![pope-francis-environment-encyclical[1]](https://wattsupwiththat.files.wordpress.com/2015/04/pope-francis-environment-encyclical1.jpg?resize=600%2C354)
Guest essay by Eric Worrall
Pope Francis, addressing members of the press while travelling on his chartered jet plane, has stated that the world is headed toward “suicide” if there is no climate agreement at the COP21 conference.
According to Reuters;
Francis, who visited Kenya, Uganda and the Central African Republic, also said the continent was “a martyr of exploitation” by wealthy countries who lust after its natural resources and try to impose Western values instead of concentrating on development.
The pope was asked if the U.N. climate summit in Paris would mark a turnaround in the fight against global warming.
“I am not sure, but I can say to you ‘now or never’,” he said. “Every year the problems are getting worse. We are at the limits. If I may use a strong word I would say that we are at the limits of suicide.“
Read more http://www.reuters.com/article/2015/11/30/us-climatechange-summit-pope-idUSKBN0TJ2FY20151130#L8vkviEg7TtoBrK4.99
I wish I had my own plane, though my dream is a little more modest than the Pope’s CO2 belching Alitalia jet.
I’ll go with never.
What was it they used to say ? If he doesn’t play the game, then he doesn’t get to make the rules.
Sounds about the same in Spanish, as it does in Italian.
g
I’ve had it with all of these pontificators; who actually know nothing at all about it.
And which “game” are you referring to? Games where players change rules are rare.
“The Game is a mental game where the objective is to avoid thinking about The Game itself. Thinking about The Game constitutes a loss, which must be announced each time it occurs.”
Welcome to post normal Science – an unlikely Popper carnie treat.
Climate games of course. That’s all we’ve been seeing since 1990- made up stories, magical temperature readings, changing the laws of physics via modeling, and on and on.
Even rarer are instances where I say “change the rules”, when I specifically mean “make the rules.”
g
You may be thinking of the notorious quote from Earl Butz (Nixon Secretary of Agriculture) about the Pope’s stand on birth control: “He no play-a the game, he no make-a the rules”. Mock Italian accent got him in trouble, of course. He had a way with words …
As for the current “Pope goes the weasel”, think of it as an IQ test question on 20th century history.
John Paul is to Poland as Francis is to Argentina.
Never sounds good. Close up the conference and do away with the climate change scam, that is the global warming scam, and we can bring much help to those in poverty.
In supposed response to Pope Francis’ “Now or never” ultimatum, TRM writes: “I’ll go with never.”
I have to note that Pope Francis is in fact a respected religious leader and his opinion on cAGW is likely the most authoritative one we will ever see, outranking even the highest ranking climate scientist. His intellectual domain is completely uncluttered by rational thought. He’s the Guy when it comes to climate experts. You should not take what he says lightly.
The Pope *is* a respected religious leader, and one who knows a few things about ignorance and humility which is why he has personally disclaimed expertise, a step up from a lot of other world leaders who are just as ignorant but much less willing to admit it. The setup in the Church has always been to hear the Pope out, but to vary deference depending on subject and expertise. Scientific matters about which the Pope has personally disclaimed detailed expertise are always accorded the lowest level of deference. When taken as a moral statement, the idea of taking care of the climate is not objectionable in the least. In fact, the Pope is probably the best route for getting around the current impasse as you can make an excellent case that climate levels being targeted are not optimal for the poor and the Pope would be compelled to speak out against that, caring for the poor being an area where he’s got more expertise and less willingness to tolerate posers.
It is generally uncontroversial that increasing TSI would tend to increase temperature and reducing it would cool the planet. An orbital sun shade/mirror is not affordable today but given current progress on reducing launch costs, it’s foreseeable as an affordable item several decades from now, when the apocalyptics claim that global warming will really hit its stride as a global disaster. Modest investments in reducing launch costs and creating orbital manufacturing facilities much less than what is being bandied about in Paris should do the trick of creating a capability to move us to a modern optimum and get rid of the specter of future ice ages.
A sun shade/mirror system would have the advantage of largely being a one time capital cost that can be turned on or off as needed. No disaster?, rotate the objects so they don’t materially affect the planet. A problem appears and you rotate things back over the course of a few hours or even days. Perhaps we can even figure out how to reduce the temperature gradient between the equator and the poles with both sides of the system operating to adjust TSI differently depending on the latitude. A lot of potential improvements there that would enhance the planet, especially for the poor, who are less able to adapt to weather and climate than the rich.
I think that Francis would have kind words to say about such an effort, and the Gaia contingent along with the socialists in watermelon guise would definitely not. Not enough graft available in it, not enough increases in political power there either.
TMLutas writes: “The Pope *is* a respected religious leader, and one who knows a few things about ignorance and humility which is why he has personally disclaimed expertise”
It’s always a little embarrassing when someone takes a sarcastic comment literally and I appreciate the measured tone of your reply but I must admit the part about declaiming expertise in the subject, while potentially true, has little influence on the majority of scientifically uneducated people, catholic or otherwise. The Pope is perceived by many (and proclaimed by the same) as a person who literally interprets and represents God’s will on Earth. It’s impossible to reconcile this position with one of ignorance on any subject.
He made a bad bargain at his meal, and forgot to bring his long spoon.
==============
We are going to find out what happens when CO2 goes up. China is not waiting. India is not waiting. Parts of Africa don’t want to wait. Most of the developed nations are not prepared to come close to the carbon reductions required to even slow the increase, never mind halt it.
We are going to find out what happens when CO2 goes up.
So these folks are going to have their apocalyptic claims tested. It may be quite embarassing.
They will simply rely on people not remembering past apocalyptic claims, while making up wild new claims far enough into the future where they will not be alive to answer for them. This has become a lifestyle of the far-left loons. Sure glad I never fell into their delusions.
Don’t forget they are making claims abut weather events now, let alone well into the future. The UK Wet office responds to questions about whether this storm or that storm was climate related, & say no it isn’t for certain but we expect more like this!
Alan the Brit…Liberal logic is non existent nowadays, they have mostly been converted to Socialism but are too dense to know it!!
The capacity of the loons to disregard their mistakes is frightening. One would think that the hiatus or reduction in warming would shake the believers to the core but that is never the case with the faithful. Y2K was a similar but smaller scale scam that brought all the worms out of the woodwork. The media were beside themselves with anxiety. All the experts were paraded past us ad nauseam. The moment the disaster didn’t materialize, all was forgotten and forgiven and we moved on to the next scare campaign. Who can forget the colossal farce of the WHO declaring H1N1 a pandemic. Apparently the whole world can. Countries which didn’t vaccinate had a below average flu year (Poland) of a less than average lethality strain. Our leaders (read con men) have discovered that they are really adept at solving problems that don’t actually exist. The other kind- not so much.
Y2K wasn’t a problem precisely because thousands of companies invested millions of man hours in preventing the problem before it occurred.
As a programmer who spent several months updating dozens of legacy programs in 1999, I can attest to that.
If the temperature goes up, they say “we told you so”. If it goes down, or stays stable, they say “look, we saved the planet”
What MarkW said. Y2K was a problem analyzed, prioritized, and dealt with. I find it disgusting and distressing to see such a good example slandered as a “scam”.
I’m with MarkW on this. Y2K is a great example of a problem analyzed, prioritized, and solved. It is harmful to [utter false criticism of] it as a “scam”.
(I posted this earlier and metaphorically used a legal term which may have stuck in an auto-moderation filter.)
P.S. If you don’t want your comments to linger for an hour in moderation, avoid using legal terminology, even as a metaphor. (Right?)
The only Y2K effect I know of is that it glitched the NASA/GISS adjustment codes.
With you on the examples except the Y2K. Yes the media did their scare routine but as someone who updated dozens of servers and thousands of clients it was not a false expenditure. The cycle is usually 3-4 years for a client system and 5-7 for servers. Some got done early some late in their cycle and there was a pause in purchasing after 2000 to allow the cycle to renew. It was never as big as the media claimed but what is?
BUT — the Y10K problem is coming up in 7,984 years and 29 days!!! Just think of all the legacy code written with output for only 4 places of decimal digits for the year instead of 5.
I say we’re doomed! — Spread the word! (At least try to divert attention to something other than CAGW.)
Y2K was real. It was known, planned for and most problems solved. Perhaps the feared “calamitous” events weren’t going to happen but indeed it did require upgrading of critical components and we did see a few interesting things with computers we didn’t bother with as they weren’t connected to our network systems. Not a big deal for non-critical components but it did have impacts – and we did testing to see what would happen on the rollover (as did many other people) just to see what would happen. Mostly the date would just revert to the initiation date (I forget what that was) but some unexpected things happened so we made sure we had most things upgraded by the fall of 1999. There are several retrospectives – just search Y2K retrospective.
Here is just one: http://www.grantjeffrey.com/article/y2kretro.htm
“MarkW
December 1, 2015 at 10:56 am”
There are two countries I know of that did nothing in the run up to Y2K. Ethiopia and Romania, and Romania had nuclear power stations.
Y2K was “fear mongering”.
If there was a Y2K problem in some of the software then it was the fault of lazy or incompetent programmers because there has been a simple little programming algorithm available since at least the 1960’s (when I first used it) for determining when there is a millennium “roll-over” as well as “leap years” ….. and there has not been a banking or money management program pertaining to mortgages, loans, depreciation, accrued interest, interest payments, etc. in the past 40/50 years that did not “use” that algorithm, …….. otherwise they would have done “crashed n’ burned” long, long before Y2K occurred.
Not all programs had the Y2K problem.
Code that did no date calculations would not have the problem.
Code that was written properly to begin with did not have the problem.
You can also fake out your computer by telling it that the year is 1990 instead of 2000.
The fact that a couple of countries did not have a problem is not evidence that there was never a problem to begin with.
“There are two countries I know of that did nothing in the run up to Y2K. Ethiopia and Romania, and Romania had nuclear power stations.”
Countries that are well known for the massive number of computers they had in operation at that time. Hint: that’s sarcasm.
Telling those of us who had to work on Y2K problems that it wasn’t a problem is not going to impress us.
@ MarkG
Cause ya’ll saved the business world and every government agency from total collapse on January 1st, 2000, …… RIGHT?
Vunderful, simply vunderful.
Yup, and an intelligent DP Manager or programmer could also fake out their computer by telling it that the year was 2001 …… and then execute a “test run” to see iffen there were any “queertrons” buried in the “code” that would cause it to “blow its mind”.
True but even if their apocalyptic claims do not materialize, they will simply ignore it and carry on.
Once this carbon tax scheme is in place, it will never go away.
The first US personal income tax was created to pay for the Civil War, somehow we’re still paying.
Yes , freeing the slaves is STILL costing us a pretty penny !!!!
How is it different from the last 18 years? CO2 went up, temperature didn’t. I cannot assume the warmists will see the light with another few years of contradictory data. They will simply adjust the numbers, talk about model predictions, change the subject to ocean acidification/extreme weather/etc etc etc, or shout you down that you are an evil capitalist that doesn’t care about the earth/poor people/minorities/etc etc etc. I’m so tired of this ridiculous waste of resources!
We’re definitely headed for suicide with the agreement the Pope, Obama, and the rest of the progressives in Paris have in mind. I’ll take my chances with no agreement.
Good thing for the Pope that he was not around in the 70s following Jim Jones, because he would have consumed the Kool-Aid for sure.
Desperate times call for desperate words from on high. same old same old.
What a 5 star hypocrite.
The Vatican is the capitalist headquarters of the planet.
Nowhere are the poor more exploited for their last few dollars than by this arrogant organisation.
Don’t mention tax to these super greedy parasites.
Marxists always want all the power and all the money.
They see the M.M.G.W. racket as their best chance ever, to get it.
Second rank, but not far off, is Scientology.
The Pope ought to rent Travolta’s 707….
So, why not take money off the table? Why shouldn’t developed nations support a barter system with developing countries until they have reasonable infrastructure and a reasonable GDP?
Fuller’s World Game is a possible approach:
https://bfi.org/about-fuller/big-ideas/world-game
Very 60’s but it’s better than a grab bag full of useless script and doesn’t require UN nonsense.
Because money is all they want, and I bet they won’t use if for what it is intended.
Tom,
Look at the win win of an alternate approach. This approach employs in both developed and developing countries, it takes profit off the table in favor of exchange rates based on barter agreements which can’t be traded to inflate or deflate their value, it focuses on true needs, it’s an approach which focuses on the true needs of the developing country and contains the good old boy elitists, etc…
Developing countries don’t want worthless script (money), they want help!
Note: if you’ve got a solution, win 100k and enter the contest:
“Each year, The Buckminster Fuller Institute invites scientists, students, designers, architects, activists, entrepreneurs, artists and planners from all over the world to submit their innovative solutions to some of humanity’s most pressing problems. A $100,000 prize is awarded to support the development and implementation of one outstanding strategy.”
Best, John
re: John McClure December 1, 2015 at 9:55 am
John, that assumes those in power really want to solve the problem. But they do not, they only want more power and control.
Remember:
First you take their money
Then you take their guns,
Then you take their freedom.
I just watched Bill Nye teaching some dumb microphone inhaler about how we are going to fix climate change. I wish I cold tell you how he is going to do it, but he was just completely incoherent.
He did hold his hands up to show her about how deep eight inches of water is.
Hey Bill ! The reason that water lies around in puddles, is because the bottom of those puddles is at a lower altitude than other places that don’t have puddles.
Don’t stand around in places with puddles. In particular, never try to push your Detroitosaurus Maximus out of a water puddle.
Nine times out of ten, you will be pushing your car uphill.
g
I used to visit a quite historic Mexican fishing town, on the Sea of Cortez.
I noticed that the kids in the town liked to fish with some nylon fishing line wrapped around an empty beer bottle (Dos equies), and they used an old outboard motor spark plug for a sinker to hurl their line and bait out into the Bay for fish.
So one year, I bought a half dozen well made plastic Hawaiian hand reels, which I loaded up with about a hundred yards of good quality line. I figured their spark plugs were as good a choice for sinkers, so I didn’t get any lead ones.
So I handed those out to some of the kids, and showed them how much better than a beer bottle the Hawaiian hand reel was.
At the end of the week, as we were leaving to come home, I saw a couple of those kids, dragging the Hawaiian hand reel around the street, trying to get it to bowl like a small hoop.
Some times, there are good reasons, why third world peoples do what they do.
And we aren’t going to be able to teach them anything better.
g
Hi George,
Exactly, the solutions must be culturely insightful or they will fail. It’s a wonderful and very difficult design exercise. Obviously, the UN isn’t up to the task. So let’s discard the UN goofs and build a proper basis for resolution.
There’s more talent on WUWT than we’re likely to find anywhere. Instead of bitching in comments, why not team up and fix some of the nonsense?
Speaking of people wanting all the money, much of the 3rd world is so corrupt that the money thrown at them will never go any where but in government officials pockets:
http://www.worldbank.org/en/news/press-release/2013/12/19/corruption-developing-countries-world-bank-group-president-kim
http://www.forbes.com/2007/04/03/corruption-countries-nations-biz-07caphosp-cx_da_0403corrupt.html
Exactly, so take money off the table in favor of a better approach! ; )
Send an email to the UN, John . . maybe they’ll reconsider ; )
Nowhere are the poor more exploited for their last few dollars than by this arrogant organisation.
==============
So true. The Vatican has trillions of tax free dollars socked away
Perhaps the weathiest parasitic organization on earth. Criminally extorting biilions each year from the poorest of the poor, lest they burn in hell. The current Pope installed in a coup. With the previous pope forced to resign. The third prophecy of Fatima, the downfall of the Roman Catholic church now unstoppable.
So presumably if there is an agreement, humanity is not at the limits of suicide anymore. Good grief.
And if there is an agreement, will the UN let us know when the climate has stopped changing?
Once the UN and the far-left achieves global control and power, they will never give it up, and if it takes a perpetual climate fraud to keep it, so be it.
Pope Frank said: “Try to impose Western values instead of concentrating on development” … isn’t that something of an oxymoron? But then maybe it’s just the standard socialist doublespeak.
So look at the values that his operation has instilled into the peoples of Central and South America, where population explodes unceasingly driven by his birth control science.
Fix your own house first.
g
South America could have been a genuine economic giant had it been colonised and managed like the United States.
Despite centuries of mismanagement and dictatorships (not to mention the questionable role of the Catholic Church) Venezuela in 1950 for instance was the 4th wealthiest country in the world per cap., Argentina in 1913 was the 10th wealthiest.
Most of the countries colonized by Britain are doing pretty well.
All of the countries colonized by Spain are basket cases.
Mark,
Colombia and Chile are doing fairly well now. Maybe Costa Rica.
The problem with the Spanish and Portuguese colonies was that they didn’t develop a middle class. Even when Venezuela was rich, it was because of Los Ricos, not Los Pobres or Los Indios, the three classes there then. To the extent there was a middle class in Latin America, it tended to be military or militarized police. Colombia and Chile have developed prosperous middle classes now and are undergoing the kind of economic expansion reminiscent of the post-war USA. Or were until the collapse of oil and copper prices. Chile is the only Latin American member of the OECD, ie officially a First World country. Parts of it remain pretty backward, though.
Yes, we don’t want to impose “Western values” on Africa, such as those taught by the Church of Rome. Why force such concepts as compassion, love, and equality on people who are so much better off without them. Is this guy Pope or what?
So, Francis wants to recall all Catholic missionaries from the Third World?
Can this nitwit possibly be as stupid as he sounds?
Is the pope that he replaced still alive? If so, maybe they should make some more smoke and bring him back.
Yes, the deposed pope Benedict is still alive, if not bumped off by palace coup perpetrators. And unlike Francis, he’s a Christian rather than a Commie.
A big majority of the influential people in the Western World has done morphed into being “PC berserk ”.
The Church of Rome and its Catholic claiming parishioners has Francis as their Pope …. and the US citizenry has Obama as their POTUS, ….. which is a direct result of Politically Correct “actions” by a portion of the populace.
Get off the jet, Pope Francis. The engine noise makes it hard to hear that last part. That part about, “the boogeyman is gonna get ya if you don’t watch out.”
He could of gone with the biblical precedent set in the New Testament and made his triumphal entry into Paris on an ass.
Why an extra ass? His worshipfullness alone is sufficient.
So what if there is agreement at COP21; that all is ok, and the scam is so unraveled that we can’t keep it up any more ?? The sheeple are getting too smart.
G
He forgot to finish off with his own famous words … “Who am I to judge?”
“… try to impose Western values instead of concentrating on development…”
Mark from the Midwest, above, has already commented on this, but I’ll make it more pointed. Without imposing some western values in these endeavors, such as transparency, honest accounting, efficiency and so forth, one does not get “development” but rather feeding by kleptocrats.
Translation: “If I don’t get my way I’m going to hold my breath until I turn blue!”
Too bad Picasso is no longer with us.
Is the Pope going to show up at COP21 at all? Seemed odd that he wasn’t one of the media celebrities of the opening day.
Jef: I guess that would be the ultimate appeal to authority.
The Vatican is a city state, so he should have been there. If the true goal of COP21 is redistribution of wealth among nations, the Vatican could float us all!
Ok, once again I’m forced to do this. Yes, this is God, and yes, once again I’m speaking to you through the admittedly decrepit body of TomJ. That clown I put in the Vatican has once again forced me to enter a human body and come down and issue another goddam (yes, I’m starting to use that phrase too) apology to all of you. Didn’t my son come down to Earth (he can assume a human body better than I can; I’m stuck using TomJ’s) and tell everybody to render unto Caesar the things that are Ceasar’s and unto God – that’s me and not Obama – the things that are, well, mine? And, my son was a helluva (I’m using that phrase now, too) younger than that old fossil. Francis, for chrissake (sorry, my son hates it when I use that phrase) I’m tired of apologizing for you. Grow up. Acquire a little wisdom. Not everyone who doesn’t succeed doesn’t succeed because they were exploited. In fact, guy, if you really understood exploitation you’d boycott that goddam (there I go again) conference. And, don’t go around insinuating that people who are capable of building that jet you fly around in are exploiters. And, if you think so, stop flying.
Wow, God’s a cool dude. Who knew? And not one whiff of fire n’ brimestone.
That was the “old” God.
There’s an explanation about Francis not knowing Mark 12:17: being an old school hard-line Marxist, he’s never read the Bible.
At least, the pope must literally be the biggest CAGW “believer”.
What an id…. (sorry).
I have no idea how ecclesiastical training fits you to comment on things scientific!
Gulping the kool aid is never a good plan. I noted an early reward for gulping though in the cover story of Nat Geo on the Virgin Mary. Such a cover story would not have been approved in advocacy bias land without the Vatican partaking of the kool aid. I can’t say what was in the article because the final few gift issues are going in the trash with the plastic cover still on.
He must be trying for the U.N. ” Socialist of Year ” award !! Too late, Obama has him beat !
So, I hear the Pope declared that we are in a slow motion 3rd world war.
Did he declare a side?
Liberal socialists interrupting with ” Denial of Service ” at the
House hearing on Paris Climate Change Conference today
The TRUTH must be prevented at all costs !!!!
Good thing they are recorded !!
He should have taken the name Pope Pessimist. He’s hung up on admonishment and puts more faith in bureaucrats and human vanity, than God’s omnipotence, to maintain this earthly existence of ours.
Mainstream religion as it has evolved requires that one make too many justifications and rationalizations of conflicting ideas to be very useful to people who employ critical thought. Does a behavioral code of ethics for humanity have to be issued by a deity to serve the people best?
Let the excommunications and burning at the stake begin for deniers and skeptics. Is there such a thing as acidic holy water?
No doubt that plans for Inquisition II are being drawn up.
Nobody expects the climate inquisition!
ug
http://www.bbc.com/news/science-environment-34977265
nice pic of STEAM there trying to be passed off as smoke
Science, logic and common sense are things that socialists ( today’s liberals ) don’t want your children to know !!!!
Looming catastrophes
Pope Francis needs to study the Revelation from Jesus Christ (not atheistic “science” advisors) – where people will seek death from the sun turning black – and from demonic oppression – not from hotter climate! vis
Revelation 6:12-17; Revelation 9:1-11
Asteroid impact will likely cause far greater damage than a foot or so rise in ocean levels from anthropogenic warming (aka “climate change”).
Revelation 8:8-9
https://youtu.be/4Yn2eMnhnfw
House committee on Paris Climate Change foolery !!!
I was raised Catholic and even though I am no longer Catholic I still had a lot of respect for the Pope. Until this one. I find little Spiritual about him. He is locked into the secular world. But I’m afriad he may not even realize it.
But I’m afriad he may not even realize it. He hopes you will believe that. It gives him cover.
This Pope is becoming a pest. He is not the brightest bulb in the chandelier I’m sick of reading about his witterings. Time he stuck to what little he knows.
So why do you persist in continuing to reading about what you call his withering. If you are that sick the answer is simple; just stop doing it.
The pope is as severely wrong as the previous chapter of the Catholic hierarchy covering up for priests.
How can such a well intended institution go so far off the tracks?
He may as well be calling for world wide communism to save us killing ourselves.
Nuts on a grand scale.
Well intentioned? The Church has had a very long history of agitating against Jews. Now almost forgotten since it is an inconvenient truth.
How about a very long history of agitating against anyone not Catholic, let’s see, the Inquisition, the reign of Mary I, complicity in the extermination of Jews and Gypsies 1939-1944 … just to name a few
It seems to me there’s a reason Roman Catholic doctrines called for suppressing the Book for centuries, actually killing some people for translated it into languages the common folk could read (or understand if read to them), or for even possessing portions of such translations . . and still does not encourage it’s followers to actually read it themselves. I think most people would be shocked if they learned how weak the Biblical case is for any sort of “Pope” ruling over Christianity. It’s not even as strong as the scientific case for a CO2 induced climate catastrophe, to me anyway.
Remember when the left thought that religion should stay out of politics completely?
Well, that was back when they used to believe in quaint things like free speech, too. Good times, good times.
the party is getting expensive for US –
http://freebeacon.com/issues/obamas-motorcade-for-climate-change-talks-costing-784825/
at a time when we shoot off $20 for Anthony to travel ???
Reductive? If only.
Nope, we are approaching the limits of cheap energy versus demand growth necessary to lift billions out of poverty. Orders of magnitude improvement replacement technology urgently required. Never mind sidestep, how about the quickstep? No vision, no leadership. Just more mumbo-jumbo while riding a whipped-up populist FUD wave for which there is no firm scientific basis. Surfing on ego, thrills and trappings, just like the rest of this sorry band of hypocrites.
May I suggest this cheap replacement technology? COAL
Won’t keep pace I’m afraid.
AJB: so what, you’ll get a good 20 – 50 years out of it.
Given the Catholic Church’s history on scientific issues, we can rest assured that we are on the right side, we should keep up the good fight, and history will judge us properly. Galileo would be proud.
Georges Lemaître may disagree
Stop it. Demagogueing history based on ignorance and bigotry detracts from the REAL and legitimate issues. Set your ignorance aside for 5 minutes and deal with the legitimate issue at hand.
The Catholic Church placed Galileo under house arrest and didn’t acknowledge that the earth goes around the sun until the 19th century. How do those facts constitute ignorance and bigotry?
Besides which, why should anyone pay attention to what an ignorant and bigoted, Marxist priest says, who also claims that pets go to heaven?
troll
What makes you suppose I’m a troll?
Your reaction to the facts about the Church appears trollish to me.
Popes aren’t infallible and its priests are most recently guilty of widespread child rape, which was actively enabled and covered up by princes of the church. Not too long ago they offered sanctuary to N-a-z-i-s and their safe passage through Europe passage to South America. Shame on the Church and its devotees.
This particular Pope is no angel and is a typical South American radical and socialist. He will cozy right up to Obama, European socialist powers that be, and the UN.
Copernicus merely said that the planets circled the sun. Galileo added that the Sun was not the center of the universe, but his observations did not prove that. When it became more obvious in the 1800’s that Galileo was right, proved with observations, the church agreed.
But the Sun is the center of the universe. So is Tulsa… and Tucumcari. That’s the speculation, anyhow.
Alan Robertson December 1, 2015 at 1:56 pm
“But the Sun is the center of the universe.”
No Barack Obama is the center of the Universe, at least in his and his followers minds. I’m sorry, I mean at least in his and his followers heads full of mush.
Galileo’s observations of the phases of Venus showed the Church-approved, geocentric, Ptolemaic system false. The Church accepted the heliocentric system in the 19th century long after direct observation showed that the earth does in fact go around the sun.
Copernicus and Galileo both wrongly believed that orbits were perfect circles. Galileo should have known better, since Kepler sent him his discovery, using Tycho’s observations of Mars, that orbits are elliptical (Mars’ more so than Earth’s, due to proximity to Jupiter). Newton invented calculus to derive elliptical orbits from his theory of universal gravitation.
In 1992, after a 13-year investigation, Polish Pope John Paul II apologized on behalf of the Church to Galileo for wrongfully imprisoning him for advocating the astronomical system of German-speaking subject of the Polish crown, Copernicus, a Catholic canon whose work was published by German Protestants.
If Warmists are at their limits of suicide, then they should go ahead and get it over with. The world would be a better place.
Meanwhile the burning of the rain forests is changing climate, mass extinctions are just around the corner in Africa, and an expansionist religion of hate with extensive youth training is threatening the world. At this rate Armageddon will be neatly explained away by AGW climate change.
COAL seems like a good answer.
Hydrocarbons are a far too valuable commodity to just chemically convert to energy by burning. They are the industrial feedstocks of the future. Right now the technological edge commodity is rare earths, which are inextricably linked to the only credible solution to future energy demand.
That is if we want to stay in the game and our collective parasites on Parisian vacation wake up and actually lead instead of dropping the ball merely to entertain the green nut brigade.
Pope Francis said: “the continent [Africa] was ‘a martyr of exploitation’ by wealthy countries who lust after its natural resources and try to impose Western values instead of concentrating on development.”
I thought part of “Western values” WAS development. I think he may be a bit confused.
What the hell did we do to deserve these ‘leaders’ ? Are they illiterate ? all of them ? How about some good technical education ?
Exactly. This was emailed to me a few mins ago on “leaders”
http://pc.blogspot.co.nz/2015/12/quote-of-day-on-our-world-leaders.html
Jesus on his Donkey
The pope is in his jet
Jesus says ‘do as I do’
‘I will. I will. but just not yet’
Jesuit man, how useful now
darling of the masters
who ridiculed your predecessors
Voices calling now for guns
held to heads of little people
all their money and their freedom gone
to those who rule by lies and sword
you speak for Caesar, Jesuit
get behind me!
Mower pleas.
=========
This is from an AP story today:” Obama met with envoys from island nations hit hard by rising seas and increasingly violent storms, which scientists attribute to climate change prompted by man-made carbon emissions. “
What??? Can someone tell me which island nation has been ‘hit hard’ by rising seas? Can someone show me the graph of ‘increasingly violent storms’? I’ll be waiting.
. . .WHAT ??? Didn’t you watch Al Gory’s movie !! Who do you think you are , an intelligent person asking a serious question ??? You , you denier you !! LOL…snarc !!
try to impose Western values instead of concentrating on development.
=========
Missionaries do that in Gods name.
ferdperple,
If you are talking about Christian missionaries then I would gently like to suggest that you look up in what part of the world Christianity was created. Or do you regard Palestine as part of the West?
Development IS a western value. You can have the socialist, 5 year plan version, or the freedom loving capitalist version. But both are Western values. You can look at 20th Century History and decide which works best for you… (hint, which one killed 100M+ people. Don’t choose that one).
If you want to stick with traditional tribal values, I’m afraid you don’t get development.
Peter
If you ask most of the old well indoctrinated Chinese they will tell you : so many ? well Chairman Mao needed to do that to create the new China. Later when asked which of the leaders that was good they will agree Deng Zhao Ping was good. He actually started to set China free from the socialist abuse and started the introduction of capitalism. That was back in 1980ies. That obvious worked, socialism do not.
Once Madame Mao was forcibly removed after Mao died!
The Chinese leaders finally wised up and realized that you didn’t need a non-functional economic system to maintain a dictatorship.
I think the Pope has a right to voice his views, just like the rest of us. I also think he’s about as well informed on climate science as I am on Mandarin punctuation rules, which is to say, not at all. I’m sure he’s a nice guy and he has literally dedicated his life to helping others, which is a laudable trait. His help of others might be better focused elsewhere, maybe somewhere where he has some level of “expertise”, like oh, I don’t know, maybe religious doctrine? We should probably just ignore his thoughts on climate, if I need climate info, I’ll come here. If I need the advice on wiring my house, I’ll call an electrician. If the Pope was my neighbor, and my car broke down, I’d call a mechanic. If a close friend died, I might ask the Pope a few things. Horses for courses…
The poop is a socialist from Argentina !! Period !!
Small correction ….that should have been ” Holy Poop ” !!
But if your mechanic was no longer allowed to be a mechanic because the collusion on a global scale happened to include an agenda against fossil fuel cars and trucks, would you notice or care about the connections of decisions and events? And if your electrician no longer worked because the housing market declined in the aftermath of tripling the price of fuels to commute to work, would you care? It’s the bad Santa butterfly effect brought to you by advocacy groups and a few prominent jet setters.
I guess God is using him to slaughter people.
Bingo.
http://www.catholicnewsagency.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2015/07/Papal-seat-cushion.jpg
Having a website with the name vatican.com speaks volumes to me.
The Catholic church is perhaps the world’s greatest owner of real estate. Imagine the respect to be garnered if this institution sold all of this real estate, along with its vast hoard of treasure and then ministered to the poor as did Jesus. Fat chance … sadly, the rot has eaten its very soul.
Its soul? The church which, in its infancy, immersed itself in the blood of tens of thousands of pagans with whom it disagreed… the church led by Middle Ages popes, some of whom were murderers, adulterers, rapists, and warmongers in their own right… the church which, along with Protestant churches, burned tens of thousands of suspected witches… the church which burned people for English translation Bibles… the church which issued indulgences for sinners? I can only think that the church’s soul is as strong and as healthy as it’s ever been.
The Church briefly served a useful purpose during the Cold War, but now it’s back to its usual hypocritical con, extortion and protection racket.
Exactly who woudl it sell all those historic churches to and all that priceless European art? Russian or Asian business men? Have you really thought through what you are proposing? I doubt it – more knee jerk anti-Catholicism.
Well said Bob, but that’s not the catholic business model.
We’re all going to self-abort. Progress.
Every time he opens his mouth, this pope proves he’s an idiot.
How about Prince Charles, Mr Gore, Mr Obama … to name a few
The pope, unfortunately, is not the only idiot.
It’s now time to call on historians to recount the times in history when so many world leaders were diverted from real issues and challenges at the same time. Or was history also distorted like current events and coverage today? I suppose the lead in to WW1 might have some similarities, with its monarchies oblivious to undercurrents. Likewise, a retreat from threats and reality in the 1930s might apply since the world was more severely impacted by trade shut down and isolationism than is normally discussed.
Maybe the many conferences and treaties post WW1 to outlaw war between nation states. Lots of hurumping and pretty speechifying leading straight to WW2.
For the most part, development means the adoption of Western values.
I wonder if the Pope would be up to a debate with Kenneth Humphries, the brilliant mind behind jesusneverexisted.com . I think Kenneth could probably put him away in the first round. What? The Israelites were never slaves in Egypt? The Noah flood was only one of nine known flood myths from antiquity and not even the oldest? Why was it Paul never quoted Jesus, referred to his virgin birth, recalled any of his miracles, when all of his collective letters were written before the gospels? How is it Josephus recalls 19 different Jesuses (plural of Jesus?) but never one from Nazareth? OH! Maybe because there was no Nazareth until hundreds of years later. So maybe, just maybe, before the Pope goes all schizo on Global Warming, maybe he should check into the authenticity of his own realm of knowledge. Like the current prophet of Mormonism, he probably knows he sitting on an empty crock of compost, but hell, he can’t let the cat out of the bag at this late date.
It is considered a fact that Jesus was crucified, by virtually all current historians, Nudely. There is corroborating evidence in the writings of several early Roman historians, including mention of several individuals that appear in the Book. This is not in serious dispute, in reality-land.
Paul was writing advice on how to live a Christian life.
He wasn’t writing as a historian.
It really is amazing how much ignorance the anti-Christians will buy into to.
Diaa Hadid, Associated Press, 21 December 2009, reported that archaeologists had uncovered a house in Nazareth that dated back to the time of Jesus. “The dwelling and older discoveries of nearby tombs in burial caves suggest that Nazareth was an out-of-the-way hamlet of around 50 houses on a patch of about four acres (1.6 hectares). It was evidently populated by Jews of modest means who kept camouflaged grottos to hide from Roman invaders, said archaeologist Yardena Alexandre, excavations director at the Israel Antiquities Authority.” As for Paul quoting Jesus, every Sunday churches recite 1 Corinthians 11: 23-26 in which, sorry, Paul quoted Jesus. There’s also Acts 20:35 and 1 Corinthians 7:10-11 and 1 Timothy 5:18. As for the virgin birth, Galatians 4:4 looks a lot like an allusion to it. Miracles? Paul was writing to people who had already heard about them; why go over it again? The letters of Peter, also written to people who had already heard about them, say nothing about specific miracles. That’d be, oh, like people here explaining in every posting what CAGW is and what a greenhouse gas is and so on.
The interesting question here is whether Pope Francis is a knave or a dupe. Is he honestly (but without having done due diligence) parroting what he has been told is the science? Though not a Catholic, I am aware of the Canon Law.
212§3 According to the knowledge, competence, and prestige which they possess, [all Catholics] have the right and even at times the duty to manifest to the sacred pastors their opinion on matters which pertain to the good of the Church and to make their opinion known to the rest of the Christian faithful, without prejudice to the integrity of faith and morals, with reverence toward their pastors, and attentive to common advantage and the dignity of persons.
That is, if you are a Catholic reader of WUWT, you have a right and arguably a duty to tell Pope Francis he is wrong.
Thanks, Eric Worrall. No doubt Pope Francis, has been thoroughly indoctrinated in the greenhouse theory; The most successful scientific theory since the Sun ceased to go around the Earth.
No, this Pope is a lefty. In this case, he is the classic watermelon.
Obviously scientific intelligence is not required to be elected Pope. Now he must know that he knows nothing about the subject – so why is he claiming that the world is falling to pieces? What exactly is he frightened of? He doesn’t seem to mind Muslims beheading his fellow Christians.
It was hard to believe Pope Francis ignored the notoriety of the Franciscans in his continent of origin, but apparently even that cannot be excluded. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Franciscan_missions_to_the_Maya
A man in a dress who leads the church of pedophilia. Sure, I’ll listen to him.
He should probably be more worried about hordes of extremist sacking the Vatican in the not too distant future.
Unfortunate words from an unfortunate man. Pope Francis speaks for a minority of American Catholics. Better that he expressed his alarm at the arrogance of Evo Morales.
The pope should stick with saving souls and leave the science of climate to the real climate scientists instead of the snake oil salesmen posing as climate scientists!!
The Pope should stick with saving souls.
But read Matthew 25:36-40
36 I was naked and you clothed me, I was sick and you visited me, I was in prison and you came to me.’ 37 Then the righteous will answer him, saying, ‘Lord, when did we see you hungry and feed you, or thirsty and give you drink? 38 And when did we see you a stranger and welcome you, or naked and clothe you? 39 And when did we see you sick or in prison and visit you?’ 40 And the King will answer them, ‘Truly, I say to you, as you did it to one of the least of these my brothers,[a] you did it to me.’
As Christianity fades in the face of a resurgent Islam he clutches at straws.
Speaking of ‘belief’ systems is it coincidental that the explosion in the Global Warming Faith happened at the same time as the expansion of Islam into the West?
Is humanity in general moving away from Rationalism and Enlightenment?
IMO the rise of the Church of CAGW coincided with the fall of Communism and is a replacement for the God Which Failed, hence watermelons.
That fits with my thesis!
Absolutely. The Brundtlandt Report was the signal and all the reds went green, externally, and co-opted the enviromental (sic) movement.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brundtland_Commission
I was a lefty at the time and remember well its impact. Suddenly all that was green was red.
Yup, former capitalist exploiters transmogrified into “climate criminals”.
Is humanity in general moving away from Rationalism and Enlightenment?
Yes, unfortunately. After all, rationalism is a hetero-normative racist world view which has no more value than any other.
Do I get my degree?
Only a Master’s of PC gibberish Newspeak. You left out some Kritical buzzwords, such as male hegemonic hierarchical structure.
One of the biggest growth areas for Christianity is Nigeria. The Christians in Nigeria are constantly attacked by extreme Moslems.
Maybe he meant sewercide which means that the AGW theory would be flushed down the toilet.
Well, in his Bull, Francis did refer to a stinking pile of filth, did he not?
Its just the drugs talking.
Ha ha
“I wish I had my own plane, though my dream is a little more modest than the Pope’s CO2 belching Alitalia jet.” I hate this argument. Either we have a problem or we don’t, but just because someone is a hypocrite doesn’t mean there aren’t issues. We are all hypocrites in some form or fashion. This line of reasoning shuts down so much discourse in politics as to make every argument DOA.
A. Easy with the caps Abe.
B. And the periods.
C. Your analogy needs some work.
D. I assume you’re not a “c.o.l.l.e.g.e GRADUATE”.
E. Nevermind, just figured out this was a joke.
Here are some pictures of the Pope’s “suicide”:
“UAH V6 Global Temperature Update for November 2015: +0.33 deg. C”
http://www.drroyspencer.com/2015/12/uah-v6-global-temperature-update-for-november-2015-0-33-deg-c/
* Violent tornadoes near historic lows(peaked in the 1970’s during global cooling):
http://www1.ncdc.noaa.gov/pub/data/cmb/images/torn…
*Tropical cyclone energy(Typhoons/hurricanes) near historic lows(peaked in the mid 1990’s):
http://www.wunderground.com/hurricane/accumulated_…
*Global drought is having a slight decrease:
http://wattsupwiththat.com/2014/05/22/interesting-…
*Recent heat unprecendented?
Yeah, especially for those that don’t have weather/climate records that go back more than 30 years:
http://www3.epa.gov/climatechange/science/indicato…
http://wattsupwiththat.com/2012/07/14/newly-found-…
*Cold weather kills 20 times more people than hot weather:
http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2015/05/15052…
*Hurricane Sandy unprecedented from climate change?
Again, only if you don’t have weather records that go back very far and believe what your read.
Sandy was a cat. 1 hurricane vs the cat. 3 major hurricane Hazel that did the exact same thing in the exact same place, for the exact same reason……. in 1954:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hurricane_Hazel
*In 1954, the East Coast region was hit by 3 cat. 3 major hurricanes in 3 months, last one Hazel…………during modest global cooling:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1954_Atlantic_hurricane_season
*Benefits of fossil fuels 50 to 500 times greater than the costs to society:
http://wattsupwiththat.com/2014/01/24/report-benef…
*The Social Benefit of Carbon: $3.5 Trillion in Agricultural Productivity:
http://www.co2science.org/education/reports/co2ben…
*Deserts greening from increasing CO2: (CO2/climate change from humans was likely not a factor in the drought in Syria which Obama/Kerry/Sanders claim caused ISIS and terrorism to be worse):
http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2013/07/13070…
The only suicide that this operational meteorologist has been observing the past 3 decades is the one that is “killing” the truth about our booming biosphere, record crop yields and massive benefits from the modest warming………….which, BTW has been most concentrated in the coldest regions of the higher latitudes of the Northern Hemisphere, during the coldest time of year and at the coldest times of day(at night).
This reduction of the temperature disparity on the planet(from south to north) from Summer to Winter and from day to night is what we, in the real world call LESS extreme.
A meteorology 101 class is all that’s needed to understand why this more uniform planetary temperature gradient provides LESS energy for many severe weather events.
This is a test. Numerous of the previous links do not work. Been trying to replace them but for some strange reason am unable to post here anymore.
Let’s try one last time:
http://www1.ncdc.noaa.gov/pub/data/cmb/images/tornado/clim/EF3-EF5.png
http://www.wunderground.com/hurricane/accumulated_cyclone_energy.asp?basin=gl
http://www3.epa.gov/climatechange/science/indicators/weather-climate/high-low-temps.html
http://www.co2science.org/education/reports/co2benefits/MonetaryBenefitsofRisingCO2onGlobalFoodProduction.pdf
http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2013/07/130708103521.htm
Mike, multiple links look like spam. That’s why your comment was held.
Let me tell you a little fairy tale of a company that we’ll call “United Nonsense Organisation Co.”, shortly UNO. This company with subsidiaries all over the world was prophesied by the prophets of doom: “Hey stop your irresposibility! Your current debt is $ 400 million, its rising at $ 12 million or 3% per year and, when this debt will reach $ 600 million, you all will be extinguished from the holy books of Wall-Street!” Everyone throughout the world, in- and outside the company, the CEOs as well as the High Priests of Metaphysics howled with fear and gathered in Paris to find a solution.
And a miracle happend! Dr.Hendricks associate of the subsidiary BRD GmbH&Co KG explained, that she wanted to play a leading role in reducing the $12 million debt increase! With the enormous sum of $ 6 (six $), one wants to stop the impending debt rise by decommissioning of the loss- making lignite power plants!
TV and Press in Germany celebrated this heroic decision and from now on,everything went for the better!
In the following winter and with zero wind the Germans sat shivering in the dark at night but the birth rate increased remarkably!
Though this be madness, yet there is method in’t!
(400ppm global CO2 concentration,3% increase p.y., 5% of CO2 concentration manmade, 3% Germany’s share, of which 10% share of electricity!)
Thanks Anthony!
Of course she pays $ 180 Dollars (typo 6 )to stop “ruin”! Sorry! Even this is a ridiculous sum compared with a 12 Million debt increase!
A skeptical Martin Luther would not survive the posting of the 95-plus-one theses in this intolerant enviro environment.
POPE FRANCIS
(The useful idiot sings a famous religious song)
(I)
I don’t care if it rains and freezes
Long as I got my plastic Jesus
Riding on the dashboard of my car
I’m driving fast to where I’m going
Horn a’honking, headlights glowing
Racing to that global climate war!
Its Armageddon straight ahead
For just as Adam Smith has said
Creating wealth sets each against all others!
The Covenant within the Ark
Is best fulfilled through Karl Marx
Shared poverty will make us Christian brothers!
(II)
I preach a new Theology
Derived from Climatology
My alter is the dashboard of my car
I had a vision, went to buy a
Naked, windup, plastic Gaia
I serve her in the global climate war
For Gaia mends the Trinity
She is the third Divinity
God feminine as Christ was made a male!
In all the nations they will herald
The Moving Spirit Of The World
— Who bobs Her head and shakes Her tail!
Eugene WR Gallun
I don’t care if it rains or freezes
Long as I got my plastic Jesus
Standing on the dashboard of my car
My plastic Jesus’ head unscrews
And he’s hollow inside and filled with booze
That’s how I hide my drinkin’ from the law
Send shysters, gats, and loot.
============
And to a Catholic, suicide is a mortal sin.
You connect the dots.
+1. Makes it harder to believe the Pope actually used the word, suicide. not in catholic vocabulary.
Or else, it puts real punch in his demand that “we’ll always have Paris”.
Buying into the Green Blob as he does, he’s committing a lot of poor people to death.
======================
If there is no forcibly binding agreement as a result of Paris talks, then suicide will be avoided.
The pope has devolved into a PR-sound-bite-producing shaman (medicine man / witch doctor) for the crusade created by the exaggerators of the observationally challenged AGW hypothesis.
John
One religion pushing another
Religion of old has been (for many) superseded by the realities of Science
Now religion seems to be using the instrument that helped diminish it, to resurrect it lost relevance.
Just how has science superseded religion?
Unless you believe that we should be worshiping science.
If we get no agreement out of Paris and death then becomes inevitable, perhaps the pontiff will suggest we all take an easy way out to avoid the starvation, pestilence and death by flood. He could pour us all little dixie cups of Jim Jones koolaid out of the hammer-and-sickle crucifix he keeps at home.
The one thing that is certain to be agreed is which plush resort should be chosen for the COP22 beanfeast. .
I hear the arctic is supposed to be nice and toasty by then.
The #1 reason the Pope is all for global warming taxes on us is…he is from South America which mostly hopes to collect lots of loot from that trillion dollar promise of ‘sin money’ we are all expected to pay.
A few months ago I sent an email to the Vatican telling them I didn’t want to offend his Holiness, but would someone please explain to his Eminence that weather is controlled by God, not man.
Thank you very little.
Lunatic.
The pontiff seems to be a good man. But he should remember what happened with Galileo.
Oh, ye of little faith…and so much activism. I think Francis will be best remembered for being the last Pope.
Ojala!
But I fear not. New suckers are born every minute. Catholics are dying off in Old Europe but not in other regions.
The trouble is the Pope has enormous influence. This anti Christian rubbish he is spewing is very embarrassing and shameful.
So the pope is admitting that God doesn’t control the weather , that God is not omnipotent and in charge of everything ?? I guess he believes that Humans are more powerful than Him !!!!
Marcus,
you point out one of the many fallacies and failings of this Pope.
Marcus,
I won’t bother to try to educate you on primary and secondary causation. It sounds like it would be a waste of time.
Alba,
Try teaching primary and secondary causation to this Pope after teaching him critical thinking and history and then worry about Marcus. It is this Pope’s egregious and ignorant leadership and positions that are the topic.
97% of Popes agree
Bergoglio misses his junta. Things were so much easier to control and get done under Videla. Still, the IPCC will have to do.
Somebody better check the communal wine
It looks like the pause is still going strong in the satellite data set. The November anomaly is +0.33deg C, which is down on last months anomaly figure of 0.43 degC.
As I have been saying for the last couple of weeks, the November satellite data was showing November to be cooler than October notwithstanding the current Strong El Nino. Dr Spencer notes that the anomaly is +0.33 degC, which is down on the October anomaly of 0.43degC. According to Dr Spencer;
“
YR MO GLOBE NH SH TROPICS
2015 01 +0.28 +0.40 +0.16 +0.13
2015 02 +0.17 +0.30 +0.05 -0.06
2015 03 +0.16 +0.26 +0.07 +0.05
2015 04 +0.08 +0.18 -0.01 +0.09
2015 05 +0.28 +0.36 +0.21 +0.27
2015 06 +0.33 +0.41 +0.25 +0.46
2015 07 +0.18 +0.33 +0.03 +0.47
2015 08 +0.27 +0.25 +0.30 +0.51
2015 09 +0.25 +0.34 +0.17 +0.55
2015 10 +0.43 +0.64 +0.21 +0.53
2015 11 +0.33 +0.43 +0.23 +0.53
“
So despite this years current Strong El Nino, 2015 is not shaping up to break any records as far as the satellite data is concerned.
Of course, we cannot expect those in Paris to take note of any of this, and the additional time that the pause has provided. One thing is sure, the requirement for action is today less than it was 15 years ago, and given the pause, it is now known that Climate sensitivity, if any at all, is considerably less than the IPCC’s unvalidated model projections.
There is no need for the Pope to be unduly concerned. The globe is doing just fine.
“So despite this years current Strong El Nino, 2015 is not shaping up to break any records as far as the satellite data is concerned.”
Hold on! When the last bottle of Champagne is empty and the policy makers have boarded their fleets of jets to go home, let’s see if they can get Karl, et al busy correcting that situation.
Can anyone imagine how JP2 would have reacted to the hammer and sickle crucifix or that chain. He would have slapped them out of Morales’ hands.
Pathetic. My apologies to night club bouncers.
The Pope is dragging religion into politics using science as an excuse. He’s gone on record that Capitalism is the scourge of the earth. He crossed a line that the Catholic church has crossed before and failed. I’m sure he realizes the forces controlling the AGW meme will quickly ban religion if they ever gain control and only regard him as useful idiot to attain their goal…. a useful idiot with a large following just like the environmentalists.
The Pope is right.
If the alarmed ones cannot get their story straight and consistent, these Paris Ites are doomed.
Fooling people for power over them and for their wealth, are time honoured traditions, ditto are the reactions of the Gulled, when they find out who has tricked them.
The costs are starting to bite home in North America, well driven home in Europe and UK.
Rolling blackouts in the next cold snap have the potential to trigger a very unpleasant reaction toward fools and bandits who are destroying our infrastructure to save us from their private bogey man.
The UN must gain control of the internet, or all is lost. For them.
The infestation is now sickening the host.
Either parasites are thinned or host dies.
Buy popcorn.
And metals.
Yes, John, I hadn’t stopped to think who the Pope was referring to as “we”.
It’s that damn pronoun thing again.
The Y2K WAS DEFINITELY A SCAM!!! All the papers and experts said cars would die in the streets and airplanes would fall out of the skies. TOTAL BS! Did your car die? Did any planes fall out of the sky? No! Did you fix your car to prevent this from happening? If you paid someone to ‘fix’ your car you are an idiot that got scammed. I wrote an article about that in 1999 and had millions of hits on my web page.
Thing is, your car can’t count that high. It doesn’t care what day or time it is. Whey time you start it it starts counting. Shut it off and it stops counting. Start it again and it starts counting again… from zero. Even today with smarter cars. Ok the nav and such know what day it is but the rest? Not at all concerned. Starts counting from zero every time. I did basically nothing to my company computer as well. Did not cost me a penny, did not have a hiccup.
Oh, I see.
1) If something can be used as the basis for a scam, it cannot be valid. Parasites do not attack truth, because they do not benefit from hijacking its credibility.
2) What applies to embedded “computers” in cars, also applies to legacy software (sometimes decades old) running on mini-computers, mainframes, etc. handling accounting, inventory, SCADA, etc.
Oh, and
3) If people tried to solve a problem, and they succeeded, then the problem wasn’t there in the first place.
Thanks for clearing that up.
(Please clear this up: the email address you’re using is bad. Please use a valid address. -mod.)
Sorry, mod. The address I’m posting with these is getting subscription and notification email from Disqus. What should I do differently? Is the address itself “contains_underscore@yahoo.com” a problem?
— BillK
(sorry, I meant WordPress)
I see, BillK. When was the first time the banks hit the Y2K problem? Do you mean to tell me that a citizen of the US couldn’t walk into a bank in 1970 and get a 30-year mortgage or a 30-year annuity? I guess until the mid-90s the banks were out of business because no one taught programmers in the 60s to change the year field to 4 digits.
I sat on a water board in the 1990s. We installed a SCADA system. I live in a dry area and it takes several wells and pumps to keep the town hydrated. In 1999 we received a certified letter from the company that installed the system stating that our system was not compliant with Y2K blah blah blah. They wanted $50K to ‘make sure our citizens had water in the next millennium.’
We simply sent a certified letter back stating that at the time they installed the system, Y2K was on everybody’s lips. If there were any Y2K problems with the system, as professionals they should have been able to look out 3 or 4 years and see it coming. Therefore, if there are any problems with our system, we welcome you to come and remedy the situation free of charge. Otherwise, don’t bug us (more-or-less!). I put my head on a chopping block convincing the rest of the board to take this coarse.
They never showed up. Our citizens had water January 1, 2000.
The whole Y2K was based on the assumption we were as stupid as the Federal Government and media.
Same deal with CAGW.
Scared people are so much easier to herd.
Cars and any mechanical system using computers wasn’t the issue. The main “issue” was BANKING and how interest on debt etc was calculated. It was not a scam as such, it was just more to do with money, but it certainly was blown out of proportion.
So you believed everything the fish wraps told you about Y2K?
Since the software in cars never did any date calculations, it was impossible for them to have the Y2K problem.
Even if airplanes had the Y2K problem, the FAA would have required them to have been repaired years before Y2K.
As someone who spent months fixing code that had the Y2K problem, it was no scam.
The first evidence of the Y2K problem occurred in 1970, when financial software calculating 30 year mortgages started giving weird results. From that day forward, the financial sector started working to fix the problem. Other institutions got into the act later.
Worst. Pope. In. Modern. History.
I just had a flash of realisation that churches face eventual financial doom from the climate change fight, as the “usual” donors from the middle classes are eliminated in the race to redistribute the wealth of the west to (the proletariat of) all countries on the planet.
The elite will have to fund religion once the west’s middle class joins the second world.
Perhaps a carbon indulgence could be sold…
Dawtgtomis — I am jealous of your wit.– Eugene WR Gallun
I must say that when this climate disaster debacle is exposed, the churches who supported it will suffer from ‘collateral damage’ to their credibility.
No, religion will become completely government funded. As a branch of government it will only grow larger, its budget ever getting bigger. Pope Francis sees the growth potential. Churches will be overflowing with priests. No worshipers but as they say about all government agencies — a bureaucracy serves best that serves no one.
Eugene WR Gallun
http://www.climatedepot.com/2015/11/29/skeptical-climate-documentary-set-to-rock-un-climate-summit-film-to-have-red-carpet-premiere-in-paris/
ratuma commented : “….http://www.climatedepot.com/2015/11/29/skeptical-climate-documentary-set-to-rock-un-climate-summit-film-to-have-red-carpet-premiere-in-paris/…”
I’m looking forward to the reviews but am more interested in what the average viewer takes away from it.
On Friday November the 13th. 130 people were killed in terrorist attacks in central Paris. For 2 weeks from that point a memorial to the victims existed at La Place de la Republique. On Friday November the 27th. a national day of mourning and remembrance was held – with La Place de la Republique being a focal point. On Sunday November the 29th. the warmist thugs – the warmist Brown Shirts – trashed the memorial including throwing the votive candles at the CRS. The CRS used tear gas and arrested over 200 of them. This is the true face of warmism.
http://twitchy.com/2015/11/29/violence-erupts-in-paris-as-climate-protesters-trash-memorial-for-terror-victims-photos-cop21/
http://www.france24.com/en/20151129-climate-protesters-clash-with-police-paris-cop21
“We spoke with several angry protesters who told me they wanted to destroy society altogether, they wanted to get their message across and this is what they are trying to do now.”
– that’s what they are all about. Pure and simple. It’s got nothing to do with science or any supposed (non existent) threat to the world. It is purely about money and power by any means, even if it means destroying the world and plunging it back into a new dark age. And that’s what we must stand up against – our very survival depends on it.
Green Shirts.
Should we listen to this man? Here is what you need to know to make the call: he does go to hospital and not to church if he feels unwell, after all – why is that? If I was friends with a guy who can re-grow missing limbs and raise the dead, I wouldn’t even pay for health insurance… just saying’. Also, I wouldn’t pay carbon-TAX.
“Suicide…”
1. I am a Catholic of Polish. The Pope is a man. Man is fallible …
2. Francis of Assisi … Difficult of his views not considered to be altruistic, but … also leftist …
3. The current (and future) increase in GHG’s emissions correspond to the developing countries. For the economy of these countries, reducing emissions (without huge subsidies from the “rich” countries) are true and real “suicide” …
4. Professor M. Salby: “Man-made CO2 emissions increased a whopping 350% faster since 2002, yet the rate of CO2 increase in the atmosphere remained steady at ~2.1 ppm/yr.” We restrict, the huge cost, the emissions (definitely hinders development of the world economy – subsidized eco-business did not “accelerate” the economy – this is nonsense) – are you sure we will reduce “the rate of CO2 Increase in the atmosphere”?
5. The only real way to quickly reduce emissions is geo-sequestration of CO2. Can we afford such a huge “ecological hazard”, if the effects are so uncertain?
6. In 2012, the IPCC published a report (Managing the Risks of Extreme Events and Disasters to Advance Climate Change Adaptation) in which de facto does not have CAGW – catastrophic AGW version …
Doubts are huge, even for the sign of change: eg. storms, hurricane – dr. T. Knutson, NOAA: “Both the increased warming of the upper troposphere relative to the surface and the increased vertical wind shear are detrimental factors for hurricane development and intensification, while warmer SSTs favor development and intensitification. To explore which effect of these effects might “win out” …”
CAGW is a margin – the scientific “outdoor museum” even for eco-climatologists scientists (not to be confused with “green” activists) proponents of AGW theory …
But who (about it) will tell the Pope – to “dictate” in the media of the latter (“green” activists)?
Since ISIS have just put a price on the Pope’s head, he may soon realise that there are more pressing problems in the world.
No, no! The Pope is not fighting against the Jihadis; he is fighting for the Climate Cong.
How a propos, especially in Paris. “Je Suit Charlie” indeed!
Interesting to note the use of the phrase ‘impose western values’. Unlike of course the Cathloic Church imposing their views, on many subjects to the population of Africa. Not least the assertion that ”(the) use of Condoms…even aggrevates the problem (spread of Aids)”
Eric Worrall writes:
I wish I had my own plane, though my dream is a little more modest than the Pope’s CO2 belching Alitalia jet.
From that can we take it that despite the reference to ‘Alitalia jet’ Eric Worrall believes that the Pope owns a plane? (Or even the Vatican?) If so, perhaps he might like to check his facts before bursting into ‘print’.
Here are the facts:
The pope doesn’t own a plane. The term “Shepherd One” suggests that the pope actually owns a plane, which he doesn’t. Even the term “papal plane” is something of a myth, since the pontiff does not have his own personal aircraft.
The Vatican always charters a plane for the three or four foreign trips a pope usually makes every year, often using a different aircraft for each leg of the journey. These are regular commercial planes that were in use making the Rome to London run, or something like it, the day before the trip and will be again once it’s over.
http://www.cruxnow.com/church/2015/09/18/fun-facts-and-more-about-life-aboard-the-papal-plane/
The truth is so much less exciting than fiction, isn’t it.
Eric Worrall’s comment about owning a plane is just another piece of evidence I suppose that people who criticise others (such as climate alarmists) for their failure to use evidence are not necessarily immune to the problem themselves.
But, hey, when it comes to the Catholic Church who needs evidence to support their criticisms?
Like this one from Steve McDonald:
The Vatican is the capitalist headquarters of the planet.
But Marcus says: He must be trying for the U.N. ” Socialist of Year ” award !! And RD assures us that, “This particular Pope is a typical South American radical and socialist. And Robert of Ottawa concurs: No, this Pope is a lefty. And markl has complete confidence that “The Pope has……. gone on record that Capitalism is the scourge of the earth.” (But shame there were no quotes.)
Or this one from ferdperple
So true. The Vatican has trillions of tax free dollars socked away
Perhaps the wealthiest parasitic organization on earth. Criminally extorting billions each year from the poorest of the poor, lest they burn in hell.
Or noaaprogrammer
The Vatican is a city state, so he should have been there. If the true goal of COP21 is redistribution of wealth among nations, the Vatican could float us all!
Then, without giving any details, M Simon alleges: The Church has had a very long history of agitating against Jews. Now almost forgotten since it is an inconvenient truth.
But Mark from the Midwewest is so well-informed that he can tell us things that nobody else knows like: complicity in the extermination of Jews and Gypsies 1939-1944 …
I suppose that would explain why the Chief Rabbi of Rome converted to Catholicism after the Second World War.
And Mark W has read EVERYTHING that the Pope has ever said. (Wow!) Every time he opens his mouth, this pope proves he’s an idiot.
And then there’s this bit of sublime wisdom from localherog2: A man in a dress who leads the church of pedophilia. Sure, I’ll listen to him.
Okay, I give up. What’s the point. People aren’t interested in evidence. Prejudice rules the day.
The Religion of Global Warming/Climate Change has is own apocalypse – Obamageddon.
+1
I don’t think Jorge Bergoglio’s comment is compatible with faith in Jesus Christ. The Catholic Church makes the mystery of the Mass the central tenant of belief. Like Baptism, Its a sacrament of faith in new life. Faith in Life Everlasting through the death and resurrection of Christ. I believe Catholics teach you are committing suicide (slow motion) if you do not believe in Jesus Christ. Essentially everlasting suicide.
The modeled global warming in the future is not a fact. It is a prophecy. No one knows the future. Mask it in high probabilities, call it by another name, it is still merely a prediction, aka, a prophecy. It is not a prophecy coming from the God of Israel, so, to the church, it has no authority. Roman Catholics are subject to one prophetic authority – the church. The church has a very long theological history of rejecting prophecy. From a practical point of view this is necessary, because you can’t argue with prophetic authority. No null hypothesis – no way to test prophecy except wait to see if it comes to pass. So the church rejects all other prophetic authority to preserve its own.
Bergoglio is doing obeisance to another prophetic authority. For the Catholic, the Martyr is the polar opposite of the suicide. Both die willingly, but the suicide is an exercise of the will contrary to the will of God, where the Martyr surrenders his will, as Jesus did when He said: ” If it be possible, let this cup pass from me, nevertheless, not my will but your will be done.” Bergoglio is teaching we preserve life, not by following Christ, but by obeying this new prophetic authority.
The old gnostic heresies are entirely consistent with the notion that Science can unlock secret knowledge (gnosis) so men through knowledge can escape their own destruction. Catholics hold that the Resurrection is a fact apprehended through belief. A fact that assures the believer in Jesus Christ he will never die. For a pope to assert mankind will be committing collective suicide if it doesn’t obey the prophetic voice of Science is novel, to say the least. Let’s just say Jorge Bergoglio is out on a limb, especially for a pope.
“Pope Francis: (97% of the) World headed toward “suicide” if no climate agreement”
I knew the proponents have been suffering climate depression with the pause, but gee I hope they don’t go that far!! Nobody could be that Waco.
What exactly is the problem with 97% “suicide? Aren’t we humans a “cancer”? Aren’t our cities “tumours”? Isn’t it right and just that we should be reduced to a relict population of root-grubbing troglodytes to pay for our unspeakable crimes of ecocide?
Make up what passes for your minds, green Fascists.