White House Budget Director: Climate Spending “a waste of your money”

By US Government – Office of Congressman Mick Mulvaney, Public Domain, Link

Guest essay by Eric Worrall

White House Office of Management and Budget Director Mick Mulvaney answering questions at a press conference, explained that the reason the President wants to slash climate funding is he considers such funding to be a waste of money.

White House: Climate funding is ‘a waste of your money’

BY DEVIN HENRY – 03/16/17 03:58 PM EDT

The White House on Thursday defended a proposal to slash federal funding for climate change programs, calling it “a waste of your money.”

“I think the president was fairly straightforward on that: We’re not spending money on that anymore,” Office of Management and Budget Director Mick Mulvaney said at a White House briefing on Thursday.

“We consider that to be a waste of your money to go out and do that. We consider that a basic tie to his campaign.” …

Read More (+ video): http://thehill.com/policy/energy-environment/324358-white-house-says-climate-funding-is-a-waste-of-your-money

I like straightforward answers to questions.

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160 thoughts on “White House Budget Director: Climate Spending “a waste of your money”

  1. Democrat and Republican lifers will be outraged by the President’s unwillingness to waste money.

  2. We d3niers evidently have been heard… at the very top.
    OK moving on. Trump can handle this now.

    • That what we brexiteers said post referendum.

      But those financially entangled in a good gravy train don’t give up without a fight, and the viciousness of that fight has only been briefly glimpsed.

      Huge amounts of money are riding on US policy decisions. More than enough to fund and train a ‘lone nutcase with an M39’…

      Remember Wat Tyler…

      Walter “Wat” Tyler (died 15 June 1381) was a leader of the 1381 Peasants’ Revolt in England. He marched a group of rebels from Canterbury to the capital to oppose the institution of a poll tax and demand economic and social reforms. While the brief rebellion enjoyed early success, Tyler was killed by officers loyal to King Richard II during negotiations at Smithfield, London

      https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wat_Tyler

      Democracy was originally invented to allow totally corrupts governments and elites to be removed bloodlessly, however that depends on the rule of law and consensus being strong enough and enjoying the support of enough peole to make it work.

      What I am seeing now is people openly calling for an end to democracy, which they now call ‘populism’ on the grounds that the populace is as ignorant as pigshit and cant be trusted to make decisions about their own lives.

      We are engaged in a war, a savage war that is not revealed to the public, and that war is between who gets their sticky hands on the public purse and public legislation, and whether or not its for the good of the actual nation and its people or for some narrow elite.

      Our ancestors left us democracy: It may be enough to make the war relatively bloodless. Meantime keep your powder dry, and ‘don’t follow leaders: Watch your parking meters’

      • So how is that different from every other system? Socialism is run by the government taking whatever they want, as are communism and dicatorships. Someone always takes what they want. At least this involves the majority, not a few leaders deciding who does what.

      • Populism is the belief that the majority (or the obnoxious, tantrum throwing minority) have the right to take whatever they want.

      • Sheri, I think what you missed because MarkW didn’t spell it out, is that “Majority Rules” is a word away from “Mob Rules”. “Mob Rules” is no rules. No guidance. No Basic Standard, No accountability.
        Those in the executive offices of the MSM and The Department of Education and even Disney love the idea of “Mob Rule”. They feed the “stupid” what they should “feel” about things.
        The “Founding Fathers” of the US built “brakes” into the Constitution and the Bill of Rights to prevent “mob rule fads” from becoming the law of the land.

        The only system of “Government” that will be perfect is awaiting the third heaven and earth. (End of the Book of Revelation.)
        In the meantime, I’d prefer to live under a man-made form of government that claimed it would allow you to worship your navel or your brain without someone who chose to be “offended” being able to use the courts or the Government to silence or fine you because you are “politically incorrect”.

    • Get ready for Warmist suicide attacks on power stations, etc. for the sake of the children, you know.

      • I’m not sure Warmists are willing to die for their cause. They’ll chain themselves to trees, hire lobbyists, even go to jail, but dying? Especially a suicide?

  3. Refreshing candor. It will piss off the greens, but so what. They have been in melt down mode since Trump’s victory anyway. It’s nice to see the white house laying it out so clearly.

    Oh yeah…it’s on!

    • LOL! If you want a good laugh to keep you going all weekend, read all the comments under the article. The greens aren’t just pissed off or in meltdown, they’re boiling and I think some might have actually exploded!

      • We who accept science are not pissed off just depressed that such an ill informed moron that probably believes some bloke in the sky made our planet in 6 days could be elected to a position of power.

    • “…piss off the greens…”

      What about all the tax payers who are PISSED OFF about being scalped all these years (never mind the greens)? Those angry tax payers are the reason Trump got elected. (if the greens don’t like it, they can go out and get their own potus)…

      • They had their own POTUS for eight years, the abject disaster Obama. Now they’re trying to preserve his legacy, which we, the voters, have voted to reverse.

      • Greens can’t get elected. That’s why they try to smuggle their policies in by through international treaties and organizations, so-called consensus science, brainwashing and scaring politicians.

  4. If Trump pulls this off — it is not the light at the end of the tunnel — but the end of the tunnel.

    Eugene WR Gallun

    • +1 Eugene.

      And before long we will be writing…

      “After years in such a long, dark, seemingly endless, tunnel,
      WUWT, “the little engine that could,” finally made it.

      And beyond…

      this!

      #(:))

    • The Dems have the discipline that the GOP never mastered.
      The GOP congress is like herding cats, but DJTs cabinet so far are consistent around a message.
      – Focus on data, not feelings or models.
      – Cut budgets for programs that do not produce results or benefits.

      • The Dems have the discipline {of a cult.} Admirable, perhaps, in its warped way, but, as with all dictatorships leading to a vile, tragic, end.

        ***********

        (the rest of the comment was great. :) )

      • The Dems also have no morals, ethics and don’t mind rank hypocrisy. Power is an end unto itself. These people would sell their own flesh & blood into slavery.

        Best not to underestimate this nasty crowd. They’ve been around for a few thousand years (Masters, aristocracy, the nobles, Duke of xyz, political elites, etc). To them, liberty and freedom are an anathema. They will literally do anything to gain the power of tell the rest of society how to run their lives.

      • “The Dems have the discipline that the GOP never mastered.”

        Maybe not any more. They rather fractured now and tend to turn on their own in anger. As long as they were winning, they looked disciplined. They are, however, more persistent. Far more. They organize and they keep at it. Obama’s Organize for Action is busily email all the followers as if he were still president. The GOP never seems to understand this. The closest we have come is Trump using Twitter. Now, if the GOP could organize and hit people with email updates, etc, they might actually stand a chance in the long run.

  5. For all of the things I dislike about Trump, there are so many great things. Calling climate change programs a waste of taxpayer money simply melts my heart. It makes all those uncomfortable things he does (like his Tweet rants) just not matter to me in the big picture.

    • I dunno…..I’m not convinced he understands the science any better than Al Gore does. The issue has become so politically polarized as R vs D (or more broadly, populist vs globalist) that there really isn’t any surprise that an R is against alarmist policies — but I have little confidence that there is any understanding there. I have yet to hear a politician who really seems to understand any of the science. I too have been pleasantly surprised at many of his policy changes (or attempts at policy changes), but he is still acting and tweeting like a buffoon, and there is little chance that he will win over any more support than he already has. This year continues to be a “news of the weird” year for me.

      • I’m pretty sure Cruz has a good grasp of the issues.

        What I don’t get is so many people on the right saying, “the science isn’t settled,” but then they want to cut the funding for the science.

        Cut the funding for the panic programs to cut CO2, sure, but then spend a few extra billion on making climate models that are actually predictive.

      • Tim,

        Science doesn’t know enough about climate to model it, and even if it did, the system is probably too complex to be modeled usefully.

        Any money for climate modeling should not just be cut, but gutted. Funding for real climatology could continue at its present level, which is low compared to the tens of billions wasted on the GIGO computer gaming that passes for “climate science”.

      • We had a good stiff breeze here today. Fighting climate change is a little like trying to make a difference by blowing back at it. It’s the dumbest thing the government has ever spent money on.

      • Jeff

        You’re probably correct that Trump doesn’t understand the science any more than Gore. The fact is YOU DO NOT HAVE TO UNDERSTAND THE SCIENCE TO KNOW THE PROCESS IS CORRUPT. Businessmen generally have a very healthy understanding of the consequences of bad data – no differential equations required.

      • “Tim Broberg March 16, 2017 at 7:55 pm
        What I don’t get is so many people on the right saying, “the science isn’t settled,” but then they want to cut the funding for the science.

        Cut the funding for the panic programs to cut CO2, sure, but then spend a few extra billion on making climate models that are actually predictive.”

        What part of climate science is actually advancing knowledge and science?

        This is before entire generations of climate scientists believing that all they have to do for a reward is to blame CO2.

        Papers and research are developed and published without anyone’s version of reality or proofs involved.
        • Fiddle with the data set till personal biases are apparent.
        • Fiddle with various statistical algorithms until result(s) are desirable.
        • Ignore inconvenient results.
        • Cite loose correlations.
        • Assume absurd reaches of causation.
        • Refuse to share critical files or code.
        • Never admit error.
        • Never correct egregious mistakes; Tiljander proxies should be used upside down…
        • Include some absurd versions of possible future disasters.
        • Blame it all on CO2.

        Then there is that lovely camaraderie that so many climate scientists share:
        • Malign any critic’s character.
        • Work behind the scenes to damage careers of critics.
        • Refuse request for information.
        • Refuse and stymie FOIA requests.
        • Close ranks while insisting FOIA and official investigations chill research.
        • Actively support FOIA requests for research, information and communications of critics.
        • Actively demand investigations against critics.
        • Woe betide any alarmist who regains sanity and agrees with critics.

      • So Jeff, you think this issue has been about science all along! Trump definitely understands what has been going on better than you appear T.

      • Tim do you honestly think it’s possible to predict the future ? No matter how much money you throw at it no matter how many scientists work on it , no matter how many super computer hours you throw at it you will never be able to predict future weather or climate until you have mastered the time machine .

      • “Cut the funding for the panic programs to cut CO2, sure, but then spend a few extra billion on making climate models that are actually predictive.”

        We’ve already spent tens of billions. Maybe it’s not possible.

        At any rate, climate modellers are going to get billions even under Trump, just some % less than under Obama — and probably more than under Bush.

      • You don’t need to know how fecal matter acquires its unpleasant odor, to smell BS and come to a reasonable conclusion that something stinks.

      • Jeff,
        Trump doesn’t need a good understanding of the science for this. He just needs a good ability to recognize scams and waste. All other issues aside, I think he has a good handle on this.

      • Tim,
        The field of climate science is politically tainted and driven by the gravy train of climate science funding. Throwing more money at it would be like throwing gasoline to put out a fire. Climate science must be returned to the obscure scientific backwater that it once was. It is so scientifically corrupt that the only solution is to drive a wooden stake through its heart.

    • Joel says rants. Jeff says buffoon.

      Have you ever been on the streets of NYC?
      Trump does have respectable degrees, but …
      … he is street-wise, also.
      Expecting polite norms and behaviours on the streets of NYC? I don’t think so.

      Further, who does “understand the science”?

      • In this case, “science” needs to be replaced by “politics” to understand the Left’s goals. Their objective is equivalent to cultural suicide but they don’t see it.

      • The science that exists is perfectly understandable to a reasonably intelligent layman. The science that doesn’t exist–namely, the CAGW scare–isn’t worth perpetuating. I’m quite sure Trump understands all the science he needs in order to say, “We’re not going to waste any more money on a chimera.”

  6. Remember, as soon as the liberals are back in power they will make up for any savings by wasting money at a faster pace – so all this “progress” is illusion. If Trump can manage some job growth, economic growth, or tax simplification THAT will actually last a while.

    I really wish they would abolish the EPA and start a truly scientific organization from scratch. But you can’t have scientists reporting to the government or you just end up with emotionally motivated activists (again).

    NASA to focus on space…wow…who would of thought of that?

    • Robert

      I understand your “liberals back in” comment, but Trump’s use of the Bully Pulpit is making it “politically correct” to begin questioning CAGW. At least half the people in the USA will now begin to do that.

      To the extent this is a public relations war, half the population has now been given air-cover to pay attention to their common sense. That’s not victory in and of itself, but it make it infinitely harder for liberals to go back to CAGW business as usual.

    • “Remember, as soon as the liberals are back in power”

      That may be a while in coming. Let’s hope it is a very long while. Say, at least 16 more years of a Republican presidency.

  7. Pouring more money into current climate change models is pouring money down a rathole. The green blob cannot admit that the notion has gone nowhere, with the models no more precise than 1979. There should be light at the end of the tunnel–the headlight of a train coming the opposite way.

  8. The power to affect climate change is not a power granted to the federal government by the constitutiion. That power is reserved for the states. All the work that has been done with models shows that the climate change we are experiencing today is caused by the sun and the oceans over which Mankind has no control. Mankind has been unable to change a single weather event let alone affect the climate. Despite the hype, there is no real evidence that CO2 has any effect on climate and plenty of scientific rational to support the idea that the climate sensivity of CO2 is really zero. There are many good reasons to be conserving on the use of fossil fuels but climate change is not one of them. The federal government is deep in debt and cannot afford to be wasting money trying to solve problems that we do not have the power to solve. We do not know what the optimum climate is let alone how to achieve it. If we could hault climate change in its tracks, extreme weather events and sea level rise would continue unabated because they are part of the current climate.

    • willhaas says:

      “plenty of scientific rational to support the idea that the climate sensitivity of CO2 is really zero”

      Thank you – no one has yet shown where there is any ‘trapped heat’ on Mars with its 95% Carbon Dioxide atmosphere that sheds 200F degrees of heat each night. We have a real world example where the “climate sensitivity of CO2 is really zero” and that bolsters the scientific rational.

  9. This isn’t very satisfying. The Donald isn’t driving a stake through the heart of CAGW. He’s just ignoring it. When, eventually, the Democrat party gets back in, it will rear its ugly head again.

    How much of Michael Mann’s funding is traceable back to the federal government? Are they acting to defund him?

    Between 1999 and 2010 he served as principal or co-principal investigator on five research projects funded by the National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration (NOAA) and four more funded by the National Science Foundation (NSF). He was also co-investigator on other projects funded by the NOAA, NSF, Department of Energy, United States Agency for International Development, and the Office of Naval Research. link

    Cutting him off from all sources of federal funds looks like playing Whack-A-Mole. Maybe Tom Steyer will fund him. :-(

    • Yes, but removing the imprimatur of national governments and the UN will help delegitimize the insanity.

    • commieBob

      What do you mean this isn’t satisfying? Is there anybody else with Trump’s power on the global stage saying CAGW is a fraud?

      Trump does not have a magic wand, just the Bully Pulpit. Now he needs to “sell” this to the public. This will be a holy war with liberals, MSM and academe.

    • Tom Steyer lost 100M on “a sure thing” that the NYT gave a 95% certainty of HRC winning. I’m sure he, sorry Soros and the rest of the plotters lost an untold amount on green schemes that Hillary was to toss their way. I hope Gore went all-in on the half billion solar cells she planned. Steyer may not pony up for more Climateering, but rather be looking for another scam angle to haul us all into feudal penury . They’ll probably also lose big along with Lords and Ladies of old Europe on the crash to come in subsidies for renoobles. There is going to be a big demand for fallers to clearcut the forests of bird shredders.

      • Tom Steyer, Soros, et al, are focusing their attention on creating mini- Socialist Republics, within the Country, running them as mini-fiefdoms, and gaining as much control as possible. It is rumored he will run for Governor at one point in time, of California, and surround himself with people even farther to the Left. The Climate Change scam is another attempt at raiding the Treasury for their benefit. Federal Immigration policies will disappear. The Useful Idiots, that Stalin mentioned, such as the Sports Stars, the “Entertainment” Industry, the Race Baiters, the Ultra Rich Techies, the illegals themselves, will be the mouthpieces for the Movement, as the all -too -Left Press (National and Local), with provide them with the megaphones to shout down anyone who is not in Lockstep with THE Movement. I am hoping that the Federal monies that the prior Administration made so available to fund this type of activity dries up, and the States will be forced to decide how to fund the non-productive people who demand free stuff, using State funds supplied by the taxpayers. Wait until the next major earthquake or other natural disaster exposes the lack of Infrastructure construction, maintenance and foresight, (think Oroville) monies and effort that have been pissed away , replaced by Earth Days and Pride (Pick something you are proud of and feel it is absolutely necessary that everyone else finds “Pride” in it) , Festivals. I could go on, but, I have to go and work to pay my taxes to fund this insanity.

      • “They’ll probably also lose big along with Lords and Ladies of old Europe on the crash to come in subsidies for renoobles.”

        You know, I hadn’t thought about it that way, but I imagine there are lots of European gentry who are invested in green companies. The perfect investment for the PC crowd who want to wave their virtue flags. They probably sit around and brag to each other about how much of their money is in green tech. Then the crash comes. Ouch!

  10. Send him over to South Australia. We have been controlled by an ideology freak. Batteries for power storage???

  11. The one thing that shouldn’t be cut is raw climate/weather data collection, and ensure it isn’t tampered with or cherry picked for the record. If we don’t have the raw data, then we will never be able to know with certainty what is going on with the natural background and any potential human induced activity. I would hope nobody with argue with collecting all long term climatic/science data to be able to understand our ever evolving climate?

    • I agree. Unfortunately, under Obama even the supposedly “raw” data have been tampered with. Independent temperature readers have found all across the country that NOAA stooges have their thumbs on the thermometers. There is no end to the corruption of science under the Dumpocrap Stalinists.

    • I do. It is uncollectable in any meaningful way. No way to collect what happened millions of years ago. It’s gone. Over and out. Deal with the present.

    • Ron

      This is supposedly what East Anglia was supposed to be all about back in the 1970’s. We’re looking at a re-boot (AKA draining of the swamp)

    • Ron Williams. I agree. Anybody who understands GHE wants to know more about the practical effect of increased CO2 on earth’s climate. It would be foolish to stop all climate research, and having government employees spout rank denialism, while nice red meat for other deniers, is not helpful to the practice of real science.

      This is one of the things that disturbs me about Trump and his appointees. Acting ignorant may impress other ignoramuses, but it’s terrible government and an insult to thinking Americans.

      And those here who crow about the end of alarmism and the ascent of right-thinking Americans need to get a grip. Climate change doesn’t cease to be a serious issue just because of one election. We need to practice smart skepticism, and not try to match alarmists in stupid oversimplification – which is what we’re getting from the Budget Director.

      • “Climate change doesn’t cease to be a serious issue just because of one election.” Yes it does. We’ve been living all these years with it without major consequences. No need to invest vast resources into something beyond our control. Understand it? Sure. Master it? Never.

      • I believe study of that can continue in universities just as it began. Billions don’t need to be thrown into it. Perhaps had the scientists STAYED scientists and not ACTIVISTS and POLITICIANS, maybe, just maybe, there would be respect for them. They brought this on themselves.

        THINKING AMERICANS are the skeptics. You do know that, right? Those that just lap up the pablum have no thought involved. There is no such thing as “d*nialism”—there is legitimate questioning of science and the corruption thereof. Again, thinking people view disagreement as part of science. Those who do not think see it as an attack on their sacred beliefs.

    • Don’t worry.. “They” are , quote, ”Rushing to sequester the years of climate data gathered , so that the “Deniers ” will not wantonly destroy it” You mean make it unavailable for independent discovery, that may show the downward revision of earlier temperatures , so as to add to the differences of total temp rise. That sort of thing..

    • “The one thing that shouldn’t be cut is raw climate/weather data collection, and ensure it isn’t tampered with or cherry picked for the record.”

      Maybe some of that will be continued. See below:

      http://dailycaller.com/2017/03/16/fears-trump-would-gut-climate-agencies-were-overblown/

      Fears Trump Would Gut Climate Agencies Were Overblown

      “Scientists and activists who claimed President Donald Trump would gut the scientific capabilities of federal climate and weather agencies can breath a sigh of relief.

      Trump’s budget does cut dozens of federal climate programs, but the deep cuts many feared would hit the National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration’s (NOAA) and National Aeronautics and Space Administration (NASA) didn’t materialize.

      For months, activists warned the White House could gut climate programs and data through draconian budget cuts. Some scientists were so concerned they began downloading government data, and others organized a political march in “support” for science.

      NOAA satellites won’t fall out of the sky and NASA will still conduct climate science, says Ryan Maue, a meteorologist and adjunct scholar with the libertarian Cato Institute.

      “Scientists lose credibility as policy advisors when they latch onto conspiracy theories created by activists,” Maue told The Daily Caller News Foundation. “The rumors and speculation that led to hysterical overreaction turned out to be unfounded.”

      end excerpt

    • Associated Press

      TOPEKA
      The Kansas Supreme Court has cleared a major obstacle to the construction of a long-delayed coal-fired power plant in the state’s southwestern corner.

      The court Friday rejected a legal challenge from the Sierra Club to a state decision giving Sunflower Electric Power Corp. the go-ahead for its $2.8 billion project. The Hays-based utility wants to build an 895-megawatt plant outside Holcomb.

      Kansas.com

      The Sierra Club will follow the EPA for a multi year losing streak.

      On one hand I see this as Justice.

      On the other hand, finding a new producer which can produce at lower costs is very rare.

  12. More good news from the new administration regarding AGW and I’m sure more to come. Probably every Fed organization will walk back on AGW. I expect my state….California…. to double down. I’m guessing Trump will allow state control over C02 but no more support or even recognition from the Fed level.

  13. Gives an answer to my question about NSB and NSF! Great!

    Question: Regarding the NSB and NSF and it’s budget ….

    Answer: … [cutting me off] “We’re not spending money on that anymore,”.

    HOOOOO! Thank you!

    :-D

    • Absolutely often so. California as an example needs to be prepared to floods, drought, earthquakes etc but that’s not currently dealt with the climate programs which go for funding wind power, for example. Not efficient in helping with the problem at hand.

  14. Overall Federal cutbacks are about 4%. The media call this a catastrophe. In business, this is done commonly, and is called a ‘deadwood cleanout.” Such cuts in large corporations are done almost annually to get rid of nonperformers. Trump is following that business model.

  15. What you didn’t show in that clip was her follow up question. Her head didn’t actually explode, and she didn’t mention climate change again – I actually saw this live on CNN.
    I was truly surprised when her follow up question didn’t address this, a great moment for the skeptics here and elsewhere…

  16. Mick Mulvaney could have added “we encourage private enterprise to spend their money on climate change research”. “We also encourage investment managers to conduct detailed research prior to investing pension fund money in green investments”.

  17. How about this . . . Federal Government propose meeting of ‘green investors’ to form a private fund for climate change research. Invite the following ‘wealthy’ to attend and indicate their likely contribution to the fund:
    Black Rock
    Goldman Sachs
    Generation Investment (Al Gore)
    JP Morgan
    Merrill Lynch
    Morgan Stanley
    Leonardo DiCaprio
    Bill Gates
    George Soros
    Barack Obama
    Bono
    Etc . . .

  18. Should there be specific funding to dedicated bodies? or just allow physics students etc to do their research and projects during their education. A bit like all other areas of research: undergrad, grad school then post doc.

    Along the way, the best of the students develop really good science, using the normal funding model for universities….

    I was just reading: ‘Surely You’re Joking Mr Feynman’ about the life and times of Feynman where he describes his route through higher education and research. How he and others developed the science we now understand and accept. – A good read.

  19. Well… the climate is always changing, right?

    you keep telling me that.

    so its changing now (even if it isn’t from human CO2 according to posters here)

    but the US won’t know how its changing, because it just canned all the money spent observing that.

    so if there is an ice age coming or a freeze or a return to more ice in the arctic, the US won’t have anyone studying or spotting that.

    And so far there is no proof whaever of manipulation of climate data or that it isn’t warming or of any fraudulent activity. Because if there was, people should be in court to answer for it.

    This gets shut down without proven cause.

    (And do think how the US looks to the world in all this…)

    [never mind the US, how do YOU look to the rest of us? -mod]

    • 1. We can never know how the climate is changing, only how it has changed in the past.
      2. The changes are never uniform everywhere.
      3. The changes can have various drivers, some short-term and others long, the most significant of which are the oceans and the sun.
      4. Paleoclimatology is likely the most useful work that can be done with regard to attempting to understand climate.
      5. The decision to view changes in climate, both now and in the past as being driven by CO2 has been an error of tragically and epically idiotic proportion.

    • Oh, for Pete’s sake. I know when the climate is changing when I step out my front door and notice it has changed. When Puget Sound stops being cold and wet in the winter and warm and less-wet in the summer, then the climate will have changed. Until then, it just doesn’t make a bloody difference.

    • What the US looks like to the rest of the world is only asked by people as insecure as teenager who has no self-esteem and needs to develop a sense of self and a backbone. Sadly, bullying and intimidation are encourage and weakness and submission are the recommended responses. A nation of non-thinkers subject to group-think and shaming.

      (Last half of comment was apparently deemed unacceptable and the whole comment blows away.)

    • Possibly one of your worst hypocritical posts I’ve bothered to read Griff , you won’t apologise to Susan even though you were wrong , 30 years of studying climate , untold billions spent and what do we have – theories , models , consensus ?
      If they put the same resources into a cure for cancer , we would have probably cured it by now .
      You ignore climategate files , you obviously have trouble with small numbers as in ph 8.1 is acidic to the likes of you , or have you homogenised the ph scale as well to fit your ideology .
      We are not ideologically driven , we just call bullshit where we it and you are covered in it .

    • As a Canadian I would say the U.S. is starting to look rational, Griff! Not something I’m used to but you should embrace it. It looks good on you!

    • Griff, baby, we still have weather satellites and TV weather forecasters (many of them outrageously attractive).

      We save up all the weather data and then, after a number years, we call it climate.

    • Robert from oz, I would argue that it is more like untold TRILLIONS.

      Skankhunt42, you are 100% correct, the climate has ALWAYS been changing, analysis of the geological record of the planet tells us that. And what we are experiencing in present day falls well within the range of normal climate patters of the past 600 million years. I am very glad that we saw a warming pattern from the late 1970’s to the late 1990’s, because cold kills way more people than heat does (17:1 ratio). And the (give or take) 20 year warming trend had more impact towards the polar areas than the equatorial area – remember a warmer planet is a more benign planet.

      However I know, I know, I shouldn’t confuse you with facts ……

    • Griff’s feeling his oats again. I’m convinced he’s some part of a horse.

      Tell you what, Griff. Channel 10’s weatherman out of Albany has a lot of “weather watchers” who call in their local temps every day from numerous towns in the viewing area. We’ll rely on them to collect data, if everything gets shut down, OK? It’s heavily Republican outside Albany, so not much worry about warmist bias. Other areas can do the same. What a network!

    • [never mind the US, how do YOU look to the rest of us? -mod]
      Bullied frankly, something to be real proud of. Well done us.

  20. I want to see the seminal paper in which it is demonstrated that accurate long range predictions in the phase space of deeply non-linear dynamical systems are now consistently accessible by numerical methods. Until we have that revolutionary piece of work climate modelling will continue to be equivalent to blindly shoving a pin into a 10^∞ dimensional phase space and hoping to get the correct answer. It is simply absurd. When I mention this severe limitation to the faithful they usually come back some time later and suggest that I probably haven’t heard of ‘sensitivity testing’ in model hindcasting or whatever and fondly imagine that in this banal statement they have somehow vaulted clean over the inherent unpredictability in non-linear dynamical systems.

    There’s nothing wrong with having a shot at it and it can be highly instructive in formalising what you think you know about the system but to spend vast sums on the effort when you haven’t even demonstrated that what you are attempting to achieve is in fact even remotely possible in the first place and then go on to formulate astronomically expensive and destructive government policy on the outcome is the very definition of gibbering insanity.

  21. Climate spending is way worse than simply a waste of money, but I am loving the schadenfreude. Gang Green is finally getting its comeuppance.

  22. I’ve been in gov’t, big business, startups, non-profits — they all have people in them and their share of corruption. You will even find it in the Trump Whitehouse and the Kremlin (surprise!). And the Clinton quote above is False http://www.snopes.com/hillary-clinton-stupid-quote/ — please check Snopes next time. BTW, I’m a big fan of this site for years now. Keep up the good work.

    • Is it okay if I check more than Snopes? I don’t really trust their conclusions.

      (The quote is false, yes.)

      • Snopes is notoriously wrong. I treat them like Wiki – perhaps a good place to start, but never the final authority on the veracity of a question.

  23. I think it would be useful to devote some funds to reproducing past papers in climate science and elsewhere. It would be handy to know which papers are correct and which are faulty.
    After all it’s what you know which ain’t so that causes most trouble.

  24. Climate science is based almost entirely (in the words of a former NOAA researcher) on computer models. These models are curve-fit to historical proxy data using fudge factors. Each climate model has its own fudge factor – implying that it isn’t only the physics of the CO2 – water vapor relationship that is not known.

    Accountability – without it, nothing works. If these climate scientists’ livelihoods were dependent on their making useful predictions (projections), this waste of money would be self-correcting.

    That’s what I like about the markets. There is no “committee” that decides who is right and who is wrong.

  25. No wonder all that money spread around to all the different agencies to target climate change ain’t worth much. The AGW science crowd, thanks to their fear…feckless leaders, nickle and dimed themselves to death.

    • It was not about worth or efficiency. It was about reward and messaging spread across many agency outlets and budgets. That difference is hard to understand by most everyday working people. It does make sense to over reach political strategists with confidence they will not be caught or even called out by a friendly press community. It also has precedence in the Bill Clinton era of funded community organizations (Enterprise Communities) as payoff for get out the vote efforts. You know it’s targeted waste when they design and fund the entire giveaway govt. program with IG oversight excluded.

  26. Don’t forget this unconstitutional piece of work.
    -Consumer Financial Protection Bureau-

    WSJ today
    Justice Department Files Brief Arguing CFPB’s Structure is Unconstitutional
    Department lawyers argue bureau’s structure creates separation-of-powers problems

  27. “A waste of your money ” Yep . Budget Director Mulvaney pure genius ! The easiest $Trillion dollars ever saved and wipe out the Obama “legacy ” at the same time . A win /win all round .
    Mr .Mulvaney well done ! Long time coming but worth the wait . Too bad the money already blown on this heist can’t be returned to tax payers, but one step at a time .
    The Science fiction is settled .

  28. “Bingo!!! Finally, someone is speaking the truth. Now turn that argument on Germany and get them to pay up for NATO.”

    Isn’t that pathetic! Germany pays only about half of its NATO dues. The U.S. pays almost twice as much as is required.

    No more Uncle Sucker, world. Trump is in charge now, and Trump is going to insist that other nations play fair and pay their fair share. We do that, and we expect you to do the same.

    How did we get so lucky as to get a Trump?! What a difference he makes! If you want to know what leadership is, you are looking at it with Trump. He’s a natural-born leader. He knows where he wants to go, and he knows how to get there, and he is undeterred. Just give him time.

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