I’m honored to offer this guest post by Jerome Ravetz, of Oxford University in the UK. Mr. Ravetz is an environmental consultant and professor of philosophy of science best known for his books challenging the assumptions of scientific objectivity, discussing the science wars and post-normal science. Read more about him at his personal web page here, his Oxford page here, or at his blog the Post-normal Times. Also, my thanks to WUWT regular “tallbloke” for his facilitation. – Anthony
Guest post by Jerome Ravetz
At the end of January 2010 two distinguished scientific institutions shared headlines with Tony Blair over accusations of the dishonest and possibly illegal manipulation of information. Our ‘Himalayan glaciers melting by 2035’ of the Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change is matched by his ‘dodgy dossier’ of Saddam’s fictitious subversions. We had the violations of the Freedom of Information Act at the University of East Anglia; he has the extraordinary 70-year gag rule on the David Kelly suicide file. There was ‘the debate is over’ on one side, and ‘WMD beyond doubt’ on the other. The parallels are significant and troubling, for on both sides they involve a betrayal of public trust.
Politics will doubtless survive, for it is not a fiduciary institution; but for science the dangers are real. Climategate is particularly significant because it cannot be blamed on the well-known malign influences from outside science, be they greedy corporations or an unscrupulous State. This scandal, and the resulting crisis, was created by people within science who can be presumed to have been acting with the best of intentions. In the event of a serious discrediting of the global-warming claims, public outrage would therefore be directed at the community of science itself, and (from within that community) at its leaders who were either ignorant or complicit until the scandal was blown open. If we are to understand Climategate, and move towards a restoration of trust, we should consider the structural features of the situation that fostered and nurtured the damaging practices. I believe that the ideas of Post-Normal Science (as developed by Silvio Funtowicz and myself) can help our understanding.
There are deep problems of the management of uncertainty in science in the policy domain, that will not be resolved by more elaborate quantification. In the gap between science and policy, the languages, their conventions and their implications are effectively incommensurable. It takes determination and skill for a scientist who is committed to social responsibility, to avoid becoming a ‘stealth advocate’ (in the terms of Roger Pielke Jr.). When the policy domain seems unwilling or unable to recognise plain and urgent truths about a problem, the contradictions between scientific probity and campaigning zeal become acute. It is a perennial problem for all policy-relevant science, and it seems to have happened on a significant scale in the case of climate science. The management of uncertainty and quality in such increasingly common situations is now an urgent task for the governance of science.
We can begin to see what went seriously wrong when we examine what the leading practitioners of this ‘evangelical science’ of global warming (thanks to Angela Wilkinson) took to be the plain and urgent truth in their case. This was not merely that there are signs of exceptional disturbance in the ecosphere due to human influence, nor even that the climate might well be changing more rapidly now than for a very long time. Rather, they propounded, as a proven fact, Anthropogenic Carbon-based Global Warming. There is little room for uncertainty in this thesis; it effectively needs hockey-stick behaviour in all indicators of global temperature, so that it is all due to industrialisation. Its iconic image is the steadily rising graph of CO2 concentrations over the past fifty years at the Mauna Loa volcano in Hawaii (with the implicit assumption that CO2 had always previously been at or below that starting level). Since CO2 has long been known to be a greenhouse gas, with scientific theories quantifying its effects, the scientific case for this dangerous trend could seem to be overwhelmingly simple, direct, and conclusive.
In retrospect, we can ask why this particular, really rather extreme view of the prospect, became the official one. It seems that several causes conspired. First, the early opposition to any claim of climate change was only partly scientific; the tactics of the opposing special interests were such as to induce the proponents to adopt a simple, forcefully argued position. Then, once the position was adopted, its proponents became invested in it, and attached to it, in all sorts of ways, institutional and personal. And I suspect that a simplified, even simplistic claim, was more comfortable for these scientists than one where complexity and uncertainty were acknowledged. It is not merely a case of the politicians and public needing a simple, unequivocal message. As Thomas Kuhn described ‘normal science’, which (as he said) nearly all scientists do all the time, it is puzzle-solving within an unquestioned framework or ‘paradigm’. Issues of uncertainty and quality are not prominent in ‘normal’ scientific training, and so they are less easily conceived and managed by its practitioners.
Now, as Kuhn saw, this ‘normal’ science has been enormously successful in enabling our unprecedented understanding and control of the world around us. But his analysis related to the sciences of the laboratory, and by extension the technologies that could reproduce stable and controllable external conditions for their working. Where the systems under study are complicated, complex or poorly understood, that ‘textbook’ style of investigation becomes less, sometimes much less, effective. The near-meltdown of the world’s financial system can be blamed partly on naïvely reductionist economics and misapplied simplistic statistics. The temptation among ‘normal’ scientists is to work as if their material is as simple as in the lab. If nothing else, that is the path to a steady stream of publications, on which a scientific career now so critically depends. The most obvious effect of this style is the proliferation of computer simulations, which give the appearance of solved puzzles even when neither data nor theory provide much support for the precision of their numerical outputs. Under such circumstances, a refined appreciation of uncertainty in results is inhibited, and even awareness of quality of workmanship can be atrophied.
In the course of the development of climate-change science, all sorts of loose ends were left unresolved and sometimes unattended. Even the most fundamental quantitative parameter of all, the forcing factor relating the increase in mean temperature to a doubling of CO2, lies somewhere between 1 and 3 degrees, and is thus uncertain to within a factor of 3. The precision (at about 2%) in the statements of the ‘safe limits’ of CO2 concentration, depending on calculations with this factor, is not easily justified. Also, the predictive power of the global temperature models has been shown to depend more on the ‘story line’ than anything else, the end-of century increase in temperature ranging variously from a modest one degree to a catastrophic six. And the ‘hockey stick’ picture of the past, so crucial for the strict version of the climate change story, has run into increasingly severe problems. As an example, it relied totally on a small set of deeply uncertain tree-ring data for the Medieval period, to refute the historical evidence of a warming then; but it needed to discard that sort of data for recent decades, as they showed a sudden cooling from the 1960’s onwards! In the publication, the recent data from other sources were skilfully blended in so that the change was not obvious; that was the notorious ‘Nature trick’ of the CRU e-mails.
Even worse, for the warming case to have political effect, a mere global average rise in temperature was not compelling enough. So that people could appreciate the dangers, there needed to be predictions of future climate – or even weather – in the various regions of the world. Given the gross uncertainties in even the aggregated models, regional forecasts are really beyond the limits of science. And yet they have been provided, with various degrees of precision. Those announced by the IPCC have become the most explosive.
As all these anomalies and unsolved puzzles emerged, the neat, compelling picture became troubled and even confused. In Kuhn’s analysis, this would be the start of a ‘pre-revolutionary’ phase of normal science. But the political cause had been taken up by powerful advocates, like Al Gore. We found ourselves in another crusading ‘War’, like those on (non-alcoholic) Drugs and ‘Terror’. This new War, on Carbon, was equally simplistic, and equally prone to corruption and failure. Global warming science became the core element of this major worldwide campaign to save the planet. Any weakening of the scientific case would have amounted to a betrayal of the good cause, as well as a disruption of the growing research effort. All critics, even those who were full members of the scientific peer community, had to be derided and dismissed. As we learned from the CRU e-mails, they were not considered to be entitled to the normal courtesies of scientific sharing and debate. Requests for information were stalled, and as one witty blogger has put it, ‘peer review’ was replaced by ‘pal review’.
Even now, the catalogue of unscientific practices revealed in the mainstream media is very small in comparison to what is available on the blogosphere. Details of shoddy science and dirty tricks abound. By the end, the committed inner core were confessing to each other that global temperatures were falling, but it was far too late to change course. The final stage of corruption, cover-up, had taken hold. For the core scientists and the leaders of the scientific communities, as well as for nearly all the liberal media, ‘the debate was over’. Denying Climate Change received the same stigma as denying the Holocaust. Even the trenchant criticisms of the most egregious errors in the IPCC reports were kept ‘confidential’. And then came the e-mails.
We can understand the root cause of Climategate as a case of scientists constrained to attempt to do normal science in a post-normal situation. But climate change had never been a really ‘normal’ science, because the policy implications were always present and strong, even overwhelming. Indeed, if we look at the definition of ‘post-normal science’, we see how well it fits: facts uncertain,values in dispute, stakes high, and decisions urgent. In needing to treat Planet Earth like a textbook exercise, the climate scientists were forced to break the rules of scientific etiquette and ethics, and to play scientific power-politics in a way that inevitably became corrupt. The combination of non-critical ‘normal science’ with anti-critical ‘evangelical science’ was lethal. As in other ‘gate’ scandals, one incident served to pull a thread on a tissue of protective plausibilities and concealments, and eventually led to an unravelling. What was in the e-mails could be largely explained in terms of embattled scientists fighting off malicious interference; but the materials ready and waiting on the blogosphere provided a background, and that is what converted a very minor scandal to a catastrophe.
Consideration of those protective plausibilities can help to explain how the illusions could persist for so long until their sudden collapse. The scientists were all reputable, they published in leading peer-reviewed journals, and their case was itself highly plausible and worthy in a general way. Individual criticisms were, for the public and perhaps even for the broader scientific community, kept isolated and hence muffled and lacking in systematic significance. And who could have imagined that at its core so much of the science was unsound? The plausibility of the whole exercise was, as it were, bootstrapped. I myself was alerted to weaknesses in the case by some caveats in Sir David King’s book The Hot Topic; and I had heard of the hockey-stick affair. But even I was carried along by the bootstrapped plausibility, until the scandal broke. (I have benefited from the joint project on plausibility in science of colleagues in Oxford and at the Arizona State University).
Part of the historic significance of Climategate is that the scandal was so effectively and quickly exposed. Within a mere two months of the first reports in the mainstream media, the key East Anglia scientists and the Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change were discredited. Even if only a fraction of their scientific claims were eventually refuted, their credibility as trustworthy scientists was lost. To explain how it all happened so quickly and decisively, we have the confluence of two developments, one social and the other technical. For the former, there is a lesson of Post-Normal Science, that we call the Extended Peer Community. In traditional ‘normal’ science, the peer community, performing the functions of quality-assurance and governance, is strictly confined to the researchers who share the paradigm. In the case of ‘professional consultancy’, the clients and/or sponsors also participate in governance. We have argued that in the case of Post-Normal Science, the ‘extended peer community’, including all affected by the policy being implemented, must be fully involved. Its particular contribution will depend on the nature of the core scientific problem, and also on the phase of investigation. Detailed technical work is a task for experts, but quality-control on even that work can be done by those with much broader expertise. And on issues like the definition of the problem itself, the selection of personnel, and crucially the ownership of the results, the extended peer community has full rights of participation. This principle is effectively acknowledged in many jurisdictions, and for many policy-related problems. The theory of Post-Normal Science goes beyond the official consensus in recognising ‘extended facts’, that might be local knowledge and values, as well as unoffficially obtained information.
The task of creating and involving the extended peer community (generally known as ‘participation’) has been recognised as difficult, with its own contradictions and pitfalls. It has grown haphazardly, with isolated successes and failures. Hitherto, critics of scientific matters have been relegated to a sort of samizdat world, exchanging private letters or writing books that can easily be ignored (as not being peer-reviewed) by the ruling establishment. This has generally been the fate of even the most distinguished and responsible climate-change critics, up to now. A well-known expert in uncertainty management, Jeroen van der Sluijs, explicitly condemned the ‘overselling of certainty’ and predicted the impending destruction of trust; but he received no more attention than did Nikolas Taleb in warning of the ‘fat tails’ in the probability distributions of securities that led to the Credit Crunch. A prominent climate scientist, Mike Hulme, provided a profound analysis in Why We Disagree About Climate Change, in terms of complexity and uncertainty. But since legitimate disagreement was deemed nonexistent, he too was ignored.
To have a political effect, the ‘extended peers’ of science have traditionally needed to operate largely by means of activist pressure-groups using the media to create public alarm. In this case, since the global warmers had captured the moral high ground, criticism has remained scattered and ineffective, except on the blogosphere. The position of Green activists is especially difficult, even tragic; they have been ‘extended peers’ who were co-opted into the ruling paradigm, which in retrospect can be seen as a decoy or diversion from the real, complex issues of sustainability, as shown by Mike Hulme. Now they must do some very serious re-thinking about their position and their role.
The importance of the new media of communications in mass politics, as in the various ‘rainbow revolutions’ is well attested. To understand how the power-politics of science have changed in the case of Climategate, we can take a story from the book Here Comes Everybody by Clay Shirkey. There were two incidents in the Boston U.S.A. diocese of the Roman Catholic Church, involving the shuffling of paeodophile priests around parishes. The first time, there was a criminal prosecution, with full exposure in the press, and then nothing happened. The second time, the outraged parents got on their cell phones and organised; and eventually Cardinal Archbishop Bernard Francis Law (who had started as a courageous cleric in the ‘60’s) had to leave for Rome in disgrace. The Climategate affair shows the importance of the new IT for science, as an empowerment of the extended peer community.
The well-known principle, ‘knowledge is power’ has its obverse, ‘ignorance is impotence’. And ignorance is maintained, or eventually overcome, by a variety of socio-technical means. With the invention of cheap printing on paper, the Bible could be widely read, and heretics became Reformers. The social activity of science as we know it expanded and grew through the age of printing. But knowledge was never entirely free, and the power-politics of scientific legitimacy remained quite stable for centuries. The practice of science has generally been restricted to a social elite and its occasional recruits, as it requires a prior academic education and a sufficiency of leisure and of material resources. With the new information technology, all that is changing rapidly. As we see from the ‘open source’ movement, many people play an active role in enjoyable technological development in the spare time that their job allows or even encourages. Moreover, all over IT there are blogs that exercise quality control on the industry’s productions. In this new knowledge industry, the workers can be as competent as the technicians and bosses. The new technologies of information enable the diffusion of scientific competence and the sharing of unofficial information, and hence give power to peer communities that are extended far beyond the Ph.D.s in the relevant subject-specialty. The most trenchant and effective critics of the ‘hockey stick’ statistics were a University-employed economist and a computer expert.
Like any other technology, IT is many-faceted. It is easily misused and abused, and much of the content of the blogosphere is trivial or worse. The right-wing political agendas of some climate sceptics, their bloggers and their backers, are quite well known. But to use their background or motivation as an excuse for ignoring their arguments, is a betrayal of science. The blogosphere interacts with other media of communication, in the public and scientific domains. Some parts are quite mainstream, others not. The Climategate blogosphere is as varied in quality as any other. Some leading scholars, like Roger Pielke, Jr. have had personal blogs for a long time. Some blogs are carefully monitored, have a large readership and are sampled by the mainstream media (such as the one on which this is posted, Wattsupwiththat.com). Others are less rigorous; but the same variation in quality can be found in the nominally peer-reviewed scientific literature. Keeping up with the blogosphere requires different skills from keeping up with traditional literature; it is most useful to find a summarising blog that fits one’s special interests, as well as a loyal correspondent, as (in my case) Roger ‘tallbloke’ Tattersall.
Some mainstream publications are now saying nice things about the blogosphere. Had such sentiments been expressed a while ago, the critical voices might have had a public hearing and the Climategate scandal might have been exposed before it became entrenched so disastrously. And now the critical blogosphere does not need to be patronised. Like any extension of political power, whether it be the right to believe, to protest, to vote, to form trades unions, or to be educated, it can lead to instabilities and abuses. But now the extended peer community has a technological base, and the power-politics of science will be different. I cannot predict how it will work out, but we can be confident that corruptions built on bootstrapped plausibility will be less likely in the future.
There is an important philosophical dimension to Climategate, a question of the relation of personal scientific ethics to objective scientific facts. The problem is created by the traditional image of science (as transmitted in scientific education) as ‘value-free’. The personal commitments to integrity, that are necessary for the maintenance of scientific quality, receive no mention in the dominant philosophy of science. Kuhn’s disenchanted picture of science was so troubling to the idealists (as Popper) because in his ‘normal’ science criticism had hardly any role. For Kuhn, even the Mertonian principles of ethical behaviour were effectively dismissed as irrelevant. Was this situation truly ‘normal’ – meaning either average or (worse) appropriate? The examples of shoddy science exposed by the Climategate convey a troubling impression. From the record, it appears that in this case, criticism and a sense of probity needed to be injected into the system by the extended peer community from the (mainly) external blogosphere.
The total assurance of the mainstream scientists in their own correctness and in the intellectual and moral defects of their critics, is now in retrospect perceived as arrogance. For their spokespersons to continue to make light of the damage to the scientific case, and to ignore the ethical dimension of Climategate, is to risk public outrage at a perceived unreformed arrogance. If there is a continuing stream of ever more detailed revelations, originating in the blogosphere but now being brought to a broader public, then the credibility of the established scientific authorities will continue to erode. Do we face the prospect of the IPCC reports being totally dismissed as just more dodgy dossiers, and of hitherto trusted scientists being accused of negligence or worse? There will be those who with their own motives will be promoting such a picture. How can it be refuted?
And what about the issue itself? Are we really experiencing Anthropogenic Carbon-based Global Warming? If the public loses faith in that claim, then the situation of science in our society will be altered for the worse. There is very unlikely to be a crucial experience that either confirms or refutes the claim; the post-normal situation is just too complex. The consensus is likely to depend on how much trust can still be put in science. The whole vast edifice of policy commitments for Carbon reduction, with their many policy prescriptions and quite totalitarian moral exhortations, will be at risk of public rejection. What sort of chaos would then result? The consequences for science in our civilisation would be extraordinary.
To the extent that the improved management of uncertainty and ignorance can remedy the situation, some useful tools are at hand. In the Netherlands, scholars and scientists have developed ‘Knowledge Quality Assessment’ methodologies for characterising uncertainty in ways that convey the richness of the phenomenon while still performing well as robust tools of analysis and communication. Elsewhere, scholars are exploring methods for managing disagreement among scientists, so that such post-normal issues do not need to become so disastrously polarised. A distinguished scholar, Sheila Jasanoff, has called for a culture of humility among scientists, itself a radical move towards a vision of a non-violent science. Scientists who have been forced to work on the blogosphere have had the invaluable experience of exclusion and oppression; that could make it easier for them to accept that something is seriously wrong and then to engage in the challenging moral adventures of dealing with uncertainty and ignorance. The new technologies of communications are revolutionising knowledge and power in many areas. The extended peer community of science on the blogosphere will be playing its part in that process. Let dialogue commence!
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My thanks to numerous friends and colleagues for their loyal assistance through all the drafts of this essay. The final review at a seminar at the Institute of Science, Innovation and Society at Oxford University was very valuable, particularly the intervention from ‘the man in the bus queue’.
@ur momisugly Tallbloke
Firstly thanks for getting this guest post on here. Although I profoundly disagree with Ravetz, this post should stimulate decent debate (and it has done)
You write
“Post-Normal Science isn’t a prescription for the way Ravetz thinks science should be done, it’s a description of what is done with the outputs of normal science (good or bad), and how we should handle those situations where it’s results are used in policy formation.”
I’m afraid Ravetz and Hulme have a much bigger role for post-normal science in mind than you believe they have. Ravetz writes:
“But climate change had never been a really ‘normal’ science, because the policy implications were always present and strong, even overwhelming.”
That statement alone contradicts your inference as to the scope of PNS. His statement is also flat out wrong
The qualifying criteria for climate studies to fit into the domain of post-normal science, according to Ravetz, is:
“Indeed, if we look at the definition of ‘post-normal science’, we see how well it [climate studies/ CAGW] fits: facts uncertain,values in dispute, stakes high, and decisions urgent. ”
Let’s deconstruct these qualifying criteria:
“Facts uncertain” – is this the preserve of PNS? NO!!! It is in fact the very basis of scientific enquiry
“Values in dispute” – what does this actually mean? Science is based on observations which are value-free. We may debate how far for example genetic engineering or human cloning should go, which does involve weighing up different values, but that is the domain of ethics, not science and certainly not post-normal science. The core from which all scientific knowledge is generated – observations – is value-free
“Stakes high and decisions urgent” – there is a severe logical fallacy in operation here. If facts are uncertain, then how do you know the stakes are high? How do you know decisions are urgent?
The whole purpose of the PNS movement is to bypass the rigours of the scientific process on the basis that because the situation is so dire and urgent, we don’t have the time for such luxuries. This is complete alarmist balls. During the darkest hours of WWII, scientists conducted real science (like developing the nuclear bomb, breaking codes, rocket technology). This was conducted under the most extreme emergency conditions – they did not abandon due scientific process in favour of citizen juries and trying to figure out what constituted a ‘respectful process’. Even if we were to confront a dire emergency today (massive volcanic eruption, massive asteroid) we would rely on science to solve the problem, not post-normal science.
I find Ravetz’ and Hulme’s philosophy utterly poisonous. Not only do they have a philosophy, they have a process which constitutes post-normal science. When you read what that process entails, you realise it jettisons real science completely
Re: Willis Eschenbach (Feb 9 23:53),
Willis, I think I agree with you in the details too, though I only stated my objection to the conclusions above. Too much fuzzy logic all through. Possibly uncertainty and ignorance have different meanings for scientists and philosopher’s of science.
Thank you, Professor Ravetz, for an insightful essay, with which I largely agree – though I do share some of the views expressed in the comments. Kuhn’s analysis of science might provide a useful description of how science actually is conducted, but I would wish to add at least a genuflection to Paul Feyerabend who drew attention to the point that scientists will lie, cheat, elbow, eye-gouge, etc -and who warned against any notion of government-sponsored science. (We might add ‘intergovernmental-sponsored science’ to that). But I think we need to be Popperians (or something approaching that) when we wish to speak prescriptively about how we should assess the quality of science. The courts have had to grapple with this issue, and had to develop standards such as Daubert, Kuhmo Tire, etc against which to judge science. The political process needs something similar, and probably needs to institutionalise scepticism (perhaps David Henderson’s idea of a ‘B-Team’) if it is to institutionalise any area of science. Let’s face it, we can now expect Climategate to be taught alongside Lysenkoism in the future.
What I think is absent for the analysis, however, is the role of information technology is bringing about Climategate. I discussed this in my book, Science and Public Policy: The Virtuous Corruption of Virtual Environmental Science.’ The internet and blogosphere has worked to expose the flaw, but it also made the whole thing possible.
At a time when knowledge has become more and more specialised, the internet has allowed a handful of scholars in any area to contact each other, collaborate, publish together and ultimately circle the wagons to defend their perspective. To change the metaphor, they were then able to sue the net to send the white corpuscles to the site of any ‘infection’ that might challenge what had become a ‘club good.’ The ‘virtual’ nature of the process has to do not just with the excessive reliance on modelling, but the means of interaction. The IPCC has exacerbated this phenomenon by bringing these scientists together, putting them in touch with each other.
This has also undermined the traditional quality assurance process of peer review. Paper are now circulated in advance, so anonymity is absent. Many of the journals do not even exercise double blind processes, so the Climategate scientists were able to accept invitations to review knowing they were being invited to review papers from dissidents – and then ensure they were rejected, and kept out of IPCC reports that they themselves edited.
And while I don’t discount the corrupting influence of the provision of research funds, much of the corrupting influence has been the nobility of the cause — ‘virtuous corruption’ — which (as noble cause corruption in policing circles) is just as unjust and pernicious. They mean well. It’s ‘all in a good cause’. The public and the politicians need to be persuaded to act as ‘we know they should.’
But this, ultimately, is a grab for technocratic power. As C.P. Snow put it, scientists should be on tap, not on top. Climategate and the blogosphere has given democracy a fighting chance.
Now, if we could only find out what the reliable science tells us about the problem…. But , unfortunately, we no longer know. But we do know for certain, the problem is one of making policy under conditions of uncertainty.
I suspect there is a lot of sloppy science out there, and sloppy science has certainly contributed to this mess!
Many years ago, I remember being amazed when I learned that a Monte Carlo simulation used in a large and expensive project, would sometimes “Abend” – implying a catastrophic programming error. I was told that this was OK, if this happened the program was just run again (with different random numbers)! Everyone had more important things to do than get to the bottom of what was causing the problem.
People who like to work like that seem to have found a perfect niche in climate science!
Pete (01:17:04) :
“REAL science has served us well for many years. I would counter the Professor that his PHS has allowed the likes of Hulme etc to prosper and wiser people than me have explained that a long time ago”
I, too, was initially beguiled by Revetz’s essay – I tried to set aside my own very strong doubts about the merits of “post-normal science”. But his mention of Hulme in such a positive light – and more importantly his apparent concern that Climategate and its aftermath will cause the public to “reject the claim” – suggested to me that while milder in tone than, say, the Guardian’s latest effort, I felt as though we were being co-opted to “the cause”.
Hulme’s “We need to ask not what we can do for climate change, but to ask what climate change can do for us” along with such turns of phrase as”
“climate change is so plastic it can be deployed across many of our human projects and can serve many of our psychological, ethical and spiritual needs”
Not to mention his “These myths transcend the categories of true and false” …
leads me to conclude that one must despair for the future of our planet and its inhabitants! And we must act…. NOW!
tallbloke (01:10:36), thanks for your comments. You say:
Say what? Unless I am misreading him badly (always possible), Ravetz is definitely arguing against proper science:
To me, saying that the “approach of ‘normal science’ is obsolete” is arguing strongly “against science being done properly in the first place”. What am I missing here?
You also say:
The problem is not that the outputs of science are abused. It is that the scientific process is not being followed, so that there are no valid “outputs of science” to be abused. For example, the issue is not how the Hockeystick was used. The issue is that the Hockeystick was a fraud and a hoax.
Yes, true scientific findings can be abused … but that’s not the current problem with climate science. The current problem is that science itself is being abused because the basic tenets of science are not being followed. And regarding that, Mr. Ravetz says not one word. If that conveniently selective blindness is “post-normal” science, he is welcome to it.
The solution to that problem is not to go haring off after some new tenets of science. It is to return to adhering to the tenets which have served us so well for so long.
I’m sorry, but to me Jerry Ravetz is a craven apologist who is trying to divert attention from the real issue. Do you note that in his entire essay he says nothing about the hiding of data? Did you see that he doesn’t mention the corruption of the peer review process? Did you observe that he said nothing about Jones refusing to give out his data because Warwick would “try to find fault with it”? Did you get that he mentions nothing about Jones and the others conspiring to destroy evidence? Did you notice that he is totally silent about Jones fraudulently evading my FOI request?
Instead, Ravetz says:
That’s a pile of crap. The problem is not that integrity receives “no mention in the dominant philosophy of science” as Ravetz claims. The problem is that the individual climate scientists involved lack integrity. And Ravetz doesn’t mention Jones et al.’s lack of integrity, not even once.
Instead he blathers on about how the problem is with “the dominant philosophy of science”. I don’t buy that, not for one second. Ravetz doesn’t have enough personal integrity to take a stand against so-called “scientists” who lie, cheat, and steal … and he wants to lecture us on integrity? And you buy that idea, that Jones’ lack of integrity is not worth mentioning, and that the problem is that the “dominant philosophy of science” lacks integrity? Really?
I’m sorry, tallbloke, but to me Ravetz is a single-issue fanatic who is trying to twist the conniving cupidity of some scientists to fit his strait jacket powder-puff philosophy. I am surprised that Anthony published this rubbish, and I’m surprised that you and others buy into it.
Thank you Willis Eschenbach (23:53:22) : and others.
The Professor writes..
“And what about the issue itself? Are we really experiencing Anthropogenic Carbon-based Global Warming? ”
A good question but the next sentence shows the Professors view very clearly…
“If the public loses faith in that claim, then the situation of science in our society will be altered for the worse.”
I think the man is schizophrenic, he writes an essay on the many problems and assumptions of AGW science, expressing that the uncertainties are far greater then presented, and then says it would be tragic if people actually doubted the need to restructure the world over AGW.
“There is very unlikely to be a crucial experience that either confirms or refutes the claim;”
Ok, the author is now back to doubting the science, and he muddies the water with non scientific words like “experience” instead of “experiment” If we get back to observations and testing we may be able to prove or disproof the CAGW theory. Lindzen and others are working in this direction.
“the post normal situation is too complex”
what the he-double hockey stick is this?. Yes, climate may very well be a chaotic process, very hard to predict, currently the unknowns out weigh the known’s. This is quite normal in “science”.
“The consensus is likely to depend on how much trust can still be put in science.” Fortunately it now appears that the consensus will depend on how open the science becomes, and then what that open science reveals.
“The whole vast edifice of policy commitments for Carbon reduction, with their many policy prescriptions and quite totalitarian moral exhortations, will be at risk of public rejection.”
Sir, please change “moral exhortations” to immoral extortions”, and add fortunately after “will” and I will agree with this.
I am very grateful he is calling for open dialogue, and his concerns will probably reach many people I have difficulty communicating with. Other then that the man’s intellect may well be superior to mine, but this may allow him to assimilate nonsense at a more eloquent rate.
“What sort of chaos would then result?”
A curious phrase in an article describing a system that may well be chaotic in nature.
“The consequences for science in our civilization would be extraordinary.”
I vote for a return to normal science.
Willis (23:53:22),
An excellent summation, but will you please stop trying to snatch defeat from the jaws of victory.
The entire essay documents at great length that ‘climate science’ as practised by the IPCC, CRU, GISS etc is not science at all, but this other discipline called ‘post-normal science’.
Why would you not agree with this?
Game Over.
A most interesting essay – thank you, Dr Ravetz. And an even more interesting thread of comments – thank you all.
My take, for what it’s worth, is that “post-normal science” as practiced by Jones, Mann et al. isn’t really science, and that science can be just fine again once it has been divorced from the “post-normal politics” we suffer today.
I think the argument will shift now in any case, away from “Climate Change” and towards “Energy Security”. Of course this was the motivation, at least the behind the scenes political motivation, for going along with AGW in the first place. The policy framework will remain exactly the same.
A wonderfully concise and illuminating essay – thank you.
Someone ought to make David Cameron read this before he goes much further. His blind adherence to the AGW agenda is alienating thousands and is likely to result in a hung parliament – and economic chaos – in the UK.
“The whole vast edifice of policy commitments for Carbon reduction, with their many policy prescriptions and quite totalitarian moral exhortations, will be at risk of public rejection.”
Good. I hope I live long enough to hear Al Gore recant.
Great essay, BTW.
Willis Eschenbach wrote,
“I don’t buy that, not for one second. Ravetz doesn’t have enough personal integrity to take a stand against so-called “scientists” who lie, cheat, and steal … and he wants to lecture us on integrity?”
Maybe Ravetz is more analogous to a criminologist – interested in the sociology and motivation for crime, but not really focused on condemning it as such.
I mean one can (and should) condemn the likes of Jones, but that isn’t the end of the story – the structure of modern science seems to let this sort of thing happen. It is the structure that needs reforming, and politicians need to take into account the fact that if they press for answer A, they will probably get it, whether it is correct or not!
As a retired scientist, I could relate to the main points of the essay. Very worthwhile post.
I think “peer review” via blogosphere makes good sense — a lot of smart people out there. Obviously, has some “growing pains” ahead. Nontheless, life experience, intelligence, education, and objectivity can make great “peers” out of non-PhDs (in a given field). Almost by definition, such people “think outside the box” — because the were never in it to begin with.
To be blunt: I’m very much surprised this essay was published here. I’m all for thoughtful discourse, in all areas of life, but even a cursory examination of this “Post-Normal Science” notion proves it to be born out of Marxist leanings. The following link exposes as much with clarity:
http://buythetruth.wordpress.com/2009/10/31/climate-change-and-the-death-of-science/
‘PNS’ seems to be an attempt to put science, historicism, and deconstructionism into a blender in order to create a new paste with which our textbooks are to be bound. Only problem is that it doesn’t stick. Though, I suppose that is the desired effect. “Science means whatever we say it does!” No thanks. I’ll stick to my stodgy old empirical ways.
WIllis has nailed it again. “I am surprised that Anthony published this rubbish”, is very much my reaction too.
Very interesting to see what is effectively an acknowledgement by a respected member of the establishment (previously climate alarmist) that the whole alarmist facade has fallen (he says in 2 months which ignores the extensive eforts of sceptics for years before, proving the Hockey Stick & many other things deliberate lies – the climategate emails were simply the tipping point after which it became impossible to maintain.
As interesting is the acknowledgement that the blogsphere has changed everything & that attempts by the MSM to censor are now relatively ineffective.
This means that several other fraudulent “scintific consensuses” maintained by the political establishment cann now get a proper examination.
I am thinking in particular of the no lower threshold theory (LNT) of nuclear radiation. By ramping up anti-nuclear hysteria this has been used to hold back 4 decades of progress, In fact not only iss there no evidence whatsoever that low level radiation is harmful there is a vast amount, from numerous different sources for the hormesis theory that it is beneficial.
Or perhaps there is some government paid scientist somewhere in the world who is willing to say why the enormously destructive LNT theory is correct?
We shall see over the next couple of days.
“The function of climate change I suggest, is not as a lower-case environmental phenomenon to be solved…It really is NOT about stopping climate chaos.
“Instead, we need to see how we can use the idea of climate change – the matrix of ecological functions, power relationships, cultural discourses and materials flows that climate change reveals – to rethink how we take forward our political, social, economic and personal projects over the decades to come.”
So has said Mike Hulme, Professor of Climate Change UEA CRU, justifying the use of non-scientific “post-normal science” to pursue purely social and political agendas.
It may be noted that he is not, as I’m sure many casual observers might assume of such a prominent expert, Professor of Climate SCIENCE. No, he is prof. of Climate CHANGE. An example of the rise of post normal science.
I am in complete agreement with the comments posted above by ScientistforTruth (16:33:26) and Willis Eschenbach (23:53:22)
ScientistforTruth has written an eloquent history, and thorough analysis of the purely political, non-scientific ideals of the “post-normal science” of Ravetz et al here:
http://buythetruth.wordpress.com/2009/10/31/climate-change-and-the-death-of-science/
Also quoting extensively Prof Hulme justifying at length the mainstream use of non-science to pursue social and political agendas.
Anyone persuaded that post-normal non-science, leant scientific credibility by pseudo scientific quality assurance (a good example of which is the title “Professor of Climate CHANGE”) and expertly packaged to be sold on to the man on the street as real, credible science, please take the time to read this most illuminating and well documented article.
Everyone’s a hero, as long as it’s not high noon.
For the benefit of readers, I reproduce a response I made to ‘tallbloke’ last November – see whole post and all comments here:
http://buythetruth.wordpress.com/2009/10/31/climate-change-and-the-death-of-science/
“I don’t doubt that Ravetz is very perceptive and makes some interesting observations. Unfortunately, there is the ‘poison in the pot’. Ravetz will forever be remembered for his championing a new type of science, post-normal science. You will see from my post just where this leads: you have Mike Hulme explicitly espousing and adopting the ideas of Ravetz and turning ‘climate change’ into metaphysics and politics. Ravetz never masked the fact that his scientific method was political – having been a radical leftie, he drew heavily on neo-Marxism to formulate his PNS theory. And in his 2006 paper ‘Post-Normal Science in the context of transitions towards sustainability’ which I mentioned in the post, he explicitly states that “PNS has always had strong political aspect…Given its deep political commitments, PNS should have been making a contribution to this process, offering its insights about the way science will need to be done in the cause of justice and sustainability.” Of course, in the mouth of Ravetz, nice sounding words like “justice and sustainability” are really Marxist goals. “…even now there is no clear focus on science among the new movements for social reform. Those of us who are involved in PNS can help to shape a new ‘science of, by and for the people’ when the time is ripe.” First of all, ‘normal’ science must be destroyed, then a new science can be introduced which serves the political agenda of the Greens and the hard left.
You really should read that paper – it reads like a communist position paper. He even discusses Marxism and its relevance to PNS: “Marxist political theory spoke of ‘leading contradictions’…as when local struggles of classes and communities interact with common struggles against external enemies…The crucial thing in our understanding of it, is that it is a compounded contradiction. We can see its historical roots in what Marx considered to be the characteristic contradiction of modern capitalist society…But there was more to it than that, in the resolution of Marx’s characteristic contradiction…In our terms, they shifted the contradiction elsewhere, thereby staving off rebellion…”
So the question we must ask is, do we consider that introducing strong politics (for example, those of the far-Left) into science is doing it a service? What has happened in the Climategate scandal is that, indeed, pretty strong politics are heavily involved, and climate science is all the more discredited for it. Hulme makes no secret about it that he is a fully paid up member of the Labour Party for 19 years, and is riding the tiger of ‘climate change’ to further his socialist ends, and that Ravetz gave him the idea and the ammunition.”
And what does Ravetz espouse in that paper:
“The time is not ripe for a modification of PNS, and so the best move forward is to raise the issue of Sustainability. For that I sketch a theory of complex systems, with special attention to pathologies and failures. That provides the foundation for a use of ‘contradiction’ as a problem incapable of resolution in its own terms, and also of ‘characteristic contradiction’ that drives a system to a crisis. With those materials it is possible to state the characteristic contradiction of our modern industrial civilisation, and provide a diagram with heuristic power.”
Heuristic power is the power to explain ‘factual novelties’. ‘Contradiction’ and ‘characteristic contradiction’ are Marxist-speak. Heard about ’sustainability’ recently? You bet!
Can’t you folks see that Ravetz is a Trojan horse?
ScientistForTruth (04:06:16) :
“Can’t you folks see that Ravetz is a Trojan horse?”
Clear as day.
Much like when the BBC reached out to Anthony we urged extreme caution, so, too, should we do the same in cases like such as this one. The legitimacy of our arguments has been well-established and now the establishment, as it were, will try to co-opt our side of the debate at every turn.
Claurila (01:24:41)
Thanks. I think the Ben Pile exposition is a better piece of philosophical thinking than the Ravetz piece.
The ravetz theory of PNS is quite clearly bullshit and exist only in the phylosophical world in which he has lived his life but never the less his piece does contain some real world observations worthy of discussion.
Excellent essay and a gold-mine in future in discussions elsewhere. He has a really good way of putting things.
Very very good essay. The clearest I have read. Thanks.
Thank you ScientistForTruth (16:33:26) and others for reposting the expose of ‘post-normal science’ and the connection with Muke Hulme who, of all the CRI team, is obviously now wanting to ‘move on’ as fast as possible. I can’t but help comparing this to ‘cargo cult science’ and I see it as a convenient and full frontal attack on the scientific method. A rather critical view of the scandals by the theory creator changes nothing and does not deserve support for this post -modern view of science, no mater how much he might see it as being consistent with his theory (now).
Secondly (and perhaps unkindly) the essay could be seen as attempting to counter what the exposure of these terrible scandals and attacks on science really are: a stake through the heart of this nearly bankrupt theory. If the scientific method triumphs and reaffirms ‘science’ thanks to the exposure of the methods used here in the name of post-normal science, what clothing does the theory have left, but as a talking point amongst philosophers?
To think that it might have (might still yet) cost the world billions of dollars and change lifestyles, the true adjective to place on this theory might be close to being determined.