Pope Francis Apparently Doesn’t Know IPCC Climate Objective Contradicts Catholic Doctrine.

Guest Opinion: Dr. Tim Ball

Pope Francis advocates the global warming agenda of the UN Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change (IPCC), with the help of the Obama White House. Apparently, he doesn’t know their ultimate objective of reducing and controlling population generally contradicts Catholic doctrine. The irony is that as a Jesuit, the ideological church police, he should know, but apparently, his personal, political and economic perspective trumps it. He also doesn’t appear to know that population control comes naturally with industrial and economic development.

Coercion of the Pope to the global warming message likely began with John Kerry’s visit to the Vatican, ostensibly to discuss Middle East issues. The Boston Globe researched Kerry during his Presidential run and discovered that,

The Kerry family was traced back to a small town in the Austrian empire, now part of the Czech Republic. There, the paper discovered that before immigrating to America, the Kerrys changed their name from Kohn and converted from Judaism to Catholicism.

His Catholicism caused him much political trouble during his presidential campaign. Now the Obama administration has taken the next step, which is standard in the entire development of the IPCC climate campaign, by involving the top bureaucrat of the Environmental Protection Agency (EPA), Gina McCarthy.

EPA Administrator Gina McCarthy told reporters that her aim in visiting was to show the Vatican how aligned President Barack Obama and Francis are on climate change. She said she wanted to stress that global warming isn’t just an environmental issue, but a public health threat, and yet also a chance for economic opportunity.

The last comment parallels the political objective identified by Canadian Environment Minister Christine Stewart, who said,

“No matter if the science of global warming is all phony… climate change provides the greatest opportunity to bring about justice and equality in the world.”

These objectives appeal to a man familiar with the slums and poverty of Argentina. The problem is the more likely objective is to eliminate the people in them. Consider Prince Philip’s quote;

I just wonder what it would be like to be reincarnated in an animal whose species had been so reduced in numbers than it was in danger of extinction. What would be its feelings toward the human species whose population explosion had denied it somewhere to exist… I must confess that I am tempted to ask for reincarnation as a particularly deadly virus.

I recommend the list begin with monarchs.

Religious and political analogies abound between environmentalism and its subset, global warming. Former Czech Republic President, Vaclav Klaus, who gave the keynote address at the first Heartland Climate Conference in New York, warned about the growing trend.

Nevertheless, there is another threat on the horizon. I see this threat in environmentalism, which is becoming a new dominant ideology, if not a religion. Its main weapon is raising the alarm and predicting the human life endangering climate change based on man-made global warming.

Figure 1 shows how, as usual, cartoonists see the trend ahead of most and are able to comment without fear, until recently.

clip_image002

Figure 1

I wrote about similar parallels between religion and global warming by comparing Al Gore to the Pardoner, in Chaucer’s (c.1342 – 1400) The Canterbury Tales. Gore pushed carbon credits like The Pardoner pushed indulgences or pardons, hence his name. Here is Paul Johnson’s description of the Pardoner.

“The Pardoner, a seller of indulgences, is a complete and shameless rogue; but Chaucer, not content with exposing his impudence, shows how good he was at his job and how powerfully he preached against sinfulness. The Pardoner had also been taught to use the figure of death to scare his hearers.”

The opening lines of the Pardoner’s Tale provide the parallel with the Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change (IPCC) message.

“My lords, he said, in churches where I preach

I cultivate a haughty kind of speech

And wring it out as roundly as a bell;

I’ve got it all by heart, detail I tell.

I have a text, it always is the same

And always has been since I learned the game,

Old as the hills and fresher than the grass,

Radix malorum est cupiditas.”

(“greed is the root of evils”)

The Club of Rome (COR) took the Malthusian idea that world population would outgrow food resources and expanded it to all resources. They sponsored the 1972 book Limits To Growth, which was a forerunner to the IPCC Reports approach. It used simple linear trends for population and resources to project catastrophic projections. They used computer models to create the illusion of scientific accuracy.

The argument was twofold. Pressure on resources was occurring simply by natural rates of population increase, and developed nations were using the resources at an accelerated rate. The goal was also twofold. Reduce population overall and reduce industrialization that caused the increased demand on resources.

First and foremost of the Club of Rome Neo-Malthusians was Paul Ehrlich, whose 1968 book, The Population Bomb, became the bible for environmentalists. It also convinced most people, even though virtually all its predictions were wrong, that the world was overpopulated. Ehrlich also co-authored a book, Ecoscience: Population, Resources, Environment, with the person, John Holdren, who continues the fight, but from a position of power as Obama’s Science Czar. It is entirely likely that he is pushing Obama, Kerry and the EPA among others on the climate agenda.

What were some of the views on population Holdren set out in the book?

“• Women could be forced to abort their pregnancies, whether they wanted to or not;

• The population at large could be sterilized by infertility drugs intentionally put into the nation’s drinking water or in food;

• Single mothers and teen mothers should have their babies seized from them against their will and given away to other couples to raise;

• People who “contribute to social deterioration” (i.e. undesirables) “can be required by law to exercise reproductive responsibility” — in other words, be compelled to have abortions or be sterilized.

• A transnational “Planetary Regime” should assume control of the global economy and also dictate the most intimate details of Americans’ lives — using an armed international police force.”

Most Americans would oppose such measures, so Holdren had a solution to bypass them, using the shield of the Constitution.

Indeed, it has been concluded that compulsory population-control laws, even including laws requiring compulsory abortion, could be sustained under the existing Constitution if the population crisis became sufficiently severe to endanger the society.

Who concluded that such laws “could be sustained”? The answer is Holdren and his cohorts. But they also control the justification for action, because Holdren decides when “the population crisis became sufficiently severe to endanger society”.

Holdren disavowed all these beliefs at his Senate confirmation hearings and in additional press releases, which said in part,

“This material is from a three-decade-old, three-author college textbook. Dr. Holdren addressed this issue during his confirmation when he said he does not believe that determining optimal population is a proper role of government. Dr. Holdren is not and never has been an advocate for policies of forced sterilization.”

Notice that Holdren doesn’t disavow his view on overpopulation. He only says, government shouldn’t control it, especially with forced sterilization. Clearly, he still thinks overpopulation is a problem.

In a larger sense, it doesn’t matter because major policy positions and global conferences continue with incorrect claims about overpopulation. It is central to the Principles of Agenda 21 set out in, what else, a Synthesis Report. It triggered the UN international population conference in Cairo in November 1994, with Vice President Al Gore leading the US delegation. One interesting comment about the Cairo conference, that shows some things haven’t changed, was this cryptic note.

Despite dire predictions that the conference would be the focus of attack by Islamic militants, there were no violent incidents.

Little else has changed either. Proponents of the IPCC and their anthropogenic global warming (AGW) hypothesis continue their crusade (pun intended) by inveigling the support of authority figures, like the Pope and by inference, associated groups. These are classic, appeals to authority, like Lord May’s use of the Royal Society to persuade other science societies to support the AGW cause.

Most members of the Societies didn’t know what their leaders were doing and many demanded retraction or at least restatement. Many of the parishioners are rebelling against religious involvement. A few years ago, members of the Catholic Church of Scotland, who were annoyed that their bishop had directed priests to preach against global warming, approached me. Their view was biblical,

“Render to Caesar the things that are Caesar’s, and to God the things that are God’s.”

The Pope apparently did not think through his commitment to the IPCC claims as expounded by the Obama White House. Likely, he was easily persuaded, because so much of the false claims fit his socialist ideology. He tried to walk back his commitment by jokingly suggesting he was not promoting population control. He said,

“Some think, excuse me if I use the word, that in order to be good Catholics, we have to be like rabbits…but no,”

He later backtracked on this comment.

Wednesday, he seemed to pull back from that statement. Speaking of his recent trip to the Philippines, where he presided over the largest mass in history, he said “it gives consolation and hope to see so many numerous families who receive children as a real gift of God. They know that every child is a benediction.”

He called “simplistic” the belief that large families were the cause of poverty, blaming it instead on an unjust economic system. “We can all say that the principal cause of poverty is an economic system that has removed the person from the center, and put the god of money there instead.”

This comment appears to show further lack of understanding, created by an idée fixe.

Ironically, both the IPCC and the Pope fail to recognize the proven dynamics of the Demographic Transition. This theory basically shows that population decreases naturally when industrial economic development is allowed. The key is it must be allowed without interference from government or the church as this author explains.

As with all models, the demographic transition model has its problems. The model does not provide “guidelines” as to how long it takes a country to get from Stage I to III. Western European countries took centuries though some rapidly developing countries like the Economic Tigers are transforming in mere decades. The model also does not predict that all countries will reach Stage III and have stable low birth and death rates. There are factors such as religion that keep some countries’ birth rate from dropping.

The good news is, most Catholics are not listening. In Catholic countries, the population rate has declined considerably. Reportedly, the best measure is the Total Fertility Rate (TFR), the expected number of children born per woman in her child-bearing years.

Taken globally, the total fertility rate at replacement is 2.33 children per woman. At this rate, global population growth would tend towards zero.

Fertility rates for four predominantly catholic countries are;

Poland – 1.41

Hungary – 1.41

Italy – 1.48

France – 1.98

But the Pope doesn’t need to worry; Italy, France, and other European nations are offsetting the decline with Muslim immigrants with higher TFRs.

Apparently, the Pope could learn from the French philosopher Montesquieu. He reportedly said, whenever he was tempted to talk about something on which he had little knowledge, he remembered his personal guideline. Never talk to other men about his wife, because they might be more knowledgeable on the subject than he was. Maybe the problem for perspective is that the Pope doesn’t have a wife.

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February 1, 2015 9:00 am

Tony – the hapless Canadian Envirominister hasn’t been in office for 15 years…

Reply to  Lemon
February 1, 2015 9:19 am

Note the author of the article/opinion piece…

RTB
February 1, 2015 9:02 am

I think we can safely ignore anyone who believes that parthenogenesis in humans is real.

mebbe
Reply to  RTB
February 1, 2015 9:39 am

RTB
I don’t agree that we can safely ignore them. There’s a lot of them.
On a lot of issues that we have to address together peculiar notions concerning the origins of the universe, life, moral codes and so on don’t interfere, but there are plenty of instances where political stances are strongly influenced by religious belief. We’ve been seeing some of that in the news lately!

RTB
Reply to  mebbe
February 1, 2015 10:39 am

You’re probably right.

Reply to  RTB
February 1, 2015 9:39 am

Well, as a one off that is specifically designated as being outside the bounds of normal experience – we can’t. Not that it can be proven, therefore, just that such singular events cannot be proven never to have happened. The rules of induction do not apply.
If parthenogenesis in humans was considered to be an everyday occurrence then the evidence would call for a more sceptical response.
Anyway, the church is huge. It is not wise to ignore it.

Steve Reddish
Reply to  RTB
February 1, 2015 9:46 am

RTB,
No one believes that parthenogenesis has any relationship to Jesus, as that would make his birth accidental. Strawman arguments reveal desperation.
SR

Steve Reddish
Reply to  Steve Reddish
February 1, 2015 10:03 am

Parthenogenesis also only produces females. Another reason for irrelevancy to Jesus.
SR

RTB
Reply to  Steve Reddish
February 1, 2015 10:37 am

What about transubstantiation?
It’s very odd that so many climate sceptics (I would also describe myself as such) will happily question shakey scientific hypotheses yet except that a bread wafer and a cup of cheap red wine can turn into the ACTUAL flesh and blood of a bronze age middle-eastern tribesman. And do so without a sceptical thought in their heads. Mind boggling!
I’m not desperate to prove or disprove anything, people have a right to believe in whatever they want and I have a right to challenge them about it. In fact I’m sure we share a lot of common disbeliefs, Zeus, Wotan, Thor etc etc so you’re heading in the right direction ☺

Steve Reddish
Reply to  RTB
February 1, 2015 10:32 am

The Catholic Church’s hierarchy is often politically motivated. Politics is the real basis for CAGW alarmism. We should counter CAGW with scientific evidence.
Opposing the Pope’s religion, or atheism verses Christianity, is a separate topic irrelevant to CAGW alarmism.
SR

Alberta Slim
Reply to  Steve Reddish
February 1, 2015 8:02 pm

No. It is up to the CAGW Alarmists to provide the PROOF of AGW.
They have not because they cannot. The GHG Theory is a hypothesis that has not been proven empirically.

February 1, 2015 9:09 am

Before the Colombian Exchange and Industrial Revolution climate change was the principal population control, followed by plague and war. Leptis Magna supplied the wheat and olives for the Roman dole. Global cooling wiped it out, along with most of the population of North Africa. The LIA was destructive enough for Europe and China, but would have been worse without Andean potatoes. Climate change is still lethal to cultures that don’t benefit from fossil fuels, whether it’s freeze or drought, though in recent decades drought has been the killer. North Africa has been drying up for thousands of years, off and on, but it does much better in a warmer climate. So does Greenland.
So turn up the heat! –AGF

February 1, 2015 9:14 am

“… he is a full-blown communist”
Pope Francis, like many Jesuits, is very liberal-minded and has supported many liberal causes. He apparently encourage Obama to “liberate” Cuba from the U.S. embargo.
But, curiously, he has always taken a somewhat dim view of the “liberation theology” priests in South America, many of whom openly embrace communism.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pope_Francis#Liberation_theology

Reply to  Johanus
February 1, 2015 9:48 am

indeed. having worked in many countries as well as several latin ones it does not surprise me. communists only go for the liberation theology if they have secumbed to it through local exposure. or it helps them locally. most countries I find are very racist in putting their people first except north america and parts of europe.
it’s not just their soccer teams they cheer.

icouldnthelpit
February 1, 2015 9:19 am

(A wasted posting effort by a banned sockpuppet. Comment DELETED. -mod)

r murphy
Reply to  icouldnthelpit
February 1, 2015 9:50 am

The fact that Dr. Ball has the courage to speak out about the behind the scenes machinations of the elites does not indicate a weakness of mind but rather incredible courage to speak truth to power, Elites collude, always have, always will, to believe otherwise is incredibly naive.

icouldnthelpit
Reply to  r murphy
February 1, 2015 10:07 am

(A wasted posting effort by a banned sockpuppet. Comment DELETED. -mod)

BFL
Reply to  r murphy
February 1, 2015 10:41 am

It’s not that the moon landings were actually faked, but that the government would have been fully and immorally capable of doing it if they had decided too. That knowledge makes it all too easy to believe many of the “supposedly” loony conspiracy theories because who really knows for sure…….

hunter
Reply to  icouldnthelpit
February 1, 2015 11:02 am

You can’t help being a troll, can you?

Mike Henderson
Reply to  hunter
February 1, 2015 12:04 pm

His DNA.

David Ball
Reply to  hunter
February 1, 2015 7:56 pm

They just do not understand whose side they are on. It’s weird.

Pieter Folkens
February 1, 2015 9:31 am

One of the most important of Tim’s comments was citing Canada’s Christine Stewart, “No matter if the science of global warming is all phony… climate change provides the greatest opportunity to bring about justice and equality in the world.” This recalls the IPCC’s Ottmar Edenhofer when he said it was not about saving the environment, but about the “de facto distribution of the world’s resources through climate policy.” It goes back to the Club of Rome’s publication, “The First Global Revolution” in 1990, in which they write about coming up with a struggle that all the disparate nations could get behind. As they said, “in need not be a real one” but only “suitable for the purpose.” Climate change was identified as one suitable for the purpose. That publication was made available at the first Rio Conference.
We can discuss the science and the numbers until we are blue in the face, but it all comes down to the political march towards global Socialism. All the IPCC intended to do was put a science-based justification on that agenda.

Reply to  Pieter Folkens
February 1, 2015 10:11 am

“Climate change” is the underlying justification for the UN’s Agenda 21.
The UN’s Agenda 21 is the Trojan horse of international collectivism.
Green is the new Red.
What they couldn’t do with tanks and guns, they now do with ‘sustainability’ and ‘regionalism.’
I think Rosa Koire’s book “Behind the Green Mask” is spot-on. Everyone should read it, and check out her videos. The woman rocks.

Dawtgtomis
February 1, 2015 9:40 am

Anybody remember the “W.W.J.D.?” movement?
Seems like it doesn’t apply to Christian perspective as much as it used to.
Maybe it was just a fad which ran it’s course and became obsolete.

Steve Reddish
Reply to  Dawtgtomis
February 1, 2015 9:51 am

Dawtgtomis,
Relevance? Point?
SR

Dawtgtomis
Reply to  Steve Reddish
February 1, 2015 10:37 am

I guess my point is that the Pope is supposed to be more like Jesus in his actions and words then anybody on Earth. Or at least that’s what my parochial schooling impressed on me. So WWJD?

Steve Reddish
Reply to  Steve Reddish
February 3, 2015 10:30 am

Dawtgtomis,
Now I understand. As I am not Catholic, I never associated the WWJD attitude with the Pope, since it arose within the evangelical community.
My reading of the Gospels gives me the the understanding that Jesus forgave individuals, telling them to sin no more, while telling the church hierarchy to stay out of politics and not to impose additional rules of behavior.
SR

February 1, 2015 9:48 am

Pope to Catholics Climate Funding: ‘Go forth and multiply.’

February 1, 2015 9:51 am

The Canterbury Tales – The Pardoner’s Tale
‘Nay, nay,’ quod he, ‘than have I Cristes curs!
Lat be,’ quod he, ‘it shal nat be, so theech!
Thou woldest make me kisse thyn old breech,
And swere it were a relik of a seint,
Thogh it were with thy fundement depeint!
But by the croys which that seint Eleyne fond,
I wolde I hadde thy coillons in myn hond
In stede of relikes or of seintuarie;
Lat cutte hem of, I wol thee helpe hem carie;
Thay shul be shryned in an hogges tord.’

mebbe
February 1, 2015 10:26 am

Is the Pope Catholic?
Well, there is some debate on that score but, on the whole, the Pope’s position on population control is less ambiguous than AGW Central’s view on it. This is largely because the AGW castle is an edifice of many chambers and we don’t have a single manifesto to examine.
Tim Ball isn’t saying the Pope’s not entitled to pipe up about AGW, he’s saying it’s ironic who he’s holding hands with.
There is plenty of evidence that many prominent players in the AGW tragicomedy have ulterior motives and clandestine agendas but I am not prepared to stick the whole orthodoxy under one tent and condemn them as misanthropic monsters all.
I will even admit to the mildest stirring of Malthusian malice while standing in line at the DMV.

Alan Robertson
Reply to  mebbe
February 2, 2015 6:05 am

Yeppers, good points, all.

February 1, 2015 10:40 am

Jesus said that: Ye shall know the truth…and the truth shall set you free.” I yearn for that day to come…to free mankind from the lies of these fools!

Jim G
Reply to  Wendellwx
February 1, 2015 1:13 pm

And He told Pontius Pilate, I have come to bare witness to the truth. In this respect the Pope has missed the mark entirely.

February 1, 2015 10:50 am

Prince Philip an environmentalist adherent ?
I don’t think so .
He dislikes and questions the need for wind turbines.
You mean Prince Charles – who has described sceptic people like me as being ‘headless chickens ‘ running around not knowing what’s going on ‘

mebbe
Reply to  brianawford
February 1, 2015 11:32 am

Without denying the worm in the fruit, that apple may not have fallen far from the tree.
The desire to be reincarnated as a virus deadly to humans is imputed to Prince Philip.

Mark and two Cats
February 1, 2015 10:51 am

Yet another Neo-Malthusian effort to redistribute and control population:
Gore: Spend $90 Trillion to Ban Cars from Every Major City in the World
I forget – how many mansions does algore own?

ferdberple
Reply to  Mark and two Cats
February 2, 2015 5:54 am

Gore: Spend $90 Trillion to Ban Cars
==============
Gore’s plan has already been tried. As you increase city density it pushes up real-estate prices, forcing people out to the suburbs, off transit and into their cars.
It is a self-defeating plan, because it ignores economics. Mass Transit systems work when large numbers of people want to travel predictably between limited numbers of destinations. However, when these same people want to travel randomly between a large number of destinations, you need a much larger number of smaller vehicles. The cost of drivers for such a system is prohibitive, so people must drive themselves if the system is to be affordable.

tom s
February 1, 2015 10:58 am

Know what I am sick of? ALL religions.

Just an engineer
Reply to  tom s
February 5, 2015 10:19 am

So are you going to give it up for Lent?

Hugh Davis
February 1, 2015 11:07 am

Why doesn’t someone send a copy of the GWPF’s latest publication “Unintended Consequences Of Climate Policies Unethical” to the Vatican?
see http://www.thegwpf.org/new-paper-unintended-consequences-of-climate-policies-unethical/
The Catholic Church is not however totally submerged under AGW alarmism. One of the Pope’s own cardinals George Pell, former Archbishop of Sydney, believes that a doubling of CO2 would be good for the planet because “plants would love it”
He is also quoted as having said “Radical environmentalists are more than up to the task of moralising their own agenda and imposing it on people through fear. They don’t need church leaders to help them with this, although it is a very effective way of further muting Christian witness.
“Church leaders in particular should be allergic to nonsense….. I am certainly sceptical about extravagant claims of impending man-made climatic catastrophes. Uncertainties on climate change abound … my task as a Christian leader is to engage with reality, to contribute to debate on important issues, to open people’s minds, and to point out when the emperor is wearing few or no clothes.”

Christopher Hanley
Reply to  Hugh Davis
February 1, 2015 1:38 pm

… doubling of CO2 would be good for the planet because “plants would love it” …
=====================
Quite so.
So called skeptics should stop being reactive, enriching the atmosphere is good for the environment.

Zeke
February 1, 2015 11:14 am

What an interesting article, links and perspective. I really loved the last line!
“Never talk to other men about his wife, because they might be more knowledgeable on the subject than he was. Maybe the problem for perspective is that the Pope doesn’t have a wife.” ~Tim Ball
This goes to the heart of the matter. It is said that these monks, prelates, priests and popes are actually single so that they can be “married to the church.”
Please remember that Peter was a married man, as were all of the twelve apostles; their wives traveled with them and Thomas’ daughters were prophetesses. Mary also had a lot of children with her husband Joseph. In light of this, it is truly fascinating to study the adherence to monasticism in the Roman Church. And it is the Roman Church: it’s dogma throughout the Middle Ages was Plato, Aristotle, Porphyry, Galen and Ptolemy, to name a few.
But take the time to look at this interesting remark on Roman Monastics here:

Will Durant argued that certain prominent features of Plato’s ideal community were discernible in the organization, dogma and effectiveness of the medieval Church in Europe:[18]
The clergy, like Plato’s guardians, were placed in authority… by their talent as shown in ecclesiastical studies and administration, by their disposition to a life of meditation and simplicity, and … by the influence of their relatives with the powers of state and church. In the latter half of the period in which they ruled [800 AD onwards], the clergy were as free from family cares as even Plato could desire [for such guardians]… [Clerical] Celibacy was part of the psychological structure of the power of the clergy; for on the one hand they were unimpeded by the narrowing egoism of the family, and on the other their apparent superiority to the call of the flesh added to the awe in which lay sinners held them…”In the latter half of the period in which they ruled, the clergy were as free from family cares as even Plato could desire”.[18]
In his book The Ruling Class, Gaetano Mosca wrote of the medieval Church and its structure:
…the Catholic Church has always aspired to a preponderant share in political power, it has never been able to monopolize it entirely, because of two traits, chiefly, that are basic in its structure. Celibacy has generally been required of the clergy and of monks. Therefore no real dynasties of abbots and bishops have ever been able to establish themselves…Secondly, in spite of numerous examples to the contrary supplied by the warlike Middle Ages, the ecclesiastical calling has by its very nature never been strictly compatible with the bearing of arms. The precept that exhorts the Church to abhor bloodshed has never dropped completely out of sight, and in relatively tranquil and orderly times it has always been very much to the fore.[19]

In brief, may I suggest to you that what the Roman Church and the UN types share in common is Plato’s caste system consisting of Philosopher King, aristocracy, and lower classes, who are strictly controlled in what they can own or eat.

February 1, 2015 11:15 am

Now we have two Divine Comedies.
One Devine Comedy is presented today by Tim Ball focused on the nether regions where resides the world-views of Obama & the Pope on climate.
The other Devine Comedy was presented in the 14th century by Dante Alighieri focused on the nether regions of the then medieval world-view of the Catholic Church.
“Adandon all hope ye who enter here**” now into either Ball’s or Dante’s version of the Devine Comedy.
** in Dante’s ‘Devine Comedy’ those words were inscribed at the entrance to Hell
John

Zeke
February 1, 2015 11:22 am

And please remember that a centennial of the Magna Carta is this year! Celebrate this wonderful document by watching A History of the English Language, by the inimitable Melvyn Bragg.
I particularly recommend episode 3 for this occasion: you can see what happened to men like Tyndale who translated the Bible out of Latin to English. It wasn’t a pretty sight.

This may be a wonderful opportunity for us all to really appreciate and celebrate the English language, and common law, or equality before the law.

Alba
Reply to  Zeke
February 2, 2015 6:29 am

Ah, myths are wonderful, aren’t they? Like the myth that Tyndale was burned for translating the Bible into English. What Tyndale was actually burned for was his determination to translate the Bible in a particular way. Like Luther he translated it in such a way as to bolster support for his own opinions. There’s a big difference. But some people just like perpetuating myths. It’s the only way they can convince themselves that they are right. (For those who don’t know about these things, Luther came up with a completely unheard of doctrine called justification by faith alone. So when he translated the Bible into German he put in the word ‘alone’ after ‘faith’ even though the word ‘alone’ did not appear in the Greek version he translated.)

Zeke
Reply to  Alba
February 2, 2015 10:53 am

Alba says, “What Tyndale was actually burned for was his determination to translate the Bible in a particular way. Like Luther he translated it in such a way as to bolster support for his own opinions.”
Surely it is a matter of public record and known history that Pope Innocent forbade the translation of the scriptures into any vernacular language.
“Canon 14. We prohibit also that the laity should not be permitted to have the books of the Old or
New Testament; we most strictly forbid their having any translation of these books.”
– The Church Council of Toulouse 1229 AD

February 1, 2015 11:27 am

The Divine Comedies most apparent are paranoia about Conspiracies, Motivations, Politics, and (natch) Al Gore. Very little about Science itself.
Could it be that the logic of those ‘Divine Comedies’ are :
1) We don’t like the imagined Policy Solutions, or
2) We don’t like the conspiracies we imagine?
3) We don’t like the political opposition? (Liberals, Democrats, Obama, or what ever the bogeyman)
Only then to be followed by 4) We reject the Science, precisely because we don’t like 1, 2, or 3, rather than disagreeing with the science itself?

Reply to  warrenlb
February 1, 2015 11:55 am

Only then to be followed by 4) We reject the Science, precisely because we don’t like 1, 2, or 3, rather than disagreeing with the science itself?
Coming from someone who has, in this forum, repeatedly challenged guest posters by complaining about their lack of science degrees, while steadfastly refusing to discuss the science presented by them, that comment is just a tad disingenuous.

Reply to  davidmhoffer
February 1, 2015 12:19 pm

I didn’t ‘complain’ about anyone’s lack of a degree. I said that if one wants an expert opinion, go to an credentialed expert, such as you would to an credentialed orthopedic surgeon for your hip replacement, not to your local barber.
And I would most certainly avoid a barber who contradicts what the credentialed surgeon says.

Reply to  davidmhoffer
February 1, 2015 12:53 pm

I didn’t ‘complain’ about anyone’s lack of a degree.
Oh bullshi*t. You dismissed Monckton’s science on the grounds that he had no degree in physics while refusing to discuss the science itself. Now you stumble into this thread espousing the exact opposite point of view, that we should discuss the science itself rather than the qualifications of the proponent. When called on it, you switch gears and start yapping about hip replacements by orthopedic surgeons. A demonstrated skill set to accomplish a known task by repeating known procedures is not science! Your about face on the issue is as disingenuous as your use of an example that has nothing to do with science. An orthopedic surgeon is no more a scientist than is a dentist or a mechanic. You contradict yourself and hide behind irrelevant analogies, but your hypocrisy is on display for anyone to read for themselves.

Patrick
Reply to  davidmhoffer
February 1, 2015 11:33 pm

Warren, you mentioned continental drift in a rant. The first person to suggest the theory there was such a action was an amateur geologist and he was ridiculed for it in his life. It was later proven, after his death, by the US Navy with sea floor mapping. What were his credentials, was he an expert? And what were the credentials of Faraday, Newton and Tesla, were they experts?

Bruce Cobb
Reply to  warrenlb
February 1, 2015 11:58 am

Only in a Warmist Trolls’ fevered imagination.

PeterK
Reply to  Bruce Cobb
February 1, 2015 5:32 pm

warrenlb: Since when is an expert opinion from a credentialed expert worth anything? ‘Climate science’ and ‘climate scientists’ in general have many expert but useless opinions based on useless climate models that disproportionately consume vast amounts of cash for no general gain for Joe Public. So much for your BS.

Zeke
February 1, 2015 11:59 am

Oh snap! I forgot the military class in Plato’s Caste.
Correction: In brief, may I suggest to you that what the Roman Church and the UN-types share in common is Plato’s caste system consisting of Philosopher King, aristocracy, military class, and lower classes, who are strictly controlled in what they can eat or own. In particular they are not to own land, chariots or weapons.

Pamela Gray
February 1, 2015 12:01 pm

Zeke: The English language is, said by some, not a language at all but a melting pot of all languages. As much a blend as our DNA. At best it is a scaffold on which words and turns of phrases from other languages have come, and still do come, together to form one of the most colorful and in-understandable modes of communication on the planet. If it wants to be boring, it can. And the next second it can move us to great depths of feeling. Few pure languages can claim such ability.

Zeke
Reply to  Pamela Gray
February 1, 2015 6:06 pm

Yes ma’am, but in my humble opinion English is a lot more Viking than anything else. And so is our family, though since converted as Protestants by King Alfred. (:

http://www.medievalages.net/wp-content/uploads/2014/01/Alfred-The-Great-king.jpg

Zeke
Reply to  Zeke
February 2, 2015 12:40 am

All Medieval humor aside, Catholics here in the New World make wonderful neighbors (and bloggers)-. I remember once when I was a teenager I was stranded in a small town, and a Catholic police officer gave me a quarter to make a phone call home. He said, “You can pay me back in heaven.” So thirty years later I still remember that and look forward to handing him that coin. Although at the time I had no earthly clue what he was talking about.

February 1, 2015 12:03 pm

John Whitman says: February 1, 2015 at 11:15 am
Now we have two Divine Comedies.
One Devine Comedy is presented today by Tim Ball focused on the nether regions where resides the world-views of Obama & the Pope on climate.
The other Devine Comedy was presented in the 14th century by Dante Alighieri focused on the nether regions of the then medieval world-view of the Catholic Church.
“Adandon all hope ye who enter here**” now into either Ball’s or Dante’s version of the Devine Comedy.
** in Dante’s ‘Devine Comedy’ those words were inscribed at the entrance to Hell
John

Then 12 minutes later we have,

warrenlb says: February 1, 2015 at 11:27 am
The Divine Comedies most apparent are paranoia about Conspiracies, Motivations, Politics, and (natch) Al Gore. Very little about Science itself.
Could it be that the logic of those ‘Divine Comedies’ are :
1) We don’t like the imagined Policy Solutions, or
2) We don’t like the conspiracies we imagine?
3) We don’t like the political opposition? (Liberals, Democrats, Obama, or what ever the bogeyman)
Only then to be followed by 4) We reject the Science, precisely because we don’t like 1, 2, or 3, rather than disagreeing with the science itself?

warrenlb,
If your Devine Comedy comment was inspired by my first mention of Devine Comedy on this thread about twelve minutes before yours, then I will reply.
The operative word is ‘Devine’. When the discussion is about the word ‘science’ being utilized in the same context and sense as ‘religion’, then you get the subject of Tim Ball’s post.
Now, I do not agree with Tim Ball in most of the article, but I tend to concur somewhat with his assessment that climate change has become religion; notice I did not call climate change a science (it looks like pseudo-science). My view is a little different than Ball’s; I think climate change is mythology which is the necessary generic pre-curser of all modern religion.
So I find all of your 4 distinctions moot.
John

Reply to  John Whitman
February 1, 2015 12:21 pm

You say Science is a religion. Does that mean you think the Religion of AGW non-experts is Science?

Reply to  warrenlb
February 1, 2015 12:56 pm

You say Science is a religion.
He said no such thing. Your arguments rest on a combination of hypocrisy and putting words in other people’s mouths. When you start discussing the science instead of diverting attention from it, you might get some traction. But you won’t because you can’t.

Reply to  warrenlb
February 1, 2015 1:36 pm

davidmhoffer on February 1, 2015 at 12:56 pm

davidmhoffer,
Yes. I responded in like vein to him below. I do continue to offer warrenlb my benevolent consideration.
Hey, I will leave the commentary soon to start serious partying for this afternoon’s Super Bowl 49. Take care. Go Seahawks!
John

Reply to  John Whitman
February 1, 2015 1:07 pm

John Whitman on February 1, 2015 at 12:03 pm
warrenlb,
If your Devine Comedy comment was inspired by my first mention of Devine Comedy on this thread about twelve minutes before yours, then I will reply.
The operative word is ‘Devine’. When the discussion is about the word ‘science’ being utilized in the same context and sense as ‘religion’, then you get the subject of Tim Ball’s post.
Now, I do not agree with Tim Ball in most of the article, but I tend to concur somewhat with his assessment that climate change has become religion; notice I did not call climate change a science (it looks like pseudo-science). My view is a little different than Ball’s; I think climate change is mythology which is the necessary generic pre-curser of all modern religion.
So I find all of your 4 distinctions moot.
John

And then in reply ~18 min later we have,

warrenlb on February 1, 2015 at 12:21 pm
You say Science is a religion. Does that mean you think the Religion of AGW non-experts is Science?

warrenlb,
Let me correct your perception of my comment. I basically said something like currently climate change is a pseudo-science and it is has evolved into something that has the a similar context and sense as that of a mythology on which all religion is derived.
Your ‘non-expert’ commentology (for lack of a real word to identify what it is) was suspended in argumentative mid-air.
Science, over time, self-corrects out myth and pseudo elements. Climate focused science is doing significant self-correction now, finally, after ~40 years of subjective focus. Viva la Skeptics.
John

Reply to  John Whitman
February 1, 2015 1:27 pm

Interesting assertions, Can you back them up?
1) How do you conclude AGW as concluded by all the world’s Scientific Institutions is ‘psuedo science?
2) How do you conclude only AGW is ‘pseudo’, but the other findings of those Institutions are not? Or do you consider all science concluded by Institutions of Science as ‘pseudo’?

4 eyes
Reply to  John Whitman
February 1, 2015 3:05 pm

Warrenlb,
resorting to authority again. Why don’t you explain why it isn’t pseudo science. You never have explained anything scientific yet or presented evidence of your beloved CAGW. Like a pampered prince you let others do the hard work.

ferdberple
Reply to  John Whitman
February 2, 2015 6:12 am

How do you conclude AGW as concluded by all the world’s Scientific Institutions is ‘psuedo science?
=============
Pseudo science rests on positive examples. I drank water and my aching back felt better. therefore water is the cure for an aching back. I know this to be true because I didn’t do anything else to make by back stop aching.
The IPCC admits that they believe human CO2 is the cause of rising temperatures because they could find no other cause. Therefore CO2 must be the cause.
Science on the other hand rests of negative examples. If one time I didn’t drink water and my back stopped aching, that single negative example would be all it would take science to prove that water did not cure an aching back.
Temperatures rose from 1910 to 1940, statistically identical to 1970 to 2000, yet there was minimal human CO2. That single negative example is sufficient for science to prove that CO2 is not the cause of the 1970-2000 warming.
Since climate science does not know the cause of the 1910 to 1940 warming, they cannot claim to know the cause of the 1970-2000 warming.
Pseudo science however is not bothered by this problem. The inability to explain the 1910-1940 warming is ignored, while human CO2 is assumed to be the cause of the 1970 to 2000 warming because they cannot find any other cause.
Science tells us that the most likely cause of the 1970 to 2000 warming is the same thing that caused the 1910 to 1940 warming. That was caused by “we don’t know”.

richardscourtney
Reply to  John Whitman
February 2, 2015 8:29 am

warrenlb
Your post says in total

Interesting assertions, Can you back them up?
1) How do you conclude AGW as concluded by all the world’s Scientific Institutions is ‘psuedo science?
2) How do you conclude only AGW is ‘pseudo’, but the other findings of those Institutions are not? Or do you consider all science concluded by Institutions of Science as ‘pseudo’?

Science consists of seeking the closest possible approximation to truth by seeking information which falsifies existing understanding then amending or replacing the existing understanding to concur with the found information.
Pseudoscience consists of supporting existing understanding as being truth and seeking information which supports the existing understanding.
Please consider if position statements by Institutions represent science or pseudoscience. You will then find the answers to your questions are obvious.
Richard

Reply to  John Whitman
February 2, 2015 2:56 pm

warrenlb on February 1, 2015 at 1:27 pm
Interesting assertions, Can you back them up?
1) How do you conclude AGW as concluded by all the world’s Scientific Institutions is ‘psuedo science?
2) How do you conclude only AGW is ‘pseudo’, but the other findings of those Institutions are not? Or do you consider all science concluded by Institutions of Science as ‘pseudo’?

warrenlb,
I am back from my commenting hiatus due to doing all the parties before, during and after the Super Bowl including hangover recovery this morning. My team lost.
I have a response with a couple of points in addition to the points made in the critical responses to your comment by 4 eyes (February 1, 2015 at 3:05 pm), ferdberple (February 2, 2015 at 6:12 am) and richardscourtney (February 2, 2015 at 8:29 am).
In support of my view that climate change is pseudo-science, look at the speech by Richard Feyman entitled ‘Cargo Cult Science’. Feynman’s description of ‘cargo-cult science’ is applicable to the research paper feeder system supplying the IPCC due to its mandated charter to look for evidence biased toward supporting climate change.
Also in support of my view that climate change is pseudo-science, is that climate change community has a strong pattern to give priority to models and ‘a priori’ premises over corroborated objective observations. That is the fallacy of primacy of consciousness over existence. Only a pseudo-science has it.
Separate from the above points and for intellectual exercise only on the matter of pseudo-science, I have just off-the-top-of-mind and quickly made up a process. Let’s discuss it:

How is the following kind of process not pseudo-science?
-Mandate that a premise is real ‘a priori’ by a self-nominating consensus/ authority
-Use that premise as the fundamental basis of a theory endorsed by the same consensus/authority
-Consensus/ authority disperses funds with intentional bias toward looking for evidence supporting the theory
-Consensus/ authority gets the everywhere evidence supporting the theory
-The subject scientific theory is proclaimed by consensus/ authority as settled science
-With the evidence found then the premise is claimed proven to be a primary fact of reality by consensus/ authority

John

ren
February 1, 2015 12:25 pm

Pope simply worry about polar bears.

Alan Robertson
February 1, 2015 12:41 pm

With all the talk of religions and what not, it’s a good time to point out the true meaning of the “72 virgins reward” for those labelled as martyrs who have performed unspeakable acts, all while trying to force God into a preconceived mold, if you will.
Those 72 virgins are nuns.
Having demonstrated a limited sense of guilt over their thoughts and actions, the subject martyrs shall be reincarnated to grow up as Catholic schoolboys, with 6 different ruler- bearing nuns for each of the 12 years of mandatory parochial school. A proper understanding of guilt is sure to follow.

Taylor Pohlman
Reply to  Alan Robertson
February 1, 2015 1:14 pm

Warrenlb: ‘And I would most certainly avoid a barber who contradicts what the credentialed surgeon says.’
Maybe, but I recommend a great book (possibly now out of print), ‘The Century of the Surgeon’ – many of the nineteenth century’s most important medical advances were made by those who opposed the ‘credentialed’ crowd, and it was just as true in physics.
Those who speak the truth and can prove they are right have the true ‘credential’.
Taylor

Reply to  Taylor Pohlman
February 1, 2015 1:20 pm

So you would indeed go to your local barber for a hip replacement?

Reply to  Taylor Pohlman
February 1, 2015 1:24 pm

So you would indeed go to your local barber for a hip replacement?
A barber and a surgeon each accomplish their tasks through the repetition of known techniques. Regardless of the skill involved, neither are scientists. Your analogy is moot, and a further attempt to distract from your hypocrisy upthread.

Reply to  Taylor Pohlman
February 1, 2015 1:56 pm

davidmhoffer,
No wonder the alarmist crowd is fast losing traction, with stupid arguments like warrenlb’s.
A much more accurate alalogy is this: you have a hangnail. You mention it to your barber. He tells you to not worry, it will be fine. AGW is much more akin to a hangnail than to any real medical issue.
AGW is not ‘cancer’, or anything else to be concerned about. The premier experts in the field have repeatedly stated that. For example, climatologist Richard Lindzen wrote:

The notion of a static, unchanging climate is foreign to the history of the earth or any other planet with a fluid envelope. The fact that the developed world went into hysterics over changes in global mean temperature anomaly of a few tenths of a degree will astound future generations.
Such hysteria simply represents the scientific illiteracy of much of the public, the susceptibility of the public to the substitution of repetition for truth, and the exploitation of these weaknesses by politicians, environmental promoters, and, after 20 years of media drum beating, many others as well.
Climate is always changing.
We have had ice ages, and warmer periods when alligators were found in Spitzbergen. Ice ages have occurred in hundred-thousand year cycles for the last 700,000 years, and there have been previous periods that appear to have been warmer than the present, despite CO2 levels being lower than they are now. More recently, we have had the Medieval Warm Period, and the Little Ice Age. During the latter, alpine glaciers advanced, to the chagrin of overrun villages. Since the beginning of the 19th Century these glaciers have been retreating. Frankly, we don’t fully understand either the advance or the retreat.
For small changes in climate associated with tenths of a degree, there is no need for any external cause. The earth is never exactly in equilibrium. The motions of the massive oceans where heat is moved between deep layers and the surface provides variability on time scales from years to centuries. Recent work suggests that this variability is enough to account for all climate change since the 19th Century.

Running around in circles and clucking like Chicken Little is the alarmists’ panicky response to completely routine natural variability. Everything we see now has happened before, repeatedly, and to a much greater degree.
Prof Richard Lindzen also wrote:
“There is ample evidence that the Earth’s temperature as measured at the equator has remained within +/- 1°C for more than the past billion years. Those temperatures have not changed over the past century.”
So global T at the equator has not changed — for more than a billion years!
Maybe our pair of hysterical alarmists here can explain exactly why we should be worried?
…Take you time, I can wait.

rooter
Reply to  Taylor Pohlman
February 1, 2015 2:37 pm

Might wonder what dbstealey is trying with this:
““There is ample evidence that the Earth’s temperature as measured at the equator has remained within +/- 1°C for more than the past billion years. Those temperatures have not changed over the past century.”
So global T at the equator has not changed — for more than a billion years!
Maybe our pair of hysterical alarmists here can explain exactly why we should be worried?”
No MWP. No LIA etc. But on the other hand, an increase in tropical SST:
http://i.imgur.com/mTSejQ9.png
No warming in the tropics for a billion years. But now.. dbstealey must be the most alarmist of all.

rogerknights
Reply to  Taylor Pohlman
February 1, 2015 7:17 pm

@Warrenlb:
You must have missed my end-of-thread collection of past WUWT comments on the medical analogy:
http://wattsupwiththat.com/2015/01/30/87-is-the-new-97/#comment-1849087

ferdberple
Reply to  Taylor Pohlman
February 2, 2015 6:29 am

an increase in tropical SST:
===================
Your reference does not show the error bars. Nor does it show actual temperatures.
the notion that we can calculate the ocean temperatures to a fraction of a degree based on intermittent ships reports from 100+ years ago is fanciful at best.
Find rural stations from 100+ years ago that are still rural stations today. You will find that the unadjusted raw data shows there has been no change.
The problem is that for large areas of the earth there is no data. these areas have been in-filled will made up data, and this made up data has unknown error.
You cannot say how far off the calculated result truly is, except by comparing them to climate models. And if the models have bias, as they appear to have, this bias will be reflected in your in-filled temperatures and thus in the calculated average temps.
the problem is that the climate models rely on temps and temps rely on climate models. A small error in one results in a feedback loop that gets amplified over and over again.

Reply to  Taylor Pohlman
February 2, 2015 5:19 pm

rooter, get a grip. I gave you a well known quote and you go all ballistic.
A lot of times I can’t even understand what you’re trying to say. This is one of them. I never said or implied that the MWP and LIA did not occur. Where did you get that nonsense? And what are you trying to show with that chart? It simply tracks the recovery from the LIA. What do you want, a totally flat line?
I suggest that you get familiar with the climate Null Hypothesis, which has never been falsified. It shows that there is nothing unprecedented happening. If you believe differently, it is simply your confirmation bias at work.

February 1, 2015 1:00 pm

“Ball” said the queen, “if I had two of you possibly we could convince my family to shut up about climate change.” We need more Balls, not because I agree with him, but because he is interesting, erudite, and makes insightful points. Who else would quote Chaucer in an article about climate change and the pope!
I like the pope even though I’m an agnostic. I like Obama even though I think he and the pope are both ignorant and wrong about global warming/climate change. I dislike Holdren and Kerry and others who promote doomsday messages, but they aren’t the reason the pope or Obama embrace the CAGW exaggerations. It’s the scientific academies. Lots of over-the-top political ranting occurs on these blogs, similar to the over-the-top ranting by the CAGW crowd. Blame the pope. Blame Obama. NO! Blame the scientific academies. I wish Ball were a little more catholic in his criticisms. I am very critical of my fellow liberals- https://sites.google.com/site/climatesensitivity/
I don’t see Ball creating the level playing field that actually advances understanding and debate much beyond the polarized and politicalized “darkling plain,
Swept with confused alarms of struggle and flight,
Where ignorant armies clash by night.”

Reply to  Doug Allen
February 1, 2015 1:19 pm

Please tell us the exaggerations that you say have appeared on ‘blogs’ from scientific academies.

David Ball
Reply to  warrenlb
February 1, 2015 1:43 pm

It’s really very easy warrenlb. Just google “climate models”. Hope that helps. 🙂

Reply to  warrenlb
February 1, 2015 2:55 pm

Actually Warren, I spend considerable time showing the 1988 and 1990 model projections of CAGW that almost all science academies uncritically embraced.. David Ball is correct. And the good news is that scientific method is working. Well, sorta. The IPCC has replaced those 1990 model projections of 3.7 C per century with its 2013 much lower model projections. The earlier high sensitivity models were falsified, based the IPCC action to replace them. The problem is the pope, Obama, most journalists, pundits and public know nothing about this good news. The politicians and bureaucracy that wrote the 2013 “Summary for Poilcymakers” omit (censure may be the right word) this lowering of climate sensitivity estimates thereby guaranteeing the obsolete sensitivity estimates will continue to fuel the climate wars. One scientific academy, The American Physics Society, made a good start last year towards addressing their previous endorsement of CAGW. I hope we hear from them soon. I imagine they’re under terrific pressure by both sides in this crazy climate war. Climate science needs to get back to data and scientific method-
https://sites.google.com/site/climatesensitivity/