Guest Post by Ira Glickstein
What should a responsible Skeptic say to an astute audience? When recently invited by the “Technology, Engineering, and Science Plus” group in my community to give a talk and answer questions, I knew I would have an attentive room of tech-savvy professionals. However, they might not be fully tuned in to the details of the Global Warming controversy. Furthermore, they were likely to have opinions closer to the supposed “mainsteam science” orientation than mine.
In this posting, I’ve summarized the main points I think are most likely to align people who are both intelligent and reasonable to the Skeptic side. My Powerpoint (with talking points for each chart in the Notes section under each slide) is available [click here] for you to use and adapt as you wish.

A. Basic Climate Science – Water vapor (H2O), carbon dioxide (CO2), and other “greenhouse” gases cause the Earth Surface to be warmer than it would be if the Atmosphere was just nitrogen.
- Light energy from the Sun warms the Earth System, which consists of our Atmosphere and the Surface. Based on satellite measurements, the Sun provides 1366 Watts per square meter (W/m^2) at the Top of the Atmosphere. After accounting for the Earth’s spherical shape and albedo (reflectiveness), the absorbed energy averages out to about 240 W/m^2 for each square meter.
- To maintain a relatively constant mean temperature, Output Energy must equal Input Energy, so the Earth System must emit about 240 W/m^2 out to Space, which it does.
- We call the Input Energy “light” because we can see (much of) it. We call the Output Energy “heat” because we can feel it. However, whether it is “short wave” energy from the very hot Sun, or “long wave” from the more moderate Earth System, we know that energy is fungible. 240 W/m^2 of one type is equal, power-wise, to 240 W/m^2 of the other. A Watt is a Watt, no matter what :^)
- But, there is an “issue” – if we consider the Earth System as a “black body”, according to the laws of physics, for the Earth System to emit 240 W/m^2, it would have to be at a temperature of only 255 Kelvin, where Kelvins are degrees Celsius above absolute zero. (The Earth System is not exactly a black body, but it is close enough for our purposes here.)
- You may remember that anything above absolute zero emits radiant energy and that 0.0 Kelvin corresponds to -273ºC or -460ºF. The “issue” is that the Earth Surface has a mean temperature closer to 288 Kelvin, corresponding to about +15ºC or +59ºF. In other words, the Surface is about 33ºC or 58ºF warmer than the “black body” formula would indicate. How to explain this added warmth?
- The generally accepted explanation is the Atmospheric “greenhouse effect”. This is true science, but the name is somewhat misleading because a glass greenhouse works mostly by restricting convection while the Atmospheric effect works mostly by restricting radiation. I use “scare quotes” around “greenhouse” to acknowledge this semantic issue.
- The Atmosphere passes most of the “short wave” energy from the Sun and absorbs most of the “long wave” energy from the Surface. The absorbed energy warms the Atmosphere and is re-emitted in all directions at a variety of “long wave” wavelengths. A portion of radiation from the Atmosphere passes out the Top of the Atmosphere to Space. A portion is emitted in the downward direction and is absorbed by the Surface. This absorbed radiant energy accounts for most of the extra 33ºC or 58ºF.
- A variety of gases in the Atmosphere, primarily water vapor (H2O) and carbon dioxide (CO2), absorb and re-emit “long wave” radiation. These are called “greenhouse gases”.
B. Divergent Views – There is a valid, science-based argument between people I refer to as Warmists, Lukewarmers, and Skeptics. I distinguish their reasoned views from the far out, unscientific rantings of people I refer to as Alarmists and their equal and opposite reaction opponents, who I call Disbelievers.
- VP Al Gore was not the first Alarmist, but his public lectures and his Nobel and Oscar-winning movie, An “Inconvenient” Truth, probably did more than anything else to bring Global Warming Alarmism to the fore in the consciousness of the major media and the general population.
- The scene depicted above was the highlight of his presentation.
- Gore displays the Ice Core record of the past 600,000 years for CO2 (red) and Temperature (blue). He points out the undoubted correlation between the two parameters. When one goes up so does the other. When one goes down, the other does as well. He points out that the then current CO2 level is considerably higher than that of the past 600,000 years, and he projects the future levels of CO2 assuming it continues to rise at current rates. So far, this is all true.
- Dramatically ascending high above the stage on his motorized platform, he implies that mean temperatures will rise in proportion to the CO2. (My graphic is annotated in dashed blue to show the implied warming.) If that happens, he warns, more and more of the polar ice will melt, causing the seas to rise and flooding coastal areas. The ground under the polar ice will be exposed, further reducing the albedo of the Surface and causing further warming. We will reach a tipping point with runaway Global Warming.
- The villain of Gore’s story is the human race and our habit of burning ever-increasing quantities of fossil fuels (coal, oil, natural gas) that release unprecedented amounts of CO2. This scene, more than any other event, is most likely responsible for the birth of what has come to be known as Catastrophic Anthropogenic Global Warming, CAGW. In other words, catastrophe due to human-caused Global Warming. It has become the mantra of the Alarmists and an excuse for governments to regulate all fossil fuels as well as land use that affects albedo. Since all industry and agriculture and civilized life itself depends upon fossil fuels and land use, the Alarmists give suitably oriented politicos an excuse to regulate and tax and restrict virtually everything. We outdoors types will need an indulgence from the government every time we pass wind. And, we can forget about lighting a campfire :^).
- But, as the annotations in my graphic above show, there is a fundamental “Inconvenient” truth about the ice core data. It has absolutely nothing to say about the current Global Warming controversy! Gore was misleading the media and the public when he implied that rising CO2 levels would cause corresponding increases in mean temperatures. In particular, as any scientist who took a close look at the ice core data would see, and as I show in the inset graph in the upper left corner, Temperature always rises eight-hundred or more years before CO2 increases. The same is true in the other direction. The Temperature falls eight-hundred or more years prior to CO2 decreases. What this shows, if anything, is that TEMPERATURE CAUSES CO2, or, that something else causes both to change, with CO2 lagging by hundreds of years. Gore got the direction of causation backwards.
- When the falsehood of this implied causation was pointed out, Gore’s apologists claimed that it was a minor matter and, after all, despite the 800-year lag, both Temperature and CO2 were up together and down together for about 5/6ths of the record. Besides, they said, we are currently burning historically unprecedented amounts of fossil fuel, and, we know that CO2 is a “greenhouse gas”, and so on and on. But, the truth is still that the ice core record is of a time when there were no humans to burn fossil fuels, so why did Gore bring it up since it has no relationship to our current situation? Raw, unfettered Alarmism has had its effect on the media, the political class, and we common citizens who have to pay the costs of the phony CAGW panic.
- In politics, as in physics, every reaction has an equal and opposite reaction. In the Case of CAGW, that opposite (and equally false) reaction is what I call Disbeliever AGW or DAGW. These are people who use pseudo-scientific arguments in their claim that humans have had absolutely no hand in the mean temperature rise of the past century, or that there has been no temperature rise, or that the basic science of the Atmospheric “greenhouse effect” is untrue, and so on. I do not like to be to critical of the DAGW crowd because, when it comes to general political decisions, they are more likely than not to agree with me than my opponents, but my academic integrity and ethical duty as a licensed professional engineer require me to state what I see as the error of their arguments. (As I have in my WUWT Visualizing series [1, 2, 3, 4, 5])
- Having dismissed what I regard as the unscientific Alarmists and Disbelievers, that leaves us with three groups that, for the most part, use rational science-base arguments for their diverse views. Of course, every member of each group has somewhat different views, and any attempt to divide them into three distinct types is bound to cross some lines. So, please consider my grouping as approximate.
- Carbon sensitivity, which is the estimate of how much mean temperatures will increase if CO2 doubles from historical or current levels, is one way to determine which of the the three groups a person belongs to. The Warmists tend to accept the UN Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change (IPCC) estimate of 2.0ºC to 4.5ºC. The Skeptics tend to set carbon sensitivity much lower, perhaps 0.2ºC to 1ºC. The third group, which I call Lukewarmers, would suggest 1ºC to 3ºC.
- How much of the rise in CO2 is attributable to human use of fossil fuels is also estimated differently. Warmists would blame humans for nearly all of it, while Skeptics would say less than half. Similarly, the blame for the supposed 0.8ºC rise in mean temperatures since 1880 is mostly attributed to human activities, while Skeptics say that data bias “adjustments” by the official climate record keepers is responsible for about a third of the supposed warming, and that natural cycles, over which humans have no control, are responsible for about half of it, leaving only 0.1ºC (or maybe up to 0.2ºC) to human responsibility. Lukewarmers are somewhere in-between.
- Skeptics have well-justified suspicions that the official climate data keepers were “cooking the books” to lend whatever support they could to the highest estimates of carbon sensitivity. Around the year 2000, US Mean Temperature data was “adjusted” down by 0.1 to 0.2ºC for years prior to the 1970’s, and upwards by 0.2 to 0.3ºC for years after the 1970’s, increasing supposed warming by 0.3 to 0.5ºC.
- The surfacestations.org project published photos of official temperature measurement stations that were very near artificial sources of heat, with most being in the lowest two of the five quality levels established by the government. The poor quality stations were compared to nearby well-located stations. There were large temperature deltas that could only be accounted for if the the stations now poorly-located were originally well-located, but had been influenced by nearby development, such as paved parking lots, buildings, and air conditioning vents.
- According to a figure in the 1990 IPCC report, 1100 to 1300 AD saw temperatures in the northern hemisphere that were higher than current levels. However, the IPCC 2001 report included the infamous so-called “hockey stick” chart that managed to make the Medieval Warm Period of about 1000 years ago disappear! (My Powerpoint set includes charts with evidence of each of the aforementioned issues.)
- These suspicions were not fully confirmed until 2009 when someone (probably an inside whistle-blower) released emails and computer code from the Climatic Research Unit (CRU) in the UK, and, later that year, a Freedom of Information Act (FOIA) request yielded a stash from the US NASA-GISS (Goddard Institute for Space Studies).
C. Climategate – UK Climatic Research Unit (CRU) emails and the US NASA GISS FOIA emails. What they tell us about the published Global Warming data.

- I refer to the CRU as the Climategate Research Unit or, more simply, the Fudge Factory because the words “fudge factor” appear in their computer code. Phil Jones, PhD, is the CRU Director. He confirmed suspicions about the infamous “Hockey Stick” graph when, in an email, he called it “Mike’s Nature trick” (because a version of that graph appeared in a paper by Dr. Michael Mann in the prestigious journal Nature ). He also wrote that the “trick” was designed to “hide the decline” in tree ring proxy data. The tree-ring expert associated with CRU, Keith Brifa, PhD, admits, in one of the emails that “the recent warmth was probably matched about 1,000 years ago”. (My Powerpoint set includes slides with direct quotes from the Climategate materials.)

- Moving on to the FOIA emails from GISS, it is interesting to note that their HQ, in New York City, happens to be in the same building as the famous restaurant where Jerry Seinfeld dined with George, Kramer, and Elaine. (It was never revealed what Kramer did for a living – perhaps he was the chief analyst at GISS :^)
- The most revealing email from GISS is reproduced above. It was from Makiko Sato, PhD to her Boss, GISS-Director James Hansen, PhD, detailing the seven different analyses and comparisons of US mean temperatures for 1934 and 1998. The later year was the hottest in the 1990’s, so it was, let us say “inconvenient” that 1934, according to data published by GISS in 1999, was over 0.5ºC warmer. If Global Warming was almost entirely due to recent human activities, and was accelerating, how could the 1930 have been warmer?
- Just as the Hockey Stick made the Medieval Warm Period disappear, GISS tried mightily to make 1934 cooler than 1998, but only succeeded in reducing the 0.5ºC lead into a dead heat. Notice that the 0.5ºC “adjustment” is more than half the supposed total warming since 1880.
- I would like to trust the work of taxpayer-supported science, but, it seems, we must rely on President Reagan’s advice regarding the old Soviet Union, “Trust, but verify!”
D. What We Can and Should Do – Energy policy (cap and trade scam vs carbon tax). Efficiency, conservation, “green“, and renewable sources.
- I am quite sure that Global Warming is REAL (i.e. the mean temperature of the Surface has increased by 0.5 to 0.6ºC since 1880) but, most of that increase is due to Natural Cycles over which we humans have no control.
- However, the warming is PARTLY Due to Rising CO2 Levels and human actions are PART of the Cause.
- There is not and never has been any real danger of catastrophe or even of serious net detriment to human life due to increased CO2 levels. Indeed, modest increases in these parameters are most likely a net benefit.
- However, we Skeptics have to be realistic in the current political climate. Like it or not (and I do not like it) the official climate “Team” (i.e., the “Hockey Team” :^) has convinced the political and media establishment, and much of the population that something has to be done. We cannot fight something with nothing, so we need something more than a passive policy of do nothing because nothing is necessary.
- Therefore, I favor reduction of the carbon footprint by efficiency, conservation, recycling, and so on, plus the introduction, if and when economically practical of so-called “Green” energy, including Nuclear, Water, Wind, Biomass and, particularly, “Clean” Coal.
- If nothing else, these will do minimum harm and, if successful, will reduce US dependence upon foreign oil. We have spent, and continue to sacrifice too much blood and treasure protecting our access, and that of our allies, to energy from unstable regions of the world.
- As for the Cap and Trade scam, it is a Politician’s Delight that rewards powerful Interests, wrecks the economy, and will NOT significantly reduce carbon emissions. It seems to me that some countries and US states that have adopted Cap and Trade have realized their folly and are backing away from it.
- You may be surprised that I favor some version of a straight Carbon Tax, collected at the mine, well, and port, with the proceeds returned on an equal basis to citizens and legal residents. Yes, James Hansen and (pardon the expression Ralph Nader) also favor it, but, so do conservative columnist Charles Krauthammer, the Wall Street Journal, and others on the right. My support for this tax is based on what I wrote above, “We cannot fight something with nothing” and “We have spent, and continue to sacrifice too much blood and treasure protecting our access, and that of our allies, to energy from unstable regions of the world.”
I’m interested in your critique and comments. (My Powerpoint presentation is available [click here] for you to use and adapt as you wish..)
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If your conclusion is the same as the Warmists (we need a carbon tax) your argument is totally meaningless. You might as well skip the whole thing and just say “John Holdren said it, I believe it, that settles it.”
The Carbon Cultists are NOT arguing for the sake of scientific details, they are arguing to achieve governmental control and Wall Street profits. The “science” is a mere exiguous variable, a public-relations vehicle to persuade educated people to go along with their purposes. This was all laid out clearly in their 1975 manifesto.
P.S. I dare you to insert the above as a succinct sample of the thinking of DisBelievers. We can always use more recruits.
Overall, a very good piece.
I regard the ice core evidence as crucial. As far as I’m aware, the data shows no instance when a change in CO2 caused a corresponding change in the temperature. This strongly suggests that, presumably due to negative feedbacks, changes in CO2 has a completely negligible effect on the climate. It then follows that mankind’s emissions have had a neglegible effect on the climate, and that the modest warming we enjoyed in the previous century was primarily natural. In other words, it’s Nature doing what Nature has always done.
But I disagree on one thing. I suspect that the combination of a slightly warmer climate and the increase in CO2 has, overall, been of great benefit to mankind. Despite more doom-mongering on the BBC’s Today program this morning – it’s funny how we’re always doomed twenty years in the future – mankind has never been more prosperous.
I think the biggest threat to the well-being of mankind is indeed climate change. But it’s not the climate itself that threatens us. It’s the poisonous CAGW delusion that, if allowed to progress unchecked, will cause the world to squander countless trillions of dollars trying to solve a problem that almost certainly doesn’t exist. That this money may be diverted from solving real problems such as clean water and malaria is a crime against humanity.
Chris
I am a layman, a retired farmer but have been heavily mixed up in agricultural science for some 30 or more years until very recently so have attended my share of a very considerable number of science presentations, forums and highly technical discussions so I have seen the good, the bad and the ugly in talk only presentations right through to power point presentations.
1 / How long, what time period do you have for your presentation?
30 minutes maximum will see most audiences out for a presentation and another 10 to 20 for questions if you’ve got them really interested.
2 / Those 34 PPT slides are full to the extreme in my opinion of often messy detail which in many cases is quite hard to sort out from the other detail, an item which just turns any audience off real fast.
So 30 minutes max for the PPT presentation, one minute to absorb each slide.
If that’s the case as we say in Australia, you’ got Buckley’s chance of pulling that one off, ie; none!
20 simplified slides and you will have a good presentation.
If you go the hour, you are very, very good of maybe just get everybody to bring along the pillow and slippers.
3 / Those slides are so full of detail that it is darn near impossible to grasp the message in each slide without a couple of minutes of quite intense concentration and after that happens 3 or 4 times in a row most of the audience just switches off with their eyes wide open.
If the audience is concentrating hard on interpreting the slide it ain’t listening to the speaker unless the audience are all ladies. They can do half a dozen things at the same time.
Us men are rather limited and apparently can only do one thing at a time!
It’s even claimed that some of us men can’t chew gum and walk at the same time.
Content I will leave for far more competent and knowledgeable science people to comment on.
However, mankind needs four things for his survival.
1 / He must have water [ which he thinks he should get for free ]
2 / He must have food. [ which he will pay as little as possible for ]
3 / He needs shelter, ie; houses, buildings , clothes and etc and for those he will expend his entire wealth to show off his status in his culture and society.
4 / He needs energy. [ He will pay well for energy but only under heavy duress ]
Even a cowpat fire used by the very poorest of poor in places like India is an example of the single greatest differentiating characteristic between humanity and animals as it is only man who deliberately harnesses and uses energy for his own purposes.
And energy, cheap, totally reliable coal based energy is the single biggest reason behind the creation of the great Industrial Revolution that began in Britain in the late 1700’s.
An with the immense and totally reliable until now supplies of cheap energy that first drove and then was further developed by that same Industrial Revolution, the great sweep of the Industrial Revolution has spread across the planet to all it’s peoples and has continued it’s ever onward development to this day.
The Industrial Revolution has enabled mankind to reach levels of prosperity, health, knowledge and even surprisingly, peace with his fellow man far exceeding anything ever seen before in the 100,000 years or more of modern Homo Sapien’s existence.
And it this energy, the very basis of our modern existence, of our industrial revolution that the stupidity of the AGW/ACCo’s and their running dogs in politics want to tax out of existence and to force our civilisation back into a dreary disease and hunger and famine driven existence.
Those who do not know history are doomed to repeat it
Dougmanxx says:
May 30, 2011 at 9:22 pm
“Climate change is a non-problem. The right answer to a non-problem is to have the courage to do nothing,”
Lord Christopher Monckton
This is also many times sound economic policy, but sadly we have gotten caught up in the cult of “do something” rather than letting the system fix itself. “Do nothing. Be courageous.”
I agree completely. I work in manufacturing and there’s always the knee-jerk response to do something, any random thing, when there’s a change in the output of the manufacturing process. This is called “chasing the mean” and has been shown to actually increase the variability of the process. A prudent course is to study carefully for real cause and effects and then fix the actual problem with a robust repair.
Overall quite a good summary. I do have one nitpick, though. You say
Temperature always rises eight-hundred or more years before CO2 increases.
This is only true if no other atmospheric CO2 sources other than ‘natural’ ones are present. Temperature is not responsible for the ~100 ppm rise in CO2 concentration since ~1850.
Ira said:
“I’m interested in your critique and comments.”
There you go. I was going to stay out of your way this thread but then I saw your plea in the very last sentence. Btw, you’re getting pretty good at bypassing the sticky science points! Better!
However, on the correct science side; you do want to be correct don’t you?; you have just one big misstep in topic A. The 33 ºC greenhouse effect (GHE) is not correct, at all. That is what some would call AGW science propaganda, plain and simple, toss all GHGs, water and co2, and keep the clouds, ‘bout normal.
If you have a pure nitrogen atmosphere, or any atmosphere without greenhouse gases, there are no clouds. Right?
And with no clouds then there isn’t 77 to 79 Wm-2 of albedo from the clouds. Right?
Here, I’ll calculate the correct greenhouse affected offset for you from the figures in Trenberth & Kiehl 2009 paper:
1364/4*(1-23/341) = 318 Wm-2 incoming solar irradiance, not 240 Wm-2, that is with clouds. And as you said, the output has to equal the input so the OLR (outgoing long radiation) would also be 318 Wm-2.
And this 318 Wm-2 gives you an effective temperature of (318/σ)1/4 or 273.7 K (0.5 ºC) mean surface temperature.
And this gives you 288K−274K or about 14 ºC of a GreenHouse Effect, not 33 ºC. Hate that term! Applies better to bugs. See how snidely they trip you? I’m sure you just overlooked that picky little science fact. You should correct all references to that in your paper to be scientifically correct. Is it real? Yes, but the sum total is a max of 66 Wm-2 and even Trenberth himself has fessed up and admitted to it (hidden in his 390−324 = the real 66 Wm-2 upward flux).
Also, I noticed in you PowerPoint presentation on slide #3 your bold TOA flux is listed at 1336, it should be 1366 Wm-2.
———
Now on the nitty-gritty of your post. I agree with nearly all of what you have said but, as many have raised, I must complain of D.#8 on some kind of carbon tax, NEVER!
I don’t take this point so politely and softly and cushy as many others here, soft words have proven to have no effect.
Never appease terrorists, never! You don’t ever cave in Ira. The AGW side of this fiasco is just that to myself, family and friends, mental terrorists that have brought terror to this entire world’s populous, and, they have done it using warped science, it’s in the papers every single day. They have been proved wrong over and over and over and over again. Dr. Ferenc Miskolczi has proved all of this AGW ‘science’ wrong now years ago.
Science is one thing I have always loved, enjoyed and respected for it’s purity and clarity over the many decades and they spit on it. Ticked? You bet! We should give absolutely nothing to the AGW pushers, especially taxing life itself, for that is what carbon is, life. The only thing the AGW side haven’t moved to yet is munitions…. wait…. 10/10 showed bombs is on their minds…. well, not real ones, yet. Ira, never appease terrorists, never. They live a lie.
Poor Aussie friends, got bald-faced lied to by their government. Surely we in USA are of better temper if our government ever tries to lie to us, our forefathers taught us that there is proper time to fight for what you believe and hold to be true:
Ira, you write ” The Warmists tend to accept the UN Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change (IPCC) estimate of 2.0ºC to 4.5ºC. The Skeptics tend to set carbon sensitivity much lower, perhaps 0.2ºC to 1ºC. The third group, which I call Lukewarmers, would suggest 1ºC to 3ºC.”
There is a fourth group (I call the out and out deniers) who claim that all these figures are based on estimates which have not been validated, since the numbers have never been measured. It is theoretically possible to measure total climate sensitivity, but the estimate of no-feedback climate sensitivity, which is a vital step in the estimate of the numbers you quote, can NEVER be measured, and is, therefore a hypothetical and meaningless number. There is doubt that it can even been estimated.
We simply do not know what the climate sensitivity for a doubling of Co2 is.
Chris Wright says:
May 31, 2011 at 3:44 am
Overall, a very good piece.
I regard the ice core evidence as crucial. As far as I’m aware, the data shows no instance when a change in CO2 caused a corresponding change in the temperature. This strongly suggests that, presumably due to negative feedbacks, changes in CO2 has a completely negligible effect on the climate.
No this is not correct. Following the ice ages, CO2 was a feedback which amplified the (probably solar-induced) warming trend. The temperature shift from glacial to inter-glacial is of the order of 5-8 degrees. It is inconceivable that the sun is solely responsible for any more than a fraction of this.
The question is: what happpens now that CO2 is an independant ‘primary’ forcing. Will strong positive feedbacks be induced as they have in the past or will the feedbacks be neutral or even negative. I tend to agree with Willis E. (I think it was him) who suggested that climate sensitivity is not a constant. For this reason I go with a modest temperature increase of <1.5 deg C for 2xCO2.
According to Marcel Leroux, man is responsible for 0.28% of the “greenhouse gaz”. All the models considers CO2 as a blackbody, that is not science! We have to consider each molecule as independant .Any temperature effect due to “human CO2″is quite small.Also, as told by by Tim Ball, Earth is not a cold planet, and geothermy takes a role.
I guess we shall have a social agenda for the world :
-more energy available in poor countries,by helping them to develop their own ressources ( coal, uranium….)
-more grain for the poor by stopping biofuels and controlling speculation,
-Improve employment level by developing economically sustainable technologies,
-improve efficiency of our technologies,
-more funds for the civilian research on H2 fusion, that will give low cost energy for more time than earth,life!
I apologise for my poor broken pidgin english ; I just want to show you we can propose a brighter future than the greens.
Jean “Littlejohn”Guichard
I do not think anyone has mentioned the most powerful argument.
Earth’s temperature has only risen about 0.8 Degrees C over the past 120 years. Future predictions of catastrophic rises are based on computer models. The reality is that temperatures have not risen since 1998 but humans are pumping out record volumes of CO2. I think that in this short period we have emitted 25% of human produced co2 for no rise in temperature.
For a simpler audience you can make the argument simpler and, perhaps, more convincing…..1. It is agreed by all main sources that temperatures rose less then 1C during the 20th centuary, much the same as they rose over the 19th. This is a very small rise and drastically less then has occurred even in the recent past i.e the 10C rise in temperatures over 50 year shown by Greenland ice deposits 11,000 years ago. 2. Temperatures have not risen this century despite the continuing rise in CO2. 3. Water vapour accounts for c.85% of the green house affect and varies we don’t know how. 4. We cannot (yet) forecast future weather long-term or even over more than 4 weeks (as deviation from annual average for the period). Any longer forecasts are scientifically invalid or, more prosaically, guesses. 5. Were CO2 concentrations in the atmosphere to double, temperatures would (all else being equal) rise by around 1C. Any additional rise is posited on a runaway feedback effect on water vapour concentrations for which there is no evidence at all. CO2 has risen by around one third from man’s activity so far. 6. For what it is worth we are still, geologically, still in an ice age. For the vast majority of the earth’s history (85-90% of it) there has been no permanent ice at the poles. There is now which makes this an ice age, albeit in an ‘interglacial phase’.
There is no evidence of a problem from rising temperatures which appear to be as stable as over any period, there is no evidence to support the theory of runaway feedback from increases in CO2. What completely beats me is how such nonsense got such a grip on worlwide bien-pensant imagination. But then, why did so few see that bankers were lending to people who obviously weren’t going to repay?
One strong argument that should be added is the futility of the developed world’s cutting CO2 emissions on its own–and the impossibility of getting the undeveloped world to do so (even if it “agrees” to do so).
No matter how many proofs are shown, I fear that the core of skeptics will never change its mind. The only hope is to find politicians sympathetic to the case, and there seems to be more of them in the US.
Of course, the sky-rocketing costs of “green” energy could help in these times of high debts
btw it’s not a “carbon tax”, it’s a carbon dioxide tax.
no to any carbon dioxide tax.
as for the so-called instability of the countries where some western countries source oil, how about giving up military control of those countries and instead just compete in the market for the oil like everyone else.
“2. However, the warming is PARTLY Due to Rising CO2 Levels and human actions are PART of the Cause.”
There is no hard evidence to prove this.
Thanks, Gerald, for your praise for 95% of my presentation. I am sorry you do not agree with the small part about a Carbon Tax.
I tried to be clear that my support for a straight Carbon Tax was not due to any worry about Global Warming, but strictly because of the high cost, in blood and treasure, of defending our access, and that of our allies around the world, to low-cost petroleum from unstable sources. Who is paying that cost? The general population, in the form of taxes towards the defense budget, plus the lives of thousands of their sons and daughters, and serious injuries to tens of thousands more.
Absolutely true. If a Carbon Tax is passed into law, it will be the consumers of fossil-fuel products who will pay the costs. However, creative corporation will be motivated to reduce the fossil-fuel content of their products and services, by efficiency and use of alternative carbon-free and carbon-neutral fuels. They will do that so their products and services cost less to produce than that of their competitors, and those savings will be passed along to their customers, workers, and stockholders.
If the Carbon Tax, as supporters say, is revenue-neutral, the overall economy will not suffer. The government already taxes and regulates products at the mine, well, and port, so the Carbon Tax will be inexpensive to collect and hard to cheat on. It will start off at a low rate but have a pre-defined growth that will allow producers and consumers to plan ahead and take prudent actions to reduce future costs.
Yes, it is re-distributive to some extent, as is our basic income tax system. If the revenues are distributed equally to every citizen and legal resident, those who use less than the average amount of products and services with high fossil fuel content will get back more than the added costs of these items. That will encourage low and moderate income folks to use walk, bike, or use public transportation to get to work, to vacation locally, and so on to save money. If they adjust their behaviors, the money they get back will more than compensate for the higher prices they pay. High income people will, for the most part, just pay the added cost, and therefore will get back less than the higher prices they pay.
I do not think the type of revenue-neutral Carbon Tax I favor (along with Charles Krauthammer and others on the right) will ever pass in the form specified. So, as a political tactic, it gives us something to oppose the Cap & Trade scam, without much chance our Carbon Tax will become law. If the politicos try to change our straight, across-the-board scheme to something different, we will shout our opposition. When you get a chance, read about Machiavelli http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Niccol%C3%B2_Machiavelli
Jaypan and a few others beat me to it, Ira – your well made point that CO2 lags temperature – but I’d like to add that if that is the accepted direction of causality, shouldn’t the question be, “How much must the temperature rise to double atmospheric CO2?” And of course the other question would be, “How much must the temperature drop to halve the amount of atmospheric CO2?”
@- Joel Heinrich says:
May 31, 2011 at 1:39 am
“For any given amount of energy to be emitted, a black body has the lowest possible temperature. Any body that is not a black body MUST have a higher temperature then that. The fact that the Earth is not a black body, and not even close to one, accounts for much of the 33K in question.”
Correct, and the rising CO2 is a key component in changing the effective albedo of the Earth in the very part of the EM spectra that carries most of the energy away from the surface.
It is because water vapour, CO2 and CH4 have such pronounced interactions with longwave radiation that they dominate the energy balance of the surface while the absorption/emissivity of O2 and N2 are several orders of magnitude smaller and therefore of little relevence EXCEPT as part of the ‘heat-sink’ that stores the thermal energy that the CO2 and other GHG’s convert from the OLR.
“We cannot fight something with nothing, so we need something more than a passive policy of do nothing because nothing is necessary.”
“Therefore, I favor reduction of the carbon footprint by efficiency, conservation, recycling, and so on, plus the introduction, if and when economically practical of so-called “Green” energy, including Nuclear, Water, Wind, Biomass and, particularly, “Clean” Coal.”
“You may be surprised that I favor some version of a straight Carbon Tax, collected at the mine, well, and port, with the proceeds returned on an equal basis to citizens and legal residents.”
I believe in true science and the free market, so I disagree with you, although I admire your work greatly.
I don’t see why mankind has to act on flawed science and I don’t see why the government should tell us how to heat our house, based on that flawed science.
Lets get the science back to how it’s supposed to work and let the people vote with their wallet on what to choose.
What we really need is another Age of Enlightenment after this Age of Stupid.
Mr. Glickstein, like all the “lukewarmers” and “alarmists”, does not know what he is talking about, and like all of them he has learned nothing from the intense debates (which I predict can therefore only increase in intensity, limited only by common sense, which unfortunately is at a low ebb everywhere now). In the face of such entrenched incompetence, one can only point to the critical evidence that definitively invalidates the greenhouse effect as promulgated by the mass of scientists:
Venus: No Greenhouse Effect [this is not a link . . kb]
I strongly suggest you also read the comments following that article.
Hint: See how I have approached the “radiating temperature” of a planet in that article, versus how the mass of scientists keep trying to make the surface of the Earth a blackbody. Then note how clear and simple (on several fundamental points concerning the warming of the atmosphere) are the results of my approach, absolutely and unconditionally confirming that approach. The lessons should be clear, to any competent physical scientist: There is NO greenhouse effect (an increase in “global temperature” due to increasing carbon dioxide in the atmosphere); the Earth’s surface is NOT a blackbody, and DOES NOT RADIATE AS ONE; the planetary atmosphere is basically warmed (during the day) by direct absorption of incident solar infrared radiation, NOT from the surface; and the effect of increased infrared (heat!) absorption and emission in the atmosphere is just increased efficiency of heat transfer within the controlling hydrostatic (vertical temperature lapse rate) structure of the atmosphere, not increased warming (nor cooling) of the atmosphere. If you want to clean up climate science, you will eventually have to confront, and accept, my simple analysis of the Venus/Earth atmospheric temperatures — because that is where the truth lies, in the definitive evidence instead of in all the competing theoretical arguments so many find reassuring, but are in fact wrong and misleading. You are miseducating the world, and a whole new generation of students.
The trick to hide the decline, as far as I can recall, only refers to post-1960 proxy values.
Your figure mentioning this and the medieval warm period at the same time is rather confusing to me, as it seems to conflate the two.
I think the figure should be split in order to adress each point separately.
This is incredible work Ira. I just wish there was an audio narration to go with it. Of course, if any of us use this we must know the stuff for ourselves before we can share it to ensure we are not hypocrites.
It’s not new. 100 years ago, alarmists (usually people in a moral panic about something or other) were shouting, “For Gawd’s sake, do something!” H.G. Wells called them “Gawdsakers,” a term that had a brief vogue back then.