Friday funny – Framing Climate Change

Josh writes: There is a fairly persistent alarmist idea that if only ‘Climate Change’ was properly communicated then everyone would believe all the hype, spin and misinformation and ignore the politicking, the dodgy science, and the duff statistics.

As we read in a post here at WUWT,   a new study from the University of California outlined how to talk about climate change to increase donations.

I think the ‘Climate Change’ message is pretty clear, don’t you?


Cartoons by Josh

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May 6, 2016 3:14 am

has there been even one year in the history of mankind that someone was’t warning about the end of the world and that if only they had more power they could save us?
I have gone through:
1) The whole Earth will be destroyed by atomic weapons soon–and usually the US was blamed (don’t think I ever heard any one warn about the weapons in the USSR or China)
2) The whole Earth would soon be under ice from the new ice age
3) The rain forests were going to be gone in just a couple of years and the Earth would become a huge desert
4) Due to less solar radiation, the ozone over the south pole decreased every winter. However, someone decided the Freon and chlorinated solvents would break down from solar radiation and the ozone would be destroyed, causing a permanent ozone hole and the southern hemisphere would be irradiated to death. As soon as Freon (a DuPont chemical that was losing its patent protection) was banned, DuPont had the replacements (not as good) and nobody EVER talked about it again.
5) Acid rain was going to destroy all water on Earth and we were all going to die.
6) DDT was going to destroy all birds on Earth. So, we decided that a unproven claim was worth banning DDT and allow millions to die every year from mosquito borne disease
7) Fishing was going to destroy all sea life in just a few years
8) Pollution was going to destroy all sea life in just a few years. In fact, some French guy found areas of the ocean that were already DEAD. Of course, those areas had been “dead” for hundreds if not thousands of years.
9) Automobile exhaust was going to kill everyone in just a few years, though nobody could point to any dying in LA or other severely polluted areas. See China today for the on-going proof that the EPA is power-hungry
10) Fracking causes earth quakes, pollutes all water (even when they can’t find the polluted water), and will destroy all life on Earth if we don’t keep petroleum in the ground.
10) Probably at least 25 others, but now we have Global Warming/Global Weather Catastrophe/Climate Change that will kill us all

Reply to  noylj2014noylj
May 6, 2016 3:25 am

lol at 1, only one country has used one.
But I agree wit the rest, be afraid, be very afraid and hand yourself over to the technocracy.

tom konerman
Reply to  Mark
May 6, 2016 3:47 am

I guess it depends on your definition of “used”

Reply to  Mark
May 6, 2016 4:06 am

Only one country has used them in war. Arguably, the use of nukes to compel Japan’s surrender saved a lot more lives than were lost. An invasion would likely have been much worse in terms of lives lost and destruction.

Reply to  Mark
May 6, 2016 5:46 am

> lol at 1, only one country has used one.
Umm, two (in an attack). Hundreds have been used in testing.

Reply to  Mark
May 6, 2016 11:23 am

Context is useful. People unfamiliar with the subject should look up the bombing of Tokyo and Operation Meetinghouse.

Reply to  Mark
May 6, 2016 1:20 pm

The fire bombing of Dresden in Germany killed more people than did the Hiroshima and Nagasaki bombs combined.

Gunga Din
Reply to  Mark
May 6, 2016 3:04 pm

tom konerman May 6, 2016 at 3:47 am
I guess it depends on your definition of “used”…

When I much, much younger, one of the fears they told us of was a “nuclear winter”.
I don’t remember if they ever said just how many nukes it would take to cause a “nuclear winter”.
Perhaps the 2,000+ nukes in your clip were enough to offset all the “Hiroshima Bombs” Man’s CO2 has caused? Man caused the pause!?
OH! The Horror!
The only way to stop Catastrophic Anthropomorphic Global Warming is Catastrophic Anthropomorphic Nuclear Cooling!
(What’s a Greenie to do?)

Reply to  noylj2014noylj
May 6, 2016 4:00 am

Yeah, I grew up on “Silent Spring” and “The Population Bomb”. It’s the same song, over and over again, “It’s an emergency! We can’t wait for the democratic process! There’s no time to investigate! Declare martial law! Execute the unbelievers! We must act now, now NOW!”
I have a book on my shelf that “proves” that all ocean life will be extinct by 1990, unless all undersea oil drilling is ended immediately. (I think it was published in 1975.) Well, we didn’t stop drilling for oil, and the the oceans are still full of whales and sharks.

Reply to  MishaBurnett
May 6, 2016 10:56 am

129,000 + people died in is beside me on how someone could think that the two bombs dropped saved lives.Once a troops make it to the emperor that war was over ,so how do you justify bombs that killed 129,000 + people.You do not ever .justifying is a liars way of telling you that they were for it .

Reply to  MishaBurnett
May 6, 2016 12:26 pm

Dew, US casualty estimates for an invasion of Japan were 1million+. That’s just US casualties. Who knows what Japanese casualties would have been. Also, while both Hiroshima and Nagasaki combined had a higher death toll than the bombing of Tokyo, the death toll in Tokyo was greater than either Hiroshima or Nagasaki individually. The bombing of Tokyo was performed with conventional munitions. So, as crazy as it is to think that the bombing of Hiroshima and Nagasaki with nuclear weapons probably ended up saving a lot of lives…well, it probably did. It certainly brought a horrible war to an end, quickly.

Reply to  MishaBurnett
May 6, 2016 1:22 pm

dew, how long do you believe it would take US troops to find and capture the emperor?
Do you actually believe that the leaders would have him remain in his palace in Tokyo as the invasion fleet approaches?

Reply to  MishaBurnett
May 6, 2016 1:25 pm

Japan was training every citizen how to defend every inch of the country. There are videos of training camps with elderly women and school-aged children being taught how to use farm tools as weapons. The emperor was a living god and every citizen was honor-bound to give their lives to defend their empire. This is the country where suicide was the preferable option to surrender, and there are gory pictures of soldiers in the south pacific to prove it.
The only way to defeat such a fanatical society was to shock them into sitting down at the negotiating table with that display of power. Those bombs saved not only countless lives, but the destruction of a whole culture and people.

Reply to  MishaBurnett
May 6, 2016 1:27 pm

I’ve read the reports of how women and children were being taught how to fight using pointed sticks.
In Okinowa, most of the civilian population killed themselves by jumping off cliffs rather than allow themselves to be captured. Including women with small babies in their arms.
The death toll would have been well up into the multiple of millions before the Japanese Islands had been fully pacified. All of those people owe their lives to the dropping of the atomic bombs.
PS: To those who claim that we should have dropped a demonstration bomb off the coast first, we only had enough uranium and plutonium to build three bombs. One of those was tested at Alamagordo.
The Japanese did not surrender until after the second bomb had been dropped on them. We were all out of atomic bombs and it would have been months before the next set was ready.

Reply to  MishaBurnett
May 6, 2016 1:42 pm

[Snip. Impostor. Don Klipstein says he did not post this. -mod]

Reply to  MishaBurnett
May 6, 2016 4:24 pm

Dew, look up operation Downfall. It was estimated that the military casualties alone for an invasion of Japan would be over a million. The numbers for civilian casualties were only guesses, but were up to ten times that much. Whether these were accurate or not is not the question. Realistically, Japan would have collapsed before nearly such tolls would have happened. The point is that they thought they were accurate. In that situation, the mass bombing is quite likely the lesser of the two evils.

Gunga din
Reply to  MishaBurnett
May 6, 2016 4:29 pm

dew May 6, 2016 at 10:56 am
129,000 + people died in is beside me on how someone could think that the two bombs dropped saved lives.Once a troops make it to the emperor that war was over ,so how do you justify bombs that killed 129,000 + people.You do not ever .justifying is a liars way of telling you that they were for it .

I’ll assume English is not your native language.
How would you have ended WW2? What would you solution have cost?
The A-Bomb was Top Secret.
The anti-nuke hysteria did not exist.
To the military, the A-Bomb was just a bigger bomb than the ones dropped on Pearl Harbor.
Grown men were climbing into airplanes with the intent from the start to commit suicide by crashing their planes into the enemy’s ships.
Grown men were committing suicide rather than surrender or be “dishonored” in battle.
Japanese civilians were throwing themselves and their children off cliffs at Saipan.
“Once a troops make it to the emperor that war was over”
How many would die before that?
1,000,000+++ by 100,000 bombs and a gazillion bullets (not to mention all the suicides) would have been better than “129,000 + people” by just those two bombs?
War is evil. WW2 was evil. Put yourself, with what they knew and had experienced, in the place of a 1945 person. How would you have ended that particular evil event?
What justification do you offer for prolonging it?

Reply to  MishaBurnett
May 6, 2016 5:41 pm

A late family friend was stationed in the Philippines at a POW camp. They didn’t even have to guard the POWs because they were afraid to escape.
The couple of POWs who did leave were dumped near the base in pieces. This is what the local citizens thought about the POWs after their country had been occupied during WW 2.
But revised history always sounds better.
Have anyone ever heard of the Batan Death March in the Philippines?

Tim Groves
Reply to  MishaBurnett
May 6, 2016 7:38 pm

My wife’s father was drafted into the Imperial Japanese Army as a young man during the war. In June of 1945 he deserted by failing to report for duty at a new posting and instead returned home because he, like everybody else in Japan, knew that the war was lost and just about over.
The existence of videos of training camps with elderly women and school-aged children being taught how to use farm tools as weapons might seem to indicate a “death before surrender” mentality, but their existence is also yet more evidence that the Japanese knew that the war was lost and just about over. What are such videos, anyway, but a crude propaganda effort to keep the disgruntled population from abandoning the war effort.
There is such a thing as propaganda, and in wartime it gets a lot more blatant, twisted and ugly than it does in peacetime. Almost everything most people who weren’t there have told me about WW2 has been brought to them through the lens of propaganda. But in my young days I heard snippets about the war first hand from people who were there and who didn’t appear to have an axe to grind What they said didn’t always fit the “consensus” accounts. In England, I talked with a friend’s aunt, an old Jewish lady who was a refugee from Poland. She told me insistently that both before and during the war, the Poles treated the Jews far worse than the Germans did. I once spoke with a former German soldier who had been captured by the British in Southern Africa, and he had nothing but praise for his captors. As I’ve lived in Japan for over 30 years, I’ve spoken to quite a few Japanese about their wartime experiences, although by and large it is not a subject most survivors were keen on talking about. Overwhelmingly, nobody would admit to have ever been enthusiastic about fighting but they were powerless to resist the nation’s call to arms. Overwhelmingly, they told me defeat was a personal relief because it brought the horror of war to an end. Several old soldiers told me that they had visited “comfort stations” and they swore that the girls there were treated better and paid better than the men who used their services. Asked about why Japanese soldiers didn’t surrender when overwhelmed, I was told that it was because Americans had a reputation for torturing or taking no prisoners.
I’ve heard Japanese of the wartime generations sum up the atrocities committed by all sides (including the atomic bombings) as “in wartime, people go crazy.” This is not offered as an excuse for anything, but as a reminder of the potential of human nature to commit evil and of the thinness of the veneer of civilization that we like to pride ourselves in.
Whether the atomic bombings saved lives or not can be debated ad infinitum. Arguably, dropping megatons of canned food, Hershey Bars, cigarettes and nylon stockings on the starving people Japanese cities would have been a kinder way to end the war and win the hearts and minds of the defeated. In any case, my father-in-law knew the war was all over bar the shouting in June 1945 and he felt confident that he could go AWOL without being punished.

Reply to  MishaBurnett
May 6, 2016 11:01 pm

This goes back to Frankfurt School and the Marxist idea of Domination of Nature.

Reply to  noylj2014noylj
May 6, 2016 5:43 am

No problem on the birds. Now Obama is planning to allow wind companies can slaughter 4000 bald eagles a year and countless golden eagles, hawks, owls, etc and millions of bats. Killing the bats increases mosquito populations and aids in the spread of the Zika virus, but wind turbines are more important than a few babies with birth defects. Millions of Africans dies after DDT was banned (and Africa decided if the US said it was bad they had better follow suit) and bed bugs are now munching up Americans because of a few thinning bird eggshells, but who cares? KIll the eagles, save the turbines.
The saddest part is the Audubon Society backed wind turbines (reportedly they are upset with this—little late to party there….) and most Americans will just stand by and watch the symbol of America sliced to shreds by wind turbines. Don’t overlook the fact that the symbol of America is being shredded. That’s the point.
Next time you see a wind turbine, visualize a chopped bald eagle on ground writhing in pain. It’s what the environmentalists want and what Americans apparently want too. How cruel and evil can one be? Guess we now know.

Reply to  Reality check
May 6, 2016 5:58 am

The saddest part is the Audubon Society backed wind turbines (reportedly they are upset with this—little late to party there….)

Audubon seems to have headed toward becoming a little Nature Conservancy (check out their net worth on IRS form 990 sometime). A lot of conservation groups seem to be focused on acquiring property instead of following their past charter.
The American Bird Conservancy seems to have taken over Audubon’s role of putting birds before people (or anything else).
(Note – I’m strongly opposed to wind turbines myself, especially in my local New Hampshire, but more from noise, performance, and aesthetics before slicing birds and batting bats.)

Hot Air
Reply to  Reality check
May 6, 2016 1:03 pm

You need to study Japanese culture a bit more, and look at what happened at the battle for Okinawa where women and children were jumping off cliffs rather than being captured. Watching the last Samurai will give you a hint. Letters from Iwo Jima is another one if you’re too lazy to read. The bombs saved millions of lives, the fact that it took 2 of ’em to finally make them surrender should be noted, and even then it almost didn’t happen. Without it, they would have fought to the last man rather than bear the shame of defeat, taking a large percentage of the remaining civilians with them.

Reply to  Reality check
May 6, 2016 1:29 pm

The military leadership was plotting a coup against the emperor to prevent him from agreeing to surrender.
It was a close run thing.

Reply to  Reality check
May 6, 2016 5:20 pm

Fish and Wildlife (USFW) is proposing new rules that will allow more than 4,000 eagles (Bald and Golden) per year to be killed (or injured) by the windmill industries. I haven’t seen the justification (study) for the rule allowance … does it include the peripheral deaths of the hatchlings or eggs?
Well, anyway, if it doesn’t it is only 12 per day on average. One every two hours.
And at the same time NMFS is, through the courts and the outcome of the their lawsuit against FEMA, is creating new standards (essentially laws) to protect salmon during a 100-year storm event. (The lawsuit was because FEMA, through its flood insurance program, provided statements as to weather someone would or wouldn’t need purchase flood insurance based on a theoretical material fill scenario … that’s it).
So, the federal government is working very hard to ensure that, on a 100 year basis, salmon will be “better” protected from the perils of fast flowing water … AND AT THE SAME TIME creating allowances for the killing or maiming of 12 to 15 eagles per day.

Reply to  Reality check
May 6, 2016 5:25 pm

Above is in response to Reality Check

Tim Groves
Reply to  Reality check
May 6, 2016 7:57 pm

Hot AIr: You need to study Japanese culture a bit more, and look at what happened at the battle for Okinawa where women and children were jumping off cliffs rather than being captured.
It’s called “death before dishonor!” It was once a Roman, a British and a Japanese virtue. One simply doesn’t let oneself or one’s family members fall into the hands of the enemy, particularly when that enemy has a reputation for violent rape, torture, scalping, and making tobacco pouches out of the scrotums of their victims.
If you believed you were being hunted by violent and bloodthirsty savages and had no means of defending yourselves, you and your family might very well conclude that jumping off a cliff was the best available solution to the problem at hand.

D. J. Hawkins
Reply to  noylj2014noylj
May 6, 2016 5:46 am

Regarding #4, not so fast. In the fire protection industry Halon was banned (new manufacture, anyway) for clean agent fire suppression systems. The major replacement was FM 200, also HFC-227 or HFC-227ea or heptafluoropropane. They’re going after that now as well.

Reply to  D. J. Hawkins
May 6, 2016 8:47 am

And R12 for ozone and R22 for “climate change” and the new freons just continue to get more expensive.

Reply to  noylj2014noylj
May 6, 2016 5:52 am

Thankfully, all these problems were fixed by government programs just like global warming will be fixed in a few years when the predicted warming stops. I just hope we don’t go to far and it starts getting cold again.

Reply to  Charles Hall
May 6, 2016 6:28 am

We are entering another cold cycle like the previous one we all remember so fondly if you love snow shoveling and -40 F weather like we had here in upstate NY.

Reply to  Charles Hall
May 6, 2016 11:04 am

Gov is never the answer to anything and never has been .there is no problem ,only the created ones that do not exist.Wake up and see that the world around for now is fine .we do not need all the things that is here now.we can use alternative means to achieve almost anything,but we do not need gov to solve it .We need Gov to get the hell out of the way so that people with their abilities can soar like eagles.

Reply to  Charles Hall
May 8, 2016 6:13 pm

Hey dew, what’cha smoking man?
Can I have some?

Sun Spot
Reply to  noylj2014noylj
May 6, 2016 6:50 am

Yes Noily; cAGW is a fear narrative just like previous fear narratives used to scare society into giving governments and corporations money willingly

Sun Spot
Reply to  noylj2014noylj
May 6, 2016 6:56 am

Noili , you missed the most recent and deadly fear narrative, WMD’s . The fear narrative known as weapons of mass destruction was used to start the dumbest war ever at the cost of 10’s of thousands of lives and a trillion dollars all for nought.

Janice Moore
Reply to  Sun Spot
May 6, 2016 8:53 am

Sun Spot: You are missing some key facts:
1. Saddam Hussein had used and repeatedly used WMD’s (poisonous gas) on his own people (image below is of an attack on the Kurds).
2. The liberation of Iraq was worth it. Sabotaged now by foolish B. Hussein O.’s policies, the fact remains that, at the time, it was well worth it.

Sun Spot
Reply to  Sun Spot
May 6, 2016 10:39 am

Janice Moore; and the key fact your missing is, America lost that war and no WMD’s were ever ever ever found, none nada, no WMD’s. You have to ask yourself, the poisonous gas that Saddam did have when he gassed the Kurds, where did he get it because he did not produce it himself !! America has to stop fighting wars that they end up loosing.

Reply to  Sun Spot
May 6, 2016 8:34 pm

Actually, the looney left as represented by CNN admitted that WMDs WERE found (hell, some were mentioned at the time and before that the truck convoys that were taking them to Jordan were talked about, and NOBODY questioned that they are used against the Kurds) but BUSH wouldn’t let the news out.
God, I hate folks that only believe what they hear from biased sources and don’t check the HISTORY.

Reply to  Sun Spot
May 6, 2016 11:01 am

The Big Lie about WMDs in Iraq was started by Saddam Hussein himself. He was more afraid of Iran (with whom he had fought the longest conventional war of the 20th century – the Iran/Iraq War, from September 1980 to August 1988, with estimates of up to 1.5 million killed) than he was of the US. He deliberately acted as if he was trying to hide something from the UN’s International Atomic Energy Agency (IAEA) when their inspectors were looking around, making them wait to inspect places and moving trucks out the back doors of these places while he made them wait. He knew that if he could convince the gulllible Americans, Brits, and French that he was working on nuclear weapons, then Iran would also believe it. His objective was strategic deterrence – making Iran too affraid to make another move against Iraq lest the nukes start to fall from the skies on Tehran.
Most anti-Bush ideologues are ignorant of this important historical fact, either by choice or because their favorite propaganda outlets never mentioned it.

Reply to  Sun Spot
May 6, 2016 1:08 pm

Sun Spot,
Interesting how the MSM have created so many uninformed people. The US had teams of experts in Iraq destroying the chemical weapons after the first invasion, I know one of them who is a friend of mine so they had chemical weapons. Don’t believe what MSNBC illiterates tell you. Besides Hillary and most other Democrats Including Biden (who now lies about that vote) voted to end the threat of Sadam for the region. Under Bill Clinton we still had planes flying over Iraq (being shot at) to protect the Kurds and others in southern Iraq from the brutal tactics of Sadam. We were still at war with Iraq, there was never a peace agreement from the first war when a large coalition of nations removed him from Kuwait.

Reply to  Sun Spot
May 6, 2016 1:31 pm

Both WMDs and WMD programs were found in Iraq.
Had we not invaded, the same people who are whining about the invasion were at the time demanding that the sanctions regime be dismantled.

Cal Weyers
Reply to  Sun Spot
May 6, 2016 5:03 pm

Want to know what was voted on to allow the use of military force in Iraq? Look up public law 107-243. It lays out the reasons for the invasion. Anyone in congress at the time who claims to have been mislead by GW Bush is lying. The text is very clear and concise. I worked next to a Marine reservist (after his tour of duty) who guarded chemical weaponry in Iraq at one of the munitions sites.

Reply to  Sun Spot
May 6, 2016 8:36 pm

While many people still believe the story that we never found WMDs in Iraq, even the NYT has reported that we did, but the information was classified.
By the way, Democrat leaders in Congress knew this secret while they were trashing America and our troops in order to gain power.

Reply to  Sun Spot
May 6, 2016 10:04 pm

It is utterly irrational to me, to believe that there were functional WMD in Iraq and the Administration covered that up.

Reply to  JohnKnight
May 6, 2016 11:32 pm


It is utterly irrational to me, to believe that there were functional WMD in Iraq and the Administration covered that up.

They (the Bush administration) did not “cover up” the WMD’s that were found in Iraq, and the ones that were moved to Syrian before the invasion, and the ones already used inside Iraq, Iran, and Syria in the years before the Iraqi wars, but they certainly did NOT effectively or productively publicize the tons of weapons that were found. Every Bush administration OPPONENT to the war was very effective in ignoring the WMD’s that were found, and the opponents to the war were very effective in MAINTAINING their commitment inside the international press to MAINTAIN the fiction that Weapons of Mass Destruction were never found.
Today’s “press corpse” and today’s administration ARE deliberately ignoring those weapons that were found in Iraq and in Syria, and the weapons programs that existed but were not yet in production, and are deliberately ignoring the very mess that they created in abandoning the area to Muslim extremist AFTER it was conquered and had begun returning to civilization and civilized ways. But today’s administration can be certainly accused of wanting the mess that they have created.

Reply to  Sun Spot
May 7, 2016 3:50 pm


Reply to  Sun Spot
May 8, 2016 3:45 am

Sam Grove,
If Japan was so eager to surrender, why didn’t they do so earlier? They were given a chance in July but refused. They were given another chance after the first atomic bomb was dropped and the Soviet Union declared war on them, but they refused again. The first bomb was dropped on the 6th, but the Japanese didn’t surrender until the 15th.
The Japanese military had the real power and weren’t about to surrender. In fact, they were preparing to kidnap and murder the Emperor. They’d already murdered tens of millions of civilians in China, Korea, Vietnam, Cambodia and the Philippines and were prepared to sacrifice millions of their own people for honor’s sake.
“By the time of the Trinity test, the Allied powers had already defeated Germany in Europe. Japan, however, vowed to fight to the bitter end in the Pacific, despite clear indications (as early as 1944) that they had little chance of winning. In fact, between mid-April 1945 (when President Harry Truman took office) and mid-July, Japanese forces inflicted Allied casualties totaling nearly half those suffered in three full years of war in the Pacific, proving that Japan had become even more deadly when faced with defeat. In late July, Japan’s militarist government rejected the Allied demand for surrender put forth in the Potsdam Declaration, which threatened the Japanese with “prompt and utter destruction” if they refused.”

Hocus Locus
Reply to  noylj2014noylj
May 6, 2016 9:51 am

On #4, let us not forget that CFCs have only just been phased out in asthma inhalers and asthma sufferers claim the new delivery mechanism for albuterol is a costly disimprovement. Aye, ’tis always the innocent that must suffer. Just what percentage of global ozone depletion was attributed to these occasional CO2-emitting asthma population? Perhaps they’re not suffering enough for what they done to the planet, additional punitive measures may be necessary.

Reply to  noylj2014noylj
May 6, 2016 11:18 am

Japan actually tried to surrender before the bombs were used, with the proviso that they keep their emperor. Truman insisted upon unconditional surrender…and let them keep their emperor anyway.

Reply to  Sam Grove
May 6, 2016 12:04 pm

does the photo up above not appear to be staged?

Reply to  Sam Grove
May 6, 2016 12:33 pm

Dew, which photo, the one with the dead bodies, starting to bloat, laying everywhere or the one with the woman holding up here purple finger indicating she voted?

Douglas Lampert
Reply to  Sam Grove
May 6, 2016 1:10 pm

No, Japan offered (indirectly) to DISCUSS possibly surrendering on terms if they could retain the Emperor, Manchuria, and various other holdings. There was never any offer to surrender under any terms prior to the dropping of the bombs.

Reply to  Sam Grove
May 6, 2016 1:13 pm

Neither, we saw these on video’s on the evening news. Where were you?

Hocus Locus
Reply to  Sam Grove
May 7, 2016 6:48 am

Douglas Lampert: No, Japan offered (indirectly) to DISCUSS possibly surrendering on terms if they could retain the Emperor, Manchuria, and various other holdings. There was never any offer to surrender under any terms prior to the dropping of the bombs.

IS correct, thank you.
Be wary of sources that push this ‘Japan tried to surrender’ revisionist meme that have been circulating. No matter where it originated, it has been taken up by a large mass of persons, principally Americans these days, who are anti-nuclear-anything (flat obvious fact) but also anti-American (my own view) to deliberately cast the USA as ‘sole evil aggressor’ for its decision to use atomic weapons, and retroactively declare such to be a war crime… It is a cheap tactic that does not seem to be motivated by self-effacing moral reflection. I’ve seen it crop up more often in discussions of nuclear energy than nuclear weapons, which pretty well says (to me) that those fronting it are not doing so to help re-calibrate our moral compass. They’re just grasping at the most emotional anti-nuclear topic they can think of to monopolize discussion.
Emperor Hirohito was considering surrender but did not have any support from his ministers or generals, even after the atomic bombings. If it were not for a few loyal servants who turned the tide during the Kyūjō incident the Emperor would likely have become a casualty by the hands of his own people.
The revisionists also cheapen and distort the motives of the war-weary people of Japan as they welcomed and embraced MacArthur. I agree it is not very comfortable and palatable, the idea that the Hiroshima and Nagasaki saved lives in the end, principally Japanese lives, for otherwise the war would would have ended after a great many more atrocities and losses on all sides. I’d even go so far as to call it an inconvenient truth, but that term seems to taste funny these days.

Reply to  Sam Grove
May 7, 2016 7:12 pm

This is what J.F.C. Fuller, one of the past century’s most respected military historians, had to say about the bombing of Hiroshima (August 6, 1945) and Nagasaki (August 9, 1945):
“There can be little doubt, had it not been for the strategical myopia induced by the policy of unconditional surrender, that the war would have ended in May 1945, and it was vital that it should end in May [as proposed by J.C. Grew, Acting Secretary of State], were a profitable allied peace in the Far East to be won… Had it done so, there would have been no need to drop the two atomic bombs…” (The Conduct of War, 1789-1961, 1961, Da Capo edition, 1992, p.303)
Also: “Belatedly, it has been disclosed that seven months before [the bomb on Hiroshima] was dropped, President Roosevelt received via General MacArthur’s headquarters an offer by the Japanese Government to surrender on terms virtually identical to those accepted by the Unites States after the dropping of the bomb [i.e. Japan surrenders but keeps its emperor]… It is certain that Truman did not give the order for it to be dropped on the insistence of his military advisers. [Some scientists] were in favour because, they urged, only by a test in war conditions could it be demonstrated that their long and costly efforts had succeeded in creating a weapon of unique power for taking human life.” (F.J.P. Veale, Advance to Barbarism, The Development of Total Warfare from Sarajevo to Hiroshima, 1953, ed. 2013,p.341)

Bill Powers
Reply to  noylj2014noylj
May 6, 2016 12:40 pm

The real irony is that even the Government and it’s dutiful agents of CAGW end of days propaganda admit that it/they can’t control the climate. The Climate cycles and has done so since before the discovery of fossil fuel; hence, restricting mans use of fossil fuel will not enable the government to prevent climate change. At the opposite end of the spectrum the real threat, which is the next cycle into an ice age, cannot be mitigated by adding more CO2 to the atmosphere. Those who own the government want control over our lives, plain and simple and they have paid handsomely for agents to whip up this story of CO2 in order to dupe the foolish into believing by controlling CO2 they can control the climate.

Reply to  noylj2014noylj
May 6, 2016 3:59 pm

Sorry but # four is bull.

Reply to  noylj2014noylj
May 8, 2016 6:08 pm

Apocalypticism has been about a lot longer than that!
Check out the Book of Revelations for example, the Four Horsemen and all that good stuff.

May 6, 2016 3:31 am

As money gets tighter I think many will show their true colors. It is easier to hide greed when there is heaps of money to go around. It is like hiding gluttony when everyone gets five meals a day, but then suddenly there is only one chop left on the platter; that is when the pushing and shoving starts.
The thing we need is the power of discernment. We have to see the worthwhile scientists and studies midst all the pretenders, or we will throw the baby out with the bathwater.

Reply to  Caleb
May 6, 2016 6:58 am

We have to see the worthwhile scientists and studies midst all the pretenders
you cannot hand out money ahead of results without creating corruption.
rather than spend $100 million a year on research, why not offer a $ 1 billion dollar prize to anyone that delivers a solution?
that will get people to invest their own money, which they will make sure delivers value, rather than politicians handing out other people’s money to whomever makes the biggest contribution to their reelection.

Reply to  ferdberple
May 6, 2016 11:07 am

very good point indeed!

Reply to  ferdberple
May 6, 2016 1:20 pm

Ferd, excellent point. The wasted money from the Government is astronomical and the results are “scientists” are doing the bidding of the politicians and getting rich in the meantime. Over $ 20 billion every year for climate change wasted, with no results..

Reply to  Caleb
May 6, 2016 7:01 am

the classic example is the wright bros, who built the first airplane with $2k of their own money, while the government poured tens of thousands of dollars into a failed effort by the politically connected governor of the Smithsonian.

Reply to  ferdberple
May 6, 2016 11:08 am

apparently they like cash cows that never come thru with results.

May 6, 2016 4:31 am

Thanks, Josh. Still smiling as I write this.

Bruce Cobb
May 6, 2016 4:38 am

How they REALLY frame it:
Dear Sheeple,
Shut up.
Do as we say (not as we do) or we are doomed.
Trust us, we’re the experts.
The 97%.

May 6, 2016 5:23 am

Communicating CAGW – whole university departments pondering this problem as we speak. To bad I wasn’t there to advise them right at the beginning. Only one piece of advice required – DON’T LIE. Far, far too late now, and the lying still continues.

May 6, 2016 5:30 am
Roy Jones
May 6, 2016 5:51 am

“There is a fairly persistent alarmist idea that if only ‘Climate Change’ was properly communicated then everyone would believe all the hype, spin and misinformation and ignore the politicking, the dodgy science, and the duff statistics.”
They have a point. If they were better liars more people would believe their lies.
I can’t fault their logic; only their integrity.

Bruce Cobb
Reply to  Roy Jones
May 6, 2016 6:03 am

Hey,give credit where credit is due. They’ve been pretty good liars, mixing in just the right amount of truth to make it believable for the unwary. The biggest problem has been their control over information. While they managed to lock up the MSM, they never could figure out a way to shut it down on the internet.

Reply to  Bruce Cobb
May 6, 2016 6:16 am

All a l1ar needs is a lab coat and the complicit press.

Janice Moore
Reply to  Bruce Cobb
May 6, 2016 8:37 am

… a lab coat… some safety glasses… and a lot of hot air.
“Climate 101” Experiment under “Science” Guy, Bill Nye’s supervision
“Mr. Gore claimed in the MNN interview on 9/14{/11}: It’s not a hoax, it’s high school physics.” (See below-linked WUWT article)
(See just how much “science” Nye did that day, here: )

Reply to  Bruce Cobb
May 6, 2016 9:35 am

A lab coat is the emperor’s new clothing.

Janice Moore
Reply to  Bruce Cobb
May 6, 2016 5:37 pm

Roger Knights: Apt comparison.
Also, lab coats are usually white,
like (bleached) sheep skins…

Johann Wundersamer
May 6, 2016 6:20 am

trust me, I’m literate.

Johann Wundersamer
May 6, 2016 6:40 am

When everybody knows nowadays farmers couldn’t compete worldwide without basic competence in chemistry, biology, logistic knowledge and Support of functioning Stock markets.
Open secrets no one dares 2 speak out loud.

Reply to  Johann Wundersamer
May 6, 2016 7:17 am

This is all it takes to lose your job:

Reply to  ferdberple
May 6, 2016 8:02 am

That is a great biting cartoon!
Too bad the guy got canned for it…

Reply to  ferdberple
May 6, 2016 1:39 pm

The CEOs of 5 of the largest companies in the country made more money combined than did 2000 family farms?
So what?
Are you arguing that those CEOs are over paid? If so, then take your complaints to the stockholders of those companies. It’s their money that is being spent.

Reply to  Johann Wundersamer
May 6, 2016 11:25 am

My grand father was a cotton farmer and he was very good at it .he after years of farming other people lands and picking other people lands saved enough to get his own farm.He planted all cotton ,other than the garden he used for food for his family.About the time Monsanto came along and Gov officials came to him and told him that he had to plant other things ,that cotton was being fazed out.Well my Grandfather sold his land and started drawing his social security,he said he was good at cotton farming and if he could not do that ,he would do nothing else.We are talking about a man that would pick his farm and pick everyone else that would let him.Him and his sons were fast pickers for the day ,by hand of course.from what i see ,cotton is still being farmed .apparently the synthetic need and require certain amount of cotton to be fire retardant.He just simply was not going to be told what he could or could not do with land he paid as far as i am concerned ,they can stick their logistics and chemical knowledge where the sun does not shine.

Janice Moore
May 6, 2016 8:02 am

Well done, Josh (as usual).
This “our problem is only HOW we communicate it, not our message itself” talk is not a genuine, hand-wringingly heartfelt, concern on the part of the Envirostalinists. It is only another ploy of deception. The false, underlying, premise: “our message is true,” is their main communication goal with this.
They are communicating quite cunningly, here.
It reeks of subtlety.
Good for you to expose it!
Listen up, AGW sc@mmers:
You will never win.
Truth wins — every time.
Here’s a little clear communication for you:
Game over.
Bwah, ha, ha, ha, haaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa!

May 6, 2016 8:22 am

The main thing about living in today’s world that scares me is the ease with which politicians seem able to pull the wool over the eyes of the sheeple – and yet still they vote for them.

Hocus Locus
May 6, 2016 9:13 am

The ENSO meter is moving!
Is it steam powered?
Shall I quench the boiler or open a relief valve?
Standing by.

May 6, 2016 9:16 am

Luc Ozade….the amazing thing is that ALL the pundits and ALL the “experts” and ALL the political specialists started out last year claiming that Bernie and Trump didn’t stand a chance in the presidential primaries and here we are. ALL those guys missed the main point about Americans being so sick and tired of “politics as usual” to the point that voting outside the political establishment left or right has become the “new normal”. Bernie and Trump are symbols that the American electorate is fed up.

Reply to  fossilsage
May 6, 2016 9:30 am

fossilage – I hope you’re right. But he (Trump) has still got to get over the line. I’m not usually a pessimistic person but in the light of previous elections (of which I have experienced many), I shall await the result with interest (as an outsider, being in the UK).

Reply to  Luc Ozade (@Luc_Ozade)
May 6, 2016 9:31 am

Sorry, fossilsage, left out an ‘s’. 🙂

Reply to  Luc Ozade (@Luc_Ozade)
May 6, 2016 9:47 am

Luc …That’s alright fossilage is probably more descriptive anyway.

Reply to  Luc Ozade (@Luc_Ozade)
May 6, 2016 10:02 am

fossilage is probably more descriptive anyway.
LOL. That makes two of us…

Reply to  Luc Ozade (@Luc_Ozade)
May 6, 2016 10:22 am

..I’ll make it a TRIO !!

Reply to  Luc Ozade (@Luc_Ozade)
May 6, 2016 12:13 pm

All trump has to do is keep pissing in the oats of the so called political elite and he will get in .i do not know how much he will accomplish after that ,but his mouth will get him in office.

Reply to  Luc Ozade (@Luc_Ozade)
May 6, 2016 12:58 pm

Marcus: /me chuckles. Welcome to ‘the club’.
dew: Probably right… it’s gonna be interesting!

May 6, 2016 10:49 am

What is simply not understood by anybody who believes in ‘consensus’ science is that some people (nearly all skeptics) have been trained in a skill called ‘critical thinking’ – essentially a vaccine against communicable diseases of the intellect.
No amount of rhetoric or persuasion will induce them to accept anything which they can readily demonstrate to themselves is incorrect.
Climate change alarmism is a communicable disease of the intellect.

Reply to  tadchem
May 6, 2016 12:01 pm

I have never not once believed the lie that comes from the agenda 21 or 2030 or any other bullshit floating sludge of environmental lunacy.
2640 or so nuclear bombs have been tested, most of which were above ground. the desert and all it’s animals are still there. John Wayne or Marion Morrison thought they have caused him cancer. it was not with the bomb that they did. It was with fluoride that they have caused so much death.
Viruses that they the Gov releases for their so called control of population and vaccines that cause as much problems that it solves . Environmentalism Is a mental Health issue. They are mental and need or require help. The talk about patents running out, hell Russia has absolute unrestrained access to our patent office and has had since 1947 agreements.
The lunatics are trying to sell property that is privately owned, so they invent crap to get folks off their land and either shoot and kill them for noncompliance or jail them for felonies that are fake to begin with. The christian and non christian alike will purchase and prepare for a fight that is coming sooner or later.
In my own opinion, Gov is dangerous. try building off grid system and see how the gov close and far panic and wind up tress passing you from your own property. They have the resources to fight years upon years and you will dwindle anything you have trying to stand alone against them, it is only when we the people stand together that they back off. Environmentalist are all through out the Gov and are willing to show you that you are not free.
Of course only a fool would believe such a thing while there is a tax anywhere on personal income. Legislation after legislation compounds the life of all, now you have to go to college and get a degree in carpentry and spend years working for another man managing his properties and buildings in order to go out and begin building homes and still they build crap homes that a 85 mph wind can destroy and of course easily burn down.
We are regulated to death and they wonder why their economies have sunk. Complete idiots if you ask me ,but i am a nobody country boy in backwoods of nowhere! TVA is selling Bellefont nuclear plant, who the hell are they going to sell it too other than the Chinese or some other foreign interest that can operate it without the possibility of retribution from the surrounding area? An already failed plant in design; TVA a bureaucracy that never should have ever been created by anyone. TVA can tresspass on your own land, that is how much authority that has been given to the bureaucracy of TVA. They can all go the way of extinction in my book !

Reply to  dew
May 6, 2016 1:45 pm

Wow, so much paranoia in such a small package.

Reply to  dew
May 6, 2016 1:45 pm

If your gonna rant, try and make it coherent. Proper grammar, punctuation, etc., helps.

Reply to  dew
May 7, 2016 7:06 am

Do you live in the Tennessee Valley? I would have guessed Asia.

Reply to  dew
May 8, 2016 6:19 pm

Ah, I bet it was the 1976 black microdot, dew!
Am I right?

May 6, 2016 10:50 am

That cartoon needs to be on a T-shirt! Well done!!

John Robertson
May 6, 2016 11:18 am

Thank you Josh.
You frame the Climate Change message perfectly.

May 6, 2016 12:13 pm

I would be willing to donate to a Not-Al Gore-Climate Con fund if it had all the right openness and legitimate science education program to counter the great con game.

May 6, 2016 1:28 pm

Sometimes the C in CAGW should stand for Corruption. Sometimes of the noble-cause kind, sometimes of the ignoble kind. Read the manifesto from the Panama Papers whistleblower:
It’s different but just the same.
Is anybody surprised? The establishment protects itself. The Climate Change message is established.

May 6, 2016 5:35 pm

Sun Spot, May 6, 2016 at 10:39 am wrote: “Janice Moore; and the key fact your missing is, America lost that war and no WMD’s were ever ever ever found, none nada, no WMD’s. You have to ask yourself, the poisonous gas that Saddam did have when he gassed the Kurds, where did he get it because he did not produce it himself !! America has to stop fighting wars that they end up losing.”
Sunspot, America did not lose the Iraq war, President Obama gave it away, by failing to protect the peace and security that George W. Bush had established in Iraq by 2008.
Others have addressed your comment about there not being any WMD’s, so I don’t need to.
Thanks, Janice Moore, for the picture of the happy Iraqi showing her purple finger after participating in her first free election in Iraq, thanks to the U.S. military and President George W. Bush. I wonder where that woman is now, with President Obama in charge. Probably dead.
Yep, the U.S. military won the war and the Liberals got in power and threw all the progress away. Just like they did in South Vietnam.
The lesson: NEVER allow Liberals to handle U.S. national security. They are not up to the job psychologically, and have proven it over and over again.
Obama is a perfect example of just how screwed up a delusional Liberal can make things. He turned Iraq from a Bush success story, into an Obama ongoing horror story of monumental proportions. The end of this tragedy is not in sight. Certainly not while a Liberal is in Office.

Janice Moore
Reply to  TA
May 6, 2016 8:59 pm

Well, TA, how kind of you to say so. My pleasure. And, to all you wrote above, amen. Sadly, amen. I wonder where that beaming young woman is, indeed…

Reply to  Janice Moore
May 7, 2016 1:00 pm

Yes, her and millions of others, dead or walking to Europe.
It didn’t have to happen. Iraq could have been secured with very little effort on Obama’s part, but he wasn’t interested.
President Bush in 2007, gave a State of the Union speech in which he outlined the horrors that would occur were the United States to abandon Iraq. Anyone interested in this subject has to read that speech.
This was during the time when Hillary Clinton, John Kerry and all the other Liberals in Congress were trying to undermine the war. Then Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid famously said: “This war is lost!”, as part of his speech trying to cut off funds for the surge of American troops that Bush wanted in order to defeat the Bathists and Al Qaeda in Iraq. Which turned into a huge success, despite the obstruction of the Liberals.
The horrors Bush described in his speech have pretty much played out as he described: Tens of thousands of innocent people murdered; millions of people displaced from their homes, which then puts pressure on surrounding nations as they try to cope with the influx of refugees.
Bush also predicted the resurgence of Al Qaeda in Iraq, which Bush had successfully defeated and reduced to a force of less than 100 fanatics who fled to Syria. After Obama bugged out of Iraq, this remnant became the resurgent Islamic Terror Army we are plagued with today. All predictable and predicted.
Obama should have paid attention to Bush’s speech, but, Obama is the smartest guy in the world, so he didn’t bother, and now we have what we have.

Dr. S. Jeevananda Reddy
May 6, 2016 9:52 pm

Right now [peak of summer] in India snowing at Sonamar/Kashmir, North Sikkim, Drass/Kashmir, Zuluku/East Sikkim, Rohtang/Himachal Pradesh.
Dr. S. Jeevananda Reddy

David Ball
Reply to  Dr. S. Jeevananda Reddy
May 6, 2016 10:05 pm

Thank you for the update from that part of the world, Dr.S.J.Reddy.

Reply to  David Ball
May 7, 2016 1:12 pm

Yes, thanks Dr. Reddy. I love hearig about what is going on all around the world.
From Tornado Alley USA: It looks like a fairly mild extreme weather season this year so far. Our first real chance at widespread severe weather and tornadoes, last week, fizzled out and barely produced a couple of F1 tornadoes.
We have another weather front coming into Tornado Alley in a couple of days, but it is not looking to be high energy either.
The focus of the weather fronts seems to be moving north, and it looks like high pressure is trying to build up which will put an end to the tornado weather once established.
The entire 21st century has been a time of fewer tornadoes and less powerful tornadoes and that trend seems to be continuing. I would guess this is related to a cooler atmosphere. There seems to be a correlation. And we are seeing a lot of “cooling” reports from around the world.

May 8, 2016 6:40 pm

The genius of the climate scam is that it started with a nonexistent problem , proven with manipulated data, and can be solved with taxes since there wasn’t a problem to begin with. You’ve gotta hand it to these guys , it’s marketing genius.

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