Essay by Eric Worrall
According to Canadian Cardinal Michael Czerny, Hurricane Ian which recently struck Florida shows that people should stop listening to populist politicians and climate skeptics.
October 5, 2022 12:01 AM GMT+10
Extreme hurricanes show time of climate change denial is over, Vatican says
VATICAN CITY, Oct 4 (Reuters) – Recent extreme weather events, such as the hurricane that devastated parts of Florida, show that the time for climate change denial and scepticism is over, a senior Vatican official said on Tuesday.
Cardinal Michael Czerny, a Canadian who heads the Vatican’s development office, made his comments at a news conference presenting “The Letter,” a new film on the climate crisis by two-time Emmy award winner Nicolas Brown.
…
“The time is over for speculation, for skepticism and denial, for irresponsible populism,” Czerny said.
“Apocalyptic floods, mega droughts, disastrous heatwaves, and catastrophic cyclones and hurricanes have become the new normal in recent years; they continue today; tomorrow, they will get worse,” he said.
…
Read more: https://www.reuters.com/business/environment/extreme-hurricanes-show-time-climate-change-denial-is-over-vatican-2022-10-04/
Exodus 23:1 tells us: “You shall not spread a false report. You shall not join hands with a wicked man to be a malicious witness.”
As WUWT has repeated detailed, there is no trend in Florida hurricane landfalls. Hurricanes worldwide are not getting worse (see the graph at the top of the page, or click here for more information). Likewise there is no significant global trend in heatwave or other extreme event intensity.
In my opinion Cardinal Czerny should spend more time consulting his bible, and do some basic research, before he makes any further sensationalist claims about climate change.
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I have looked at all of the ground-based wind speed measures around the Ian landfall and I have yet to see one that showed anything other than a CAT 1 storm. The storm surge did the damage. I would like to know where the NHC was getting their Saffir Simpson wind speed data from that allowed them to classify Ian as a strong CAT 4 at landfall.
Chicken Little appears to have been one of the most prolific and unnecessary procreators on planet Earth. A complete lack of critical thinking is apparently an unavoidable family trait, paired with a devout belief in magic and and evils spirits.
Cardinal Czerny works for the Pope. The Pope has spoken on the subject of global warming.
Both the Cardinal and the Pope are supposed to be working for Christ. The Pope has no authority outside the area of religion.
It always amazes me to see on threads like this the number of seemingly sensible sceptics sticking to a belief in an entity whose existence is completely evidence free. I would have thought any sceptic worth their salt would be an atheist.
If that is your only thought then I don’t think you understand quite a lot of things – people, faith and most religions being just a few. I have no problem with you believing in whatever you like (or not as the case may be), just don’t go throwing it into my face. I’ll go my way quietly and you can go yours, equally.
Not throwing anything in anybody’s face. Just commenting.
Why are religious types so touchy? Is it a lack of faith in their own beliefs that makes them so spiky?
@ur momisugly Andrew – Actually sir, every word you have written is a specific, well thought out and targeted attack on anyone with faith.
Dismissed,
Gunny
“Dismissed”.
You sound like one of my old school masters. However, he was a chronic alcoholic and extremely violent. So I doubt you are completely like him.
You never served. Go figure.
I don’t drink, but you can ask the Mujahedeen how “violent” I can be.
I left lots of em in the dirt.
Gunny
Eh?
You have infested this thread with provocative comments.
I have no dog in any religious squabble and comment from a neutral position.
You have so far been nothing less than antagonistic whether you care to recognise that or not.
Infested this thread? I made a couple of comments and then got a deluge of replies trying to prove me wrong. I was just replying to those replies. If making replies is akin to being an infestation, then call me Andrew “Bubonic” Wilkins
OK – Andrew “Bubonic” Wilkins.
The point is your comments are dismissive, mocking and antagonistic. There’s no need for it. Some people have their beliefs. Who are you to sneer at them?
14 But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned. (1Co 2:14 KJV)
As long as people don’t claim their religion as “science” or factual, I don’t care what people believe.
I’ve always been amazed how so many atheists find it impossible to believe that there are so many people who don’t believe as they do.
I must admit to being rather surprised that so many sceptics who quite rightly decry the lack of empirical proof of CAGW are still quite happy to believe in a supernatural entity whose existence lacks any empirical proof.
Oh well, people are free to believe what they want. I accept that I can agree with someone about some subject areas, but disagree with them completely on other areas. That’s the fun of debate.
Oh well…Pfff
You are not interested in debate.
There really is no “debate” where God and faith are concerned.
Either you believe, or you don’t.
You do not respect anyone with faith.
You are dismissed.
Gunny
“You are dismissed.” !!!
Sadly that’s an attitude we see many times from the alarmists ( who don’t understand physics), but who have ‘a simple faith’ that what the propaganda tells them is gospel.
faith / ( feɪθ) / noun strong or unshakeable belief in something,
esp without proof or evidence
a specific system of religious beliefs
Science is more often wrong than it is right.
A scientific theory is a belief. It exists to be falsified.
Was not talking to you.
Go get your vax booster.
Your “science” is WHACK and WRONG 99% of the time.
“Green energy”
“Boys can be girls”
“Masks stop virus spread”
“Our VAX works great”
On and on… Get lost.
You are dismissed.
Gunny
You really need to cheer up.
There you go with the dismissing thing again. Are you sure you’re not a teacher?
Something wrong with teachers?
Nothing wrong with teachers.
I’m a teacher.
No, he/she/it is just a person of low intellect who ‘dismisses’ everything he/she/it doesn’t understand … come back griff all is forgiven.
At least Griff was amusing.
Andrew, please stop engaging the “True Believers”! They are okay with a vengeful god who allows innocent children to die, through no fault of their own. Their god is okay with injustice, criminal activity, I could go on. It’s all part if his omniscient plan. “There is a reason god allows all that” says the believer. So just let them be as long as they don’t try to “guilt” you into giving up your property. The bible is based on and created from ancient Pagan religions and myths but the believers don’t want to know about facts. Belief above all! Regards.
I asked my secondary school Geography teacher if he believed in God being that he was a scientist.
He replied that he wholeheartedly believed in God but he didn’t believe in the idea that he actively manages things on earth, or interferes in the way’s of man.
His opinion was that he created the environment for intelligence to flourish and when the time was right, sent his son (the control group in an experiment) to measure our progress.
In his opinion, God has largely left mankind to its own devices ever since as his own little experiment.
You’ve got it spot on there Barry. Whenever a Christian tells me that their god is a “loving God”, I ask them where is god’s alleged love when a young and innocent child is viciously abused by an adult. None of them have been able to give me a cogent reply; some of them go for the “god moves in mysterious ways” cop out.
Where does it say in the bible that god will intervene in every human event?
A bit authoritarian don’t you think?
Had you not simply skipped over my reply to Barry Malcolm you might have read a response that doesn’t conform to your “god moves in mysterious ways” fantasy.
God gave us free will which, unfortunately, doesn’t always end well, especially with those who turn their backs to God and humanity and choose to walk into darkness. As an atheist, I would have thought you would have been keen on not ascribing to God that which is entirely due to humanity. You can’t have it both ways, although God knows, you are trying desperately to do so.
There’s no rational argument one can make to convince the True Believers. We just have to let it go and tolerate them! Pity the original sinner children for being born that way! Kind of like being in a card game with never getting aces.
The things you mention are not due to God, but humanity. If you have such a big problem with criminality, injustice, war, cruelty, etc then challenge humanity don’t blame God. That would be like blaming the US President if your neighbour’s dog poops on your doorstep.
An ancient saying that is disputed as to said it but…
Is God willing to prevent evil, but not able?
Then he is not omnipotent.
Is he able, but not willing?
Then he is malevolent.
Is he both able and willing?
Then whence cometh evil?
Is he neither able nor willing?
Then why call him God?
God is Just.
Do you object to having freewill?
He’s thrown Man the life preserver.
John 3:16 to18.
Your choice which verse applies to you.
Your choice.
God is just?
Let babies be raped by horrendous child abusers doesn’t appear very just to me.
People blame God because if they had His power they’d fix everything. Freewill be damned!
But, you’re right, Man is his own worst enemy. Romans 1,2 and 3 sums up Man without God.
But there’s something else in play.
God gave His “image”, spirit, to Adam along with authority. He lost both.
The thorns and thistles stuff wasn’t punishment. It was a consequence of him loosing that dominion and spirit.
Who has that dominion now? Read about the Temptations of Jesus. In Corinthians he’s called “The god of this world”. (“World is the Greek word that means “age”, not “ages” but just this age.)
“The last Adam” (1 Corinthians 15:45) will end his “age”.
Please tell me you don’t believe Adam and Eve were a real thing.
But I thought God loves humanity? So in that case, why does he let bed stuff happen to the people he allegedly loves. Can’t you see how ridiculous this is?
I haven’t seen any evidence of you debating anything on this thread.
We’ve been debating the existence of a god. Do keep up!
You have most certainly not been debating.
I have. I’ve discussed the accuracy of the bible, the empirical proof of a god, and the origins of the universe, amongst other things. You might not believe it, but I regard discussing such concepts as debating.
You need to cheer up a bit and enjoy the thread!
You have left a trail of post’s mocking people Andy “Bubonic” Wilkins.
Who ever told you that was debate?
YOU are not “debating” anything.
You must be a liberal twink.
Every comment you post is condescending and argumentative.
You add ZERO VALUE to this thread.
I won’t bother to engage with you just like I refuse to engage any liberal twink.
Go away already.
There you go again with your childish name calling; seems to be the pinnacle of your debating skills .
Again, I was not speaking to you.
Mind your own business.
I don’t think you know what “debate” means.
Calm down dear!
Who made you the thread arbiter? If saveenergy wants to make a comment it’s not your place to tell them to mind their own business.
Now, sit back, relax, and accept that there is no god. You’ll find your life is much easier if you do.
Not entirely sure what a “liberal twink” is, but I voted Conservative in the last election.
You don’t think I’m debating because I’m not agreeing with your religious sensibilities. That’s akin to thermageddonists such as Mike Mann refusing to engage with sceptics because Mikey knows he’ll lose the debate. What strange company you keep.
BTW Gay slang for a gay man with boyish characters is “twink”. Do the young chaps float your boat?
Ok, for me it was a deep dive into the human immune system that convinced me there’s more to this than we understand. Study it. Look at the very involved complexities of it, and try to rationalize how it developed though a series of random mutations.
Too many times I’ve seen a critical path to ‘z’ where ‘a’ must happen before b, b before c, c before d, all the way to z for z to happen, and the organism was only advantaged by z. So why would it maintain all those other changes until z was reached?
And we still haven’t figured out how to “turn on” carefully constructed molecular arrangements and give it life. We can completely deconstruct something living, replicate the parts, put it together, and nothing. What’s missing?
I’m not advocating religion, just that the present alternatives offer no satisfactory answers, either.
“I’m not advocating religion, just that the present alternatives offer no realistic answers, either.”
It’s just because science hasn’t solved it yet. Perhaps it will one day. That’s the beauty of science and the universe we live in: there’s always more to discover.
For people to say “God did it” because they can’t explain it is akin to medieval Christians thinking that the plague was created by God to punish man’s evil ways.
Science can never solve the ‘why’. It is not a scientific question. The belief (since it cannot be proven) is that everything comes from randomness. Chaos, if you prefer. I maintain that there are too many examples of things for which it is difficult to ascribe to randomness.
Where does the “free will” of an abused child fit in the True Believers paradigm? God could perform a miracle, maybe even “convince” the abuser to reconsider? All part of God’s plan. Don’t waste your time Andrew. God speed, hahaha.
“God speed”
Love it! Haha!
Any sceptic worth their salt bases their skepticism on evidence. I once believed in anthropogenic ozone depletion, global cooling and population bomb. But when cooling changed almost overnight to global warming I said wait a minute, that’s contradictory. Show me evidence. And then I saw evidence that debunked all the alarmism.
I follow the evidence. I know more about the science of the origin of the universe, the origin of life and evolution than 95% of those who claim science as reason for their atheism. That makes my highly skeptical of atheism.
This whole situation is infuriating, frustrating. AGW, Covid vax adverse event , great reset scheme etc etc.
K-Bob summed it up for me: you try to have a civilized evidence based discussion and they try to shut you up.
Note what is still going on with Covid vax discussion censorship; even though Das Fuhrer has declared the pandemic crisis over the censorship is permanent and actually I think worse than ever. Its going to be a long hard road to get our constitutional rights back.
In the same way that Obama’s attorney general pronounced the necessity of never letting a crisis to waste, the authoritarians are trying to get every possible ounce of opportunity to oppress from Covid. Sadly for them, a lot of studies are underway, or have already concluded, that document just how damaging government’s every reaction to Covid (including the vaccinations) were.
‘Twould be nice to see the linear trendlines for the data in that chart at the top of this post.
I would far sooner trust the empirical observations of someone who has lived in Florida for 76 years, than the opinion of Cardinal Michael Czerny (76), who has lived most of his life in Canada and Northern America.
The Bible is scathing of false prophets and false teachers. “Your prophets have seen for you false and deceptive visions; . . . . . have seen for you oracles that are false and misleading.” The Cardinal has not been very observant because he would have noticed how many false prophets are among the ranks of climate alarmists.
I really don’t want to get into a religious discussion but how does one know a false prophet from a true one? Real “science” is easily falsifiable.
The Bible tells you how to distinguish false prophets from real ones.
By their fruits, you will know them.
Things predicted by real prophets happen, the things predicted by false prophets, don’t.
Perhaps ask yourself what real “science” is first.
It’s a theory, in other words a belief. In fact, our faith in the scientific method is a belief. If the scientific method is truly scientific, it’s also falsifiable.
I’m not convinced by MarkW’s statement that “By their fruits, you will know them” as Jesus was murdered. Would we not see the same happen today?
The only hope I hold out is that I have led a good enough life to squeak through the pearly gates.
“I do not fear death. I had been dead for billions and billions of years before I was born, and had not suffered the slightest inconvenience from it.” (Mark Twain)
Cardinal Czerny’s problems aren’t the climate, it’s relevance in Canadian society. Here is an excerpt from an article in the National Post.
“ The role of the Catholic Church in society is not what it once was. What used to be a pillar in the social and political life of communities has now, for some, become the building they pass on the way to the grocery store. Its reputation has been tarnished by sex abuse scandals in Canada and around the world, and after last summer, when hundreds of suspected unmarked graves were discovered on the sites of past residential schools, many were reminded of the church’s role in this country’s controversial history.”
https://nationalpost.com/news/canada/the-state-of-the-catholic-church-in-canada/wcm/5983ba01-dfe9-4189-a545-877fb67c4efb/amp/
Why is is that so many high ranking clerical figures think it’s important to push soulless computer influenced political positions rather than then needs and concerns of their congregation? It’s no wonder these establishment religions have been in steady decline for decades.
I don’t think individuals of that type ever had any concern for the congregation.
Its no different than Muslims blaming natural disasters that happen to their enemies on alla.
‘According to Canadian cardinal Michael Czerny…..’. And according to my window cleaner the Cardinal is absolutely correct! (She has the same Academic qualifications as the Cardinal regarding the climate).
The Cleaning Lady.
I think that Czerny should return to his studies.
I think he’s intimately familiar with his navel by now.
The Bishop should see that the Bible is a guide to moral behaviour, not a scientific reference manual.
And you see some very strange interpretations of what is ‘moral’ !!!
The Catholic Church might first address the question of paedophilia amongst it’s clergy before preaching about climate change.
Oddly enough the accusations against the Catholic church always get bigger headlines but if you look at the numbers, more accusations are made against Protestant clergy than any other church. It seems that when someone is put in a position of religious authority, the temptation to abuse that position crosses all denominations.
https://www.cbc.ca/news/world/796-irish-orphans-buried-in-mass-grave-near-catholic-orphanage-historian-1.2663895
https://adoptionland.org/3443/catholic-mass-grave-sites-of-350800-missing-children-found-in-ireland-spain-canada/
My emphasis in both cases.
I have never seen an instances of mass child graves of protestant children.
No mass graves found, no. But the Protestant orphanages at Wicklow, Halifax and several others across N.Ireland have all been involved in mass abuse, ill treatment and torture. My point is still valid – this occurs equally across the board.
I found actual numbers and instances. No use waving a vague reference around and claiming all’s equal. How many children were abused in your references?
Time to DUMP RELIGION maybe?
The Catholic Church hasn’t moved very far from the days when it excommunicated Galileo and Copernicus.
Busier with kids now?
Sorry, Cardinal, not Bishop….
Another example of ‘stay in your lane.’
Where is the discussion of Volcanos?
The pic is Mt Saint Helens that I watched blow it’s top in 1980.
It was not even considered a large eruption yet covered eastern Washington and north Idaho with 6″ of ash for a decade.
We have over 40 above ground volcanoes active today and spewing ash worldwide and countless underwater eruptions in every sea.
One volcano puts out more particulate matter in 60 seconds than all the cars in history.
“Global Warming” is a scam as is the entire “green agenda” that is neither green, nor energy efficient.
Notice that NONE of the famous climate fanatics have given up their private planes, giant yachts, multiple properties or extravagant lifestyles.
What a farce and I will not comply.
Be well,
Gunny
Mt Saint Helens 1980
Very much with you on this subject. Until the climate alarmist’s can tell me precisely how many volcanoes, vents and fissures are on seabeds around the world, and they can measure precisely what gases they emit, then they cannot possibly quantify how much CO2 mankind contributes to the atmosphere.
It took until ~2018 to discover 91 volcanos under the west(?) Antarctic ice sheet.
Thanks.
It does not fit their AGENDA.
There is ZERO “man made” climate change and the earth has been MUCH warmer and much colder throughout history than it is today.
Carry On,
Gunny
Here is the subtext of the Cardinal’s statement “The time is over for speculation, for skepticism and denial, for irresponsible populism,”:
“We are The Borg
The time for your freedom of thought and belief is over
Resistance is futile
You will be assimilated
We are The Borg
The time for your freedom of thought and belief is over
Resistance is futile
You will be assimilated
We are The …… (Blah Blah Blah)”
Let’s see Cardinal, hmm, no thanks, I will continue to think for myself, unlike politicians and Klimate sientists.
The climate cult and the cult of pedophilia working together, seems fitting.
Maybe he can say
a few thousand hail Mary’s and it will all be okay!
The Cardinal does not know what he is talking about. According to the paleoclimate record we have been warming up from the Little Ice Age much as we warmed up from the Dark Ages Cooling Period more than 1400 years ago. There have been many warming and cooling periods during the Holocene over the past 10,000 years and they have nothing to do with CO2. During the current warmup, extreme weather events have not been increasing in either frequency or intensity. A category 4 hurricane hitting Florida near the peak of the hurricane season is not unusual and is not indicative of climate change.If the Cardinal knows so much about climate change I would like him to tell us what he believes to be the climate sensitivity of CO2 and to provide the science behind his answer in his own words. The climate sensitivity of CO2 is very central to the discussion of human caused climate change. It is my opinion that there is no real evidence that CO2 has any effect on climate and that the climate sensitivity of CO2 is zero and hence AGW is a false hypothesis..
.
Since when are church officials suddenly the big authorities on the climate and whether it’s changing or not. Here’s something for them to ponder before they link climate change with increased fossil fuel use. In the US, 8 of the deadliest hurricanes in history occurred before 1950; likewise for 9 of the deadliest tornadoes. So who at that time was blaming increased industrial activity on these weather phenomena? And let’s not forget that prior to 1950 the planet’s population and carbon emissions were nowhere near to what they are today. Yet these violent storms still managed to form and cause extensive death and destruction.
WUWT or Heartland or some other skeptic site should send a very public statement to Cardinal Czerny challenging him to state his case to you and in turn you will state your case to him. In a public venue of course. He can bring all the help he needs. If he refuses then he should stick to preaching because he damn sure doesn’t know climate. Personally I don’t look to the church for scientific guidance just as I don’t look to science for spiritual guidance.
Maybe our dear cardinal should , himself, take more notice of Exodus 23:1.
Here’s a similar chart of cyclone number and intensity in the southern hemisphere showing similar findings… Two similar charts from opposite sites in the world and BOTH show a similar DOWNTREND in tropical storm number and intensity…
Graph showing the number of severe and non-severe tropical cyclones from 1970-2017 which have occurred in the Australian region. Severe tropical cyclones are shown here as those with a minimum central pressure less than 970 hPa.
http://www.bom.gov.au/cyclone/images/tc-graph-1969-2012.png
The Cardinal Point?
The “good man” doth protest too much..
The Cult of Calamitous Climate has all the bells and whistles..
“Doom,Doom”.bang the drums of apocalypse..sing the dirges for mankind…
Well anything for a buck and a little more power over the gullible..
Yes indeed “We own the “science””.
These apocalypse clergy need to decide which church they serve,for a foot in each camp may cause them to be on slippery ground..
Although the scam is as old as language…
“The Gods are angry,pay me and I will divert their attention from you”…
For a suitable fee..