Eating less Meat won’t save the Planet. Here’s Why

What I’ve Learned
1.83M subscribers

Big thanks to Dr. Frank Mitloehner for chatting with me. You can find him on twitter under @GHGGuru

Navigation:

00:00 – Why are people saying Cows are bad for the planet?

1:14 – How much would Americans going plant based actually reduce GHG emissions?

2:56 – Do cows really take all the water?

4:53 – The real problem with water

7:01 – Do Cows really take all our Food?

7:53 – Livestock make the whole food system more efficient.

10:17 – Do Cows really take all our Land?

12:30 – You can’t just grow whatever wherever.

13:54 – Why Global numbers are Misleading

15:45 – United States cattle are super efficient

16:48 – What about methane?

20:52 – Something more worth talking about than meat

✍️ “DEBUNK” RESPONSE 🥩 https://www.patreon.com/posts/51285771 📑 (PDF) – Here is my reply to a popular plant-based youtuber’s attempt at “debunking” this video.

✍️Actually, there’s been a lot of youtubers attempting to “debunk” this video. Here is my reply to another one: https://www.patreon.com/posts/50919460  I’ll get to the others as I have time.

🌎The discussion with Dr. Mitloehner was immensely helpful but for those of you worried that I’m relying on one source: plenty of research was done before and after our conversation. I double checked all of his points and they are all backed up by research that is not his own. (All sources are in the below link.)

🐄This video is talking about conventional beef, not grass fed beef.

🥩There’s actually still a ton more to talk about that  couldn’t fit in this video, how many of you guys would like to see another video expanding on this topic?

LINK TO A PDF WITH SOURCES: https://www.patreon.com/posts/50493370

Also, check out the documentary “Sacred Cow” by Diana Rogers, narrated by Nick Offerman – well made, informative and engaging. The graphic design for the animation at 17:26 was based on an infographic from the Sacred Cow website – https://www.sacredcow.info/helpful-resources

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HT/Paul Homewood

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Rod Evans
July 17, 2021 2:08 am

For those of us who love milk, cheese, steak, and leather goods particularly shoes, we find the woke attitude to beef, typical of their lack of scientific understanding, coupled with their desire to destroy all that is good in life.

Editor
Reply to  Rod Evans
July 17, 2021 3:25 am

Moo!

Regards,
Bob

Greg
Reply to  Rod Evans
July 17, 2021 1:05 pm

I always knew these claims of vast resources used by beef husbandry were ludicrous but I’d never spent the time to dig into how they were calculated and where the lie was.

This is an excellent and informative video … spoilt by the end when he goes into how terrible fossil fuels are.

Fossil fuels are increasing the very grass which cows are eating. CO2 is the base of all life on Earth !!

Last edited 1 month ago by Greg
Richard M
Reply to  Greg
July 17, 2021 8:24 pm

Just as CO2 and H2O are key elements of life, they are also key elements of the climate. More of them would Edenize the climate. Burning more fossil fuels is the path.

Jay Willis
Reply to  Rod Evans
July 17, 2021 1:19 pm

I am amazed at the response to this subject on WUWT – I expect to see clear eyed scientific responses to climate change. However, your comment, and many that follow are knee jerk responses to any discussion about vegetarianism, vegans, or reduction of meat in our diet. No! No! No! never, I LOVE cheese!. What all cheese? Are you sure? You don’t even want to consider the possible benefits of a plant based diet? Whatever scientific debates have been had, whatever the evidence? You just know, instinctively. No never, no no no! Your view and many others which follow are looking more and more like a climate alarmists view on climate – they just FEEL it’s right.

Milk, cheese, Steak – these are not all the same. Like Vaccines are not all the same! Surely it is possible to hold the concept in your head that all things which are called vaccines are not good, and similarly all steak, or all milk is not necessarily good, or produced in a way that is respectful to the animals, or healthy to you.

Then we have masses of unsubstantiated bollox about stomach acid and our physiology and outright statements about “vegetarianism is not healthy”. Tell that to Mike Tyson! That’s Mike Tyson the vegan. Or Scott Jurek – the vegan. If you have never heard of Scott Jurek – look him up! Do your research – like you are so often, and rightly, telling climate alarmists – do your own research! You’ll be a lot less likely to spout utter claptrap like suggesting that we are not evolutionaryily predisposed to plant based diets. Consider gorillas for a moment. By the way they do eat meat every now and again – and if they fancy doing that, would you try to stop them?

For my part, I have been plant based for about 2 years, and it has been brilliant for my health – I’m not religious about it – I care about animal welfare – but not enough to give up meat – I eat a little Wild Alaskan Salmon, as I have been a fisheries scientist and this is the best managed fishery in the World. I eat a little organic beef – maybe once every few months. But I don’t eat any dairy – the scientific data here is unequivocal – there is a substantially increased risk of certain cancers from dairy. My reference for this is The China Study, and if you haven’t read that – you should.

So come on folks – take a good long look at yourselves. The western diet contains way too much meat, and we’d all be better off with clear, sound advice from organisations and people with no corporate influences. If we all ate about 1/10 of what meat we eat, we’d all be able to eat much better quality meat, with good animal welfare standards, and be much more healthy.

Philo
Reply to  Jay Willis
July 17, 2021 1:57 pm

https://sciencebasedmedicine.org/the-china-study-revisited/

The China Study has been found by at least one qualified scientist to be less definitive than you seem to think.

Dave Fair
Reply to  Jay Willis
July 17, 2021 2:46 pm

And what governmental department will write and enforce the healthy lifestyle rules? You are free to express your opinion, but so am I (at least under current rules).

Van Doren
Reply to  Dave Fair
July 17, 2021 11:43 pm

I agree completely with video, and I think that animal product consumption is responsible for most of the civilizational diseases, but any government should not be in the business of mandating us what to eat. At all.

Rod Evans
Reply to  Jay Willis
July 17, 2021 3:38 pm

Jay, you have clearly got a bit of a problem with your sense of proportion. Please read my comment, and do not simply lay at my door comments from everyone else.
The number of straw men you have created in your response is ridiculous. Even suggesting I won’t eat vegetables?
I love vegetables, I recommend everyone should eat vegetables, it is good for the balanced needs of our metabolism and our general wellbeing.
This may come as a surprise to you, but it is possible to like vegetables, fruits and meats along with dairy products and nuts.
My comment points out the insane uneducated views held by vegans. Unlike vegans, I am perfectly happy that some people prefer to live on whatever diet they like.
My only request, is they stop telling other people, many of whom are wiser and better educated than they are, to start eating as they do.
Enjoy your veg and allow others to enjoy a balanced diet that includes meat. That is all we are collectively saying here. (Not including you obviously)

John in Oz
Reply to  Jay Willis
July 17, 2021 4:52 pm

A minimal amount of searching found https://manofmany.com/lifestyle/fitness/mike-tysons-workout-diet-plan (dated 28 March 2021)

The ‘vegan’ Mike includes chicken, steak, ice cream and milk (for his Cap’n Crunch).

Looks like I must also be a vegan (other than the Cap’n Crunch)

Rod Evans
Reply to  John in Oz
July 18, 2021 12:49 am

LoL!
Thanks John, maybe the answer to all this is for everyone to self identify as a vegan, as per Mike Tyson’s example. 🙂

TonyG
Reply to  John in Oz
July 18, 2021 9:33 am

Since Jay seems to have problems with definitions I looked it up, just for clarity:

vegan: a strict vegetarian who consumes no food (such as meat, eggs, or dairy products) that comes from animals

https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/vegan

Tyson gave up veganism last year after trying it for four years.

michel
Reply to  Jay Willis
July 17, 2021 7:19 pm

Eating less meat will, like most or all of the things the green lobby advocates, have no effect on the climate. But this is just an excuse. Climate is a currently fashionable cause, so its used as a justification to advocate for lots of things people want to do anyway, for other or no reasons.

Veganism is a religion in search of arguments and reasons, and the latest reason to be grasped at is climate.

That said, there is nothing wrong with lowering one’s animal food intake and increasing the plant intake. In fact, its documented that the 7th Day Adventists are very healthy, and have a mainly though not exclusively plant diet. We probably should eat more plant based foods that Americans do, and we should certainly eat less factory foods.

Why do I say that veganism is a religion in search of justification?

Because until about 1920 there was no way to survive on a vegan diet. If you try, without B12 supplements, you will get very ill, and if you try to feed it to children they will get even more ill. There have only been B12 supplements for 100 years, probably only readily available as supplements for about 50.

We, like other animals, make B12 in our digestive system. Unfortunately we make it too late in the process for us to be able to absorb and use it. Unlike cows, for instance. Vegan fanatics often deny this, but its just a fact.

There are apparent vegans in India and other places. However much of their food storage is in conditions allowing insect infestation. Without the accidental consumption in this way of animal produce, they wouldn’t be able to do it.

The significance of this is to do with how we should think about diet. The rational way to eat is to follow the diets of healthy groups who we have a record of. They should have a healthy history extending over several generations. This is impossible to get for vegans, because veganism in pure modern form has only been possible for less than a century, and widely followed in the West for far less than that.

Don’t try to be vegan. Avoid factory made foods. Avoid anything labelled low fat, fat reduced etc. Avoid corn oil, sunflower oil or any oil high in unsaturates. Avoid vegetable suet. Olive oil in moderation, peanut oil for frying, very sparingly. Just prepare from scratch using raw ingredients, plenty of grains and vegetables. And include full fat dairy, eggs, meat, fish. In moderation.

“Eat food. Not too much of it. Mainly plants” Michael Pollan

By ‘food’ he meant things your grandmother would recognize as food.

Al Kour
Reply to  michel
July 18, 2021 5:38 am

I use only sunflower oil (and sometimes lard) for cooking and salads for 60+ years already.
Poor me! According to your sciense I should be dead long ago.

Jake J
Reply to  michel
July 18, 2021 7:50 pm

You know NOTHING about even the recent history of food. But what else to expect from a “progressive” who specializes in ignorance and righteous lectures based on superstition?

Gary Pearse
Reply to  Jay Willis
July 17, 2021 9:04 pm

Jay: there are people who are allergic to dairy, and rare cases of people allergic to beef and other meats. People bitten by the lone star tick are prone to beef and other meat allergies. There are many people allergic to shrimp and shellfish, nuts, peanut butter, etc.

Our ancestors’ main game staple for much of the last 300,000yrs was the aurok, giant wild cattle and a smaller subspecies ‘Bos’ close relatives of modern cattle. Meat was the mainstay, but when hunting was poor, they ate a variety of edible vegetable matter. Pre agriculture, this meant gathering, not a quick way to feed one what energy was needed for the natural lifestyle of hunters.

An adequately nutritious vegetarian diet is to a significant extent dependent on several artificial supplements otherwise found only in fish, meat, dairy, and eggs. About a dozen nutrients critical to good brain, heart, muscle function, and red cell production are unavailable in a natural vegetarian diet.

A common central ingredient in V diets is tofu. Two ingredients in it mimic estrogen according to a large number of studies which report incidences of gynecomastia (man boobs) who consumed larger amounts of tofu More recent studies argue earlier against such findings. In this post normal time, politically motivated over-writing has become commonplace in agendized science (consensus climate science the prime example) muddying the waters. Consider that today the anti-meat movement and the multibillion dollar vegetarian and supplements industries are not an independent r source of info on this.

Early studies found vegetarians lived shorter lives. This may be because of a lack of info on nutrition and the limited availability of artificial supplements. Modern studies found that the reverse was true but noted that those switching to V for health reasons also tended to switch to healthier lifestyles, exercising, diligently ensuring a healthy diet, less alcohol, no tobacco, etc.

Sorry, I didn’t post the many links, but the subject is easy to search to get an overall picture of what’s out there. Most quote the Adventist studies because they don’t use alcohol or tobacco and tend to live healthy lifestyles

https://adventisthealthstudy.org/studies

Jake J
Reply to  Gary Pearse
July 18, 2021 7:52 pm

Hitler was a vegetarian, and died young. LOL

ozspeaksup
Reply to  Jay Willis
July 18, 2021 2:57 am

if we all(majority of 1st world anyway) ate half of what we eat of ANY food we wouldnt have the diabetes and obesity issue

TomR
Reply to  Jay Willis
July 18, 2021 3:11 am

Have you seen the Vegan Deterioration video channel to see how “vegan health looks?

https://www.youtube.com/user/cdm0014

Trying to Play Nice
Reply to  Jay Willis
July 18, 2021 6:26 am

You want scientific responses yet your only science is a study that does not say what you think it says. Why do you think the results of the China Study that you know about are in a book and not a peer reviewed scientific paper? It’s because the BS you know about has no scientific basis. I am not a food scientist but my daughter is a physician with a graduate degree in human nutrition. She laughs at the China Study and promotes meat protein as the way to go. By the way, Campbell neglected to point out the cancers that he encountered in China, only the ones he didn’t.

rah
Reply to  Jay Willis
July 18, 2021 9:32 am

It should be noted that they had to chance the medical definition of what a “vaccine” is to include the mRNA altering versions to be included in the definition.

Paul S.
Reply to  Jay Willis
July 18, 2021 12:53 pm

You are quite welcome to eat what you want. But don’t tell me what I should eat

John Dilks
Reply to  Jay Willis
July 18, 2021 1:26 pm

Actually, the Western diet contains too much sugar.

Jake J
Reply to  Jay Willis
July 18, 2021 7:45 pm

Look, if you want to be a vegan, then be one. But stop ordering us around, eco-fascist.

markx
Reply to  Jay Willis
July 19, 2021 5:18 pm

Mike Tyson ditches vegan diet stating ‘vegetables and blueberries are really poisonous for him’
https://www.totallyveganbuzz.com/news/mike-tyson-ditches-veganism/

July 17, 2021 2:20 am

Vegans are about as ignorant of agriculture as they are evangelical scolds.

Rod Evans
Reply to  Tom Halla
July 17, 2021 3:47 am

If I was a vegan, I would want to keep very quiet about it. I would not wish to broadcast how gullible I was.

Chaswarnertoo
Reply to  Rod Evans
July 17, 2021 4:42 am

Or how undernourished and retarded.

Kenan Meyer
Reply to  Chaswarnertoo
July 17, 2021 9:25 am

one could easily replace a standard IQ-Test with just measuring how fervently someone is defending veganism…

Greg
Reply to  Chaswarnertoo
July 17, 2021 1:01 pm

Except that if he was vegan he would not realise how undernourished and retarted he was and the main objective would be to morally lecture everybody else in the room.

Vegans are zealots, of course they want to broadcast. It’s their raison d’etre.

Peter Fraser
Reply to  Chaswarnertoo
July 17, 2021 3:46 pm

Vegan woman need B vitamin supplements to prevent miscarriage

Gerry, England
Reply to  Rod Evans
July 17, 2021 7:19 am

You have to handle vegans carefully – no not because they are wokelings but because they will have fragile bones from lack of calcium.

Jake J
Reply to  Gerry, England
July 18, 2021 7:54 pm

So they are a variety of soft-shelled crab, cooked in butter?

Frank from NoVA
Reply to  Tom Halla
July 17, 2021 5:20 am

Time for Rip and the rest of the hands from the Dutton Ranch to have a word with these idiots…

David Kamakaris
Reply to  Frank from NoVA
July 17, 2021 8:24 am

Right on! Like when Rip and Kacee turned a bull loose in that bar!

Jay Willis
Reply to  Frank from NoVA
July 17, 2021 1:24 pm

Hi Frank, why don’t you offer to take on Mike Tyson – the vegan – in a face to face discussion about how idiotic veganism is for your health.

TonyG
Reply to  Jay Willis
July 17, 2021 1:52 pm

Jay, is it possible to be 100% vegan without supplements and be healthy? If so please elucidate on how, because that’s not something I’ve seen.

Jay Willis
Reply to  TonyG
July 17, 2021 2:22 pm

Who said 100% vegan? It’s up to you. That’s like an extreme. It is possible in fact, but people usually take additional b12 in the form of a yeast flake stuff, call it a supplement if you like, but I like marmite, or those flakes anyhow.

But yes it is perfectly possible, if you want to go to extremes. But I thought the whole point of the original ‘straw man’ above was to look at just one day! Meat free Monday.

TonyG
Reply to  Jay Willis
July 17, 2021 2:29 pm

So “vegan” isn’t “100% vegan”? So 99% vegan is ok, you can have meat 3x every year?

Those are damn fast moving goalposts you have there.

Plus I notice that you didn’t answer my question.

Jay Willis
Reply to  TonyG
July 17, 2021 2:36 pm

Yes I did. It is perfectly possible. As I say. And yes, why not have less meat in your diet? It’s not moving goalposts, I’m not trying to win any points here. Well perhaps a point for rational scientific enquiry. How much meat is optimal? That’s the question that we should look at.

TonyG
Reply to  Jay Willis
July 17, 2021 3:25 pm

You did not answer my question, nor did you answer my followup.

In your response you took exception to “100% vegan”, but if vegan doesn’t mean ALL vegan, no meat, fish, or dairy, then what exactly does it mean? By changing “vegan” to mean something other than “absolutely no meat, fish, or dairy” you’re moving goalposts, whether intentionally or not. So let’s define our terms and stick with those meanings.

And “please elucidate” is a request for more information about HOW to do it, which you did not provide. That was the second part of my first question.

Reply to  Jay Willis
July 17, 2021 4:09 pm

Possible, yes – in the First World economies. Just barely.

MarkH
Reply to  Jay Willis
July 18, 2021 3:24 am

You are free to have less meat in your diet if you want. You are NOT free to demand that others have less meat in their diet.

Trying to force people to do what you want is authoritarian.

Dave Fair
Reply to  Jay Willis
July 17, 2021 2:47 pm

No problem; I have firearms.

StevenF
Reply to  Tom Halla
July 17, 2021 8:29 pm

I probably shouldn’t jump in here but what the heck. I eat whole food plant based (WFPB). I don’t eat meat or dairy or anything animal based. I am not a vegan, that seems to be a religion and not terribly healthy. But a vegan diet and what I eat tend to overlap a lot. But not completely.

I switched to plant based 10 years ago. The research on the value of eating a WFPB diet is pretty conclusive. Not perfect though. It never will be because we can’t do real double blind cross over studies on diet. So all the studies are epidemiological and suffer from that limitation. But the data is consistent. The greatest benefit of a WFPB diet seems to be the effect on your biome.

It was hard to give up a few things. Good cheese, sausage, smoked salmon, milk chocolate, and filet. But I feel a whole lot better than I did when I started. I personally don’t care if someone else eats meat. To each your own. I actually have no real interest in converting anyone to my lifestyle. But still it reasonable to set some of the record straight.

Someone described vegans as undernourshed and retarded. Some are. Some are fat. There is unhealthy vegan food. But I am in pretty good shape on this diet. I turn 67 in four months. I cycle. I weigh 148lbs and my threshold aerobic power is 173 watts. Which means that on a bike I can hold 173 watts for an hour. Over 2.5 watts/Kg. Not bad for a thin 66 year old. What I do well is climb because of my weight. So I don’t think I can be considered undernourshed. Not sure how to comment on the retarded part.

The bottom line is that it isn’t easy to go WFPB. It is hard to give up certain kinds of food. Not everybody is willing to make that sacrifice. Do what’s right for you and don’t worry about it. But a WFPB diet is a healthier way to live. Though for many people it isn’t a happier way to live, and I get that.

Take care

Waza
July 17, 2021 2:34 am

India has the most cattle and their vegetarians.
The average herd size is about 2 or 3 likely being super inefficient.
But India has millions of cattle that just wander around doing nothing.
Being anti cow is just something only a juvenile westerner believes in.
“Oh eating meat is bad”
“Oh climate change is bad”
“Oh cows cause climate change ohhhh”

To me they are a pack of whingers who need to be ignored.

Steve Case
Reply to  Waza
July 17, 2021 2:39 am

“… they are a pack of whingers who need to be ignored.

They are running the show, so ignoring them isn’t an option.

Oldseadog
July 17, 2021 2:39 am

I am surprised to see that the video refers to “conventional beef” not “grass fed beef”. Here in Scotland nearly all beef is grass fed, certainly during the summer. The beasts may get supplements but they are usually outside in fields.
I assume “conventional” refers to there enormous feed lot things.

Oldseadog
Reply to  Oldseadog
July 17, 2021 2:41 am

these not there.

Pamela Matlack-Klein
Reply to  Oldseadog
July 17, 2021 4:00 am

This is only my take on the meaning of “conventional beef” based on all the tripe I see about how evil feed lots are. I suspect that they are trying to show that, while letting cows eat grass and take their time getting ready for market, the fast track method used in feed lots is not terrible for the planet. And it does produce significant amounts of quality beef. Personally I prefer the flavor of grass-raised beef and when I raised Wagyus in Virginia all they got was pasture and quality hay. Meat opponents have always singled out feed lots as the most egregious form of cattle finishing, responsible for a myriad of crimes to Earth and the climate. It’s good to see someone standing up for the industry instead of trying to tear it down and banish delicious beef from our diets.

Kazinski
Reply to  Oldseadog
July 17, 2021 4:46 am

Most beef here is grass fed to, up until the final few months at the feed lot. “Conventional” Beef cattle spend the first 18 months to 2 years eating grass on the range, then the final 3-10 months at the feed lot fattening up. So at least 2/3 of their lives they are being “grass fed”.

mikebartnz
Reply to  Kazinski
July 17, 2021 11:42 pm

It takes about eleven weeks when changing from one type of feed to another for the previous one to fully exit the body.
Years ago we were given a lamb that had been fattened on Lucerne and it was revolting compared to grass fed. Once years ago we got two hoggets that had been living in the foothills and must have been living on a lot of fern and bracken of which we had one feed and the dogs had the rest. They didn’t complain. :))

DMacKenzie
Reply to  Oldseadog
July 17, 2021 6:53 am

Where beef is “grass fed” it’s because that is the cheapest way to do it in those local circumstances, and where it is “feedlot beef” it is because that is the cheapest way to do it in somewhat different local circumstances. And when good tasting beef-like protein can be made artificially in giant vats, we will also eat THAT, again because it is the cheapest way.

Mike Sexton
Reply to  DMacKenzie
July 17, 2021 1:14 pm

No I won’t

Dave Fair
Reply to  DMacKenzie
July 17, 2021 2:51 pm

As long as it tastes the same and provides the same benefits, why not? The dog barks, but the caravan moves on.

Drake
Reply to  DMacKenzie
July 17, 2021 3:15 pm

Soylent Green??

Van Doren
Reply to  DMacKenzie
July 17, 2021 11:59 pm

Animal biochemistry is too complex, I do not believe that we will be able to reproduce nutritionally comparable product anytime soon.

V. Dominique
Reply to  Oldseadog
July 17, 2021 8:31 pm

As a rule, beef cattle spend their first six months grazing next to their dams. At the age of six months, they are weaned and sold to stockers, who put them back on pasture for another six to eight months. They aren’t sent to a feed lot until they are twelve to fourteen months of age, where they will remain until they reach butchering weight (usually somewhere between thirty and ninety days.)

Jake J
Reply to  V. Dominique
July 18, 2021 8:16 pm

Thanks for this. I live in ranch country, and you saved me from having to educate these pathetic city slickers. LOL

July 17, 2021 2:42 am

Cows eat grass.
I can’t eat grass.
I can eat cows.
There is no other way for me to eat grass.

Rich Davis
Reply to  Leo Smith
July 17, 2021 4:05 am

They want to protect the grass from your predation, Leo.

Richard (the cynical one)
Reply to  Leo Smith
July 17, 2021 5:41 am

Every cow I have ever eaten was a vegan. So I am a second hand vegan, getting the best of both worlds.

James Donald Bailey
Reply to  Leo Smith
July 17, 2021 7:13 am

Sheep and goats are another good way for us to eat grass.

Dave Fair
Reply to  James Donald Bailey
July 17, 2021 2:53 pm

Pigs eat anything and everything. Near me, a hog operation uses surplus Las Vegas hotel scraps.

bill Johnston
Reply to  Dave Fair
July 17, 2021 3:31 pm

And if that was in North LV, I believe that has closed down.

Dave Fair
Reply to  bill Johnston
July 17, 2021 6:18 pm

Moved to Apex by the original old guy’s kids, just a few miles NE. Still using Las Vegas slops.

gringojay
Reply to  Leo Smith
July 17, 2021 8:27 am

The way I eat barley grass is to initially soak the seed then germinate it and let it grow for several days. When it is about 8 inches tall, cut the green sheaf ff at it’s base and then pass the leaves through a manual screw drive expeller press.

The fresh grass juice extracted is then drunk fresh. More people in the USA who drink grass juice are using soft wheat seed than barley seed. Most just grow their grass for juice on soil flats, but I have rigged an ersatz air-o-ponic system.

[Although I do not chew and then swallow the grass juice pulp I knew a person of color acquaintance in the early 1970s who did. His resilience to weather and physical aspect was robust despite not being that young; yet ate only uncooked grains as grass &/or whole seeds + drank mineral water.]

Currently I drink about an ounce of fresh barley grass juice 1st thing in the morning and empirically think it has controlled arthritic symptoms in my thumb. That amount of barley grass juice is obtained from 15 grams of barley seed; the seed stock from the supplier I now have is relatively better at producing shoots than some seed stock which produces relatively more roots.

gringojay
Reply to  gringojay
July 17, 2021 8:37 am

If intrigued see (2018) free full text available on-line: “Preventative and therapeutic role of functional ingredients of barley grass for chronic diseases in human beings”.

I started growing wheat grass when lived in the USA about 50 years ago and now like the taste of barley grass better.

image.jpg
John Tillman
Reply to  gringojay
July 17, 2021 9:40 am

The highest and best way use for barley is beer and scotch. For rye, bread and whiskey.

gringojay
Reply to  John Tillman
July 17, 2021 9:48 am

Either way: “John Barley Corn Must Die!”

gringojay
Reply to  gringojay
July 17, 2021 11:52 am

My sequential daily barley grass indoor crop; when winter a simple long fluorescent grow light suspended above greens them up. Buckets partially filled with water each have a sprayer (patented “deweymister” ) that are driven by air pumps (on a timer) and that (air-o-ponic like) forces water spray up toward seeds/roots. (This does not utilize water pumps, so does not require any flood & drain reservoir. The only reason mine is on a platform is for my convenience of less bending down involved – buckets could be employed directly on the floor or ground.)

[To hold the grass seed a rigid molded open weave plastic support (garden store planter under spacer) sits on the bucket rim & I cut out it’s central portion. Atop this lays a cut to matching hobby store foam piece with corresponding central portion cut out; this blocks any spray pattern from escaping bucket onto floor. Then to place the pre-soaked (~ 6 hours) grass seeds over the bucket spray without those seeds falling into the water I place a small disposable piece of plastic mesh & sow the seeds atop that mesh. Harvest is tidy, clean up post harvest minimal and cut greens refrigerated in closed plastic keeps several days if I don’t juice it right away.]

To correct an earlier point: I juice using an electric powered screw driven expeller press & not a manual extractor.

image.jpg
Gary Pearse
Reply to  gringojay
July 17, 2021 1:04 pm

I raised my 6 kids on a 40acre mixed farm in Ontario. I grew winter grain sprouts on a stack of screen shelves watered from the top. In a week, you could lift out in one piece a luxuriant ‘rug’ of sprouts that I fed to the chickens, ducks and geese as a tonic to get safely over the February barrier which, in these parts, is when most deaths of fowl and other animals occurs because of long winter stress. I believe I beat the odds substantially

Also, in summer, I let my birds and pigs out in the pasture along with sheep and a dairy cow with calf to eat insects, roots, weed seeds mice, grass and alfalfa. The pigs found ready treats in warm fresh cow pies as well (another valuable product from cows – officially known as ‘companion feeding’).

Jay Willis
Reply to  gringojay
July 17, 2021 1:55 pm

gringojay, thanks for your interesting and illuminating comments, I will look into the production of grass like this – it looks great.

TonyG
Reply to  gringojay
July 17, 2021 1:55 pm

I prefer to let my barley juice sit for a few weeks before drinking 🙂

Zig Zag Wanderer
Reply to  gringojay
July 17, 2021 2:26 pm

The way I eat barley grass is to initially soak the seed then germinate it and let it grow for several days. When it is about 8 inches tall, cut the green sheaf ff at it’s base and then pass the leaves through a manual screw drive expeller press.

My preference is I partially germinate the barley seeds. Then bake them. Then cook them at particular temperatures and drain off the liquid.

After this, boil them with hops, ferment for a week or so, and bottle. Drink after a few weeks more.

Alternatively, leave out the hops, distil the result, and store in barrels for several years. Serve as a cold soup with frozen water croutons.

Last edited 1 month ago by Zig Zag Wanderer
Dave Fair
Reply to  gringojay
July 17, 2021 2:58 pm

I get all my supplements and vitamins and minerals the way God intended: In a pill. As an aside, I don’t know how old guys survived before Tamsulosin.

Paul
Reply to  Dave Fair
July 18, 2021 4:47 am

It was hard….er..tough.

John Tillman
Reply to  Leo Smith
July 17, 2021 9:44 am

Bread, noodles and boiled rice are made from grass seeds.

Humans rely on seeds like eight billion canaries.

But grass leaves and stems do need processed by livestock.

TonyG
Reply to  Leo Smith
July 17, 2021 1:54 pm

My favorite food is pre-processed vegetables, and cows are really good vegetable preprocessors.

The Emperor’s New Mask
July 17, 2021 2:53 am

I am less concerned about saving the planet, and more concerned about optimizing my health. Humans aren’t vegetarian, and vegetarianism isn’t healthy.

From the pH of our stomachs to sizes of our intestines it is clear that humans are carnivore specialized omnivores. While one can subsist on vegetarian food, it will generally be far less healthy than a diet based in animal products.

Modern “nutrition science” is one of the few pseudosciences that rivals “climate science” for its ideological inflicted harm.

Rich Davis
Reply to  The Emperor’s New Mask
July 17, 2021 4:26 am

That is exactly right.

The evangelists of veganism promote bogus concerns about methane emissions as a response to this kind of irrefutable argument. Yeah, meat might be an easier way to get the nutrients we need, but we have to stop because it’s unethical. Oh, you don’t buy that? Umm, climate change! Essentially a non sequitur.

Much as the evangelists of climate change/global warming (and before that global cooling) have been saying for generations that we need to stop burning fossil fuels. For them the goal is to destroy capitalism, but the bogus excuse is the same—we’re changing the weather.

I love your screen name btw.

Van Doren
Reply to  Rich Davis
July 18, 2021 12:07 am

I think CO2 emissions are beneficial, and I think animal products are not healthy. May be excluding fish.

Last edited 1 month ago by Van Doren
Rich Davis
Reply to  Van Doren
July 18, 2021 5:15 pm

Ok, Van Doren, you’re welcome to your opinion. Nobody is trying to force you to eat meat, nor block you from expressing your opinions or the reasons and evidence you may want to present about it.

Speaking for myself only, the point where offense is taken is when others presume to decide for me whether I will eat animal products or when policies are pursued to distort markets so that animal products are in short supply or increased in cost due to taxes.

I would hope and presume that you do not advocate any such thing and so I have no quarrel with you even if I disagree with your point of view. All things in moderation.

Kazinski
Reply to  The Emperor’s New Mask
July 17, 2021 4:51 am

But your assuming technology stays the same, I’m sure they are working on a 4 stomach Crisper modification to inject in the womb to allow us to directly eat grass.

Scissor
Reply to  Kazinski
July 17, 2021 5:17 am

Another “tech solution,” which is also a favorite of Bill Gates, is artificial and lab grown meat. Welcome to the Brave New World. Would you like fries with that?

Abolition Man
Reply to  Kazinski
July 17, 2021 7:49 am

Kaz, sir!
They are already working on breeding grass fed humans in North Korea! Maybe Cuba and Venezuela are working on similar programs!
I know a Russian attempt failed in the Ukraine as well, but if the communists keep disassembling humans and putting them back together willy nilly; maybe they will eventually hit on a design where their system actually works!

Scissor
Reply to  The Emperor’s New Mask
July 17, 2021 5:21 am

Good comment. Your moniker captures the essence of contemporary skepticism perfectly.

gringojay
Reply to  The Emperor’s New Mask
July 17, 2021 10:38 am

Just as a point of reference: our human stomach pH uniquely helped the stomach destroy pathogens that our ancestral genus Homo ingested. In our stomach the pH naturally will be about 1.5pH. This stomach pH is not simply indicating we are carnivores, since the carnivore cat stomach pH is comparatively only 3.6 pH.

That said, I do concur that humans developed as omnivores – so my comment above is not meant to be argumentative. And, a further observation is that the omnivore domesticated pig has a stomach pH of 2.6pH which places our human 1.5 stomach pH in it’s own evolutionary capability.

The length (“sizes”) of our intestines is reputedly related to how our genus Homo’s intestinal length began to decrease compared to their evolutionary ancestors about 2.5 million years ago. It was about 6 (to 8?) million years ago that humans had a last common ancestor with relatively longer intestine length chimpanzees; so that leaves around 3.5 (to 5.5?) million years of our ancestral intestine proportional length being unknown.

Curiously, the proportionate length of our intestinal tract in greater in the young and this usually changes. [Adult men also usually have relatively greater length of intestines than women. But, that now must be challenged since nobody has surveyed how intestines themselves identify given their lived experience.]

Last edited 1 month ago by gringojay
Rich Davis
Reply to  gringojay
July 17, 2021 1:08 pm

Ah yes, gringojay, it takes real guts to have a lived experience as an intestine. Likely the adversity leads some to identify as a bladder or even as an ovary. I wanted you to know that someone picked up on your gem of wisdom. 😉

Gary Pearse
Reply to  The Emperor’s New Mask
July 17, 2021 1:23 pm

The ignorance and apriori linear reasoning (as used by life-inexperienced teenagers arguing with their parents) of these civilization destroyers is amazing. Vegetarianism is a marker of know-it-all ignorance of the reality of their diet – growing inputs and agriculture in general. Its telling that a variety of Malthusian nuts spread their plagues in the wake of post normal climate science’s ascendency

Jay Willis
Reply to  Gary Pearse
July 17, 2021 1:46 pm

Gary

“Named one of the greatest runners of all time, Scott Jurek has become a living legend. He has claimed victories in nearly all of ultrarunning’s elite trail and road events including the historic 153-mile Spartathlon, the Hardrock 100, the Badwater 135-Mile Ultramarathon, and—his signature race—the Western States 100-Mile Endurance Run, which he won a record seven straight times. Scott has also taken the running world by storm with his 2015 Appalachian Trail speed record, averaging nearly 50 miles a day over 46 days—and the United States all-surface record in the 24-Hour Run with 165.7 miles: 6.5 marathons in one day. ”

His diet is totally plant based. I’m afraid the ignorance is all yours.

TonyG
Reply to  Jay Willis
July 17, 2021 2:25 pm

“His diet is totally plant based.”

No supplements?

Jay Willis
Reply to  TonyG
July 17, 2021 2:40 pm

Not ones made of meat! No.

Jay Willis
Reply to  TonyG
July 17, 2021 2:46 pm

Honestly Tony, I’ve got to wonder who’s been keeping you in the dark all these years. Yes you can live on only plants! Yes you really can. Who knew? Maybe there is a large industrial corporate interest in making you think you need meat, not only every day, but every meal. Who knows? Whereas on the other side of the corporate arm wrestle we have “big beatroot” twisting the science and lobbying the government in favour of veg.

Pat from kerbob
Reply to  Jay Willis
July 18, 2021 7:32 am

There are always exceptions that prove the rule, there are people who can eat thousands of calories a day and not gain weight snd there are people very over weight but never the less are healthy

lee riffee
Reply to  Jay Willis
July 17, 2021 8:53 pm

This is a testament to the fact that homo sapiens can survive on a very poor diet indeed…we did not get to be the dominant species on this planet by being extreme dietary specialists. Evolution shows over and over again that creatures with highly specialized diets are the first to go when the going gets tough. Our species can basically survive on garbage and dietary dregs, at least long enough to reproduce…kind of like an engine that can run on just about any fuel. Doesn’t matter if it shortens the life of the engine, but hey, the engine will continue to run in spite of crappy fuel.
However, if there is a choice not to do that, probably most people would not opt for such a meager and spartan survival diet. Or shorten the life of an engine by using substandard fuel….

Van Doren
Reply to  The Emperor’s New Mask
July 18, 2021 12:05 am

Yep, vegetarianism isn’t healthy, low-fat whole-food pesco-veganism is. In fact, butter is probably one of the worst foods out there.

spangled drongo
July 17, 2021 3:10 am

Having controlled herds of livestock consuming rapidly growing grass not only controls the danger of excess wildfire fuel but keeps it sweet, short and green instead of long, dry and flammable as well as removing the extra fuel of woody weeds.

Even if you never ate the livestock the net result is a benefit. But when by selling them they provide you with a decent living as well, this tried and tested system is a win/win.

Kazinski
Reply to  spangled drongo
July 17, 2021 5:01 am

It should be pointed out also that cattle have just replaced the natural bison herds that roamed north America in tens of millions. And cattle and bison are in the same family, and are so genetically similar that they can create fertile hybrids, which indicates a very close genetic similarity.

Getting rid of cattle without fully replacing them with buffalo could cause an enormous ecological upheaval in an environment that has always had large herds of grass eating herbivores. Who knows what havoc that could create?

meab
Reply to  Kazinski
July 17, 2021 12:51 pm

The desertification of large tracts of grassland in the US Southwest is tied to the disappearance of bison.

TonyG
Reply to  Kazinski
July 17, 2021 1:58 pm

Since when have the activist crowd ever cared about the ecological impacts of their policies?

dodgy geezer
July 17, 2021 3:11 am

There is no point addressing this policy with reasoned argument. It is not based in reason, and so is invulnerable to any reasoned proof that it will not work.

Policies of this kind, involving fundamental changes to society, seem to operate in two stages. First, some activists have an idea, and an aim to change the world. I suspect that most of these attempts at self-aggrandisement die a fairly rapid death, though some persist as the cults which we hear about from time to time.

if the idea becomes successful and is taken up, and increasing number of people start to make money out of it, and base their careers on it. At this stage it is self-perpetuating, and will continue regardless of any disproof of the fundamental idea. Books are written about it, and Foundations set up to support it.

In fact, it is a huge benefit for the idea to be totally wrong, because in that case the proposed countermeasures will not work, thus ensuring continuing jobs for those who are employed to administer them. The ‘War on Drugs’ is a good example of this, and are the ‘Protection of Rare Animals’, and ‘Solution to Homeless Rough Sleepers’. All of these social initiatives must never be successfully addressed, because that would put large numbers of otherwise unemployable people out of work.

Climate Change, Environmentalism generally, Socialism/Communism, Population Control, World Government, and many other of these unworkable activist initiatives are of these types. They may start with good intentions, but can only be successful in perpetuating themselves as never-ending meal tickets so long as all the proposals for implementing them are essentially unworkable…

Pamela Matlack-Klein
July 17, 2021 4:17 am

The notion that a meatless diet is healthy, good for the planet, provides all the essential nutrients a body needs, and is actually a good thing is preposterous! The human body evolved to be able to eat almost anything and still survive, but a diet high in quality protein is preferable to one based on beans and rice. None of these militant anti-meat folks would survive for long were it not for the supplements they must take to make up for the lack of essential amino acids in their diet.

Cows and other ruminants have the correct dentition and digestive systems to eat plants and turn it into protein that humans can then eat. This is a really nice system, sun > plants > cows > people. In return for care, these animals also give us milk, cheese, leather, butter, and fertilizer for the fields where their food is grown.This has been going on for thousands of years and works great to the benefit of tasty critters and humans.

Jay Willis
Reply to  Pamela Matlack-Klein
July 17, 2021 1:54 pm

Pamela, this is so wrong, I hardly know where to start. All amino acids come from plants – none come from animals.All animals ultimately get their protein from plants. Many millions of people leve very healthily on a plant based diet. There are many World class sportsmen and women who have exclusively plant based diets. My person farourite is Scott Jurek – look him up!

Pamela Matlack-Klein
Reply to  Jay Willis
July 17, 2021 3:02 pm

Good for you, Jay. However, I do not agree that plants are a source of complete amino acids.Therefore I will continue to eat a varied diet high in protein and low in simple carbohydrates.

Giordano milton
July 17, 2021 4:42 am

Confusing format

Peta of Newark
July 17, 2021 4:58 am

“Beware of stupid people, especially when they occur in large numbers”

There-in is The Problem.
The Stupid People really do believe, via Magical Thinking, that eating plants will save them – and everybody of course.

wrong wrong wrong wrong

Eating plants (cooked starch = sugar) is what makes you stupid
It also makes you:

  • Fat and Obese
  • Diabetic
  • Guaranteed to get you Cardio Vascular Disease and or Stroke
  • The sugar and vegetable fats will give you cancer (via Free Radicals & Oxidative Stress)
  • The vegetable proteins will drive your Immune System perfectly insane, leaving you wide open to any petty poxy little bacterial or viral bug that happens along
  • Giving sugar to young girls of age 2 thro 12 will make them short, fat and thicc – physically as well as mentally but especially makes childbirth an absolute nightmare for them later
  • Chronically depressed, thus prone to Magical Thinking, Paranoia and Panic-driven policy decisions. Revist that photo and writings of Andrew Dessler – its all there.
  • Deficient in vitamins, trace elements and minerals – the manifestations of which are manifold
  • Eating plants is THE Stupid Dumb Thing that WILL be the end of us

Does anyone else see a Positive Feedback Loop in there?

The real problem is, as the plant eaters effectively assert, there is now No Way of growing sufficient ‘cow’ for all of us.
If think someone, several folks maybe even, predicted this happening

Growing plants, especially annual plants destroys the very thing they are looking to save – The Soil/Dirt.
(Cows, when left to their own devices, actually make Good Dirt)

Biq question is for The Betting Men amongst us, Which will get us first, an under-dose of dirt or an over-dose of stupidity?
Even bigger question, will anyone be around to pay you your winnings?

This thing has GOT to be stopped, somehow.

Rich Davis
Reply to  Peta of Newark
July 17, 2021 5:36 am

Peta
in medio stat virtus

You’re in the ditch on the other side of the road from where the vegans are stuck.

Retired_Engineer_Jim
Reply to  Peta of Newark
July 17, 2021 9:20 am

However, all the vegans I know (who are not proselytizing) are skinny as rails.

Frank from NoVA
July 17, 2021 5:09 am

I’d be interested in knowing how today’s herd size (dairy and beef cattle combined) compares to the number of bison that formerly grazed the same lands. I’ll bet it’s not much different. And probably a similar story in Africa.

rah
Reply to  Frank from NoVA
July 17, 2021 5:46 am

I used to make that argument and others to point out how silly they are being. I would also point out that it is believed that Hominids developed ever larger brains because of increased access to the concentrated proteins provided by meat. Then realized it doesn’t matter to these people. Now I just make fun of and ridicule them. I don’t really care anymore! They are trying to take away my steaks and replace it with some fake concoction. That is one of the great things about getting older. You care far less about what most other people think of you.

Scissor
Reply to  rah
July 17, 2021 7:14 am

I’d like to see someone pull a prank on vegetarians by getting them to sample a new meat substitute. They would be told they would be tasting a vegetarian steak.

Instead, give them some Wagyu steak.

skiman
Reply to  Scissor
July 17, 2021 8:21 am

While I share most of your views, the prank would not be wise and could result in sudden and extreme health issues for the vegan or vegatarian. Just juice from a real steak can cause issues.

Scissor
Reply to  skiman
July 17, 2021 8:41 am

No worries. We could call it Moderna meat, therefore no liability.

Pamela Matlack-Klein
Reply to  skiman
July 17, 2021 3:03 pm

Really? What issues would that be?

StevenF
Reply to  skiman
July 17, 2021 8:39 pm

I eat plant based but I don’t think that is true. Your taste buds over time change so it may not have the same flavor. At the same time, your biome (gut bacteria) changes and changing diet can have an effect on the biome but an isolated incident will likely have minimal effect.

Reply to  skiman
July 18, 2021 5:05 pm

They would be shocked consuming high nutrient food for the first time.

Reply to  Scissor
July 18, 2021 5:02 pm

What a waste of steak that would be.

badEnglish
Reply to  rah
July 17, 2021 8:43 am

Ha! I can relate, Frank from NoVA. Reminds me of a consultancy I recently learned of: https://assholeconsulting.com/

Cheers!
badEnglish

badEnglish
Reply to  badEnglish
July 17, 2021 8:44 am

Oops! Apologies, rah!

badEnglish

rah
Reply to  badEnglish
July 18, 2021 5:07 am

No apology needed.

Last night for dinner it was spaghetti and meatballs, garlic toast, and a salad. Most of the salad came from our garden (leaf lettuce, baby spinach, onions, and tomatoes) as did the basil used to help flavor the meatballs and sauce. Pretty balanced I think, lacking only the dairy component of what I was taught is a balanced diet way back in grade school.

I am nearly 66 years old, 5′ 11 1/2″ tall and weigh 194 lb. Used to be 6′ but gravity, heavy rucksacks, and hard shocks from PLFs (parachute landing falls) have taken their toll.

Reply to  rah
July 17, 2021 9:29 am

Vegans prove by behaviour that meat is an essential need for brain developement.

StephenP
Reply to  Frank from NoVA
July 17, 2021 6:06 am

There were an estimated 60 million buffalo/bison on the prairies, depending on the time of year in relation to calving, and were almost exterminated between the Civil War and 1900.
A sad tale which can be read here:
http://Www.theatlantic.com/national/archive/2016/05/the-buffalo-killers/482349/
They were large animals so the biomass was probably equivalent to modern cattle herd size.
As regards methane their diet of forage would result in very similar emissions to the present day emissions from cattle.
The subsequent ploughing up of the prairies would have resulted in the release of prodigious quantities of carbon that had built up and been sequestrated in the prairie turf over hundreds or thousands of years. This destruction of the sward eventually led the dust storms in the Dust Bowl years as there was nothing to bind the topsoil together, and the dry years of the 1930 meant that enen where crops were sown they did not provide cover for the soil from the wind.
At present India has the greatest number of cattle at over 300 million. India is where the expression Sacred Cow came from.
I would not want to be the person telling them that they had to get rid of them in order to reduce global warming.
As regards water usage by cattle: rain falls, grass grows, cattle eat grass, cattle excrete dung and urine which recycles much of the water as well as providing nutrients for further grass growth and habitat for dung flies and beetles which are also part of the ecosystem that includes birds and other beasties.
Much of the area in grassland is unsuitable for arable cropping (viz. Dust Bowls ) and provided there is proper range management will result in significant sequestration of carbon through the accumulation of dead roots etc.
Arable farming is the main culprit as regards the loss of carbon from the soil.

Jay Willis
Reply to  Frank from NoVA
July 17, 2021 1:38 pm

Frank – I did those calculations for a paper I wrote about whales – from memory, there were about 60 million tons of whales killed in the southern ocean – 2 million units at about 30 tons each, and the same for bison, about 60 million tons, which at about 1 ton each meant 60 million units. Again, from memory, I think there are 300 million cattle in the USA. Which shows the tremendous increase in productivity we have gained, especiallyu when you consider all the grain we harvest on those same lands – there the benefit of evolution right there there! ecosystem engineering. It’s a pity we f*cked up the Southern Ocean however – and continue to do so with our massive and destructive krill fishery – but well – out of sight out of mind..

rah
Reply to  Jay Willis
July 18, 2021 5:13 am

Despite our netting of Krill I saw on a National Geographic program a few weeks ago that various species of whales that rely on that food source are increasing in numbers. Hopefully we will be able to find the proper balance. There is enough for all if properly managed.

RonK
July 17, 2021 5:40 am

how may years did Catholics do meatless fridays, did that change anything

Scissor
Reply to  RonK
July 17, 2021 8:43 am

Many restaurants still have fish fry Fridays.

John Hultquist
Reply to  RonK
July 17, 2021 12:06 pm

Meatless Fridays (unless false info) were to help the folks that caught and sold fish.
I try not to engage in religious meanings.
Repeating info from a friend.

Paul
Reply to  RonK
July 18, 2021 5:07 am

On earth or in Heaven?

Redge
July 17, 2021 5:44 am

In the UK we have a quiz show called QI

I watched the other night and Stephen Fry revealed having a pet labrador from puppy to death causes the same CO2 to be emitted as not 1 but 2 Toyota Land Cruisers throughout the life of the vehicles

So Griff, Loydo, etc, do you have pets?

Time to eat your dog methinks

noaaprogrammer
Reply to  Redge
July 17, 2021 7:28 am

“How to wok your dog!”

Gary Pearse
Reply to  noaaprogrammer
July 18, 2021 10:38 am

Best laugh of the week! I’m sure I’m going to steal this!

mikebartnz
Reply to  Redge
July 18, 2021 12:15 am

I think that QI is a bit more than just a quiz show as it has great comedy as well. I have learnt and forgotten a lot watching it.
The Vatican state has the lowest age of consent at 12 and also has the highest crime rate. Probably all the pickpockets.

Redge
July 17, 2021 5:50 am

Here’s an idea:

Stop eating cows and let all of them roam free immediately!

Of course, without any natural predators in the UK, we’d soon be up to our necks in bullshit

I could argue with all the rubbish talked by the climate doomsters and the misleadia, we already are.

Don Perry
Reply to  Redge
July 17, 2021 7:24 am

“…we’d soon be up to our necks in bullshit”
We’ve been up to our necks in it for quite some time now, but it comes for two-legged critters. I may already be too late to return to sanity without a revolution.

July 17, 2021 5:59 am

Not a biologist but it seems to me that a cow is designed to take plants and turn it into high grade protein – MEAT, the food that helped the brains of humans grow large enough to advance out of the jungle. Humans need 50 to 60 grams of PROTEIN a day. Look at the intelligence level of those countries that have trouble getting 60 grams of protein a day. Look at the protein content of the vegetarian foods that have significant protein like soy, and the amount of this food to get 60 grams of protein needed to eliminate the cow.
My back of the envelope calculation shows that lots of trees are going to be cut down to plant more high protein plants. More plant products will be turned over into the soil to keep it fertile and the more tractors and harvesters will be running to process this protein so that more trucks can haul it to the factories to produce soy (or whatever) based protein food for YOU. The other problem is that the more plants YOU eat to obtain your protein, the more methane YOU produce. Worse, I have not found one of those new high protein substitute foods palatable.
Has anyone done a REAL analysis to see if there is a, REAL, actual decrease in methane? My first twenty years of life on a farm tells me plants will not provide enough protein for the world.

PS, grams of Protein per pound of beef = 120, grams of Protein per pound of Soy =15.

Last edited 1 month ago by usurbrain
aussiecol
Reply to  Rich Lentz
July 17, 2021 6:14 am

Man’s first invention was the spear.

mikebartnz
Reply to  Rich Lentz
July 18, 2021 12:23 am

Years ago in NZ there was an advert promoting beef and its protien. They had a steak on a plate and behind that was a carving dish full of spinach. When the spinach was brought level with the steak you realised just how much of it you would have to consume to get the same amount of protien. It was a clever advert using perspective dramatically.

Sorry but
Reply to  mikebartnz
July 18, 2021 5:11 am

protein

mikebartnz
Reply to  Sorry but
July 18, 2021 1:44 pm

Well spotted as it was iron

David Elstrom
July 17, 2021 6:11 am

The Climatista to “save the world” propaganda is all a tactic inside the twisted scam of Climate Change. Wether the whining is about global cooling, global warming, or climate change, the solutions are always less liberty and more elitist looting of normal people. Time for control freaks to go by whatever means necessary.

2hotel9
July 17, 2021 6:45 am

So, according to leftards animals are bad for the climate. OK, lets kill all the animals to save the climate.

July 17, 2021 6:45 am
Tom Abbott
July 17, 2021 7:01 am

Cows are carbon-dioxide neutral.

fretslider
July 17, 2021 7:15 am

How do you know if someone is a Vegan?

They tell you.

This vegetarianism lark is a[nother] triumph of ideology and belief over cold hard reality.

The last time I checked humans are definitely omnivores. And as we all know, omnivores are animals anatomically and physiologically adapted to eating both plant and animal matter. 

It’s a belief that needs Calcium supplements amongst other things

Rich Davis
Reply to  fretslider
July 17, 2021 4:25 pm

How do you know if someone is a Vegan?

They tell you.

And tell you.
And tell you.

Kevin kilty
July 17, 2021 7:26 am

I first encountered this carping over cattle and climate change in an article in Drover’s Journal in 1988. I found it to be a joke because some scientist calculated the climate effect of cattle to be 0.004C. After 33 years it is becoming an old joke. Even assuming it can be calculated at all the effect is too tiny to bother worrying about. It is what comes from people who know nothing about something, have no experience withit, and have never listened to anyone who does, believing they can plan it all to work better.

Rod Evans
Reply to  Kevin kilty
July 17, 2021 7:49 am

It is worth remembering an expert is someone who knows more and more about less and less. The ultimate achievement being, someone so expert they know everything about nothing.
For some reason, a mental image of Michel E Mann came to mind, as I typed this comment.

Dave Fair
Reply to  Rod Evans
July 17, 2021 3:15 pm

Actually, an expert is a guy 50 miles from home.

Abolition Man
July 17, 2021 7:32 am

It is truly amazing, watching and listening to the various fascistic death cults winge and moan about the horrors of meat consumption! I am immediately worried that their ignorance and stupidity may actually be the result of low amino acid levels causing dementia type symptoms, and recommend that they increase their protein intake with a nice fat steak or slab of prime rib! That was always my choice after a day of dealing with some incredibly stupid, stubborn and delicious cows and their offspring in a roundup, or gather!
I’ve also witnessed numerous wildfires burning right up to our fence lines then dying for lack of fuel! What is it with ecoloons and burning stuff? Is it just a Commifornia thing or do libtards in other states also enjoy incinerating forests, fields and brush land with their idiotic policies?
Living now in a state that is proud of it’s forests, hunters and ranchers; and encourages wise use of ALL natural resources; it’s easy to forget how enraging it was watching all that beauty go up in smoke!

Last edited 1 month ago by Abolition Man
Scissor
Reply to  Abolition Man
July 17, 2021 9:42 am

Last edited 1 month ago by Scissor
Dave Fair
Reply to  Scissor
July 17, 2021 3:24 pm

When I was a kid, on cold days I would go out in the pasture and lay on one particular Jersey cow’s neck and she would wrap her head around me. I never laid down in a pig wallow like this guy, though. I’m happy he inherited enough wealth and property to ignore having to make a living.

They are called livestock for a reason: We raise them to eat. He and the fools listening to him are delusional enough to believe they are pets that should not be slaughtered.

mikebartnz
Reply to  Dave Fair
July 18, 2021 12:30 am

Years ago a friend of mine got two pigs and I asked his young kids if they were going to call them breakfast and dinner.

James Donald Bailey
July 17, 2021 7:36 am

Been watching competing propaganda films over diet that seem to turn into lies about meat vs lies about grains. Notice that both sets of propagandists put forward people who look sickly. Not everyone, but enough to make both arguments worrisome.

Wish people would start from the fact that we are omnivores. We aren’t herbivores, with GI tracts and teeth specialized in getting nutrients out of grass. Neither are we carnivores, with teeth and GI tracts specialized in consuming meat.

And we were gathering grains long before we became agricultural. That is part of being a hunter gatherer.

And long life, surviving to a natural old age, is a very recent development. So too is the massive increase in being overweight. Funny what technology and abundance can do.

These lying propagandists can’t stop themselves from abusing every opportunity that might give them an edge in their fight over us. That is why they glom on to climate change to justify the things they were already trying to force on us.

But then that is true for many others.

gringojay
July 17, 2021 7:42 am

As a vegetarian for over 50 years I want to extend my sincere gratitude to all the people over lo those many decades who have eaten the animals that would have eaten my food.

DMacKenzie
Reply to  gringojay
July 17, 2021 8:56 am

….good one, gringo

Bruce Cobb
July 17, 2021 7:54 am

Here’s an idea: How about everybody shut up about how much healthier/better their diet is? That includes meat-eaters. Can it already.

John Hultquist
Reply to  Bruce Cobb
July 17, 2021 12:11 pm

I don’t like canned meat!

Tom in Florida
Reply to  John Hultquist
July 17, 2021 1:17 pm

Thinly sliced SPAM, fried until crispy and slightly burned on the edges tastes just like bacon without all the grease.

rah
Reply to  Tom in Florida
July 18, 2021 4:06 am

SPAM (Shoulder Pork Ham) was concocted by a French Chef for Hormel as an efficient way to use the meat in pork shoulder). It has saved countless lives from starvation. We sent 1,000s of tons of the stuff to Russia during WW II. We sent 1000’s of tons more to the various countries liberated during that war and then to the Germans afterward. It helped keep Berliners alive during the airlift.

In the US military during WWII it was a staple in many places. It went under the nomenclature, “luncheon meat, canned”. An Essex class aircraft carrier would typically stow away 4 tons of the stuff before deployment.

I keep a couple cans of the low sodium stuff in the larder in my truck. Very satisfying when cut in the appropriate size and eaten on a cracker with a little Buffalo sauce or perhaps Arby’s Horsey sauce on it.

At home we sometimes fry it up or cube it and bake it into mac & cheese.

Gary Pearse
Reply to  rah
July 18, 2021 10:59 am

Field geologist (the only real kind) – northern Canada (also Nigeria, Tanzania, Benin,Togo… but no spam there). Yeah, fried spam was what we used when the bacon was gone. Re-supplied every 2 weeks by float plane, longer if an active forest fire season. Tasted pretty good.

Dave Fair
Reply to  John Hultquist
July 17, 2021 3:26 pm

I do.

Michael E McHenry
July 17, 2021 8:35 am

What is often left out by the alarmists is the fact that there were an estimated 60 million bison in north America at the start of the 19th century

Olen
July 17, 2021 8:44 am

How objectionably convenient that a small well connected group presumes to tell us what to eat, drive, say, live in and own in our daily lives and going about our own business.

Social mores and codes along with business are established by the society, not by politicians, kings and potentates, and investment busybodies.

Joe
July 17, 2021 11:15 am

Just an observation. Watching the video I did not notice any information about the pet food industry nor the corn to ethanol impact on the planet.

David Blenkinsop
July 17, 2021 11:26 am

Great video, very informative.

David Blenkinsop
Reply to  David Blenkinsop
July 17, 2021 11:33 am

One of the reasons why I think that debunking the vegan climate alarmist message is important (besides the fact that they are actually wrong), is that the world saving fervor of their message is clearly aimed at government policy, along with all the other bad alarmist prescriptions, of course!

That is to say, on the level of forcing a reduction in meat use, the activists will do *that* if they can, or even *ban* meat use ultimately. What concerned do-gooder doesn’t want to ban whatever is said to be wrecking the world?

Last edited 1 month ago by David Blenkinsop
Dave Fair
Reply to  David Blenkinsop
July 17, 2021 3:27 pm

People used to dismiss them as busybodies.

michael hart
July 17, 2021 12:23 pm

Wow, so food goes off if people don’t eat it?
Before today’s more efficient agrochemical/food industry, the food use to go off before it even got to the consumer. In the past people ate more unsafe food and consequently suffered more food poisoning and related GI cancers.

Excellent video.
Unfortunately, this has all been known for a long time. The saddest thing is that so much of the population is being lied to about such things as the beef industry. Most people probably still believe all the “green” BS that is thrown at us.

Gary Pearse
Reply to  michael hart
July 18, 2021 11:43 am

Working in remote fields geology) we had occasion to pick maggots out of bacon and beef hung in a screen box from a tree that an occasional fly or two got into.

The bacon we also washed with a bit of vinegar. Groups of larvae on the beef could be scraped off. The outer surface of the beef was pretty hard and dry. Cutting steaks from the beef, you trimmed the dry border, salted it and put it in a jar with small perforations in the lid to be used later in a stew.

On occasion at home these days, if the bacon slab gets a bit of mold I wash this off with vinegar (before my wife sees it and throws it out).

Wasted food could be reduced considerably with a little foreplanning. Cook up vegetables before they go off to make stew, soup, spaghetti sauce shep pie… Fruit, pies….. Buy in sensible amounts.

H.R.
July 17, 2021 1:18 pm

Why are vegans riding the Climate Change® gravy train? I thought they were against gravy.

gringojay
Reply to  H.R.
July 17, 2021 5:49 pm

Riders are ready for orders.

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Graeme McElligott
July 17, 2021 3:03 pm

Concerns about the environmental impacts of cattle farming shouldn’t be confused with the ethical nature of “veganism”, which is really more about how we treat others. We are already vegan in how we treat other people, the issue is to do with how much we extend that kind of moral concern to other animals. That has much broader scope than simply rejecting meat in your diet.

That said, there are many problems relating to eating meat and dairy and good reasons why we should do a lot less of it, given the environmental damage and poor animal welfare caused by modern production methods.

Gregg Eshelman
July 17, 2021 8:59 pm

The anti-science craziness of the vegans just won’t end. Humans are omnivores.

Van Doren
Reply to  Gregg Eshelman
July 18, 2021 12:49 am

Doesn’t mean it’s the healthiest way to eat.

Gary Pearse
Reply to  Van Doren
July 18, 2021 12:47 pm

Mad cow disease came about through feeding cows sheep entrails and other slaughter house waste.

Why would you think that there is a healthier way than what you evolved to eat. You are a vegan but a half dozen nutrients critical to brain, heart, muscle fcn and red cell production need to be added to your diet.

Before such nutrient knowledge, natural vegetarians lived shorter lives than generally healthy meat, dairy, egg and fish eaters.To me, you have simply removed the bulk mass of these foods, added more vetables and substituted prime nutrients of these ‘forbidden’ foods into what has become an ersatz diet.

Moreover, you have probably bought into the massively over-wriiten agendized literature on tofu (diet/supplement multibillion industry), another manufactured principal ingredient in the vegetarian diet. This one has a literature on the two tofu ingredients that mimic estrogen. Studies show that many men that eat a lot of tofu and/or, apparently, almond milk, a ‘disorder’ known as gynecomastia (formation of man boobs) results. The pooh pooh post normal agendized over-writes “debunk” these ‘assertions’ to your satisfaction. I’m sure you have ready links to re-educate me.

“Beam me up, Scotty”
” No thanks”

ozspeaksup
July 18, 2021 2:55 am

pity it wasnt GRASSfed NON CAFO beef figures
annoying the same old pics of steamclouds from industry made to look dark n “evil” too

TomR
July 18, 2021 2:59 am

Almost everybody is doing wrong this one: mixing carbs and fat in the same high-calorie meal. This triggers inflammation via Randle Cycle.

In Randle Cycle, in presence of high amount of energy substrates in cells:

  • lots of fat block intake of carbs
  • lots of carbs block intake of fats

thus leading to negative health effects

The general idea to avoid it is to:

  • eat high calorie meal with fats and protein (eg. meat as a meal) but without carbs.
  • eath high calorie – high carb, no-fat or very low fat meal (eg. potatoes)
  • keep multi-hour time distance between high-fat and high-carb meals (preferably next day)
  • eat very low calorie meals (temporarily – not sustainable for a long term), only low calorie eating can have mixed carbs and fats

Randle cycle means humans are hunter-gatherers, but not at the same time, at a given time we are either hunters (low carb, high fat meal) or gatherers (high carb, low fat eating).

gringojay
Reply to  TomR
July 18, 2021 11:22 am

Hunter-gatherer “diet” based on Randle cycle needs contextual relationship with a circadian transcrip-tome. Hunter-gatherers, if like other humans, naturally experience rhythmic phase changes in up to 237 gene transcripts (in 6.4% of our transcrip-tome). Of this portion of the transcrip-tome up to 228 genes’ expression can be de-synchronized with circadian rhythms.

Randle cycle is integrated with liver dynamics; which (liver) normally has rhythmic gene expression patterns occurring throughout the day that themselves occur at generally even intervals. Hunter-gatherers sleep & wake pattern is unlike most of our contemporary circadian experience; our modern sleep/wake pattern negates the liver’s normal (hunter-gatherer) fairly even phased genetic expression and now our (moderns) liver genetic expression pattern becomes just dual (not multi) phasic.

This means that unlike hunter-gatherers the majority of our phasic liver genes’ are not evenly cyclic, but rather up-regulated (at peak operating capability) either at light of day or when dark begins. This in turn has a knock-on effect of liver genes that themselves are not classically (hunter-gatherer) rhythmically expressing types of liver genes; namely, in 2 paradigms: some non-rhythmic genes alter their normal levels of expression (up-/down- regulate from their individual standard of base-line activity), and also some normally non-rhythmic liver genes become rhythmic actors.

Last edited 1 month ago by gringojay
Robert Maginnis
July 18, 2021 3:42 am

Seventy percent of US grain is feed to animals.

Sorry but
July 18, 2021 5:16 am

My daughter ,aged 47,has been a vegan for 29 years, but there are personality issues which predated her decision and cause it to persist

Jake J
July 18, 2021 8:04 pm

There seems to be a non-trivial non-American audience here, so let me horrify you.

I am an American with a whole lot of ammo and 16 guns, including the dreaded AR-15. And a 1,000 lb gun safe, framed in and bolted to the floor. It’s a combo of collecting and target shooting, with personal safety an added benefit in case I need to fight off a horde of starving vegans intent on stealing our Spam and toilet paper.

Come ‘n get it, Portland! I need the practice. LOL

sadbutmadlad
July 19, 2021 12:12 am

The other problem with veganism is that it requires food from far flung corners of the Earth. If vegans kept to just local plant food they would die pretty quickly. They cheat and harm the environment by having fancy foods with the extra vitamins, minerals, etc from distant countries.

Steve Safigan
July 19, 2021 12:42 pm

I wish I could send this to my vegan son and daughter-in-law. They’ve given up meat purely for environmental reasons. Unfortunately this one video can’t undo everything they’ve “learned” by watching videos affirming their position almost daily. And if I want to have a good relationship with them, I have to refrain from giving them anything that would refute their belief. 100 videos in support of a position beats 1 video against, right?

Steve Safigan
July 19, 2021 12:51 pm

I’d always wondered about the water usage of cattle. I reasoned, “Don’t they just drink the water from the mud pond and then pee it out?” As it turns out, yes. Yes they do.

July 20, 2021 4:44 am

More about meat and climate change

https://tambonthongchai.com/2020/06/19/vegandiet/

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