Guest Post by Willis Eschenbach
Well, this has been a circuitous journey. I started out to research volcanoes. First I got distracted by the question of model sensitivity, as I described in Model Climate Sensitivity Calculated Directly From Model Results. Then I was diverted by the question of smoothing of the Otto data, as I reported on in Volcanoes: Active, Inactive, and Retroactive. It’s like Mae West said, “I started out as Snow White … but then I drifted.” The good news is that in the process, I gained the understanding needed to direct my volcano research. Read the first of the links if you haven’t, it’s a prelude to this post.
Unlike the situation with say greenhouse gases, we actually can measure how much sunlight is lost when a volcano erupts. The volcano puts reflective sulfur dioxide into the air, reducing the sunlight hitting the ground. We’ve measured that reduction from a variety of volcanoes. So we have a reasonably good idea of the actual change in forcing. We can calculate the global reduction in sunlight from the actual observations … but unfortunately, despite the huge reductions in global forcing that volcanoes cause, the global temperature has steadfastly refused to cooperate. The temperature hasn’t changed much even with the largest of modern volcanoes.
Otto et al. used the HadCRUT4 dataset in their study, the latest incarnation from the Hadley Centre and the Climate Research Unit (CRU). So I’ll use the same data to demonstrate how the volcanoes falsify the climate models.

Figure 1. Monthly HadCRUT4 global surface air temperatures. The six largest modern volcanoes are indicated by the red dots.
This post will be in four parts: theory, investigation, conclusions, and a testable prediction.
THEORY
Volcanoes are often touted as a validation of the climate models. However, in my opinion they are quite the opposite—the response of the climate to volcanoes clearly demonstrates that the models are on the wrong path. As you may know, I’m neither a skeptic nor a global warming supporter. I am a climate heretic. The current climate paradigm says that the surface air temperature is a linear function of the “forcing”, which is the change in downwelling radiant energy at the top of the atmosphere . In other words, the current belief is that the climate can be modeled as a simple system, whose outputs (global average air temperatures) are a linear function of the SUM of all the various forcings from greenhouse gas changes, volcanoes, solar changes, aerosol changes, and the like. According to the theory, you simply take the total of all of the forcings, apply the magic formula, and your model predicts the future. Their canonical equation is:
Change in Temperature (∆T) = Change in Forcing (∆F) times Climate Sensitivity
In lieu of a more colorful term, let me say that’s highly unlikely. In my experience, complex natural systems are rarely that simply coupled from input to output. I say that after an eruption, the climate system actively responds to reductions in the incoming sunlight by altering various parts of the climate system to increase the amount of heat absorbed by other means. This rapidly brings the system back into equilibrium.
The climate modelers are right that volcanic eruptions form excellent natural experiments in how the climate system responds to the reduction in incoming sunlight. The current paradigm says that after a volcano, the temperature should vary proportionally to the forcing. I say that the temperature is regulated, not by the forcing, but by a host of overlapping natural emergent temperature control mechanisms, e.g. thunderstorms, the El Nino, the Pacific Decadal Oscillation, the timing of the onset of tropical clouds, and others. Changes in these and other natural regulatory phenomena quickly oppose any unusual rise or fall in temperature, and they work together to maintain the temperature very stably regardless of the differences in forcing.
So with the volcanoes, we can actually measure the changes in temperature. That will allow us to see which claim is correct—does the temperature really follow the forcings, or are there natural governing mechanisms that quickly act to bring temperatures back to normal after disturbances?
INVESTIGATION
In order to see the effects of the volcanoes, we can “stack” them. This means aligning the records of the time around the volcano so the eruptions occur at the same time in the stack. Then you express the variations as the anomaly around the temperature of the month of the eruption. It’s easier to see than describe, so Figure 2 shows the results.

Figure 2. Stacked records of the six major volcanoes. Individual records show from three years before to five years after each eruption. The anomalies are expressed as variations around the temperature of the month of the eruption. The black heavy line shows the average of the data. Black vertical lines show the standard error of the average.
The black line is the average of the stacked records, month by month. Is there a signal there? Well, there is a temperature drop starting about six months after the eruptions, with a maximum of a tenth of a degree. However, El Chichon is clearly an outlier in this regard. Without El Chichon, the signal gets about 50% stronger.

Figure 3. As in Figure 3, omitting the record for El Chichon.
Since I’m looking for the common response, and digging to find the signal, I will leave out El Chichón as an outlier.
But note the size of the temperature response. Even leaving out El Chichon, this is so small that it is not at all clear if the effect shown is even real. I do think it is real, just small, but in either case it’s a very wimpy response.
To properly judge the response, however, we need to compare it to the expected response under various scenarios. Figure 3 shows the same records, with the addition of the results from the average models from the Forster study, the results that the models were calculated to have on average, and the results if we assume a climate sensitivity of 3.0 W/m2 per doubling of CO2. Note that in all cases I’m referring the equilibrium climate sensitivity, not the transient climate response, which is smaller. I have used the lagged linear equation developed in my study of the Forster data (first cite above) to show the theoretical picture, as well as the model results.

Figure 4. Black line shows the average of the monthly Hadcrut temperatures. Blue line shows the average of the modeled annual temperatures from the 15 climate models in the Forster paper, as discussed here. The red line shows what the models would have shown if their sensitivity were 2.4°C per doubling of CO2, the value calculated from the Forster model results. Finally, the orange line shows the theoretical results for a sensitivity of 3°C per doubling. In the case of the red and orange lines, the time constant of the Forster models (2.9 years) was used with the specified sensitivity. Tau ( τ ) is the time constant. The sensitivity is the equilibrium climate sensitivity of the model, calculated at 1.3 times the transient climate response.
The theoretical responses are the result of running the lagged linear equation on just the volcanic forcings alone. This shows what the temperature change from those volcanic forcings will be for climate models using those values for the sensitivity (lambda) and the time constant (tau).
Now here, we see some very interesting things. First we have the model results in blue, which are the average of the fifteen Forster models’ output. The models get the first year about right. But after that, in the model and theoretical output, the temperature decreases until it bottoms out between two and three years after the eruption. Back in the real world, by contrast, the average observations bottom out by about one year, and have returned to above pre-eruption values within a year and a half. This is a very important finding. Notice that the models do well for the first year regardless of sensitivity. But after that, the natural restorative mechanisms take over and rapidly return the temperature to the pre-eruption values. The models are incapable of making that quick a turn, so their modeled temperatures continue falling.
Not only do the actual temperatures return to the pre-eruption value, but they rise above it before finally returning to the that temperature. This is the expected response from a governed, lagged system. In order to keep a lagged system in balance, if the system goes below the target value for a while, it need to go above that value for a while to restore the lost energy and get the system back where it started. I’ll return to this topic later in the post. This is an essential distinction between governors and feedbacks. Notice that once disturbed, the models will never return to the starting temperature. The best they can do is approach it asymptotically. The natural system, because it is governed, swings back shortly after the eruption and shoots above the starting temperature. See my post Overshoot and Undershoot for an earlier analysis and discussion of governors and how they work, and the expected shape of the signal.
The problem is that if you want to represent the volcanoes accurately, you need a tiny time constant and an equally tiny sensitivity. As you can see, the actual temperature response was both much smaller and much quicker than the model results.
This, of course, is the dilemma that the modelers have been trying to work around for years. If they set the sensitivity of their models high enough to show the (artificially augmented) CO2 signal, the post-eruption cooling comes out way, way too big. If they cut the sensitivity way, way down to 0.8° per doubling of CO2 … then the CO2 signal is trivially small.
Now, Figure 4 doesn’t look like it shows a whole lot of difference, particularly between the model results (blue line) and the observations. After all, they come back close to the observations after five years or so.
What can’t be seen in this type of analysis is the effect that the different results have on the total system energy. As I mentioned above, getting back to the same temperature isn’t enough. You need to restore the lost energy to the system as well. Here’s an example. Some varieties of plants need a certain amount of total heat over the growing season in order to mature. If you have ten days of cool weather, your garden doesn’t recover just because the temperature is now back to what it was before. The garden is still behind in the total heat it needs, the total energy added to the garden this season is lower than it would have been otherwise.
So after ten days of extra cool weather, your garden needs ten days of warm weather to catch up. Or perhaps five days of much warmer weather. The point is that it’s not enough to return the temperature to its previous value. We also need to return the total system energy to its previous value.
To measure this variation, we use “degree-days”. A degree-day is a day which is one degree above from some reference temperature. Ten degree-days could be five days that are two degrees warmer than usual, or two days that are five degrees warmer than usual. As in the example with the garden, degree-days accumulate over time, with warmer (positive) degree days offsetting cooler (negative) degree days. For the climate, the corresponding unit is a degree-month or a degree year. To convert monthly temperature into degree-months, you simply add each months temperature difference from the reference to the previous total. The record of degree-months, in other word, is simply the cumulative sum of the temperature differences from the date of the eruption.
What does such a chart measure? It measures how far the system is out of energetic balance. Obviously, after a volcano the system loses heat. The interesting thing is what happens after that, how far out of balance the system goes, and how quickly it returns. I’ve left the individual volcanoes off of this graph, and only shown the stack averages.

Figure 5. Cumulative record of degree-months of energy loss and recovery after the eruptions. Circles show the net energy loss in degree-months four years after the eruption.
Remember that I mentioned above that in a governed system, the overshoot above the original temperature is necessary to return the system to its previous condition. This overshoot is shown in Figure 3, where after the eruptions the temperatures rise above their original values. The observations show that the earth returned to its original temperature after 18 months. The results in Figure 5 show that it took a mere 48 months to regain the lost energy entirely. Figure 5 shows that the actual system quickly returned to the original energy condition, no harm no foul.
By contrast, the models take much larger swings in energy. After four years, the imbalance in the system is still increasing.
Now folks, look at the difference between what the actual system does (black line) and what happens when we model it with the IPCC sensitivity of 3° per doubling, or even the model results … I’m sorry, but the idea that you can model volcanic eruptions using the current paradigm simply doesn’t work. In a sane world, Figure 5 should sink the models without a trace, they are so very far from the reality.
We can calculate the average monthly energy shortage in the swing away from and back to the zero line by dividing the area under the curve by the time interval. Nature doesn’t like big swings, this kind of response that minimizes the disturbance is common in nature. Here are those results, the average energy deficit the system was running over the first four years.

Figure 6. Average energy deficit over the first four years after the eruption.
In this case, the models are showing an average energy deficit that is ten times that of the observations … and remember, at four years the actual climate is back to pre-eruption conditions, but the models’ deficit is still increasing, and will do so for several more years before starting back towards the line.
CONCLUSIONS
So what can we conclude from these surprising results?
The first and most important conclusion is that the climate doesn’t work the way that the climate paradigm states— it is clearly not a linear response to forcing. If it were linear, the results would look like the models. But the models are totally unable to replicate the rapid response to the volcanic forcings, which return to pre-existing temperatures in 18 months and restore the energy balance in 48 months. The models are not even close. Even with ridiculously small time constant and sensitivity, you can’t do it. The shape of the response is wrong.
I hold that this is because the models do not contain the natural emergent temperature-controlling phenomena that act in concert to return the system to the pre-catastrophic condition as soon as possible.
The second conclusion is that the observations clearly show the governed nature of the system. The swing of temperatures after the eruptions and the quick return of both temperature and energy levels to pre-eruption conditions shows the classic damped oscillations of a governed system. None of the models were even close to being able to do what the natural system does—shake off disturbances and return to pre-existing conditions in a very short time.
Third conclusion is that the existing paradigm, that the surface air temperature is a linear function of the forcing, is untenable. The volcanoes show that quite clearly.
There’s probably more, but that will do for the present.
TESTABLE PREDICTION
Now, we know that the drops in forcing from volcanoes are real, we’ve measured them. And we know that the changes in global temperature after eruptions are way tiny, a tenth of a degree or so. I say this is a result of the action of climate phenomena that oppose the cooling.
A corollary of this hypothesis is that although the signal may not be very detectable in the global temperature itself, for that very reason it should be detectable in the action of whatever phenomena act to oppose the volcanic cooling.
So that was my prediction, that if my theory were correct, we should see a volcanic signal in some other part of the climate system involved in governing the temperature. My first thought in this regard, of course, was the El Nino/La Nina pump that moves warm Pacific water from the tropics to the poles.
The snag with that one, of course, is that the usual indicator for El Nino is the temperature of a patch of tropical Pacific ocean called the Nino3.4 area. And unfortunately, good records of those temperatures go back to about the 1950s, which doesn’t cover three of the volcanoes.
A second option, then, was the SOI index, the Southern Oscillation Index. This is a very long-term index that measures the difference in the barometric pressures of Tahiti, and Darwin, Australia. It turns out that it is a passable proxy for the El Nino, but it’s a much broader index of Pacific-wide cycles. However, it has one huge advantage. Because it is based on pressure, it is not subject to the vagaries of thermometers. A barometer doesn’t care if you are indoors or out, or if the measurement location moves 50 feet. In addition, the instrumentation is very stable and accurate, and the records have been well maintained for a long time. So unlike temperature-based indices, the 1880 data is as accurate and valid as today’s data. This is a huge advantage … but it doesn’t capture the El Ninos all that well, which is why we use the Nino3.4 Index.
Fortunately, there’s a middle ground. This is the BEST index, which stands for the Bivariate ENSO Timeseries. It uses an average of the SOI and the Nino 3.4 data. Since the SOI has excellent data from start to finish, it kind of keeps the Nino3.4 data in line. This is important because the early Nino3.4 numbers are from reanalysis models in varying degrees at various times, so the SOI minimizes that inaccuracy and drift. Not the best, but the best we’ve got, I guess.
Once again, I wanted to look at the cumulative degree-months after the eruptions. If my theory were correct, I should see an increase in the heat contained in the Pacific Ocean after the eruptions. Figure 6, almost the last figure in this long odyssey, shows those results.

Figure 6. Cumulative index-months of the BEST index. Positive values indicate warmer conditions. Krakatoa is an obvious outlier, likely because it is way back at the start of the BEST data where the reconstruction contains drifts.
Although we only find a very small signal in the global temperatures, looking where the countervailing phenomena are reacting to neutralize the volcanic cooling shows a clearer signal of the volcanic forcing … in the form of the response that keeps the temperature from changing very much. When the reduction in sunlight occurs following an eruption, the Pacific starts storing up more energy.
And how does it do that? One major way is by changing the onset time of the tropical clouds. In the morning the tropics is clear, with clouds forming just before noon. But when it is cool, the clouds don’t form until later. This allows more heat to penetrate the ocean, increasing the heat content. A shift of an hour in the onset time of the tropical clouds can mean a difference of 500 watt-hours/m2, which averages over 24 hours to be about 20 W/m2 continuous … and that’s a lot of energy.
One crazy thing is that the system is almost invisible. I mean, who’s going to notice if on average the clouds are forming up a half hour earlier? Yet that can make a change of 10 W/m2 on a 24-hour basis in the energy reaching the surface, adds up to a lot of watt-hours …
So that’s it, that’s the whole story. Let me highlight the main points.
• Volcanic eruptions cause a large, measurable drop in the amount of solar energy entering the planet.
• Under the current climate paradigm that temperature is a slave to forcing with a climate sensitivity of 3 degrees per doubling of CO2, these should cause large, lingering swings in the planet’s temperature.
• Despite the significant size of these drops in forcing, we see only a tiny resulting signal in the global temperature.
• This gives us two stark choices.
A. Either the climate sensitivity is around half a degree per doubling of CO2, and the time constant is under a year, or
B. The current paradigm of climate sensitivity is wrong and forcings don’t determine surface temperature.
Based on the actual observations, I hold for the latter.
• The form (a damped oscillation) and speed of the climate’s response to eruptive forcing shows the action of a powerful natural governing system which regulates planetary temperatures.
• This system restores both the temperature and the energy content of the system to pre-existing conditions in a remarkably short time.
Now, as I said, I started out to do this volcano research and have been diverted into two other posts. I can’t tell you the hours I’ve spent thinking about and exploring and working over this analysis, or how overjoyed I am that it’s done. I don’t have a local church door to nail this thesis to, so I’ll nail it up on WUWT typos and all and go to bed. I think it is the most compelling evidence I’ve found to date that the basic climate paradigm of temperatures slavishly following the forcings is a huge misunderstanding at the core of current climate science … but I’m biased in the matter.
As always, with best wishes,
w.
APPENDICES
UNITS
Climate sensitivity is measured in one of two units. One is the increase in temperature per watt/m2 of additional forcing.
The other is the increase in temperature from a doubling of CO2. The doubling of CO2 is said to increase the forcing by 3.7 watts. So a sensitivity of say 2°C per doubling of CO2 converts to 2/3.7 = 0.54 °C per W/m2. Using the “per doubling” units doesn’t mean that the CO2 is going to double … it’s just a unit.
DATA
Let’s see, what did I use … OK, I just collated the Otto and Forster net radiative forcings, the Forster 15 model average temperature outputs, the GISS forcing data, and the dates of the eruptions into a single small spreadsheet, under a hundred k of data, it’s here.
METHOD
The method depends on the fact that I can closely emulate the output of either individual climate models, or the average output of the unruly mobs of models called “ensembles” using a simple lagged linear equation. The equation has two adjustable parameters, the time constant “tau” and the climate sensitivity lambda. Note that this is the transient sensitivity and not the equilibrium sensitivity. As you might imagine, because the earth takes time to warm, the short-term change in temperature is smaller than the final equilibrium change. The ratio between the two is fairly stable over time, at about 1.3 or so. I’ve used 1.3 in this paper, the exact value is not critical.
Using this lagged linear equation, then, I simply put in the list of forcings over time, and out comes the temperature predictions of the models. Here’s an example of this method used on the GISS volcanic forcing data:

Lambda (a measure of sensitivity) controls the amplitude, while tau controls how much the data gets “smeared” to the right on the graph. And sad to say, you can emulate any climate model, or the average of a bunch of models, with just that … see my previous posts referenced above for details about the method.
INDIVIDUAL RECORDS
Here are the most recent six eruptions, eruptions that caused large reductions in the amount of sunlight reaching the earth, with the date of the eruptions shown in red.






Discover more from Watts Up With That?
Subscribe to get the latest posts sent to your email.
Stephen Rasey : “It is only as extra credit that Willis proffers his expected response from a governed, lagged system hypothesis. Furthermore, the governor apparently does not govern just temperature, but governs something like a “degree-day” quantity. Profound! The system does not NEED to operate this way. That it DOES is the jewel Willis uncovered.”
Yes, I think this is another important feature that Willis has discovered. This goes _beyond_ his idea of a governor mechanism since a governor will just restore the controlled variable not it’s integral. I corrected him on this earlier but he has not responded to that comment.
Like all hypotheses I’m sure this one can be improved and hopefully Willis will look at the technical points I have raised, none of which undo his basic premise but should make it less prone to rejection because he got some details wrong.
I should clarify something I said earlier. Linear negative feedback will only cause overshoot in a system with inertia. Most mechanical damped spring systems like car shocks do this. Climate temps could possibly show inertia by setting masses or air or water in motion but I doubt we are seeing that here.
The key misunderstanding here is that overshoot is proof of a non linear governor. It is neither necessary to see that in a governed system nor it is proof of non-linear feedback.
The degree.day integration is an important find but this is not a feature of a governor either. The key feature of a governor is the return, not the overshoot.
Nick Stokes: “That’s completely wrong. Here is the plot of the 19-model average. It recovers from every eruption. No indefinite cooling effect – it rises 1°C over the period.”
Climate models do not “recover” from the eruption, they have other positive feedbacks , mainly GHG, bot also other small ones, which are positive.
This is KEY to what Willis has pointed out. The two are not the same.
What they have is exaggerated positive forcings which counteract the incorrect response to volcanism. This means they get _roughly_ the right global average response while both are present and go tit’s up when one or the other is missing : post 2000.
There is NO cooling in the real climate:
http://climategrog.wordpress.com/?attachment_id=270
http://climategrog.wordpress.com/?attachment_id=271
http://climategrog.wordpress.com/?attachment_id=275
All the modelled cooling does is coincide with the already happening downward trends that figure 4 shows , on average, coincide with the major eruptions.
The fact Willis showed in his previous post, that despite all the smoke and mirrors, the net response is _equivalent_ to a linear model verifies what I’ve just said. The models to not “recover” from eruptions, they just have equally incorrect positive forcings that compensate.
Me says: “The degree.day integration is an important find but this is not a feature of a governor either. The key feature of a governor is the return, not the overshoot.”
Since Willis has shown the degree.day integrator is kept constant , this means that the overshoot is stronger than that of an damped governor feedback. This comes back to the idea of a PID controller that I discussed in more detail earlier:
http://wattsupwiththat.com/2013/05/25/stacked-volcanoes-falsify-models/#comment-1316550
Thanks to “onlyme ” for bringing that up.
Willis, have another think about the degree.day integrator. This is a separate feature you have found and I think it is probably as significant a find as the governor. Possible more so.
Willis write “One crazy thing is that the system is almost invisible. I mean, who’s going to notice if on average the clouds are forming up a half hour earlier?”
Our best weather forecasting models (and I mean short term here) can predict storms but are limited to “late afternoon” or “morning” and cant resolve specific factors to give timings. They’re not going to be able to model changes such as increasingly earlier onsets because they simply dont have that resolution in their predictions.
I think your ideas of the earth’s climate being a governed system are intuitively satisfying and believe that they are almost certainly going to be important ideas to explore if we’re to understand our climate. I also believe there will be resistance to them because modellers know they cant model emergent properties with anything like the accuracy we’re going to need if we’re to understand CO2’s role in changes in the atmosphere.
Another slight correction Willis, you have often referred to what you are calculating as being a “lagged” response. However, there is not lag term in your equations. The deltaT is simply a course numerical integration method. dT=1 year is the integration step , not a lag.
You could do the same calculation with a one month integrations step and get the _same_ results, just with more resolution. This is not a lag in the response you are modelling which you appear to think it is.
Again, don’t get annoyed by all these corrections. You are basically right, making important discoveries and backing them up. I’m trying to reinforce your efforts by correcting them, not trying to knock what you’re doing.
best regards, Greg.
Timthetoolman: “I also believe there will be resistance to them because modellers know they cant model emergent properties with anything like the accuracy we’re going to need if we’re to understand CO2′s role in changes in the atmosphere.”
There are technical solutions to global resolution not being sufficient for storms. The resistance will come because of dogma, orthodoxy and the self-interest of maintaining alarm to maintain funding. Add a tint of political bias is you wish.
Greg writes “There are technical solutions to global resolution not being sufficient for storms. ”
Not for the problem of modelling changes to onset times, there aren’t. If you cant precisely model a storm’s initiation then you cant model changes to it either. This isn’t a problem like maintaining energy conservation where you can check the result.
Willis black box formula is actually an “exponential moving average”
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Moving_average
No, I am not Margaret Hardman of Leeds University. I once worked in a university but resigned on the principle that it was introducing a course in pseudoscience (in this case homeopathy).
I don’t see any fundamental reason why modelling the basic physics on a local, high resolution grid, would not produce a storm. If SST is higher more would erupt or they would erupt earlier. You don’t model when they erupt you model the causes and watch.
Once a working model on a local scale can imitate something like real behaviour this could be used to as a basis for cloud parameters fed to GSMs. This kind of approach is used to when ice models of Arctic are linked in.
If modellers were to recognise this is one area where the current paradigm was producing fundamentally incorrect behaviour , they could attack the problem.
The current reluctance is because of the reasons I outlined, not technical impossibility. That does not scare them off trying to model the whole world form first principals , does it?
Greg Goodman says: May 26, 2013 at 2:20 am
Greg,
I think you’re trying to deduce a lot of dynamics from not many yearss data there.
But Ken G has raised the question of whether they are even right. And I get similar results to his. I averaged the 19 model average from Willis’ earlier spreadsheet (digitized) by calendar year. I took the five eruptions that Willis used – Ken took all 6. My results for 9 years were:
0.22 0.21 *0.15* -0.01 0.01 0.09 0.12 0.15 0.17
I’ve starred the eruption year. These are offset up from Ken’s, not sure why. But the pattern is the same. A smaller dip, not so different to Hadcrut, and a more rapid recovery. You might like to try yourself on that spreadsheet.
Margaret, do you realize the purpose of Eschenbach’s article is not talking about you? Presumably most of the readers would agree.
We noticed your complaints. You have been answered. Looks like quite enough.
Stephen Rasey says:
May 25, 2013 at 7:34 pm
“…From first principles, I see no theoretical reason why any non-active system needs to restore the degree-months balance…”
Hi Stephen – have a look at the ‘law’ of Maximum Entropy Production (MEP) and Spatiotemporal Chaos to get some insight into reasons why the balance gets restored.
@Margaret Hardman – Do some serious reading about the ideas of Sir Karl Raimund Popper before you sail into the fray about the post normal scientific mess which climate science has become. It’s also worth a look at the work of Khun, for balance, then making your own decision about the value of the scientific method currently being employed by academia and the worth of the IPCC climate reports.
Margaret Hardman says:
May 25, 2013 at 4:44 am
“The conclusion needs to have strong valid evidence to support it which appears to be missing. Because unsubstantiated assumptions are made in this post, the assertions remain speculative at best and most probably wrong. There will be those that pick that last sentence out for criticism so I shall answer it now. Firstly, taking a simple equation that models part of the behaviour of the climate system and showing it might be wrong does not invalidate all climate models. I believe there are 19 models referenced by the IPCC. Even if this equation is fundamental to them all, the evidence here does not invalidate it.”
Where is the “strong valid evidence” that supports any of the IPCC models? Do you just ASSUME they are valid? It seems so. You are strongly biassed. Show your evidence.
Jesus, about half this thread is now about one irrelevant comment. Everyone, DROP it , please.
We’re discussing volcano forcings , right?
People might be interested in this paper which is a detailed study of the response to Pinatubo. It looks at radiative fluxes and water vapor as well as LT temperature.
Nick: “I’ve starred the eruption year. These are offset up from Ken’s, not sure why. But the pattern is the same. A smaller dip, not so different to Hadcrut, and a more rapid recovery. You might like to try yourself on that spreadsheet.”
This looks to be rather a mess. 15 or 19 ? Yours and Ken’s having an offset, mislabelled columns?
There is something that needs clarifying here. Since all this comes from Willis’ xlsx files and his digitisation of Forster et al , hopefully he will be able to explain what is going on.
For me I have enough work to do on data to start trying to hindcast other people’s copy/paste errors. Hopefully those responsible can straighten this out.
I also think the real volcanic forcing is how much the surface solar radiation falls. And that is 3.0% to 4.0% for Pinatubo or 7.0 W/m2 to 10.0 W/m2.
The reduced OLR is a negative radiative feedback, not a forcing.
So,one can do the math all over using those numbers.
While there has been a great deal of obfuscation on this thread, the simple fact is that real-world experiments like volcanoes always turn out to have much less impact than global warming predicts with its forcing —-> forcings + feedbacks —-> temperature increase
Always.
Ken,
Unfortunately I couldn’t get to your spreadsheet – the link just went to FoS homepage.
I showed my results above – I realize now that you followed Willis in setting the eruption year (or near) average to zero, which explains the offset. They still don’t quite match, but that may be because I made no allowance for eruption month.
It would appear that any response lasting between 6 months (small eruption – like Iceland’s 2x years ago) to 18 months to 24 months (Pinatubo) would have to start explicitly with the year.month value.
Margaret Hardman says:
Well Margaret, you started your first post with an ad hominem against Willis by gas-bagging about his training and the mark he should be given, and you immediately turn your second post into another ad hom in which you ridicule his BA instead of considering his argument, so why on earth should John M not call you on it and give his reaction to the very personal and irrelevant remarks you made about Willis? You opened the door.
Nick Stokes says:
People might be interested in this paper which is a detailed study of the response to Pinatubo. It looks at radiative fluxes and water vapor as well as LT temperature
Yes, it is interesting. And yet more confirmation of my point about confounding pre-existing downward trends in temperature (and water vapour I can now add) with the effects of Pinatubo.
They blinker there temp data to start just before the the eruption and thus fail to notice that temps were falling ANYWAY.
http://climategrog.wordpress.com/?attachment_id=270
In view of rest of their paper this is very poor science. This invites an implicit and spurious assumption that temp and water vap. would have been flat except for occurrence of the eruption.
It is obvious once pointed out and demonstrably wrong if you look at the data. That does not necessarily mean their time constants are significantly wrong though.
They do also note the overshoot in TOA radiation budget which is in the sense of confirming Willis’ governor plus the fact it retains a small positive offset long after.
“The value then remains close to zero (or a very slight positive anomaly) for the remainder of the
timeseries.”
… and …
” This accords with Wielicki et al. [2002], who show that in the tropics the net flux departs from zero only for the duration of the SW anomaly, and tracks this anomaly quickly back to zero (and thereafter remains remarkably close to zero, at least within the ‘noise’ of the results). ”
Maybe with a little literature searching Willis may find published evidence of what he is proposing.
Thanks for pointing to a relevant starting point.
[“there temp data” ?? => “their temp data” perhaps? Mod.]
Nick, did you miss my comment of May 25, 2013 at 10:41 pm
I change the file name to replace the blanks with _ so the link should work.
http://www.friendsofscience.org/assets/files/WillisE_Forcings_and_Models.xlsx
It should be possible to measure whether volcanic eruptions cause a delay in tropical cloudiness.
If tropical clouds form later in the day then the earth’s albedo will decrease, as more solar radiation is absorbed by the ocean.
To measure the earth’s albedo, the brightness of the earthlit part of the moon can be used.
After a volcanic eruption the earthlit part of the moon should be less bright.
I think this would prove scenario B.