About that graph…

clip_image001This one:

The title “Battle of the Graphs” certainly lives on, even though it is approaching a decade in age, as there has been a lot of off-topic contention on this WUWT thread as well as a free-for-all bashing over at the “Stoat” a.k.a. William Connolley (who “takes science by the throat”, implying he is some sort of “tough guy”) saying that this graph that appeared in a Telegraph article was erroneous and created by Christopher Monckton.

Based on the simplest available evidence, I was ready to conclude, as were many, that indeed Monckton had created the graph, that it was in error, and that he had refused to admit to any of this.  I was ready to censure him myself, just as the over-the-top Stoaters wanted to do, probably so Connolley could direct a new denigrating Wikipedia entry as he is known to do (he’s not allowed to edit Wikipedia pages of living persons anymore, so he directs by proxy). Now, after further investigation I can tell you I was wrong, and so is Connolley.

If Monckton was wrong I certainly would’ve had no trouble pointing this out just as the Stoaters were doing, but I have one advantage that neither Monckton nor the Stoaters have: I have actually worked at a newspaper and I have submitted articles as a guest author to newspapers. So, I am familiar with the artwork process. Further, I have also published a number of articles from Monckton myself here and I am quite familiar with his style of producing graphs.

Thus, I noticed something about the Telegraph article that no one else seemed to.

WUWT commenter Kevin O’Neill, who also frequents Connolley’s website pointed out in this comment the charges against Monckton.

First let’s have a look at the article itself. The URL for it is:

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/1533290/Climate-chaos-Dont-believe-it.html

A screencap of the heading portion is shown below with the highlight done by me in yellow.

Telegraph_monckton_2006

Unfortunately the link under the yellow highlight no longer works and so for some it is impossible to check Monckton’s references and calculations that were included with the essay. We’ll get back to that in a moment, please read on.

Here is how the article presented the graph that is in contention, I have screen captured a portion of the original Telegraph article:

Telegraph_monckton_2006_graph

Several things immediately struck me as being out of place when I first saw the graph after reading about the contention surrounding it, here is a list.

  • The style (colors, font, etc) is not anything like I’ve ever seen from Monckton in all the graphs he has submitted to WUWT.
  • The horizontal lines on the bottom portion of the graph are obviously spaced incorrectly (the 20th century average line looks like it is incorrect on left axis) along with other cues in the plot line indicating to me that they were hand-drawn yet I’ve never gotten the graph from Monckton that was hand-drawn. Everything he has ever sent me has always been from a computer program output, thus the idea of having improperly spaced lines and coordinates a hand drawn plot didn’t make sense to me.
  • My experience with newspapers told me that this was likely a graph that was prepared by the art department of the UK Telegraph. You see, all major newspapers and even some middle and minor ones have an art department. And, when they get some sort of illustration from a guest author, or data from a government report, they almost always redraw it to fit the style and format of the newspaper. Especially the colors and the fonts.

Just look at any major newspaper in the United States like USA Today when they get in data from say, the Labor Department, they produce their own graphs of that data. They can also make grievous mistakes with such data in the way it is presented such as this article from Charles Apple (who watches newspapers and the graphics and photos they produce) demonstrates:

110706UsaTodayWeatherSnapshot02[1]

Obviously, neither the editor nor the artist saw the sexual suggestion in the imagery. I don’t blame the NWS or the Red Cross who provided the data, I blame Doyle Rice and Julie Snider. Note the references at the bottom of the graphic.

Here, USA Today took data from the National Weather Service and the American Red Cross and turned it into what is obviously a ridiculous graphic. It got past the editor, and made it into the final publication.

I noted such references to internal artists, editors, and sources were missing from the UK Telegraph article as seen in the screen cap further above, and it is this omission that I believe led many people to conclude that Monckton produced that graphic.

If you examine other graphics from the UK Telegraph, you will find that they do have such references but they are also similarly designed and of a similar size with similar fonts and colors. For example, look at this graphic from 2005 that has been redrawn, but no mention given of an internal reference to The Telegraph art department:

Telegraph_GW_2005Source: http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/4198339/Global-warming-will-bring-cooler-climate-for-UK.html

It is plainly obvious that is a graphic created by the newspaper and not by any scientific entity, otherwise it wouldn’t have the jagged shadow edges. So, the question surrounding the graph allegedly produced by Christopher Monckton is; did he included in the original list of references that he provided the Telegraph in that now missing link at the top of the original article? I’m happy to say I have found that original source file that Monckton provided to the Telegraph. It was lodged in the Wayback machine. I was able to find it simply by putting in the correct URL of the original Telegraph article as shown below:

https://web.archive.org/web/20090301000000*/http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/1533290/Climate-chaos-Dont-believe-it.htmlWayback_Monckton_telegraph

When you pull up the archive from 2009, the link appears for the PDF file of Monckton’s references but unfortunately it gives a 404 as seen below:

Wayback_Monckton_telegraph2

Oddly though if you click on  the LEFT MOST vertical lines  (circa 2007/2008) in the timeline above, the PDF will actually download, and that is what I did. For those of you that would doubt this you can go here and try it yourself:

Click to access warm-refs.pdf

And for posterity, here is a local link to the PDF of the References Monckton provided for the Telegraph article in 2006: warm-refs

If you open that PDF file you will notice a number of graphs and references including the graph from IPCC section 7 graph C. McIntyre speaks of its source here.

But no trace of the exact artwork combination as presented above appears in the Telegraph article is in Monckton’s reference PDF file, clearly indicating that the telegraph art department redrew that 1990 IPCC graph and the hockey stick graph, changing the top-bottom order. Below is page 6 from Monckton’s “warm-refs” PDF file, showing those graphs:

Monckton_Warm_refs_page6

While I was ready to condemn Monckton for producing a sloppy graph like many of these Stoaters, it is now abundantly clear to me that he did not draw it and the claims by these people are erroneous and simply mendacious.

Stoat/Connelley is simply flat wrong, and the website that cited Monckton’s graphic as an example of what not to do needs to clarify that it was the newspaper that made the errors, that the source graphs came from the IPCC, and that Monckton drew none of them.

All this breastbeating over something that can be simply researched as I have done is just a waste of everyone’s time.

Monckton prepared a rebuttal as well which I present below.

=================================================================

There comes a point …

By Christopher Monckton of Brenchley

Those of us who have raised questions about the magnitude of Man’s influence on climate have become used to the expensively funded, often carefully co-ordinated campaigns of personal vilification organized by adherents of the Climatist Party Line. Occasionally we growl a little. More often we refuse to be distracted. We carry on.

The purpose of these relentless attacks on us is not only to do us down but also to frighten off third parties who might otherwise find the courage to speak out and express their own doubts about the Party Line.

But there comes a point when it is necessary to take action. I hope no one will disagree that that point is reached when allegations of lying or fabrication are made; when the allegations are unquestionably false; when they are persisted in despite requests to cease and desist; and when they are widely disseminated in a manner calculated baselessly to cause maximum reputational damage.

Recently a commenter at Jo Nova’s blog posted several comments to the effect that I had “faked” a graph. I quickly asked Jo to replace them with a note to say legal proceedings were in train. Enough, I had decided, was enough.

Here is the diagram I was supposed to have “faked”:

clip_image001

This surely blameless diagram appeared alongside an article I had written for the Sunday Telegraph on 5 November 2006, the first time I ever went public on the climate question. The article went live on the internet at midnight on a Saturday night. Two hours later the Telegraph’s website crashed, for 127,000 people had tried to access the article.

Now, it is not the custom of UK newspapers to ask their contributors to illustrate their articles. As usual, I was not consulted and offered no advice on the matter, and had no hand in their production and no foreknowledge that they were to be used. The graphs are not labeled as having been sourced from the IPCC (indeed, one of the graphs has the shadow of a hockey stick overlaid on it and marked as the “IPCC ‘hockey stick’”, making it blindingly obvious that it is not an official IPCC’s graph).

The Telegraph’s graphs are simple and, it seems to me, harmless schematics illustrating the difference between the representations of 1000 years’ global temperatures as they appeared in the IPCC’s 2001 (top) and 1990 (bottom) reports.

The graph from p. 202 of the IPCC’s 1990 report now looks like this:

clip_image003

With the article I supplied some background material for Telegraph readers on its website. In that material, the IPCC’s 1990 graph also appeared, mistakenly captioned as 1996 rather than 1990. The graph as I reproduced it looked like this:

clip_image005

What I had not realized until very recently was that for several years allegations had been circulated all over the place to the effect that I had fabricated the graphs that had appeared in the Sunday Telegraph article. Yet not one of those who had made these allegations had ever contacted me to verify the facts. And not one of them had said what was wrong with the Telegraph’s graphs anyway.

Perhaps the worst of the many allegations of dishonesty against me appeared on a “science education” website, where an entire section under the bold heading “Misuse of scientific images” was devoted to the Telegraph’s graphs.

The offending section contained the following untruths:

  • Ø that in that article I had “disputed the concept of climate change” (Not that old chestnut again! I had accepted the concept but queried its likely magnitude);
  • Ø that the Telegraph’s graphs were instances of “poor use of graphical displays” that “can confuse and obscure data” (No, they neatly showed the main point: in 1990 the medieval warm period and little ice age were shown clearly, but by 2001 both had gone, and a sharp uptick in the 20th century had been added);
  • Ø that I had “created the [1990] graph on the bottom using different calculations that did not take into account all of the variables that climate scientists used to create the top graph” (No, I had not created either graph or done any calculations for such a graph);
  • Ø that I had deployed “common techniques used to distort visual forms of data – manipulating axes, changing one of the variables in a comparison, changing calculations without full explanation – that can obscure a true comparison” (No, none of the above); and
  • Ø that the article had been published in the Daily Telegraph (No, the Sunday Telegraph, and that suggests the website had never seen the original article but had picked up the libel from somewhere else).

I only discovered that this spectacularly inaccurate and profoundly damaging infestation of allegations when the commenter at Jo Nova’s site who had accused me of “faking” the graph mentioned on his own blog that I had not objected to the libel as it appeared on the science-education website. I had not objected because I had not known about it. No one at that website had thought to check any of the facts with me, or, as far as one can tell, with anyone else.

In short order a letter before action was sent to the website, which promptly did the right thing and took out the entire section, though there are indications that attempts are being made in some quarters – unsuccessfully so far – to get them to put it back up again.

I gave the commenter at Jo Nova’s website who had accused me of “faking” the graphs several chances to retract and apologize. Instead, he and several others sneeringly doubled down by accusing me of “lying” when I had said the graphs at the Telegraph website had not purported to be, and had not been labeled as, IPCC graphs.

They also alleged that the graph in my background materials accompanying the Telegraph article was “not the same graph” as that from the IPCC’s 1990 report: in effect, that I had “faked” that one as well. Judge that for yourselves from the two monochrome versions of the graph above. There seem to me to be no material differences, and I think it would be hard for the defendants to convince a court that there were any.

So I am going to court. My lawyers say the libels are plain and indefensible. They comment additionally that no judge would regard the schematics in the Telegraph (whoever had drawn them) as significantly misrepresenting the difference between the 1990 and 2001 reports’ images of the past millennium’s global temperature anomalies. As far as they can see, there is not a lot wrong with the graphs in any event.

I have told this story not only because some commenters here have been unwise enough to repeat in threads here the allegations they have made elsewhere but also because I thought it might be time to reveal the steps we have to take on an almost weekly basis to try to stem the tide of false allegations directed at us.

Nor am I by any means the only victim. For years, this shadowy Propagandaamt has been tampering with Fred Singer’s Wikipedia page to allege that he believes in Martians.

Niklas Mörner, the sea-level expert, has had his page got at on the ground that he sometimes dowses for water or other underground treasure. My late father once did that for the Maltese Government, and found three lost Punic tombs and a fine marble head of Seneca from the first century AD. My drawing of it (in the day before digital cameras) is probably still to be found somewhere in the Museum of Classical Archaeology at Cambridge. But I never had the knack for dowsing myself.

A pressure-group founded and funded by Prince Charles is prone to intervene to try (unsuccessfully, the last time they tried it on me) to prevent the publication of skeptical scientific papers in British learned journals.

A team of paid hacks telephones the Chancellor and the Dean of the Faculty at every university at which skeptics are invited to speak. About half the time, they succeed in getting us disinvited.

Journal editors are sacked for printing papers by skeptics.

However much one might hope that scientific discourse can be conducted in an open atmosphere of sensible dialog, the truth is that on the climate it can’t, because the extremists won’t play fair. The Politburo are determined to keep the scare going for just a little longer, till they can get the Treaty of Paris safely signed by all nations in December 2015.

So I am going to court to defend myself and, in so doing against the constant barrage of falsehoods told in support of the Party Line. We went to court against Al Gore because his movie was poisonous political propaganda dressed up as science.

We won. Nothing else but a court case would have worked. It was only when the department of education in London were confronted with 80 pages of scientific testimony, and knew that that testimony would stand up in court against all their falsehoods and evasions, that they caved in and settled, paying $400,000 to the plaintiffs and undertaking to circulate 77 pages of corrective guidance to every school in England.

In the present case, the other side has blinked thrice. On the website of my defamer, there is a nervous little note that he will not give me his name and address unless I answer various impertinent questions of his. The court will have no patience with any nonsense of that sort.

And there are now various postings at the same blog, again rather nervous, saying that perhaps they could plead that I don’t have a reputation and they can accuse me of whatever they like.

They will be unwise to take that line. For if they say I have no reputation they have to be able to come up with evidence that any material detrimental to my reputation on which they may try to rely is true. And most of it is no more accurate than their accusations that I “faked” a graph that I had plainly not faked. If they waste the court’s time with point after point that has nothing to do with the case at hand, they will merely aggravate the damages they will have to pay.

Finally, the perp has been unwise enough to admit that at the time when he made his allegation of “fakery” he did not know whether I had “faked” the graph or not. In the courts, to make a damaging and untrue allegation not knowing whether or not it is true is as culpable as making it when one knows it is not true. And there is no defense once that admission has been made. It has been made.

There is a curious and touching notion among some skeptics that, since the truth will of course prevail in the end, we should persevere with the scientific argument but not take the defamers and the scamsters to court. The feeling is that using the courts somehow isn’t cricket.

Sometimes, though, it’s necessary to play hardball. Being Valiant for Truth is not for wimps.

================================================================

UPDATE:

From comments, Steve McIntyre finds another version of the Lamb/IPCC AR1 1990 graph, which looks to me to be much closer to the graph used in the Telegraph article. This graph does NOT appear in Monkton’s PDF.

He writes in a comment:

The lower panel of the Telegraph diagram appears to have derived from (what appears to be) a variation of the Lamb graphic, a variation that I had not noticed until now. The variation appears in the following blog posts (and visually matches almost exactly):

LAMB_2ndversion

http://drtimball.com/2011/they-are-still-trying-to-rewrite-climate-to-show-current-conditions-are-abnormal/

http://hockeyschtick.blogspot.ca/2009/12/from-mann-paper-in-nature.html

Neither blog post provides a citation for the figure, but there are clues that should enable its exact provenance to be tracked down fairly quickly. It appears to be from a book about European climate and have been developed by Lamb. It is unclear why the Telegraph would have used this variation instead of the IPCC 1990 variation, but doubtless we will find out in due course.

UPDATE2:

Nick Stokes adds in comments (bold mine):

There is a version of that graph at the John Daly site here. The article does not seem to be dated, but Daly is indicated as the author, which would make it 2004 or earlier. No source given.

Here is the graph from John Daly’s website, listed as figure 4:

And here is the Metadata, dating the creation of it precisely to Feb 10, 2004, two years before Monckton’s article in the Telegraph.

(right click on image at Daly’s website here to verify yourself)

John-Daly-Metadata-1000yrs

Nick Stokes adds in a second comment:

Steve McIntyre says: July 3, 2014 at 12:12 pm

“The lower panel of the Telegraph diagram appears to have derived from (what appears to be) a variation of the Lamb graphic, a variation that I had not noticed until now.”

Here, on the Wayback machine, is a version from 2001 on the John Daly site.

And the screencap:

John-Daly-solar-2001-wayback

Since Daly’s graph is a near perfect match for the one in the Telegraph, and appears as far back as April 21, 2001, and Monckton did not provide it in his PDF to the Telegraph, I’d say “case closed”.

UPDATE3:

There is some whingeing from Kevin O’Neill in comments that Figure 7.1c from IPCC AR1 WG1 chapter 7 (available here: http://www.ipcc.ch/ipccreports/far/wg_I/ipcc_far_wg_I_chapter_07.pdf ) was not “faithfully” reproduced in my article, even though I made a reference to a technical discussion at Climate Audit on that specific graph and the exact figure appears no less than 3 times in the essay split between my own and Monckton’s

If you open that PDF file you will notice a number of graphs and references including the graph from IPCC section 7 graph C. McIntyre speaks of its source here.

To satisfy such whingeing, here is the exact page from IPCC AR1 WG1 chapter 7, followed by a magnified view of figure 7.1 (including graphs A,B, and C) in case Mr. O’Neill wants to claim “a magnified version is needed for readers with poor eyesight” as part of his game. I challenge him and readers to find any material difference between the graphs below taken directly from the IPCC WG1 Chapter 7 page 202 and those in the essay.

 

IPCC_FAR_Figure 7-1_page202

Magnified figure 7.1abc:

IPCC_FAR_Figure 7-1abc

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milodonharlani
July 4, 2014 4:56 pm

oneillsinwisconsin says:
July 4, 2014 at 4:45 pm
Yes. The Medieval Warm Period was most certainly global in scope, as has been repeatedly demonstrated on this blog from studies conducted around the world. So was the Little Ice Age which followed the MWP & the Dark Ages Cold Period which preceded it, along with the Sui-Tang lesser warm spell within it. So too were the older Roman Warm Period, the Greek Dark Ages Cold Period, the Minoan WP, the cold period before that & the Holocene Climatic Optimum.
For a few of the overwhelming number of studies showing the world-wide reach of the Medieval Warm Period, see:
http://www.co2science.org/data/mwp/mwpp.php
See also:
http://wattsupwiththat.com/2013/10/31/new-paper-shows-medieval-warm-period-was-global-in-scope/
http://www.theregister.co.uk/2012/03/23/warm_period_little_ice_age_global/
http://hockeyschtick.blogspot.com/2012/07/another-broken-hockey-stick-new-paper.html

July 4, 2014 5:18 pm

anonymous – i have no idea what you mean by “indicative of acquiescence on your part”
Has he admitted that the reference material graph is not authentic? If so, I missed it. I did a word search on this page and never found him using the word. He has evaded admitting the graph used was not an authentic IPCC graph.
He writes: “Frankly, it is extraordinary that my defamers found such willing takers for the nonsense that I had “faked” the Telegraph’s graphs. Given the narrow purpose for which the graphs were drawn, there is nothing wrong with them: indeed, their clarity is commendable.”
But the graph is not authentic; we call that a knock-off, imitation, fake, counterfeit, etc. If it was captioned as based on, derived from, etc then the charge would be baseless. It says “from UN 1996 report”. It isn’t. Monckton has not revealed where it’s from – but we know it is not from IPCC 1990. Remember what Dr Mashey wrote: “In academe, this is called false citation, misrepresentation of a source, or falsification/fabrication. Such things can be academic misconduct, not because the curve [on the graph] is wrong ….”
Whether the graph is a fake does not depend on if it is a relatively faithful reproduction – it’s being passed off as authentic. It’s not. And there are material differences despite what some may think. The error in the X-axis title (Years before present) is not there in the fake, nor is the c) in the upper left portion of the graph. We may find it convenient to remove these or ‘correct’ them – but that means they are no longer original sources and can’t be called such.

Robert in Calgary
July 4, 2014 5:31 pm

In news that actually matters, the mighty Germans will be taking on host Brazil in a World Cup semi-final.
Since this thread is now a tap dancing extravaganza, here’s my contribution.

This thread is now ripe for another great Josh cartoon. Kevin as Inspector Clouseau.

NikFromNYC
July 4, 2014 5:46 pm

Kevin misdirects: “…was the MWP global in scope?”
Yes. The proxy studies that show it listed at CO2Science.com are from all over the world. But this news article pointed out a vast historical revisionism that involved a Northern Hemisphere hockey stick of Michael Mann that itself turned back into a MWP restoring bowl when Mann’s conveniently mistaken centering of his principle component analysis was corrected. But a trivial date typo by Monckton somehow merits claims that skepticism against this fraudent revisionism is willfully bogus as personified in Christopher since he’s a liar? What possible motivation would a six year difference in report date make towards deceiving readers about the fact of historical revisionism? Is this typo why you classify the graph as “not authentic?” It’s a well known graph that he submitted, and was indeed in an IPCC report.
I’ve copied some Southern Hemisphere plots of the MWP here:
http://oi62.tinypic.com/9amiqw.jpg

Anonymous
July 4, 2014 6:34 pm

oneillinwisconsin:
The graph as used by Lord Monckton is indeed materially the same as the one found on page 202 of the IPCC report. The differences are immaterial. If you don’t believe me, do the work of overlaying one on the other With minor scaling and rotational changes, the material aspect of the two graphs, namely the curve, is identical. The erroneous caption and labeling as item c in in a three graph group do not change the data that are being discussed. You can be pedantic all you want, but in so doing you are willfully ignoring the pertinent information and instead focusing on meaningless trivialities.
Your words:
"To date we have my claims that:
The reference material graph that purports to be from UN 1996 is not authentic.
The caption for said graph is false.
If Monckton were an academic or serious researcher he may be guilty of misconduct."
On point one, as pointed out above the relevant information in the graph is not materially different from the graph found on page 202 of the IPCC report. Consequently I do not find this claim to be meritorious.
On point two, Lord Monckton has noted that the graph is from the 1990 report and not the 1996 report, so the caption was incorrect. Calling it false may imply an intent to deceive. I do not concur that there was such an intent on the part of Lord Monckton, thus I prefer to call it incorrect, and Lord Monckton has acknowledged as much. As such, I find this claim as well to lack merit.
We have discussed point three and choose to differ regarding whether a determination of misconduct would or would not be made. As I believe that reasonable minds can differ, I’ll call this one a push.

NikFromNYC
July 4, 2014 7:32 pm

Kevin here rises up in the social status hierarchy of tribal allegence to warmongers. Alas his cartoonish overweighting of skeptical foibles that strongly invoke the red flag laugh test means Connolley remains nakedly exposed as a hacktivist spin doctor, civil courts be damned for God now be Michael Mann, so Monckton is the Devil dammit, and by hook or crook we intent to prove it.

July 4, 2014 7:52 pm

That’s DOCTOR CONnolley. :)~

NikFromNYC
July 4, 2014 8:22 pm

[snip – that comparison is a bit over the top – you are welcome to resubmit -mod]

July 4, 2014 8:39 pm

Back now from two [excellent] barbeques, and I have one comment:
I do not agree with O’Neill, but let’s pretend that O’Neill is completely right about everything. What would that mean?
That would mean that he has successfully misdirected the debate toward a trivial difference in charts. Does this matter? Not a bit.
What does matter? Maybe this reminder will help:
The entire “climate change”, “global warming”, “carbon” scare is based on the discredited notion that a rise in CO2 will cause runaway global warming. If it does, then we should be having that debate.
But if it doesn’t, then the alarmist crowd, including O’Neill and Connolley, have been proven wrong. That is the real reason that O’Neill is so wound up and fixated on Lord Monckton: it is much preferable to admitting he has been wrong all along regarding the central issue: does CO2 cause catastrophic AGW? The answer, clearly, is No. Global warming has stopped, and not just recently.
Planet Earth has been demonstrating for the past decade and a half that the alarmist crowd is flat wrong. If they would admit it, then skeptics would be happy to help them determine why their conjecture was wrong, and maybe find an explanation that makes sense. That is how the Scientific Method works. But like an alcoholic, O’Neill must first admit to reality.
As O’Neill shows here, he is incapable of admitting that global warming has stopped. That would negate any serious concern about CO2, and everyone could move on to important things. But instead, O’Neill preposterously claims the MWP was local. [See here. Mouse over interactive charts.] As we see, the MWP was planet-wide, covering both hemispheres.
Skeptics have no problem admitting when we’re wrong. I thought global warming was a serious problem in the late ’90’s. But facts changed, and my views changed with them. That is the glaring difference between skeptics and climate alarmists: alarmists simply cannot admit that they were wrong — even when the planet rubs their nose in it.
As O’Neill writes:
…still unable to admit your initial mistake, eh? It’s really not that hard. Just try typing s-o-r-r-y -I-w-a-s-m-i-s-t-a-k-e-n.
But O’Neill can’t admit his initial mistake. He cannot admit he has been proven wrong about the effect of CO2. Most alarmists cannot admit that their initial belief about CO2 has been shown to be flat wrong. There is a mountain of empirical evidence proving that any warming due to anthropogenic CO2 is too small to measure. So people like O’Neill stick with their religious True Belief, despite all evidence to the contrary. He cannot admit that his initial conjecture turned out to be wrong. Sad, really.

Non Nomen
July 5, 2014 12:53 am

Follow the Money says:
July 3, 2014 at 1:01 pm
The bots got upset now about one newspaper graph from 8 years ago? Really? That is what this is all about?

_________________________________
If that slander isn’t stopped once and for good, it will never end.
[/sarc]

July 5, 2014 12:57 am

This latest dust up sounds like another attempt to make the Medieval Warm Period disappear, like in the ClimateGate emails. Rather than making a lawsuit perhaps Monckton should focus on that.
Bob Clark

richardscourtney
July 5, 2014 1:06 am

oneillsinwisconsin:
I am taking the – probably forlorn and foolish – risk of again trying to help you.
I wrote with genuine attempt to help you at July 4, 2014 at 1:42 pm in a post that is here. I concluded that post saying

Clearly, you are failing to recognise the depth of the hole you are in. Perhaps you need to consider that stopping digging would be sensible.

Your reply was at July 4, 2014 at 1:47 pm and is here. It rejected my attempt at help, said you had refused to read most of my post, provided two ‘red herring’ insults, and attempted to start an ‘angels on a pin’ argument by saying

richardscourtney says:

”You claim Viscount Monckton is responsible for inclusion of a graph in an article when the addition was an Editorial decision of ‘The Daily Telegraph’….”

I stopped reading there because you are WRONG.
I have always referred to the graphs in his reference materials. I don’t care about the ‘Battle of the Graphs’ image.

Well, as others have pointed out, you DID claim that Viscount Monckton is responsible for inclusion of a graph in an article when the addition was an Editorial decision of ‘The Daily Telegraph’. However, I ignored your falsehood because it ignored my expression of concern in attempt to help you. Indeed, your falsehood was a distraction from my attempt to help you, and – concern having failed – I replied first with logic, then with mockery, and after that with ridicule. Nothing worked.
You were determined to keep digging and you still are despite the wide range of people who have now attempted to help you understand your problem.

I now write to ask you to read the thread from my post which first tried to help you (I have provided a link which jumps to it from this post), and to reflect on all the posts from all the people up to this point. For your sake, as has been said to at least two others, I say to you

I beg ye in the bowels of Christ to consider that ye may be wrong.

Richard

Non Nomen
July 5, 2014 1:12 am

Lord Monckton is far too intelligent to tamper or forge data. And imho he is of undoubtable integrity, both giving him a considerable leap of faith.
I am convinced the telegraphists will get a mighty electric shock in court.

July 5, 2014 6:58 am

Non Nomen, that’s given me a good laugh. The good Lord’s list of being economical with the truth is lengthy.
As for Rev Courtney and William Robinson’s communal lack of reading comprehension, Kevin has come up against the traditional debating technique – let’s keep bringing it back to something that has been settled tomavoidnhaving to confront the charge being made. Lord Monckton’s own words suggest there is a case to answer. Let us have a coherent answer to it.

J Murphy
July 5, 2014 6:59 am

“We went to court against Al Gore because his movie was poisonous political propaganda dressed up as science.
We won. Nothing else but a court case would have worked. It was only when the department of education in London were confronted with 80 pages of scientific testimony, and knew that that testimony would stand up in court against all their falsehoods and evasions, that they caved in and settled, paying $400,000 to the plaintiffs and undertaking to circulate 77 pages of corrective guidance to every school in England.”
Christopher Monckton, 3rd Viscount Monckton of Brenchley
(I put the extended title because, as someone else here has already mentioned, quite a few Americans seem to be in awe of British gentry and their titles!)
Anyway, that’s quite a mix-up comment he’s given.
Firstly, if he’s referring to ‘Dimmock v Secretary of State for Education & Skills [2007]’, then the case was against the Secretary of State for Education & Skills (as it says in the title of the case) and not against Al Gore. The claims were under “political indoctrination” and a “duty to secure balanced treatment of political issues” in schools (as judged under ss406 and 407 of the Education Act 1996).
Secondly, the film was allowed to continue to be shown in schools because the final paragraph of the judgement (yes, it went to a form of judgement after opposing arguments were held in front of a judge. There was no ‘caving in’) :
—“In the circumstances, and for those reasons, in the light of the changes to the Guidance Note which the Defendant has agreed to make, and has indeed already made, and upon the Defendant’s agreeing to send such amended Guidance Note out in hard copy, no order is made on this application [“to declare unlawful a decision by the then Secretary of State for Education and Skills to distribute to every state secondary school in the United Kingdom a copy of former US Vice-President Al Gore’s film, An Inconvenient Truth…”], save in relation to costs, on which I shall hear Counsel.”
Thirdly, the “80 pages of scientific testimony” must refer to the defence case because the judge says, among other things:
—“The following is clear:
i) It is substantially founded upon scientific research and fact, albeit that the science is used, in the hands of a talented politician and communicator, to make a political statement and to support a political programme.”
—“I have no doubt that Dr Stott, the Defendant’s expert, is right when he says that:
‘Al Gore’s presentation of the causes and likely effects of climate change in the film was broadly accurate.'”
—“Mr Downes [the claimant’s Counsel, i.e. the one trying to prevent the film being shown] produced a long schedule of such alleged errors or exaggerations and waxed lyrical in that regard. It was obviously helpful for me to look at the film with his critique in hand.
In the event I was persuaded that only some of them were sufficiently persuasive to be relevant for the purposes of his argument…”
—“References are helpfully now given to the IPCC report.”
Fourthly, I have read that Dimmock’s costs were approximately £200,000, of which the Government department had to pay two-thirds of them, i.e. about £140,000. This left Dimmock (and his backers) with a bill of approximately £60,000. Can Christopher Monckton, 3rd Viscount Monckton of Brenchley confirm or deny this?
Finally, the Guidance booklet has a total of 70 pages. How can “77 pages of corrective guidance” fit inside that?
The judgement is here : http://www.bailii.org/ew/cases/EWHC/Admin/2007/2288.html
The booklet is here: http://www.google.it/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=1&ved=0CCIQFjAA&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.ase.org.uk%2Fdocuments%2Fclimate-change-revised-guidance%2FCCrevisedguidanceNov07.pdf&ei=Sfq3U7KcHIuQ4gTc_IC4BQ&usg=AFQjCNFFkWBAAq5TbxdNMzzW-fLUa3LvEQ&sig2=91ExlfGzAAGzKdYnsNVB6A&bvm=bv.70138588,d.bGE
(This is what the notes say on the web page next to the Guidance booklet:
—“In 2007, judicial review proceedings were issued in the High Court challenging the distribution of the Climate Change film pack for teachers, which had been sent to secondary schools. The claim argued that use of the pack and, in particular, showing the film, ‘An Inconvenient Truth’, would place local authorities and schools in breach of ss. 406 and 407 of the Education Act 1996.
On 10 October, the High Court ruled that it is lawful for schools to use ‘An Inconvenient Truth’ and the other parts of the climate change pack in accordance with this amended guidance.”)

J Murphy
July 5, 2014 7:06 am

And does anyone know of any climate-related libel proceedings Christopher Monckton, 3rd Viscount Monckton of Brenchley has actually threatened, carried out, followed through with and won?

Jud
July 5, 2014 7:09 am

O’Neill. As someone with 100% Irish blood, and who has had the pleasure of knowing many much more honorable bearers of your name let me clear a few things up.
It turns out Monckton has been openly called a liar by your colleagues(and, who knows, maybe by you too – it would be interesting to see what the record shows there) for many years based on an allegation he made ‘fake’ charts for a Telegraph article.
Now that it has come to his attention he has – very reasonably – asked for a retraction.
Rather than offer that retraction I am seeing a couple of things happening.
Things that, by the way, are absolutely typical of warmist sleaze and evasion.
The stoat – who seems to have disappeared – has doubled down on his liar accusation – even though the original basis for it has been clearly demonstrated to be wrong.
That is, Monckton had absolutely nothing to do with the creation of the graph that supposedly shows him to be a liar.
The stoat’s apprentice, meanwhile, has picked up something equivalent to a typo (which had already been openly acknowledged by Monckton, and which has zero bearing on the original ‘liar’ accusations) and is trying to make that the crux of the ‘liar’ debate.
Your objective has been to divert the fire on the stoat over the substantive issue.
In that respect I say well done – there hasn’t been much said on the actual issue since you decided to clog up the discussion.
On the other hand you should be ashamed of yourself.
Either man up and address the main issue – that Monckton has been erroneously called a liar for several years – or go back to the stoat’s echo chamber from whence you no doubt came.

richardscourtney
July 5, 2014 7:45 am

J Murphy:
Your post at July 5, 2014 at 6:59 am concerns the legal case of ‘Dimmock v Secretary of State for Education & Skills [2007]‘. Viscount Monckton’s brief mention of it was true and accurate. Your post is misleading, and probably deliberately misleads as a method to side-track the thread onto irrelevant discussion of that case.
A short and reasonable understanding of the legal issues pertaining to Gore’s film in the UK is here.
This thread is not about that. It is the long-standing and repeated libel concerning the graph in the Daily Telegraph.
Richard

richardscourtney
July 5, 2014 7:51 am

Margaret H@rdma@n:
At July 5, 2014 at 6:58 am you assert

Lord Monckton’s own words suggest there is a case to answer

Really!? I am astonished to learn of that at this late stage.
Please quote and cite “Lord Monckton’s own words” which you assert “suggest there is a case to answer”. Or are you merely throwing an unjustifiable smear?
Richard

July 5, 2014 7:59 am

I appreciate honesty. Thanks Anthony.
Based on the simplest available evidence, I was ready to conclude, as were many, that indeed Monckton had created the graph, that it was in error, and that he had refused to admit to any of this. I was ready to censure him myself, just as the over-the-top Stoaters wanted to do, probably so Connolley could direct a new denigrating Wikipedia entry as he is known to do (he’s not allowed to edit Wikipedia pages of living persons anymore, so he directs by proxy). Now, after further investigation I can tell you I was wrong, and so is Connolley.

J Murphy
July 5, 2014 8:31 am

richardscourtney, Christopher Monckton, 3rd Viscount Monckton of Brenchley himself brought up the Dimmock case, without mentioning the details and the actual recorded result :
“So I am going to court to defend myself and, in so doing against the constant barrage of falsehoods told in support of the Party Line. We went to court against Al Gore because his movie was poisonous political propaganda dressed up as science.”
Please show where the “misleading” parts are in my post, so I can correct them if necessary.
And I don’t need to read other websites personal opinions on the case – I can read the original (and I gave the link for everyone else who is interested), see the words of the judge, and can see that the film is still available to be shown by every state secondary school in the United Kingdom.
The only winning came as a result of common-sense, scientific fact and legal judgement. As usual, the rational and reasoned arguments won and the film can now be watched by children, and they can read the accompanying booklet, knowing that the facts are there for all to see. Something that everyone should be pleased about.

richardscourtney
July 5, 2014 9:03 am

J Murphy:
re your post at July 5, 2014 at 8:31 am.
No, I will not bite your red herring and I commend everybody else to ignore it, too.
This thread is about the patience of Viscount Monckton having exhausted so he is planning legal redress for the untrue smears about the ‘Telegraph graph’. I fully understand why warmunists want to discuss anything other than that, but please have those diascussions where it is not an irrelevant nuisance.
Richard

Non Nomen
July 5, 2014 9:25 am

Margaret Hardman says:
July 5, 2014 at 6:58 am
Non Nomen, that’s given me a good laugh. The good Lord’s list of being economical with the truth is lengthy.
As for Rev Courtney and William Robinson’s communal lack of reading comprehension, Kevin has come up against the traditional debating technique – let’s keep bringing it back to something that has been settled tomavoidnhaving to confront the charge being made. Lord Monckton’s own words suggest there is a case to answer. Let us have a coherent answer to it.
____________________________
So you certainly have no problem with presenting that lenghty list in full here, have you?

July 5, 2014 9:31 am

Margaret Hardman says:
The good Lord’s list of being economical with the truth is lengthy.
Please give us that long list, because I for one missed it.

Non Nomen
July 5, 2014 11:23 am

Margaret Hardman: don’t let us wait until the cows come home to see that list! I am really keen on having a look at it,

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