Mark Serreze, University of Colorado Boulder
With the setting of the sun and the onset of polar darkness, the Arctic Ocean would normally be crusted with sea ice along the Siberian coast by now. But this year, the water is still open.
I’ve watched the region’s transformations since the 1980s as an Arctic climate scientist and, since 2008, as director of the National Snow and Ice Data Center. I can tell you, this is not normal. There’s so much more heat in the ocean now than there used to be that the pattern of autumn ice growth has been completely disrupted.
To understand what’s happening to the sea ice this year and why it’s a problem, let’s look back at the summer and into the Arctic Ocean itself.
Siberia’s 100-degree summer
The summer melt season in the Arctic started early. A Siberian heat wave in June pushed air temperatures over 100 degrees Fahrenheit at Verkhoyansk, Russia, for the first time on record, and unusual heat extended over much of the Arctic for weeks.
The Arctic as a whole this past summer was at its warmest since at least 1979, when satellite measurements started providing data allowing for full coverage of the Arctic.
With that heat, large areas of sea ice melted out early, and that melting launched a feedback process: The loss of reflective sea ice exposed dark open ocean, which readily absorbs the sun’s heat, promoting even more ice melt.
The Northern Sea Route, along the Russian coast, was essentially free of ice by the middle of July. That may be a dream for shipping interests, but it’s bad news for the rest of the planet.
Warmth sneaks in underwater
The warm summer is only part of the explanation for this year’s unusual sea ice levels.
Streams of warmer water from the Atlantic Ocean flow into the Arctic at the Barents Sea. This warmer, saltier Atlantic water is usually fairly deep under the more buoyant Arctic water at the surface. Lately, however, the Atlantic water has been creeping up. That heat in the Atlantic water is helping to keep ice from forming and melting existing sea ice from below.
It’s a process called “Atlantification”. The ice is now getting hit both from the top by a warming atmosphere and at the bottom by a warming ocean. It’s a real double whammy.
While we’re still trying to catch up with all of the processes leading to Atlantification, it’s here and it’s likely to get stronger. https://www.youtube.com/embed/C17-Z_sl5cI?wmode=transparent&start=0
Climate change’s assault on sea ice
In the background of all of this is global climate change.
The Arctic sea ice extent and thickness have been dropping for decades as global temperatures rise. This year, when the ice reached its minimum extent in September, it was the second lowest on record, just behind that of 2012.
As the Arctic loses ice and the ocean absorbs more solar radiation, global warming is amplified. That can affect ocean circulation, weather patterns and Arctic ecosystems spanning the food chain, from phytoplankton all the way to top predators.
On the Atlantic side of the Arctic, open water this year extended to within 5 degrees of the North Pole. The new Russian Icebreaker Arktika, on its maiden voyage, found easy sailing all the way to the North Pole. A goal of its voyage was to test how the nuclear-powered ship handled thick ice, but instead of the hoped-for 3-meter-thick ice, most of the ice was in a loose pack. It was little more than 1 meter thick, offering little resistance.
For sea ice to build up again this year, the upper layer of the Arctic Ocean needs to lose the excess heat it picked up during summer.
The pattern of regional anomalies in ice extent is different each year, reflecting influences like regional patterns of temperature and winds. But today, it’s superimposed on the overall thinning of the ice as global temperatures rise. Had the same atmospheric patterns driving this year’s big ice loss off Siberia happened 30 years ago, the impact would have been much less, as the ice was more resilient then and could have taken a punch. Now it can’t.
Is sea ice headed for a tipping point?
The decay of the Arctic sea ice cover shows no sign of stopping. There probably won’t be a clear tipping point for the sea ice, though.
Research so far suggests we’ll stay on the current path, with the amount of ice declining and weather systems more easily disrupting the ice because it’s thinner and weaker than it used to be. https://www.youtube.com/embed/vtM9KTVGFVw?wmode=transparent&start=0
The bigger picture
This year’s events in the Arctic are just part of the climate change story of 2020.
Global average temperatures have been at or near record highs since January. The West has been both hot and dry – the perfect recipe for massive wildfires – and warm water in the Gulf of Mexico has helped fuel more tropical storms in the Atlantic than there are letters in the alphabet. If you’ve been ignoring climate change and hoping that it will just go away, now would be an appropriate time to pay attention.
Mark Serreze, Research Professor of Geography and Director, National Snow and Ice Data Center, University of Colorado Boulder
This article is republished from The Conversation under a Creative Commons license. Read the original article.
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The fresh water will more easily freeze… nothing to see here.
Except a record low extent for this date… truly exceptionally low for the Laptev.
(and not just for the satellite record either: the Soviet/Russian records going back to 1933 are available and they show this year is far lower on Russian side than any date since 1933…)
Hi Griffo
It is likely to be lower the next year too, and possibly another one. It is quasi-harmonic natural oscillation at its ~70 years periodicity minimum, so is H. Hemisphere’s temperature at it’s maximum, look at the graph and calm down.
http://www.vukcevic.co.uk/ArcticIce.htm
No surprise, just sit back and enjoy the warmer climate while it lasts
All Sereze’s graph shows is that two cherry picked years of the 2011-2019 period were lower than the average of that decade. What does that tell us about all the other years he chose NOT to show us?
WOW, that should be headline news. We’d all been brainwashed into believing that it had already hit the tipping in 1997 and it was an ever accelerating “death spiral” ever since.
So now even the alarmists at Boulder have had to admit that we are not seeing “run away melting”. They winding their necks in a bit an claiming just a continued decline. Presumably one of the dastardly “trends”. If ever you can fit a straight line using Excel trend fitter, it is formal proof that said linear trend will continue indefinately are you can bet the farm ( or the national economy for that matter ) on it doing so.
Yes, you can make a straight-line decline look like part of sine function if you make the wavelength long enough.
Andydo
I was going to say the same thing, except you said it first and I didn’t want to insult Vuk, because I loved his last line:
” just sit back and enjoy the warmer climate while it lasts”
Oh, come on! There’s clearly an effect over and above any natural cycle.
If its a cycle, why is this one so low? Lower than the last low point, by miles?
RUBBISH.. It is MUCH HIGHER than for most of the last 10,000 years
WHY is it SO HIGH, griff ?????
Stop your idiotic natural climate change denial, griff
850 AD to 1250 AD Greenland was warm enough to have FORESTS (Viking graves have been found with tree roots grown through them), grapes, and to raise barley.
4 CENTURIES of “climate changed” in Greenland (wasn’t local, they were also growing grain crops in Norway) and the world didn’t end in flames.
Figure it out.
Griff is the 5,000 year old man. He remembers all previous cycles and took detailed measurements so he could worry about everything at an appropriate time. Or else he thinks that 100 years is along time to the Earth. Or else he’s just another Socialist determined to destroy Western civilization.
Except that the Laptev Sea has had a jetstream over it for almost all of October and a lot of September, A jetstream coming from the southern edge of Russia and dragging lots of warm air with it.
and your point?
Most post was originally attached as a reply to griff, above, but it has moved.
I wish that jetstream would bring us some of your so called “warm air”.
It’s friggin freezing every day in the middle (here in URAL) and the wind is from the south for the last weeks…At night it’s already down to -6 and snow has already fallen like clockwork, just like it does every year in mid October.
Better know what you are on about!
In the Baltic they already have the communal heating on, and I am not looking forward at all to my trip up there by the sea.
I don’t care what the numpties are writing.
The only winter without Baltic sea ice that I can remember was last year.
I have no doubt it will freeze solid and they can open the ice roads they didn’t manage last year come january again.
I will wager $10,000 in an escrow account that Arctic sea ice formation from October 21st through March 21st, 2021 will be in the Top 3 since 1979.
Any takers?
Nope. I agree.
Feel free to use me as the escrow agent 😀
Pillage Ridiot
The top three
largest areas…. OR
lowest areas….OR
most volume….OR
Least volume……….?
Just asking, in case you’re wearing flip – flops
In July 2020 the Arctic Ocean was up to 1.4C cooler than in July 2002 according to MODIS SST data. Over the 20 years, the area averaged SST reduced by 0.2C.
https://1drv.ms/u/s!Aq1iAj8Yo7jNg3GJZzfUccCa6osu
Note that it has not changed at the equator because it cannot. It is tightly controlled to its current maximum by an incredibly powerful thermostat known as Convective Available Potential Energy (CAPE); the reason for monsoons and cyclones.
Note that the two highest recent Arctic sea ice minima where in 2013 and 2014, after the record low of 2012.
And 2017 and 2018 were well above the low year of 2016.
And 2008 was higher than the low year of 2007, while 2009 was slightly above 2013 and 2014.
However the low year of 2019 was followed by the second lowest 2020, thanks to a Super El Nino in 2015-16 and another big one in 2019-20.
But now we’re in a La Nina and open Arctic waters are radiating heat to the air and on to space.
Plus of course the low years feature at least one summer storm to pile up and spread out the floes.
Let us all simply ignore griff, it is not worth it to rebut him and he will not change, don’t encourage the trolls.
He wilfully refuses to learn anything.
When you observe something like this, it’s something else, beyond lack of education or stupidity even, so go easy on him if you can. It’s not going to change, and it does serve a purpose, albeit not the one intended.
The problem is that any idiocy that’s not refuted stands as the final word.
What we need is to form an anti-griff collective so that we can assign a single person per week to refute the griff collectives nonsense. That way they can’t take over threads.
I reckon Griff is really Eric – just making sure we’re paying attention and keep practicing our rebuttals…
Our friend Griffo is actually a climate sceptic who is playing a ‘devils advocate’. His fallacies/ sophisms are offered in order to make sure true sceptics are still ‘on the ball’.
Ah yes! The collective! We will divide up the work and there will be no rewards as no one will really work. Then we will institute trials in order to figure out who to blame for the failures of our system. We will root out these running dogs ruthlessly ( unless we have a Ruth out there).
The problem is I think Griff might be the only expertise we have on collectives and fabricating evidence. What to do, what to do?
griff is not trying to convince any of the regulars here. He is hoping to scare off people who are trying to learn more about whether the climate catastrophe is a hoax or not. Therefore it’s better to respond to him by posting information about failed climate forecasts adjacent to his comments. For example documentation about the failed predictions that the Arctic would be ice free by 2013, or 2014, or 2015, or 2016, or 2018: https://cei.org/blog/wrong-again-50-years-failed-eco-pocalyptic-predictions
“Never argue with an idiot. They will drag you down to their level and beat you with experience.”
— Samuel Clemens
THERE IS NO GRIFTER !
HE IS A FIGNEWTON OF THE IMAGINATION !
The Grifter is a fictional character created in the warped mind of out beloved moderator, formerly known as Johnny Rotten, now respectable as Charles “lefty” Rotter, although no one knows where the “lefty” came from.
Mr Rotten uses the Griff moniker to still up page views at this website, like feeding raw meat to lions. For inspiration, Mr. Rotter uses an old TV comedy character created by Johnny Carson long ago, Floyd R. Turbo, but reversing the politics from conservative to leftist, for the “beloved” Griff character.
This information has been verified — proven true — by me reading it on the internet, which was invented by Al Gore, one of the most honest men in human history, now better known as a climate perfesser: Al “the climate blinp” Gore.
This comment is Moderator Bait.
I have often thought the very same thing.
I too think it’s just a way to stir the pot, a fun game, a way to get us all talking! It works doesn’t it.
I love Griff. He makes these threads much more fun to read. Comment on Griff, if only for my enjoyment.
Griff what caused the previous low extent that took place before the discovery of fossil fuel for energy? Enlighten us from you George Soros Stylebook.
griff hunts through the 10’s of thousands of data point for weather in the arctic so that they can find one that is going in the direction they are paid to push.
Hello? This is 3.2 million less square kilometres of ice than the 1990s average… that really isn’t a n isolated data point, is it?
Hellooooo , there is FAR MORE Arctic sea ice than for most of the last 10,000 years
Late 1970s and the LIA were isolated points
Again……
WHY do you prefer Arctic sea ice to Arctic sea LIFE.
Is it just that you HATE life so much ?
And again
Do you have ANY EVIDENCE at all that the highly beneficial drop in Arctic sea ice from the extreme highs of the LIA and late 1970s has any human causation?
Good. Ice is a bane & a nuisance, not anything useful.
Griff give you brain a chance !! Al gore is Roung about Everything
Link
Explanation period (B).
Link for the above comment
https://www.researchgate.net/publication/228908543_Observed_sea_ice_extent_in_the_Russian_Arctic_1933-2006
YAWN..
Its STILL way higher than it has been for MOST of the Holocene
The current RECOVERY from the extreme highs of the late 1970’s, similar to the Little Ice Age..
.. has meant that Arctic sea life has made a resurgence.
The drop in sea ice slightly toward the pre-LIA levels has opened up the food supply for the nearly extinct Bowhead Whale, and they are returning to the waters around Svalbard.
https://partner.sciencenorway.no/arctic-ocean-forskningno-fram-centre/the-ice-retreats–whale-food-returns/1401824
The Blue Mussel is also making a return, having been absent for a few thousand years, apart from a brief stint during the MWP.
https://journals.sagepub.com/doi/abs/10.1177/0959683617715701?journalCode=hola
Many other species of whale are also returning now that the sea ice extent has dropped from the extreme highs of the LIA. Whales cannot swim on ice. !
https://blog.poseidonexpeditions.com/whales-of-svalbard/
Great thing is, that because of fossil fuels and plastics, they will no longer be hunted for whale blubber for lamps and for whale bone.
Hopefully the Arctic doesn’t re-freeze too much in the next AMO cycle, and these glorious creatures get a chance to survive and multiply.
From the second link..
“Shallow marine molluscs that are today extinct close to Svalbard, because of the cold climate, are found in deposits there dating to the early Holocene. The most warmth-demanding species found, Zirfaea crispata, currently has a northern limit 1000 km farther south, indicating that August temperatures on Svalbard were 6°C warmer at around 10.2–9.2 cal. ka BP, when this species lived there. The blue mussel, Mytilus edulis, returned to Svalbard in 2004 following recent warming, and after almost 4000 years of absence, excluding a short re-appearance during the Medieval Warm Period 900 years ago.
Arctic is so much COOLER than it was for most of the Holocene, which explains why there is still so much sea ice up there.
You would think that someone like Sereeze would not be such a climate change DENIER, and would look more at the facts and longer term history of Arctic sea ice, and realise it is still in the top 10% of the last 10,000 years rather that making stupid yabbering noises.
The article is leftist climate scaremongering, not real science, and not worthy of space here. It is gloom and doom nonsense. Yet another leftist biased “perfesser”, always seeing gloom and doom ahead … unless leftists rule the world. That’s why the grifter loves this opinion piece masquerading as real science.
Interesting how few numbers are in this essay — one chart that does not match the data I found, and posted at the link below. and one number — the high temperature in some Russian town that just happened to be slightly above the prior record for that town … which the author neglected to mention. Yes, the high temperature on ONE day of the year, in ONE Russian town, tells us EVERYTHING we need to know about the Arctic climate? … Not.
There was lots of sea ice in 2017 — was there no global warming then?
2020 has been similar to 2019 so far — 2019 finished the winter season with a large gain of sea ice extent. Let’s wait until the winter is over. And even if 2020 ends up with a lower sea ice extent than 2019, then so what? Our planet has been in an intermittent global warming trend since the 1690s. And sea level has been increasing for 20000, years … How is Arctic ice melting a danger to anyone.
Arctic ice extent has barely changed in 14 years based on data from mid-October from MASIE:
https://elonionbloggle.blogspot.com/2020/10/artic-ice-is-melting-and-then-it-comes.html
Can you add a link to the original data?
SEA LEVELS
RISING
Science has uncovered in-
disputable evidence that the
level of our oceans is rising.
This is the result of a sudden
and unexpected increase in our planet’s northern tempera-tures. Ice masses are melting
rapidly away. If the rate of
thawing continues, civilisation
near the sea may be sub-
merged and profound changes
be wrought in climate, soil, sea and the race itself. The whole face of the earth may be moving towards a vast transformation.
The discovery that the earth
is getting warmer was made by
Professor Hans Ahlmann, of
Stockholm University, while he was studying glaciers. His facts have beneficent as well as alarming aspects. Here is what he found:—
Air temperatures over much
of the Arctic and sub-Antartic
have soared as much as 10 de-
grees since 1919, a rise that is more noticeable in winter than in summer.
Ocean temperature readings
have climbed from three to five
degrees in a score of years.
February sea temperatures in
parts of the Arctic were eight degrees higher on the average.
A glacier on Spitsbergen is
losing ice through melting at the rate of 30,000,000 tons a
year. As late as 1910 glacier
ice figured far down a Nor-
wegian valley. Today it has completely vanished. All gla-
ciers that Professor Ahlmann
measured are sinking rapidly.
Air photography over the Rus-sian sector of the Arctic showed a reduction of drift
ice of more than 1,000,000 tons
in 20 years. On the Siberian
mainland the limit of frozen
earth has been retreating
dozens of miles towards the
pole annually. As a result of
all this, the green of conifer
forests is beginning to mantle
once barren northern wastes.
This may mean new supplies
of timber and pulpwood.
Professor Ahlmann’s calcu-
lations show that the annual
disappearance of ice and snow from the polar cap is raising
the global sea level about one
foot every 200 years. This is
a slow rise. But it shows ac-
celeration from year to year.
“If this accelerated rate is maintained it can mean pro-found changes to sea-level communities and to the earth’s
weather,” the Professor avers.
“It could submerge seaports
such as London, Singapore,
Buenos Aires, forcing their in-
habitants to flee to higher
places and causing a widely different distribution of peoples.
The situation calls for immedi-ate study on an international
and urgent basis.”—Los An-
geles “Times”.
Record since when????
Keep up the good work Griff. You are one of the most interesting commenters here. Always well informed comments, and on the topic. I have learnt a lot.
This site wouldhave been a boring echo chamber without you, and a few others.
/Jan
Pity he is always PROVABLE WRONG
And no, they are NIL-INFORMED comments
Not backed by anything except AGW mantra
If you have learnt from griff, your knowledge has gone BACKWARDS in leaps and bounds.
Who cares? What possible use is arctic ice? Why are liberals and progressives so terrified of change?
you dont understand atlantification
Hi Steven
People shouldn’t take for granted everything written in the ‘Carbon Brief’ blog
The ice free Arctic is going to radiate a whole lot more heat into space during the NH winter than an iced up Arctic. Part of the Earth’s feedback system. What exactly is the worry? And the warmer the water, the more heat radiated out.
Steven Mosher October 29, 2020 at 10:35 am
you dont understand atlantification
This comment seems to be directed to Mark Serreze.
_ _ _ _
Explain this in the context of atlantification:
“It will without doubt have come to your Lordship’s knowledge that a considerable change of climate, inexplicable at present to us, must have taken place in the Circumpolar Regions, by which the severity of the cold that has for centuries past enclosed the seas in the high northern latitudes in an impenetrable barrier of ice has been during the last two years, greatly abated.
(This) affords ample proof that new sources of warmth have been opened and give us leave to hope that the Arctic Seas may at this time be more accessible than they have been for centuries past, and that discoveries may now be made in them not only interesting to the advancement of science but also to the future intercourse of mankind and the commerce of distant nations.”
President of the Royal Society, London, to the Admiralty, 20th November, 1817 [13]
*13 President of the Royal Society, Minutes of Council,
Volume 8. pp.149-153, Royal Society, London.
20th November, 1817.
For Marxists and Climatistas like Serreze, the past does not exist, except where it can be rewritten.
There are MANY, MANY things you do not understand, mosh..
.. yet you still make stupid comments about them.
Neither do you, nor does Serreze.
Perhaps if you both take a look at this you will start to understand:
http://ocean.dmi.dk/arctic/meant80n_anomaly.uk.php
Start by asking why +80N mean summer anomaly is stuck at zero since 1960 and what that means. Then ask why +80N mean winter anomaly has been growing since 2000 and not between 1960-2000.
The Arctic warms when the planet cools. This year the planet has started to cool since August and is likely to cool down for a couple of years. We have the same temperature at this time than in 2017. Next year will probably be the coldest since 2015.
“Start by asking why +80N mean summer anomaly is stuck at zero since 1960…”
Thats fairly easy, melting ice puts a cap on temperature in summer because of the latent heat of fusion. As long as there is some ice to melt, summer temps will hover around zero.
“The Arctic warms when the planet cools.”
Based on what?
“We have the same temperature at this time than in 2017. Next year will probably be the coldest since 2015.:
Based on what, other than your 3 year trend? “Coldest” is an interesting choice of words, btw.
Ignore that:
a. Arctic temperatures are climbing faster than anywhere else,
b. this year was another close to record low extent and is, of this date, the lowest,
c. the pack is thinner than 2012 and more vulnerable to extreme events,
d. Atlantification is accellerating and the open water is mixing more and
e. albedo is falling.
No, its wishful thinking that all this going to just miraculously turn around. As the buffer of melting ice is removed, summers temperatures will also start to climb, feeding back to melt the ice even faster. The days of the Arctic sea ice are well and truly numbered.
a. Arctic temperatures are climbing faster than anywhere else,
Utter BS.. No warming in the Arctic this century except from the 2015 El Nino
b. this year was another close to record low extent and is, of this date, the lowest,
More utter BS.. Arctic sea ice is still WAY above what it has been for most of the last 10,000 years
c. the pack is thinner than 2012 and more vulnerable to extreme events,
SO WHAT.. still far more Arctic sea ice than for most of the last 1-0,000 years, and Arctic sea life is finally returning after being frozen out during the LIA and late 1970s
d. Atlantification is accellerating and the open water is mixing more and
More utter BS….. Northern Atlantic has cooled significantly this century
e. albedo is falling.”
LOL.. more unsubstantiated garbage
You know you have absolutely ZERO EVIDENCE of any human causation of the NATURAL variability of Arctic sea ice due to the AMO , and the highly beneficial warming since the LIA.
1… Do you have any empirical scientific evidence for warming by atmospheric CO2?
2… In what ways has the global climate changed in the last 50 years , that can be scientifically proven to be of human causation?
Run and hide again, little evidence-free, scientific non-entity.
Not much happening in real data, ..
https://elonionbloggle.blogspot.com/2020/10/artic-ice-is-melting-and-then-it-comes.html
https://elonionbloggle.blogspot.com/2020/10/artic-ice-is-melting-and-then-it-comes.html..
Poor loy-dope, all his childish panic is based on pure ignorance
And he shows no signs of wanting to overcome that ignorance.
And a third question for loy to twist and turn and slither trying to avoid answering.
3… Do you have any evidence at all that the highly beneficial drop in Arctic sea ice from the extreme highs of the LIA and late 1970s has any human causation?
Wrong. That’s the air temperature at 2 m from ECMWF, that in winter reaches –30°C.
http://ocean.dmi.dk/arctic/meant80n.uk.php
The same air temperature that you say is increasing. The same air temperature that in July it was said to have reached +38°C.
0° anomaly is not 0°C, it has nothing to do with the melting temperature of ice. The average for the Arctic North of 80° is around 2-3°C during the summer, as it was in the 1960s.
I see you don’t know either.
What about this?
Kobashi, Takuro, et al. “Modern solar maximum forced late twentieth century Greenland cooling.” Geophysical Research Letters 42.14 (2015): 5992-5999.
La Niña, solar minimum, Eurasian autumn snowpack and the QuasiBiennial Oscillation.
Only in winter. Going from –38 to –33 matters nothing.
Sea ice is decreasing as the planet warms. BFD.
Less ice means the planet cools more efficiently. The ice is an insulator to the ocean-atmosphere temperature exchange.
Atlantification is a cooling process, not a warming one. The more Atlantification the more heat is diverted to the Arctic instead of Europe.
Albedo is irrelevant because it goes opposite to irradiation. Maximum albedo when minimal irradiation and vice versa.
Bulls*hit. You don’t know what you talk about. Sea ice is decreasing because the planet is warming and needs to cool more. The demise of the Arctic sea ice has been wrongly prophesied many times. There would still be plenty of sea ice when everybody alive now has died of old age.
fred250
I’m not interested in defending commenter Loydo: that to do is his problem.
I write rather concerning your superficial AND incorrect answer to him.
*
” Utter BS.. No warming in the Arctic this century except from the 2015 El Nino… ”
Sorry, I think the BS is on your side: you are doing manifold cherry-picking here.
– Firstly, Arctic sea ice isn’t primarily driven by the lower troposphere; it is by the Arctic ocean;
– Secondly, showing only UAH6.0 introduces a cooling bias; even if RSS4.0 shows a warming bias, it would be fair to present it as well;
– Third cherry-picking is to restrict your view to half the UAH record;
– Fourth cherry-picking is to start a trend line from the highest point of the record, what automatically and inevitably leads to a very low trend.
*
Here is a more correct description of what happens from UAH’s point of view, by looking at UAH’s complete record:
https://drive.google.com/file/d/1y9FQtNwfr8pKKHfkGrseTMgqbS5bgnBh/view
And here is a comparison of UAH6.0 LT and RSS4.0 LT for 60N-82.5N:
https://drive.google.com/file/d/1dNtppkU8Fco8u4f85WGak-_2kR1tuRVt/view
The similarity of the running means is a good hint on how few separates the two time series. The difference is no more than a dispute on which NOAA satellite was the right one.
Maybe that for most WUWT readers, RSS data is wrong, because so many think here that only cooler data can be right. The truth certainly is inbetween.
*
Furthermore: didn’t you look at Javier’s post?
– Didn’t you see the DMI surface data for the satellite era?
– Didn’t you read DMI’s comments concerning Arctic temperatures above 80N?
But a look at a comparison of UAH6.0 above 80N with the data provided by a few weather stations there shows how useless it is to use such data, because both time series have only one small 2.5 degree latitude band above 80N:
https://drive.google.com/file/d/1NLFY7b_jvmY2t9_5QBIJcj9CnfMhizgA/view
Thus, if you want to see a fair comparison of UAH6.0 LT with RSS and surface data, you have to do it beginning with 60N:
https://drive.google.com/file/d/1-Zyz99oPVBbXThNbHWGqUEv-zB15YTTY/view
Linear estimates 1979-2020, in °C / decade:
– UAH6.0 LT: 0.25 ± 0.02
– GHCN daily & HadSST3: 0.41 ± 0.02
– RSS4.0 LT: 0.47 ± 0.02
As you can see, your claim about ‘no warming in the Arctic’ is completely wrong.
There are other points subject to contradiction in your comment, but I lack motivation to continue.
J.-P. D.
“No warming in the Arctic this century except from the 2015 El Nino… ””
This is a TOTALLY CORRECT statement.. DATA shows that to be correct
Also, the UAH and RSS data show that the ONLY WARMING is at El Nino events.
If you can’t look at the data and see that is a totally correct statement, you are beyond help.
Even RSSV$ shows that to be the case, and that’s after the massive data tampering and changes from RSSv3
No warming from 1980-1997 then the El Nino
No warming from 2001 -2015 then the El Nino.
Try not to be as ignorant as Loy and griff !!
Its not a good look. !
“because both time series have only one small 2.5 degree latitude band above 80N:”
LOL….. again the IGNORANCE shines through..
The area above 82.5N is only 10.4% of the Arctic Circle and its all water.
Great to see you using those El Nino events to show the NATURAL warming
…. because there isn’t any between them.
Also UAH goes to 85N, so only misses 4.6% of the Arctic, all sea ice, nearly always.
Only warming this century has come from the El Nino event
GET OVER IT !!
Thats fairly easy, melting ice puts a cap on temperature in summer because of the latent heat of fusion. As long as there is some ice to melt, summer temps will hover around zero.
Wrong. That’s the air temperature at 2 m from ECMWF, that in winter reaches –30°C.
http://ocean.dmi.dk/arctic/meant80n.uk.php
The same air temperature that you say is increasing. The same air temperature that in July it was said to have reached +38°C.
0° anomaly is not 0°C, it has nothing to do with the melting temperature of ice. The average for the Arctic North of 80° is around 2-3°C during the summer, as it was in the 1960s.
I see you don’t know either.
Your reply is so confused it is difficult to say whether you are right or wrong. I will say for clarification: the reason summer temps (north of 80N – because that is the area used in your link to DMI) remain close to zero is entirely due latent heat of fusion of the melting ice. North of 80N there is nearly always 100% ice. Surface temperatures will not rise much above zero while there is ice to melt.
I can’t be bothered trying to pry any of your other tightly held, erroneous beliefs out of your clenched fists. Perhaps other than to dissaude you of this myth:
“Going from –38 to –33 matters nothing.”
False. Which do think helps create a deeper, harder freeze, more resilient to to next summer’s melt?
Forgot the quotation marks from “Thats fairly easy… to ….I see you don’t know either.”
Arctic albedo is insignificant compared with Antarctic. Most Arctic sea ice lies at high latitude, where, when the sun shines, the albedo of ice differs little from seawater.
Antarctic sea ice reaches lower latitudes, where there is a difference, and where the sun shines even in winter.
If CO2 has caused Arctic sea ice to decline since 1979, why has Antarctic ice grown?
Wrong, wrong, wrong. Global heat transport shows the ocean is relevant mainly in the tropics. The bulk of heat transport in mid and high-latitudes is done by the atmosphere.
Arctic atmosphere warms because there is more meridional transport and receives more warm air from the South.
The ice is melted mainly by the ocean and the sun. The atmosphere plays almost no role and is warmed by atmosphere transported heat and by the ocean. That’s why global warming and sea-ice melting are decoupled. Sea ice didn’t decrease much during the 80s and early 90s when most of the warming took place.
You have all the basics wrong. No wonder you don’t understand what is going on.
“you dont understand atlantification”
you dont understand how to form a proper sentence.
Neither does Chambers dictionary. When it does will be time enough to pay attention.
Meanwhile we can safely ignore yet another piece of self-serving, scaremongering claptrap. If the current state of the Arctic is such a matter for concern how come H H Lamb didn’t appear relieved when the average temperature fell by more than a full Celsius degree between 1949 and 1979?? A decline from which it has not yet fully recovered.
???
“The process of joining or being influenced by the Atlantic bloc countries”
Aha 😀 😀
The Atlantic Council is the cause of it all 😷
“you don’t understand atlantification”
Mr. Masher uses that “line” to meet women at Korean noodle bars !
Yet another drive by comment from the Masher.
Wow, big word ‘atlantification’
So big in fact, it’s not even in the Merriam-Webster on-line dictionary
https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/atlantification
Must be one of those new climate sciencey thingys.
There was no sea ice in 1817. This information comes from the book Borrow’s Boys which tells the story of Arctic exploration in the 1800s. The lack of ice was reported by whalers who back then had no ‘climate change’ or ‘global warming’ agenda but were simply reporting what they saw. Check it out and explain why this happened 200 years ago. The lack of ice encouraged search for the Northwest Passage and when the Arctic froze up again many lives were lost, including the members of the infamous Frankling Expedition.
As I read in a review, the NW Passage was closed.
But:
Source: The Top of the World:
Is the North Pole Turning to Water? by John L. Daly
PS
Apart from the archaic language, this parallels the recent reports of arctic ice melting. However, it’s a draft of a letter to the British government from Council Minutes of the Royal Society, written in 1817
Yes first-hand reports from past eras that describe observations about low ice conditions in the Arctic region always seem to be ignored in direct proportion to current low ice observations.
1922 comes to mind when the herring & sardine catches from northern waters were reported to be alarmingly poor on account of the warmest sea temps evah.
(Plot spoiler – they cooled off again on their own accord and things returned to “normal”)
“The Arctic as a whole this past summer was at its warmest since at least 1979, when satellite measurements started providing data allowing for full coverage of the Arctic.”
This makes no sense as this was the coldest year of the most recent cold period. Something is off here. They may be looking only at the warm air that had to flow north periodically as cold air masses poured south. I find it hard to believe that colder climate means less ice in the Arctic.
Sorry should be ‘Barrow’s Boys’.
Still part of the recovery from the Little Ice Age.
Beneficial for humans, animals and plants.
Beneficial? Well, for shipping interests, maybe, but as Mark Serreze points out, it’s bad news for the rest of the planet. There will be a lot more plant growth, due to the extra warmth and CO2 and, in most areas, more precipitation. Bears’ habitat will be affected as the tree-line in Canada and Russia moves northwards, so the bears will have to change their habits in order to use the new areas opened up for them. Farmers will have to consider changing the crops they grow, or moving further north to take advantage of the better growing conditions. The list goes on and on, and everyone should be really really scared: SOME THINGS WILL CHANGE!!! OK, so all the changes will actually be improvements, but anyone trying to point that out needs their head read – you can’t get a good headline from improvements.
” it’s bad news for the rest of the planet.”
NO its is not.
It takes the planet a tiny bit towards the MWP , RWP and Holocene optimum climates.
These regions were provable much warmer in the not too distant past.. Trees found under retreating glaciers etc…
Animals cope with change, otherwise they wouldn’t still be here.
The highly beneficial drop in sea ice from the extreme levels of the LIA and late 1970 has allowed Arctic sea life to return,
Bowhead whale, nearly extinct , is making come-back.
Exactly what I’ve been telling you all along!
I don’t see that you can say this is anything except… exceptional!
https://forum.arctic-sea-ice.net/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=2975.0;attach=290121;image
But that doesn’t make it true 😀 and exceptional ? No, only if you forget the longer record you don’t have 😀
Like most warmunists, griff feels he has the right to ignore any data that doesn’t agree with what he’s paid to believe.
Of course it is ‘true’. You can compare the maps with satellite pics on Worldview. This is real data. If it isn’t – where’s YOUR better data?
ISN’T IT FANTASTIC to see the RECOVERY in Arctic sea ice back toward more normal levels., griff ! 🙂
Plenty of data showing that current levels of sea ice are WAY ABOVE most of the last 10,000 years
Why do you think it is a good thing that the Arctic should be frozen solid all years?
Why do you HATE Arctic sea life some much that you want it to continue to struggle to exist in a frozen wasteland ?
Why don’t you want the Bowhead Whale to come back from near extinction
https://partner.sciencenorway.no/arctic-ocean-forskningno-fram-centre/the-ice-retreats–whale-food-returns/1401824
Your hatred of LIFE must run very deep, griff.
And of course you have absolutely zero evidence of any human causation in the HIGHLY BENEFICIAL partial return to more normal Holocene extents after the debilitating, life destroying EXTREME highs of the LIA and the late 1970s.
We have a very low solar minima, certainly lower than any since we started recording Arctic ice. The deep minimum results in very disorderly jetstreams (this is a long observed phenomenon). The jetstream has been encroaching above the Arctic circle all summer and autumn. Hence the lack of freezing.
It is also the reason why we have a very cold autumn in N. America and Europe – which you didn’t tell us about.
Interesting how ice conditions that aren’t in the slightest out of normal, are being pushed by paid trolls as being exceptional.
It is ‘exceptional’, if you can understand the long periods and cycles! It has happened before. It will happen again. Over and over and over. It always returns to ‘normal’ however, as noted in that letter. It ISN’T the end of the world Griff! Sorry.
Bandar Log (Monkey people)
“We all say it, so it must be true”
griff
I would judge that 2012 was exceptional in recent history. Because 2020 is in second place, I would judge it to be almost exceptional — but, no ‘seegar!’
Actually, the late 1970’s was the exception
It was up there with extents of the Little Ice Age anomaly. !
Griff, it’s just pointless alarmist opportunistic nonsense seizing on a meaningless moment in time. We all know it is the residual effect of the Siberian heatwave – which happens periodically – as we learnt many decades ago at school.
Even if Arctic ice levels mattered, clearly they don’t as the world still exists – ice volume is already above last year’s level and central Arctic temperatures have plunged in the last few days with ice now advancing from the Russian shore and from the pack in the ocean.
Hope this reassures you!
Also, it’s currently -21C in Verkhoyansk, and the forecast for EARLY November is between -29C/-37C day/night for the foreseeable, which is all completely ‘normal’.
WRONG AGAIN griff.
It is NOT EXCEPTIONAL except in the fact there is STILL much more Arctic sea ice than there has been for most of the last 10,000 years
Stop being a rabid, ignorant CLIMATE CHANGE DENIER, griff.
The benefits of the warming in the Arctic since the LIA have been great
Not only is the land surface GREENING, but the seas are also springing BACK to life after being TOO COLD and frozen over for much of the last 500 or so years (coldest period of the Holocene)
The drop in sea ice slightly toward the pre-LIA levels has opened up the food supply for the nearly extinct Bowhead Whale, and they are returning to the waters around Svalbard.
https://partner.sciencenorway.no/arctic-ocean-forskningno-fram-centre/the-ice-retreats–whale-food-returns/1401824
The Blue Mussel is also making a return, having been absent for a few thousand years, apart from a brief stint during the MWP.
https://journals.sagepub.com/doi/abs/10.1177/0959683617715701?journalCode=hola
Many other species of whale are also returning now that the sea ice extent has dropped from the extreme highs of the LIA. Whales cannot swim on ice. !
https://blog.poseidonexpeditions.com/whales-of-svalbard/
Great thing is, that because of fossil fuels and plastics, they will no longer be hunted for whale blubber for lamps and for whale bone.
Hopefully the Arctic doesn’t re-freeze too much in the next AMO cycle, and these glorious creatures get a chance to survive and multiply.
Why is it that you HATE Arctic sea life and want to see it driven out by a total frozen Arctic?
Why is it you prefer sea ice to LIFE.. ?
Well-behaved ice melts when the planet warms. I don’t see anything exceptional about that. What would be exceptional is that the ice would grow as the planet warms.
But CO2 doesn’t melt the ice. The Rhône Glacier melted hugely between 1850 and 1900 and it wasn’t CO2.
“what I’ve been telling you all along!”
SO WHAT.! Your comments are irrelevant to reality.
Serreze shows he has your level of IGNORANCE and CLIMATE CHANGE DENIAL
That makes him a mental abyss. !
Since it has been at least this warm or warmer for several thousand years during the Holocene optimum, with Arctic ice levels lower than now (presumably since we don’t have direct measurements) your definition of exceptional must vary from the standard usage.
Another sky is falling article.
Please, write at least thousand more.
The first million wasn’t enough.
Andrew
Bad Andrew, you beat me to it.
After I read the first few paragraphs of the article (no reason to waste my time on the rest), I thought,
Yippeeeee, more alarmism from Serreze!!!!!
Regards,
Bob
Thing is, you would expect someone in his position to know more about Arctic sea ice history, and not constrain his little mind to a period starting from the highest extent outside the Little Ice Age.
Yes, sea ice has recovered a bit from that anomalous high,
That is totally a GOOD THING. !
…. and he’s the gatekeeper of the data too. You couldn’t make it up.
“Another sky is falling article.”
No, another “Arctic screaming” article.
Isn’t less ice the solution to less ice? More open water means more heat lost from the water to the atmosphere to space. Seems to me arctic sea ice is an efficient mechanism for regulating the temperature up there.
I went for a brisk walk this past weekend and came home “stoked”. So, I took off two layers – a windbreaker and a sweatshirt. I then sat down at my laptop for a couple of hours. Chilled, I got up and put the sweatshirt back on.
1) There was nothing unusual about this summer’s heat wave.
2) There’s always warm water entering the arctic during an El Nino. We’ve been in El Nino conditions more or less constantly since the massive El Nino back in 2016.
3) 8 years and we still haven’t gotten back to the lows of 2012, and this is supposed to be a crisis?
4) Anyone who claims that lack of sea ice in the arctic means that more solar energy is absorbed either doesn’t know what he’s talking about, or is a bald faced liar.
Conditions returned to La Nina in August.
You can see the effects of the 2015 El Nino/Big Blob event clearly in the UAHNoPol data.
Gradually dissipating.
Interesting graphic
Taken straight from UAH data. 🙂
What’s even more interesting is that from 1980 to the start of the 1997/8 El Nino, the Arctic actually COOLED.
fred250
Your chart is labelled ‘UAH NoPol 1980-1995’. That usually means Jan 1980 to Dec 1995. Matter of fact your chart shows UAH NoPol from Dec 1979 and it stops at Nov 1994, not Dec 1995. So it stops more than 2 years before the start of the 1997/8 El Nino. Amazing how so many skeptics here never seem to check on the data or charts posted.
Do you DENY the cooling trend ?
Or do you want to include the build-up to the 1997/1998 El Nino. !
If you actually bothered looking at the UAH NoPol data you would see that the step up in the Arctic occurred in 1995 and there was no 1998 peak at all.. A very different sort of event than the recent El Nino /big blob event
But don’t bother looking at the actual data, that would be too much for you.
What heat wave? For some of us in the central U.S. we recorded the second consecutive year of no 100 degree F days. That was due in part to heavy rains that did not fall elsewhere.
Griff probably thinks -30ºC in Siberia is a heat wave..
Yes it is above normal in Siberia for this time of year.. but really !!!
MarkW, the lack of sea ice does mean that more solar radiation is absorbed. However, there are other results associated with the change. The first is that there is less absorption in the water than at lower latitudes due to the low Sun angles (more reflection). The warmer water also radiates out more. In addition, increased evaporation removes more surface energy which convects up to dissipate energy at higher altitude. The higher water vapor content also causes more clouds which block some of the sunlight. I don’t know the net result, but it is likely that the change is not very much either way.
Leonard
You remarked, “The higher water vapor content also causes more clouds which block some of the sunlight.” Yes, the Arctic is notoriously cloudy and foggy and frequently the sun cannot be seen. That is why Vikings used something called a sunstone, to help them navigate.
The Arctic ice decrease started 160 years ago, as “climate change” wasn’t an issue, and CO2 was at low levels.
Sea ice extend shown in the graph in the post show lower extend than what DMI shows.
ocean.dmi.dk/arctic/plots/icecover/icecover_current_new.png
Is that a min cover, 15%, issue?
Now tell us about all of the anomalously cold parts of the NH. Above your pay grade, I guess.
There is a very simple reason why the Arctic is late freezing this year, and that is the jetstreams. They are all over the place. The northern jetstream has been as far south as the Canaries, and also frequently flowing up into the Arctic. On a couple of occasions we have had a jetstream over the North Pole. All that drags warm air with, hence no freezing. These disorderly jetsreams, associated with the solar minimum, were also the cause of the high temperatures in Siberia in the summer.
“the pattern of autumn ice growth has been completely disrupted”
Completely? Really? We even got treated to a graph that showed us the exact opposite of that. I.e. The sea ice is increasing as it usually does at this time of year, albeit a bit more slowly (I would guess that’s as a result of some weather).
“Research so far suggests we’ll stay on the current path”. I wish they’d make up their minds – Peter Wadhams told us that one day it’d just disappear quite quickly. We’ve all seen that quote of his.
Are we really meant to use observations over the last 40 years to form an opinion about what is ‘normal’ up there? That seems like a pretty short period of time to this non-expert. You’d think that the director of this place might think to look a bit further back in history.
Verkhoyansk got to 100F for the first time? Really? I’ve seen enough of these false claims to suspect that this really isn’t the case. It’s more likely that Verkhoyansk _frequently_ gets that hot.
Chris Nisbet: Are you talking to me? It doesn’t look much like it.
My bad. It was meant to be a new comment.
One of my comments (above) started as a reply to griff, but sometime later got moved to a new comment. Te site does that sort of thing from time to time.
I recall reading on WUWT about the poles shifting. If that is so, how much effect would that have on our climate? It seems to me it would have QUITE an effect!
PC_Bob, the magnetic poles may shift, not the physical poles (based on the axis of rotation). The space radiation which comes in near the magnetic poles may have a small local effect, but the sunlight angles will not change due to the magnetic pole shift.
How many years did storm numbers fall way short of predictions? Over and over again. So for once, we have more storms. This is known as confirmation bias. It’s unscientific, of course.
Arctic ice data may need to be collected for another century before we know what the normal behavior is. There are climate cycles we know about, and perhaps other phenomena to be discovered. Why should we assume the Earth is or should be more or less static. That seems tremendously naive. Nature does not work that way. Rather, there are cycle as mentioned, and other chaotic behavior that tends to remain bounded.
Hyperbole is often used for political and self-promotion purposes. Is that how science is advanced?
The southern hemisphere is doing very well. Antarctic sea ice is above normal. In fact if you look at sea ice levels in 1986 for both poles, Antarctic sea ice was at near record lows and Arctic sea ice at near record highs.
The green lines:
Antarctic:
Arctic:
Maybe Mark Serreze can explain this one.
look, a squirrel!
griff goes running off after it, because the squirrel mistook his brain for a chestnut !
Maybe look around….
http://ocean.dmi.dk/arctic/plots/meanTarchive/meanT_2020.png
Way around….
The Arctic is screaming. It can’t take any more of Serreze’s Alarmist blathering.
Other than it’s late, what’s the problem? It’s not the latest it has ever been in recent nor past history and we/people and animals have thrived through it all. Or is this just another exercise in apocalyptic anomalies?
I still don’t care if there is a single ice cube left in the Arctic. It has NO EFFECT on the rest of the world other than economic.
This is interesting and no doubt accurate but we need to keep in mind the big picture. Is an increase in temperature of the earth good or bad for humanity., history says it is good. Is the greening of the Sahel and the rest of the planet where people live a net benefit that is worth more to us than worrying about the Artic where nobody lives. Will the “greening ” in the arctic produce benefits as well? The article focuses on the real or imagined downsides and neglects to consider upsides as appears to be the norm for the academic and bureaucrat community so they can keep their funding streams. I will be really impressed when they can tell us how much of the change in climate is natural and how much man made using data not models.
Close your eyes and imagine. Imagine Vikings colonizing Greenland for several more centuries!
Deep heat really could be the issue, deep deep heat as in Geothermal. Does anyone know what is going on with the currents around the Gakkel Ridge? There are weird currents jetting from that region of the arctic basin
Geothermal heat at the surface is a few orders of magnitude below other sources (sun, atmosphere)
There is a strong La Niña cycle developing, which will likely cause very cold Arctic temps over the next 2 winters and will likely cause an increase in Arctic Ice extents.
Long term, Arctic Ice Extents won’t likely recover much until the PDO and AMO reenter their respective 30-year cool cycles, but once they do, there will likely be 30-years of increasing Arctic Ice Extents and global cooling, and much turmoil among CAGW advocates.
We’ll see soon enough…
No matter, they will have their carbon taxes permanently embedded in budgets and program spending by then.
“won’t likely recover much”
Would people PLEASE stop saying an increase in sea ice is a “recovery”
It is NOT.
The “recovery” has been the drop from the anomalous extreme high of the 1970’s
and it still got a fair way to go to get back down to the Holocene norm.
In the above article, Mark Serreze writes: “There’s so much more heat in the ocean now than there used to be that the pattern of autumn ice growth has been completely disrupted.”
Hey, Mark, might it be simply that with the Earth now going some 20+ years on the warm side of the AMO cycle, there is an associated effect on Arctic ice growth patterns?
And guess what? . . . the warm part of the previous AMO cycle ended around 1962, well before you became an Arctic climate scientist (by you own words) and, later, director of the National Snow and Ice Data Center. So perhaps your definition of “normal” applied to Arctic ice coverage-by-month is a bit colored by your personal experience.
And darn that increasing “heat content” in the oceans. It doesn’t seem to be reflected in the worldwide Argo ocean float data, so once again it seems to have resorted to hiding somewhere in the world’s oceans. Olly olly oxen free!
And finally to address your advice regarding “If you’ve been ignoring climate change and hoping that it will just go away . . .”: please don’t worry about me. I have long recognized that climate change now is a part of Earth’s natural variations as it has been for BILLIONS of years in the past. Why should I expect it to “go away”???
And if by that last phrase you were perhaps referring to man-made climate change™, no worry . . . there is no such thing . . . but perhaps you are late in getting the developing “scientific consensus” in this area.
Don’t know about the Arctic, but as to the Atlantic this ‘negative’ is also going on, that’s what they emphasize.
https://nsf.gov/discoveries/disc_summ.jsp?cntn_id=301502&org=NSF&from=news
https://www.nature.com/articles/s42003-020-01326-0
Declines in shellfish species on rocky seashores match climate-driven changes
“Between 20 and 50% of the total variance in abundances and recruitment is due to variation among sites (Supplementary Table 7)…..The rates of declines we have observed are sobering.”
Only 3 of 50 references were before 2000, none having to do with previous warming of the Gulf of Maine. Their figures are not very impressive, one species clearly diminishing, others more scattered. Don’t doubt that it happened, their data showing some, but again a negative, poorly historically researched paper. Other questionable stats?
Wonder if their T is dropping.
https://gizmodo.com/an-indigenous-group-in-the-amazon-has-experienced-a-dro-1845508162
Didn’t check out the paper to see if it was also sobering.
They always don’t have in mind, oceans, ice, temps act in cycles and they only look at the status quo in the belief all is in an one way mode – wrong, isn’t.
Yes. They seem to have no concept of change and anything different to yesterday is wrong and bad.
It’s really quite pathetic navel gazing.
What is the panic about .
It is not yet the end of October and winter in the Northern Hemisphere starts when .
When the sun does not even appear above the horizon for months it will freeze up.
Just another scare story for the news outlets .
Tell us about it next May .
I have it on good authority from a well respected scientist that the total amount of sea ice at both poles generally averages out when the Arctic is low the Antarctic is higher.
The freeze should have started at a steady rate just after the minimum, which was, if I recall, September 9th 2020. At present we are 3.5 million sq km lower than the 1980s average for this date…
A WEATHER event stalled it.. SO WHAT.
I suspect we will now see a rapid growth during November.
And as you well know the late 1970s was a period of anomalously high extremes of Arctic sea ice.
THANK GOODNESS there is less sea ice than then, the Arctic sea life is LUVING it.
Even near extinct species are returning… .. as if you cared.
Now the big question is…
WHY IS THERE STILL SO MUCH ARCTIC SEA ICE.?
Still far more than for most of the last 10,000 years
I remember many of your PROFITS saying it would be “ice-free, many years before now.
Do you have any evidence at all that the highly beneficial RECOVERY in Arctic sea ice from the extreme highs of the LIA and late 1970s has any human causation.?