Richard Lindzen Petition to President Trump: Withdraw from the UN Convention on Climate Change

lindzen

Guest essay by Eric Worrall

Dr. Richard Lindzen has sent a petition to President Trump, asking the President to withdraw the United States from the United Nations Convention on Climate Change.

The petition contains the names of around 300 eminent scientists and other qualified individuals, including physicists, engineers, former Astronauts, meteorologists, immunology specialists, marine biologists, chemists, statisticians, doctors, military weather specialists, geologists, accountants, a former director of NASA, economists, soil specialists, mathematicians, hydrologists, environmental scientists, computer modelling specialists, and many more. It is a long list.

Let us hope that President Trump acts quickly on Dr. Lindzen’s request.

If anyone you know claims the climate debate is over, show them a copy of Dr. Lindzen’s petition.

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311 thoughts on “Richard Lindzen Petition to President Trump: Withdraw from the UN Convention on Climate Change

    • Hardly dogs.
      Think of it as the skeptic iceberg coming out of the waters as proverbial [political] salinity levels go up, showing for all to see that the 97% “consensus” so cherished by the alarmist establishment is no more than a mirage generated by an ice free Arctic… :-)

      • I am confident that President Trump will put a break to that bullshit?

        [But you add a question mark to your declaration? .mod]

    • Kenji qualifies as a climate scientist easily. Being a skeptic requires to be human and many other things.

    • I was invited to sign, but I figured I’m too much of a lightning rod. My signature would have given them an excuse to attack the whole petition. So instead, I wrote and wished Dr. Lindzen well with his petition.

      w.

      • On the one hand I think you should be on the list as the work you’ve done is serious and follows the scientific method. That said I can see your point and agree with you on it. I hate having split brain on issues.

      • Sorry, but I can’t follow your reasoning, Willis. “Lightning rod”? Can’t that be said, to varying degrees, of all signatories simply because they signed? Isn’t Lindzen himself one? Yes, reactions will be mixed but, on balance, signatures add clout. Yours especially. Above all else, it’s the response of the addressee that matters and I can’t see him heeding mindless attacks just because your name is there. He’s demonstrably too smart for that!

      • Willis

        I think that you made the right decision. Have you seen the recent Hale 2017 paper on the Carbon Cycle. The Abstract looks very interesting, but since I have only seen the Abstract, I have not formed a view on the merits and strength of arguments. Perhaps it is something for you to get your teeth into. I know that many readers of this site (and your site) would be interested.

        See: http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0921818116304787

        PS. I have posted the Abstract in my comment set out at February 25, 2017 at 11:06 pm

      • Willis, keep up the good work.
        Yet another paper that seriously questions the validity of IPCC assumptions around CO2 has been published here:
        http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0921818116304787
        “Scrutinizing the carbon cycle and CO2 residence time in the atmosphere”, by Hermann Harde, 2017.

        Short summary of this paper here:
        http://notrickszone.com/2017/02/25/blockbuster-paper-finds-just-15-of-co2-growth-since-industrialization-is-due-to-human-emissions/#sthash.B7MvJ0Xa.dpbs

        Key conclusions: “The anthropogenic contribution to the actual CO2 concentration is found to be 4.3%, its fraction to the CO2 increase over the Industrial Era is 15% and the average residence time 4 years.”

      • “Lord Monckton signed Willis, he’s also a lightning rod for greens.”

        Monckton lacks the humility to make the right choice. He has a self importance typical of the British aristocracy.

        Congratulations to Willis on making a wise and humble decision. The quality of the signatories is more important than the number and need to be people with classically recognised credentials, not controversial bloggers with no formal training, as Willis correctly recognises.

        Sadly, I find the wording of the petition and letter rather weak though to the point and focusing on UNFCCC is probably the most effect and fastest remedy, as suggested here by the legally competent ‘ristvan’

      • @Greg
        “…the signatories…need to be people with classically recognised credentials…”
        Fair enough. Presumably only those people have been invited to sign. But shouldn’t those credentials be displayed in all cases? Some are not. Roger Bee is the first one.

      • Willis

        Sensible move. You would definitely be a lightning rod.

        Donald Trump appears to have the attention span of a gnat and is very unlikely to read through the list. Therefore, though I understand the purpose of the Alphabetical listing, from the attention span point of view and in order to make the maximum impact, I would have put the 50 most credible people first. Those are likely to be people with classical and relevant degrees or those with first hand experience in working for/running an appropriate and relevant organisation.

        tonyb

      • Thank you Richard Verney and others for citing this paper by Hermann Harde.

        In my 2008 icecap.us paper, I cited two relevant papers by Dr. Jan Veizer et al. There appears to be similarities, based on a quick scan of Harde.
        http://icecap.us/images/uploads/CO2vsTMacRae.pdf

        Veizer, “Celestial Climate Driver: A Perspective from Four Billion Years of the Carbon Cycle”, GeoScience Canada, Volume 32, Number 1, March 2005
        http://www.gac.ca/publications/geoscience/TOC/GACgcV32No1Web.pdf

        Ferguson & Veizer, “Coupling of water and carbon fluxes via the terrestrial biosphere and its significance to the Earth’s climate system”, Journal of Geophysical Research – Atmospheres, Volume 112, 2007
        http://www.agu.org/pubs/crossref/2007/2007JD008431.shtml

        I have long felt that Jan Veizer was “miles ahead of the curve” on this important question.

        The mainstream CAGW debate between the skeptics and warmists is about ECS – is it low or high? Both sides may be wrong, since CO2 lags temperature at all measured time scales.

        This observation suggests that global temperature (among other factors, which could include fossil fuel combustion, deforestation, etc.) drives CO2 much more than CO2 drives temperature.

        Cart before Horse? :-)

        Best, Allan

        Scrutinizing the carbon cycle and CO2 residence time in the atmosphere
        Hermann Harde

        http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0921818116304787

        Highlights

        • An alternative carbon cycle is presented in agreement with the carbon 14 decay.
        • The CO2 uptake rate scales proportional to the CO2 concentration.
        • Temperature dependent natural emission and absorption rates are considered.
        • The average residence time of CO2 in the atmosphere is found to be 4 years.
        • Paleoclimatic CO2 variations and the actual CO2 growth rate are well-reproduced.
        • The anthropogenic fraction of CO2 in the atmosphere is only 4.3%.
        • Human emissions only contribute 15% to the CO2 increase over the Industrial Era.

        Abstract

        Climate scientists presume that the carbon cycle has come out of balance due to the increasing anthropogenic emissions from fossil fuel combustion and land use change. This is made responsible for the rapidly increasing atmospheric CO2 concentrations over recent years, and it is estimated that the removal of the additional emissions from the atmosphere will take a few hundred thousand years. Since this goes along with an increasing greenhouse effect and a further global warming, a better understanding of the carbon cycle is of great importance for all future climate change predictions. We have critically scrutinized this cycle and present an alternative concept, for which the uptake of CO2 by natural sinks scales proportional with the CO2 concentration. In addition, we consider temperature dependent natural emission and absorption rates, by which the paleoclimatic CO2 variations and the actual CO2 growth rate can well be explained. The anthropogenic contribution to the actual CO2 concentration is found to be 4.3%, its fraction to the CO2 increase over the Industrial Era is 15% and the average residence time 4 years.

      • richard verney and Allan M.R. MacRae.

        Prior to about 1945, the natural sources of CO2 were higher than our emissions. CO2 actually increased by more than our total accumulated emissions since 1750 Since 1945 human emissions have been higher than the CO2 rise as the natural sink rate has increased.

        –> 1850 –> CO2 rise to date 6.8 ppm; total accumulated human emissions to that date, 0.61 ppm
        –> 1900 –> CO2 rise 16.1 ppm; total accumulated human emissions, 5.7 ppm
        –> 1945 –> CO2 rise 31 ppm; total human emissions, 26 ppm
        –> 2016 –> CO2 rise 123 ppm; total human emissions, 199 ppm

      • @ Willis, I’ll not second guess your decision.
        I will say that your declaration here may even be better than a signature.

      • @ Greg, Monckton of Brenchley won’t wither under the stones you threw. Those who considered his principled positions and asked for his assistance, did not consider yours, nor extend to you an invitation (nor one to me.)

        @ tonyb, You denigrate a man’s attention span and claim he lacks experience, or the ability to run a large organization and yet, that man has built a successful and lucrative worldwide business organization and with his entry into politics, just displayed the acumen to listen to the advice of a team he selected and proceed in a manner which won him the presidency of the USA.
        You, on the other hand…

      • “Donald Trump appears to have the attention span of a gnat …”

        You appear to be silly, big shot ; )

      • Alan said to me

        ‘You denigrate a man’s attention span and claim he lacks experience, or the ability to run a large organization and yet, that man has built a successful and lucrative worldwide business organization and with his entry into politics, just displayed the acumen to listen to the advice of a team he selected and proceed in a manner which won him the presidency of the USA.
        You, on the other hand…’

        I merely said he had a limited attention span. You completely made up the rest of the words you have attributed to me . Why would you do that? I said nothing of the sort.

        My point was that, as can be seen on twitter he is a mercurial character whose attention flits about. He is very unlikely to read all the way through a petition of this nature-he must get lots of them on various topics. He might flip through the first dozen names though. My point was that it would be best to market the petition better by putting those with the strongest credentials at the top.

        tonyb

      • Bill Illis,

        Not sure what you are saying to me. Looks like the old Mass Balance Argument, with which I am officially agnostic.

        In any case, my following statement, repeated from my above post, allows for a wide interpretation of this issue:

        “This observation suggests that global temperature (among other factors, WHICH COULD INCLUDE FOSSIL FUEL COMBUSTION, DEFORESTATION, ETC.) drives CO2 much more than CO2 drives temperature.”

        I am NOT saying that the increase in CO2 has no manmade component. We just do not know enough about this issue, unless we make certain simplifying assumptions that may or may not be correct.

        The CO2 satellites do not seem to show much of a fossil fuel urban component in high CO2 concentrations. From the satellites, it looks mostly natural.

        Regards, Allan

      • You continue to be a class act. As you have been since I began reading what you have been presenting to the world! Facts should never be lightening rods. The just are!

      • tonyb – I wouldn’t jump to conclusions based on Trump’s tweets. There is method behind what appears to be at times madness. He has consistently attacked the media, and there is a good reason for that. If he is taking on a fight, I’m sure he knows by now fights incur a price and I don’t believe he would fight unless there is more to be gained than lost.

        He is very resilient as he has demonstrated against a wide array of foes, some even in his own party. There is a huge force pushing the status quo many of us rail against. It will take some fighting to free ourselves of the globalistic oligarchy. The pain is worth it!

      • @ tonyb, I stand corrected.
        After seeing the first part of your post, I had scanned quickly through the rest, in disgust. “…with first hand experience in working for/running an appropriate and relevant organisation.” Having now re- read your quote in context, it’s apparent that you weren’t also directing that remark at POTUS.

        I’m the one with limited attention span, especially before the coffeepot has started its work.
        Nevertheless, I agree completely with JohnKnight.

      • “I merely said he had a limited attention span.”

        Whereas you have an unlimited attention span, silly? ; )

      • You’re too modest Willis, your signature would have substantially improved the average level of the signatories qualifications.

      • All,

        That ScienceDirect paper… needs to get into the dust bin as fast as possible. It is a harrasment to the skeptic case as it starts with the same basic error as many times before: it is all based on the residence time of ~5 years, which is how fast any CO2 molecule, whatever the origin, in the atmosphere is exchanged (“swapped”) with exact one CO2 molecule from another reservoir. That doesn’t change the CO2 amount of the atmosphere with one gram.
        That says absolutely nothing about how fast an extra shot CO2, whatever the origin, above the temperature controlled equilibrium is removed from the atmosphere and ends in the oceans or vegetation.
        That needs much more time (~51 years e-fold rate) than simple exchanges…

        It is the same difference as looking at the throughput of a factory (capital and goods turnover) and concluding anything about what the gain or loss will be…

        I am discussing that at Notrickszone

  1. Has this already been sent? His statement that more are signing every day suggests that it hasn’t. If not, some minor editing is needed, starting with the first sentence.

    • It appears that Dr. Lindzen’s letter has been sent, but, that he is informing President Trump that the attached petition is in flux. Trump can, thus, if he chooses, go to the petition and see the latest version which is changing daily.

      So, the letter is correct as written.

      • Janice, read the first sentence out loud. Unlike a lot of petitions, this one has the potential of making serious impact. It should be as polished as possible. : > )

      • Dear Mr. Slayton,

        Please re-read my comment. It addresses only the “signing every day” concern you had. I did not comment on your second concern, editing such things as, “support of your.”

        You have sharp eyes. Good catch.

        Dr. Lindzen should run his drafts by you (and…. then…….. you can let me look over your list of suggestions for Lindzen, (ahem — smiling), just in case…..).

        #(:))

        Sincerely,

        Janice

      • Janice,
        You make me nervous with that Mr. stuff. Takes me back to Fort Dix. Juan sounds better (and anyway civilians outrank majors).

        Regarding the petition, I just wish I were qualified to sign it. I’m afraid linguists would be looked down upon by the 97%. And I hope Willis changes his mind.

      • Dear Juan,

        How nice to hear from you again. :) You, such a loyal, conscientious, well-informed, WUWT supporter, deserve the honor of a “Mr.”. You also deserve to have your wishes respected, thus, Juan it is!

        See you around!

        #(:))

        Your WUWT friend,

        Janice

        P.S. My credentials would be a “weak link,” too. Yours are more then mere credentials, though, you have demonstrated repeatedly that your linguistic training and native language ability are first class. I can see Willis’ point (and I noticed several other names missing….). I can also see the opposite view. Good for him to be true to himself. And good for you to so kindly cheer him on and encourage him. You are a class act, Mr. Slayton.

      • Janice, (I used to proof read tech manuals) I also spotted the odd construction in the first sentence but let it go. But Chris Monckton won’t like being listed as ‘Mockton’. :-)

      • The CACA carbonieri have managed to ignore or pooh-pooh the original Oregon Petition, but it’s still as valid as ever.

    • Para#2, Line 4.
      “…have, and will continue to cause…”
      Oh dear! Please change to
      “…have caused and will continue to cause…”
      Note the absence of the rogue comma!

      • How good it is that this community of smart, diverse and open-minded individuals a cheerful mini-debate on punctuation can take place without digressing from the core issue of scientific integrity.

      • Brent Hargreaves, I stand to be corrected, but I do detect a hint of sarcasm in your comment! Is there a problem with rendering the submission more professional by applying a bit of spit and polish to its content?

      • Graham, no sarcasm from me. Many of the posters on WUWT are articulate people with signs of being well-read as opposed to the narrow joyless monomaniacs in the uebergreen camp. Jarome’s “I hate rogue, commas” is a witty little aside.

      • i use hyphens and ellipses these days…
        william shatner made me commatose once; i was scarred for life
        but jeez- a grammatical error that would get red penciled in jr high english class starts out the petition?
        just say ‘oops’ and fix it. do not try to pretend illiteracy doesn’t matter or that those with standards triggered a flight to safe spaces.
        (and no, muphry didn’t bite me and i don’t have an ee cummings fetish. my little finger doesn’t get along with the shift key and i don’t care cuz i’m not writing to the president of the usa, mmk?)

      • It appears that the most important need of all Americans is for the POTUS to sign an Executive Order stipulating that henceforth, ….. all written commentary and/or verbiage of a scientific nature, context or content, regardless of when or where it is published, must be composed and written by a Lawyer or team of Lawyers to insure that there is no possibility of anyone, anywhere, ….. 1) bitching about the choice of words or their order of usage; 2) misunderstanding what is being claimed or stated; or 3) being confused about what the ell they are reading.

        Then everyone will be happy campers and the discussion of the “subject matter” can continue uninterrupted by “kibitzers” who think their “pet peeves” are more serious than a “heart attack”.

    • It is plant food not poison.

      The “Plant Food” term makes me cringe. Somewhere there’s a “Climate Crock of the Week” where that Sinclair guy has Monckton saying “Plant Food” over and over again in his wonderful aristocratic tones. Something along the lines of saying that Carbon Dioxide is the basic feed stock of all life on Earth might be a little bit more encompassing.

      • Chlorophyll: – C₅₅H₇₂O₅N₄Mg

        Lignins, Amino acid, Anthocyanin, fatty acids, amino acids, esters.

        ALL are based on ORGANIC chemistry, with minor atoms of nitrogen, magnesium, potassium, sodium etc etc etc

        But BY FAR the major part of the structures are made of CARBON, OXYGEN and HYDROGEN

        The whole world is ABSOLUTELY and TOTALLY DEPENDENT on those three atoms…

        …. which are invariably sourced from CO2 and H2O

      • Sorry, Steve. No problem with “plant food”. None at all. It rocks. It’s understood universally. In an instant, it knocks the lights out of the brain dead claim that it’s a toxic gas.

      • Steve,

        What is wrong with “plant food”? That’s precisely what carbon dioxide is. Plants and other photosynthesizers split water molecules apart, attach the hydrogen atoms to CO2 atoms, making glucose (C6H12O6) or other sugars, ie plant food, and release leftover oxygen atoms to the air or water for us animals to breathe.

      • Thanks for all the replies. Here’s Peter Sinclair’s “CO2 is Plant Food” crock:

        [I’ve tried posting this twice and I think the YouTube link the Perter Sinclair’s Climate Crock of the Week is what’s making my post just disappear. So you will have to Google the “CO2 is Plant Food” Climate Crock of the Week for yourself ]

        And if you do:

        You can count how many times he has Monckton saying “Plant Food”. He does it because the term is easily made fun of. The Green Mafia knows how to use ridicule and they do it well. And conservatives continue to let them do it and define the terms of the argument.

        Yes, we are a carbon based life form and every carbon atom in our bodies was once CO2 in the atmosphere. Here’s a little graphic to illustrate why that is:

        However true the term “CO2 is Plant Food” is, I guarantee the left will make fun of it.

      • Enough already, Steve. Monckton repeats “plant food” ad nauseum. So what? How does that demonise the term? As for alarmists getting cranky, what’s new? I can’t see your suggestion, “Carbon Dioxide is the basic feed stock of all life on Earth”, going down a bomb. Any audience would switch channel before you’re halfway through!

    • I will not comment on the current draft of the petition, which seemed adequate when I read it.

      I will comment on Richard Linden’s past writing style, which I found worthy of praise years ago.

      Richard is not only brilliant, he is also courageous. Back when only a few were willing to speak out about the deeply flawed “science” of global warming alarmism, Lindzen spoke out, and he did so with ringing clarity and great courage. Bravo Richard!

      I still re-read with admiration the excerpt of his 2001 WSJ article below, and suggest you do so as well.

      Regards, Allan

      https://wattsupwiththat.com/2013/10/08/lindzen-understanding-the-ipcc-ar5-climate-assessment/#comment-1441028

      I greatly admire Richard Lindzen.

      Not only does he make sense, but the man writes like an angel.

      Excerpted from the Wall Street Journal, 2001:

      Scientists’ Report Doesn’t Support the Kyoto Treaty
      By Richard S. Lindzen. June 11, 2001
      http://eaps.mit.edu/faculty/lindzen/OpEds/LindzenWSJ.pdf

      “The full IPCC report is an admirable description of research activities in climate science, but it is not specifically directed at policy. The Summary for Policymakers is, but it is also a very different document. It represents a consensus of government representatives (many of whom are also their nations’ Kyoto representatives), rather than of scientists. The resulting document has a strong tendency to disguise uncertainty, and conjures up some scary scenarios for which there is no evidence.

      Science, in the public arena, is commonly used as a source of authority with which to bludgeon political opponents and propagandize uninformed citizens. This is what has been done with both the reports of the IPCC and the NAS. It is a reprehensible practice that corrodes our ability to make rational decisions. A fairer view of the science will show that there is still a vast amount of uncertainty — far more than advocates of Kyoto would like to acknowledge — and that the NAS report has hardly ended the debate. Nor was it meant to.”

      ******************************

      • Richard S. Lindzen: “The full IPCC report is an admirable description of research activities in climate science, but it is not specifically directed at policy. The Summary for Policymakers is, but it is also a very different document.”

        Allan: “I greatly admire Richard Lindzen.”
        WR: Me too: Richard Lindzen wrote those words on June 11, 2001(!): “The Summary for Policymakers is [specifically directed at policy] ”
        I have my doubts about the ability of ‘science’ to keep her scientific integrity. 16 Years passed since he wrote that words. Science should realize that it has not been able to correct what was going wrong. In fact IPCC (‘Government’) had manipulated herself into a position that she could manipulate the public opinion by suggesting that the ‘Summary for Policymakers’ represented the full IPCC report and even worse: that she represented ‘full [climate] science’. ‘Science’ did not correct what she should have corrected. A structural failure.

        16 Years have passed. It is time to finally end up this scandalous situation that is at the detriment of whole societies. Who wants climate science to be real science should welcome this petition.

        I do.

      • Moderator: If you have the time, please insert the word “with” in this sentence:

        “Lindzen spoke out, and he did so WITH ringing clarity and great courage. Bravo Richard!”

        Thank you..

        [Reply: You’re welcome. -ModE ]

      • Thank you Wim, an excellent post.

        I assume you are in Holland, and it is a pleasure to make your acquaintance. I truly enjoyed my visits to the Netherlands and especially your outstanding art museums and the Dutch countryside, which was beautiful.

        I will be even more condemnatory of the IPCC and the global warming alarmists, as follows:

        I have known since about 1985 that global warming alarmism was a false crisis, unfounded in scientific fact.

        Since about 2002 I have been convinced that it is a fraud, based on deliberate falsehoods.

        When someone says “the science is settled”, you know they are not being truthful. Science, and particularly climate science, is far from settled.

        The Mann hockey-stick papers, starting with MBH98, were never remotely credible – “Hide the decline”, “Mike’s Nature trick”. splicing dissimilar datasets, etc. What a farce!

        Furthermore, the Climategate emails proved the extent of the fraud and identified some of the leading fraudsters.

        Global warming alarmism is the most costly scientific fraud in the history of our planet – it has caused society to squander trillions of dollars of scarce global resources, damaged energy systems, and cost many lives.

        I have published the following statements since about 2002, and all have proven correct:

        1. “Green energy” is not green and produced little useful energy.”

        2. “Green energy relies upon life-of-project subsidies.”

        3. “Cheap, reliable, abundant energy is the lifeblood of society”

        4. “When imbecilic politicians fool with energy systems, innocent people suffer and die.”

        Best regards, Allan

  2. There is a site called Change.org that collects online signatures to send the President. Professor Lindzen should start one there for this. It is primarily a liberal site, so it might cause some stir.

  3. Thanks indeed to Dr. Lindzen.

    I do wish he had emphasized that he was a contributor to Chapter 4 of the IPCC Second Assessment (1995) and a Lead Author of Chapter 7, “Physical Climate Processes and Feedbacks” of the IPCC Third Assessment Report ( 2001). You don’t really get more qualified to judge the value of the IPCC exercise than that.

    Side note: I’m really not sure how to take the presence of a signatory “Christopher Mockton”. It’s a good laugh in any case.

  4. List of HEROs.

    For those of you who now look down and see your own nakedness, good news; sign up and you may hide in the list of heros. GK

  5. As I read down that impressive list of petition signers, I just kept shaking my head in amazement, thinking, “Wow. WOW. This is something, this is really something.”

    Not only do all those credentials silently thunder, “LISTEN TO US. WE KNOW,” the depth and breadth of the knowledge of those signing is of such great magnitude that the only response of a sane opponent to such an army is:

    Oh. Crap.

    • I might agree with you but the mainstream scientists include Tom Karl. His record is far greater.
      He would show you if his computer hadn’t broke.

  6. An interesting and well-worded initiative. Refreshing too.

    It will be interesting to read the climate-scientist version and their counter-letter-petition pleading for a permanent hand positioned in the public pocket to see whether or not Lindzen & Co are correct or maybe not.

      • Don’t forget they have their white ‘lab coats’, those are issued by the protest organizers to improve credibility.

        Frankly, my “black lab’s coat” is far more significant, not to say more useful in the winter. “Let the fur fly”. /sarc off

    • I thought all the “climate scientists” working for the government were invited to move to France.

      The only words I know in French are: “bon appetite!” (Maybe the French government will at least feed them.)

  7. A “great cloud of witnesses” is cheering you on, dear warriors for truth in science:

    (L->R: Kirby, Pasteur, Newton, Carver, Maxwell, Kepler, Boyle, Bell)

    We are so proud of you (and they must be, too)!

    And they are watching to see what you will do.

    You know who you are…..

    ***********************************************************

    NICE JOB, LINDZEN!

    You rock!!!

    • Janice,
      your list (L->R: Kirby, Pasteur, Newton, Carver, Maxwell, Kepler, Boyle, Bell) can’t be real scientists…
      … they’re not wearing white coats & carrying placards saying ‘Give ME more grants’ & they didn’t hide their data.

    • A strange assortment of basic and applied scientists, lifted from the anti-scientific ICR. Kirby collected insects and Bell was a surgeon, from a family thereof. As most Americans know, Carver was an ag products researcher. But four or five of them might be on most lists of ten most important scientists and at least one definitely would be at or near its top. Few if any however needed enough courage to rate as heroes. Newton kept his heretical unitarian beliefs secret.

      • On second thought, Sir Isaac did show courage in resigning his senior fellowship and Lucasian professorship at Trinity (!) rather than take the necessary holy orders in the Anglican Church, key tenets of its doctrine which he could not accept. It worked out well for him in the end, however, as he left Cambridge for London and a government job as director of the mint, not requiring ordination.

      • Newton’s theological writings are enormous, at more than a million pages, possibly much more, so there is plenty of room for interpretation on his undeniably Unitarian views (although some 19th century historians tried to defend his orthodoxy).

        Sir Isaac has been accused of being an Arian heretic or worse (Keynes, who bought his papers, saw him as practically Jewish), and might well have been early in his scriptural studies on the nature of Christ. But, after reading the Early Church Fathers, it appears that he ended up, while still heterodox, opposed mainly to the doctrine of consubstantiation rather than being a more thoroughgoing Unitarian, like the Deists among the US Founders and Framers, who objected to the divinity of Jesus. This group includes, among many others, Washington, Jefferson, Franklin, Madison, Monroe and both John and Abigail Adams, as well as Lincoln, whom his wife called “not technically a Christian”.

        http://www.sfu.ca/~poitras/Arian_newton.pdf

        It is quite possible that those who have come to the conclusion that Newton was either “orthodox” (Biot, Brewster) or an Arian (More and contemporary scholars) are simply interpreting his position in light of an inadequate framework of options. More illustrates this kind of framework:

        The anti-Trinitarians can be classed under three main divisions: the Arians who denied that the Son was coeternal with the father, though he was begot before time began and by him the Father created all things…the Socinians who believe that he did not exist before his appearance on earth, but that he was an object of prayer; the Humanitarians, or Unitarians, who believe him to be a man, and not an object of prayer.

        It may be that in the early 1670s Newton himself wrote out of a similar framework and saw the Arian position as the most consistent. It seems clear, however, that by the 1690s (or if Westfall’s dating of the Clark MS is right, by the 1680s) his trinitarian study was sufficiently nuanced so as to have adopted the homoiousian position over and against both Athanasianism and Arianism.

        Rather than squeezing Newton into the standard seventeenth century schools of thought on the trinity, I am suggesting that the key to his thought is found in the broader categories of the fourth century upon which he had developed an expertise, specifically among those, like Eusebius, who held the homoiousian interpretation of the Nicene Creed, with which Newton was now obviously quite familiar and sympathetic. If the Newton historians of the nineteenth and twentieth centuries have found it “a blot on his record” that Newton was unwilling to join Whiston’s attempt to restore “primitive Christianity” or to defend him when he was ousted from Cambridge, perhaps it was, after all, not due to Newton’s being “all too human” but because he believed Whiston, as an avowed Arian, had pushed his subordinationism too far.

        Newton was neither “orthodox” (according to the Athanasian creed) nor an Arian. He believed that both of these groups had wandered into metaphysical speculation. He was convinced that his position was the truly biblical one, in which the Son was affirmed to be the express image of the Father, and that this position was best represented by those Bishops at Nicaea who held the Son to be of the same kind of substance as the Father but not numerically the same. Newton may still be considered heterodox, but in light of the evidence of his theological development he may no longer be considered an Arian, that is to say, a heretic.

      • Gloateus,

        Science is a method, not a set of beliefs that you, or anyone else, dictates must be accepted, lest one be anti-scientific. Honest.

    • To this list I would Michelson and Morley, great experimenters who upset the leading paradigm of its day (the ‘aether ‘) because fact beats theory, and they sought the facts. Wonder what they would say about climate science today…

  8. Global Garden Gets Greener
    NASA Earth Observatory
    (June, 2003)
    * * * * * *

    Earth getting greener due to rising carbon dioxide levels, global snapshot shows
    (Australian Broadcasting Corp, April 2006)
    “The most comprehensive modelling of remote sensing data so far shows the area on Earth covered by plants in this time has increased by 18 million square kilometres — about 2.5 times the size of the Australian continent — largely due to the fertilising effect of carbon dioxide (CO2).”
    * * * * *

    Evidence for a recent increase in forest growth
    (PNAS, January 2010)
    Sean M. McMahona,b,1, Geoffrey G. Parkera, and Dawn R. Millera
    http://www.pnas.org/content/107/8/3611
    * * * * *

    Deserts ‘greening’ from rising CO2
    (CSIRO, July 2013)
    https://www.csiro.au/en/News/News-releases/2013/Deserts-greening-from-rising-CO2
    * * * * *

    Greening of the Earth and its drivers
    (Nature, March 2016)
    “We show a persistent and widespread increase of growing season integrated LAI (greening) over 25% to 50% of the global vegetated area, whereas less than 4% of the globe shows decreasing LAI (browning). Factorial simulations with multiple global ecosystem models suggest that CO2 fertilization effects explain 70% of the observed greening trend, followed by nitrogen deposition (9%), climate change (8%) and land cover change (LCC) (4%).”
    http://www.nature.com/nclimate/journal/v6/n8/full/nclimate3004.html
    * * * * *

    Accelerated plant growth: it’s the only “forcing” you can confidently measure.

    • Thanks for those links, they are driving my watermelon FB followers to “unprecedented” levels of dissent. :)

      • I got un-friended by many FB friends I actually know and banned from FB because of my views on climate change. In discussions about climate change and CO2, when I mentioned “Ideal Gas Laws”, gravity and mass, they ran away and un-friended me.

    • (Australian Broadcasting Corp, April 2006)
      “The most comprehensive modelling of remote sensing data so far shows the area on Earth covered by plants in this time has increased by 18 million square kilometres — about 2.5 times the size of the Australian continent — largely due to the fertilising effect of carbon dioxide (CO2).”

      This from our comunist ABC? I’m flabbergasted!

  9. Lots of people from other countries on that list. Sweden. Norway. But I think he really needs to get more people from Russian if he wants to influence Donald Putin.

  10. This is to Anthony and/or Eric,
    Why don’t you do a post asking WATTSUPWITHTHAT readers from all over the world to send letters to Trump supporting the Lindzen petition. You may want to prepared a standard letter that we could all copy to our own letterhead. I wonder why Dr. Curry’s signature was missing?

    • Ronald Abate,
      A letter such as you suggest will go to a large secure building and tested for many things but the scientific worthiness of the ideas will not be one of those. If your wording suggests you are a bit nutty, your name will go on a list you might prefer not to be on. If your comments suggest you are favorable toward DJT or Republicans, your name and address may get sent to the Republican National Committee and you may receive a solicitation (please send money).
      Your letter may get you a 1 digit increase in a tally that becomes an entry in a briefing book where a large number indicates letters from “deniers” (now crossed out and “skeptic” inserted) and another indicates “believers.”
      After that, your letter becomes biomass to help heat the capitol building.
      Some of the above might, maybe, could be true.
      Whatever does happen, Mr. President will not see your letter.

      • I agree, but if thousands of similar letter, or tens of thousands that may make a difference. I have no idea how large the readership is at WUWT, but I assume it is quite large. Anyway, just a thought.

    • The black box under the text below Dr Lindzen’s photo contains the petition and all signers by scrolling.

      Maybe an issue with your browser?

      • My secure Firefox doesn’t like it. Insecure Firefox on another machine displays it. Midori doesn’t like it. Ubuntu browser displays it.

  11. The American Geophysical Union, American Meteorological Society, American Physical Society, American Chemical Society and the Association for the Advancement of Science will act proactively to Excommunicate and seek financial Retribution on those listed. Obama still has many Vietcong among the US Federal Government and many sympathizers in other countries especially European.

    • Well , I always thought a scorched earth policy on ones political enemies is the best course of action.
      Pull their funding, let them swim on their own for a bit.
      The sharks in the real world of commerce don’t care about your opinion,just working results.

  12. This is a heavyweight petition, and deserves worldwide attention at peak levels of government. Unfortunately the first sentence of the introductory letter is cumbersome and contains a split infinitive. Delete the “everywhere”, or better, rewrite it. I am not being pedantic (ok I am), but its important that the message is not diluted by allowing pedantic people to get distracted or to mount irrelevant criticisms.

    Scientists are not expected to be grammatical masters, that’s understood. This is an opportunity for the non technical people to assist the boffins a little.

    • … contains a split infinitive …

      That hasn’t mattered for a long time.

      The Columbia Guide to Standard American English notes that the split infinitive “eliminates all possibility of ambiguity,” in contrast to the “potential for confusion” in an unsplit construction. link

  13. I would sign this but my highest qualification is Masters Law. Over 95% of people in that field are Warmists and we could not win in a battle of numbers by accepting scientific and non scientific opinion as equally valid “votes”.

  14. Dr. Lindzen, I hold you in the highest regard. Thank you for maintaining your position in the climate field, despite what can only be described as fanaticism from those who disagree with your findings. Keep up the good work.

  15. Correction: UNFCCC
    Not:
    UN Framework on Climate Change Convention.

    actual name.
    UN Fraudulent Climate Change Cult.

  16. Not on topic but a new paper of much interest has recently been published one the Carbon Cycle.

    This paper concludes that there is a very short residency time, such that manmade CO2 emissions account for only about 15% of the increase in CO2 since the industrial revolution/pre industrial times. Unfortunately, the paper is paywalled so i have not reviewed it but perhaps it is something that one of the main contributors (such as Willis0 will look at since, if it is correct, it potentially has far reaching consequences and is a good reason in itself for the US pulling out of the UN Convention on Climate Change.

    The abstract of the paper (Hale 2017) reads:

    Abstract

    Climate scientists presume that the carbon cycle has come out of balance due to the increasing anthropogenic emissions from fossil fuel combustion and land use change. This is made responsible for the rapidly increasing atmospheric CO2 concentrations over recent years, and it is estimated that the removal of the additional emissions from the atmosphere will take a few hundred thousand years. Since this goes along with an increasing greenhouse effect and a further global warming, a better understanding of the carbon cycle is of great importance for all future climate change predictions. We have critically scrutinized this cycle and present an alternative concept, for which the uptake of CO2 by natural sinks scales proportional with the CO2 concentration. In addition, we consider temperature dependent natural emission and absorption rates, by which the paleoclimatic CO2 variations and the actual CO2 growth rate can well be explained. The anthropogenic contribution to the actual CO2 concentration is found to be 4.3%, its fraction to the CO2 increase over the Industrial Era is 15% and the average residence time 4 years.

    See: http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0921818116304787

    • The anthropogenic fraction of CO2 in the atmosphere is only 4.3%.

      Human emissions only contribute 15% to the CO2 increase over the Industrial Era.

      The reason the alarmists require, and write papers trying to prove, long residence time is that otherwise the human contribution to atmospheric CO2 is insignificant as this paper shows. The alarmists do that kind of thing a lot.

    • I have always (past 15+ years) claimed/stated that it was utterly ignorant or stupid for anyone to claim or believe that human emitted CO2 remains in the atmosphere for tens to hundreds of years.

      “HA”, surely raindrops alone “wash” more CO2 out of the atmosphere each year …. than humans emit into the atmosphere each year.

      • @ Samuel C.;
        I recall reading the argument that a CO2 molecule created when coal is burned becomes part of a “short term” cycle. That is, the coal was buried and thus not going to influence anything in the near future. However, the new (human caused) molecule becomes part of an apple that is eaten and/or rapidly decomposes. Millions and Millions of apples later that molecule (or its Doppelgänger) still manages to be in the atmosphere to cause warming. Thusly, they get to “tens to hundreds of years.” And, by implication, we are doomed.
        Just for the record, I think the concentration of atmospheric CO2 is too low.

      • The CAGW secret they don’t want you to know.

        There is a nasty ole Anthropogenic Global Warming secret about CO2 that the proponents of CAGW are not telling you. Surprise, surprise, there are actually two (2) different types of CO2.

        There is both a naturally occurring CO2 molecule and a hybrid CO2 molecule that has a different physical property. The new hybrid CO2 molecule contains an H-pyron which permits one to distinguish it from the naturally occurring CO2 molecules.

        The H-pyron or Human-pyron is only attached to and/or can only be detected in CO2 molecules that have been created as a result of human activity. Said H-pyron has a Specific Heat Capacity of one (1) GWC or 1 Global Warming Calorie that is equal to 69 x 10 -37th kJ/kg K or something close to that or maybe farther away.

        Thus, said H-pyron is very important to all Climate Scientists that are proponents of CO2 causing Anthropogenic Global Warming (CAGW) because it provides them a quasi-scientific “fact” that serves two (2) important functions: 1) it permits said climate scientists to calculate an estimated percentage of atmospheric CO2 that is “human caused” ……. and 2) it permits said climate scientists to calculate their desired “degree increase” in Average Global Temperatures that are directly attributed to human activity.

        As an added note, oftentimes one may hear said climate scientists refer to those two (2) types of CO2 as “urban CO2” and ”rural CO2” because they can’t deny “it is always hotter in the city”.

        And there you have it folks, the rest of the story, their secret scientific tool has been revealed to you.

        Yours truly, Eritas Fubar

    • The paper is junk. More Salbyism. Look at the abstract: Residence time 4 years. The C14 bombspike proved average atmospheric residence time of a CO2 molecule is ~11 years. Look it up.
      That experiment has been done. The paper is wrong.

      • Ristvan. You right, see my comments. There is a real experiment carried out by the radiocarbon 14C startin from the year 1964. The residence time for the anthropogenic CO2 is 16 years and for the total CO2 55 years.

      • He gets the residence time of 4 years from the IPCC’s own numbers.

        Regarding the decline of C14 after the bomb spike, that shows only the net removal. It includes a cancellation from C14 that is re-emitted back into the atmosphere, for example, each year when plant foliage dies and decomposes. The residence time is determined by the un-cancelled removal. That has to be faster than net removal and therefore faster than the decline of C14.

      • Ian,

        The 4-5 years residence time is caused by the full seasonal carbon cycle which is (nearly) as much in as out, thus doesn’t change anything in the atmospheric CO2 quantity. That has nothing to do with any removal of CO2 (whatever isotope) out of the atmosphere.

        13C and 14C are really removed out of the atmosphere, due to the very long recycle time of the deep oceans of 500-1000 years. What goes in the oceans is the current isotopic ratio (minus the air-water isotopic shift), what comes out is the isotopic ratio of ~500-1000 years ago (including what happens in the deep and the water-air isotopic shift), which is quite different from the current one.

        That makes that any extra 13CO2 (by humans) or 14CO2 (by humans) is removed a lot faster than any extra 12CO2 (which is the bulk of all CO2 at near 99%). See the fate of 14C vs 12C in 1960 at the height of the 14C bomb tests spike:

        Of the total CO2 in 1960 going into the deep oceans, 97.5% comes back in the same year.
        Of the 14CO2 in 1960 going into the deep oceans, 44% comes back in the same year.
        That makes that the decay rate of 14CO2 (and also 13CO2) is much faster than for the bulk of CO2.

        Based on the observed net sink rate (~2.15 ppmv/year) at the current extra CO2 pressure in the atmosphere (110 ppmv, that is ~110 μatm) above equilibrium, any extra CO2 has an e-fold decay rate of ~51 years, or a half life of ~35 years, quite constant over the past 57 years…

        Why does the IPCC use much longer times? They use the Bern model, where for each reservoir different sink rates are applied (no problem with that) but also saturation levels. That is true for the ocean surface (at 10% of the change in the atmosphere), but very questionable for the deep oceans and not at all applicable for the biosphere…

        Anyway, the report in question does start with a complete wrong assumption – not the first time that happens – and thus is good for the dust bin, in good company with all the climate models there…

    • Just two comments. This issue of CO2 residence time comes up weekly. Hale does not specify the residence time, if it is for anthropogenic CO2 or for the total CO2. They are totally different and it looks like this residence time of 4 years is for the total CO2. It would mean that if the present CO2 emissions of 10 GtC/year would be stopped totally, the present CO2 amount of 850 GtC in the atmosphere would decrease to the preindustrial level of 600 GtC in 4*4 years = 16 years. It would mean that the CO2 flux into the sink (=the ocean) would be at least 15 GtC/year. Mission impossible.

      • I must be missing something. Different residence times for anthropogenic CO2 and total CO2? Does each molecule have a label identifying it as anthro or non-anthro? (so the biosphere and oceans know which ones to absorb preferentially)

        i stand to be corrected, but it sounds a bit fishy to me.

      • Dr. Lindzen accepts the elementary tenets of climate science. He agrees that carbon dioxide is a greenhouse gas, calling people who dispute that point “nutty.” He agrees that the level of it is rising because of human activity and that this should warm the climate.
        April 30, 2012 New York Times

      • Lindzen concludes, however, that the IPCC is using a vastly exaggerated figure for the sensitivity to CO2 and net feedback.

      • Smart Rock. You should have a basic knowledge about the CO2 recycling between the atmosphere the ocean and the biosphere. About 25 percent of the CO2 amount in the atmosphere is changed every year. It means that about the same amount of the total CO2 is recycled back. Only 45 % of the yearly 10 GtC emission is removed into the deep sea and not coming back. The relatively small fluxes of 14C and anthropogenic CO2 is recycled back. That is why the residence time of 14C and anthropogenic (13C) is much shorter than the total CO2: the removal rate of these CO2 fluxes is greater than the total CO2. You are not the only one not knowing this.

        Here is a link to my blog based on the scientific paper: http://www.climatexam.com/single-post/2016/08/29/The-residence-times-of-carbon-dioxide-are-16-and-55-years

    • It does however include Einstein’s replacement at Princeton’s IfAS Freeman Dyson, who also signed the Oregon Petition.

    • Or just fuel the controversy that Trump is “Out of Control” to the snowflakes and cite this is an example of such behavior. I would think that such an action should be well orchestrated and planned in advance to maximize its impact and not get cited and therefore dismissed as another “example” of an out of control Presidential Action.

      Confidence building is very important to politicians who have the power. The reason we are in this scientific mess is because of the lack of confidence by the political scene and a noisy but very vocal minority.

      • “Or just fuel the controversy that Trump is “Out of Control” to the snowflakes and cite this is an example of such behavior. I would think that such an action should be well orchestrated and planned in advance to maximize its impact and not get cited and therefore dismissed as another “example” of an out of control Presidential Action.”

        Sorry, the MSM is going to portray Trump as out of control no matter what he does. Trump should not try to conform anything he does to what the MSM want. That’s what lilly-livered Republicans do. They let the MSM intimidate them and then these Republicans refrain from putting forward their conservative policies for fear of criticism from the MSM. Not so Trump.

        There’s no pleasing the MSM when you are a Republican. Trying to please them is a fool’s errand. So many of the Elite Republicans desperately want the MSM to love them, but it will never happen, guys, so give it up and quit conforming to the MSM flawed view of the world.

  17. Petitions are Politics.

    I want proper science to be done. If Trump commissions some proper science it will put an end to this farrago permanently. If the false assertions of the Climate Change fanatics are not exposed, they may be back again before we know it.

    In particular, the media need to have their noses rubbed in the fact that they were wrong, and acting as propaganda support for a fraud…

  18. Apparently, Obama looks “better” and “healthier” now that he’s not in the top job? Really? Telling/supporting porkies takes a toll…who knew?

  19. Trivia time! Do the BBC…
    A. Report on this highly significant petition from serious and credible scientists?
    B. Lead with a new UN climate Czar puff piece?

  20. Not being a scientist (despite some long forgotten science training) I am of the view that the top stratum of scientists should not sign or even less initiate mass petitions.
    Individual request combined with public statements in any channels open to the world class scientist, ranging from science conventions and publications to the mass media outlets, would be noted and likely more effective.
    Petitions attenuate individuality and personal achievements of the signatories.
    Petitions are for the lower level of ‘scientific’ creature, as myself and perhaps one or two others, who despite shouting loudest are not even heard by anyone, let alone listened to.

    … but good luck with it anyway.

  21. The petition states:

    “Observations since the UNFCCC was written 25 years ago show that warming from increased atmospheric CO2 will be benign — much less than initial model predictions.”
    __________________________________________

    That’s a testable claim.

    According to combined surface observations (HadCRUT4, GISS and NOAA), which is the metric used by the WMO, surface air temperatures have risen at a statistically significant rate of 0.20 C per decade since the UNFCCC treaty was negotiated in June 1992. That’s a total rise of ~0.5 C in just under 25 years, or ~2.0 C per century.

    The satellite record shows less agreement, but still warming. In the lower troposphere (TLT) UAH v6.5 beta shows warming of 0.13 C per decade since June 1992. UAH’s current published TLT set (v5.6) shows 0.15 C/dec warming. The RSS TLT v3.3 data set contains what its producers call “a known cooling bias”, but RSS’s recently updated total troposphere (TTT) 4.0 data show warming of the atmosphere at around the same rate as the surface since June 1992, 0.21 C/dec.

    So what were the “initial model predictions” available to the UNFCCC back in 1992 and have observations really shown “much less” warming than was forecast?

    The second IPCC report was published in February 1992, so it is to this document that the UNFCCC Treaty would most likely have referred. Section B of that document refers to model forecasts (they only had 4 models back then). Quoting from the Executive Summary of that chapter:

    “All but one of the models show slow initial warming (which may be an artefact of the experimental design) followed by a nearly linear trend of approximately 0.3°C per decade. All models simulate a peak-to-trough natural variability of about 0.3°C in global surface air temperature on decadal time-scales.”

    So back in 1992, the IPCC was predicting a long term rise in surface air temperatures of 0.3 C/dec after a slow start, but this rate could vary by +/- 0.3 C/dec, depending on natural variability.

    Re the initial ‘cold start’, the text of the document goes on to say:

    “…three of the models show relatively little warming during the first few decades of the integration rather than a constant rate of warming throughout, despite the near constant rate of increase in radiative heating. This so-called “cold start” is barely noticeable in the GFDL simulation, but in the UKMO and MPI models the warming is negligible during the first 2 to 3 decades.” [IPCC, 1992, B2.2, pg 104].

    In summary, 3 out of 4 of the model predictions available to the UNFCCC in 1992 showed “negligible” warming over the first 2-3 decades of the forecast runs, followed by a long term warming rate of 0.3 C/dec (+/- 0.3 depending on natural variability). What has actually been observed in the25 years since 1992, the period during which 3 out of 4 models were predicting negligible” warming, has been statistically significant surface air warming of 0.2 C/dec and atmospheric warming of between 0.13 and 0.21 C/decade, the latter rate also being statistically significant.

    How can anyone seriously claim that observations since 1992 show “much less” warming than the models available at that time were forecasting?

    • Perhaps because since 1998 there has been all but no warming notwithstanding that more than 30% of manmade CO2 emissions have been emitted since then..

      • DWR,

        The “surface data sets” are antiscience fiction at best, fantasy and fr@ud more like it.

      • I see DWR54 is still trying to use ENSO to claim a warming trend. That alone shows how desperate the true believers have become. Aren’t these the same people who claimed the 1997-98 El Nino was the cause of the pause? Since 1997 the satellite measured trend of ENSO neutral months is essentially zero. Your denial of the best data remains illustrative.

      • DWR,

        RSS has been “adjusted” now to conform to the fake consensus. But the interval between super El Ninos is far from the whole phony reconstruction. The fakers are constrained by the satellites since 1979 (ignoring space observations from the 1960s and prior ’70s). They do their dirtiest work and cook the books the worst prior to 1979. Then the charlatans hide their deeds with the lame excuse of having lost their homework, so they don’t have to show their chicanery.

    • DWR56
      Too short a period my friend Go look at more than 340 years of CET temp records with a long term trend 0.26C per Century . With more than 2C rise over a shorter period during that period before the industrial revolution took hold. Its all a “storm” in a teacup and lets face it we know the model predictions are in Thomas Crapper territory.

      • Frank,

        If the 25 years since 1992 is too short a period then why does the petition attach such significance to it?

      • DWR54 = WD40 (slippery)

        https://wattsupwiththat.com/2017/01/23/december-2016-global-surface-landocean-and-lower-troposphere-temperature-anomaly-update-with-a-look-at-the-year-end-annual-results/comment-page-1/#comment-2404993

        My work suggests that The Pause would extend back to 1982, were it not for two huge volcanoes in 1982 and 1991; Bill Illis’s work suggests The Pause extends back to at least 1958.

        Since there was global cooling from about 1940 to 1975, one could conclude that there has been no net global warming since about 1940.

        Regards, Allan

      • Allan M.R. MacRae

        My work suggests that The Pause would extend back to 1982, were it not for two huge volcanoes in 1982 and 1991; Bill Illis’s work suggests The Pause extends back to at least 1958.
        ___________________________

        The observed warming in the combined surface data sets since 1958 is 0.86 C; a rate of 0.15 C/decade. How this can be described as the continuation of a ‘pause’ isn’t immediately obvious. Where is your ‘work’ published Allan?

      • Read the cited reference, WD40 – it is all there.

        See Billi Illis’s plot back to 1958. What “adjusted” temperature data are you citing?

        Preferably, just do not write ma anymore. You are a troll WD, and I have no time for you.

      • I wrote above: “My work suggests that The Pause would extend back to 1982, were it not for two huge volcanoes in 1982 and 1991.”

        Here is further corroboration of my statement, derived from a paper by Santer et al (2014). This comment is by Dave Burton:

        2. THE “PAUSE” IS OVER TWO DECADES LONG. THE MEASURED WARMING IS ALL IN THE FIRST 14 YEARS. THEIR 3RD GRAPH (WITH CORRECTIONS TO COMPENSATE FOR BOTH ENSO AND VOLCANIC FORCINGS) SHOWS NO NOTICEABLE WARMING IN THE LAST 21 YEARS.

        This conclusion says no significant warming since 1993, I say no real warming since 1982 (after accounting for major volcanos).

        Note that the authors are all warmists. It appears they failed to adequately account for the major climatic effects of the volcano El Chichon (1982).

        Regards, Allan

        https://wattsupwiththat.com/2015/12/20/study-from-marvel-and-schmidt-examination-of-earths-recent-history-key-to-predicting-global-temperatures/comment-page-1/#comment-2104175

        [excerpts from Dave Burton’s post]

        A paper last year by MIT’s Ben Santor (with many co-authors, including NASA’s Gavin Schmidt) did an interesting exercise. They tried to “subtract out” the effects of ENSO (El Niño / La Niña) and the Pinatubo (1991) and El Chichón (1982) volcanic aerosols from measured (satellite) temperature data, to find the underlying temperature trends. Here’s their paper:

        http://dspace.mit.edu/handle/1721.1/89054

        These graphs are from his paper:

        Look at that 3rd graph. Two things stand out:

        1. The models run hot. The CMIP5 models (the black line) show a lot more warming than the satellites. The models show about 0.65°C warming over the 35-year period, and the satellites show about half that. And,

        2. THE “PAUSE” IS OVER TWO DECADES LONG. THE MEASURED WARMING IS ALL IN THE FIRST 14 YEARS. THEIR 3RD GRAPH (WITH CORRECTIONS TO COMPENSATE FOR BOTH ENSO AND VOLCANIC FORCINGS) SHOWS NO NOTICEABLE WARMING IN THE LAST 21 YEARS.

        *********************************************

    • Curve fitting. Considering the parameterisations in the models and that at least two of the major datasets have been adjusted in such a way that they are closer to model expectation, then the ‘rough agreement’ of which you speak is hardly surprising. . .
      What about all the other ‘climate indicators’? How did the models do on California’s ‘permanent drought’ (or not)? How about jet stream behaviour or conditions in Western Europe? How about Arctic/Antarctic projections? How many models/climate scientists predicted ‘the pause’? El Nino/La Nina behavior? I could go on.
      To condense ‘climate change’ down to one property (a nebulous global average temp) and then compare model expectation to that alone is is, quite frankly, stupid – especially since we have little in the way of reliable measurement of what it actually is.
      Let’s compare projections of actual climatic behaviour in the models with the ‘climate’ that we actually experienced, shall we. Only then will we know if the models are any good.
      Or otherwise. . . Cc

    • The letter uses the word “benign”. Warming that is benign means that it is quite harmless. It does not refer to any defined rate of warming. Indeed, interstadial warming is not only benign, it is beneficial. How do we know? Flora and fauna organic debris is more abundant in paleosoils from warm periods than during cold periods. Warm periods are moist. Cold periods are dry. Better to have the occasional drenching hurricane than a dry steady wind.

      • Benign is a pretty generous description in my opinion. I noted in “GISS’s warmest evah year” that world agricultural production was outstanding. Regardless of the tortured statistical arguments over the methods and thousandths of a degree, real metrics like sustaining ourselves on this earth are not shown to be impaired in any way. Agricultural output this decade is a QED that there is no catastrophe.

      • Not just crops but global meat production is growing:

        Anti-human doomsayers claim that is a bad thing.

    • Evidence of warming isn’t evidence of CO2 induced warming.

      He says “warming from increased atmospheric CO2”, the climate changes naturally, always has, you need to prove the CO2 link and models aren’t evidence, they’re just an illustration of a theory.

  22. Willis, I don’t know that you will see this, but this question was put to me:

    ‘If we are supposed to still be in a post-Ice Age, why is it that the natural warming trend is never removed from their figures and charts? Why do they continue lumping it together with what they think is man-made? Is it to make the claim for man-made effects look more sensational on their reports and projections.’

    I don’t know that anything could really be done with it, but it seems like an interesting question to put to the alarmists.

    • If we are supposed to still be in a post-Ice Age, why is it that the natural warming trend is never removed from their figures and charts?

      The fact is, in the 1980’s the proponents of CAGW decided to “highjack” the natural warming that has been occurring during this Interglacial Period, but only from the year 1880 to present (2017), based on the historical Temperature Record maintained by the NWS.

      Why do they continue lumping it together with what they think is man-made?

      Again, the simple fact is, ……. if they were to exclude the “average natural warming” from their “fuzzy math” calculated “average CAGW warming” …… there would be nothing remaining to warrant the publishing of their “fear mongering” commentary.

  23. Reblogged this on Climatism and commented:
    EXTREMELY Important petition that the Trump administration must act on ASAP for the health and wellbeing of humanity and the environment worldwide!
    Without access to fossil fuels (CO2) there would be mass casualties and environmental devastation on an unprecedented scale. People cutting down every tree in the planet to provide for their warmth, cooking and industry.
    Notable Richard Lindzen comments about colourless, odourless, trace gas and plant food CO2 over the years:

    “For a lot of people including the bureaucracy in Government and the environmental movement, the issue is power. It’s hard to imagine a better leverage point than carbon dioxide to assume control over a society. It’s essential to the production of energy, it’s essential to breathing. If you demonise it and gain control over it, you so-to-speak, control everything. That’s attractive to people. It’s been openly stated for over forty years that one should try to use this issue for a variety of purposes, ranging from North/South redistribution, to energy independence, to God knows what…”

    •••

    “CO2 for different people has different attractions. After all, what is it? – it’s not a pollutant, it’s a product of every living creature’s breathing, it’s the product of all plant respiration, it is essential for plant life and photosynthesis, it’s a product of all industrial burning, it’s a product of driving – I mean, if you ever wanted a leverage point to control everything from exhalation to driving, this would be a dream. So it has a kind of fundamental attractiveness to bureaucratic mentality.”

    https://climatism.wordpress.com/2013/08/28/bureaucratic-dioxide/

  24. Lindzen said from the very beginning all that crap is fake. He started calling it voodoo early and said for it to be a theory, it had to be science, which it is not.

    • It could be because Judith Curry has a potential to work for President Trump to whom this petition is addressed.

      • Or that she is marginal skeptic more tied to the usual Green left community. It’s the most superfluous comparison to think she is in Dr. Lindzen’s category of skeptical honesty about core issues with climate policy.

    • Pure conjecture, but I sense in a lot of her writings and opinions that Dr Curry would still like to play a role in reconciling what now are two very divergent scientific camps. (Not everyone on the “consensus” side is an idealogue like Karl or a Schmidt.) Her blog can be seen as saying “let’s talk”.
      She jumped out of academia to avoid the restrictions on her opinions; signing the petition may seem like a step too far if she is still to act as a neutral agent.

      • Or George there really is a delusional form of skepticism that can’t (won’t more accurately) resolve the underlying political motivations of being “green”/”climate” advocates or what the heart of the debate is really about.

        It’s the “science only” framing skeptics that need to change.

        The letter is basically softly worded but Dr. Curry has a hundred nuances to maintain climate statism even if she realized Big Kahuna climate authority was striking out over a decade now. Of course her name isn’t on the letter since like so many (including many labeled “skeptics”) that are comfortable with the status quo and aren’t committed to actual progress that eliminates their view. Dr. Curry would never sign the letter because she believes in some form of climate central- planning. That’s what the U.N. Framework is. It really is that simple.

  25. Any country can just ignore this treaty. It has no enforcement mechanisms anyway and most international treaties are just ignored. See all the climate scientist trying to geo-engineer the planet’s atmosphere which is specifically forbidden under UN Convention.

    You can pull out of this treaty now and the Democrats can re-sign it again if they ever regain power. I would just leave it as is.

    The next point is that the US is probably going to meet the targets just by converting to combined cycle natural gas electricity production and efficiency drives by corporations which is happening on its own. The US government does not need to do anything except open up regulations against technology development and fracking etc.

    • I think you are confusing this…United Nations Convention on Climate Change…. With this… Paris climate agreement.

      • The UN Convention on Climate Change was from 1994 commonly called the “Rio Convention”. This eventually lead to the Kyoto Protocol from 1997 in which industrialized countries committed to reduce emissions 5.0% below 1990 levels by 2020. Most developing countries were exempted.

        The Paris Agreement from 2015 was based on trying to keep the temperature increase below 2.0C (or 450 ppm CO2e although no one seems to understand that is what it really was – we are already over that in CO2e numbers including all GHGs).

        Each country built their own commitment. It has been ratified by over 100 countries now so it has now come into force (with no enforcement mechanisms of course).

        The US committed to reduce GHG emissions by 17% below 2005 levels by 2020 and 26% below by 2025. In 2015, US GHG emissions were 10% below 2005 levels so 5 more years to reduce another 7% and 10 years to reduce 16%.

      • And the UN Convention which forbids geoengineering the atmosphere without permission is the UN Convention on Biological Diversity (1992 Rio Earth Summit again but the geoengineering provision was added in 2012).

      • Except that humans have been geoengineering the atmosphere at least since the discovery of fire.

        Although our effect on the atmosphere hasn’t been a pimple on the posterior of cyanobacteria’s.

      • GK,

        If that’s your definition.

        But smoke in the air is a byproduct of intentional burning of forests and grasslands.

    • The Paris “agreement” gives political cover to the holdovers in the US federal agencies in their resistance to any reformations by the new administrations.
      Despite its lack of any real enforcement mechanism it is great to wave in front of the public and in today’s judicial climate they may use it in some Progressive court in a ruling that defies legal common sense (e.g. Judge Robart’s immigration ruling) to throw down roadblocks to DJT.

  26. This is good news. A great petition.

    I don’t know how President Trump will handle it, as he has many problems at present. He is fighting the establishment in BOTH parties as well as the deep-state. My biggest goal would be to stop the incessant war-mongering that has gone on since ’45. The USA needs a break from fighting wars overseas. My next goal would be to reduce all government activity including faking climate data. The government has defrauded the public in medicine every bit as much as in climate. The idea that only government should decided every issue of the day must be defeated.

    I hope the president is good at fighting a multi-front war.

  27. I’ve lurked on this site for years and this is my first post. I don’t have a scientific background, but as a layman even I can see that this petition is a game changer. Keep up the good work Anthony and the others that make this site a ‘must visit daily’.

    • Beaufort,
      I maybe should not do this, but several years ago a lady made a “first” comment much like yours as a reader but never commenting. I suggested to her that she too had information and ideas to share.
      You might have seen her comments. Look above for the exchange between Janice Moore and Juan Slayton.
      [Hi Janice and Juan. Juan, sorry about all the rain. So far this morning we’ve gotten 2 inches of snow. Part of WA’s “left coast” was to get some too. Janice?]

      • Hi John,
        In California, we steal anything that’s not tied down. Including Caribbean doggerel. Forgive me if I’ve used this before.

        De rain, it falleth on de just,
        And also on de unjust fella.
        But chiefly on de just because
        De unjust steals de just’s umbrella.
        : > )

      • Hey! How COOL! Someone wants to talk to me!! :)

        Hi, John. Yes, indeed, Beaufort. It was Mr. John F. Hultquist who warmly welcomed my after my first feeble attempt at a comment. I will repeat to you the encouragement he gave to me that day in April, 2013, You know things. Share.

        And I have been “sharing” — with gusto! — ever since.

        And John H. is not the only WUWTer who would welcome your commenting. There are LOTS of wonderful scientists/engineers here who LOVE TO TEACH and who are kind. Ignore the jerks who “yell” at you (I try to…. sometimes, I go lick my wounds for a few days, but, if that happens to you, COME BACK — this is a great place to hang out! ….. er…. well…… most of the time, lol).

        Thanks, John!

        (still waiting, too — that Milton quote was SO appropos…. and encouraging).

        Re: snow over here in zip code 98233, none. Just rain this am. Now! VOILA! It is sunny with partly cloudy skies. I was so happy when I looked out the garage door just now I nearly screamed for joy! :)

        Maybe, just MAYBE….. spring is on the way!

  28. I believe that there is a very rational and constitutionally supportable action that Trump should follow, rather than to simply withdraw. All legal scholars agree that this agreement is a Treaty – so Trump should publicly acknowledge that since it is a Treaty, it must be submitted to the Senate for approval, as all Treaties must be. And he should state clearly that he will support the Senate’s decision, whatever it may be.

    And Trump can further promise to follow up the Senate vote without whatever EO’s are required to carry that decision out, if any are necessary.

    • Careful there, the senate has John McCain who is still pissed at the entire country for rejecting him as president and selecting a community organizer instead (he was used to his daddy getting him another plane whenever he crashed one), and Lindsey Graham who has his head stuck in his egomaniacal fundament. Now either of these guys would have been substantially better as president than the community organizer but neither can be depended upon in the senate to support rational action, plus possibly other turncoats and cowards.

      • “Careful there, the senate has John McCain who is still pissed at the entire country for rejecting him as president and selecting a community organizer instead (he was used to his daddy getting him another plane whenever he crashed one), and Lindsey Graham who has his head stuck in his egomaniacal fundament.”

        Passing the Paris Agreement as a Treaty would require a two-thirds favorable vote of the Senate. There’s no way that many Senators will vote for this, McCain and Graham notwithstanding. Even many Senate Democrats will vote against this treaty, after the American public learns just how much it would cost U.S. taxpayers, while other nations pay nothing and have no restrictions on themselves.

        The Paris Agreement is a non-starter in the U.S. Senate. It’s doomed because the science can’t make a case for it, and it’s doomed because it is an obvious financial boondoggle designed to suck money out of U.S. taxpayer’s pockets.

        I would say take it to the U.S. Senate. Then, when it is defeated, it will not be the climate alarmists of the world against Trump, it will be the climate alarmists of the world against the United States. Trump should spread the credit around.

      • TA,
        You may be underestimating the degree to which the Washington establishment wants to subvert Trump. Look at all the Republicans who bought into global warming scams and the Democrats usually march in lock step irrespective of the damage done to our country. Obamacare?

  29. I would sign it but I’m just an old construction worker with some conman sense. I hope Trump has some conman sense.

  30. I’m a 100% in the Dr. Lindzen framing of the climate debate. Regardless, 300?? Sounds like a Climate Thermopylae in the making.

    If people interpret the cosigned as a mere “science” endorsement and then have it reprocessed by the activist media and the consensus cartel little will be achieved. Endorsement science is post normal. Climate alarmism should be rejected because it doesn’t meet the scientific standards of proof. Standards were changed (models) to fit the political goals of the climate regulatory agenda.

    When people focus on the corruption of endorsement science and motives skeptics win the debate. I understand why the science is debated in itself but it’s beyond naive to think that is decisive to broad social debate.

    The endorsement game is dominated by massive social trends (leftist academic culture in science and media) of political predisposition stacked against skeptical reasoning.

    It’s only one specific letter outlining a positive policy step. Getting it reduced down to endorsement science isn’t going to help the goals of the letter. Denouncing the politicized history of green agenda science as a whole makes more progress and Dr. Lindzen is a hero in that regard as well. All-be-it in an overly scholarly fashion much of the time but understandably so since he’s a scholar first and likely could never imagined what 50 years of green advocacy would do to astrophysics.

    Yes, support the goals of the letter but don’t delude yourselves that winning science endorsements (if those are the limited views of the letter) as if each side was fair, rational as if it was really mostly about “science” in the debate was ever true. That’s a false narrative in fact and a loser politically.

    Science is about proof not endorsements and the climate policy debate isn’t about conclusive science through its recent 50 year period. The letter signers are highly qualified but billions go to much larger list of consensus supporters and they mostly share a driving political world view on to of it.

    • Sparta (300 warriors, plus helots) had better propaganda than Thebes (400 on the third day) and Thespiae (700). There had previously been an estimated 7000 Greeks guarding the beach and pass.

  31. Donald Trump has already shown in just his first month that he has the courage and the instincts to do the right things – he’s shown that he’s got more common sense and is more conservative and is more individual freedom loving in one month than what many Republican politicians have shown in their whole careers.

    And he’s also shown he will fight for what he believes, and win, as few politicians have ever done before. I have a good feeling that he can get “science” back on track, if anyone can.

  32. I commented on the Dailysomething that since these 300 must be part of the 3% ( 100% – 97% ) , it should be trivial to put together a petition signed by 9,700 “real” scientists whose rice bowls are at stake .

  33. While it would be nice to change Climate Science form “Model Base” to “Evidence Based”, I think the economic argument of Bjorn Lomberg is stronger:
    Thing like the Paris Treaty create a miniscule change at an enormous cost, (that’s if they succeed in producing any change at all). The inevitable, assuming you believe the model would be postponed by only a few years. A far more economic strategy would be to fix the adverse events as they occur (if they occur) and enjoy the benefits (which have actually occurred on the planet itself as opposed to a computer model).
    Trump is more likely to understand the economic argument since he is a businessman.

    • This is just the strangest thing. When arguing with alarmists I frequently try the economic case and say that even if I accept all of the direst predictions of IPCC, how much is it going to cost to effect what minuscule and likely beneficial change? They never engage with that side of the debate and invariably take it as watershed moment of you conceding defeat.

  34. Don’t hope for it. Trump made a lot of promises but it’s been more than 100 days (?) and nothing is happening. (NATO, UN etc)

  35. Over and over research finds the previous Eemian to have been, at its peak, warmer than today. And over and over research uses INCREASED vegetation as that signal. Today’s warming has not yet risen over the previous interstadial and may have as much as 2 degrees more to warm before it matches it. Warmth is benign and indeed beneficial, were it not for the FACT we are heading for a jagged dive to another stadial. That period will be worth global commitments towards survival, not taxing plant food.
    http://s3.amazonaws.com/academia.edu.documents/34285170/Quantitative_reconstruction_of_climate_variability_during_the_Eemian.pdf?AWSAccessKeyId=AKIAIWOWYYGZ2Y53UL3A&Expires=1488132066&Signature=IXEGDNA%2Fx4RWbbcXtS%2FMy3gRZsQ%3D&response-content-disposition=inline%3B%20filename%3DSeiriene_V._Kuhl_N._Kisieliene_D._2014..pdf

  36. The letter needs to include three key points that form the basis of the justification for policy reform. The first is prediction accuracy of the IPCC vs. satellites. The second is a review of cycles and their lengths and variability. The third is a call for research integrity review.

  37. If Donald Trump dosen’t heed and act to implement the advice from genuine scientists and intelligent thinkers his chances of retaining a majority in the senate in 2018 will nose dive.

    His chances of re-election will do likewise.

    He must no let gravy train scientist’s propaganda dominate reasoned and selfless scientific inquiry.

    The incredible arrogance of Gore,Mann, and others who believe that the intellectual capacity of everyday people in akin to a rubbish tip is disgraceful.

    Put the biggest organised crime gang in the history of humanity out of business with people of scientific high intelligence and…….. integrity.

    • Yes, Trump never had a bigger chance. He must take it offensive and not hesitantly give it away. And I think Steve Bannon knows this and will curb the influence of Ivanka aka Yael. He probably did this before the moment I wrote this. Blood is never thicker in politics than water. An old rule from ancient Rome.

  38. And there are also others in his team: ….. Pruitt added the EPA’s focus on combating climate change under former President Barack Obama had cost jobs and prevented economic growth, leading many Americans to want to see the EPA eliminated completely.

    “I think its justified,” he said. “I think people across this country look at the EPA much like they look at the IRS. I hope to be able to change that.”

    Great things are coming soon. The wildest nightmares of the global socialists now come true.

    http://www.reuters.com/article/us-usa-trump-epa-idUSKBN1640S9?feedType=RSS&feedName=topNews&utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campa

    This is too good to be able to experience …….

  39. I may be missing them and the scrolling petition window doesn’t support searching, but there are at least a couple of names I’d like to see as petition signers who aren’t.

    IMHO, the petition goes unnecessarily far by claiming that CO2 is a major benefit and that observed warming has been benign. Not everyone will sign on to that. I believe a better petition could be crafted on the following mostly procedural points:

    1. IPCC claims, especially in the SPM, consistently over-state the confidence reasonably justified by research.

    2. IPCC routinely violates its own procedures regarding cutoff dates for publications cited, and permits lead authors to re-write important sections based on new publications after the review comment period has closed.

    3. IPCC authors and lead authors are chosen in some cases for the conclusions of their research rather than the quality of it. In some cases junior researchers are elevated above far more experienced ones.

    4. Climategate emails reveal a pattern of “gaming the system” on peer-reviewed publications. Valid research has been suppressed and questionable research promoted due to collusion by IPCC researchers.

    5. IPCC Summary for Policy Makers (SPM) is written primarily by political officials before the various section working groups have completed their work. In some cases key sections are re-written to conform to the SPM.

    6. The SPM as a result presents an unjustifiably negative picture of both the extent and likely effects of human-caused warming.

    7. Further US participation in the IPCC as currently constituted only increases the chances we will undertake very expensive and pointless industrial policy measures to avoid some largely phantom future menace. Either reform the IPCC or withdraw from it.

    All of this has been documented previously. The IPCC SPM, which is the only thing most people ever hear about, is a political manifesto cloaked in scientific findings which consistently claim unjustifiable confidence levels. Add to that the documented collusion to suppress contrary research and you have good grounds to ignore the IPCC findings and not undertake any policy initiatives based on them.

    • That more CO2 has been a benefit is an easily demonstrable observation. It’s a scientific fact.

      Unless you’re a Green Meanie who ironically hates a greener earth and better environment for humanity.

    • “7. Further US participation in the IPCC as currently constituted only increases the chances we will undertake very expensive and pointless industrial policy measures to avoid some largely phantom future menace. Either reform the IPCC or withdraw from it.”

      This should be done at times of Dr Rajendra Pachauri. The “Zeit” of 2013:

      ZEIT: Three years ago, you had made proposals for a reform of the IPCC. The aim was to reduce the impact of environmentalists and other associations. It was about dealing with conflicts of interest and mistakes. Was this implemented?

      Von Storch: No, but why should they listen to me? I am still not aware of an IPCC body which independently asserts allegations that there are errors in the report. And one checks whether authors can represent foreign interests, but only by asking: Are you paid by someone? So with money. But not in the currency of that good feeling to belong to the right and good rulers. ”

      Hans v. Storch is a widely respected climate researcher and former IPCC researcher and contributor. But not an alarmist.

      http://www.zeit.de/2013/40/weltklimarat-ipcc-bericht-interview-hans-von-storch/seite-2

      What happened instead? Nothing. On the contrary, the gargoyles of global warming have looked over or paused or “(kar(l)t the pause”. And have used the record El Nino 2015/16 to spread their miss messages further.

      No, a real kick in the butt is what deserves these people.

    • Anything sent to Trump should mention fake data, fake sources – fake, he likes that word and understands ‘conspiracy’. NOAA, something the govt funds must have come to his attention and be in his sites. Trump has been around a long time, he knows a thing or two or ten.

  40. Dear Eric,

    Many thanks indeed: this is your best article / post EVER !

    It is sensational, refreshing and ultimate. Thank you.

    Regards,
    WL

  41. Thank you Professor Lindzen.

    I’m sure President Trump will use this supporting document wisely as he CONTINUES to make good on the promises that he made. Its an amazing thing to see such a high level DULY elected leader follow thru on campaign promises.

    To the readers of WUWT please recognize the grave threat that is facing the country. This threat is of such a grave nature that should they succeed far worse consequences will occur within our republic. Please read the following attachment written by a knowledgeable and respected expert on the subject.

    http://www.paulcraigroberts.org/2017/02/16/trump-presidency-rip/

    Do More Than Pray
    Thank you

    • Thats Snow from yesterday. In the meantime, the FBI an the intelligence gives statements, that there is no evidence of the Trump-haters conclusions in the press. Therefore there is no need to pray. For Trumps Life to pray for other reasons is however appropriate. Already several times, American presidents were a target. And when I read the hateful comments in the social media and Democrat party congresses, there might be a climate to implement such attacks. But I am certain that the team Trump and Trump himself knows this. Unlike John F. Kennedy, who seemed to be to sure because of his popularity. And in addition, it is a movement. There are many GOPs and members of his Team who are still pursuing a more restrictive line. It does not all depend on Trump, but much. And there are many political scientists who prophesy a civil war in the US in the event of an assassination attempt on Trump. A civil war, which will be won by the right and will move the country even further to the right, as happened under Trump

      • The authenticity of evidence is unnecessary for deep state operations. What is necessary is a lack of discernment in a suitable number of the masses. The deep state ensures this thru a weaponized media in the short term and a number of long term tactics generally geared towards state dependence.

        Taking down Flynn was child’s play for them as Obama left the gift of deep politicization in key agencies.

        Civil war is a messy game and the least desired option. Escalating a day to day propaganda campaign (Obama legalized this btw) that is meant to create a seditious atmosphere thru key groups is far more effective. An excellent example of this technique is a group called Indivisible.

        Once CAGW pillars are attacked you’ll see this group used to bully the issue on the local level. The goal is to harass/distrupt and build momentum towards impeachment.

        As always good music helps to make the point

      • “Taking down Flynn was child’s play for them as Obama left the gift of deep politicization in key agencies.”

        Flynn took himself down by not being completely truthful to Vice President Pence. The MSM had nothing to do with Flynn’s firing.

        If Flynn had told the Vice President the truth, he would still be employed, and it would not have mattered that he talked to the Russians. No wrongdoing has been found according to the FBI.

        It was Flynn’s job to talk to the Russians. It was also Flynn’s job to tell the vice president exactly what he said to the Russians. Flynn failed in that last requirement and was fired because of it. An internal matter, not brought about by the MSM.

  42. Thinking a about Willis’ concerns of giving ammunition to AGW ideologues. Why not start a companion list of “deplorables” who would have signed if the list of invitees were not cleansed for quality purposes. I just have a lowly BA degree in Geology and a MBA. I guess I am not important except as part of a hug mass of un-tainted “deplorables” I am not buying into the AGW scare until proof of skill in prediction is demonstrated by scientific method a la Popper. Go figure there are a huge number of people who have common sense. You do not need to be an informed esoteric climate scientist to judge skill in prediction. That is the beauty of scientific theory. I really don’t have to delve into understanding your formulas and models. The test is whether the data verifies the skill of the “scientists” mumble jumble or falsifies it. This is an up or down in my mind. If your model on how science advances is Kunn. OK tweak the model to get better results until the tweaking is obviously ridiculous to all who are still live. Thhe point is to get better results in skill over time. One of th best examples iI have seen recently is the NOAA diagram Offered at the Tall Ships Conference in Boston this month showing the improvement in hurricane track predictability over the past 30 years.

    SO how to identify the size of the un reported “deplorable” constituency.

    • Well imagine how you’d feel if a lot of young earth creationists – not a geologist among them -got up a petition to have the President declare earth created in 4004 BC

      climate scientists by definition study climate and are more informed about it than people who create posts on websites.

    • The form can change “this” but “stupidity” is in the DNA.

      I don’t think there is enough political logic to even force the climate change movement into academic incubation mode. So it’s no where near ending.

      Tesla trading near 245 off recent high of 287, this company says it all about social stupidity. Feds give the public $7500 per car subside to largely the upper 1% of income earners to be “green” and “fight emissions”. States like California throw more subsidies into the hat. Of course there is no net emissions saved from the charge process, the long term pollution may well be worse from the battery outcome.

      A 40 billion dollar company, just a tiny slice of a 1.5 trillion green industrial complex and much of it tied to climate policy handouts and priority.

      Want to talk solar subsides next? The Book of Stupid has an entire chapter on this.

  43. First sentence of letter reads: “Citizens of the USA and America’s admirers everywhere support of your campaign promises to place . . .”

    Has this been corrected? Either get rid of ‘support’ or ‘of’. Both together make no sense.

    I have long been a fan of Richard Lindzen. How about another Petition in Support of Richard Lindzen’s Petition, one that all of us without science degrees can sign?

    /Mr Lynn

  44. Let’s just hope that Dr Lindzen’s letter and attached petition reaches its intended recipient AND if it does, that he actually bothers to READ it and consider its extremely important message. (I don’t think it’s very likely that Dr Lindzen personally handed his petition to Mr Trump)…

  45. Pruitt/Conway received the letter and it will be helpful as an HONORABLE tool of support. Like all good men they don’t easily accept that their opponents don’t play fair. In the end this is YOUR opponents greatest advantage.

    They gain ground to head you off at the pass with methods that you consider unethical and unfair. By the time you recognize them for what they are your opponents have already secured ground in the battle.

    Trump getting elected was the equivalent of the comatose patient being awoken from his state. The success of the movement will require a far greater willingness to beat your opponent at his game.

  46. Ironically, I bet 97% of the people who signed that petition believe that climate change is real :)

  47. Having seen this post, today I re-read Dr. Lindzen’s 1990 article “Some Coolness Concerning Global Warming”. It was very insightful in its own time and remains relevant, as the GCM’s still suffer essentially the same limitations and conceptual defects today as in 1990. To me, this seems like a must-read piece of background for any WUWT reader. A pdf is freely available on the page given here. The article is in the list and there is a button to download the pdf. http://journals.ametsoc.org/toc/bams/71/3

    • My favorite quote from this article is on page 295 (of the journal), lower right, “Models commonly have difficulty reproducing well-observed major features of the current climate … without what is euphemistically referred to as ‘tuning.’ “

  48. US withdrawal from the Paris agreement would effectively scuttle it which is easily done since it was dead in the water from the outset because it was purely voluntary. China, India, Russia, and Brazil, which have been going through the motions on emissions reductions for years now, will either pull out also or simply scale back their efforts to an even lower point than they’re at now; and since they,along with the US, contribute 54% of all global emissions, the Paris deal will be laid to rest once and for all. In fact, maybe we should be reserving space for it alongside Kyoto and Copenhagen.

    • As an actual enforced agreement Paris is meaningless, the larger purpose is maintaining the climate authority system. Another step along the road with its heart set on global carbon controls beyond democracy. Similar in design to the global Keynesian monetary authority and directive.

      That’s the dream of central planners and their supporters everywhere.

  49. Wouldn’t it be a fine thing if DJT invites all signatories to the White House for a meeting? I can see the Alarmists heads exploding by the score…what a gore…

  50. But I thought Al Gore said the “Science is settled ” . Gore couldn’t carry the jock strap of any of the 300 signatory of the letter yet $$Trillions get directed to an unscientific fraud .
    This will be the easiest $$Trillion dollars Trump ever saved .

    • Abraham’s rebuttal makes perfect sense to me. A lot of the signatories don’t have climate science qualifications and quite a few seem to have worked for or have links with the fossil fuel industry.

      [if you’ll check, you’ll also see that Michael Mann, James Hansen, Gavin Schmidt and many others don’t have climate science degrees…they are no more qualified to model the future than the people who are criticizing the follow of their cottage industry -mod]

      • One doesn’t need to be a climate scientist to google the names of these scientists to see if their qualifications are relevant to climate science or more importantly to see if they have connections to the fossil fuel industry.

      • ..FACTS Dermot, FACTS,.,….Back up your accusations with FACTS …AKA…Evidence ! I am sick and tired of you liberal nut bags accusing real scientists of being in the pay of “the Fossil Fuel Industry” !!…Look in the mirror….

      • Facts, Butch? Dermot gave you facts, an article that talks about the lack of scientific qualifications of the signatories, as well as their lack of relevant published research.

        To the moderator, your comment about climate science degrees ignores the point that the author made about relevant scientific research. Mann, Hansen and Schmidt have published a great deal of research in atmospheric sciences. The signatories mentioned in the article? Almost none.

    • And the article was right, wasn’t it?

      The 300 don’t include people who have studied, researched or published on climate or anything related to it.

      • The usual cartel inflation comment. Climate science is closer to a humanities field then many other more serious science fields. Even with that given what is published outside the consensus peer review cartel? It’s largely a closed shop.

        The rest of science sits in judgement of political hack climate science not the other way around.

      • Read the list again Griff. For example,does not Nils Morner and sea levels ring a bell,

  51. Christy, Curry, Lomberg, Tol, Ridley, Svensmark, Shaviv and others I’d like to see on the list are missing.

  52. It would be enormously helpful if there weren’t many names on the list which are, er, just names with no quals or anything else appended. Given that the list maker must have been aware that this list would be scrutinised with an electron scope by hyper-avid detractors how could they have been so mind-bogglingly stupid as to do this?? Lordy give a boy a man’s job! Next time I insist on being a proof reader.

  53. Despite al the scientific evidence that worries over CO2 are tax raising bunk, there is an even greater probably realistic truth. Mankind will not be merely oxidising Carbon,i.e, burning fossil fuels, as a realistic main source for his power and heat needs to the same degree in 2101 as it did in 2001. The same as energy needs were not supplied by cetacean blubber in 1901, as in1801. We will be some fifty or more years into the controlled Fusion era, the true Solar Energy. Propaganda aside, the diffuse power offered by PV or thermal Sun powered energy harvesting, will never be truly economic,

    Mankind will have advanced to better cleaner and essentially inexhaustible source by half a century. The resistance to Fission based energy, is largely due to the large cache of highly radio-toxic materials stored there, while Fusion has little or none such large quantities of toxins.. Man or Nature can destroy a controlled Fusion power plant to little dileterious effect; and the same cannot be true for Fission without massive efforts, which may be to no avail.

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