NCEP ensemble forecast shows deep La Niña coming

We know that we are currently in a La Niña pattern by the various maps and graphs we have on the WUWT ENSO page, for example this one:

clickable global map of SST anomalies

But have a look at the ensemble forecast, updated yesterday. The average line which has now dipped “off the scale” of the graphic from February-March of 2012:

h/t to reader Erik Anderson

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SteveSadlov
October 17, 2011 12:34 pm

Last one still left us with decent moisture in California. This time we may not be so fortunate.

Keith
October 17, 2011 12:39 pm

Garrett says:
October 17, 2011 at 9:57 am
Very, very cold subsurface anomalies appearing in eastern ENSO regions. An east-central based Nina looking likely again. In terms of Winter, if the greenland block returns and gets established…look out!

And perhaps even more interestingly, it doesn’t appear to be due to displacement west of warmer water, as the anomalies there are dropping too. Might it have been instead giving up heat across the width of the ocean to the atmosphere? Might this explain the slightly-unexpected spike in the UAH temps since June? If so, we really are headed for a spell of cooler temps…

Mike
October 17, 2011 12:47 pm

Last year, here in Northern Nevada, winter started in late September and it stayed cold and snowy into June of this year. By comparison this Fall is staying mostly warm, although we had an early October snow storm push through recently. Not sure how long this nice Fall weather will hold.

richard verney
October 17, 2011 12:58 pm

In the UK, during the last couple of months, there has been concern at the rising costs of energy and the stretch that this will place on households. The BBC has interviewed several people regarding this (politicians on both sides of the political spectrum) and they have offered stated that this winter will be a very cold winter. If the BBC will allow interviews where the interviewee discusses very cold winters, one knows that the forthcoming winter is truly expected to be bad. The BBC normally oinly runs with stories that fit the warmist mantra.
It does appear that the UK is preparing for a cold winter this year. If that hapopens, it will be 3 very cold winters in a row. So much for snow being a thing of the past, and that the UK would be experiencing milder winters.

roger
October 17, 2011 1:04 pm

“, our illustrious coalition Secretary of State for Energy and Climate Change, Chris Huhne, calms the nation by simply telling us all to shop around and switch suppliers, on national TV.”
For crass stupidity and ignorance of even basic economics this man takes the biscuit on an almost daily basis. After a weekend of lambasting the Energy Suppliers for making £125 profit per customer on an average spend of £1325 he appears in our papers and on our screens to tell us to change supplier and by selecting a different tariff cut our bills by more than £200.
Conveniently he omits to tell us that through VAT and ROC the government is taking at least £200 from every household and that even this imposition will go very little way towards providing the £200Bn needed to pay for the outrageously subsidised and inefficient renewable energy sources that he favours.

October 17, 2011 1:04 pm

Hi Joe Bastardi!
Due to the lack of succes from other models and better succes for CFS/NCEP predicting the 2010 La Nina, then i would note at all rule out that CFS/NCEP is indeed going to be closest, we will see much lower than -1,2K in the spring 🙂
That my guess, see fig 2 how hopelessly most other models has “predicted” the 2010 La Nina:
http://hidethedecline.eu/pages/posts/yes-it-appears-that-a-historic-super-la-nina-is-just-few-months-ahead-243.php

Gary Pearse
October 17, 2011 1:14 pm

Cold wind, sleet in Montreal today. Heading for tropical Ottawa Ontario where its a degree or two warmer. If a couple of years ago Phil Jones admitted there was no statistical warming since 1995, can we say we will have had statistical cooling soon? I’m waiting for UHA’s stuborn avg monthly lower Trop temp to move down in earnest. I’m awfully conflicted about this development. Ha ha you new world order guys, we’re going to freeze to death. See what I mean!

Stephen Wilde
October 17, 2011 1:14 pm

Low solar activity = more meridional/equatorwatd jets = more global cloudiness = less energy into the oceans = La Nina gains strength in relation to El Nino for net system cooling.

Auto
October 17, 2011 1:30 pm

We had snow lying throughout December last year – in south London. I cant’ remember anything like that since 1963-64, when the Boxing Day [and onwards] snow didn’t finally vanish until April [west London].
Gues I shall start checking all our guttering is clear.

Keith
October 17, 2011 1:32 pm

Gary, to be honest the Malthusians amongst the New World Order guys don’t particularly care if we freeze or boil to death, just so long as billions of us die.

Rosco
October 17, 2011 1:32 pm

Alarmism hasn’t changed!
SAID HANRAHAN by John O’Brien
“We’ll all be rooned,” said Hanrahan,
In accents most forlorn,
Outside the church, ere Mass began,
One frosty Sunday morn.
The congregation stood about,
Coat-collars to the ears,
And talked of stock, and crops, and drought,
As it had done for years.
“It’s looking crook,” said Daniel Croke;
“Bedad, it’s cruke, me lad,
For never since the banks went broke
Has seasons been so bad.”
“It’s dry, all right,” said young O’Neil,
With which astute remark
He squatted down upon his heel
And chewed a piece of bark.
And so around the chorus ran
“It’s keepin’ dry, no doubt.”
“We’ll all be rooned,” said Hanrahan,
“Before the year is out.”
“The crops are done; ye’ll have your work
To save one bag of grain;
From here way out to Back-o’-Bourke
They’re singin’ out for rain.
“They’re singin’ out for rain,” he said,
“And all the tanks are dry.”
The congregation scratched its head,
And gazed around the sky.
“There won’t be grass, in any case,
Enough to feed an ass;
There’s not a blade on Casey’s place
As I came down to Mass.”
“If rain don’t come this month,” said Dan,
And cleared his throat to speak –
“We’ll all be rooned,” said Hanrahan,
“If rain don’t come this week.”
A heavy silence seemed to steal
On all at this remark;
And each man squatted on his heel,
And chewed a piece of bark.
“We want an inch of rain, we do,”
O’Neil observed at last;
But Croke “maintained” we wanted two
To put the danger past.
“If we don’t get three inches, man,
Or four to break this drought,
We’ll all be rooned,” said Hanrahan,
“Before the year is out.”
In God’s good time down came the rain;
And all the afternoon
On iron roof and window-pane
It drummed a homely tune.
And through the night it pattered still,
And lightsome, gladsome elves
On dripping spout and window-sill
Kept talking to themselves.
It pelted, pelted all day long,
A-singing at its work,
Till every heart took up the song
Way out to Back-o’-Bourke.
And every creek a banker ran,
And dams filled overtop;
“We’ll all be rooned,” said Hanrahan,
“If this rain don’t stop.”
And stop it did, in God’s good time;
And spring came in to fold
A mantle o’er the hills sublime
Of green and pink and gold.
And days went by on dancing feet,
With harvest-hopes immense,
And laughing eyes beheld the wheat
Nid-nodding o’er the fence.
And, oh, the smiles on every face,
As happy lad and lass
Through grass knee-deep on Casey’s place
Went riding down to Mass.
While round the church in clothes genteel
Discoursed the men of mark,
And each man squatted on his heel,
And chewed his piece of bark.
“There’ll be bush-fires for sure, me man,
There will, without a doubt;
We’ll all be rooned,” said Hanrahan,
“Before the year is out.”

October 17, 2011 1:55 pm

I would not trust the CFS beyond the next month or so. I’ve done so before, and it has made an a– of me.
There was a long La Nina from March 1954 to January 1957 which can be called a “triple dipper.” El Ninos were few and far between back in those days. If we are returning to that part of a “cycle,” it will be hard to keep world temperatures from dropping.

Septic Matthew
October 17, 2011 2:08 pm

Did you save the forecasts for Sept and Oct, so we’d have an idea of what accuracy we might expect from these forecasts?

October 17, 2011 2:12 pm

You know what I hate about La Niña? It’s that creepy thing above the last N.

Green Sand
October 17, 2011 2:12 pm

AMSR-E, not yet gone a month but already I have a untoward feeling.

Baa Humbug
October 17, 2011 2:15 pm

Well now these ensemble forecasts have been off the chart for a few weeks now, nothing new. And they’re all wrong. They all show a swing back up towards positive territory in March. The Nino 3.4 just doesn’t do that.
I said on a couple of accasions earlier this year that a La Nina will develop if the 3.4 doesn’t swing back up by the 2nd week of July. It didn’t and a weak La Nina started to develop.
The 3.4 chart will stay on this path until early January, that’s when we’ll know if it will swing back up towards neutral. (And it should)
The difference between this La Nina and the one of last year is that this one is NOT accompanied by strong easterly trade winds.
http://www.pmel.noaa.gov/tao/jsdisplay/plots/gif/sst_wind_anom_5day_jsd.gif
(Notice how the cool Pacific waters are broken up somewhat. That’s because the winds are in all sorts of weird directions.)
http://www.osdpd.noaa.gov/data/sst/anomaly/anomnight.current.small.gif
The Southern Oscillation Index (SOI) has only recently barely hit La Nina territory due to the cooler than normal SSTs near Darwin. These SSTs have recently been warming. If they continue to warm, the SOI will climb dramatically, the trade winds will pick up, then we might see this La Nina develop into a strong one. (I’m betting the 3.4 will barely hit -1.5 i.e. not as strong as the 2008 event)
The upshot of it all is that this La Nina (whether moderate or strong) will be with us until the years end, meaning we will have cooler than normal temperatures right the way through until at least next July/August.
In the meantime, check out the amount of radiation that’s been leaving the system for the last 4 years or so
http://www.bom.gov.au/climate/mjo/graphics/region.ts.dateline.gif.small.gif

Anthony Scalzi
October 17, 2011 2:24 pm

Wade says:
October 17, 2011 at 11:02 am
Living in the southeast US I have noticed that there are more acorns this year than last year. Winter isn’t long now, we shall see what happens.

Living in the northeast US, I’ve noticed the maple trees behaving very oddly this year. Normally the maple seeds ripen and drop before the trees leaf out. This year however, the seeds stayed on the trees all summer and only in the past week or so have they started falling.

Hoser
October 17, 2011 2:28 pm

Robertol says:
October 17, 2011 at 9:47 am
Habitualmente esto provoca intensas sequías en Sud América. Especialmente en Argentina y Brasil. Compren soja… Va a aumentar de precio.!!
ldd says:
October 17, 2011 at 9:56 am

OK, here’s my attempt:
Usually this causes intense droughts in South America. Especially in Argentina and Brazil. Buy soy… It’s going to increase in price!!

October 17, 2011 2:30 pm

It means life is gonna suck in Ohio & I had better keep adding to the wood pile before it starts 😉

Babsy
October 17, 2011 2:31 pm

The Second Law of Thermodynamics. Old Sol. Sea water. These are the things that drive the process called ‘climate’ on this planet.

thedudeabides
October 17, 2011 2:37 pm

Joe Bastardi, sorry, maybe I missed it but what exactly was your prediction: “I am on record as saying the objective global temp will drop to at least -.15C by march”
Also what exactly did you mean about returning to the 1950s climate? Do you mean that global temperature and sea ice will return to 1950s levels?

Editor
October 17, 2011 2:53 pm

*EVERYBODY PLEASE CALM DOWN BEFORE WE ALL MAKE FOOLS OF OURSELVES IN PUBLIC*. There are *TWO* sets of forecasts accessable from http://www.cpc.ncep.noaa.gov/products/people/wwang/cfs_fcst/ There is a “raw” forecast, and there is a “PDF-corrected” forecaste (PDF = Probability Density Function). See http://www.cpc.ncep.noaa.gov/products/people/wwang/cfs_fcst/PDFcorrection.html for an explanation…
> The probability density function (PDF) correction is done by mapping CFS
> forecast PDF to observed PDF. The observed PDF is defined using OIv2
> analysis for 1981-2006. The CFS PDF is defined using individual members
> (15 for each initial month) from the hindcast for 1981-2006. The PDF mapping
> is a function of initial time and target time, and is done for monthly mean and
> for individual members
In plain English… the raw forecasts tend to overdo the extremes, which has everybody here fooled. The PDF-corrected forecasts tend be more accurate. The raw forecast for Nino 3.4 is at http://www.cpc.ncep.noaa.gov/products/people/wwang/cfs_fcst/images3/nino34SSTMon.gif while the PDF-corrected forecast is at http://www.cpc.ncep.noaa.gov/products/people/wwang/cfs_fcst/images3/PDFcr_nino34SSTMon.gif which shows -1.5 for January.
I hate to rain on the parade, but everyone please calm down.

Jimmy Haigh
October 17, 2011 2:54 pm

Wow. Just imagine how bad the La Nina would have beeen if we hadn’t been killing theplanet by burning all these fossil fuels for all these years… /sarc.

October 17, 2011 3:02 pm

There’s nothing wrong with cold weather.

Kevin Kilty
October 17, 2011 3:32 pm

I hope we don’t remain in what appears to be this La Nina driven drought. We have been very dry, and windy, for about 16 months now. We could use a break. In the past I tried to correlate Wyoming droughtiness with El Nino, but really there is no definitive correlation. La Nina seems to make us droughty. Does anyone have any information on what to expect?