About that graph…

clip_image001This one:

The title “Battle of the Graphs” certainly lives on, even though it is approaching a decade in age, as there has been a lot of off-topic contention on this WUWT thread as well as a free-for-all bashing over at the “Stoat” a.k.a. William Connolley (who “takes science by the throat”, implying he is some sort of “tough guy”) saying that this graph that appeared in a Telegraph article was erroneous and created by Christopher Monckton.

Based on the simplest available evidence, I was ready to conclude, as were many, that indeed Monckton had created the graph, that it was in error, and that he had refused to admit to any of this.  I was ready to censure him myself, just as the over-the-top Stoaters wanted to do, probably so Connolley could direct a new denigrating Wikipedia entry as he is known to do (he’s not allowed to edit Wikipedia pages of living persons anymore, so he directs by proxy). Now, after further investigation I can tell you I was wrong, and so is Connolley.

If Monckton was wrong I certainly would’ve had no trouble pointing this out just as the Stoaters were doing, but I have one advantage that neither Monckton nor the Stoaters have: I have actually worked at a newspaper and I have submitted articles as a guest author to newspapers. So, I am familiar with the artwork process. Further, I have also published a number of articles from Monckton myself here and I am quite familiar with his style of producing graphs.

Thus, I noticed something about the Telegraph article that no one else seemed to.

WUWT commenter Kevin O’Neill, who also frequents Connolley’s website pointed out in this comment the charges against Monckton.

First let’s have a look at the article itself. The URL for it is:

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/1533290/Climate-chaos-Dont-believe-it.html

A screencap of the heading portion is shown below with the highlight done by me in yellow.

Telegraph_monckton_2006

Unfortunately the link under the yellow highlight no longer works and so for some it is impossible to check Monckton’s references and calculations that were included with the essay. We’ll get back to that in a moment, please read on.

Here is how the article presented the graph that is in contention, I have screen captured a portion of the original Telegraph article:

Telegraph_monckton_2006_graph

Several things immediately struck me as being out of place when I first saw the graph after reading about the contention surrounding it, here is a list.

  • The style (colors, font, etc) is not anything like I’ve ever seen from Monckton in all the graphs he has submitted to WUWT.
  • The horizontal lines on the bottom portion of the graph are obviously spaced incorrectly (the 20th century average line looks like it is incorrect on left axis) along with other cues in the plot line indicating to me that they were hand-drawn yet I’ve never gotten the graph from Monckton that was hand-drawn. Everything he has ever sent me has always been from a computer program output, thus the idea of having improperly spaced lines and coordinates a hand drawn plot didn’t make sense to me.
  • My experience with newspapers told me that this was likely a graph that was prepared by the art department of the UK Telegraph. You see, all major newspapers and even some middle and minor ones have an art department. And, when they get some sort of illustration from a guest author, or data from a government report, they almost always redraw it to fit the style and format of the newspaper. Especially the colors and the fonts.

Just look at any major newspaper in the United States like USA Today when they get in data from say, the Labor Department, they produce their own graphs of that data. They can also make grievous mistakes with such data in the way it is presented such as this article from Charles Apple (who watches newspapers and the graphics and photos they produce) demonstrates:

110706UsaTodayWeatherSnapshot02[1]

Obviously, neither the editor nor the artist saw the sexual suggestion in the imagery. I don’t blame the NWS or the Red Cross who provided the data, I blame Doyle Rice and Julie Snider. Note the references at the bottom of the graphic.

Here, USA Today took data from the National Weather Service and the American Red Cross and turned it into what is obviously a ridiculous graphic. It got past the editor, and made it into the final publication.

I noted such references to internal artists, editors, and sources were missing from the UK Telegraph article as seen in the screen cap further above, and it is this omission that I believe led many people to conclude that Monckton produced that graphic.

If you examine other graphics from the UK Telegraph, you will find that they do have such references but they are also similarly designed and of a similar size with similar fonts and colors. For example, look at this graphic from 2005 that has been redrawn, but no mention given of an internal reference to The Telegraph art department:

Telegraph_GW_2005Source: http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/4198339/Global-warming-will-bring-cooler-climate-for-UK.html

It is plainly obvious that is a graphic created by the newspaper and not by any scientific entity, otherwise it wouldn’t have the jagged shadow edges. So, the question surrounding the graph allegedly produced by Christopher Monckton is; did he included in the original list of references that he provided the Telegraph in that now missing link at the top of the original article? I’m happy to say I have found that original source file that Monckton provided to the Telegraph. It was lodged in the Wayback machine. I was able to find it simply by putting in the correct URL of the original Telegraph article as shown below:

https://web.archive.org/web/20090301000000*/http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/1533290/Climate-chaos-Dont-believe-it.htmlWayback_Monckton_telegraph

When you pull up the archive from 2009, the link appears for the PDF file of Monckton’s references but unfortunately it gives a 404 as seen below:

Wayback_Monckton_telegraph2

Oddly though if you click on  the LEFT MOST vertical lines  (circa 2007/2008) in the timeline above, the PDF will actually download, and that is what I did. For those of you that would doubt this you can go here and try it yourself:

Click to access warm-refs.pdf

And for posterity, here is a local link to the PDF of the References Monckton provided for the Telegraph article in 2006: warm-refs

If you open that PDF file you will notice a number of graphs and references including the graph from IPCC section 7 graph C. McIntyre speaks of its source here.

But no trace of the exact artwork combination as presented above appears in the Telegraph article is in Monckton’s reference PDF file, clearly indicating that the telegraph art department redrew that 1990 IPCC graph and the hockey stick graph, changing the top-bottom order. Below is page 6 from Monckton’s “warm-refs” PDF file, showing those graphs:

Monckton_Warm_refs_page6

While I was ready to condemn Monckton for producing a sloppy graph like many of these Stoaters, it is now abundantly clear to me that he did not draw it and the claims by these people are erroneous and simply mendacious.

Stoat/Connelley is simply flat wrong, and the website that cited Monckton’s graphic as an example of what not to do needs to clarify that it was the newspaper that made the errors, that the source graphs came from the IPCC, and that Monckton drew none of them.

All this breastbeating over something that can be simply researched as I have done is just a waste of everyone’s time.

Monckton prepared a rebuttal as well which I present below.

=================================================================

There comes a point …

By Christopher Monckton of Brenchley

Those of us who have raised questions about the magnitude of Man’s influence on climate have become used to the expensively funded, often carefully co-ordinated campaigns of personal vilification organized by adherents of the Climatist Party Line. Occasionally we growl a little. More often we refuse to be distracted. We carry on.

The purpose of these relentless attacks on us is not only to do us down but also to frighten off third parties who might otherwise find the courage to speak out and express their own doubts about the Party Line.

But there comes a point when it is necessary to take action. I hope no one will disagree that that point is reached when allegations of lying or fabrication are made; when the allegations are unquestionably false; when they are persisted in despite requests to cease and desist; and when they are widely disseminated in a manner calculated baselessly to cause maximum reputational damage.

Recently a commenter at Jo Nova’s blog posted several comments to the effect that I had “faked” a graph. I quickly asked Jo to replace them with a note to say legal proceedings were in train. Enough, I had decided, was enough.

Here is the diagram I was supposed to have “faked”:

clip_image001

This surely blameless diagram appeared alongside an article I had written for the Sunday Telegraph on 5 November 2006, the first time I ever went public on the climate question. The article went live on the internet at midnight on a Saturday night. Two hours later the Telegraph’s website crashed, for 127,000 people had tried to access the article.

Now, it is not the custom of UK newspapers to ask their contributors to illustrate their articles. As usual, I was not consulted and offered no advice on the matter, and had no hand in their production and no foreknowledge that they were to be used. The graphs are not labeled as having been sourced from the IPCC (indeed, one of the graphs has the shadow of a hockey stick overlaid on it and marked as the “IPCC ‘hockey stick’”, making it blindingly obvious that it is not an official IPCC’s graph).

The Telegraph’s graphs are simple and, it seems to me, harmless schematics illustrating the difference between the representations of 1000 years’ global temperatures as they appeared in the IPCC’s 2001 (top) and 1990 (bottom) reports.

The graph from p. 202 of the IPCC’s 1990 report now looks like this:

clip_image003

With the article I supplied some background material for Telegraph readers on its website. In that material, the IPCC’s 1990 graph also appeared, mistakenly captioned as 1996 rather than 1990. The graph as I reproduced it looked like this:

clip_image005

What I had not realized until very recently was that for several years allegations had been circulated all over the place to the effect that I had fabricated the graphs that had appeared in the Sunday Telegraph article. Yet not one of those who had made these allegations had ever contacted me to verify the facts. And not one of them had said what was wrong with the Telegraph’s graphs anyway.

Perhaps the worst of the many allegations of dishonesty against me appeared on a “science education” website, where an entire section under the bold heading “Misuse of scientific images” was devoted to the Telegraph’s graphs.

The offending section contained the following untruths:

  • Ø that in that article I had “disputed the concept of climate change” (Not that old chestnut again! I had accepted the concept but queried its likely magnitude);
  • Ø that the Telegraph’s graphs were instances of “poor use of graphical displays” that “can confuse and obscure data” (No, they neatly showed the main point: in 1990 the medieval warm period and little ice age were shown clearly, but by 2001 both had gone, and a sharp uptick in the 20th century had been added);
  • Ø that I had “created the [1990] graph on the bottom using different calculations that did not take into account all of the variables that climate scientists used to create the top graph” (No, I had not created either graph or done any calculations for such a graph);
  • Ø that I had deployed “common techniques used to distort visual forms of data – manipulating axes, changing one of the variables in a comparison, changing calculations without full explanation – that can obscure a true comparison” (No, none of the above); and
  • Ø that the article had been published in the Daily Telegraph (No, the Sunday Telegraph, and that suggests the website had never seen the original article but had picked up the libel from somewhere else).

I only discovered that this spectacularly inaccurate and profoundly damaging infestation of allegations when the commenter at Jo Nova’s site who had accused me of “faking” the graph mentioned on his own blog that I had not objected to the libel as it appeared on the science-education website. I had not objected because I had not known about it. No one at that website had thought to check any of the facts with me, or, as far as one can tell, with anyone else.

In short order a letter before action was sent to the website, which promptly did the right thing and took out the entire section, though there are indications that attempts are being made in some quarters – unsuccessfully so far – to get them to put it back up again.

I gave the commenter at Jo Nova’s website who had accused me of “faking” the graphs several chances to retract and apologize. Instead, he and several others sneeringly doubled down by accusing me of “lying” when I had said the graphs at the Telegraph website had not purported to be, and had not been labeled as, IPCC graphs.

They also alleged that the graph in my background materials accompanying the Telegraph article was “not the same graph” as that from the IPCC’s 1990 report: in effect, that I had “faked” that one as well. Judge that for yourselves from the two monochrome versions of the graph above. There seem to me to be no material differences, and I think it would be hard for the defendants to convince a court that there were any.

So I am going to court. My lawyers say the libels are plain and indefensible. They comment additionally that no judge would regard the schematics in the Telegraph (whoever had drawn them) as significantly misrepresenting the difference between the 1990 and 2001 reports’ images of the past millennium’s global temperature anomalies. As far as they can see, there is not a lot wrong with the graphs in any event.

I have told this story not only because some commenters here have been unwise enough to repeat in threads here the allegations they have made elsewhere but also because I thought it might be time to reveal the steps we have to take on an almost weekly basis to try to stem the tide of false allegations directed at us.

Nor am I by any means the only victim. For years, this shadowy Propagandaamt has been tampering with Fred Singer’s Wikipedia page to allege that he believes in Martians.

Niklas Mörner, the sea-level expert, has had his page got at on the ground that he sometimes dowses for water or other underground treasure. My late father once did that for the Maltese Government, and found three lost Punic tombs and a fine marble head of Seneca from the first century AD. My drawing of it (in the day before digital cameras) is probably still to be found somewhere in the Museum of Classical Archaeology at Cambridge. But I never had the knack for dowsing myself.

A pressure-group founded and funded by Prince Charles is prone to intervene to try (unsuccessfully, the last time they tried it on me) to prevent the publication of skeptical scientific papers in British learned journals.

A team of paid hacks telephones the Chancellor and the Dean of the Faculty at every university at which skeptics are invited to speak. About half the time, they succeed in getting us disinvited.

Journal editors are sacked for printing papers by skeptics.

However much one might hope that scientific discourse can be conducted in an open atmosphere of sensible dialog, the truth is that on the climate it can’t, because the extremists won’t play fair. The Politburo are determined to keep the scare going for just a little longer, till they can get the Treaty of Paris safely signed by all nations in December 2015.

So I am going to court to defend myself and, in so doing against the constant barrage of falsehoods told in support of the Party Line. We went to court against Al Gore because his movie was poisonous political propaganda dressed up as science.

We won. Nothing else but a court case would have worked. It was only when the department of education in London were confronted with 80 pages of scientific testimony, and knew that that testimony would stand up in court against all their falsehoods and evasions, that they caved in and settled, paying $400,000 to the plaintiffs and undertaking to circulate 77 pages of corrective guidance to every school in England.

In the present case, the other side has blinked thrice. On the website of my defamer, there is a nervous little note that he will not give me his name and address unless I answer various impertinent questions of his. The court will have no patience with any nonsense of that sort.

And there are now various postings at the same blog, again rather nervous, saying that perhaps they could plead that I don’t have a reputation and they can accuse me of whatever they like.

They will be unwise to take that line. For if they say I have no reputation they have to be able to come up with evidence that any material detrimental to my reputation on which they may try to rely is true. And most of it is no more accurate than their accusations that I “faked” a graph that I had plainly not faked. If they waste the court’s time with point after point that has nothing to do with the case at hand, they will merely aggravate the damages they will have to pay.

Finally, the perp has been unwise enough to admit that at the time when he made his allegation of “fakery” he did not know whether I had “faked” the graph or not. In the courts, to make a damaging and untrue allegation not knowing whether or not it is true is as culpable as making it when one knows it is not true. And there is no defense once that admission has been made. It has been made.

There is a curious and touching notion among some skeptics that, since the truth will of course prevail in the end, we should persevere with the scientific argument but not take the defamers and the scamsters to court. The feeling is that using the courts somehow isn’t cricket.

Sometimes, though, it’s necessary to play hardball. Being Valiant for Truth is not for wimps.

================================================================

UPDATE:

From comments, Steve McIntyre finds another version of the Lamb/IPCC AR1 1990 graph, which looks to me to be much closer to the graph used in the Telegraph article. This graph does NOT appear in Monkton’s PDF.

He writes in a comment:

The lower panel of the Telegraph diagram appears to have derived from (what appears to be) a variation of the Lamb graphic, a variation that I had not noticed until now. The variation appears in the following blog posts (and visually matches almost exactly):

LAMB_2ndversion

http://drtimball.com/2011/they-are-still-trying-to-rewrite-climate-to-show-current-conditions-are-abnormal/

http://hockeyschtick.blogspot.ca/2009/12/from-mann-paper-in-nature.html

Neither blog post provides a citation for the figure, but there are clues that should enable its exact provenance to be tracked down fairly quickly. It appears to be from a book about European climate and have been developed by Lamb. It is unclear why the Telegraph would have used this variation instead of the IPCC 1990 variation, but doubtless we will find out in due course.

UPDATE2:

Nick Stokes adds in comments (bold mine):

There is a version of that graph at the John Daly site here. The article does not seem to be dated, but Daly is indicated as the author, which would make it 2004 or earlier. No source given.

Here is the graph from John Daly’s website, listed as figure 4:

And here is the Metadata, dating the creation of it precisely to Feb 10, 2004, two years before Monckton’s article in the Telegraph.

(right click on image at Daly’s website here to verify yourself)

John-Daly-Metadata-1000yrs

Nick Stokes adds in a second comment:

Steve McIntyre says: July 3, 2014 at 12:12 pm

“The lower panel of the Telegraph diagram appears to have derived from (what appears to be) a variation of the Lamb graphic, a variation that I had not noticed until now.”

Here, on the Wayback machine, is a version from 2001 on the John Daly site.

And the screencap:

John-Daly-solar-2001-wayback

Since Daly’s graph is a near perfect match for the one in the Telegraph, and appears as far back as April 21, 2001, and Monckton did not provide it in his PDF to the Telegraph, I’d say “case closed”.

UPDATE3:

There is some whingeing from Kevin O’Neill in comments that Figure 7.1c from IPCC AR1 WG1 chapter 7 (available here: http://www.ipcc.ch/ipccreports/far/wg_I/ipcc_far_wg_I_chapter_07.pdf ) was not “faithfully” reproduced in my article, even though I made a reference to a technical discussion at Climate Audit on that specific graph and the exact figure appears no less than 3 times in the essay split between my own and Monckton’s

If you open that PDF file you will notice a number of graphs and references including the graph from IPCC section 7 graph C. McIntyre speaks of its source here.

To satisfy such whingeing, here is the exact page from IPCC AR1 WG1 chapter 7, followed by a magnified view of figure 7.1 (including graphs A,B, and C) in case Mr. O’Neill wants to claim “a magnified version is needed for readers with poor eyesight” as part of his game. I challenge him and readers to find any material difference between the graphs below taken directly from the IPCC WG1 Chapter 7 page 202 and those in the essay.

 

IPCC_FAR_Figure 7-1_page202

Magnified figure 7.1abc:

IPCC_FAR_Figure 7-1abc

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July 4, 2014 12:45 pm

I see no portcullis in the graph in question. Isn’t that changing the goal posts?

NikFromNYC
July 4, 2014 12:51 pm

Kevin now digs deeper by slanderously equating seasoned climate skepticism about the now undeniably *fraudulent* hockey stick version of temperature history with the naive sensationalism of a politician. Kevin also now oddly claims that the news article graph which is itself merely a quite fair and accurate boilerplate comparison of a hot past versus a fraudulently cold past has Monckton’s graphic moniker attached to it despite being illustrated in the style of the newspaper without any graphic logo actually on it. Kevin in big lie fashion parrots the same lame claim that only the tiny hockey stick team proxy studies merit attention while he simply ignores the fact that the vast majority of worldwide proxy studies reveal precedent for contemporary warming in medieval times as are collected on the CO2Science.com web site in its MWP section.

oneillsinwisconsin
July 4, 2014 12:52 pm

dbstealey – You are referring to the ‘Battle of the Graphs’ image. That image was NOT in the reference materials.
The reference materials graph is at the top of the post in whose comment thread we abide.
http://wattsupwiththat.files.wordpress.com/2014/07/monckton_warm_refs_page6.png?w=640
The claim is NOT that Monckton created said graph (in the reference materials) but that he falsely attributed it to the IPCC. It is not an authentic IPCC graph. The caption is false.
Why do people comment when they haven’t read and cannot follow the threads of a discussion?

oneillsinwisconsin
July 4, 2014 12:58 pm

Notice how there is no response on the substance of Figure 7.1.c and the text of the report?
The authors clearly indicated they questioned its application to global temperatures. Lamb never claimed it was representative of global temperatures. Yet how many times as it been trotted out as ‘proof’ of the MWP as a global phenomenon? How many separate posts here and other skeptical sites have used it without ever once mentioning the caveats?

Monckton of Brenchley
July 4, 2014 1:07 pm

To those who unwisely try to maintain that the graph in my reference materials was not the graph from IPCC (1990), when they should have retracted and apologized for their allegation that I lied about it, I say that the caption shown in my reference materials is the caption shown in the graph from IPCC (1990), i.e. “1000 AD 1500 AD 1900 AD”. The graphs themselves are identical in all material particulars.

July 4, 2014 1:11 pm

Notice how there is no response on the substance of Rep Hank Johnson?
And notice how there is no response on the substance of: If I am wrong, then simply post testable, measurable scientific evidence quantifying the fraction of a degree of global warming caused by human GHG emissions. That should be simple, since scientists have been looking for exactly those measurements for more than 30 years. ?
The basic debate is, and always has been, over the conjecture that CO2 causes global T to measurably rise. Since the alarmist crowd has decisively lost that debate, all they are left with is minor nitpicking.

July 4, 2014 1:14 pm

Well, we’ve been invited to two barbeques and Mrs S says it’s time to go, so I will withdraw from the debate for now. ☺

July 4, 2014 1:19 pm

Here is the graph on page 202 of the 1990s IPPC report.
http://www.ipcc.ch/ipccreports/far/wg_I/ipcc_far_wg_I_full_report.pdf

oneillsinwisconsin
July 4, 2014 1:21 pm

I just did a quick Google search for text “the shorter Medieval Warm Period around 1000 AD” – a direct quote from the Executive Summary and which is followed immediately in the Summary by the parenthetical remark “(which may not have been global)” . I enclosed the quoted text in double quotes so that I would only get returns that included the entire phrase.
Google returned 45 hits. Only 12 were displayed. Not one came from a skeptical site – except where used in the comments to rebut a misrepresentation of the Lamb schematic.
In other words, I cannot find a single skeptical climate poster/blogger/writer that has ever quoted the Executive Summary’s indication that the MWP may not have been global. Not one. Brandon Smith is not alone.

oneillsinwisconsin
July 4, 2014 1:29 pm

Monckton of Brenchley – The caption for you upper figure clearly says, “from UN 1996 report”
“1000 AD 1500 AD 1900 AD” are labels – they are not the caption.
http://wattsupwiththat.files.wordpress.com/2014/07/monckton_warm_refs_page6.png?w=640

NikFromNYC
July 4, 2014 1:36 pm

I wonder if I’ll get redacted again over at Willipedia’s blog:
“How can you guys just ignore the MWP revealing proxy studies from the Southern Hemisphere in order to discount the MWP as being just a local event that didn’t amount to real climate history? Just pretend out loud they don’t exist?! Claiming the MWP was just Northern itself is a claim that falsifies hockey sticks since most of them are Northern hemisphere claims too. The highly technical wording of your arguments can’t and hasn’t concealed this intellectual circus. It’s shocking that mainstream climate “science” also promotes your activist view of things that falsifies itself upon closer examination. I call it a circus since the argument goes in circles such that hockey sticks are real since the MWP was only Northern and look here we found a hockey stick in the South too so that confirms the Northern one and Monckton presented a falsified diagram of the MWP that was only local so our also Northern hockey stick is real since the MWP didn’t occur in the South too, since we ignore studies that say it did since those studies are only tabulated on a “denier” web site called CO2Science.com. Also don’t talk further about Marcott fabricated blade or we will “redact” you since we “covered” the latest hockey stick before.”

richardscourtney
July 4, 2014 1:42 pm

oneillsinwisconsin:
re your series of posts culminating with the one at July 4, 2014 at 1:21 pm.
Clearly, you do not understand the problem you have.
Viscount Monckton intends to sue YOU for assertions YOU made.
Statements and actions of politicians, Brandon Smith or anybody else are not relevant.
You claim Viscount Monckton is responsible for inclusion of a graph in an article when the addition was an Editorial decision of ‘The Daily Telegraph’. For your claim to be true you must show that Viscount Monckton personally agreed to inclusion of the graph prior to its publication, but you have not.
You assert that Viscount Monckton did not include all caveats the IPCC provided with the graph. That, too, is not relevant because nobody disputes the IPCC said those caveats were possibilities and not facts (that is what the word “may” means).
You claim the graph is materially different from a graph published by the IPCC. You have not stated any such material difference and none is apparent.
You claim these issues pertaining to the graph amount to Viscount Monckton having deliberately published falsehood, he denies that and is taking you to court for libel.
Clearly, you are failing to recognise the depth of the hole you are in. Perhaps you need to consider that stopping digging would be sensible.
Richard

oneillsinwisconsin
July 4, 2014 1:47 pm

richardscourtney says:”You claim Viscount Monckton is responsible for inclusion of a graph in an article when the addition was an Editorial decision of ‘The Daily Telegraph’….” I stopped reading there because you are WRONG.
I have always referred to the graphs in his reference materials. I don’t care about the ‘Battle of the Graphs’ image. The reference material was put together by Monckton. The graphs that were included in the reference materials were Monckton’s decision. The mistakes in the reference materials are Monckton’s and have nothing to do with the Telegraph.
Why do people comment that cannot read and follow a thread? Are you dbstealey’s twin?

richardscourtney
July 4, 2014 2:06 pm

oneillsinwisconsin:
I am saddened by your post addressed to me at July 4, 2014 at 1:47 pm.
I wrote a post (at July 4, 2014 at 1:42 pm) which attempted to help you by assisting you to understand your grave problem which your posts in this thread are increasing.
Your reply was to say “WRONG” to my first point, to say you had not read most of what I wrote, and to conclude by making the laughable implication that I “cannot read and follow a thread”.
oneillsinwisconsin, it is no wonder that you are in this great mess and making your situation worse when you rebut attempts to help you understand your problem by metaphorically putting your fingers in your ears and shouting ‘I won’t hear you! I won’t hear you! I won’t …’.
Richard

oneillsinwisconsin
July 4, 2014 2:07 pm

To refresh anyone that may have missed my offer in the previous post on this topic – since it was very near the end of the comments. I made what I consider to be a charitable offer to Monckton of Brenchley:
I will retract my claim that Monckton of Brenchley lied, *if* he will explicitly state:
A) The caption on Page 6 of his reference materials is wrong.
B) That the figure on Page 6, purportedly from IPCC 1996, is not from either IPCC 1996 or IPCC 1990 and that the figure is not authentic, i.e., a fake.
C) His research methods were shoddy and only excused by the fact he is neither an academic nor a serious researcher.

A) is demonstrably true.
B) is demonstrably true
C) Is Monckton’s own excuse for not being guilty of misconduct
If this is being dragged out it is by Monckton’s own design. I have *zero* fear of a libel suit. None whatsoever. If anything, it will give me an excuse to visit Europe. I have even charitably offered to withdraw the charge if he will simply state what is known to be true or already admitted.

oneillsinwisconsin
July 4, 2014 2:13 pm

richardscourtney – when someone starts off a comment by getting an essential fact WRONG – I feel no need to read further. I notice in your recent post you fail to admit you were wrong.
If I were Monckton of Brenchley I’d be threatening you with a libel suit for making a false accusation against me – since you wrote, “You claim Viscount Monckton is responsible for inclusion of a graph in an article when the addition was an Editorial decision of ‘The Daily Telegraph’…” and I never made any such claim and you have failed to either admit you were wrong or apologize.

Simon
July 4, 2014 2:17 pm

From what I have read of Mr Monckton, I think it highly unlikely he will carry through on his threat to sue. The loud Lord has a history of threatening action of this kind without much happening
http://www.stuff.co.nz/national/education/8545516/Sceptics-ire-amuses-but-views-retain-sting
But, I for one hope he does. It will make for great entertainment. I have never heard of this O’Neill fellow, but he seems as sharp as a tack. If nothing else, he has sparked a great conversation here.

richardscourtney
July 4, 2014 2:17 pm

oneillsinwisconsin:
At July 4, 2014 at 2:07 pm you say

I have *zero* fear of a libel suit. None whatsoever.

If that be true then you are a fool. And it explains your inability to see the problem you have; you are too stupid to see it.
Richard

oneillsinwisconsin
July 4, 2014 2:19 pm

richardscourtney – are you offering legal advice? Generally on the web that is accompanied by a disclaimer – IANAL – unless you are a lawyer. In which case, which law school – I want to make sure any lawyer I may ever hire in my life never went there.

NikFromNYC
July 4, 2014 2:21 pm

Kevin spins: “Notice how there is no response on the substance of Figure 7.1.c and the text of the report? / The authors clearly indicated they questioned its application to global temperatures. Lamb never claimed it was representative of global temperatures. Yet how many times as it been trotted out as ‘proof’ of the MWP as a global phenomenon? How many separate posts here and other skeptical sites have used it without ever once mentioning the caveats?”
Yet in the IPCC report itself the graph is described as being global: “Schematic diagrams of global temperature variations.”
The only caveat included was: “…though it is still not clear whether all of the fluctuations indicated were truly global.”
The report also says that the former hot era 5-6K years ago was “worldwide.”
The great irony here is that claiming the MWP was only Northern becomes an admission that Northern hockey sticks stand falsified, meaning nearly all hockey sticks. Logic destroys their claims that seem to merely amount to word games as, in a public debate, William and Kevin are loudly accusing Christopher of lying but when challenged only offer arcane technicalities well within the norms of newspaper publishing, as they double down with new claims of lying based on obscure “mistakes” made in reference materials where any casual observer can see no mistakes at all, just everyday schematics that are used for reference by everyone involved in the climate debate.
Maybe these Wikipedia guys can plead insanity.

oneillsinwisconsin
July 4, 2014 2:22 pm

Simon – I appreciate the sentiment, but it’s really not a case that I’m so sharp; rather they’re so dull. I only look sharp in comparison.

richardscourtney
July 4, 2014 2:26 pm

oneillsinwisconsin:
Your post at July 4, 2014 at 2:19 pm adds to the evidence of your stupidity.
No, you silly boy, I did not and I have not given any legal advice.
I pointed out that only a fool enters into a legal dispute with what you call “*zero* fear” because the only certainty about a court case is that the lawyers will make money.
It seems that your severe inability at reading comprehension is part of the reason you are in the mess with Viscount Monckton.
Richard

oneillsinwisconsin
July 4, 2014 2:30 pm

NikFromNYC writes: “…when challenged only offer arcane technicalities well within the norms of newspaper publishing..”
Again and again. The newspaper did NOT publish Monckton’s reference materials. He compiled his reference materials. He selected the reference material graphs for inclusion. He is responsible for the mistakes in the reference materials – the Telegraph had nothing to do with them.
dbstealey, richardscourtney, NikFromNYC — please people, read the thread and attempt to understand it before you chime with something that is completely wrong.
NikFromNYC adds:”The only caveat included was….” Wrong. I gave two examples in my post that addressed the substance of Figure 7.1.c. So, either you can’t count past one or you can’t read. I don’t really care and I’ve given up on anyone actually admitting a mistake. At least we have an audience of one (Simon) that recognizes how poor your collective arguments are.

oneillsinwisconsin
July 4, 2014 2:35 pm

richardscourtney – still unable to admit your initial mistake, eh? It’s really not that hard. Just try typing s-o-r-r-y -I-w-a-s-m-i-s-t-a-k-e-n

richardscourtney
July 4, 2014 2:39 pm

oneillsinwisconsin:
re your post at July 4, 2014 at 2:35 pm.
Yes, I am very sorry that I made the mistake of trying to help you.
I was very, very mistaken because – as everybody can now see – you are so stupid that you are incapable of being helped.
Richard

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