Climate craziness of the week – paleotootology

I don’t have much comment on this, as the press worldwide has pretty much said it all. I await the coming comparisons between, ahem, human emissions, and dinosaur emissions.

Click image for the story.

It’s another modeling extrapolation. From the article:

==============================================================

Scientists believe that, just as in cows, methane-producing bacteria aided the digestion of sauropods by fermenting their plant food.

”A simple mathematical model suggests that the microbes living in sauropod dinosaurs may have produced enough methane to have an important effect on the Mesozoic climate,” said study leader Dr Dave Wilkinson, from Liverpool John Moores University.

”Indeed, our calculations suggest that these dinosaurs could have produced more methane than all modern sources – both natural and man-made – put together.”

==============================================================

Something smells alright – the stench of extrapolation is overpowering.

It says the paper was published in Current Biology, but I can’t find it. Anyone know where to get a copy?

UPDATE: The BBC http://www.bbc.co.uk/nature/17953792

British scientists have calculated the methane output of sauropods, including the species known as Brontosaurus.

By scaling up the digestive wind of cows, they estimate that the population of dinosaurs – as a whole – produced 520 million tonnes of gas annually. They suggest the gas could have been a key factor in the warm climate 150 million years ago.

“520 million tonnes”, that’s all? That seems in error. They obviously mean 520 teragrams. (/sarc from the paper – they quote teragrams, which sounds much bigger for MSM scare stories, but I guess they needed some unit people could get their nose around)

Here’s figure 1 from the paper:

The paper itself is a marvel of weak extrapolation:

Link to excerpt of curent “Current Biology” issue, showing the full article:

http://download.cell.com/current-biology/pdf/PIIS0960982212003296.pdf

Could methane produced by sauropod dinosaurs

have helped drive Mesozoic climate warmth?

David M. Wilkinson1,*, Euan G. Nisbet2, and Graeme D. Ruxton3

Mesozoic sauropods, like many modern herbivores, are likely to have

hosted microbial methanogenic symbionts for the fermentative

digestion of their plant food [1]. Today methane from livestock is a

significant component of the global methane budget [2]. Sauropod

methane emission would probably also have been considerable. Here,

we use a simple quantitative approach to estimate the magnitude of such

methane production and show that the production of the ‘greenhouse’

gas methane by sauropods could have been an important factor in warm

Mesozoic climates. Sauropod dinosaurs include the largest terrestrial animals known

and exhibit a distinctive body shape, featuring a small head at the end

of a very long neck. Their diversity and geographic range suggest that

sauropods may have been keystone species in many ecosystems during

the Jurassic and Cretaceous [1]. Based in part on data from the

Late Jurassic Morrison Formation (Western USA), Farlow et al. [3]

estimated population densities for sauropods ranging from a few

large adult animals to a few tens of individuals per km2. Specifically,

they estimate that if dinosaurs had an endothermic, mammalian-style

metabolism, then the total abundance of these megaherbivores would

have been 11–15 animals/km2 with a total biomass density of around

42,000 kg/km2. It is, however, very unlikely that large-bodied sauropods

had metabolisms as high as predicted by the assumption of mammalian

metabolism [1]. If instead a reptilian metabolism in assumed, then Farlow

et al. [3] calculate a predicted biomass density of 377,000 kg/km2.

————————-

Per Caddyshack, I think we have a new exclamation, “Oh, dinosaur farts!”

Best not to say it during a thunderstorm climate disruption.

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Richard
May 7, 2012 8:38 pm

“Did Dinosaur Flatulence Warm Prehistoric Earth?”
Cant say really but flatulence from Michael Mann, James Hansen, Phil Jones and their merry men, is definitely warming modern Earth.

May 7, 2012 9:03 pm

kadaka (KD Knoebel): The article you cited concludes with:
University of Victoria climate scientist Andrew Weaver said: “Frankly, methane emissions from dinosaur burps is probably not the No. 1 thing we should be concerned about in modern society.”
Finally, some sanity in the coverage of this issue. And from a climate modeller too!!!

Goldie
May 7, 2012 9:33 pm

Ok so….
Bovine’s have four stomachs which amongst other things accomodate specific bacteria for breaking down cellulose in grasses.
Sauropods had ? stomachs which housed ? for breaking down cellulose from ferns and cycads (because grass didn’t exist at that time).
Ummmm yep makes real sense to factor up from cows. After all we know nothing at all about saurod digestive pathways or biochemistry so lets just assume that they’re are like cows because cows are homeothermic and sauropods were ? so we don’t know if they maintained a gut temperature sufficiently high to maintain methanogenesis.
And we know the population of sauropods because……?

david
May 7, 2012 11:40 pm

I just can’t get over the numbers…. 11-14/sq KM. But that is for mammalian metabolism. Looks like 7-8 times more for reptile. So 80-110 of these big dinos per sq KM. Now imagine sending little Johnnie to school back then, he would have to dodge one every hundred yards or so. What about chasing one of these out of your back yard…. Dang these things would be all over the place… All farting incessantly. Of course these are only the big guys. There would be thousands of smaller dinos…. some tooting too.

Disko Troop
May 8, 2012 2:02 am

Every day is the 1st of April!
Goldie says:
May 7, 2012 at 9:33 pm : Exactly right. It’s like studying rats and extrapolating for geckos because “they are about the same size.”
Should we now start calling DF (for Dinosaur Farts) on stories instead of BS?

Dave (UK)
May 8, 2012 2:43 am

That’s one small burp for a dino, one giant lie by mankind.

Alix James
May 8, 2012 6:57 am

Re: David Ball David Ball “Shall we count the billions of buffalo? ”
I’ve always found it fun to make a watermelon’s head explode by pointing out that, if cow gas is causing us trouble, killing all those buffalo was a GOOD thing…

Dr. Jay Cadbury, phd.
May 8, 2012 8:16 am

You know I think the time of the dinosaurs is extremely important to understanding the earth’s temperature and climate. Is everyone here in agreement that dinosaurs had the largest carbon footprint? Not sure if anyone knew but this is a point of hot debate with true believers, who of course say that humans have to have the biggest, but it doesn’t make sense. Dinosaurs consumption is so much higher than that of a human. The massively high levels of carbon dioxide during the time of the dinosaurs and their prosperous existence makes global warming theory false.

DDP
May 8, 2012 8:59 am

Whatever completely made up figure that is arrived at should be cut in half, because as we all know lady dinosaurs didn’t fart.

Pull My Finger
May 8, 2012 10:11 am

I think the “Ancient Astronaut Theorists” are more believable when they state that aliens hunted the dinosaurs to extinction.
For those who want an excellent laugh, tune into Ancient Astronauts on H2, a whole bunch of alien wackos including the granddaddy of them all Erick VanDanikan. It’s especially hilarious when [they] frame a question and the half-crazed interviewee posits that the only possible answer is “aliens”, duh!”

May 8, 2012 11:49 am

– I have this wacky theory that the Mega-tonnes of CO2 that the dinosaurs got from plants, probably went back into new plants. And meanwhile the Tera-tonnes released from ocean storage when sun changes or something made the ocean warm would be far likely to make a difference to the CO2 level in the atmosphere.

Ed Zuiderwijk
May 8, 2012 11:50 am

Holy cows!

Ed Zuiderwijk
May 8, 2012 12:02 pm

In cows the methane finds its way out primarily via burps. Many years ago there was a story in a Dutch newspaper under the headline “Cow burns barn down”. It told about a vet who wanted to show a disbelieving farmer that his cows indeed produced methane when burping. He did this by lighting the gas when it was expelled. Unfortunately there was quite a bit of force behind it and the cow was not optimally positioned so the flamethrower it had become pointed straight into the hay supply for the farm.

May 8, 2012 12:04 pm

– I see PZ Myers said “I read the report it says nothing like that headline” ..
.. His commentors went on to say it’s just another anti-global warming headline Fox news made up
… funny that’s not the way the BBC hyped iot up & spun it… Their meme seemed to be “see the dinosaurs ruined their earth with CO2 & nopw we are doing the same”
..Stew & No2BS

mikerossander
May 8, 2012 3:51 pm

Interesting closing comment to the article. I thought the “reptilian metabolism” hypothesis was disproven back in the 1970s. While that does not necessarily mean that dinosaurs enjoyed the full-up mammalian metabolism, I’m skeptical of their use of the reptilian end of the spectrum.

leftinbrooklyn
May 8, 2012 5:51 pm

I wonder…. Could this all be a precursor to; ‘Too many people exhaling too much CO2?”

May 9, 2012 4:06 am

Yes, but it was natural variability.

May 9, 2012 9:09 am

“Stars and Stripes” Mideast Edition picked up the story today via the AP and popped it — predictably — on the weather page. The final paragraph has this corker: “NASA climate scientist Gavin Schmidt quickly ran some calculations based on Wilkinson’s figures. Dinosaur methane would have increased temperatures about half a degree, which is a fraction of what has been caused by the burning of fossil fuels like coal and oil in the 20th century, he said.” My emphasis.
Whenever his name comes up on WUWT, I’ll have this awful visual of Gavin Schmidt running calculations on Cretaceous cropdusting…

WTF
May 9, 2012 12:59 pm

Here is a funny article about this in the Toronto Sun
http://www.torontosun.com/2012/05/09/when-inconvenient-wind-blows-strobel

May 12, 2012 12:43 am

Well, that squares perfectly with a hypothesis advanced before the meteor thing that the rise of angiosperms gave dinosaurs indigestion.

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