


“Extreme. That’s the only way to describe the socialist Green New Deal. With its failure in Venezuela, Ocasio-Cortez, Markey and their fellow democrats have picked a bad time to force socialism here in our country. Rest assured, The Heartland Institute will continue to lead the opposition to this socialist green dream.”

 

Tim Huelskamp, Ph.D.
President
The Heartland Institute
thuelskamp@heartland.org
312/377-4000


Dr. Huelskamp represented Kansas’ 1st District in the House of Representatives from 2011 to 2017
.


“It is no coincidence that the radical socialist freshman congresswoman from New York has made the Green New Deal her top priority. In addition to bankrupting our energy economy, the Green New Deal would impose the very same programs that destroyed Venezuela, transforming the Latin American nation from a wealthy, relatively free society into a poverty-stricken totalitarian dictatorship.

“This Venezuelan model is what Ocasio-Cortez and other socialist Democrats dream for America. They realize that a contrived climate crisis provides their best opportunity to amass the power to do so.”

 

James Taylor

Senior Fellow for Environmental Policy

The Heartland Institute

 


“Justifying the need for the Green New Deal on the alarmist and unscientific reports by the International Panel on Climate Change would turn America into a socialist state because of a lie.

“Despite what this resolution states, human activity is not the ‘dominant cause of observed climate change over the past century.’ Sea levels are not rising at a dangerous and accelerated rate. Storms, droughts, and wildfires are not more frequent, nor are they more severe than in even recent history. And the truth is that the United States, by embracing market-driven forces in energy production, is seeing carbon dioxide emissions fall while that of our more-socialist friends overseas is on the rise.

“In a way, the socialist Green New Deal and the IPCC are a perfect match. Both peddle fantasy and not fact.”

 

Jay Lehr
Science Director
The Heartland Institute


“There are numerous socialist policies mandated under the Green New Deal that would harm tens of millions Americans and drive up the national debt to unsustainable heights. Just some of those policies include single-payer health care, a national tuition-free college program, a promise to provide every American with ‘healthy food,’ a national basic income program, a universal promise for housing and ‘economic security,’ and a plan to ‘upgrade’ every single building in the country, including every American’s home. This isn’t just radical socialism, this is madness.”

Justin Haskins
Executive Editor
The Heartland Institute


The Heartland Institute is a 35-year-old national nonprofit organization headquartered in Arlington Heights, Illinois. Its mission is to discover, develop, and promote free-market solutions to social and economic problems.

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Neil Jordan
February 7, 2019 3:08 pm

Occasonal-Cortex’s Brave Green World manifesto has been taken down.
https://www.thegatewaypundit.com/2019/02/that-didnt-age-well-ocasio-cortez-pulls-her-lunatic-green-new-deal-bridge-across-the-oceans-plan-from-her-webpage/?omhide=true

I understand Occasional-Cortex labored mightily to give birth to the Green New Deal. The text was delivered to her web site. The text was kept comfortable. The text was resuscitated with corrections to some but not all typos because that is what Occasional-Cortex and Nancy wanted. Then a discussion ensued between Nancy and Occasional-Cortex and Schumer snipped the server cord.

Reply to  Neil Jordan
February 7, 2019 3:46 pm

https://dailycaller.com/2019/02/05/ocasio-cortez-green-deal-redistribute-wealth/

From the article:
Many Democrats have rallied around New York Rep. Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez’s so-called “Green New Deal” that aims to eliminate fossil fuels within 10 years. (RELATED: Liberal Operative Reveals The Real Reason Ocasio-Cortez Backs A ‘Green New Deal’)
[excerpt]

A progressive activist who worked on New York Rep. Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez’s campaign and helped draft an outline for a “Green New Deal” characterized the global warming plan as a “proposal to redistribute wealth.”

“America’s ruling class is freaking out about [Ocasio-Cortez’s] proposal to redistribute wealth and power from the people on top to the people on the bottom,” Waleed Shahid tweeted Tuesday, referring to a Fox News segment on the “Green New Deal.”

[end of excerpt]

My concern, as an energy expert, is that intermittent energy from wind and/or solar power cannot supply the grid with reliable, uninterrupted power. These so-called green energy technologies are not green and produce little useful energy, because they require almost 100% conventional backup from fossil fuels, nuclear or hydro for periods when the wind does not blow and the Sun does not shine. Green energy does not even reduce CO2 emissions, because of the need for almost 100% conventional spinning reserve. There is no current grid-scale “super-battery” technology that can economically solve the intermittency problem, except for Pumped Storage that requires special siting that exists in only a few places in the world.

If these “green energy” warriors have their way, I would get off the grid and generate my own power from natural gas. That is the rational approach when politicians ruin a perfectly good grid energy system with their naïve, uninformed foolishness.

MarkW
Reply to  ALLAN MACRAE
February 7, 2019 4:28 pm

America’s ruling class is freaking out about [Ocasio-Cortez’s] proposal to redistribute wealth

Imagine that, people who’ve worked their butts off to improve themselves and provide for their families are upset that people who would rather not work are going to use government to steal everything they have worked for.

William Astley
Reply to  MarkW
February 7, 2019 4:36 pm

And waste it on stuff that which will result in almost no real reduction in CO2 emissions, but will triple the cost of electricity.

The plan is to force jobs to leave so there will be more people on welfare which are Democrat supporters.

The trick/challenge/logical constraint is to make more money so the country can spend more.

It is idiotic/irrational on multiple levels.

steve case
Reply to  William Astley
February 7, 2019 7:14 pm

William Astley…at 4:36 pm
And waste it on stuff that which will result in almost no real reduction in CO2 emissions…

Your post implies that reduction of CO2 emissions needs to be done. It doesn’t.

Stop buying into what the Left tells us needs to be done.

RockyRoad
Reply to  William Astley
February 8, 2019 12:03 am

Indeed, CO2 is the gas of life and reducing it curtails life on the planet! Democratic socialists are hell-bent on destroying everything they touch but particularly Western civilization. They’ve been brainwashed into believing their Globalistic Nirvana is obtainable while anybody with an ounce of brains knows their approach can only fail! Give them a napkin and they’ll go skydiving with enthuasiasm!

Mike Bryant
Reply to  William Astley
February 8, 2019 5:42 am

The Libs have really done it now,
proposed the telling Green New Deal!
You’re on the list, they’ll disallow
what you love and what you feel.
Forget your cars, forget your plane,
your barbecue, your life, your house.
You’ll go by train, eat what they deign,
for they’re the cat, you are the mouse.
In paradise no one must work,
you’ve seen this all played out before.
You’ll be controlled by the berserk,
you’ll starve and die as they get more.
Venezuela, Russia, Cuba,
North Korea, Vietnam,
Cambodia, Romania,
East Germany, Afghanistan.
So tell me, fellow earthly dwellers,
are we the masters of our fate?
Shall we curl up or hide in cellars,
meekly obey, succumb to hate?
Drain the swamp! Build the wall!
Make the bastards earn their rent!
Stand up, you people, Do Not Crawl!
We’re the ONLY government!

MarkW
Reply to  William Astley
February 8, 2019 7:14 am

William was just pointing out the absurdity of what the liberals are doing.

DaveKeys
Reply to  MarkW
February 8, 2019 7:03 am

They do not care. Out of the ashes of capitalist society will come a nice shiny new one. A society not based on greed. Even if it fails they will have destroyed white America. for her a brilliant result. Her name will be spoken of in 1000s of years. The society that replaces white America will be their America with their American values.

Years ago you neede an army today just a demographic that votes.

Craig from Oz
Reply to  ALLAN MACRAE
February 7, 2019 6:01 pm

“America’s ruling class is freaking out about [Ocasio-Cortez’s] proposal to redistribute wealth and power from the people on top to the people on the bottom,”

Ummm… No.

The Ruling Class are congratulating each other on how much they look after the little people. In any Brave New World the Ruling Class will remain the Ruling Class because they are better than us and clearly need to maintain their nice things in order to do their important jobs.

What is really going to happen is the middle class and the working class will have their wealth removed to construct a new Dregs Of Society Class at the very bottom where all Dregs are Equal.

The Ruling Class will then go and live in their apartment in Paris and the Dregs Class can stay and enjoy being patronised by tourists who now visit America because of the 20 to 1 exchange rate against the US dollar.

Goldrider
Reply to  Craig from Oz
February 7, 2019 7:48 pm

What gets me is who’s really behind this. Steyer? Bloomberg? No 29-year-old ditzy bartender came up with this on her own, believe me. There’s got to be some BIG money behind this chick feeding the publicity machine. I can’t even believe such a basket of steaming codswallop has actually seen the light of day! Maybe Pelosi can take her down to that 33rd level catacomb under the Capitol building and explain the Facts of Life to She Guevara. This is the gods’ gift to the GOP . . . and it shows the Watermelons’ hand to the world at last!

Patrick healy
Reply to  Goldrider
February 8, 2019 2:55 am

Oh Goldrider there are many of them :-
Let’s start at the top.
‘ My’ Pope (I am a catholic).
The club of Rome (not necessarily related to above)
The Rothschilds
Soros.
The Bilderberg Group.
Other Masons.
Probably the remnants of the Soviet union.
Probably communist China.
The entire Marxist democrat party.
Agenda 21
The Ippc.
Enough yet?

Craig Austin
Reply to  Goldrider
February 8, 2019 6:55 am

This gal is too perfect to be anything but a Trump operative. She is his 2020 campaign insurance.

matthewdrobnick
Reply to  Goldrider
February 8, 2019 7:21 am

Patrick. Thank you for mentioning the “unmentionables” here on this site.

it is no coincidence she is pushing for 2030- right in line with Agenda 21/2030.

Reply to  Goldrider
February 8, 2019 9:33 am

What gets me is who’s really behind this.

My understanding is that Cotexless [I mean, “Cortez”] is the House sponsor of the bill. It actually arose from the Sunrise Movement organization with which she has been associated for a while. My guess is that active thinkers and leaders in this organization have been hammering out the language for quite some time, and they are using Cotexless [I mean, “Cortez”] as one of the political mouthpieces to articulate it, and as one of the governmental arms to push it out there into the real world.

https://www.sunrisemovement.org/gnd/

Samuel C Cogar
Reply to  Goldrider
February 8, 2019 12:36 pm

Goldrider – February 7, 2019 at 7:48 pm

What gets me is who’s really behind this. Steyer? Bloomberg? No 29-year-old ditzy bartender came up with this on her own, believe me.

Well now, ……. actually, realistically and technically, …. it is the US Public School System that is responsible for the beliefs and actions of Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez et el (and all like-minded millennials) and their “Green New Deal” manifesto …… because that is what the public school students have been “brainwashed” to believe during the past 30+ years.

Cortez’s election “win” was a one-in-a-billion “fluke” and it jump-started the lefty liberal “bandwagon” playing and a parade quickly formed behind it.

And that parade is just getting started and won’t end any time soon. So, set back in your “easy” chair and watch the protesting, fighting and name calling.

Wally
Reply to  Goldrider
February 8, 2019 2:51 pm

Indeed, it’s excellent that we can now all see exactly what the Communists are up to.
BTW, call them what they are, Communists.

No more ‘maybe this, maybe that’.

There it is folks, the true game plan revealed.

comment image

Bill
Reply to  Craig from Oz
February 7, 2019 9:41 pm

To Craig from Oz…from Bill from Aus.
By then there wont be a US dollar, they will. be trading in yuan. I think the ruling class is freaking out as they see their chance to steal all our belongings and freedoms sliding away to loony land on the superfast green dream.
It appears that the Dems might be on the verge of a massive split. An old friend of mine once warned me of the folly of having mad friends as they will eventually turn on you….

MarkG
Reply to  Bill
February 7, 2019 10:05 pm

There is already a huge split between the establishment Democrats and the Millenials. The Establishment are freaking out because they’ve just realized their base considers them obsolete.

The Democrats, through control of the schools, created the batcrap-crazy Millennials by force-feeding them Marxist claptrap for decades. The Millennials are now turning on all the old white folks in the Democrat party, because Too White (and, mostly, Too Male).

Xhe Guevera is not some crazy lady from out of left field. She’s just a typical, average Millenial who’s been taught that she knows everything, socialism is just super-cool, and The Future Is Brown Female.

That’s the problem with relying on lunatics as your support base. You can never tell what a lunatic might decide to do.

DMacKenzie
Reply to  ALLAN MACRAE
February 7, 2019 9:00 pm

Allan, I really have started liking the term “weather dependent energy”. The word “renewable” just has some inherent connotation of reliability that is just plain wrong.

Crispin in Waterloo
Reply to  DMacKenzie
February 8, 2019 2:59 am

DMackenzie. You make a good point. Weather-dependent is exactly the right description.

I think the silly plans for overturning the power generation system without some basic breakthrough are taken from or inspired by Hollywood sci-fi movies wherein the rebels, the cool ultimate victors, scrounge advanced spare parts for a few shillings and fly spacecraft made from millions of tons of metal that appear without any energy input. It is a scavenger economy that has an unseen source of processed metal. In effect, the plots are redistributive because they take what exists and redistribute it very inexpensively, akin to running down a battery someone else charged.

That said, crony capitalism is as insane and short sighted as the loopy Left’s plans to discharge the economic battery in the interests of, among other things, literally everyone having a college degree.

As president of South Africa PW Botha asked, “And who will bring you your tea in the morning?” I suppose the answer will be someone with a college degree in flavinoids.

A just society requires a commitment to genuine equality of opportunity, not equality of outcomes. Slave wages does not qualify as equality of opportunity. Being a member of Congress does not imply equality of outcomes. There is a lot of growing up still to be done.

Jamie
Reply to  DMacKenzie
February 8, 2019 4:42 am

We should all start using that term. First of all the energy is not renewable because you can’t make the solar panels or wind turbines from the energy it produces. You need fossil fuels to make materials

Reply to  Jamie
February 8, 2019 7:02 am

Jamie, BINGO! This is the heart of the problem. How many wind turbines does it take to produce enough concentrated energy to manufacture the materials for one single wind turbine? I am just a biologist, but I’ll wager that the number is north of an infinite number of wind turbines. And, until this week, I never considered the energy costs to manufacture the materials for the base/pedestal. Yeah, right, renewables! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B4jEFPdUiMs&feature=youtu.be

Robert of Texas
Reply to  DMacKenzie
February 8, 2019 2:06 pm

“Weather dependent” is better than “Green” but not entirely correct. For example, solar doesn’t work on a cloud-free night either – the weather doesn’t matter. I still prefer “intermittent energy” because it covers both weather and nightfall. “Works Some-Of-The-Time energy” just doesn’t roll off the tongue.

mike macray
Reply to  Robert of Texas
February 11, 2019 5:08 am

Texa Robert
Texas Robert
…I still prefer “intermittent energy” because it covers both weather and nightfall….

How’s about “Diurnal Weather Dependent..?”
( not to be confused with a Storm safe Public Convenience )…
semantics will be the death of me!
Cheers
Mike

Paul Penrose
Reply to  ALLAN MACRAE
February 8, 2019 10:35 am

To be fair, 100% “renewable” energy is only impossible if you assume that the demand side of the equation does not change. The current electrical system has all the flexibility built into the supply side. This allows the consumer (you and me) to demand electricity whenever we want want it and at whatever amount we want (up to the limits of our service class, of course). But if you have inflexible (non-dispatchable, unreliable) supply (provided by wind and solar mostly), then the system can work if you have flexible demand. In other words, you allow the grid operators to “adjust” demand as necessary to balance the varying supply. This would be done by putting devices at all customer locations which allow the grid operator to turn off circuits and services as they see fit, or even disabling entire subgrids for periods of time. Now that is a radical change to the current system, and most likely is incompatible with our technological society today. I doubt most people would be in favor of such a change, which is probably why this aspect of 100% renewables is never mentioned by its proponents.

Thomas Ryan
Reply to  Neil Jordan
February 7, 2019 3:57 pm

10+

vukcevic
Reply to  Thomas Ryan
February 8, 2019 12:46 am

Reincarnated Vladimir Ilich
No.
Leon Trotsky more likely

Big T
Reply to  Neil Jordan
February 7, 2019 4:06 pm

Aselo kotex gave Trump a valentine present!

Barbara
Reply to  Neil Jordan
February 7, 2019 6:31 pm

U.S. International Trade Administration (ITA)

SELECT USA

“Energy Industry Spotlight”
“Overview”
“The Energy Industry in the United States”

Includes Renewable Energy, Energy Efficiency, Other Energy topics and Organizations involved in U.S. Energy Issues.

There is more taking place than just the U.S. Congress and Senate.
http://www.selectusa.gov/energy-industry-united-states

And,

UN Sustainable Development

“Clean Energy Finance University”

Description
Partners:
U.S. Department of Energy, NREL
Bloomberg New Energy Finance
Clean Energy Solutions Center
Frankfurt School – UNEP
UNEP

https://sustainabledevelopment.un.org/partnership/?p=1038

Look behind the scenes for what’s taking place.

MattS
Reply to  Neil Jordan
February 7, 2019 9:55 pm

“Occasonal-Cortex”

Hahahahahahahahah! Love it! 🙂

old white guy
Reply to  Neil Jordan
February 8, 2019 4:00 am

the Cortex and all those who support her are really quite insane. One need not even bother to try and analyse her stupidity.

Roy W. Spencer
February 7, 2019 3:08 pm

I think all Democrats throughout this great nation should support AOC’s Green New Deal. Before the next election.

Joel Snider
Reply to  Roy W. Spencer
February 7, 2019 3:25 pm

Yeah, but what if they get elected?

Seriously – I feel ya, but you simply cannot count on common sense being a factor.

MarkW
Reply to  Joel Snider
February 7, 2019 4:30 pm

I was reading of a poll recently that found that a majority of voters would support raising the tax rate to 70%. Reading the comments was really depressing. Person after person whining about how it was so unfair that some people had so much, so they want government to do something about it.

HotScot
Reply to  MarkW
February 7, 2019 4:43 pm

“The inherent vice of capitalism is the unequal sharing of blessings. The inherent virtue of Socialism is the equal sharing of miseries.”

Winston Churchill, House of Commons, 22 October 1945

joe
Reply to  HotScot
February 7, 2019 6:31 pm

Except for the ruling classes who will:
a) live in big dachas
b) travel in big bullet proof gasoline powered cars
c) will use dedicated ruling class only travel lanes
d) will shop in well stocked ruling class only stores

Hey we’ve been here before … back in the USSR

Art
Reply to  HotScot
February 7, 2019 7:59 pm

Winnie was a little off on the second sentence. It should have been, “The inherent virtue of Socialism is the equal sharing of miseries except for the ruling elite.”

Bob Johnston
Reply to  Roy W. Spencer
February 7, 2019 3:28 pm

The problem for these people is that there are no repercussions to offering up something this blatantly stupid because so far the adults have said “No effin’ way”. But until these wannabe socialists feel the effects of policy like this they’ll just continue on being critical of the systems that allow them to act this way in the first place instead of having to scratch and claw for survival every day.

I wish I had a time machine so I could send them back to the medieval times so they could be serfs and let them enjoy that way of life for a year or so… perhaps NOAA will lend me the use of theirs (that is how they are able to determine how all past temperatures needed to be adjusted down, isn’t it – they went back in time and remeasured?).

Jim
Reply to  Bob Johnston
February 7, 2019 3:39 pm

Sorry Bob AOC goes back medieval times to live as a serf and she stays there. Or fly her up to the top of Alaska and say sorry you can’t use the airplane these have been outlawed. Here is a kayak. Good luck!

I’m a Canadian Baffin Island would be an excellent spot.

MarkW
Reply to  Jim
February 7, 2019 4:32 pm

According to her Green Insanity Plan, airplanes are going to be phased out in favor of high speed rail. In just 10 years.

Don Perry
Reply to  MarkW
February 7, 2019 4:57 pm

Yeah, I’d like to see her try her high speed rail on its way to Hawaii.

Rocketscientist
Reply to  MarkW
February 7, 2019 5:29 pm

old joke about bridges to Hawaii with a modern twist:
Granted one wish a man asked for a bridge to Hawaii.
The Genie laughed in his face, “Far too crazy! Ask again!”
“Okay,” the man replied. “Then tell me what the heck that Cocasio-Cortez woman is thinking.”
“Hmm,” replied the genie, “You want that bridge one lane or two?”

Bryan A
Reply to  MarkW
February 7, 2019 6:52 pm

With gas stations, restaurants and motels every 200 miles.

David Chappell
Reply to  MarkW
February 7, 2019 8:03 pm

Has AOC ever been outside the continental USA? I don’t think she realises there’s a whole lot of world out here.

brians356
Reply to  MarkW
February 7, 2019 10:13 pm

But, but … we have to at least try . We can’t just do nothing !

StephenP
Reply to  MarkW
February 7, 2019 11:19 pm

Not gas stations every 200 miles on the Hawaii bridge, electricity recharge points as she will be using an EV.
She will have to join the queue as it takes about half an hour to recharge even from a rapid recharge point. If it is normal domestic supply it will take over-night!

StephenP
Reply to  MarkW
February 7, 2019 11:46 pm

Interesting the difference between the time stamp of 11.19pm on 7th Feb, and the actual time here in the UK at about 7.20 am on 8th Feb.
I presume that the time stamp is California time.

Menicholas
Reply to  MarkW
February 8, 2019 12:48 am

Rocket Scientist,
Good stuff, mind if I steals it?
That needs to go on Twitter.

MarkW
Reply to  MarkW
February 8, 2019 7:19 am

David, I’m not sure she’s ever been outside New York City.

Bryan A
Reply to  MarkW
February 8, 2019 10:00 am

Unfortunately she HAS been out of NY NY, She was in DC for the State of the Union address all decked out in white.

4TimesAYear
Reply to  Jim
February 7, 2019 10:21 pm

I have often said that they should ship the alarmists to the North Pole and leave them there. See how well that “global warming” is working for them then. Or the South Pole. The South Pole might be better. It’s land-locked; it’s colder.

Menicholas
Reply to  4TimesAYear
February 8, 2019 12:50 am

How about to the Midwest last week with only wind and solar available?
That would solve the problem.
At least one person froze solid in her own home when her thermostat malfunctioned.
It does not even take a power failure to die in Winter in the US.

John Endicott
Reply to  Jim
February 8, 2019 5:18 am

With gas stations, restaurants and motels every 200 miles.

Not gas stations every 200 miles on the Hawaii bridge, electricity recharge points as she will be using an EV.

Neither of those things, it’s Highspeed rail only. She wants to eliminate cars as well as planes.

Bryan A
Reply to  John Endicott
February 8, 2019 10:02 am

How about a moving sidewalk??

Warren
Reply to  Roy W. Spencer
February 7, 2019 5:13 pm

And so should we up to the steps of the polling booth.
Favorably promote AOC to every Democrat you know.
It’s the smart thing to do.

Menicholas
Reply to  Roy W. Spencer
February 8, 2019 12:44 am

I agree with Roy.
This is great news, and we all ought to give them all the rope they want.
It will be the biggest landslide in electoral history.

Sweet Old Bob
February 7, 2019 3:11 pm

And there IS pie in the sky …

Rocketscientist
Reply to  Sweet Old Bob
February 7, 2019 5:42 pm

But, they’re made of marshmallow and served in the back of a cab with Lucy, by the rocking horse people.

Reply to  Rocketscientist
February 8, 2019 7:12 am

Then Occasional Cortex must be the girl with kaleidoscope eyes.

Planning Engineer
February 7, 2019 3:11 pm

What person with potentially acceptable credentials would sign off on the assertion that a functioning renewable energy system could be built and manintained anywhere near the assumed cost of the Green New Deal?

George Daddis
Reply to  Planning Engineer
February 7, 2019 5:43 pm

It is easy enough to believe that young “useful idiots” with no experience can jump aboard the fairy dust train, but what excuse do reasonably intelligent veteran lawmakers like Harris and Sanders have?

I’ve been routinely bashing activists and politicians who start with erroneous assumptions and then go on to build complex conclusions and recommendations upon those false assumption; but none of the GND recommendations can stand a minimum test of economic or scientific scrutiny. You could go on and on!
– where”s the steel for all the new infrastructure going to come from if the only energy is wind and solar?
– cement is a major source of CO2 emissions; each of the infinite number of proposed wind turbines needs a 50′ deep concrete base.
– what do I do with my 2019 Honda that will still be running in 10 years, if gas is not available? Do we need walls to prevent Texans from driving to Mexico for their next fillup? What do we do with all the corner gas stations over the next 10 years?

The inconsistencies go on and on. A home schooled 5th grader can blow holes in these recommendations. This does not say much for the Economics Department of Boston College.

Nancy
Reply to  George Daddis
February 7, 2019 6:22 pm

Harris is not that smart. She was my state’s attorney general before she ran for Congress. I can tell you, her success in government wasn’t due to the matter between her ears. I left the state before she became their senator.

As for Sanders? We all know he never had a job in his life that would pay the bills until he conned the voters into putting him in Congress.

Robertvd
Reply to  George Daddis
February 8, 2019 8:38 am

This says a lot about the Economics Department of Boston College.

knr
February 7, 2019 3:13 pm

I think you being unfair I have already picked a name for my free unicron , its Jiff .
And it can eat of the free gold plates I am going to get too.

JimG1
February 7, 2019 3:13 pm

Occasional Cortex has a chip on her shoulder and aside from being an imbecile is, like Obama, trying to harm the country and does not like. The United States of America. What is most disconcerting is the number of people in this country, including the majority of the media and educational system who fall for such complete idiocy.

damp
Reply to  JimG1
February 7, 2019 6:11 pm

Covetousness, envy and resentment are the primal impulses of all Marxists, as far as I can tell – including Marx. Give them a mic and they screech, “You didn’t build that!”

Tom Halla
February 7, 2019 3:21 pm

This is a campaign gift to the Republicans. This mash-up of Venezuela and Germany’s Energiewende is a lampoon of watermelon proposals.
On second thought, maybe enough people are ignorant enough to not recognize the utter impractibility of this proposal, and vote for people backing it. A decent plot outline for a disaster movie?

Joel O'Bryan
Reply to  Tom Halla
February 7, 2019 5:37 pm

there are a lot of green propaganda brainwashed Millennials out there who’ve been raised on “free stuff ” and paid for with OPM.

Menicholas
Reply to  Tom Halla
February 8, 2019 12:53 am

They closed the website with the details within hours, once they had even that amount of feedback time to hear how stupid and ill-conceived their “plan” was.

MarkV1
February 7, 2019 3:23 pm

Representative Cortez (really, is name calling the height of your arguments-the commenters give all of the appearance of being 5 year olds on the playground) demonstrates (unless I see evidence to the contrary)!more intelligence than all of you combined.

Yes, there are mistakes in the Green Deal, including not understanding that our electrical grid can’t support 100% renewable at this time. But the alternative is to cede the future to China and other countries as we continue down the road to irrelevancy.

Latitude
Reply to  MarkV1
February 7, 2019 3:39 pm

Uh Mark, China is building more coal plants, has already increased it’s coal consumption, has doubled it’s methane emissions and still increasing…and is rapidly writing deals to increase it’s petro. coal, and gas imports..
..and other countries too

…the only way we would cede the future to China…is be stupid enough to do some green deal

get out of your shell and research what China is really doing…not what you have been spoon fed

Ron Long
Reply to  MarkV1
February 7, 2019 3:46 pm

MarkV1, your statement that Representative Cortez “demonstrates…more intelligence than all of you combined” is an impossibly summation to defend, the combined intelligence of only several Watts readers and commentators would easily exceed hers. This ridiculous comment of yours leaves me wondering if you might be consuming too many Trix cereals and Red Bull.

H.R.
Reply to  Ron Long
February 7, 2019 8:33 pm

Ron Long writes: “[…] the combined intelligence of only several Watts readers and commentators would easily exceed hers.”

I’d back just any one randomly selected reader here as being more intelligent than AOC, and that includes any from the loyal opposition, should their name be drawn out of the hat.

John Endicott
Reply to  H.R.
February 8, 2019 5:34 am

Unless that random name happens to be MarkV1 as his post demonstrates that even AOC is smarter than him. Simple math shows that his comment is mathematically impossible. Even if you assumed for the sake of argument that everyone here is classified as “Extremely low IQ” (IE 69 or below – about 2% of the overall population) there’s enough people here that when you combine all the numbers you end up with a number in the “Extremely High” (130+ – about 2% of the overall population) range of the Wechsler scale. Even being extremely generous, there’s no way that AOC ranks in the top 2% of intelligence (or if she does, she hides it extremely well every time she opens her mouth and stupid comes tumbling out).

MarkW
Reply to  John Endicott
February 8, 2019 8:26 am

Looks like MV1 was just doing a seagull impersonation.

Joel Snider
Reply to  MarkV1
February 7, 2019 3:57 pm

When you’re confronted by this level of insanity, what good are rational arguments?
As your own idiotic post has proved beyond a shadow of a doubt.

DonM
Reply to  MarkV1
February 7, 2019 3:59 pm

mark6,

I don’t understand the part about ceding the future to China.

What logic works to say that using the most efficient energy production systems (and not inefficient green stuff) puts the USA in a secondary position?

Germany is currently leading the way in showing that the green stuff does not work. China doesn’t really care ….

But seriously, how not does jumping onto the greenwagon make the USA irrelevant?

Kevin kilty
Reply to  DonM
February 8, 2019 6:05 am

He is not Mark 6; he is Mark version 1.

MarkW
Reply to  Kevin kilty
February 8, 2019 4:10 pm

Version 1? Heck, he’s still in the prototype stage.

MarkW
Reply to  MarkV1
February 7, 2019 4:35 pm

Why do leftists get so upset when stupid people are called stupid?
Hits to close to home.

The electrical grid will never be able to support 100% renewable.

PS: I notice that you don’t criticize any of the other insanities? From that can I conclude that you are actually moronic enough to agree with them?

PPS: I take it that you are clueless enough to be taken in by China’s meaningless promises.

MarkW
Reply to  MarkV1
February 7, 2019 4:38 pm

In amongst the insults, there are a lot of criticisms for this plan.
I notice you didn’t even attempt to refute any of those criticisms.
Can I take that as an admission on your part that you can’t refute any of them?

jtom
Reply to  MarkV1
February 7, 2019 4:40 pm

Please tell us what, in you opinion, is not a ‘mistake’ in her proposal. A specific actionable item, please, not a sweeping statement like everyone should have clean air to breath.

Retired_Engineer_Jim
Reply to  MarkV1
February 7, 2019 4:48 pm

It;s not that the “grid can’t support 100% renewable at this time” – it’s that renewables can’t support the grid anywhere near 100% of the time. No matter how many renewable energy devices you emplace.

Latitude
Reply to  MarkV1
February 7, 2019 4:59 pm

you guys realize…the same woman that says do all this in 10 years
…says the world is going to end in 12

Rocketscientist
Reply to  Latitude
February 7, 2019 5:37 pm

With math skills like hers it’s damn good that Pelosi didn’t give a spot on the Ways and Means Committee.
And, from other sources I’ve read, Pelosi is not too enamored with this plan.

Reply to  Rocketscientist
February 7, 2019 8:46 pm

Rocketscientist

That’s because the last time Markey pushed through a climate bill, (Cap and Trade 2009) the Democrats lost 63 House seats and 7 Senate seats in the next election.

Don Perry
Reply to  MarkV1
February 7, 2019 5:01 pm

You have just shown yourself to be an extremely poor judge of character and cognitive ability.

icisil
Reply to  MarkV1
February 7, 2019 5:25 pm

There’s only one reason She Guevara is in the spotlight right now, and it’s not her IQ. If she looked like Lena Dunham she would be getting no attention. The only reason she’s getting so much attention is because she’s young, trim and sexy.

http://pixel.nymag.com/imgs/daily/vulture/2016/08/30/30-lena-dunham.w1200.h630.jpg

Goldrider
Reply to  icisil
February 7, 2019 7:51 pm

You forgot “marginalized ethnic group.”

Craig from Oz
Reply to  MarkV1
February 7, 2019 6:12 pm

Destroy your economy and your children will spend the rest of their lives saying ‘I hope the room is to your liking’ to working class Chinese tourists who now holiday in the US because the US dollar is utterly worthless.

That is the New Green Deal. Ignore all the hippy unicorn power generation stuff and look at the shameless social reform. Everyone gets free education. Everyone gets a family supporting job. Everyone gets. No one pays for it because clearly the rich people will.

Spoiler – rich people don’t have to stay because being… how shall I word it… RICH, they can afford to transfer to a new country. The people who are going to be forced to pay for it are the middle class who will be dragged down into the new Dregs class where everything is meaningless.

SOCIALISM DOESN’T WORK.

Deal with it.

John Endicott
Reply to  Craig from Oz
February 8, 2019 5:41 am

Nah, Craig from Oz. your children won’t even get to say that. Look to the socialist paradise of Venezuela and it’s utterly worthless currency, you don’t see many tourists (Chinese or otherwise) going there these days. What good is a strong Yuan compared to the local currency when there’s nothing left in the economically-destroyed country worth spending it on?

Menicholas
Reply to  MarkV1
February 8, 2019 1:14 am

Mark VeeOne,
Here is a tribute to your hero chicklet:

https://twitter.com/i/status/1093502913136209921

Andy
Reply to  MarkV1
February 8, 2019 2:28 am

“Representative Cortez is more intelligence than all of you combined”

Well she is the master of disguise as well then to hide it so well.

Neo
Reply to  MarkV1
February 8, 2019 6:10 am

I’m torn between “Green Rape Culture” and “Green Final Solution”

Paul Penrose
Reply to  MarkV1
February 8, 2019 10:53 am

Mark,
I agree with you on the name calling. It is childish; there is simply no other way to describe it. But that’s where we part company on this subject. Ms. Ocasio-Cortez is not very intelligent, IMHO, and her proposal has more holes in it than swiss cheese. Even a 12 year old could spot some of them. It is nothing less than a naked power grab and a path to the ruination of this country.

Rob
February 7, 2019 3:24 pm

Stalin and Mao both murdered millions trying to apply Marxist ideology to really, and the these Marxist dimstick leftists will achieve no less.

Hivemind
Reply to  Rob
February 8, 2019 4:18 am

You forgot Pol Pot & Maduro.

Walt D.
February 7, 2019 3:25 pm

No Air Travel = no Climate Conference boon doggles = no free champagne and lobster.
This is going to go down like a lead balloon!

Spetzer86
Reply to  Walt D.
February 7, 2019 4:10 pm

You’re misreading that part. “No air travel” refers to those of us that aren’t in the Leftist Elite class. Members of that class will, of necessity, have to frequently travel around the world. Particularly if there’s a tropical island in need to a little TLC.

MarkW
Reply to  Walt D.
February 7, 2019 4:37 pm

She claims that high speed rail will be so ubiquitous and comfortable, that nobody will want to fly anymore.

Of course the idea that we could build a nationwide high speed rail network in just 10 years ranks as one of the stupidest ideas in this plan.

Walt D.
Reply to  MarkW
February 7, 2019 6:09 pm

I look forward to riding the bullet train from Fresno to Bakersfield.

H.R.
Reply to  Walt D.
February 7, 2019 8:43 pm

I’m a little ways out in the country. I look forward to riding the bullet train milk run to the grocery store; stops once at every house and twice at every duplex.

Stopping at every house may take a bit longer, but man-oh-man! You wouldn’t believe the speeds it reaches between houses.

Retired_Engineer_Jim
Reply to  Walt D.
February 7, 2019 9:37 pm

As I understand it, the train will stop ~6 miles outside of Bakersfield. Some technical problems beyond their control.

MarkW
Reply to  Walt D.
February 8, 2019 8:27 am

Haven’t they been working on that train for almost 10 years by now?

Gerry
Reply to  MarkW
February 7, 2019 10:57 pm

Of course intermittent rail travel will only occur during daylight hours where most of the intermittent power for the rail is generated. Nothing happening at night.

StephenP
Reply to  MarkW
February 7, 2019 11:59 pm

How long will it take to get to the railway station?
How do you get there, walk, bicycle, horse and buggy?
Ditto at the other end of your trip.
In the UK we have a similar plans for HS2, (high speed).
It will cost a fortune to build, cost a fortune to ride, will save only a few minutes in travelling time and drop you off near where you don’t want to go. As well as destroying a swathe of beautiful countryside.

StephenP
Reply to  MarkW
February 8, 2019 12:05 am

How will the electricity be generated to run the train at night when the wind does not low.
I can imagine the train needing to pull a battery the size of the train to keep it moving.
Don’t say you can swap batteries every so often, it will be like returning to the state-owned era with changing horses every few miles.

StephenP
Reply to  StephenP
February 8, 2019 12:08 am

B….. Autofill
Does not blow
Stage coach
Although state-owned may also be apposite

John Endicott
Reply to  StephenP
February 8, 2019 6:01 am

The trains wouldn’t need a “battery the size of the train” as most bullet trains get their electricity from electrified lines (Japans shinkansen uses electrified lines with 25 kV AC over head power supply) – in other words the power is generated at a generating station and distributed to the trains. Therefore, in the green new deal, the “generating station” would be renewable wind and solar farms – so the train won’t be going very far when the sun isn’t shining and the wind isn’t blowing unless the station has a honking huge battery (but at least the train won’t have to be lugging that battery around)

Joel Snider
February 7, 2019 3:27 pm

These people are crazy – AND they’ve got an army of marching brooms that will apparently back them up no matter HOW crazy they are.

Seriously – they seem to be running on the platform of destroying the American lifestyle – to save the planet – yet seem to demand that same lifestyle as a right for everybody else – AFTER they’ve destroyed it.

I can’t wait for this Ocasio Cortez to start repeating the pattern of all her predecessors, when her twelve-year doomsday doesn’t materialize, she’ll change her story, say it’s another ten years off, or say that it actually IS happening – just slower – or off-screen somehow.

The possibility that she’ll actually learn enough to change her tune is absolutely zero.

Just think of the damage they’ll do should when they eventually regain full control of government. They do enough damage locally – and they’ve certainly poisoned a generation of school students.

See, THESE are the mechanisms of behavior-based extinction.

(Repost – but it fits even better here)

AWG
Reply to  Joel Snider
February 7, 2019 3:47 pm

May explain why they are so eager to rid the population of guns – so as to monopolize violence for themselves.

I don’t see how America votes its way out of this mess.

Joel Snider
Reply to  AWG
February 7, 2019 3:54 pm

Well, more like leaving the population defenseless.
In the name of ‘protection’.

And frighteningly, you’re right about the vote – if Ocasio-Cortez was the Democrat nominee, she would carry New York and California without a hitch.

Don
Reply to  Joel Snider
February 7, 2019 5:13 pm

Fortunately, she’s ineligible until 2024 at the earliest.

Supposedly, she has an economics degree, but it’s clear that the economics program at Boston U. is hopelessly dysfunctional if she graduated from there with a passing grade.

Reply to  Don
February 7, 2019 9:36 pm

Don

I believe AOC is very illuminatory of our institutes of higher learning. The fact that she doesn’t know the first thing about economics but can recite liberal dogma at will is very indicative of her professors priorities.

MarkG
Reply to  Don
February 7, 2019 10:09 pm

“Fortunately, she’s ineligible until 2024 at the earliest.”

Who’s going to stop her?

Seriously, if she was to run and win, who’s going to say ‘nope, you’re not eligible, sorry’?

Law no longer exists in America. That’s been proven time and again over the last decade or so.

Rud Istvan
February 7, 2019 3:27 pm

This GND is a gift to Trumplicans for 2020. It shows moderate Dems and Independents how completely off the sanity rails left wing Dems have gone. And look who has already declared for Dem pres candidate: Fauxcahontas, Horizontal Harris, Spartacus,…
We are going to run out of popcorn by end of 3 Nov 2020.

David Dirkse
Reply to  Rud Istvan
February 7, 2019 3:40 pm

Instead of using dumb names to refer to politicians you dislike, why don’t you call them by their proper names, and show that you have some class, instead of coming off like an idiot?

Tom Halla
Reply to  David Dirkse
February 7, 2019 6:52 pm

It is not as if it is limited to one side in using dismissive nicknames. “Drumpf” , anyone?

Joel Snider
Reply to  Tom Halla
February 8, 2019 9:01 am

It is, however, predominately on one side, though, isn’t it? Basically one guy has appeared on the scene and thrown it back on them.

MarkG
Reply to  David Dirkse
February 7, 2019 10:10 pm

The left hate, hate, hate seeing their own tactics used against them, don’t they?

Menicholas
Reply to  David Dirkse
February 8, 2019 1:01 am

Fauxcahontas earned her nickname the old-fashioned way, by lying through her teeth.
And Harris earned hers the hard way.
And Spartacus named himself.
Get a grip Dirkse, your snowflake is showing.

Menicholas
Reply to  David Dirkse
February 8, 2019 1:26 am

BTW David, save your hypocrite tears for someone that matters…Warren is done.
She has had so many lies exposed she has zero chance of even being on a debate stage, assuming they stick to the 5% polling support minimum.

MarkW
Reply to  David Dirkse
February 8, 2019 7:29 am

Why is it that leftists have absolutely no self awareness?

Joel Snider
Reply to  David Dirkse
February 8, 2019 8:58 am

Hey David – Perhaps you now see what Trump’s been illustrating by using your own tactics against you – and boy can you guys not take it.

I notice you jump right to your phony moral high-ground.

Sorry – you guys set the terms of this fight a long time ago.

Paul Penrose
Reply to  David Dirkse
February 8, 2019 11:06 am

I’m so conservative that I make some of you look like DFLers, but I don’t like the name calling either, regardless of whatever your political beliefs you hold. There are some exceptions, like Booker who gave himself the nickname “Spartacus”. But just because someone calls the president “Drumpf”, it does not make it any less childish to call Warren “Fauxcahontas”. There are plenty of legitimate issues to criticize these people over, so call them out on their lies and deceptions and disastrous policies, but please leave the juvenile taunts on the playground.

DeeDub
Reply to  Rud Istvan
February 7, 2019 3:42 pm

Well, um . . .

“Ninety-two percent of Democrats supported the idea, including 93 percent of liberal Democrats and 90 percent of moderate-to-conservative Democrats. But 64 percent of Republicans—including 75 percent of moderate-to-liberal Republicans and 57 percent of conservative Republicans—also backed the policy goals outlined in the Green New Deal.”

https://www.motherjones.com/politics/2018/12/the-green-new-deal-is-really-popular-even-among-republicans

Joel Snider
Reply to  DeeDub
February 7, 2019 3:59 pm

DeeDub is right – none of this is funny. Because they’re not kidding. We’ve already got one idiot on this thread claiming she’s got more intelligence than all of us combined.

Mike McMillan
Reply to  Joel Snider
February 7, 2019 9:43 pm

Of course she’s got more intelligence than all of us combined. As a Congressprincess, she’s in the ruling class now, unlike us. The ruling class always does well under socialism.

Carol Anne
Reply to  DeeDub
February 7, 2019 4:00 pm

No, not really. Polls were before details were published. People here “green” and think, oh, that sounds nice. Tell them you would take their cars and their beef and airplane travel away, and leave them intermittently in the dark and cold, and there would be a different result.

MarkW
Reply to  Carol Anne
February 7, 2019 4:41 pm

Who’s going to tell them?
Remember congress passed ObamaCare without ever learning what was in it.

DonM
Reply to  DeeDub
February 7, 2019 4:10 pm

Well, um

Per your referenced article, when asked (by the Yale climate change propagandists), 82% responded they they knew nothing about the new green deal. When pressed, 80% of the respondents then said that it sounded like a good thing.

So, you find a big portion of no-nuthings and ask them if “clean energy” is a good plan. They say YES. And you think that you have a good consensus.

The dems thought that for a while too. Then they cleansed the Ocawzio website when they realized they were only fooling themselves.

sycomputing
Reply to  DonM
February 7, 2019 6:09 pm

The dems thought that for a while too. Then they cleansed the Ocawzio website when they realized they were only fooling themselves.

Indeed, just as they did another Progressive rite a few decades ago. But lo, just those few decades later, it’s no longer unthinkable that a helpless infant living outside the womb should have his/her life terminated by the sacrificial knife of the Priests of Progressivism.

Not taking this woman seriously is a fool’s errand . . . more than irresponsible and wholly stupid of those who don’t.

Goldrider
Reply to  DonM
February 7, 2019 7:55 pm

My mother watches CNN and MSNBC (yeah, I know, don’t go there) and claims she saw not one thing about this all day today. Dems. are burying the story because it’s so embarassing.

Just imagine how embarassing it would be as their candidate’s platform in 2020 . . .

Garland Lowe
Reply to  DeeDub
February 7, 2019 4:20 pm

DeeDub, I don’t buy it. All of the Republicans think its nuts. Not one supports the green new deal.

“Eighty-two percent of Americans say they have heard “nothing at all” about the sweeping proposal to generate 100 percent of the nation’s electricity from clean sources within the next 10 years, upgrade the United States’ power grid, invest in energy efficiency and renewable technology, and provide training for jobs in the new, green economy.”
82% of Americans haven’t heard of the green new deal, but 90%+\- support it when it is explained to them.
Got it.

DeeDub
Reply to  Garland Lowe
February 7, 2019 4:55 pm

Yes, Garland and Don, now that the utter insanity of it is out there for all to see (prompting AOC’s website to promptly remove it), the Republicans — and soon enough most Democrats — will run from it like the economic plague that it is.

Which is to say that AOC could well have done the country and the rest of the world a great favor by laying it on the line as to what absurd measures would be required to prevent the equal absurdity of manmade CO2 ending the world in 12 years.

Thank you, dear girl, now go away. And let us warm ourselves by the precious fires of fossil fuels until their services to humanity have been replaced by energy sources that are genuinely better in cost and performance.

Tom Abbott
Reply to  DeeDub
February 7, 2019 6:47 pm

“Thank you, dear girl, now go away.”

I think that is the proper sentiment.

I noticed Nancy Pelosi referred to the Green New Deal and the Green Dream. Nancy pointed out how others were excited about it, but didn’t include herself in that group.

Rep. Ocasio’s obviously unattainable GND goals are a gift to conservatives. Let the derision begin. No airplanes? No cars? These ideas are going to crash and burn after a little public scrutiny. This bill may not even pass in the Democrat House. It’s full of loony ideas and Democrats who promote it are going to look loony, too.

John Endicott
Reply to  DeeDub
February 8, 2019 6:08 am

No phone, no lights no motor cars, Not a single luxury. Like Robinson Crusoe, As primative as can be.

AOC is Gilligan. (sorry, Bob Denver, I owe you and your character a massive apology).

Alan Tomalty
Reply to  DeeDub
February 8, 2019 6:30 am

Don’t underestimate the power of the greenies who have been brought up and educated with the religion of green energy and global warming. A court in Australia has just turned down a proposed coal plant because of climate change. The greenies will turn America into Venezuela with their last shivering breath caused by a future polar vortex. America and the free world are doomed.

John Endicott
Reply to  DeeDub
February 8, 2019 7:13 am

America and the free world are only doomed if saner heads shrug their shoulders and let the greens get away with it.

Don
Reply to  DeeDub
February 7, 2019 5:16 pm

It’s an article from Mother Jones, hardly a paragon of objective reporting.

KT66
Reply to  DeeDub
February 7, 2019 6:46 pm

Well um…

Mother Jones.

Menicholas
Reply to  DeeDub
February 8, 2019 1:03 am

Anyone stupid enough to believe anything printed by MotherJones deserves to be laughably misinformed.
Golly, DeeDub, are you really so easy to dupe?

Menicholas
Reply to  Menicholas
February 8, 2019 1:16 am

Aah, I see you were being sarcastic.
Just so hard to tell anymore, when the people that buy this ridiculous nonsense sound like they must be joking when they are being sincere.
Some of the conversations I had today on Twitter were mind bending.

DeeDub
Reply to  Menicholas
February 8, 2019 5:44 am

Again, thank you, dear girl, though to read the article linked below is to prefer that she be propped up in a chair someplace prominent in the Capitol and encouraged to keep talking until the 2020 elections:

https://www.zerohedge.com/news/2019-02-07/meet-alexandria-ocasio-cortez-republicans-secret-weapon-2020

sycomputing
Reply to  Rud Istvan
February 7, 2019 4:22 pm

This GND is a gift to Trumplicans for 2020.

Perhaps for now. But then I remember all through the 90’s I used to laugh at a certain conservative radio talk show host when he did his “Environmentalist Wacko Updates” skits.

You could laugh then because they just wanted to do it . . .

Pft
February 7, 2019 3:30 pm

“There are numerous socialist policies mandated under the Green New Deal that would harm tens of millions Americans and drive up the national debt to unsustainable heights. Just some of those policies include single-payer health care, a national tuition-free college program, a promise to provide every American with ‘healthy food,’ a national basic income program, a universal promise for housing and ‘economic security,’ and a plan to ‘upgrade’ every single building in the country, including every American’s home.“

I love all of that. It neednt drive up the national debt though. Simply create the money without taxes or borrowing, taxing only as needed to control inflation, using the countries vast natural assets as reserves to back the country (land, energy, water, food, minerals, forests)

Go back and formalize a new Bretton Woods to fix currencies exchange rates based on agreement for currency creation as a percentage of each nations proven resources

As for elimination of carbon based energy. Pure hogwash. Focus on infrastructure development and manufacturing the things we use to avoid too many . imports. That is thtown in their to enforce more austerity measures and controls. Its a trap and the rest is bait. Keep the bait and avoid the trap.

MarkW
Reply to  Pft
February 7, 2019 4:44 pm

So you can just create trillions of dollars of fiat money, and it won’t have any impact on the economy?
Tell that to the Wiemar Republic, and Venezuela.

Menicholas
Reply to  Pft
February 8, 2019 1:10 am

Last week we could not afford a wall that cost less than the fight by leftists to prevent it.
This week umpteen bajillion dollars to rebuild the entire country and outlaw everything from milk and cheese to planes and cars…well, that much is chump change we can easily afford by ramping up the printing press at the mint.

I am wondering who is going to rebuild every structure in the country if they are guaranteed a cushy life of abject laziness if they do not feel like working?
Makes me lazy just writing about it.

Eric Stevens
February 7, 2019 3:33 pm

She has no idea of how the economy works.

She has no understanding of how manufacturing works.

She has no understanding of how the economy works.

She has no understanding of our dependency on energy.

She has no understanding of from where we get energy.

She has no understanding of how the world works.

Krishna Gans
Reply to  Eric Stevens
February 7, 2019 3:43 pm

She has understanding of how dancing

MarkW
Reply to  Krishna Gans
February 7, 2019 4:45 pm

I’ve heard she can make a mean cup of coffee. But only if you give her a big tip.

Reply to  Eric Stevens
February 7, 2019 4:06 pm

She has no understanding of global warming, climate change, climate disruption…I wish someone would just ask her some basic questions about climate change (CO2 etc.). Someone like Ted Cruz, not letting her get away with her wrong, non answers or out and out lies.

4TimesAYear
Reply to  Jon P Peterson
February 7, 2019 10:52 pm

I wish someone would ask her some basic questions about basic climate, period. Forget about “change”. Bet she has no idea what causes the winds, ocean currents, etc. Probably hasn’t a clue what latitude is, etc. And then someone could always pin her on what the ideal or “normal” levels of CO2, sea level, etc. are. Nobody has an answer for that.

billtoo
Reply to  Eric Stevens
February 7, 2019 4:09 pm

she went to BU

Menicholas
Reply to  Eric Stevens
February 8, 2019 1:18 am

Eric,
Yeah…but Science!

AWG
February 7, 2019 3:37 pm

This is the sage wisdom of a aging bartender…

Lets see, the World Trade Center collapsed in 2001, and the replacement building didn’t open until near the end of 2014.

That is just one building. And she wants to rid the US of every building, every reliable power plant and every aircraft, replace it with ???? all within ten years – and do it with unionized labor.

If she is the model of the intelligence of the Millennial generation, is there anyone within that generation that can design anything other than a mobile app? How exactly does that Phd in romantic comedies translate into any useful skill in forming this Utopia?

I’m still laughing at how comprehensively stupid the “high-speed rail” across the ocean is.

Stevek
Reply to  AWG
February 7, 2019 4:43 pm

It would cost less just to remove the co2 from atmosphere. And that would be waste of money too !

James Snook
February 7, 2019 3:37 pm

If the Russians are looking for a useful idiot they need look no further than A O-C.

February 7, 2019 3:37 pm

All it will take is that 51 % of the voting population to be taken in by the promise of the “Free things “and you will have your Green revolution. All it needs is a few millions of “of the so called “Refuges from South America and other parts of the world, and her “Dream” will come true.
Whilst from our point of view her in Australia there are faults with the USA system, overall its a good system and most important it actually works.

MJE

James Snook
February 7, 2019 3:40 pm

The Russians have found their useful idiot without having to look too hard.

Joel Snider
Reply to  James Snook
February 8, 2019 11:10 am

It’s not like the mainstream press and the universities weren’t already populated with them.

commieBob
February 7, 2019 3:44 pm

The original New Deal can be argued about ’til the cows come home. It may, or may not, have prevented the growth of a Communist party in America. I know folks who were raised on the Great Plains during the dirty thirties. It was really miserable. People might have supported a tyrant who promised to make things better. The thing that ended unemployment was WW2. Nobody argues with that.

There is no need now for a New Deal. The economy is doing great and unemployment is at record lows. link The only people who would support a New Deal are the deluded and those who think the world owes them a living.

MarkW
Reply to  commieBob
February 7, 2019 4:48 pm

The Communist party was thwarted by having most of it’s platform adopted and enacted by one of the major parties.
The people did support a tyrant.

commieBob
Reply to  MarkW
February 7, 2019 5:57 pm

For a brief time in the 1950s and 1960s, America was a workers’ paradise, then the workers were betrayed by the Democrats.

MarkW
Reply to  commieBob
February 8, 2019 7:36 am

The only reason why it was a workers paradise was because the rest of the industrialized west was still rebuilding from WWII.
It was a period that could not last.
Had industry taken the money that was being earned and invested it in new plants and equipment, the good times could have continued.
Unfortunately they used it to buy labor peace instead.
As a result, when Europe and Japan finished rebuilding, their brand spanking new factories easily out competed the 30 and 40 year old factories still being used in the US.
Labor’s solution was to ban all competition in a desperate attempt to keep the gravy train going.

Neo
Reply to  commieBob
February 8, 2019 8:30 am

Without cows:

A bacon-cheese burger would be just bacon and cheese.

Paul Penrose
Reply to  Neo
February 8, 2019 11:14 am

Where would the cheese come from?

Patrick MJD
February 7, 2019 3:44 pm
February 7, 2019 3:46 pm

The coal fired power plants and natural gas fiord power plants should not have to shut down. They should only have to reduce their emissions. Even though I developed these technologies in Canada they are now with me in the USA. The coal plants can emit no vapor emissions whatsoever with the ZECCOM™¹(Zero Emissions Coal Combustion) Process, and with no vapor emissions there would be no reason to shut them down. The natural gas fired power plants, can emit no vapor emissions whatsoever with the ZENGCOM™¹ (Zero Emissions Natural Gas Combustion) Process, and with no emissions there would be no logical reason for shutting them down.

PaulH
Reply to  Richard Hood
February 7, 2019 4:15 pm

Yes, but there are socialists. Logic and proportion have fallen sloppy dead.

Bartemis
Reply to  PaulH
February 7, 2019 5:54 pm

Feed your head…

Rocketscientist
Reply to  PaulH
February 7, 2019 6:01 pm

They follow the advice of the white rabbit.
…would that make Pelosi the Red Queen?

TonyL
Reply to  Richard Hood
February 7, 2019 4:39 pm

Zero emission coal and NG. Sounds Good!
You specifically say “no vapor emissions”. Are you talking about water vapor?

The emission of interest in the GND is carbon dioxide, which is a gas not a “vapor”.
Please endeavor to be accurate in your communications here.

If you really are proposing carbon dioxide free fossil fuel system, we would all love to hear all about it.
In the meantime, I would like to hook you up with one Sid Abma, who comes by here from time to time to pester us.
Here is his latest video explaining his “clean coal” plan.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RQRQ7S92_lo

Enjoy.

D. J. Hawkins
Reply to  Richard Hood
February 7, 2019 5:04 pm

How about we save a whole bunch of money on top, and ditch your ZEECOM. Then all will be right with the world. Honestly, it takes a special brand of stupid to buy into carbon capture and sequestration.

Tom in Florida
February 7, 2019 3:53 pm

Hahaha, hohoho, and a couple of ladidas,
That’s how we pass the day away in the merry of land of Oz
(not Australia, the fictional Oz)

Curious George
February 7, 2019 4:23 pm

The Plan would guarantee “a job with a family-sustaining wage, adequate family and medical leave, paid vacations, and retirement security to all people of the United States.” Irresistible, and very promising.

This comes from people who have successfully redefined “marriage”, “science”, “peer review”, and “free speech”. Conclusion: “family-sustaining”, “adequate”, and “retirement security” will follow.

icisil
February 7, 2019 4:24 pm

Something as ridiculous as this absolutely requires a blithering idiot to introduce it.

Garland Lowe
February 7, 2019 4:28 pm

Thank God our founding fathers made it difficult to get legislation enacted. This is exactly what they were trying to prevent or slow down. These progressives would shove this down our throats today if they could. The founding fathers were brilliant.

Mike H
February 7, 2019 4:29 pm

By comparison, AOC is making Charles Manson look sane.

Jim
February 7, 2019 4:31 pm

I am stunned by the utter stupidity of these guys oops girls. Just imagine alone the jobs that would be lost if all the airplanes in the USA were grounded tomorrow. This alone would put the economy in a tail spin.

OK and gasoline guzzling cars are now illegal. Everybody tomorrow is driving their electric car to work. The demand for electricity would shut down the grid almost instantly. I would guess that even if you could supply it the amount of new power needed would be unbelievable. Would not be surprised if 10 times more would not be enough to keep everything going. I suspect that it would be 50 or 100 times or more. OK where are you going to get all that extra power? We know that wind mills and solar are basically useless. So that means building hundreds if not thousands of new electricity power plants run by good old fashioned coal and natural gas to supply it. The good old USA has got lots of coal and gas. But whats the point all these needed new power plants would still be putting huge amounts of CO2 in to the atmosphere. So what would be the difference? We still would be doing that but in a different way. And yes I know that CO2 is a good thing. I am not criticizing that.

Their lack of any brains is astounding, can’t they think anything through.

Heres another thing and that is the amount of power in those 2 huge engines to say get a big Boeing 787 in to the air. The amount of raw energy supplied by the kerosene fuel is huge. You could not supply that with electricity from a battery and even if you could the battery would be took big and way too heavy. The airplane would never get off the ground and would have a significantly reduced payload. Totally out of the question and even if you could do that which you cannot you could not get to your destination. You would run the huge batteries down very quickly. The power drain would be massive. Typically a big airliner engines uses say something like 600 kg of fuel just to taxi from the gate to the runway.

Cheers from a cold Canadian freezing in the dark. Anybody and all like to contribute so I can fly south to Florida in a gas guzzling Boeing? So I can thaw out.

WR2
February 7, 2019 4:37 pm

Implementing communism (let’s not pretend what they are advocating is socialism lite, what they are describing is pure communism) is bad enough. Tying it together with mandating only energy sources that can barely produce as much energy as it took to build is a guarantee of civil war and millions of dead.

Stevek
February 7, 2019 4:41 pm

I started reading the New Green Deal and stopped when I read something about racial injustice in it. At that point I knew it was hogwash.

D. J. Hawkins
Reply to  Stevek
February 7, 2019 5:06 pm

Took you that long? Well, points for making the attempt I suppose.

Troe
February 7, 2019 4:44 pm

The Heartland Institute is worth our support Venezuela has been run on exactly these lines.

Thank You Democratic Socialists for this gift. We will use it to maximum effect

Don Bennett
February 7, 2019 4:52 pm

My son calls it “The Green Leap Forward” in memory of Mao’s “Great Leap Forward”. It fits.

AGW is not Science
Reply to  Don Bennett
February 12, 2019 3:46 am

Should be the “Green Leap BACKWARD.”

Gary D.
February 7, 2019 5:02 pm

I believe in their proposal they acknowledge that zero emissions is not possible so they are looking for net zero emissions, which I guess means carbon credits and a robust carbon trading market. What could possibly go wrong with that?
/sarc

Go Home
February 7, 2019 5:02 pm

All I can say, even if this were technically feasible (which of course it is not), to have the Government run this huge change in our economy is suicide. First of all it will cost 10 times what it would need to cost and would work one-tenth as well if private company acted to implement it.

Anyone remember after the billions and billions that the Government spent on putting together a simple Obamacare website. When they flipped the switch, only a dozen people a day could purchase healthcare. This was also repeated as failures on state run websites also.

EternalOptimist
February 7, 2019 5:03 pm

To a kid starting out, 10 years from now must seem like an eternity away,
but to the more wiser amongst us, we know it is just a blink

jtom
February 7, 2019 5:04 pm

As has been said many times before, the Constitution is not a suicide pact. If the SCotUS doesn’t squash most, if not all, of their plans, look for states, from the borders of Mexico to Canada, to secede. It will be quite simple if it comes to that. By then, anyone with assets, skills, incomes, or intelligence will have moved to one of those states. Perhaps legislatures in those states will enact pre-emptive “sanctuary state” laws saying they will not participate in any of these proposed government programs.

The east and west coast morons can watch each other starve. If it comes to a physical confrontation, guess which side has all the guns and ammo.

Wealth, guns, income. Want it? Molon Labe. And I’m one of the more peaceful, non-violent, non-confrontational guys.

Fenlander
Reply to  jtom
February 7, 2019 11:08 pm

“Guess which side has all the guns and ammo.”

Indeed, one side has 350 million weapons and maybe a trillion rounds of ammo, while the other side can’t work out which bathroom to use.

TonyL
February 7, 2019 5:12 pm

This is not a serious proposal, of course. If the GND was at all serious about weaning the country off of fossil fuels, front and center would be Nuclear Power, straight up. To go one step further, we would be talking Thorium, as well as Uranium. There is no other possibility.
Above, MarkV1 frets that China will steal a march on us if we do not go down this path. This is a standard talking point from the Left by now. Curiously both China and India have vigorous Thorium programs. They very well could steal a march on us with our moribund nuclear industry.
Of course, to the modern Left, and nuclear proposal is more radioactive and lethal than any nuke plant ever was.
So the GND is not serious, but it is dangerous. Very dangerous.
They are promising Free Stuff to the Free Stuff Brigades, and the troops are turning out in force.
Vast numbers of young people want free college and free health care. Worse, they feel entitled as this is their Right. Free “Clean and Green” is just more of the package.

Dangerous. Very Dangerous.

Warren
February 7, 2019 5:19 pm

Seriously move to Australia before it’s too late.
If you’re young, you have less than 50-years.
If you’re old, it’s too late.
Socialist hell is coming to America.
The ‘billionaires’ are currently paying for it and there’s very little anyone can do about it (including Trump & Co).
Do you think the billionaires are incompetent investors?

mikee
Reply to  Warren
February 9, 2019 1:35 am

Don’t be rediculous! Australia has its own complement of green lunatics and imbeciles.

R.S. Brown
February 7, 2019 5:21 pm

Folks,

We’ve seen this before.

It (the Green gambit) is an effort to dominate the political conversation via
flooding the idea market to see what floats and what doesn’t catch on with
the voting public.

An omnibus plan like the “Green New Deal” is a bit like a smorgasbord. where
you can either try a little bit of everything or just stick with the meat and potatoes
with a bit of dessert at the end.

It does no good to name-call the proponents of such lofty ideas… they wear such
epithets as badges of courage, proudly considering them as battle scars.

If you successfully pick apart one part of the “Deal” they’ll simply move on to
another aspect of the plan and you get to play the game again. Meanwhile they
lambaste you for being obstructionists or worse.

The “Deal” is an opening move in power politics.

As the Queen recommended to the pro/con Brexit folks, be polite.

markl
February 7, 2019 5:29 pm

She won’t get a second term. The Democrats won’t allow it and anyone who thinks they can’t stop her is naive. She’s already recognized as a loose canon and along with the other radical house members recently elected ….. all on platforms of Socialism and minority appeasement …. people are taking notice of the beast that’s been created. That beast only plays in big cities and universities where the majority, but not all, are disconnected from reality in the USA. Successful minorities, and there are many more than unsuccessful, don’t want the American status quo upset because they worked for it and it works for them. Yes my glass is half full.

Sweet Old Bob
Reply to  markl
February 7, 2019 5:35 pm

Nah ….it’s just twice as big as it should be …
8>))

KetilM
February 7, 2019 5:30 pm

Thomas Sowell said: “Activism is a way for useless people to feel important, even if the consequences of their activism are counterproductive for those they claim to be helping and damaging to the fabric of society as a whole.”

Ve2
February 7, 2019 5:36 pm

There is only one type of person who could come up with this idea.
First part of the word rhymes with duck, the second part is wit.

WR2
February 7, 2019 5:37 pm

Let’s just be thankful that their entire green wet dream would require tearing up the entire constitution, so it has no chance of actually happening. More likely it will just result in middle america moving more towards the GOP in the next election, while the liberal echo chamber on the coasts whip themselves into a frenzy.

The only real risks I see are 1) if Trump wins reelection, the Calexit movement may very well proceed in earnest, with the end being either mass arrests for treason or outright civil war, and 2) if the libs win, their only chance to implement any of this nonsense is to proceed with their “stack the court” strategy, which could also lead to civil war.

Retired_Engineer_Jim
Reply to  WR2
February 7, 2019 9:54 pm

And having California exit would be bad because? (Note, I live in SoCal.)

Menicholas
Reply to  WR2
February 8, 2019 7:09 am

When Trump wins re-election.
There, fixed it for you.
As for the rest of that, CA is not going anywhere.
They need us more than we need them.

Joel O'Bryan
February 7, 2019 5:40 pm

Sen. Ed Markey (D-MA) is that special kind of stupid that keeps on giving to Republicans across the Nation. Joined now with his fellow traveler AO-C. One could add their two IQs together and still not break a 100.

GUILLERMO SUAREZ
February 7, 2019 5:41 pm

Snarky Malarky and Coco Loco Cortez – Chief editor and publisher of “The Deranged Donkey” . When the world is gonna end in 10 , sanity is not an option, and you’re planning on running in 12, what do you have to lose ?

Al miller
February 7, 2019 5:42 pm

And should this madness come to pass, thus will begin the next civil war!

CD
February 7, 2019 5:45 pm

What is the difference between a government job for those unwilling to work and forced labor camps?

Ed Quaintance
February 7, 2019 6:10 pm

Eerily similar cut-and-paste of the 2015 “Leap Manifesto,” … authored by a who’s who of Canadian “eco-socialists” and leftists, such as Naomi Klein … environmentalist David Suzuki … and 350.org … Bill McKibben.”

https://www.foxnews.com/opinion/alexandria-ocasio-cortezs-green-new-deal-is-actually-an-old-socialist-plan-from-canada

Sommer
Reply to  Ed Quaintance
February 8, 2019 3:43 pm

“Given Ocasio-Cortez’s direct connections to former members of McKibben’s 350.org and the Bernie Sanders presidential campaign, as well as the close similarities between the language of the Green New Deal and the policies proposed by key environmentalists involved with the “Leap Manifesto,” it seems very likely much of the Green New Deal is nothing more than a recycled version of a failed, three-year-old socialist proposal from Canada.”

Dipchip
February 7, 2019 6:16 pm

I have not had time to read the comments and see how many have considered the farmers ability to continue.

Are they going back to horses or use half their farm to produce ethanol? Either way it takes a lot of energy to produce high yield crops.

Tom Abbott
Reply to  Dipchip
February 8, 2019 4:47 am

“Are they going back to horses”

Well, the Green New Deal proposes to do away with cattle because they produce methane gas as part of their biology, and I think that probably applies to horses, too, so we may have to resort to harnessing humans to pull those carts and wagons.

Louis Hunt
February 7, 2019 6:28 pm

The resolution calls for the United States to embark on a 10-year “economic mobilization” with the goal to “achieve net-zero greenhouse gas emissions…”

Let’s say they manage to accomplish their impossible fantasy in ten years. What good will it do? Other countries will not be stupid enough or able to afford to do the same thing. So if 4.4% of the world’s population living on 6% of the world’s land are able to achieve net-zero greenhouse gas emissions, it won’t put a dent in the worldwide emission rate. The fossil fuels we don’t use will be scooped up by other countries at a discount rate. China and India alone will increase their emissions by more than what we currently emit in short order. That means we will spend trillions to accomplish nothing except to destroy our economy and make us ripe for takeover by our enemies.

michel
Reply to  Louis Hunt
February 7, 2019 7:18 pm

Yes. This is really not about taking action on global warming. The universal demand among the climate activists is that the US shall take hugely expensive actions which will obviously, on the most basic analysis, neither lower US emissions materially nor affect global emissions at all.

What you notice is that there is never any explanation of what the effect of the proposed measures will be.

This is a cultural crisis, not a climate crisis. There may or may not be a global climate crisis, but the US cultural crisis is the widespread mania for doing things which, if the alarmed are correct, is a totally ineffective response to it.

The US, and not just the US, but the US to a greater extent than any other nation, has spent the last 50 years teaching its entire population of college students that reality is whatever you think it is. The products of the Left Bank nonsense factory dominate liberal arts faculties, and AOC as a typical product of the culture has no idea how even to think connectedly.

And so it seems reasonable to her to propose eliminating US fossil fuel use in ten years, and it doesn’t occur to her or her supporters that you might need any kind of plan to show the stages of how that would be brought about and what the country would look like. And it also seems reasonable to her to do this in the name of solving the climate crisis, without it being at all necessary to specify what quantitative effects the action, even were it sucessful in itself, could have on the climate crisis.

The current American cultural revolution began sometime in the sixties. It continued to gather momentum through the early decades of the present century. We are now approaching Thermidor, and the reaction will begin. Trump is only a precursor of it. When it comes with full force it will be unmistakable, very far reaching, and dramatic.

After Thermidor comes some form of authoritarian rule focussed on completely different matters from those which dominated the revolution. They vanish from view, they simply become irrelevant, no-one thinks about them any more. And a while after that, we have the Restoration.

M E
February 7, 2019 6:38 pm

Rebuilding or upgrading all buildings in the United States would require a lot of seasoned timber as it is the typical framing material. and it would need to move by rail and truck so the building will need a lot of time to be completed.. Global Warming will be upon us by then according to the received opinion.

As to to the builders, these days they need to be qualified and they use electrical tools !
Where do all the builders come from if they cannot travel by air? By ship? At present many professional building technicians travel around the world to scenes of disasters. They won’t go where they need hammers and handsaws.
Jobless youths can be trained if they have the aptitude but that takes time and where are the instructors to come from?

Michael Jankowski
Reply to  M E
February 8, 2019 12:25 pm

Imagine the wasted energy and resources involved in these rebuilds/upgrades.

It is usually pretty wasteful to demo something long before its useful lifetime is approaching.

Caligula Jones
February 7, 2019 6:46 pm

I have tremendous respect for bartenders. I’ve known some great ones. The one at my local is near perfect.

I would never vote for him to be anything other than a bartender, though.

I mean, we elected our AOC as Prime Minister up here in Canada so we can’t really brag about getting things right, but still…

Joel O'Bryan
February 7, 2019 6:57 pm

In 2016, avowed Socialist Bernie Sanders, running as Democrat for the Presidential nomination, committed the cardinal sin among Democrats for his health-care and welfare proposals. Bernie clearly articulated that his proposals would need at least $10 Trillion in new taxes in the first 10 years, with a heavy tax rate on the wealthy, a key Democrat constituency in New York and California donors. Democrats aren’t supposed to talk about how much their policies would cost in the out years, especially in new taxes. Bernie broke that rule.

I frequently compare the alarmist rhetoric of climate change to a Trojan Horse agenda. A facade to scare people with socialism and power for the Democrats as its real purpose.

Today in 2019, we can thank Ms AO-C finally, openly exposing the Democrats’ climate change agenda. She finally removed the Green Curtain facade and exposed what is really inside the Climate Change facade — Socialism.
And then told us how much money (which is low-ball estimate for sure) and it would need in new taxes, hammering the rich but of course recognizing the Middle Class would get hit hard too.

The end of the Climate Scam is now at hand as the Socialism that powers it has been laid bear for all Americans to see. And Trump ambushed them at the SOTU address with his declaration against Socialism.
Green socialists in the US don’t realize it, but they are mortally wounded now and bleeding out.

David Hoopman
February 7, 2019 7:00 pm

People both for and against this “Green New Deal” concept are calling it socialism but if you read the actual text of the congressional resolution rolled out earlier today, you could be forgiven for seeing it as something else.

All the language about harnessing the entire populace to a glorious “national mobilization” and government directing every aspect of the economy to advance that unified national purpose is very strongly suggestive of fascism, a term that would undoubtedly set AOC’s hair on fire.

Nevertheless, it wouldn’t be entirely unbelievable to find she doesn’t actually grasp what she’s advocating.

Joel O'Bryan
Reply to  David Hoopman
February 7, 2019 7:08 pm

The Wall Street Journal Op-Ed today noted about the Green New Deal’s ,
“…as imagined by Rep. Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez, all of this would be planned by a Select Committee For a Green New Deal. Soviet five-year plans were more modest. ”

If they were still around, Soviet 5 year planners would blush with envy at what a US Senator and Congressperson seems to think is a good idea.

Ms AO-C’s and Mr Markey’s proposal is simply full-on Communism. No doubt about that.

Warren
February 7, 2019 7:00 pm

Civil-war will come (eventually) because the ‘green billionaires’ are paying for the NGD.
They’re not stupid; they’re successful investors.
A brief civil war will occur when California first declares secession to fight climate change.
It’s all planned.
The Feds will try to remove Cal Gov and that will set many battle lines.
Other States will secede in solidarity and to fight (the immediate existential threat of climate change).
They’ll ban fossil fuels and many non-socialist activities.
Opposing groups within subject States will become hostile and small running street battles will occur.
War is good for the military complex.
The Feds will attempt to crack-down on State secession.
The military will become divided (it’s already infested with climate socialist).
Fundamentalism and fanaticism on both sides will grow furiously.
The media and academia (controlled by the billionaires) will begin pumping our propaganda for the new order.
People who can afford to leave will flee to safe countries (like Australia; forget Canada).
States that reject the NGD will have low cost electricity so many energy intensive manufacturers will move operations there.
RED states will become very RED and there’ll be a concentration of right-leaning businesses and people in the low-cost energy States.
Now the ‘forts’ and battle grounds are known.
Cal will be the first to attack with a missile strike on an oil refinery in the RED State that most threatens them because of inaction (on catastrophic climate change).
The Feds will retaliate with a ground strike to seize control of the Cal ‘media’ and ‘politicians’ in their homes.
Socialist US Army and Navy Generals in Cal will meet to plan retaliation . . .

Myrt
February 7, 2019 7:01 pm

The Arlington Heights byline sure takes me back.
I grew up in Rolling Meadows in the 60s.

Gandhi
February 7, 2019 7:09 pm

Ocrazio-Cortez’s plan almost makes one wonder if a conservative think tank “punked” her with an “Onion” style green energy plan as a practical joke. She certainly is making a name for herself – and it’s not a good one.

Smart Rock
February 7, 2019 7:11 pm

The “plan” is (not surprisingly) a bit short on details about exactly how the aims are to be achieved. It’s not significantly different from the plan proposed by Naomi Klein for Canada last year (does anyone even remember that one?). The lack of budget numbers is striking.

The 70 percent tax rate on incomes over $10 million seems pretty tame though.

In the 1950s, when American power, prestige and prosperity were at their zenith, the marginal income tax rate was 91 percent. That rate applied to income over $200,000 (about $1.9 million in today’s money)

The 72% rate kicked in at an income of $44,000 (about $400,000 today)

Life went on, as far as I can tell.

In the UK, the marginal income tax rate at the top end was 95 percent (“If 5 percent should seem too small, be grateful I don’t take it all”)

Tom Halla
Reply to  Smart Rock
February 7, 2019 7:28 pm

The nominal tax rates in the 1950’s were strictly that, nominal. There were enough write-offs and deductions the real world tax rate was not much higher than currently, unless one had utterly incompetent tax accountants and lawyers.

cerescokid
Reply to  Smart Rock
February 8, 2019 12:25 am

Yes, in the late 40s, all the 50s and until 1964, the top marginal rate was 91%. There were only 640 tax filers who paid that in 1954, as an example, and only 201 who had Adjusted Gross Income over $1 Million. But here is the important thing, forgotten by most, and the most important thing, the Effective Rate, that is the percent of Gross Income actually paid in taxes by those in the Top 1% of income earners was only 32-34% for most of those years. In some of those years the top 1% paid an Effective Rate as low as 30%. Today the Effective Tax Rate for the top 1% is 27%.
There is a myth that there was massive income redistribution during those high top marginal rates. Yes, the top paid higher Effective Rates, but there were so few paying those rates, as a percentage of taxes paid, it was chump change. As an example in 1954, again, the millionaires paid less than 0.3% of total taxes paid.
Also, keep in mind that in constant dollars median family income in the early 1950s was 1/3 what it is today.
I have no problem with the very wealthy paying a higher Effective Tax Rate. But don’t expect there to be a huge windfall. If taxes for those earning over $10 Million were to double that would generate only $120 Billion. We spend $4.4 Trillion a year, with $3 Trillion spent on Social Programs. Our deficit is going to be $800-900 Billion this year and growing.
None of these economic illiterates ever talk about reducing the deficit or acknowledge in FY 2020 the Debt Service cost to the budget will be $426 Billion . Adding taxes to the rich generates just so much and unknown is how much it might hurt investments and economic growth.
The biggest threat to this country is not AGW. It is lack of growth in our income. Between 1945 and 2000, Real Growth in Income averaged 3.3% per year. Since 2000, it has averaged 1%. If Real Growth in Income had averaged 1% from 1945 to now, our Median Household Income would be $20,000 rather than $61,000 that it is.
Let’s see how many wonderful, pie in the sky Programs we can afford in 50 years if we continue with only 1% Real Growth in our Income.
AOC and her fellow travelers have to come back to a simple calculation. Out total Gross Income is $10.2 Trillion. It is growing in Real terms only 1% per year. The Federal Government spends $4.4 Trillion. State & Local Government spends $2 Trillion. Her earlier proposal of Freebies for All added another $4 Trillion per year. And now the Green New Deal of untold costs. With the Government Spending so much…..
Who will have any money for a McDonalds?

MarkW
Reply to  cerescokid
February 8, 2019 7:55 am

The problem with having high marginal rates for the wealthy is that the wealthy aren’t stupid.
They are going to hire accountants and lawyers whose job it will be to minimize the total taxes paid.
The result is lots of money going to investments that minimize the tax hit, rather than investments that maximize the economic benefit.

If you like hindering the economy is such a fashion, that’s good. As for me, when given the choice of a good paying job, or socking it to some rich guy, I choose the good paying job.

MarkW
Reply to  Smart Rock
February 8, 2019 7:52 am

Something happened prior to the 50’s that made it possible for the US to dominate the rest of the world economically.
Perhaps you’ve heard of it. The history books usually call it WWII. As a result of this war most of Europe and Japan were flattened. Not a working factory to be found.
The consumers in these countries wanted stuff, and the rebuilding factories needed stuff. The only place to go for this stuff was the US. (There were a few other places, such as Argentina that could supply stuff, but their factories weren’t capable of churning out the volumes needed.)

This is why the US economy was able to withstand those high tax rates.
If you want to bring back such tax rates, you are going to have to destroy all the factories in the rest of the world first.

February 7, 2019 7:27 pm

A recent quick tally of mineral resources (hypothetically) needed to build wind turbines to supply all electrical power here in Washington State shows it won’t happen–no enviro would allow it. Our state has lots of hydropower but our president-wanna-be global-warming-pretender-expert governor wants to end that too along with coal that’s now outlawed along with his tame renewable portfolio standards that will increase power costs at least seven-fold if not kill thousands in 20 years. Madness for sure but the right coast cannot monopolize the smarties deficit. To build wind turbines to supply all electric power for 9.7 million residents in Washington State (not DC) would for most minerals extracted far, far exceed one year’s US-wide production in 2018 of mineral resources needed. I assumed 1000 kwhrs/mo per household. I have a chart and Excel but cannot figure how to upload it, so here’s the “quick stats”, in order by commodity of 1,000s of tons produced in US annually and 1,000s of tons needed for Washington State’s wind turbines (data from varied sources mostly 2018 USGS Mineral Commodity Summaries):….
Neodymium & dysprosium rare earths for magnets: 0 produced–674 needed;
molybdenum for steel: 45 produced–8,606 needed;
oil to make fiberglas: 603,670 produced–17,603 needed;
silica sand for fiberglas: 55,115 produced–28,752 needed;
cement for concrete: 94,688 produced–128,946 needed;
limestone for steel and fiberglas (cement need not included): 733,030 produced–227,473 needed
steel: 90,389 produced–430,302 needed;
coal for elec. generation, cement making, coke for steel making: 761,689 produced–438,879 needed;
sand, gravel for aggregate: 981,047 produced–650,524 needed;
iron ore for steel: 51,036 produced–860,604 needed;
soil excavated: 2,390,565,333….larger than any mine on earth
Of course this does not include transportation, construction, mining, electric power, copper, transmission and whatever else. The area needed at 100 acres/turbine, 26% operating efficiency, using 1% siting efficiency (avoiding impact of grizzly bear, wolf, spotted frog, yellow carp, blue gopher, busy bee habitats….), producing 0.91 watts/sq m for 1.44 million turbines at 226,000 sq miles is an area 320% larger area than the total area of the state.

CD in Wisconsin
February 7, 2019 7:33 pm

Cong. AOC has me reminding myself that I have (for a while now) subscribed to the philosophy that far-left and far-right ideologies need to be inherently totalitarian in order to really work. There of course has been some evidence of this from history, and evidence still exists today in numerous countries.

If Cong. AOC decides to run for President in 2028 or later (when she will be of age) but does not get the Democratic Party nomination, I suggest there are alternative party nominations that she could consider and pursue:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Workers_World_Party
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Communist_Party_USA
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Socialist_Party_USA

The last one above claims to be democratic socialist, so it might be particularly appealing.

It disconcerting for my generation (the post-WWII baby boomers) and our parents (the generation that fought WWII — God bless them) to have lived through the Cold War on one hand and now see the rise of far-left politics on the other. AOC and the millennials, having not experienced the Cold War first hand, might not have a really good grasp of what it was all about. As the saying goes, we don’t always know what a good thing we have until we’ve lost it. AOC and the millennials seem to take too much for granted these days.

The Soviet Union and its East European satellites never were able to match (much less exceed) the economic prosperity of the West. Those of us who lived through the Cold War should know that. AOC and the millennials do not seem to. Yes, there are problems that are inherent in a free market economic system. But using the power of govt to wage legislative and ideological war on it isn’t the answer. Other than charities and govt social safety nets for the poor and needy, I don’t know what is. No supporters of any economic system should ever claim that their system is perfect.

Here’s hoping that AOC and her far-left socialism is just a passing political fad like the bell-bottom jeans and disco music fads were in the 1970s. The Bee Gees were great.

andy
February 7, 2019 8:03 pm

I thought “socialism”” involved ownership and control of utilities and companies etc by the state. Not just social welfare or redistribution of wealth among citizens. We already have tons of that in western countries.

Tom Abbott
Reply to  andy
February 8, 2019 6:36 am

“I thought “socialism”” involved ownership and control of utilities and companies etc by the state. Not just social welfare or redistribution of wealth among citizens. We already have tons of that in western countries.”

Socialism = Control Freaks

Control Freaks want to control every aspect of other people’s lives. Their undermining of society starts out slow and eventually takes over everything in the society. Venezuela is a good example.

The United States is another good example. The socialists have managed to take over society’s means of mass communication, the News and Entertainment Media, and have taken over the nation’s school system, and almost took control of the U.S. government on a permanent basis under Barack Obama.

Obama almost managed to successfully prevent Trump from being elected by using the power of the government against Trump to put another socialist/ control freak, Hillary Clinton, in Office as his successor. And then Hillary would have continued the unlawful, unconstitutional attacks on the opposition party to prevent them from ever gaining access to the presidency again, in order to keep herself and those she favored in Office in perpetuity. And this particular battle is still ongoing and the outcome is uncertain.

This Obama/Hillary coup attempt might have worked except it appears that Trump must be pure as the driven snow because despite the tremendous efforts expended by these enemies of the people, to get Trump, they can’t find a thing to use against him.

Now the Democrat-led House is ramping up their efforts to undermine a duly elected government by going after Trump’s personal tax records and after his family and associates, which have nothing to do with his presidency. They are desperate to find anything they can use to undermine Trump because he is destroying the socialist agenda, and demonstrating the right way to run the U.S. government. Trump is being successful, despite the blizzard of criticism thrown his way every day, and he is showing that socialism is a dangerous farce, and this is killing the Left.

We have a bunch of leftist control freaks in the U.S. government who are trying to take over our lives and run them for us. We should not allow this to happen. The government works for the People, not the other way around.

MarkW
Reply to  andy
February 8, 2019 7:57 am

andy, how do you think you are going to get the “social welfare” or “redistribution of wealth among citizens”?

GeneDoc
February 7, 2019 8:38 pm

Innumerate Insanity. Such an embarrassment.

H.R.
February 7, 2019 8:46 pm

I say the Republicans should come up with the Dilithium Crystal New Deal as a counter proposal.

T port
February 7, 2019 9:08 pm

To describe her as sophomoric would be too complimentary unless you specify high school sophomore.

Neo
Reply to  T port
February 8, 2019 10:27 am

Some high school sophomores are gonna be really insulted by this

Chris Hanley
February 7, 2019 9:40 pm

Roosevelt’s New Deal had the opposite effect that was intended and prolonged the Depression in the US, was coercive (for instance a tailor was imprisoned for pressing a suit for 35 cents instead of the fixed price of 40 cents), and many of the legislative provisions were ruled unconstitutional.
https://mises.org/library/new-new-deal
Ocasio-Cortez’s Green New Deal is tippy-top insanity and the necessary legislation wouldn’t survive ten minutes in U.S. Supreme Court.

John Endicott
Reply to  Chris Hanley
February 8, 2019 6:12 am

Only so long as we have a majority of Supreme Court justices that actually understand and follow the consisitution. Had Hillary won, that wouldn’t be the case. Thank God for the Justices appointed by President Trump. May he soon get the chance to replace more of the left-wing loons that are still on the court

Chris Hoff
February 7, 2019 11:02 pm

AOC reminds me of what CIA director William Casey said.

“We’ll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false”

I’m becoming convinced that everything in the MSM is 100% scripted and completely fictional. That goes for most of the internet too. In what sane universe can an Alexandria Occasional-Cortex brain become an elected representative, how deep does the rabbit hole get, is it all a joke?

MarkW
Reply to  Chris Hoff
February 8, 2019 7:58 am

Can you document this quote?

John Endicott
Reply to  MarkW
February 8, 2019 11:31 am

Supposedly he said it in a 1981 cabinet meeting. a google search mainly turns up conspiracy type sites, no “legitimate”/Mainstream news sources that I could find. The main source of the quotes (according to one site) traces back to Mae Brussell, the late political researcher and host of the radio show Dialogue: Conspiracy. that site then goes on to point out that “Brussell is not the only person that can be attributed to this sharing quote”. Apparently Barbara Honegger on a post to Quora in response to a meme that used the alleged quote claims to be a witness to Casey saying it and thus the source of the quote:

https://www.quora.com/Did-CIA-Director-William-Casey-really-say-Well-know-our-disinformation-program-is-complete-when-everything-the-American-public-believes-is-false

“I am the source for this quote, which was indeed said by CIA Director William Casey at an early February 1981 meeting of the newly elected President Reagan with his new cabinet secretaries to report to him on what they had learned about their agencies in the first couple of weeks of the administration….I was present at the meeting as Assistant to the chief domestic policy adviser to the President….As he did to all the other secretaries of their departments and agencies, Reagan asked what he saw as his goal as director for the CIA, to which he replied with this quote, which I recorded in my notes of the meeting as he said it. “

John Endicott
Reply to  John Endicott
February 8, 2019 11:38 am

googling Barbara Honegger reveals she’s a bit of a conspiracy nut herself. She’s known as the clock lady, the woman who believes that the clocks all stopped at 9:32 in the Pentagon on 9-11, thereby disproving the government’s claim that the Pentagon was hit at 9:37

John Endicott
Reply to  John Endicott
February 8, 2019 11:49 am

Basically, it looks a lot like Trumps alleged “S-Hole countries” comment in that it’s been alleged to have been said but there’s no recording of him ever saying it, just someone’s word that he said it. But hey, Barbara Honegger a woman so we have to believe her, right?

MarkW
Reply to  John Endicott
February 8, 2019 2:14 pm

And of course will believe anything that confirms what he already wants to believe.

February 7, 2019 11:23 pm

One doesn’t need to be a member of some think tank to understand that this “Green Deal” is sheer madness. I sincerely hope that Americans are not as gullible as this shrill and stupid woman imagines.

And why is it that so many filthy rich people support and finance socialist madness? Ask this question every time they start telling you fairy tales about the socialist land of milk and honey.

Socialism equals death. I’ve seen it. Period.

John Endicott
Reply to  Alexander Feht
February 8, 2019 7:16 am

And why is it that so many filthy rich people support and finance socialist madness?

because they believe they’ll be among the elites that run the show. They don’t expect to be trapped in misery with the masses who will suffer under their mad policies.

Admad
February 8, 2019 12:04 am

Krudd Gillard of the Commondebt of Australia
February 8, 2019 12:25 am

I thank God every day for President Donald J Trump. Without his leadership, they would be making this madness reality.

sonofametman
February 8, 2019 12:43 am

I like this bit:
Economic security for all who are unable or unwilling to work.

People who are unwilling to work get to enjoy economic security ? Eh? What?

Dear GOP.
Please make sure you win in 2020.

griff
February 8, 2019 1:10 am

The new infrastructure and building upgrade projects would create as many, if not more, jobs than are lost.

Fenlander
Reply to  griff
February 8, 2019 1:19 am

I’ve had a sneaking suspicion for a while now that Kym, Percy and griff are paid to post here to make credulous climate warriors look like idiots.

Dipchip
Reply to  griff
February 8, 2019 3:58 am

How do all these people get to their New jobs? How are all the additional building materials produced? How are all the additional building materials transported. Is most of the global warming caused by socialists blowing hot air? Will the hot air they blow produce enough wind energy to accomplish their goal? Is the Green Dream a comedy skit?

John Endicott
Reply to  griff
February 8, 2019 5:21 am

And breaking windows creates more jobs for window makers. It’s called the broken window fallacy

MarkW
Reply to  griff
February 8, 2019 7:59 am

And if we broke every window in town, think of all the work the glaziers will have.

griff, I know that you like to portray your ignorance, but do you have to start so early in the morning?

Tom Halla
Reply to  MarkW
February 8, 2019 8:39 am

If I have the time zones right, Griff is in the UK, which is four hours ahead of the US east coast time.

John Endicott
Reply to  Tom Halla
February 8, 2019 8:51 am

I think it’s usually 5 though Daylight savings time can much that up a bit (the two countries have different start/stop times for daylight savings) Currently 6:10am London time (when Griff posted) is 1 :10am Washington DC/Eastern time. Either way it can be considered early in the morning.

John Endicott
Reply to  John Endicott
February 8, 2019 9:02 am

Correction, I thought forum was displaying local time, but looking at the timestamp on the post I just made it looks like it’s showing California time which has an 8 hour time difference from London, So Griff posted at 9:10am London time (1:10 am Cali/Pacific time) – so not quite as early in the morning as it seemed.

Richard M
Reply to  griff
February 8, 2019 8:15 am

So griff, you’re saying all these new jobs will be a boon to the economy. Please explain how this will be great while just rebuilding only coastal cities in the advent of one or more meter sea level rise would be disastrous????????

griff
February 8, 2019 1:17 am

and here’s an example of just how many jobs you lose with a closing coal plant, plus an example of how it doesn’t impact power generation

https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2019/feb/07/coal-power-station-cottam-to-close-after-half-a-century

MarkW
Reply to  griff
February 8, 2019 8:00 am

It really is sad how little economics reporters and greens know.

Reply to  griff
February 8, 2019 10:35 am

Aha, and money grows on trees.

Paul Penrose
Reply to  griff
February 8, 2019 11:25 am

Idiot. The system has a certain amount of resiliency built into it so that the loss of one generating station doesn’t have a noticeable effect. Try closing a few more right on the heels of that one and see how that works out.

MarkW
Reply to  Paul Penrose
February 8, 2019 2:15 pm

I shot him once. He didn’t die.
I just proved you can’t kill someone by shooting them.

MarkW
Reply to  Paul Penrose
February 8, 2019 2:16 pm

Paul, Over on the Green New Deal article, didn’t you just get finished chastising others for using insults?

Paul Penrose
Reply to  MarkW
February 10, 2019 12:55 pm

No, for using silly schoolyard name calling; for example, making fun of someone’s name, which they have no control over. In this case, griff said something idiotic, and this is not the first time, so I called him/her out on it. At some point, when someone refuses to debate honestly and in good faith, I don’t feel the need to be polite anymore. But to avoid even the appearance of being a hypocrite, I’ll just call him/her a liar from now on.

Rah
February 8, 2019 2:20 am

The socialist Democrats skipped shooting themselves in the foot and went for a head shot. Good shooting.

Flight Level
February 8, 2019 3:17 am

Venezuelan States Of America ???

Think twice “revolucion” obsessed youngsters. No free meal. Example Venezuela where this ideology comes from.

With oil reserves and geographical position, potentially a dream hub for air travel.

However instead of fighting for presence and slots, airlines massively avoid the place and pull out their interests.

Don’t you ask yourselves why an industry where every cent comes at a cost actively avoids tanking on what’s probably the lowest priced fuel planetwide ?

That many financial analysts, route planners, dispatchers, worldwide, got it all wrong and avoid Venezuela because they don’t know where it is ?

Grow up.

Donald Kasper
February 8, 2019 4:01 am

I listen to morons like Cortex for entertainment purposes. As a child I would watch Dark Shadows or Edge of Night for creepy soap opera thrillers or As The World Turns for shenanigans. Now I watch Cortex news.

Donald Kasper
February 8, 2019 4:02 am

Cortex is a Chinese and Russian dream. We should push this crap on them, and watch them implode.

Earl T Hackett
February 8, 2019 6:34 am

I read somewhere that some time ago AOC had strong conservative opinions. This Green New Deal is simply nuts and is a gift to the GOP. Which brings up the thought that AOC might be a Trogan Horse.

Tom in Florida
Reply to  Earl T Hackett
February 8, 2019 6:56 am

Well she may be from Trog.

John Endicott
Reply to  Tom in Florida
February 8, 2019 7:19 am

she certainly believes in TROG (“Total Reliance on Government”) for the masses.

Tom in Florida
Reply to  Earl T Hackett
February 8, 2019 7:32 am

While there is a lot of comedy on this thread, let me share with you a really funny happening back in the 60’s. ABC was televising the UCLA (nickname the Bruins) vs Southern Cal (nickname the Trojans) college football game. They were panning the crowd and someone from the UCLA side was holding a sign that said “Puncture the Trojans”. The image stayed on the screen for quite a while until the director finally realized what it was referring to.

John Endicott
Reply to  Tom in Florida
February 8, 2019 7:59 am

That reminds me of a time back around the time Pac-Man was a popular arcade game. In school we had various shop classes, and in one we were designing and making buttons. This one smart-alec boy designed a button with a Pac-Man and a Cherry with the words “#1 Cherry Popper”. The teacher initially approved the button until one of the girls in the class explained the non-Pac-man meaning of the slogan to him.

Dr. Deanster
Reply to  Earl T Hackett
February 8, 2019 7:59 am

Earl … ya know … I haven’t thought of that. I mean .. AOC is completely over the top, and as mentioned in a recent WSJ article, her bill reads like a parody if the GOP where to define the DNC positions.

Wouldn’t that be a hoot if AOC was a conservative plant, who won the NY district by pretending to be a democrat, just catering to the deranged DNC base with all the free-bee stuff and climate change crap, with the intention of floating an absurd bill that parodied the DNC positions on things for the purpose of getting the message out! Damn .. that would be fricken sweeeeeeet.

Curious George
February 8, 2019 7:16 am

Is she promising a paradise for parasites?

John Endicott
Reply to  Curious George
February 8, 2019 7:23 am

Since she’s promising “Economic security for all who are … unwilling to work” I’d say the answer to your question is an unequivocal yes.

Curious George
Reply to  John Endicott
February 8, 2019 7:42 am

Nancy Pelosi proudly calls it a “safety net”.

James Clarke
February 8, 2019 8:26 am

Green New Deal: ‘This isn’t just radical socialism, this is madness’

Socialism is madness! Radical socialism is stupid insanity.

The United States has been trending towards socialism since FDR, but the concept is the antithesis of the American Dream and the hugely successful American Experiment. It could not be presented openly and honestly to the American people. Instead, it has been introduced slowly and incrementally, using H. L. Mencken’s endless series of imaginary hobgoblins.

While the Green New Deal is being universally condemned on this site, it is being universally praised on many other sites, and defended as plausible in the mainstream. The American people are buying into the Big Lie, and the cycle of human progress is about to turn into its next ‘dark’ phase, if it hasn’t already.

From the Renaissance to the present, the human condition has been steadily improving, but instead of celebration, there is a growing desire to condemn and trash all of our progress for irrational fears and pipe dreams. It is a cancerous thought that has been growing for 100 years, and now infects many of the worlds dominant institutions, political movements and a growing percentage of the population. The resistance is loosing ground and the momentum towards the darkness is getting stronger.

The biggest threat to a free and prosperous people will always be their fear and distrust for their freedom and prosperity.

Robertvd
Reply to  James Clarke
February 8, 2019 9:07 am

Follow the yellow brick road and behind the curtain you will find The (Not) Federal (but private) Reserve. They made government BIG and We The People POOR. Big government will always run out of other people’s money. If you don’t abolish that cancer it will kill the body.
You can’t pay a ‘New Green Deal’ in worthless dollars not even taxing the rich 100%.

MarkW
Reply to  James Clarke
February 8, 2019 9:16 am

It goes back a lot further than FDR. The elites have been wanting to run the rest of the country for their own benefit going all the way back to the founding fathers.

Robertvd
Reply to  MarkW
February 8, 2019 9:39 am

You mean the money changers (not) federal (but private) reserve of the temple elites

Sweet Old Bob
February 8, 2019 8:48 am

For the Green New Deal : Agent Orange Cortez ….

Robertvd
Reply to  Sweet Old Bob
February 8, 2019 9:24 am

The so hated rich 1 % will pay for it. Remember all high ranking democrats belong to this so hated 1 %. Pelosi will love it.

Gordon Dressler
February 8, 2019 9:11 am

For those who don’t want to read the full resolution (available at https://assets.documentcloud.org/documents/5729033/Green-New-Deal-FINAL.pdf ), here is a link to a concise summary of it:
https://assets.documentcloud.org/documents/5729035/Green-New-Deal-FAQ.pdf

For amusement, I will just point out the following from the first response under the summary’s FAQ:
“Yes, we are calling for a full transition off fossil fuels and zero greenhouse gases.
Anyone who has read the resolution sees that we spell this out through a plan that
calls for eliminating greenhouse gas emissions from every sector of the economy.
Simply banning fossil fuels immediately won’t build the new economy to replace it –
this is the plan to build that new economy and spells out how to do it technically. We
do this through a huge mobilization to create the renewable energy economy as fast
as possible. We set a goal to get to net-zero, rather than zero emissions, in 10 years
because we aren’t sure that we’ll be able to fully get rid of farting cows and
airplanes that fast, . . .”
(yes, that is a verbatim quote . . . can you believe it???)

Yeah, it will be tough to build highways across the world’s oceans within the next 10 years. I will leave it others to address that most critical issue (on the same level of eliminating airplanes) of eliminating farting cows.

Rhys Jaggar
February 8, 2019 9:19 am

I am afraid all those statements in the article are assertions, not evidence evaluation.

Let us look at a few possibilities:

1. Universal health coverage.

No American wishing not to be called a psychopathic and pathological liar can refute voluminous evidence that universal healthcare programmes in Western Europe consume less of GDP than Americans spent using their primitive HMO system. You lot sacrifice the basics for 50 million people so the top 5-10 million can have perfection. Simple economics says that if you spend less of GDP on health through universal coverage and single bulk purchaser drug cost savings, you Americans will have more money to spend on other things. Shameful….

You can rant, scream and squeal all you like. Go look at European systems and how much cheaper they are. The rich can top themselves up, they already do anyway.

2. You can rant and rave about energy, but if you build houses properly, domesticq energy usage can be markedly reduced. Modern glassware is a better insulator than masonry and the best glassware can now generate electricity. Commercial skyscrapers can become power stations. The technology exists and will improve. Designing houses to be energy neutral is well established in Europe. It may require different approaches in some parts of US, but costs of home energy can be radically reduced. More healthy homes means lower health bills. Healthier infants. More happiness, which all you Americans are told to pursue.

Healthy homes are the bulwark of healthy societies. Each state has different climate, so may need different approaches. But making the most important place in society healthy, warm and hospitable should be priority one for every sane society.

Those two I would say are achievable in ten years. The building sector and health cover. It is a good start.

Removing oil from private auto transportation I reckon may take considerably longer. The challenge is the electricity generation issue. Replacing every gas station with rapid rechargers capable of keeping 200 million vehicles on the road will not happen quickly. To me, a reasonable ten year goal would be creating recharge technology capable of national scaling. I do not see it being possible to replace petrol cars in ten years. People will not tolerate willy nilly installations failing regularly. They will expect seamless transitions, like landlines to mobile phones. Capital investment ceilings for extra electricity generation suggest it will take a few decades.

Similar arguments with airlines. Safety requirements suggest very conservative approaches to new technology introduction and people will not stop flying to kiss AOC’s ass. I would be very surprised to see elimination of oil from airlines before 2050, maybe not before 2100.

Public transportation using renewables allows for more discrete roll out. Pilot projects can occur, be rigorously tested and then scaled when operating issues are ironed out. Within ten years, several flagship projects could be in pilot phase testing. Rapid airport-city centre shuttles. High speed rail routes. Electric greyhound buses being trialled on discrete routes. Local bus and tram services using electric. Commuter railways.

You might roll out three dozen projects by 2030, with widespread uptake by 2050.

There are energy implications to work out. But they are not insurmountable.

The guaranteed wages, holidays and pensions is nothing to do with being Green. That is pure socialism which can occur in any generation, green technology or coal. It is domestic economics, not energy policy. And as democrats are not in power, I would suggest they need a Democratic President to get such proposals onto the statute books.

Constructive argument rather than insults is probably the way to engage in arguments.

Oil will run out one day, so the arguments about replacement are more to do with timing than necessity…

I hope this froth is not all about demanding to steal all the Venezuelan oil…..

Robertvd
Reply to  Rhys Jaggar
February 8, 2019 9:34 am

I would like to remind you that the US is a bankrupt nation and that a worthless fiat currency can’t do miracles.

Reply to  Rhys Jaggar
February 8, 2019 11:04 am

1. Is this why rich Europeans and Candians flock to the USA for their health care?

2. Anything built by the government order fails and falls. Leave it to the capitalist building industry to define the demand, and to satisfy in the way that customers prefer.

Tom Abbott
Reply to  Alexander Feht
February 8, 2019 3:50 pm

I heard on the radio today (Hannity) about a Canadian who had exhausted his medical options in Canada and has decided to travel to the U.S. to get the medical care he needs. He’s not traveling because of costs, but because of lack of availability for what he needs.

Perhaps the U.S. does spend more money on health care than European countries but a lot of that has to do with the implementation of Obamacare which drastically increased health care costs.

A free market health care plan like Trump is going to implement will be much cheaper and much more available than what we have now or what the Europeans have now.

Paul Penrose
Reply to  Rhys Jaggar
February 8, 2019 11:35 am

That which the government funds, it controls. I don’t want government bureaucrats deciding what kind of health care I can have or deserve. In the US, if I need/want an MRI, I can get one in a few days. In countries with “free” medicine, the wait is week or months, if ever. They can simply deny you if they don’t think it’s required. And it’s not usually doctors that are making these decisions. I recently had to have