Guest post by Steven Goddard
The Washington Post reports today:
An undersea volcano erupts off the coast of Tonga, tossing clouds of smoke, steam and ash thousands of feet (meters) into the sky above the South Pacific ocean, Tuesday, March 17, 2009. The eruption was at sea about 6 miles (10 kilometers) from the southwest coast of the main island of Tongatapu an area where up to 36 undersea volcanoes are clustered
Besides the unusual feet to meters conversion in the quote above, I found it interesting because the SST maps show a warm anomaly in that region, and extending off to the east. Is that anomaly a result or coincidence?
http://weather.unisys.com/surface/sst_anom.html
How much influence do volcanoes have on local climates?
We know that the Antarctic Peninsula (advertised as the fastest warming place on the planet) is a volcanic chain which has seen recent activity.
Noted Antarctic expert Eric Steig tells us that Volcanoes under the ice can’t affect climate on the surface, 2 miles above! This is indeed true and interesting, because CO2 on the surface reportedly can affect the melting of the basal ice, two miles below.
According to some of the best AGW minds, increases of 0.0001 atmospheric CO2 concentration may be more powerful at affecting localized micro-climates than are 2000 degree volcanoes.
In another volcanically active area, the Gakkel Ridge, which was shown to have eruptions last year, the possibility also exists for localized warming. Here is a schematic of the Gakkel Ridge sea floor:
However in that case there is the claim by oceanographic experts that it is impossible for the sea ice above to be affected due to stratifed water layers and thus making the released heat “unable to communicate” to the surface.
Perhaps that is true, but does that stratification remain in a steady state? And is such an inability to “communicate” heat from the depths a feature of our oceans globally?
Someone who knows who was photographed this volcanic eruption?
Nick Stokes (18:49:48) :
Earle,
No, these sea vent figures aren’t comparable. Your vent is producing about a megawatt. There are computers that generate more than that. And if the surface flux is 6 W/m2, that’s only over an area of about 1/6 of a sq km. That’s not going to show up as a SST hot spot.
That’s quite a computer, it would dim the lights in our street.
A domestic dwelling in temperate climates only consumes about 20000 kW Hours per year.
Looks like a good place for a power plant to generate “clean” electricity. Not only can we harness the steam, but we can place giant windmills nearby to catch the thermal outgassing. Think of the people lining up for all those green jobs, if they can stand the heat….
Nick Stokes,
Thanks for your response. I took another look at my back of the envelope calculation and realized I was using a radius 1/2 too short. The radius of the surface circle is equal to the depth.
So that 100 tpd, 250 C vent is releasing roughly 1 MW of heat energy with a surface flux of 1.5 W/m2
Check out tis NOAA page for some info on the scale of the hydrothermal systems along the Tonga-Kermadec Arc: http://oceanexplorer.noaa.gov/explorations/05fire/background/plumes/plumes.html
and this paper:
http://www.segweb.org/EG/SkinnerAwardPapers/05-1097.pdf
I postulate that the subsea volcanism along the arc may be releasing sufficient heat to influence the surface SST observations. You may be able to dismiss the notion without considering the scale of the detected active volcanoes, vents, and hot springs. I’m not so glib in ruling it out as a possile influence.
I could also hypothesize a positive contribution from the increased biota in the near surface waters, as well as increased light absorption nearer the surface from the minerals entrained in the plumes.
What I would dismiss, glibly, is using an analysis comparing the kinetic energy of a single eruption with the thermal energy of a continuous hydrothermal system.
It is interesting to know which active volcano’s at this moment create plumes that penetrate the stratosphere:
Galeras (Columbia) has created a plume reaching an altitude of 12.300 meters and
the Tonga Eruption has reached 15.000 meters.
http://volcanism.wordpress.com/2009/03/19/siusgs-weekly-volcanic-activity-report-11-march-2009-17-march-2009/
I should rephrase my last paragraph:
What I would dismiss, glibly, is using an analysis estimating the kinetic energy of a single eruption rather than the thermal energy of a continuous hydrothermal system.
Some fantastic images of the eruptions here:
http://www.boston.com/bigpicture/2009/03/undersea_eruptions_near_tonga.html
“crosspatch (09:20:23) :
“EDMONTON – Frigid temperatures this winter have killed off more than 90 per cent of the mountain pine beetles in Alberta forests, new scientific data suggests.””
Here in Sydney, this summer (Or last rather, it’s Autum now) there was a noticeable lack of flies. Typically a hot summer brings lots of flies, this summer was much cooler which killed off flies…no “Aussie wave” this year.
It makes sense that undersea vulcanism should heat the surrounding water.
HOWEVER, the warmer-than-normal SSTs which extend from the central North Pacific southwestwards towards Indonesia and back southeastwards into the central South Pacific (over Tonga) are the pattern you would normally expect during a La Nina (the colder-than-normal SSTs in the eastern equatorial Pacific West of Colombia).
That normal pattern could be amplified in the vicinity of Tonga. I guess the proper way to analyse this would be to take the mean SST response during all March La Ninas (could probably use the NCEP NCAR Reanalysis data for this) and determine of the anomaly near Tonga significantly exceeds the normal La Nina variance.
BTW the warm anomaly East of Argentina could be related to the drought they have had in Argentina during southern Hemisphere summer http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2009/mar/08/argentina-drought-ranchers
– that has fed back into a hot summer there and I suspect that heat has warmed SSTs downstream (that area would be in the southern hemisphere westerlies.
Note that (before you AGW Alarmists spring into action) a La Nina NORMALLY produces dry conditions in Argentina http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20601086&sid=aj1nH.0owWcY
sorry to post so late, so often there’s just so much to take in!
Just for fun I assembled an animated gif of SST anomalies taken at weekly intervals in June 2008, and one thing I noticed was the appearance of hot “blips” against a background of steadier change. This strongly suggested undersea vulcanism. For one, the hot blips are not quite equalled by cold blips. For two, many are mid-ocean in known volcanic areas. For three, look at the “flame” off the west coast of S America. However, of course, that is just the first sight of anomaly that could inspire a more thorough study… eg also explaining both hot and cold areas adjacent to NH land in terms of land’s capacity for far greater temp fluctuations.
There has to be a sort of dynamic equilibrium here, with the interior heat of the planet accounting for some of our life-sustaining mild temperature on the surface.
I wish you would resize your images instead of squeezing huge images into small spaces.
In my post “Oceanic Volcanism and Sea Surface Temperature”, I’ve elaborated on my belief that the warm spot pointed to above is simply weather related. The noted warm spot is along the Southern Pacific Convergence Zone:
http://bobtisdale.blogspot.com/2009/03/oceanic-volcanism-and-sea-surface.html
And as noted a few times above, the hotspot is also about 900 miles from the volcano.
I wish you would squeeze even bigger images into even smaller spaces.
Lucy Skywalker (00:17:03) :
Quite interesting your observation. I have noticed that before on NOAA el Nino maps, not only big hot spots but sometimes very small ones surrounded with cold waters. If you revise all that data against not only volcanoes but earthquakes in near areas you will be surprised.
Tim L (17:36:39) :
“Jeff L (11:31:00) :
what about the heat from the rock on the sea floor.
the heat is not just the vent.
Ric Werme (16:03:29) : Mike D. (14:42:35) :
But where dose the heat go? it is not a small amount!
Bob Tisdale (15:59:52) :
There is a huge magnetic anomaly going on there as well, a hole in the earth magnetic field”.
Scientist from the University of Würzburg in Germany have developed a new type of direct volcano ejecta detection by measuring short term electric static changes that occur during an eruption.
For this purpose they place a grid antenna on a pole at a few hundred meters from the volcano. This way they are able to accurately measure the severity of an eruption, even if the volcano is not visible due to clouds or night conditions.
http://adsabs.harvard.edu/abs/2006AGUFM.V51A1664B
Ron de Haan:
Those short term electric static charges referred by the University of Würzburg is the same phenomena as “earthquake lights”, I observed twice, as big light flashes, in Lima city sky, a few minutes after the 7.9 Richter earthquake at Pisco, Peru (290 km.south of Lima).
Video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eNy6YQB8nnw
Lucy Skywalker, there are no volcanoes off the east coast of S America…Nor for that matter (if you look at your animation) in the North Sea!
Peter Hearndern “Lucy Skywalker, there are no volcanoes off the east coast of S America”.
Those hot spots in Lucy´s animation are Volcanic Galapagos Islands.
Peter Hearndern . You are right. Those west of SA , at the equator are the Galapagos islands, but around the hot spot off the east of Argentina coast there are no volcanoes.
I wish I could squeeze into a really really small space.
Adolfo Giurfa (08:24:06) :
Ron de Haan:
“Those short term electric static charges referred by the University of Würzburg is the same phenomena as “earthquake lights”, I observed twice, as big light flashes, in Lima city sky, a few minutes after the 7.9 Richter earthquake at Pisco, Peru (290 km.south of Lima).
Video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eNy6YQB8nnw”
Adolfo,
This very well could be but the Germans have calibrated he system and they get a very accurate read out of emission volumes.
On sky News, they Authorities reported that no fish was affected and no humans affected in the Tonga eruption, is this true?
Am very concerned about the minerals exposed on to the formed foothills of the volcano(s), scientists my have the best time to quest on the minerals yet a n earthquake may surprise the tonga Islands unnoticeably as the scientists fetch diamonds. where do these scientists come from any way?
Berni. Tour guide in Uganda- East Africa http://www.sunlinktravel.com
@Berni (00:17:16)
Diamonds will not form from the type of volcanism happening in Tonga.
The energy released from Mt St. Helens in a few minutes on May 18, 1980 was 24 megatons, which is enough to warm about twenty four billion cubic meters of water by one degree centigrade. That would cover an area 50km wide by 500km long, similar in size to most of the Antarctic Peninsula
It also melted the massive Mt. St. Helens glacier in a matter of a few seconds. Volcanoes do not emit heat consistently. They can sit dormant for thousands of years and then release heat in explosive bursts, as is being seen in Tonga now.
@ur momisugly Steven Goddard (18:33:17) :
So Steven, you believe that the volcanoes in west Antarctica are responsible for the warming observed there? Is the evidence simply because volcanoes are there, and there is warming? Just curious what all you are going on.
And yes, that was a lot of energy released by Mt. St. Helens when it erupted, but it was not all thermal energy, nor would all of the energy released be capable of adding heat energy into the surrounding environment. Not all energy is thermal energy, but you knew that; even though your comment implies otherwise.