Guest Post by Thomas Fuller
It is not often that I get called a ‘denialist’ and a ‘troll’ for the dark forces of Al Gore on the same day, but it does happen.
It’s because I am a ‘lukewarmer,’ one who believes that the physics of climate change are not by theselves controversial, but who believes that the sensitivity of the earth’s atmosphere to a doubling of concentrations of CO2 is not yet known, but is likely to be lower than activists have claimed.
I suppose it should bother me that I am getting slammed at activist websites such as Only In It For the Gold, Deltoid and ThingsBreak because they think I don’t go far enough, and slammed again here and at The Air Vent because I go too far. Although I want to be liked as much as the next fellow, it doesn’t, because the reasons given for slamming me never seem to match up to the reality of what I write.
Critics here have focused on a lack of substance, so I’ll try and address that in this post. I’m a bit amused at one commenter who yesterday said I understood nothing of energy. (Shh! Don’t tell my clients–I just delivered a 400-page report on alternative energy, and they’ll be ticked off…)
And I’m equally amused that I have to acknowledge that Michael Tobis (at last) got one thing right in a comment yesterday, when he wrote that the real problem we face is coal–and Chinese coal at that. (More on that in a minute.)
The LukeWarmer’s Way
The operation of CO2 as a greenhouse gas is one of the least controversial ideas in physics. The calculations that show a temperature rise of between 1 and 2 degrees Celsius if concentrations double is also widely accepted, including by all skeptic scientists without (AFAIK) exception.
We don’t know the sensitivity of the atmosphere to a doubling of CO2, so the effects of feedbacks are not know. Activists think it is 3 degrees or higher. Contrarians think it is very low–1, maybe 2, tops, some thinking it is even lower.
If activists are right we have a very big problem on our hands. If contrarians are right we don’t. If both are wrong, there is a lukewarmer’s way.
If you believe that about 2 degrees of warming is headed our way this century, it will be a problem–probably not for those reading this, because of our fortunate geography, but for those in the developing world, who will have to add droughts, floods and heatwaves to their current long list of miseries. And it’s not really the size of the temperature rise that worries me, although having a 2 degree average means it will be greater in some places, and again, probably in the least fortunate locales. But it’s really the speed of change that will make it tough to adapt to.
So as a lukewarmer I believe that if there are ‘no regrets’ options, by which I mean things that make sense for us to do no matter what happens to the climate, that we should move quickly to do them in hopes that it will a) help prepare for whatever temperature rise comes our way and b) may serve in some small way to lessen the total temperature rise and its impacts.
The devil is in the details, obviously, and a bigger devil lies in who should decide and how much authority we give them. And we probably don’t get to pick and choose at the right level of detail.
For example, I have no problem with the EPA actively encouraging power plants to shift from old coal configurations to combined cycle natural gas. It’s not a permanent solution but it’s a quick win. But I do have a problem with them classing a school with 3 buses as a major emitter of CO2 and getting them involved in the bureaucratic nightmare of emission control.
I do not want Maurice Strong to control our approach to the world’s environmental issues. I’m reading his book right now (‘Where On Earth Are We Going?, with a foreward by Kofi Annan), and it is horribly bad, and horribly wrong. I’ll give it a full review later, but suffice it to say that I wouldn’t trust him with any responsibility at all.
But there are some in both government and science who I do trust. And I’m willing to work towards helping them get to where we need to go. If a panel composed of both Pielkes, Judith Curry, Mike Kelly, John Christy, Richard Lindzen and a few others were to work on proposed solution, I’d be pretty happy. I might be alone in my joy, I realize.
Another no regrets option I’d like to see is a review of building planning, permitting and insurance in areas that are already vulnerable to tropical storms and floods. We are in the silly situation right now where middle class workers in the Midwest are subsidizing rich people who rebuild ruined but rich second homes in Florida or Malibu Canyon.
We could also allow planes to use modern technology to choose the most fuel efficient routes, descend directly rather than in stages and unblock no-fly spaces left over from the Cold War.
I’d like to see greater use of X prizes to stimulate innovation, as it did with private spacecraft. I’d love to see prizes for utility level storage or better use of composites for distribution, or improvements to HVDC transmission. Prizes almost always work.
I’d like to see more base research done on superconductors, for example, and other technologies that are threatened with being trapped in the Valley of Investment Death.
And I don’t think that list of no regrets options is too controversial, either here or with the activists. (I’m sure I’ll hear about it if it is.)
But the real problem is counting to 3,000. Because a straight line extension of energy consumption gets us to 3,000 quads (quadrillion BTUs) by 2075, with 9.1 billion people developing at present trends and GDP growing at 3% per year.
If those 3,000 quads are supplied by burning coal, we’ll choke on the fumes, no matter what it does to temperatures. China has doubled its energy use since 2000, it may do so again by 2020, and 70% of their energy is provided by coal. The massive traffic jam into Beijing a couple of weeks ago, 90 miles long and lasting three or four days, was composed primarily of small trucks bringing coal into China’s capital. And the pollution and soot that is caused by China’s coal travels–to the Arctic, hastening ice melt and over the rest of the world, as small particulates and just general haze.
So I also advocate pushing for renewable and nuclear energy. I think we’ll need them both. Nuclear is ready to roll right now, but it’s expensive and time consuming to put up as many plants as we’re going to need. Solar is on the verge, and I’d like to give it an extra push. Natural gas is a temporary solution in terms of emissions, but at current prices we can’t ignore its advantages.
We also need to push piecemeal solutions that will not solve our problems by themselves, but are important contributors at a local level, such as geothermal power, or small hydroelectric and run-of-river installations.
No matter what you or I believe about climate change, we face an energy issue that we need to address today. Our coal plants are dramatically cleaner than they used to be. China’s are not. If we don’t want the air we breathe to taste of China’s coal, we need to work on better solutions.
And the worst of all possible worlds is where we don’t do the right thing on energy because we are at war with each other about climate change.
I’m a firm believer in markets, and I like free markets better than the other sort. I also think they work better with light regulation. I think it’s legitimate to nudge the energy market in the direction we want it to go, without giving the reins and the saddle to government bureaucracy. And I do think it can and probably will work.
So I’m not a ‘denialist.’ I’m not a ‘skeptic.’ I’m a lukewarmer–and I’m right.
Thomas Fuller http://www.redbubble.com/people/hfuller
Thomas Fuller
There would be no global warming without new technology. And that’s not because new technology uses so much energy.
It’s because new technology has allowed us to measure new phenomena, and old phenomena with radically more powerful tools.
Mike Smith gives us an example in his book ‘Warnings’, a great story about how technology addressed the warning system for U.S. tornadoes (and which is advertised here on the right hand column). He notes that many tornadoes that are called in to reporting centers today would never have been noticed before, thanks to a growing American population and the ubiquity of mobile telephones.
The same is more or less true of hurricanes. Before satellite coverage began in 1969, we really didn’t know exactly how many hurricanes actually happened in a given year, nor how strong they were. If they didn’t make landfall, they would only be catalogued if planes noticed and reported them, and they would only be measured if specially equipped planes basically flew through them and charted their strength.
It’s certainly also true of measurements of ice extent, volume and area, which would not be possible without satellite imagery.
New technology has had a radical effect on the time series of measurements made for extended periods before the technology was adopted. Sailors used to measure sea surface temperatures using a thermometer in a bucket lowered into the sea. When Argos buoys began providing a network of more accurate measurements, there was a break in the timeline. When surface stations converted to electronic thermocouples on a short leash, the adjustments required caused another break in the data series. (I guess readers here might know something about that already.) Scientists have worked hard to make adjustments to correct for the new sources of data, but the breaks are still pretty noticeable.
The sensible thing would be to give the new technologies time to develop an audited series of measurements long enough to determine trends, rather than grafting new data on top of older, less reliable series. But there are two objections to this: First, who’s to say another new measurement technology won’t come along and replace our brand new toys and resetting the clock to zero? Second, and of more concern, there is a whole scientific establishment out there saying we don’t have time to wait for a pristine data set. Some say we’ve already waited too long, others say that if we start today (and they really mean today), we just might avoid climate disaster.
And if you start to muse on the remarkable coincidence that warming apparently started at the same time as we got all this new-fangled technology, why that makes you a flat-earth denialist. Or something.
As it happens, while serving in the U.S. Navy I took sea surface temperatures with a thermometer in a bucket. There were not many detailed instructions involved. Should I have done it on the sunny side or the shady side? Nearer the pointy end of the ship (that’s technical talk) or the flat back end? How long was I supposed to leave the thermometer in the water?
I wouldn’t want to make momentous decisions based on the quality of data I retrieved from that thermometer, which wasn’t calibrated–I think the U.S.N. stock number was like 22, or some other low number indicating great antiquity. I much prefer what comes out of Argos.
But there are times I wish all those fancy instruments on the satellites were pointing at another planet.
Thomas Fuller href=”http://www.redbubble.com/people/hfuller
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Well, I don’t have pretty pictures of coal trucks (or 9 million bicycles) in Beijing. That’s a fact.
But Reuters seems to think that’s what happened:
http://www.reuters.com/article/idUSTRE6810UC20100902
“More than 10,000 trucks mainly carrying coal are stuck in a 120 km (75 mile) traffic jam in the northeastern Chinese region of Inner Mongolia, in the latest dramatic snarl-up on the country’s roads.”
Adam R.,
Next time you drive by, bring me a cup of coffee, willya?
Mr. Barker, you get extra credit for mentioning my favorite philosopher as well as one of my favorite humans.
Z, cooling for me would be a matter of length of time, not number of degrees. If it cools for the next 20 years, we all win, and I’ll be happy to eat crow in any venue you name. Really. But that might be because I would win a thousand dollar bet with Joe Romm… 😉
George E. Smith, I’m assuming you wrote in haste. The 1.5 to 4.5 C estimate by the IPCC is of course of atmospheric sensitivity to a doubling of CO2 concentrations, not the warming expected solely from a doubling of CO2 itself.
Obviously, I’m adopting common usage for my reference–it’s global mean temperature. I agree with you that it’s not a useful way of looking at any real world consequences, and am fully aware that the Earth offers a wide spectrum of local and regional climates and that humans have done remarkably well in adapting to them.
I’ll repeat my concern, which is that temperature rises over a short period of time would be extremely troubling to some parts of the world that have not had the opportunity to develop the resilience we show in so many other parts of the world. Right or wrong, that’s my worry.
Steven mosher said on September 17, 2010 at 2:28 pm:
There is a major difference between the precautionary principal with regards to CO2 and Pascal’s wager. We still don’t have evidence that CO2 will be a problem that must be taken care of, while it is proven fact that all human bodies will eventually expire. For only one of the two are we certain that “We’re all going to die!!” applies.
😉
I’ve produced some analysis which had “lukewarmer-type” results but let me poke some holes in the lukewarmer approach.
– The 1.0C per doubling of GHGs (without feedbacks) actually refers to troposphere temperatures – 5.5 kms up – not the Surface – (note this number is sometimes quoted as 1.2C but it is really 1.0C). The Stefan-Boltzmann equations, however, indicate this will only produce 0.7C of warming at the Surface where we live (a never talked about discrepancy).
– The 1.0C per doubling comes from calculations by Myhre et al 1998 (and Hansen and Manabe earlier) which said doubling GHGs increases the forcing in the troposphere by 3.7 watts/m2.
http://folk.uio.no/gunnarmy/paper/myhre_grl98.pdf
Nobody can really verify these calculations (although the same kind of numbers is built into Modtran for example). Does doubling GHGs really increase the forcing in the troposphere by 3.7 watt/m2? I can’t say I have ever seen that calculation demonstrated including in the above.
– The historic temperatures have been adjusted to increase the trend. No wonder no climate model can reproduce a 1.0C total sensitivity – they are trying to reproduce artificial historical temperature trends. And they are forced to use artificially high Aerosol estimates which artificially produce higher GHG sensitivities.
– The satellite troposphere trends is lower (two new papers out on this – one today) and my own analysis indicates that the sensitivity is around 1.0C from the temperature trends produced by the satellites – which might also show that the historical temperature figures before 1979 have been adjusted again.
– The Paleoclimate history supports a vey low sensitivity – between 0.0C and 1.5C per doubling.
– Feedbacks to date are extremely low if not negative (see Trenberth 2009 which has the feedbacks at a negative value). When are they supposed to start producing a +200% additional positive impact?
http://www.cgd.ucar.edu/cas/Trenberth/trenberth.papers/EnergyDiagnostics09final2.pdf
Sure thing, nincom…er, Tom. Cream and sugar?
Mr. Illis, my opinion (and that’s all it is) about 2 degrees Celsius incorporates other anthropogenic influences, such as deforestation and other changes to land use / land cover. I actually think CO2 will provide a bit more than half that.
Svante Arrhenius, when he recalculated his numbers in 1906 (and which Al Gore and John Rennie never seem to have heard about), came up with 1.6 C from CO2 and about 0.5 from feedbacks. There are things he didn’t know about at the time, but I like his end results.
Time will tell.
Steven mosher says:
September 17, 2010 at 2:48 pm
“Tom does market RESEARCH. sheesh do you even understand what that job is and how it differs from campaign marketing..”
Tom does market research. This can lead into other areas such as generating sales leads.
He worked at Kable – ‘The company helps ICT suppliers to understand the government market better and to reach public sector decision-makers. Kable also helps public servants to make informed decisions about transformation and technology.’ i.e helping companies sell technology to the government.
He also worked at IPT (Online Lead Generation, List Rental & Email Marketing Specialists – myoffers.co.uk!), has a line specialising in leads to helps green technology suppliers find customers through permission marketing. He has protested that he wasn’t involved in the green technology website, ‘I worked for two years at IPT in a separate division doing market research.’ but as Managing Director of market research he surely had some exposure.
Factoring in the big proposals for EC tenders he has submitted through a specialist EC grant negotiating company I believe that TF has a far broader range of skills and interests than market research. It is certainly POSSIBLE that TF became involved in the climate debate through a financial interest in promoting green technologies and I for one would like to keep pushing to make it clear that this is not the case.
Background information and documentaries on Darth Maurice Strong as he’s affectionately known by some.
http://pathstoknowledge.net/2009/12/18/its-the-end-of-the-world-as-we-know-it-only-one-earth-under-the-new-world-order-based-upon-false-science-brought-to-you-by-maurice-darth-strong/
Philip, you’re really on the wrong track here. I don’t work for either of those companies–it’s been years. I have no financial interest in promoting green technologies. I never have.
How clear do you want me to be? I have no dog in this fight at all.
Adam R., before you start calling people names, you’re the one spending time in a place he doesn’t like…
Tom Fuller says:
September 17, 2010 at 5:52 pm
Tom, I was just presenting another side to the issue. Generally, one should be in the lukewarmer-like category given the trends to date but even the trends to date may not reflect what has actually happened. Let’s say the temperature increase to date is really only 0.45C. Well, then that would not indicate 2.0C by 2100, maybe 1.0C. If the real trend to date is 0.65C, maybe 2.0C is in the ballpark then.
E.M.Smith says:
September 17, 2010 at 2:27 pm
since CO2 is not a glass barrier to convection, it’s just part of the megatons of mass flow from the surface to altitude where the heat radiates off to space…..And no, we don’t need to do anything about it and we don’t need to have governments making decisions that ought to be made by energy companies. The choice of fuels and systems is none of the governments business.
Thank you Mr. Smith. Your comment made the most sense of all in this thread.
“So then because you are lukewarm, and neither cold nor hot, I will spew you out of my mouth.” Rev. 3:16
I could not resist on that one. 😉
Chris
Don V says: September 17, 2010 at 8:27 am
“The magnitude of concentrations of CO2 vs water vapor alone convinces me that water has a far, far greater effect than the miniscule role of CO2.”
Hi Don V. Most of us have experienced the difference between a cold cloudness night and a relatively warmer cloudy one. This is a direct consequence of water vapour acting as a greenhouse gas, slowing infra-red radiation’s passage to space. CO2 does the same. What would happen if all the non-water-vapour GHGs were magically scrubbed from the atmosphere? Whereas a molecule of CO2 stays in the atmosphere for ~100 years, water vapour is precipitated in the order of days or weeks. As rain fell in any given region temperatures would plummet and we would rapidly reach snowball earth. Blackbody radiation theory suggests earth would be 33C colder without our present combination of GHGs. Water vapour on its own has such a small residence time in the atmosphere that it is not self-sustaining.
savethesharks says:
“So then because you are lukewarm, and neither cold nor hot, I will spew you out of my mouth.” Rev. 3:16
I could not resist on that one. 😉
.
LOL! XLNT!
Oops I see Anna V already beat me to that one, long ago.
E.M.Smith says:
September 17, 2010 at 2:27 pm
THE major problem with the CO2 thesis is it is all focused on radiation physics. But the atmosphere is dominated by convective processes and water vapor. Major mismatch.
So reasonable thinking people certainly can look at the ‘CO2 as greenhouse gas’ thesis and say it’s broken on the face of it; since CO2 is not a glass barrier to convection, it’s just part of the megatons of mass flow from the surface to altitude where the heat radiates off to space.
Take just a moment to look at the three hurricanes in the Atlantic right now. Then ask: How effective is CO2 at blocking them from moving heat from the ocean to the upper atmosphere?
=======================================
Repeated for effect here. EXTREMELY well said.
Chris
Phillip:
“It is certainly POSSIBLE that TF became involved in the climate debate through a financial interest in promoting green technologies and I for one would like to keep pushing to make it clear that this is not the case.”
Phillip you are so far from the truth you have no idea. I’m not just saying that because I know Tom personally. You still dont get what a reseacher does and why researchers dont and cant promote.
Dunno if its bad for the political situation Thomas is trying to describe. It is like in the labor movement when those that thought the the commies should not be outlawed they were sometimes called pinkos. The Lukewarmer term was used by Savonarola in the bonfire of the vanities days in Florence to describe those who would not join his movement to purge the vanities of the city. It was his term to chastise the moderate, respective, wealthy practicing Christians. Speaking as God’s mouthpiece he would scream the apocalyse But because you are lukewarm…I am going to spit you out of my mouth! . One could almost say that Savonarola destroyed the renaissance in florence.
Z:
“As a general question: What level of cooling would be incompatible with physics as you know it? I.E. How much would the Earth have to cool before you’d say “That’s against the laws of physics”?”
wrong question and a total misunderstanding of how physics is developed, refined and modified. it would take more than a cool spell to overturn the physics involved, way more.
I don’t believe a trace gas is going to turn out to be Earth’s #1 looming problem. In face, I don’t believe it is a problem nor is it really a driver of climate. The Earth is fully capable of wolfing down any extra C02 we put out, and more, if and when it decides to.
The real problem is pollution. Chemicals, plastics and soot. The S02 and soot we had either licked or on the way to getting under wraps in the US. We really did clean up our air. We could have continued on, and cleaned up a lot more than just the S02 problem, but profits got in the way, and government agencies/regulators were bought/lobbied. We sent our core industries and tooling overseas, along with our productivity.
There isn’t much we can now do about China. That situation is at least 10 years or more removed from any meaningful influence we might have had. Now, they are ready to leapfrog us, and they appear not to care one bit how much pollution they have to spit out in the process of becoming #1. Our troubled consumer-driven market is not in the drivers seat, China’s is.
We do not control our monetary system, they do (Bernanke did it … 2005) via the long-term interest rate and thier investments.
So, what exactly can the US do? What we used to do: Make products that last.
Throwaway products that are cheap cost jobs, our jobs, and as they don’t last long, they are a huge waste of resources & energy.
Great for Asia, very bad for the US. Even worse for pollution on 2 continents.
Green energy? We use to call some of these schemes perpetual motion.
Nuclear? We had better get some serious reform into our oversight & regulatory agencies before we start messing with that genie again.
Renewables? Localised and subsidized so far. Tranmission lines blocked. Outsourced.
It’s going to be a while before the US has the wherewithal to make meaningful changes, the present economic malaise has seen to that.
Tom Fuller,
I can believe Mike’s photos. At the same time that gives me reason to not believe Reuters.