Is the EU’s 30% climate budget greenwashing?

From Gulf Times

By Leonie Kijewski, DPA Brussels

When then-defence minister for Germany Ursula von der Leyen ran for the European Union’s top job last year, she pitched herself as a climate enthusiast.

“We must go further. We must strive for more,” she said during her candidate speech at the European Parliament. “I want Europe to become the first climate-neutral continent in the world by 2050.”
She got the job, and has been serving as European Commission president since December.

Under her leadership, the commission — though the initial proposal pre-dates her presidency — suggested spending 25% of the European Union’s seven-year budget and the coronavirus recovery package on “climate targets.”

The EU governments pushed for even more, and committed to spending 30% of the EU’s budget on climate — a 10% jump from the 2014-20 budget. With a total package of 1.8tn euros ($2.1tn), the climate tag comes in at 600bn euros.

But while that might sound good on paper, environmentalists remain sceptical.

“The problem is right now it’s turned into massive greenwashing,” said Berenice Dupeux, senior policy officer for agriculture at the European Environmental Bureau, a network of various environmental groups.
She said most of the spending that the EU counted under its climate umbrella — about 50% — isn’t actually to be spent on the environment: instead, they went to the union’s Common Agriculture Policy, without setting additional climate criteria.

And a large chunk of that money was paid out as direct payment to farmers to support their income, she said.

Yet, as the commission expects farmers to respect environmental regulations the EU had put in place, it automatically counts 20% of direct payments as going towards the climate target.

But as standards were simply the bare minimum, Dupeux said, and no one checked what the farmers use the money for, the percentage didn’t reflect reality.

Dupreux alleged that much of this approach, which she said lacked scientific evidence, stemmed from political pressure.

The commission is often dependent on the approval of the 27 governments in the bloc, so its rules aimed at striking a balance between the different interests.

The national agricultural ministers, in turn, wouldn’t agree on cutting funding from direct farmers and financing pure climate activities instead, she said.

“Politically, they will not survive if they do that. They don’t want to touch the pot of money that is spent for social issues and shift it to climate,” she said.

The European Commission rejected the allegation. “This is the biggest green investment package the world has ever seen,” a commission spokesperson said. “The ambitions for a greener, more digital and more resilient Europe will remain guiding principles of the Next Generation EU and the next long-term budget.”

The spokesperson said that it followed a “clear and well-established” methodology to measure progress, namely the so-called Rio markers.
The Rio markers measure whether reducing greenhouse gas emissions is the principal objective of an activity, a secondary but significant objective, or if it does not target climate change at all.

Depending on that assessment, it attributes how many per cent of a spending activity went to climate.

For Dupeux, the EU’s use of this method failed to produce any tangible results as it didn’t look into the actual effects a project had on climate.
Markus Trilling, finance and subsidies policy co-ordinator at Climate Action Network, echoed her assessment and said that much clearer benchmarks were needed to assess what projects and investments the money should be spent on.

The current budget approach to climate, he said, “is an accounting exercise rather than a strategic, forward-looking planning approach.”
But the commission said its agricultural policy required EU countries to put sufficient emphasis on climate. “Member states will have the legal obligation to clearly show greater ambition than at present with regard to care for the environment and climate,” a spokesperson said.

Read the full article here.

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Howard Dewhirst
August 7, 2020 10:07 pm

How can this ever happen when we will be buying more and more stuff from China and India, helping them generate more and more CO2

Reply to  Howard Dewhirst
August 7, 2020 11:28 pm

Climate action can only work with a global emission reduction program. We don’t have one. All we have are national climate action programs. That won’t cut global emissions. Surely the EU knows that but politically they have to be in the game.

Two links below.

https://wp.me/pTN8Y-3ZO

https://tambonthongchai.com/2020/08/05/a-covid-sales-strategy-for-the-climate/

Jacques Lemiere
Reply to  Chaamjamal
August 8, 2020 12:19 am

yes it is just displacement of spendings..

Curious George
Reply to  Chaamjamal
August 8, 2020 7:35 am

The first climate-neutral continent in the world is already here – Antarctica.

John V. Wright
August 7, 2020 11:04 pm

“as it didn’t look into the actual effects a project had on climate.”

Of course they didn’t – they never do. Because to do so would reveal that huge amounts of public money are being wasted to achieve barely discernible reductions in the global average temperature. It has become the greatest farce in human history.

Apparently, if all the nations who signed up to the virtue-signalling Paris Agreement carried out all the actions they had pledged then GAT would fall by 0.3ºC by 2100. But, of course, not only have these nations NOT implemented most of their trumpeted ‘reforms’ but China – aware that it will be restricted to the CO2 emissions it is producing in 2030 – is building coal-fired power stations at an astonishing rate.

Our history regularly throws up these periods of collective hysteria – the South Sea Bubble, the Dutch Tulip Bubble, the Y2K nonsense – and CAGW is the latest (and certainly the biggest, thanks to modern media technology). Those of us who take the longer view understand that it is complete bollocks, of course, but politely pointing out the presence of a cliff edge will not stop you being trampled underfoot by the human lemmings as they rush onward, possessed by the latest version of a case of the screaming abdabs.

As far as the EU is concerned, the only difference is that as an organisation it is entirely incompetent and completely corrupt from top to bottom. By corrupt, I mean politically, financially and morally corrupt. Here in the UK we have finally managed to slip its clutches although many of the Scots are clamoring to leave the UK and join the EU. Human mental frailty is in evidence everywhere.

Phil Rae
Reply to  John V. Wright
August 7, 2020 11:41 pm

John……..I trust the Scots won’t be so stupid. Despite all the “Braveheart” blah-blah from the SNP along with the ever-unreliable opinion polls, most Scots realise that there is NO PLAN to address how Scotland would survive as an independent nation. It already has a huge fiscal deficit and without funds from Westminster, that situation would be much, much worse. It certainly can’t rely on its now-ruined oil & gas industry to prop up its economy, as had been promoted by the SNP prior to their referendum defeat. And, of course, the EU has strict rules about countries who can’t balance the books so an independent Scotland’s chances of even gaining re-entry to the EU are pretty slim, at best.

So, as usual, all that sound & fury from the SNP’s tartan army signifies nothing!

Redge
Reply to  Phil Rae
August 8, 2020 12:50 am

Most of my Scottish friends want out of the Union.

I respect their decision even if I think they are fools.

I think Scotland will leave the Union, possibly followed by Northern Ireland. Assuming Scotland will be able to join the EU, after repatriating all the Scots 😉 we will have to close the border with Scotland and impose whatever tariffs are agreed with the EU.

I also think the EU will welcome the Scots regardless of the rules just to spite the UK. IIRC, the EU told the Scots before the referendum they would be welcomed back into the EU fold should they decide to leave the UK.

Pretty hypocritical given that the EU have told Catalonia they will be on their own should they decide to leave Spain.

HotScot
Reply to  Redge
August 8, 2020 2:38 am

Redge

It would take the best part of a generation before Scotland was granted entry to the EU were it to win independence, by which time the country would be bankrupt. Even were it only ten years the net result would be the same.

The EU itself is in trouble, they don’t want another basket case to rescue. As usual the SNazi’s demand entry, as they demanded all ‘their’ Oil, and ‘I want doesn’t get’.

Even with the Unions support, the country is going down the tubes.

The real scandal amongst all this is that in 13+ years of power, the SNazi party has failed to attract a single major industrial business. There are, however, lots of low skilled Amazon and call centre jobs. Meanwhile, their education system is appalling and the Scottish NHS is utterly dire, the country has the worst drug problem in the whole of Europe, they have the highest Taxes in the UK, and their Coronavirus record is lamentable.

None of this is going unnoticed.

Redge
Reply to  HotScot
August 8, 2020 7:37 am

I don’t disagree with you, HotScot.

I think most of my Scottish friends vote with their heart rather than with their brains.

One friend in particular voted out of the union mostly because she hated the monarchy, without considering the damage it could do to the Scottish economy.

Walter Sobchak
Reply to  Redge
August 8, 2020 12:03 pm

“I also think the EU will welcome the Scots regardless of the rules just to spite the UK.”

You think the EU wants a Greece without sun shine?

They might be spiteful, but they haven’t got the money to afford to indulge their spite.

AndyHce
Reply to  Walter Sobchak
August 8, 2020 12:34 pm

One friend in particular voted out of the union mostly because she hated the monarchy, without considering the damage it could do to the Scottish economy.

Sounds just like the anti-fracking crowd.

MarkW
Reply to  Walter Sobchak
August 8, 2020 12:47 pm

What they “say” now, may not be what the “do” later.

Patrick MJD
Reply to  Walter Sobchak
August 8, 2020 8:48 pm

I guess she didn’t know about Charles the 1st.

Sara
Reply to  Phil Rae
August 8, 2020 4:44 am

Wait – are you guys saying that whole Europe United thingy isn’t working, after all? This is fascinating. I wondered just how long it would take. Any possibility that Wales and Cornwall might decide to become united against the rest of the island?

Somehow, it sounds silly but it isn’t. really silly. Small cracks seem to be appearing in everything, everywhere. Small cracks can get lots bigger as time goes by. The South can still secede from the North.

Walter Sobchak
Reply to  John V. Wright
August 8, 2020 12:01 pm

If you think the Chinese have any intention of limiting their coal consumption or their CO2 output because of some paper that it signed with inferior westerners, I have a bridge in Brooklyn that you ought to buy.

Joe Wagner
Reply to  Walter Sobchak
August 8, 2020 4:24 pm

Naw- they’ll just fake their books to make themselves look Greener… Build a couple hundred fake turbines or something to make it look plausible- like they built those fake malls..

(I’ve been inside one: it was the creepiest feeling)

August 7, 2020 11:33 pm

A few decades ago anyone that suggested that the EU governments would want to spend 30% of its budget on trying to change the climate of the World, by fiddling with windmills and telling farmers how to suck eggs, would have been regarded as insane. The idea all makes the South Sea Bubble, Dutch Tulip Bubble and the Y2K spoof look like serious financial endeavours

LdB
Reply to  nicholas tesdorf
August 8, 2020 12:50 am

However as long as you aren’t in the EU it is fun to watch.

Scissor
Reply to  nicholas tesdorf
August 8, 2020 5:32 am

Insanity is neither created nor destroyed, it is only changed from one form to another.

Alastair gray
August 7, 2020 11:33 pm

Howard, what happened on your initiative to make. Geolsoc London review its executive stance on climate, and justify its stance to membership

Joel O'Bryan
August 7, 2020 11:50 pm

” “I want Europe to become the first climate-neutral continent in the world by 2050.””

“Climate-neutral continent????” Really?
How sad to see such ignorant people, people who went to college and university, and believe that garbage and it has any meaning in the real world.

She (Ursula von der Leyen) might as well believe in voodoo magic, volcano gods, and rain-dances if she believes that anti-science nonsense.
Clearly, the climate scammers have gotten their money’s worth in paying to dumb-down the education systems in Germany. Nice job Vladimir.

Reply to  Joel O'Bryan
August 8, 2020 2:36 pm

If UvdL is worrking in the EU Commission as she was working as Minister of Defence in Germany, ok that may be a successs 😀 . No flying Navy helicopter over sea (rust problems…) and several comparable problems in other Army parts, that leads to less CO2 production.
But fine, since her, we have an army with kindergarten 😀

Joel O'Bryan
August 7, 2020 11:52 pm

” “I want Europe to become the first climate-neutral continent in the world by 2050.””

“Climate-neutral continent????” Really?
How sad to see such ignorant people, people who went to college and university, and believe that climate garbage, and that it has any meaning in the real world.

She (Ursula von der Leyen) might as well believe in voodoo magic, volcano gods, and rain-dances with virgin sacrifices if she believes that anti-science nonsense.
Clearly, the climate scammers have gotten their money’s worth in paying the EU to dumb-down the education systems in Germany. Nice job Vladimir.

griff
August 8, 2020 12:26 am

the EU of course had the world’s largest drop in CO2 emissions in 2019:

“Energy-related CO2 emissions in the European Union, including the United Kingdom, dropped by 160 Mt, or 5%, to reach 2.9 Gt. The power sector drove the trend, with a decline of 120 Mt of CO2, or 12%, resulting from increasing renewables and switching from coal to gas. Output from the European Union’s coal-fired power plants dropped by more than 25% in 2019, while gas-fired generation increased by close to 15% to overtake coal for the first time.”

https://www.iea.org/articles/global-co2-emissions-in-2019

Together, the 27 member states of the European Union plus the UK are the third largest emitter of carbon dioxide – responsible for a combined 9% of global emissions.

The EU has a large impact on climate change and is a leader on CO2 reduction…

LdB
Reply to  griff
August 8, 2020 12:52 am

Cool you guys do it for the world …. Rah rah.
Don’t mind us while we spectate for a while it’s always fun watching a slow moving train wreck 🙂

Redge
Reply to  griff
August 8, 2020 12:55 am

And in the process caused real hardship on their citizens through rising energy costs.

comment image

And by 2050 that bottom line will look like a hockey stick

LdB
Reply to  Redge
August 8, 2020 1:18 am

Isn’t it amazing how cheap renewable energy always costs so much, another European success turning something cheap into very expensive 🙂

Scissor
Reply to  griff
August 8, 2020 5:51 am

If your so-called “climate change” were only real, then the EU might have an impact.

Unfortunately, real climate change does not require artificial inputs and has nothing to do with whether the EU exists or not.

Joel
Reply to  griff
August 8, 2020 6:01 am

And how did this affect atmospheric CO2?

Jeff Alberts
Reply to  griff
August 8, 2020 8:06 am

“The EU has a large impact on climate change and is a leader on CO2 reduction…”

How many degrees did they drop “global temperature”? I’m so excited to find out!

ole jensen
Reply to  griff
August 8, 2020 12:08 pm

Please show me exactly where the EU`s impact on CO2 is popping up in this graph :
https://www.esrl.noaa.gov/gmd/ccgg/trends/gl_trend.html

James P
Reply to  griff
August 8, 2020 1:34 pm

The key is switching from coal to natural gas in power generation, which is cost effective and doesn’t need to be driven by huge subsidies. Same thing has happened in the US.

Rod Evans
August 8, 2020 12:52 am

Let us not forget here green credentials extend to global population control.
She only managed to have seven yes seven children, before she looked up the world hypocrisy.

Flight Level
August 8, 2020 1:16 am

When EU talks budgets I feel the cold ants of existential anxiety running circles on my back.

Printing more Euros and rising taxes won’t fill the tanks in midflight. No Ladies and Gentlemen, virtual fuel, even plenty of it, won’t make your day.

Bruce Cobb
August 8, 2020 2:20 am

It’s a double-fake. They are pretending to “reduce carbon”, which itself is an idea that pretends to “save the planet”. The Climate Liars even lie about their lying. They have no shame.

August 8, 2020 2:24 am

The European Union is a corrupt Mafia style protection racket, that has bought politicians and institutions all across Europe, and operates by extorting funds and distributing them to where its interest will best be served whilst operating the pretext that its ‘all in the best possible taste* interest of the people.
Anyone who though green funds would be deployed to actually reduce carbon emissions is, not to put too fine a point on it, criminally naïve…

* All in the best possible taste..

Matthew Sykes
August 8, 2020 2:26 am

Thats a relief, for a moment there I thought they were taking this CO2 rubbish seriously!

HotScot
August 8, 2020 2:40 am

“I want Europe to become the first climate-neutral continent in the world by 2050.”

Is this a climb down from achieving Net Zero by 2050?

Coeur de Lion
August 8, 2020 3:06 am

Come on everybody- CO2 is not climate!!! The whole shebang is a howling nonsense. Many of the posts above worry me on a sceptic blogosphere

Jeff Alberts
Reply to  Coeur de Lion
August 8, 2020 8:08 am

Most of the posts above are sarcasm. Your detector needs fixing.

Jonas
August 8, 2020 3:17 am

Ok, they may be half-lying. Unfortunately, there is some truth in statements from EU.

I am pretty sure that we will waste a lot of billions on windmills, electrical vehicles, ridiculous climate actions, meaningless climate research and undefined climate jobs (city climate experts). The main effect is that we will become less competitive with Asia.
Sometimes I think it would be better just to burn the money.

Wolf at the door
August 8, 2020 3:45 am

Leo Smith.Totally agree.EU is full of self- serving nose – in -the trough politicians who waste tax-payers money with gay abandon.The waste AND corruption is staggering.That’s one of the reasons (but by no means the only one) why we Brits left.The problem we Scots have is that the Scottish Government ,run by the SNP ,is virtually a Communist one- supported (surprise surprise) by the Scottish Green Party.The reason more Scots seem to want independence is that Boris Johnson’s handling of the covid crisis has seemed inept compared to that of Nicola Sturgeon.-Also Boris seems to rub Scots the wrong way!
Nicola Sturgeon ,leader of the SNP and Scotland’s First Minister ,is a clever and ruthless politician .She will do anything and say anything to achieve Scottish Independence.Rejoin EU? certainly, if she thinks saying that will persuade Scots to vote for independence.The sad fact is that though she is an accomplished politician her government ,like all left wing governments,is seriously incompetent.At the moment she is”fooling most of the people most of the time. “

Sara
August 8, 2020 4:47 am

I want Europe to become the first climate-neutral continent in the world by 2050. – article

I do my best to try to understand politicians and their gobbledygook speechifyin’ but this one — well, it just doesn’t make any sense. What in the blinkin’ blue-eyed bimbo bureaucratic world is the meaning of ‘climate neutral’? Huh? Someone please enlighten me. Does ‘climate neutral’ mean a year-round temperature of 70F with precipitation at the beck and call of the politic worms that are trying to ruin things?

Frankly, Jabberwocky makes whole lot more sense.

old engineer
Reply to  Sara
August 8, 2020 2:58 pm

Sara-

I also wondered what climate-neutral meant. Are they going to bring the earth’s axis tilt to zero degrees, so we will have no seasons?

Thinking about it, I realized that I have become climate-neutral, not on a continental scale, but in my house. The temperature in my house never varies more than a total of 6 degrees F, day or night, all year. And it never rains. Well, it did rain 3 years ago when a hail storm broke my skylight, and it rained in the house. But other than that, climate-neutral all year.

Yirgach
Reply to  Sara
August 8, 2020 2:59 pm

Well silly, everyone knows the climate is deigned by decree:

Jeremiah Puckett
August 8, 2020 5:36 am

Isn’t Antarctica pretty much climate neutral already?

Jerry Mead
August 8, 2020 5:39 am

“a greener, more digital and more resilient Europe”

So the EU retires any sort of coal & gas base load in favor of solar and wind, the sun stops shining, the wind stops blowing, and in the world of resulting black and brown outs… goodbye to your digits!!

Laughable.

Goodbye, and thanks for (the return of) all the fish.

Right-Handed Shark
August 8, 2020 6:24 am

Climate neutral. Yes, we’ve all been emitting far too much climate. Not only do we need to stop emitting climate, we have to actively capture climate and, erm, bury it.. in a hole.. somewhere.

Sara
Reply to  Right-Handed Shark
August 8, 2020 10:48 am

Oh, is there a limit and nobody told me? Durnburnit, I just can’t keep up any more. It’s almost like it changes with the way the wind blows…. wait, that’s a clue right there, isn’t it? 🙂

Ben Vorlich
August 8, 2020 6:43 am

Boris and his Take Back Control worked well in the North of England with unemployed ex-miners, ex-textile workersand ex-Shipbuilders, and in the Midlands of England with ex-manufacturing workers. But not in Scotland where many of the same groups blame Mrs Thatcher and Westminster Tories for their industries moving East.

Taken with comparisons to Norway which has become wealthy on the back of oil and Hydro-electricity, for Scotland oil revenues were used to pay for 5 million UK unemployed. For many taking back control means taking it back from Westminster. All the messages about the dead hand of Brussels, sunlight uplands etc ad infinitum can be applied to Westminster y clever politicians, even not so clever ones. Ad homs against a leader are usually counter productive.

Any Indy Ref2 will start off with the premise look what happened last time a Tory PM promised what he couldn’t deliver.

I’m not saying which is right and which is wrong just sitting watching with the words of Burns addressing a mouse depressing me.

Still, thou art blest, compar’d wi’ me!
The present only toucheth thee:
But Och! I backward cast my e’e,
On prospects drear!
An’ forward tho’ I canna see,
I guess an’ fear!

Carl Friis-Hansen
August 8, 2020 7:43 am

“We must go further. We must strive for more,”

Sure, Danish windmills are helping a lot today:
Wind turbine current contribution to total load: 3%
Wind turbine current Capacity Factor: 2%
Current electricity import: 65%

Yes, we need to plant a lot more wind turbines, preferably produced outside EU, so we do not risk being accused of producing CO2 from the production.

The strategy of the Catastrophic Climate Change Policy (CCCP) is fulfilled to schedule in line with the 1984 prescription.

Welcome to the bright new world of Agenda21 – be happy!

griff
Reply to  Carl Friis-Hansen
August 8, 2020 7:59 am

Have the Danes no solar power?

Germany is getting 31GW as I write… about half of weekday peak demand… (and its Saturday)

https://www.sma.de/en/company/pv-electricity-produced-in-germany.html

LdB
Reply to  griff
August 8, 2020 9:06 am

Happy clap and wow even with all that solar they are emitting 264 tonnes of CO2 per minute which still makes them well terrible
https://www.electricitymap.org/zone/DE

Remember your target is zero to save us all.

We promise we will start doing our bit once they get to zero 🙂

griff
Reply to  LdB
August 9, 2020 12:05 am

Well they will be turning off coal power plants up till they all go in 2038… so they are getting better all the time, as the song has it…

LdB
Reply to  griff
August 9, 2020 7:52 am

So okay well I guess we will do something in 2038 oh wait … the Germans missed their 2020 targets and are miles away from there 2030. So probably more like 2100 before we will have to do anything.

Carl Friis-Hansen
Reply to  griff
August 8, 2020 9:46 am

Yes, Danes have solar too, but they are more proud of their wind turbines:
https://carl-fh.com/climate

griff
Reply to  Carl Friis-Hansen
August 9, 2020 12:07 am

Well thanks… but my Danish is a little rusty… I have only visited once, but spent all day in windowless client offices, so have only seen Copenhagen in December dark!

Reply to  griff
August 8, 2020 3:35 pm

Fine, and latest next thursday it’s over with solar power in Germany.
A drop of about 20°C is forecasted, with clouds and rains and thunderstorms.
Did you think about battery storage of the actual overproduction ‘?
No ? Very bad you forgot it.
Ah you didn’t ?
There not the batteries to store.
So you started with the third step instead of the first, soooo bad, soooooo green ( behind the ears too, that’s why ee may call you griff, the Greenhorn.) 😀 😀

griff
Reply to  Krishna Gans
August 9, 2020 12:04 am

solar doesn’t drop to zero in those conditions… and with clouds and rain comes… anyone? … wind!

Reply to  griff
August 9, 2020 7:13 am

If there comes wind with thunderstorms you have to stop the windmills in case of to strong winds 😀 😀
And now ???
You have no chance at all to promote sun and wind to a success 😀 😀

griff
Reply to  griff
August 10, 2020 12:13 am

It has to be a very, very high level of storm to shut down wind…

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/blogs-magazine-monitor-24706238

and yes, that news item references a turbine fire. do go check how many a year and how many turbines in the world.

Redge
August 8, 2020 8:23 am

And by 20:30, Germany will be getting precisely 0.0GW from solar, but not to worry fossil fuels are quietly burning away, wasting energy, bur ready for when the sun doesn’t shine.

So consumers are paying for solar energy and fossil fuel to be always ready – no wonder energy prices are huge in Germany

LdB
Reply to  Redge
August 8, 2020 9:26 am

The electricity price for households is only about 45 percent above the European average. We strongly urge Griff to press them to go harder the future of the planet is at stake. All the nuclear power stations have to be shutdown by 2022 so those renewable unicorns in Germany better get a move on.

griff
Reply to  LdB
August 9, 2020 12:03 am

But as I repeatedly state, German households are energy efficient and their bills are lower than in the US.

and just think: very many of them have solar panels or shares in community windfarms…

LdB
Reply to  griff
August 9, 2020 7:55 am

You keep saying but the German news say differently and you aren’t exactly a known for telling the truth … remember the fact checks I ran on you before you left only to come back? Remember why you left …. for lying.

griff
Reply to  LdB
August 10, 2020 12:10 am

I am telling the truth… the evidence is out there for you to find, if you had the will to do it.

some sites keep repeating figures about German power without ever checking them.

I’ve only ever left here when the US political nonsense got too much.

(I’m only back so much lately as stuck in house while various bits of structural maintenance need addressing after covid induced halt!)

The German desire to halt nuclear is perverse on one level, but Germans see good reasons, separate from climate issues, to proceed with it.

Roger Knights
Reply to  griff
August 9, 2020 11:52 am

“But as I repeatedly state, German households are energy efficient and their bills are lower than in the US.”

Average German dwelling sizes are about 33% smaller than those in the U.S., IIRC. Clothes dryers aren’t as common. Nor is A/C, I suspect.

About 400,000 German households have had their electricity cut off for neon-payment of bills, IIRC. Germans are cutting down lots of trees for firewood.

Reply to  griff
August 9, 2020 3:45 pm

What are you smoking, griff ?
Is that free stuff or with prescripting only ?
Even if lower than in US, always to high for a lot of people, believe me, what ever you repeatedly may state, it’s nonsense or a lie, often enough (always, precisely said) you have been proven wrong.
Don’t try to tel a German s.th. about energy prices in Germany.

Even you must know, that comparing energy bills without coomparing income, and necessary other living costs and taxes is idiotic. Why do you always try to spread your BS ?

Bruce Cobb
August 8, 2020 8:32 am

Germany is getting 31GW of laughable condemnable unaffordable unreliables? Good to know.

griff
Reply to  Bruce Cobb
August 9, 2020 12:01 am

Germany is getting half its power requirements, or thereabouts… from an absolutely predictable power source

Roger Knights
Reply to  griff
August 9, 2020 11:56 am

“Germany is getting half its power requirements, or thereabouts… from an absolutely predictable power source”

Surely you’re joking. Doesn’t Germany rely on backup power from Poland (coal) and France (nuclear)? What’ll happen when they’re gone, as EU plans intend?

Reply to  Roger Knights
August 9, 2020 3:54 pm

Predictible ???? 😀 😀 😀
You mean the sun ?? 😀 😀 😀
In the afternoon today, a greater part of Germany was under clouds, rain and thundersrorms, local heat thunderstorms, not because of a cold front, that’s forecasted for around Thursday.
So many thunderstorms were not predicted, but your friend, the sun was 😀 😀 😀

griff
Reply to  Krishna Gans
August 10, 2020 12:07 am

The Germans are adequate weather forecasters and can forecast wind and solar on that basis

this is German power production.
https://www.energy-charts.de/power.htm?source=all-sources&year=2020&week=33

you should be able to see forecast as well as actual power for rest of day/week (if not change settings for week at left).

Reply to  Krishna Gans
August 10, 2020 2:15 am

Local heat thunderstormss can’t be forecasted, not where, not their strength, not the way they will take.
That may be more or less guessed.

The German Weather Service was 3 days in a row wrong in concern of temperarures for northern Germany, about 5-9°C !!
Very adequate forecasts 😀

griff
Reply to  Roger Knights
August 10, 2020 12:04 am

It doesn’t… look at the German import/export figures for power. At times Germany props up France.

Matt
August 8, 2020 10:27 am

My sports car is already climate neutral. I have that in writing from Shell, including the numbers. So I don’t need an electric car and if I had one, it would make no difference.

Bob Hunter
August 8, 2020 11:00 am

The North Sea is almost depleted and Europe has very little oil, natural gas, thermal coal or metallurgical coal. Therefore, IMO, is one of the primary reasons many Europeans accept the shoddy climate science.

Roger Knights
Reply to  Bob Hunter
August 9, 2020 11:57 am

“The North Sea is almost depleted and Europe has very little oil, natural gas, thermal coal or metallurgical coal.”

Lot of peat in Ireland, though!

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