From the UNIVERSITY OF CALIFORNIA – LOS ANGELES and the “flux capacitor” department.
Hydrogen cars for the masses one step closer to reality, thanks to UCLA invention
2-in-1 device also uses supercapacitor to store energy that could power computers and smartphones
UCLA researchers have designed a device that can use solar energy to inexpensively and efficiently create and store energy, which could be used to power electronic devices, and to create hydrogen fuel for eco-friendly cars.
The device could make hydrogen cars affordable for many more consumers because it produces hydrogen using nickel, iron and cobalt — elements that are much more abundant and less expensive than the platinum and other precious metals that are currently used to produce hydrogen fuel.
“Hydrogen is a great fuel for vehicles: It is the cleanest fuel known, it’s cheap and it puts no pollutants into the air — just water,” said Richard Kaner, the study’s senior author and a UCLA distinguished professor of chemistry and biochemistry, and of materials science and engineering. “And this could dramatically lower the cost of hydrogen cars.”
The technology, described in a paper in the journal Energy Storage Materials, could be especially useful in rural areas, or to military units serving in remote locations.
“People need fuel to run their vehicles and electricity to run their devices,” Kaner said. “Now you can make both electricity and fuel with a single device.”
It could also be part of a solution for large cities that need ways to store surplus electricity from their electrical grids.
“If you could convert electricity to hydrogen, you could store it indefinitely,” said Kaner, who also is a member of UCLA’s California NanoSystems Institute.
Traditional hydrogen fuel cells and supercapacitors have two electrodes: one positive and one negative. The device developed at UCLA has a third electrode that acts as both a supercapacitor, which stores energy, and as a device for splitting water into hydrogen and oxygen, a process called water electrolysis. All three electrodes connect to a single solar cell that serves as the device’s power source, and the electrical energy harvested by the solar cell can be stored in one of two ways: electrochemically in the supercapacitor or chemically as hydrogen.
The device also is a step forward because it produces hydrogen fuel in an environmentally friendly way. Currently, about 95 percent of hydrogen production worldwide comes from converting fossil fuels such as natural gas into hydrogen — a process that releases large quantities of carbon dioxide into the air, said Maher El-Kady, a UCLA postdoctoral researcher and a co-author of the research.
“Hydrogen energy is not ‘green’ unless it is produced from renewable sources,” El-Kady said. He added that using solar cells and abundantly available elements to split water into hydrogen and oxygen has enormous potential for reducing the cost of hydrogen production and that the approach could eventually replace the current method, which relies on fossil fuels.
Combining a supercapacitor and the water-splitting technology into a single unit, Kaner said, is an advance similar to the first time a phone, web browser and camera were combined on a smartphone. The new technology may eventually lead to new applications that even the researchers haven’t considered yet, Kaner said.
The researchers designed the electrodes at the nanoscale — thousands of times thinner than the thickness of a human hair — to ensure the greatest surface area would be exposed to water, which increases the amount of hydrogen the device can produce and also stores more charge in the supercapacitor. Although the device the researchers made would fit in the palm of your hand, Kaner said it would be possible to make larger versions because the components are inexpensive.
“For hydrogen cars to be widely used, there remains a need for a technology that safely stores large quantities of hydrogen at normal pressure and temperature, instead of the pressurized cylinders that are currently in use,” said Mir Mousavi, a co-author of the paper and a professor of chemistry at Iran’s Tarbiat Modares University.
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So how are the authorities going to cope with terrorism when anyone can access a large amount of powerful explosive from any car parked on the side of the road?
From that perspective, today’s gasoline-fueled vehicles are much more of a threat.
D. J., you may have been watching too many movies. It is rather difficult to get gasoline to explode, despite all the special effects in innumerable movies.
@Tom Halla
I am well aware of the difference between real life and Hollywood Physics. Bruce was talking about “access”, not directly blowing up a hydrogen laden vehicle. The tricky bit with gasoline would be aerosolizing it properly before igniting it. On a really big scale, that’s how the various BLU-XX and CBU-XX series weapons work. Also H2 would require generating the proper fuel/air mixture as well. Tragic as the Hindenburg disaster was, there was no explosion. The H2 basically burned from the outside in.
the ” proper fuel/air mixture ” for hydrogen is from ~5% hydrogen to ~95% hydrogen.
@paqyfelyc
Imagine a sphere of pure hydrogen with radius “r” surrounded by air at STP, encased in a “magic membrane”. Ignoring buoyancy effects, imagine the membrane disappears at t=0. The gas immediately begins to diffuse into the surrounding air. From “r” to “r+Δr” the concentration varies from 100% to 0%, ignoring also for the moment that diffusion is a two-way street. At a distance “d” from “r” we have an ignition source. As soon as the spherical shell element “r+Δr” expands to the point where the gas concentration is greater than 5% the mixture will ignite, burning all the way back along the radius until the concentration is 95%. If diffusion is fast enough, the gas will keep burning inward until all the fuel is exhausted. What will not happen is the flame front racing into the center of the H2 sphere where the concentration is 100%.
@paqyfelyc
by the way, the upper and lower limits for hydrogen are actually 4% and 75%, and gasoline 1.2% and 7.1%, respectively.
https://www.mathesongas.com/pdfs/products/Lower-(LEL)-&-Upper-(UEL)-Explosive-Limits-.pdf
H2 is not green that comes from fossil fuels because it releases CO2, and as everyone knows, it greens the planet and doubles crop harvests and the endothermic photosynthesis reaction has a cooling effect (by definition). You won’t read about this cooling effect from alarumists, even though the process is not in dispute..
Here’s a commercial electrolysis hydrogen production unit. It doesn’t care if the electricity comes from the grid or from solar cells.
http://www.teledynees.com/our-products/hydrogen-oxygen-generation-systems/titan-el
You put in water and electricity and get hydrogen and oxygen, and efficiency approaches 100% so what is it the UCLA researchers have discovered?
That showed high H2 purity, not efficiency. The energy input is much greater than H2/O2 reaction output.
Fuel cells need high purity hydrogen, or they need frequent purging to prevent the buildup of other gasses, some that may destroy the surface catalyst. For example, the Space Shuttle fuel cells had a separate grade of hydrogen than the H2 tank feeding the main engines. As for efficiency, yeah, I was looking at cells optimized for low cost. Mea Culpa.
“You put in water and electricity and get hydrogen and oxygen, and efficiency approaches 100%”
Can you provide the link to that efficiency claim? IIRC they’re closer to 50%-70%?
Here’s a paper that shows up to 90% efficiency, but the current density is low, so not appropriate for an energy-dense application such as automotive.
http://pemfc.princeton.edu/Documents/Publications/PowerPerf_2006.pdf
“Here’s a paper that shows up to 90% efficiency…”
Thanks Dan, but could you point out that statement to me, it appears that paper is about fuel cells, not electrolysis.
High efficiency electrolyses has an energetic yield of around 80% if one uses “active” electrodes (which erode away over time…). Fuel cells are at 50% yield, thus the overall yield of PGP (power to gas to power) is about 40%.
NiMH batteries have a power to power yield of over 90%.
Seems to me that better batteries will win the battle over time…
At the power plant only us engineers using experience and hydrogen sniffers were allowed to do the gassing up or down of the generators (operators were of course allowed to keep the hydrogen maintained in the generators). Now does anybody think hydrogen is going to be a casual fuel for millions & millions of vehicles & inexperienced/untrained people?
cant wait to see what happens when someone drives away from the hydrogen fueling station with the hose still attached! or they leave the cap off! or the fueling nozzle doesn’t seal perfectly! with gasoline, all you need to clean up a spill is a small amount of kitty litter, a broom, a shovel and a small metal trash can….hydrogen, no, not quite so simple.
Dissipates on it’s own.
As did the Hindenburg.
I keep thinking about the fuss that was made about the Ford Pinto and the gas tank that tended to rupture and explode if the car was rear ended. The Pinto soon went out of production – for good reason. It was NOT necessary to take that particular risk. Now, the same question: Is it necessary to take a similar risk by using hydrogen.
BZ!
Large electric generators are cooled with hydrogen because of several unique physical properties.
As Beng indicated, handling hydrogen is not something you want to get wrong.
Two workers were killed at a coal power plant in Ohio.
Hydrogen is lighter than air and can collect pocket such as a roof overhang.
“Conservation of energy” principles suggest to me that the available energy in the created/stored hydrogen from electrolysis cannot be more than the photovoltaic energy used to hydrolyze it. If that is correct, the available energy is limited to the power that can be produced with solar to drive the hydrolysis, which is not much, at least compared to fossil fuels.
Also, I visited an oil refinery once. My understanding is that hydrogen was a co-product of the refining process (presumably not without some energy loss) and did not require direct consumption of the feedstock per se? But that was a long time ago so my memory may be incorrect.
conservation of energy principles, naw, those don’t matter!….with renewables, its easy. 1 Watt of solar input to “crack” water and get 2 Watts of hydrogen fuel. Abracadabra!! And the suns rays and water are free, so lets get to it. Or you can use free wind!
“Or you can use free wind!”
I have a lot of free wind,….you can use some of mine.
Kerry,
About 95% of all current hydrogen is made from fossil fuels, mainly natural gas. The 5% is the byproduct of chlorine electrolysis. Our neighbors of the Exxon refinery bought part of our hydrogen for their desulphuration plant, as their own production from petroleum cracking was not sufficient.
Thus while not totally “free”, as a byproduct it was sold at low price, or burned at the stack…
Since about a year several hydrogen/fuel cell buses are driving here, taking hydrogen once a day from a chlorine plant in the Antwerp harbor. Advantages: high, continuous accelleration and much less noise…
And therein lies the rub. There can only be so much H2 production from chlor-alkali plants without the excess chlorine/hypochlorite overwhelming the planet. Remember that chlorine was the first “weapon of mass destruction” and bleach is labeled as being poisonous when sold to the public.
This and self driving should really up the efficiency of terrorist… Just add spark…
Did I miss something? Did they give any indication of how MUCH electricity would store how MUCH hydrogen? And how LONG it would take to charge this device so that it could provide a useful length/amount of output?
Thus, so far, it’s another pie in the sky green energy magic smoke.
Some years ago I saw a nice product on sale: a 1 square meter portable solar cell to recharge your car battery. Nice. It needed 120 hours of sunshine to completely charge an empty battery.
Our car is already powered by Hydrogen….,that is, Hydrogen + Carbon + Oxygen. It works well.
Small problem with thermodynamic: Water electrophoresis have maximal yield about 30 per cent. You need produce not only hydrogen, but also oxygen.
Hydrogen explosion:
https://youtu.be/W69thuv4e3o
Phil
I just happen to be an expert in handling hydrogen at both BWRs and PWRs.
On BWRs, hydrogen is produced by intense flux in the reactor core. Since hydrogen is a noncondensable gas, it has to be removed from the condenser. The hydrogen and oxygen are recombined with the heat and water recovered.
With a loss of power, ventilation was not available to purge the hydrogen.
The video is an example of a detonation. Fortunately no serious injuries resulted by workers trying to rig temporary power.
Sorry, I forgot the difference between an explosion and a detonation. Still pretty impressive how it snapped several foot thick reinforced concrete beams and columns as if they were matchsticks.
http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-4r6GsJPtcoU/TfUMmhJk7eI/AAAAAAAAD-I/ZeURICM7U8g/s640/17.jpg
That wasn’t a hydrogen blast. Check out the hydrogen blasts of reactors 1 and 2 (horizontal). I think the proper term for what happened at reactor 3 (the video) is a critical excursion.
No isotopes to confirm that, IIRC. Chernobyl now supposedly was a nuclear explosion- followed by a steam explosion. Theory supported by isotopes.
Oh wait is right. Elon Musk researched super or ultra capacitors early on and dropped them in favor of lithium batteries. He’s had nothing good to say about hydrogen and “fool cells.” But he’s not God, true. Just say’n….
Doesnt more water into the atmosphere add to the greenhouse effect, isnt h20 largest greenhouse gas?
A much more useful thing to do with cheap hydrogen, should it come about, will be to make the conversion of coal (or biomass) into gasoline and diesel fuel more economical. Transportation fuel problem solved. Hydrogen storage problem solved. Oh, and the very minor point of convincing folks that carbon dioxide is not actually a pollutant will come along soon enough too, I expect.
One application for high temperature gas cooled reactors. Not anytime soon.
Elemental oxygen at high concentration is corrosive. If you are going to do large scale electrolysis, you better have a plan for the oxygen.
What an absolute waste of time. 16 moving parts in an electric car, battery technology streaming ahead. Moving back to any form of ice motor vehicle is an absolutely desperate move by a pack of dinosaurs.
Listening to the debate between BEV and HFC is fun. Clueless versus clueless. By bad idea is better than your bad idea.
+100
Nah + 1000 ;-D
Just a couple of problem I can see —
1. Apartment block underground vehicle parking, say 100 vehicles all leaking a little hydrogen might just be a problem.
2. A storage capacitor is NOT a steady voltage device, the larger the load ( the larger the current requirement) the more the voltage droops. Just might be a problem trying to get a fast start from the (electric) motor.
So we have a device that can, cheaply and with minor environmental impact, produce Hydrogen. So to power our cars, all we have to do is build out an entire distribution infrastructure, placing the hydrogen as close as a gas station to the cars, always keeping in mind that Hydrogen is explosive and a safe storage solution is needed.. Trenches, pipelines, tanks, transfer devices all over the place. OR, we could put a bunch of these devices at a power plant, make the Hydrogen there on the fly, burn it to produce the electricity, and use the already existing infrastructure to charge the car at your house, no need for lining up at gas stations. Let’s see, whole new explosive, inconvenient infrastructure, existing,relatively safe convenient infrastructure….gosh,I don’t know. The only real question is whether this gadget is both feasible and cost-effective for desalinization.
““Hydrogen is a great fuel for vehicles: It is the cleanest fuel known, it’s cheap and it puts no pollutants into the air — just water,/b.,” ”
Wait… Thought water vapor was a much more potent GHG than CO2?
I’ve yet to hear what would be done with the water that would be the “emissions” from hydrogen-powered vehicles. If this is allowed simply to run onto the streets and highways, they’d constantly be wet, increasing the likelihood of accidents from slippery roads. In northern cities, these surfaces would become vast skating rinks. I’ve heard that one solution would be to equip each vehicle with water recovery tanks which would have to be emptied before it could be re-fueled. If anyone knows of any other solution, I’d be curious to hear of it.
It comes out at elevated temperature so it evaporates. It might condense under very cold conditions, just like that from automobile tailpipes.
You sceptic numpties should wean yourself off your fossil fuels addiction.
The world is changing my friends and you need to change with it. The jobs growth is now in renewables so get used to this FACT … King Coal has had its day and is now on its way out:
http://www.bbc.com/news/av/world-us-canada-42015435/once-homeless-under-a-bridge-now-working-high-up-on-a-roof
Ivan you want me to do what to make your electricity?
From the video, Ivan wants to send poor black people up ladders to make teeny, tiny amounts of power.
As discussed earlier, there is hydrogen hazard with large generators that make huge amounts of power. At a power plant, safety experts like me are responsible for getting things done safely. Different people have different expertise. I would specify precautions necessary for confined spaces with hydrogen from nuclear reactions for example.
If doing my job required climbing, another expert would specify precautions, make sure I am trained, and watch me.
Here is the problem with parking your HFC car in the garage and getting power from your roof, I want to know where your children sleep so I can specify precautions.
When, not if, there is a problem, Ivan will be getting his children killed.
“You sceptic numpties should wean yourself off your fossil fuels addiction.”
Says Ivan who owes his health, his education, his standard of life, his iPhone o whatever he uses to post on here, the health of his loved ones, his access via transport to all of the above, even his toothpaste, the nightlife, cinema ect, to fossil fuels,
Dude you are a parody, stop you are killing me baahahahahaha
Keeping on living in your fantasy world my friend. The sceptics are going the way of the dinosaurs and J am just helping them along…
ivankinsman, the proud witchhunter, I pity you.
when old enough, you’ll look back and think “OMG, that was ME ? What a shame, not even sure my being young is enough an excuse”
LMAO — a link to the BBC….
The best way to store hydrogen is to combine it with carbon into compounds called hydrocarbons which are easy to store and handle at normal pressures and temperatures.
Hydrogen, even liquid hydrogen, is so light that any given volume of it carries very little energy.
One liter of liquid hydrogen contains 71 grams of hydrogen. One liter of gasoline contains 118 grams of hydrogen, and on liter of diesel, 130 grams.
Of course liquid hydrogen costs lots of energy to make, is difficult to store (it will leak out of any container in a matter of days), and is 423 degrees F below zero, so be careful when handling it.
Compressed hydrogen is less dense than liquid, and kaboom.
Climate sceptic numpties are also holding back US industry – is this really their hidden agenda?
By criticising and trashing media reports about vehicles powered on sustainable energy, they are making it that much harder for US vehicle manufacturers to compete on the world stage. Well done guys – let America’s competitors lead the way:
https://mankindsdegradationofplanetearth.com/2017/11/21/china-is-winning-electric-cars-arms-race/
Yeah, Ivan, the pure and noble motives of the greens are so overwhelming we must judge their proposals by those motives, and totally ignore the technical and actual environmental performance in the real world.
“By criticising and trashing dishonest media reports about vehicles powered on sustainable energy, ”
Fixed that for you Ivan.
Hybrid drivers by the many go back to gas cars thereafter.
Most of the claims about fossil fuel powered electric cars are at beset dishonest.
also 75% of global renewable is burning trees and garbage
What an absolute pile of crap 🙂
Some of the stuff you have come up with has me laughing out loud.
Which part is crap?
Renewable global
Solar wind 0.7%
Tide and GeoT 0.8%
Hydro (which you eco muts block at every turn) 2.1%
BURNING TREES AND GARBAGE 9.4%
lol
Gas prices were the biggest driver of Hybrid purchases, as prices fell, so did the numbers of those going back for another Hybrid.
#economics
*as “gas” prices fell
Love your solid argument “IT’S CRAP” 😀
Mind the gap
“Love your solid argument “IT’S CRAP”
With ivan, about all you will get.
the “carp” is in his tiny socialist mind. !
mankindsdegradationofplanetearth
^^ self hating human website 😉
Read it and learn something useful … you still have time to see what is really happening, particularly in terms of the great progress being made to combat AGW!
Read it and learn the opposite of reality more like
Don’t hate your fellow humans Ivan, we are not destroying the planet, the planet is doing just fine.
Combat AGW, a theory that gets invalidated by observations at every turn, and relies solely on model projections 80 years from now
A theory that has led to hundreds of utterly failed predictions.
New York is meant to be almost under water by now, 50 million climate refugees, 1200 sunk pacific islands.
Kinds wont know what snow is, hurricanes will be worse and more, cyclones too.
*New York haivng no issue with SLR
*only 1200 pacific Islands to sink for that prediction to be right
*still waiting on 1st climate refugee
*Hurricanes lol
*cyclones lol.
Observations burst your bubble at every turn, but to carry on
just as well snow has ended, there is white stuff outside my window, must be flour, might bake a climate cake.
The article says they designed it…I did not see anywhere that it says they ever built anything.
Models anyone?
Well, except for the fact that it is highly flammable and hard to store.