‘Greenest President Ever’ trip to India has a carbon footprint bigger than the citizens of many US cities

From the 4th Seoul International Media Art Biennale Seoul Museum of Art - http://seoulmoa.seoul.go.kr/html/eng/index.jsp

Carl Pope, Executive Director of the Sierra Club, wrote in January 2010 on the Huffington Post that President Barack Obama was “The Greenest President Ever“.

Weeellll….maybe not. You see, today we have these headlines:

The Daily Mail: Forty planes and six armoured cars: Obama visit to India the ‘biggest ever by a US President’

NDTV reports: US to spend $200 million a day on Obama’s Mumbai visit

(Note: snopes.com posted on November 4th that this $200 million figure was wrong, but at the same time the White House can’t provide the actual numbers for security reasons. However, the numbers are likely inflated and a result of an error that started with an Indian News Agency that got repeated. – read details here The Daily Mail has not retracted their story as of the evening of November 4th. If they do, we will certainly follow.  -Anthony)

…About 3,000 people including Secret Service agents, US government officials and journalists would accompany the President. Several officials from the White House and US security agencies are already here for the past one week with helicopters, a ship and high-end security instruments…

Of course we know any US President doesn’t travel lightly, and needs security details and armored cars…but really, 3000 people and forty aircraft?

Let’s do the carbon math:

Estimate of the carbon footprint of President Obama’s trip to India

We are constantly told how bad air travel is for the planet. For example the UK has a whole organization dedicated to the issue, called “Plane Stupid”. Fortunately it is groups like these that enable us to calculate the carbon emissions of air travel using the handy dandy Terrapass web page.

1. If one assumes that all 3,000 people fly commercial from Washington, DC to New Delhi and back (and nowhere else), their cumulative carbon footprint can be calculated according to Terrapass at http://www.terrapass.com/carbon-footprint-calculator/#air.

Here’s the info on their calculation methodology.

So here’s what we get for the maximum number of people, ten, that we can select at one time on that website. Note that Bombay India is now called Mumbai, but the airport code is still BOM in Terrapass:

So multiply 62,238 lbs of CO2 for ten people times 300 (to make three thousand) and we get: 18, 671,400 lbs, or 9,336 short tons (2000 lbs) or 8,469 metric tons of CO2

To get the per capita figure in metric tons, divide that again by 3000 people which gives us 2.823 metric tons per person for this round trip.

2. The Brookings Institute did a survey in 2008 ranking major US cities by their per capita emissions. You can read the full report here. (PDF). If we were to compare his trip to the city table:

Obama’s trip comes in between Memphis and Raleigh on a per capita basis.

3. Caveat: Of course, this calculation excludes the carbon footprint for also traveling to Indonesia, S. Korea and Indonesia as part of this Grand Tour, as well as any other activity while in those places. Plus vehicles, and other forms of travel.

If we figured in all the travel, it would well be higher.

The message? Travel lightly but carry a big hockey stick.

4. If Obama wanted to offset the Carbon using the tool of choice of his buddy, Al Gore, the Chicago Climate Exchange, he could do so pretty cheaply since carbon offsets there are selling for 5 cents per metric ton.

So with 8,469 metric tons of CO2 emitted for the Washington to Bombay round trip, he could buy a carbon indulgence for a mere $423.45. That’s chump change when you are blowing a cool 200 million per day to keep everybody traveling in style.

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137 Responses to ‘Greenest President Ever’ trip to India has a carbon footprint bigger than the citizens of many US cities

  1. Tom in Florida says:

    Everyone is equal but some are more equal than others.

  2. Jeff Larson says:

    Our government has found a way to be on permanent vacation at taxpayer expense. Yes, we must keep that deficit spending going to keep those poor banks alive!

  3. DaveUK says:

    I didn’t have kids and haven’t flown on a plane since 1992.
    Done my bit for the environment.
    Where’s my bloody rebate Al Gore?
    ‘WOT,NO CARROTS?’

  4. Curiousgeorge says:

    Somebody remind me why he’s going to India? Is there a party or something I don’t know about? I thought Obama was hip to technology. Did anyone clue him in about Netmeeting?

  5. Patrick Davis says:

    Do as we say not as we do.

    Orwells’ 1984 and the movie Soilent Green sould be a warning of things to come.

  6. John Trigge says:

    “Do as I say, not as I do” is a common mantra of the green brigades, politicians and all others who would control our lives to save the planet. remember, this is all for your own good and they only have your best interests at heart.

  7. DL says:

    The G8 and g20 met in Toronto over a weekend this summer. They met over teh weekend. The G20 arrived on Friday and left at about noon on Sunday.

    The security cost for this meeting was 1 billion (thats right a billion for 3 days) dollars.

    How could anybody spend a billion dollars for a 3 day event? The G20 met a few months later in Seoul so the billion dollars was for a meeting that will happen seveal times a year.

  8. Tom says:

    Some wag got in quick on Wikipedia. It doesn’t show up on the wiki article, but searching for Boeing 747 on Google currently gives me this snippet attached to the Wikipedia result:

    Recent groundbreaking studies from the university of Harvard have proven that President Barack Obama has the same anatomical makeup as a Boeing 747

    Might explain some of it…

  9. Peter Miller says:

    The most important thing to realise about a green politician is what they are really trying to say: “But that doesn’t apply to me, I’m far too important. It only applies to the ‘little people’ like you, you and you.”

    Al Gore is an absolute classic example of this.

    Perhaps the new Republican controlled House of Representatives can make Obama travel economy class.

  10. Natsman says:

    Whilst these holier-than-thou “do as we say, not what as we do” hypocrites continue to be entertained, this type of nonsense will persist.

    They, unfortunately, are blind to their own failings.

  11. Natsman says:

    There’s an extraneous “what” in my last – ignore it!

  12. Chuck says:

    Mr. Watts

    BO must have read your blog and realized man-made global warming was a hoax; or

    Two, Democrats are having their last fling before the writing on the wall dries; or.

    Three, a trial run for after the 2012 elections.

    Let’s hope the White House staff doesn’t let him take the toilets when he leaves.

  13. A C Osborn says:

    A typical case of DO AS WE SAY, NOT AS WE DO.

  14. Hoskald says:

    It reminds me of the Circus of the ancient Kings when they would pack up their entire court and travel the country. Bloody expensive….

  15. Murray Grainger says:

    It *is* definitely worse than we thought.

    About these “carbon emissions”. I have been carefully watching my wife’s diamond ring since carbon started emitting a few years back but have not noticed any significant change. Should I study a lump of coal instead? Would it, being bigger than her diamond, show the carbon emitting phenomena more clearly?

  16. R. de Haan says:

    Only a small price to pay for the One who promised to bankrupt the coal industry.

  17. Chaveratti says:

    And that’s only calculating the per capita figure.

    There’s still those six armoured cars and all the equipment for the 3000 personnel to get into India, bet that’s a bit more than the personal allowance!

  18. kim says:

    What, no visa to Pakistan?
    =================

  19. Don B says:

    Evidence of more excess is that Obama’s group booked the entire 570 room Taj Mahal Hotel, and 300 more rooms in three other hotels.

    http://economictimes.indiatimes.com/news/politics/nation/Barack-and-Michelles-Mumbai-darshan-plans/articleshow/6797379.cms

  20. H.R. says:

    Some of that is my money. (grrrrr….)

    I don’t see that there will be any return on that money; the trip won’t avert a war or bring a few billion bucks of revenue back to the U.S. That’s a lot of jack for what amounts to a sightseeing tour.

  21. Pull My Finger says:

    Just shows what a fool Carl Pope is. Obama has no use for “Greenies” other than as a political tool. He knows Greens will never vote Republican, ever, so he pays them a little lip service here and there to mollify them. Other than that he has done nothing green at all. Notice how hard he’s pushing cap and trade? Oh, you haven’t? How about all those green jobs?

    Good result for common sense in the energy and environment sector last night. Republicans crush the House, Senate will be close to 50-50 with the Dems having a 1-3 vote advantage (if you count WVa Dem Senator who campaigned on repealing Obama care, cap and trade). Looks like ex-Republican Murkowsky won her write in campaing handily in Alaska. We’ll see what happens, sometimes when neither party has too much power the best results come about.

  22. Frank K. says:

    Limiting carbon footprints is for the little people…

    When the new Congress is sworn in, it is my fervent hope that we can begin the process of defunding the climate elites at NASA , NOAA, the UN, and elsewhere so as to reduce their carbon footprints on my wallet…

  23. AntonyIndia says:

    I hope he is not going to lecture India on “global warming”: lots of Indian villagers are not even connected to the electric grid, and the move around bare foot or on a bicycle at most. If the IPCC Chair would not have been the Indian Pachauri, the Indian government would have been even less interested in this.

    President Obama does needs a lot of security as his “trusted” ally Pakistan is housing all kinds of terrorists since decades and still receiving plenty of American cash and hardware at the same time.

  24. CPT. Charles says:

    Once again, reality trumps The Onion.

  25. Tim says:

    We must ask ourselves why some of those in power are so hated that they need an ‘army’ to protect them. If their actions and truths were self-evident and transparent, they were aligned with the aspirations of the people they ‘represent’, and they spread global goodwill and fairness, they could walk the streets and happily shake hands with people in any country.

  26. ew-3 says:

    If they admit to it costing $200 million per day, imagine what it really costs.

    On the plus side, they can buy carbon offsets (aka indulgences) for a song and tap dance.

  27. des332 says:

    Do as I say not as I do…

  28. Joanie says:

    It’s amazing how quiet most of the front groups for ‘greenness’ are, when it comes to their favorite President. And he is blind to the irony of his huge travel expenses, carbon footprint, etc. Just as so many of the leaders of the liberal movement are. This calculation of ‘carbon footprint’ doesn’t include all of the air traffic and ground traffic, the circling planes and idling cars, the wasted hours of commuters, in the cities where he so unabashedly visits. Just as when he visited Los Angeles and tied up traffic in the biggest snarl you can imagine, it just doesn’t signify in his internal calculations that he is making everyone else inconvenienced.
    You know, we have this amazing thing called the Internet… conference calls…. ‘Go To Meeting” software… showing fiscal restraint in times like these would be amazingly positive… but no, he has to go and visit in person, shake hands and sit down face to face… with three thousand in tow! You don’t get treated like Royalty on the internet, no press conferences, no front page pictures…. so these big dog and pony shows go on.
    And who was it that suggested that we use one sheet of toilet paper? Huh.

  29. John Nicklin says:

    Yes, but its “green carbon” its only bad dirty carbon when the great unwashed do such things.

  30. Mr Lynn says:

    I know you use the term ‘carbon footprint’ facetiously, mocking those who take it seriously, but it drives me crazy. Doubtless the greenies will miss the joke, and just nod approvingly.

    This extravagant presidential (lower case) junket is plenty obscene on its face, a lavish waste of the taxpayers’ money on a scale befitting some tinhorn royalty, regardless of how much ‘carbon’ is emitted.

    /Mr Lynn

  31. UK Sceptic says:

    My goodness, Mr. President, those are mighty big feet you have…

  32. grayman says:

    WOW! 200 MILLION PER DAY, Really???? I really want to know who comes up with figures? IMO they need to trim the list by A LOT. OH yes the CO2, Well at least with all the bull sh!t Obama slings the CO2 can help fertelize some where else for a change.

  33. latitude says:

    They really think they are so important, they can save the world………

  34. tallbloke says:

    H.R. says:
    November 3, 2010 at 5:29 am
    I don’t see that there will be any return on that money; the trip won’t avert a war or bring a few billion bucks of revenue back to the U.S. That’s a lot of jack for what amounts to a sightseeing tour.

    The modus operandi of the previous administration seemed to be to bring a few billion bucks of revenue back to the (favoured corporations in the) U.S. by starting wars rather than averting them.

    “Forty planes and six armoured cars”? Pah. Check the Gulf War’s carbon footprint. Not to mention the depleted uranium bootprint.

  35. Brad says:

    So what’s the alternative? Don’t protect him while he is there?

    [Go. But go only when needed. Go only with what's needed. Robt]

  36. DaveUK says:

    “The greenest president ever”
    I thought President Obama was black.
    For folk who don’t see colour these librals don’t half obsess about it.lol
    DaveUK

  37. P.F. says:

    Should be no surprise. It is consistent for a Progressive Collectivist like Obama. The political elite deserves this kind of attention and service since they know better what is appropriate for the rest of us, even if they have no intent of applying on themselves that which they want us to do for the good of society.

    Meanwhile, here in the People’s Republic of California, we now have Progressive Collectivists top-to-bottom in the leadership, including the top three who have demonstrated a very soft regard for the rule of law. Add to that an unbridled AB32 that allows a band of unelected religious zealots to wreck havoc on energy and business in the state. When it all comes apart, will they take responsibility for the failure? Probably not. It is not their way.

  38. the_Butcher says:

    Brad:

    It’s ok he’d pass for a local anyway…

  39. Dave says:

    Obama’s visit to Trinidad and Tobago a couple of years ago can trump that. On top of the (presumably ubiquitous) extensive US Naval presence, with all the associated emissions – although, come to think of it, the nuclear powered carrier doesn’t add to that – and the usual entourage, 200 brand new luxury German cars were purchased for the visit by T&T.

  40. H.R. says:

    tallbloke says:
    November 3, 2010 at 7:00 am

    :o) I appreciate your point, tallbloke, but this trip isn’t even to start a war. As near as I can make it, it’s pure sightseeing… and photo ops. of course.

    I’ll eat my cyberwords if he makes it back home having accomplished anything of consequence.

  41. Smokey says:

    Compare our current President with the last great President:

    .

  42. Werner Weber says:

    Could somebody explain to me, how you get to 200 Million US$ cost per day for the visit of President Obama?
    3000 people travel with him, that is a lot. Altogether roughly 3000 metric tons of kerosin are burnt, makes 2 million US$ (7 barrels per ton and 90 US$ per barrel). Lease of the airplanes is five times the fuel cost, makes it 10 Million US$ . Each person has 1000 US$ expenses per day and gets another 1000 US$ extra pay. Makes another 6 Million US $. Sofar I am still short of 20 Million US$ per day. Where is that factor of 10 hidden in the calculation of NDTV?

  43. Dexter Trask says:

    There’s a reason we hold wheels-up parties at embassies at the conclusion of presidential visits. 3,000 is the biggest number for a POTUS trip that I’ve even seen, however.

  44. mike sphar says:

    O does greens but usually after doing the fairways first. Does anybody know his handicap ? Or is that hidden along with the birth cert ?

    The planes I’ve been flying on lately have been filled with vacationers, zero seats available. So does that make the plane flight greener ? Or just more crowded. Is this what a recession feels like ? Tough to get cheap flights to the tropics!

  45. Schadow says:

    Watch for a ‘Hail Mary’ attempt to pass Cap & Tax during the lame duck session starting 15 November. The mechanism: Reid and the senate accept and pass the House Bill (Waxman/Markey) without changes. Obama signs.

    Only way to stop is if some Dem senators realize they’re toast in 2012 if they sign on to the travesty.

  46. Layne Blanchard says:

    Smokey,

    I’m so glad I clicked that link…. :-) Well done.

  47. Enneagram says:

    Only the people affected with the Dalton disease can see the real color of greens=RED :-)

  48. Enneagram says:

    NDTV reports: US to spend $200 million a day on Obama’s Mumbai visit

    That’s only TWO BUCKS at 1950′s value. Cheap!

  49. John from CA says:

    This is why Presidents shouldn’t travel but invite guests to the USA — its cheaper.

    Regarding the CO2, its ok – Obama already knows CO2 isn’t a problem.

  50. Beth Cooper says:

    Obama’s ‘Green Army.’ Good to see them hard at work on behalf of the planet:(

  51. Ian E says:

    Sure BO is the greenest president ever – just look behind his ears!

  52. Tom says:

    So what’s the alternative? Don’t protect him while he is there?

    Quick quiz: How many US presidents have been killed while overseas? How many have been killed in the US?

    So, where does he need the protection, now?

  53. jorgekafkazar says:

    Hoskald says: “It reminds me of the Circus of the ancient Kings when they would pack up their entire court and travel the country. Bloody expensive….”

    Circus is right. Still happening, too.

  54. JPeden says:

    tallbloke says:
    November 3, 2010 at 7:00 am

    The modus operandi of the previous administration seemed to be to bring a few billion bucks of revenue back to the (favoured corporations in the) U.S. by starting wars rather than averting them.

    “Forty planes and six armoured cars”? Pah. Check the Gulf War’s carbon footprint. Not to mention the depleted uranium bootprint.

    So America deserves Obama’s flagrant excesses because Saddam Hussein did not comply with his Gulf War I surrender agreements?

  55. What happened the last time a prominent US government official visited India? This was pre-Copenhagen, pre-Glaciergate, pre-Climategate – basically in ‘those heady days’ period.

    http://nigguraths.wordpress.com/2010/11/01/eli-rabett-himalayan-glaciers/

  56. JPeden says:

    A Malignant Narrcissist must be served! Especially the America hating latte’ Commie varitety.

  57. Curiousgeorge says:

    @ tallbloke says:
    November 3, 2010 at 7:00 am
    …………………………… Not to mention the depleted uranium bootprint.

    DU is used for a quite a lot of very mundane things besides big bullets, in case you weren’t aware of it. Used extensively in aircraft (including commercial airliners) for weight and balance of control surfaces among other things. It’s very useful stuff, where you need lots of weight in a small volume. I wouldn’t advise eating it or breathing DU dust from machining, etc. because it is a toxic metal, but the radiation component is insignificant.

  58. pat says:

    The very definition of a limousine liberal.

  59. 7.87×10^11 USD for the “Recovery & Reinvestment Act” nonsense plus 5.6×10^10 USD to help out his (PBUH) UAW buddies, to say nothing of his (PBUH) explicit support for Bush’s TARP & the whole Health Care raping, divided by his 652 days in office gives us a meagre 1.3×10^9 USD/day. At a mere 2.0×10^8 USD/day, it’s cheaper to keep him over there by an entire order of magnitude.

    Let the profligate Keynesian stay in India for the rest of his dissipated life.

  60. John Nicklin says:

    Hoskald says:
    November 3, 2010 at 5:08 am
    It reminds me of the Circus of the ancient Kings when they would pack up their entire court and travel the country. Bloody expensive….

    Didn’t the king usually require the nobles he visited to pay the expenses?

  61. Breckite says:

    “A nation can survive its fools, and even the ambitious. But it cannot survive treason from within. An enemy at the gates is less formidable, for he is known and carries his banner openly. But the traitor moves amongst those within the gate freely, his sly whispers rustling through all the alleys, heard in the very halls of government itself. For the traitor appears not a traitor; he speaks in accents familiar to his victims, and he wears their face and their arguments, he appeals to the baseness that lies deep in the hearts of all men. He rots the soul of a nation, he works secretly and unknown in the night to undermine the pillars of the city, he infects the body politic so that it can no longer resist. A murderer is less to fear. The traitor is the plague.”

    — Cicero

  62. nc says:

    Okay this is somewhat off topic but want to start some where. The only thing on the news today is all the talking heads analyzing the elections. Thrown in for good measure health and defence costs while leaving out the biggest elephant in the room, the climate disruption scam and costs involved. Now if these talking heads would only put a tiny amount of their energy into investigating this scam.

  63. Dodgy Geezer says:

    @Hoskald

    “It reminds me of the Circus of the ancient Kings when they would pack up their entire court and travel the country. Bloody expensive….”

    Umm.. there were no comms back in 1100. How else was a king to make on-the-spot inspections and advertise himself to his subjects?

    Besides, all the travel and equipment used complied perfectly with Green requirements….

  64. Jason Calley says:

    It is absolutely true that Obama is pushing the envelope toward a more extravagant, costly and wasteful Federal government. That is not meant to imply that the Dems are more evil than the Repubs though. No US President in the last half century, either Democratic or Republican has actually delivered a smaller or more efficient government than the President before him. The difference between Dem or Repub administrations is approximately the same difference as between being stabbed with a metal spike or clubbed with a metal pipe.

    I will say this for Obama however; he is a much better public speaker as long as he has a ghost written script and a working teleprompter.

  65. Bryan A says:

    $200mil a day works out to $1.4bil per week. How do I stop it from coming out of MY pocket?

  66. Neil Craig says:

    In his autobiagraphy Lee Kuan Tew said how ge used to fly commercial with an assistant to Commonwealth conferences while the premier of Bangladesh came by personal jet which stood waiting on the tarmac all week. He said that the poorer the country & the more useless the government the bigger the plane. But only 1 plane.

  67. Frank K. says:

    “The modus operandi of the previous administration seemed to be to bring a few billion bucks of revenue back to the (favoured corporations in the) U.S. by starting wars rather than averting them.”

    Good to see you giving your seal of approval to environmentalist Sadaam Hussein (big thumbs up)…

    Come to think of it, I don’t see much difference between the fascism of militant environmentalists and Sadaam….

  68. Mike M says:

    I think the report is in error; 200 million rupees per day I might believe. 200 million USD per day for 3000 is over 15X the cost per soldier per day to fight the Iraq war including equipment – aircraft carriers, tank battalions, bullets, etc.

  69. Curiousgeorge says:

    Watching the Prez on the tube. He is still determined to push the CO2/green/EPA regulation agenda. His words: “There is more than one way to skin that cat”, referring to the failure of the Kerry Cap and Tax bill.

    He still thinks that a “Green” economic strategy is a job creator.

  70. Kitefreak says:

    kim says:
    November 3, 2010 at 5:25 am

    What, no visa to Pakistan?
    =================
    They’re already sick of him droning on.

  71. Jeff Larson says:

    Well, you know, Obama’s staff has been working overtime for months now trying to mitigate the losses of the Democratic Socialist party. It’s only fair to give them a well needed rest in some exotic place. We taxpayers should be grateful for all their efforts to support the Progressive cause!

  72. Kitefreak says:

    I didn’t know about this upcoming presidential visit until I read it here. I find it quite ominous. This is not sightseeing and photo-ops.

    “I know you haven’t been getting on with your neighbour. We can help. Yes we can. Would that be OK with you?”

    These things have to be done face-to-face.

  73. John from CA says:

    Curiousgeorge says:
    November 3, 2010 at 10:44 am
    Watching the Prez on the tube. He is still determined to push the CO2/green/EPA regulation agenda. His words: “There is more than one way to skin that cat”, referring to the failure of the Kerry Cap and Tax bill.

    He still thinks that a “Green” economic strategy is a job creator.

    =======
    The “bit” the world is missing is that “He” is simply an icon for us. The President in the US accounts for very little within a scheme that was designed from day one to inhibit crazy government.

    The system of checks and balances works very well.

    Ignore the “Man behind the Curtain”, he is a sour blink in time. Focus on our similarities and not the Fools who attempt to lead us astray.

    ; )

  74. Stephen Brown says:

    Her Royal Highness, Queen Elizabeth the Second has slightly more restrained rates of expenditure. The Queen and the Duke of Edinburgh are the only members of the Royal family who receive an annual parliamentary allowance.
    About 70 per cent of the Civil List expenditure goes on staff salaries. It also goes towards meeting the costs of official functions such as garden parties, receptions and official entertainment during State Visits. The Queen entertains almost 50,000 people each year. All travelling costs are met from the same budget.
    In 2006-2007 the revenue surplus received by the Treasury from the Crown Estates was £200 million ($322 million). Since 2001, The Queen receives a set amount of £7.9 million ($12.7 million) per annum.
    In real terms, the payment is worth only a quarter of its 1990 value, and the Royal Household is expected to spend £14.9 million next year to enable the Queen to carry out her official duties. The £7 million shortfall will be made up out of a reserve fund which the Royal Household has built up over decades.

    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/financetopics/budget/7848129/Budget-2010-Queens-spending-under-scrutiny-as-Royal-Household-books-opened.html

    http://www.royal.gov.uk/TheRoyalHousehold/Royalfinances/Sourcesoffunding/TheCivilList.aspx

  75. Kitefreak says:

    Curiousgeorge says:
    November 3, 2010 at 9:50 am

    @ tallbloke says:
    November 3, 2010 at 7:00 am
    …………………………… Not to mention the depleted uranium bootprint.

    DU is used for a quite a lot of very mundane things besides big bullets, in case you weren’t aware of it. Used extensively in aircraft (including commercial airliners) for weight and balance of control surfaces among other things. It’s very useful stuff, where you need lots of weight in a small volume. I wouldn’t advise eating it or breathing DU dust from machining, etc. because it is a toxic metal, but the radiation component is insignificant.
    —————————————————–
    Try telling that to the doctors in Falluja dealing with an epidemic of birth defects since the US-led Operation Phantom Fury in November of 2004. When I say an epidemic I mean WAY more than two standard deviations by the way. Can send you links to pictures if you like, but they’re not pretty. Must have been something other than the DU then… maybe the “shake and bake”?

  76. Curiousgeorge says:

    @ John from CA says:
    November 3, 2010 at 11:24 am

    The “bit” the world is missing is that “He” is simply an icon for us. The President in the US accounts for very little within a scheme that was designed from day one to inhibit crazy government.

    I wouldn’t go quite that far. The “bit” that other countries have difficulty understanding (and indeed many in the USA don’t understand ) is the difference between the office and the occupant of that office. Our system was designed to eliminate the influence of “personality”. By that I mean we do not give our loyalty/allegiance to the “person”, but rather to the “institution/office”. That is the essence of the Oath of Office for military, as well as political office holders. This magnificent departure from historical “personality dependent” cultures/government is what makes the US system unique, and what will ensure that it is perpetuated. Those checks and balances are focused on maintaining that “personality independence”.

    If we can keep it, as Franklin said. We can keep it so long as it is kept out of the hands of those who demand loyalty/fealty to them rather than the office. Obama rode into office on the strength of personal loyalty, and last night was a reminder to him that “we the people” will not tolerate that kind usurpation of the office.

  77. Dave Wendt says:

    Bryan A says:
    November 3, 2010 at 10:19 am
    $200mil a day works out to $1.4bil per week. How do I stop it from coming out of MY pocket?

    The answer is quite simple. Just assume the role that BHO prefers for all his constituents. Join the ranks of the unemployed. You can then be the recipient of all those wonderful gifts that only He can provide, unemployment checks (according to Pelosi the best possible economic stimulus), food stamps, Medicaid, etc.. And if you can’t make your mortgage payments, not to worry, they’ll just declare a foreclosure moratorium and you can live in your house for free.
    All that is required in return is a personal declaration of eternal fealty to to the Mighty Emperor Barack the First( May He Be The Last and May He Not Last)

  78. Bryan A says:

    Dave W

    Agreed

  79. kadaka (KD Knoebel) says:

    Obama could see his party was going to lose, candidates were running away from his agenda and losing support due to their votes for it, he can see his policies will not go further and are likely to be turned back.

    So he schedules a nice long trip, to immediately follow the election, bringing along his family, supporters, and sycophants, off to far away turbulent lands. The security people are very professional, the President will be very well protected on the ground and from the air. And this is the area of the world where a rogue nuclear weapon either made or acquired by terrorists would most likely be located, that can be set off several blocks away, and President, family, supporters, and sycophants can all be killed in a sudden glorious nuclear fireball. It will be memorable, providing a unique legacy, far more notable than that coming from a young political activist who quickly rose in prominence to the presidency and culminated his career with a failed and discredited one-term tenure who then descended into a historically ignored obscurity.

    A very dark scenario, to be sure, one no sane person would ever want to see pass. Besides, how much of an uncaring absolute narcissist would one have to be to desire such a memorial?

  80. David L says:

    I thought Bush 43 was the greenest with his geothermal house?

  81. H.R. says:

    kadaka (KD Knoebel) says:
    November 3, 2010 at 1:01 pm

    “[...] So he schedules a nice long trip, to immediately follow the election, bringing along his family, supporters, and sycophants, off to far away turbulent lands. The security people are very professional, the President will be very well protected on the ground and from the air. And this is the area of the world where a rogue nuclear weapon either made or acquired by terrorists would most likely be located, that can be set off several blocks away, and President, family, supporters, and sycophants can all be killed in a sudden glorious nuclear fireball. [...]“

    So then we’d have President Biden? I’m assuming he’s not allowed to go on this jolly.

  82. John T says:

    Don’t forget the carbon footprint of the teleprompter and the remodeling that had to be done to accommodate it.

  83. kadaka (KD Knoebel) says:

    From H.R. on November 3, 2010 at 1:31 pm:

    So then we’d have President Biden? I’m assuming he’s not allowed to go on this jolly.

    And in the time frame, that’d also be Vice President Pelosi. She’s Speaker of the House until next year, she’s still in line. Given that she’s otherwise killed off her political career to push through The Agenda, she would appreciate a nice payoff. Vice President is much nicer than some ambassadorship to some minor country somewhere, likely has a better pension as well. Don’t you agree?

    A one-term lame duck or a running gag for the remaining two years: neither could do much more damage at this point.

  84. Dodgy Geezer says:

    I note a lot of people here complaining about President Obama and the Democrats. Not being a Yank, I couldn’t care much about internal US politics any way, but I suspect that Obama has not got much practical say in the matter of how much is spent on a trip to India. The UK TV series ‘Yes, Minister’ refers – all the civil servants and other hangers-on will be pushing for places, and making things very awkward unless they get their trip. They are the ones in charge, constantly extending their empires. The US President, the British Prime Minister – all these are just convenient figureheads to hide behind when any questions are asked…

  85. mycroft says:

    So Barack is doing the same as our “holier than thou”climate scientists who fly around the world holding seminars/conferences in far flung exotic places,then preach
    about the dangers of CO2..hypocrites

  86. Dave Andrews says:

    Kitefreak,

    There is no evidence DU was used in Fallujah. The doctors’ comments and photos are anecdotal. No serious scientific or epidemiologocal studies have been undertaken and you have no idea at all what the rate of birth defects in Fallujah was before 2004.

  87. Tom in Florida says:

    kadaka (KD Knoebel) says: {November 3, 2010 at 1:56 pm}
    From H.R. on November 3, 2010 at 1:31 pm: So then we’d have President Biden? I’m assuming he’s not allowed to go on this jolly.
    And in the time frame, that’d also be Vice President Pelosi. She’s Speaker of the House until next year, she’s still in line.”

    Pelosi would not become Vice President. She would remain Speaker of the House until her term ends. The Speaker of the House would only become President if both the President and Vice President were removed at the same time. The new President would nominate a new VP to be confirmed by both Houses of Congress as per the 25th Amendment:
    “Section 2. Whenever there is a vacancy in the office of the Vice President, the President shall nominate a Vice President who shall take office upon confirmation by a majority vote of both Houses of Congress.”

    Now if new President Biden foolishly nominated Hillary Clinton for VP, he just might “disappear” and Hillary would then finally get her shot at being President of the U.S.

  88. JC says:

    I call BS on the $200 million per day. Even if we pad the number by 500 people that’s still $57 K per person per day. They could all have a brand new Porsche to drive and stay in 5 star hotels for that and still have change left over.

    This sounds like a typical sound byte where they derive the costs from money that will be spent either way they are just attributing it to this event.

  89. Curiousgeorge says:

    @ Kitefreak says:
    November 3, 2010 at 12:01 pm

    Try telling that to the doctors in Falluja dealing with an epidemic of birth defects since the US-led Operation Phantom Fury in November of 2004. When I say an epidemic I mean WAY more than two standard deviations by the way. Can send you links to pictures if you like, but they’re not pretty. Must have been something other than the DU then… maybe the “shake and bake”?

    I don’t like to point to Wiki as a source, but in this case I’ll refer you to the 114 references given at the bottom of this page: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Depleted_uranium . I think you will find several differing opinions. As for the “birth defects”, etc. there may, MAY, be some validity to the claim, IF the ingested dosages were high enough. However, it is extremely unlikely due to the nature of U238, and is dependent on the proximity of potential victims to where the DU was deployed. Keep in mind that not many people survive an attack by those weapons in the first place.

    If you decide to read the Wiki page, please verify this conclusion for yourself by following up on the referenced urls. I’m not a doctor, so I can’t claim any personal expertise or experience in this specific medical area. However, I have acquired some personal experience and education regarding nuclear materials (and warfare) in the last 50 years or so.

  90. richard verney says:

    In the UK we pay a lot of tax on air travel (this tax is set to rise sharply) in order to placate the greens. Of course, the traveller should be given an option, namely that if they buy the appropriate carbon credits they don’t have to pay the (green) tax. Given that these credits can be bought at 5 cents a ton, a family of four could go on a long haul holiday without having to pay more than a dollar for the required carbon credits instead of being forced to pay approx £300 in green taxes! Madness all of this. Why we are allowing our governments to rip us of like this is beyond comprehension.

  91. old44 says:

    R. de Haan says:
    November 3, 2010 at 5:14 am

    1:07 mark of the video “Without emitting greenhouse gases or carbon” ?????

  92. Amino Acids in Meteorites says:

    “The Greenest President Ever“…….18, 671,400 lbs, or 9,336 short tons (2000 lbs) or 8,469 metric tons of CO2

    All CO2 is equal. Some CO2 is more equal than others.

  93. Jimbo says:

    The appalling hypocracy of the watermelons is a disgrace to man’s reason.

  94. Jimbo says:

    Forty planes…”
    WTF

  95. savethesharks says:

    Smokey says:
    November 3, 2010 at 8:12 am
    Compare our current President with the last great President:

    =============================

    Bingo, Smokey. That was a profound speech. Thanks for the link.

    Chris
    Norfolk, VA, USA

  96. savethesharks says:

    Dave Wendt says:
    November 3, 2010 at 12:28 pm
    Bryan A says:
    November 3, 2010 at 10:19 am
    $200mil a day works out to $1.4bil per week. How do I stop it from coming out of MY pocket?

    The answer is quite simple. Just assume the role that BHO prefers for all his constituents. Join the ranks of the unemployed. You can then be the recipient of all those wonderful gifts that only He can provide, unemployment checks (according to Pelosi the best possible economic stimulus), food stamps, Medicaid, etc.. And if you can’t make your mortgage payments, not to worry, they’ll just declare a foreclosure moratorium and you can live in your house for free.
    All that is required in return is a personal declaration of eternal fealty to to the Mighty Emperor Barack the First( May He Be The Last and May He Not Last)

    ===============================

    Repeated for effect. Thanks, Dave. WELL said.

    But instead of “B H O”….that takes too long to say.

    I prefer “B O”, for short! 8-)

    Chris
    Norfolk, VA, USA

  97. Part of Barry’s ‘core retinue’.. or courtiers are the 215 CEOs from the likes of Pepsico, etal. So in addition to carbon credits, expect American jobs to also be burned:

    http://mindtaker.blogspot.com/2010/11/shtfplan-taxpayers-to-pay-nearly-1.html

    Slavery 2.0 is here… and the slave is… YOU.

    -Drunken Economist

    http://twitter.com/drunk_economist

  98. davidmhoffer says:

    Tom in Florida;
    Now if new President Biden foolishly nominated Hillary Clinton for VP, he just might “disappear” and Hillary would then finally get her shot at being President of the U.S.>>

    That seems like counting on an awful string of events. I modeled the future on my laptop. It isn’t working well yet, but I do get a snippet of conversation now and then, here’s one from just a bit over three years from now you might be interested in:

    Treasury Dept; M. President, we regret to inform you that the country has gone bankrupt.

    President; Dang. Was hoping that wouldn’t happen. Only needed a few more trillion to spend my way out of this recession. OK, so we’re bankrupt. Who owns the paper?

    Treasury Dept; Uhm… mostly China.

    President; Well what do they want? Can we mortgage something? How about California? They have to take Schwartzenneger with it though.

    Treasury Dept; We already mortgaged California. All the other states too. They said they want to take title to a state or two….

    President; Fine. They can have California.

    Treasury Dept; Uhm… they don’t want California. They asked for Alaska. They said something about Guam, but then they changed their mind, something about it being too tippy.

    President; Alaska? ALASKA!? Why would they want Alaska?

    Treasury Dept; Oil… all that oil you wouldn’t let us drill for is still there….and they want half of Texas too…

    President; Oil? They want oil? Would they take Canada instead?

    Treasury Dept; Uhm… we don’t own Canada.

    President; Does China know that?

    Treasury Dept; I think so…

    President; Well offer them Canada and see what they say. Tell them we’ll throw in Guam, and the tippy thing is just a myth. If they won’t take Canada I guess we might have to cut a deal for Alaska. Are the values of the states marked on the backs of the map pieces here? What do I do, just turn them over and look at the numbers?

    Treasury Dept; This isn’t monopoly…

    President; Canada. Final offer. Canada or nothing. We still got nukes you know.

    Treasury Dept; Actually, we took a loan out on those too. They’re being held as collatoral in Iran. Part of them agreeing not to enrich Uranium anymore, remember that deal?

    President; $^&W#R*U!! I should never have taken this job. I must have “inhaled” the day I decided to run for this office. Should have known I couldn’t clean up Obama’s mess in four years. Should never have run against him in the primaries. Shouldn’t have picked my stupid husband for treasury either.

    Treasury Dept; I tried to tell you…

    President; Shut up Bill.

    Treasury Dept; Yes Hillary.

  99. juanslayton says:

    $200 million a day doesn’t pass the sniff test. I see that Senator Bachmann is being ridiculed on CNN for accepting what is clearly an inflated figure.

  100. Black Sabbath says:

    Don’t forget the other 1000 people back here and around the world who have to keep an eye on him day and night while he’s on his escape, er, trip to India. They have to sit in front of energy burning computers, talking on energy burning phones monitoring satellites with energy-sucking electronics, satellites that were launched by the way on rockets – the carbon footprint of which you can’t even begin to imagine. Etc. etc…

  101. POWinCA says:

    Obama’s profligate carbon expenditures began on his first day of office.

    He polluted the atmosphere with tons of CO2 when he signed his Energy Bill in Colorado instead of Washington, DC.

    He contributes to Global Warming, so you don’t have to.

  102. Neil Craig says:

    Must admit the prospect of President Biden scares me more that Obama or even Hillary. This is the guy who said he wanted to put all 10 million Serbs into “nazi style concentration camps”. That Nazi differs from Hitler only in that Hitler was intelligent.

    Regarding Falluja this article, again from Wikipedia http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mass_hysteria gives many instances of such mass hysteria, most relevently communities in fear of mysterious & non-existent gas attacks. The cure is to ignore it. Regretably that cure would diminish newspaper revenues. The fact is that radiation releases at undetectable levels are undetectable compared to easily detectable background radiation & is, in any case, entirely harmless.

  103. kadaka (KD Knoebel) says:

    From Tom in Florida on November 3, 2010 at 2:25 pm:

    Pelosi would not become Vice President.

    Yup, you’re right, and Wikipedia agrees. I had remembered that much of the Presidential line of succession, but thought there’d be a simple indexing of positions, with the House merely choosing a new Speaker for the vacancy at the end of the chain. Leave it to the politicians to have problems drawing a straight line. ;-)

  104. Blade says:

    For those of you doubting the $200,000,000 per day, which you think is inflated too high, never EVER err on the low side when government spending is involved (hey, it’s how we got to this financial point remember?). Everything comes in way over budget and past all projections. When it happens to be the occupant of the White House who has practically no oversight over him/her, the sky is the limit.

    That said, the sources all appear to point to an original source based in India. The ones ‘in the know’ are not telling. Only Congress could get this actual information, and not a single member, likely an oversight committee in a secret session so we’ll probably never know for sure. So we have to roll with what we got.

    Naysayers should also note the source has said that Barry and his 3,000 closest friends are booking and taking over the entire Taj Mahal Hotel (plus others), its approx 500 rooms for 10 days (and presumably relieving the entire staff of I’m guessing several thousand).

    Take a look at these vacation digs (and feel free to test book a room in the calculator) …

    http://www.agoda.com/asia/india/mumbai/taj_mahal_hotel.html

    Some of the money was also spent on Removing Coconuts which may fall on his head as reported by the BBC.

  105. DT says:

    Three days right? So $600,000,000 total?

    You could employ 12,000 Americans at $50k for one year with that money.

    You could build 6,000 $100k homes to house homeless Americans.

    How about food for the hungry or medical care for the destitute?

    What can he accomplish by being there that he can’t accomplish with video conferencing?

    Why is he even going there? To offshore more American jobs?

    I despise the man. There is a special place in hell for entitled politicians who think they are royalty and would waste this kind of money while their nation is in a depression. I hope he and his wife keep this nonsense up. I will enjoy watching them tossed out on their rears in 2012. Greedy little entitled monsters the both of them.

  106. R. de Haan says:

    Obama’s visit to India looks more like an invasion.
    Besides 400 planes, armored cars, helicopters and security staff he brings in Navy with a fleet of 34 ships including an aircraft carrier.

    http://www.ndtv.com/article/india/34-warships-sent-from-us-for-obama-visit-64459

  107. Curiousgeorge says:

    Part of that cost includes a Carrier Battle Group. http://www.ndtv.com/article/india/34-warships-sent-from-us-for-obama-visit-64459

    This is starting to sound more like an invasion than a visit.

  108. Norman says:

    Useless Obama pissing away taxpayer money, yet another violation of our rights. Add it to the list of gov’t violations of our right:
    They violate the 1st Amendment by placing protesters in cages, banning books like “America Deceived II” and censoring the internet.
    They violate the 2nd Amendment by confiscating guns.
    They violate the 4th and 5th Amendment by molesting airline passengers.
    They violate the entire Constitution by starting undeclared wars for foreign countries.
    Impeach Obama and sweep out the Congress, except Ron Paul.
    (Last link of Banned Book):
    America Deceived II (book)

  109. Kitefreak says:

    OK, I don’t know much about DU, but something has really damaged Falluja, this is a newspaper (well, it’s the Guardian, sorry) report from November of last year:

    link here: http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2009/nov/13/falluja-cancer-children-birth-defects

    Doctors in Iraq’s war-ravaged enclave of Falluja are dealing with up to 15 times as many chronic deformities in infants, compared to a year ago, and a spike in early life cancers that may be linked to toxic materials left over from the fighting.

    The extraordinary rise in birth defects has crystallised over recent months as specialists working in Falluja’s over-stretched health system have started compiling detailed clinical records of all babies born.

    Neurologists and obstetricians in the city interviewed by the Guardian say the rise in birth defects – which include a baby born with two heads, babies with multiple tumours, and others with nervous system problems – are unprecedented and at present unexplainable.

    A group of Iraqi and British officials, including the former Iraqi minister for women’s affairs, Dr Nawal Majeed a-Sammarai, and the British doctors David Halpin and Chris Burns-Cox, have petitioned the UN general assembly to ask that an independent committee fully investigate the defects and help clean up toxic materials left over decades of war – including the six years since Saddam Hussein was ousted.

    “We are seeing a very significant increase in central nervous system anomalies,” said Falluja general hospital’s director and senior specialist, Dr Ayman Qais. “Before 2003 [the start of the war] I was seeing sporadic numbers of deformities in babies. Now the frequency of deformities has increased dramatically.”
    ——————————————————————-
    Here in Scotland Member of the Scottish Parliament has been making some noise about this (September, 2010) :

    “Bill Wilson MSP (SNP) has lodged a Parliamentary Motion highlighting the consequences of the US and UK’s use of Weapons of Mass Destruction during an attack on Fallujah in 2004.

    Speaking after lodging his motion, Dr Wilson said, “The consequences are ongoing: a survey showed a four-fold increase in all cancers, a 12-fold increase in childhood cancer in under-14s and a 38-fold increase in leukaemia. By contrast, Hiroshima survivors showed a 17-fold increase with regard to the latter. What’s more, because of this cancer crisis, local doctors are advising women not to have children.

    “It is disappointing, to say the least, that our media have paid relatively little attention to this issue. Yet women are now being advised not to have children. To turn a blind eye now would surely make us all complicit.”

  110. Kitefreak says:

    Sorry, I meant to add to my previous post – and help pull it back on-topic – that India will be very glad – or at least serene – about receiving Obama. But Pakistan, given what has occured in Iraq and Afghanistan, and has already started happening in its own country, must be crapping itself.

    Honestly, the carbon footprint of this visit is nothing compared with what has already been expended taking multiple carrier battle groups to the regions of the Persian Gulf (through the Suez canal), the Indian Ocean and South China Sea this year. The naval ships will no doubt be left there when Obama returns to US soil.

    The biggest threat to climate today is nuclear war. No doubt about it.

    And we all better take care ‘cos war makes money and the people makin’ the money don’t care how many people get killed while they’re makin’ the money.

  111. Kitefreak says:

    Norman says:
    November 4, 2010 at 10:42 am

    They violate the 1st Amendment by placing protesters in cages.
    ————————————————————–
    Only if they are protesting outside the new “free speech zones”. WTF is a free speech zone in a “free country”? Is that not what they call an oxymoron? I’m confused.

    Not from the US but always keen to follow what goes on there because it usually arrives here (UK) a few years later (internet, free phone calls, jogging, breakfast TV, McDonalds, War on Terror, anti-terror legislation, etc.)

  112. Curiousgeorge says:

    @ Kitefreak says:
    November 4, 2010 at 12:17 pm

    “Bill Wilson MSP (SNP) has lodged a Parliamentary Motion highlighting the consequences of the US and UK’s use of Weapons of Mass Destruction during an attack on Fallujah in 2004.

    This is a particularly egregious definition of the term “Weapons of Mass Destruction”, for no purpose other than political hyperbole. Warfare is ugly and deadly – that’s the whole point. I’ve been there and done that. But to stoop to using that fact for partisan political advantage is even uglier. A machine gun or a hand grenade can be called a WMD by those who wish to cloud the issue with emotional appeals. Warfare is destruction, with the intent to convince the opponent to quit fighting.

    The end game of diplomacy is always, ALWAYS, the use of force. Everything prior to that is an attempt to avoid that use of force. Surprise! It doesn’t always work. You better be glad that the USA has the means and the will to use it, or you and I and 300 million other citizens would not be enjoying the freedoms that some take for granted. As has been said: “There is no substitute for victory”.

    Quite frankly, I would rather our enemies suffer the indignities of warfare than the citizens of the USA, and when I was in that business I did my very best to ensure just that.

  113. Kitefreak says:

    I think the Bush Blair definition of weapons of mass destruction was particularly egregious.

    I find it particularly outrageous that George Bush juniour would joke about it (WMD’s) while giving a dinner speech:

    There were no WMDs, just like there is no man made climate change.

    There are many, many civilian deaths. So, who are our “enemies”?

  114. davidmhoffer says:

    Curiousgeorge;
    or you and I and 300 million other citizens would not be enjoying the freedoms that some take for granted.>>

    You might want to add all the other countries who have benefited as well, putting the number at billions.

    Thank you for your service.

  115. Kitefreak says:

    Curiousgeorge:

    “Quite frankly, I would rather our enemies suffer the indignities of warfare than the citizens of the USA, and when I was in that business I did my very best to ensure just that.”

    Who tells you who your enemies are?

    Why do you believe them?

  116. Curiousgeorge says:

    @ Kitefreak says:
    November 4, 2010 at 2:53 pm

    So, who are our “enemies”?

    Simple. Anyone who works to undermine or supplant the USA position in the world. And this conversation is over.

  117. _Jim says:

    Missing information – a LOT of you are completely missing vital information re: the cost of this trip, which includes, the breakdown, transport, and re-assembly (+ required personnel since ‘state’ dept. won’t be performing the mechanics’ work) of all manner of in-theater transport (incl. CARS and HELICOPTERS) for the $200 million/day …

    Geesh. Where would y’all be without me …

    .

  118. eadler says:

    Yet another Watts blobpost based on incorrect information, swallowed whole by the acolytes who comment here.
    The figure of $200M/day and the others associated with it are made up out of whole cloth by an Indian News Agency. The details mentioned are denied by administration spokespeople for the Pentagon and the Whitehouse.
    http://www.snopes.com/politics/obama/india.asp
    Is this website turning into a shill for loopy conservative Republicans like Michelle Bachmann?

    [REPLY - Well, we're pretty low class, I guess. We allow your posts. ~ Evan]

    REPLY: Funny how Mr. Eadler attacks me, instead of going to the source of the error. But then, he’s predictable. But the great thing about WUWT is that we can admit when something is wrong, instead of trying to cover it up like some people do. So yes, based on what snopes says, it appears to be wrong. Unfortunately, snopes.com also says:

    The U.S. government isn’t likely to be forthcoming with a cost breakdown for President Obama’s Asia trip (particularly since a large chunk of the expenses necessarily involve security arrangements, which obviously can’t be publicly outlined or detailed), but it’s probably safe to say that the ultimate cost will be well short of the claimed $200 million per diem figure.

    So, it’s unconfirmable either way.

    “Is this website turning into a shill for loopy conservative Republicans like Michelle Bachmann?”, I wouldn’t know, never heard of her until you mentioned it.

    Oh and Eric, and good job on ignoring all the other details of the story. – Anthony

  119. Mark S says:

    Repeating the $200 million a day canard gives this forum the same credibility as Fox News. In other words: none.

    Anthony, you really need to have some standards here.

    REPLY: See comment above. I look forward to your complaint letter to the Indian News agency responsible. I’ll be happy to post it here for you. – Anthony

  120. kadaka (KD Knoebel) says:

    Mark S said on November 4, 2010 at 6:15 pm:

    Repeating the $200 million a day canard gives this forum the same credibility as Fox News. In other words: none.

    And with that enlightened statement, I know exactly how much credibility to assign your comments. ☻

    Anthony, you really need to have some standards here.

    Yup, he’d even give UnReal Climate or Open-Aired Mind credit if they’d get something right. Go figure.

  121. POWinCA says:

    The $200 million per day cost is no less credible than Joe Stiglitz’ estimate of a $3 trillion war.

    The $200 million per day is no less credible than the Lancet article which claimed 100,000 dead Iraqi civilians.

    When I was an Army Jumpmaster, if we didn’t see the panels on the landing zone and had to make another pass for our drop, it would cost $1500 in extra fuel.

    I don’t think it’s implausible at all to spend $200 million per day with so many ships and aircraft. Obama’s inauguration ceremony and parties cost $160 million and dumped 100 tons of trash on the streets of DC. The correct calculation, though, should be the extra expenses over and above regular operating costs. Joe Stiglitz didn’t bother with such petty details.

    The remarkable thing about those who doubt the massive cost, regardless of its plausibility, is that you SIMPLY DON’T CARE how much it costs or how much CO2 he emits during the trip. The Indian media shouldn’t be calculating the magnitude of Obama’s hypocrisy, YOU should be.

  122. fhsiv says:

    Looks like this is Obama’s “Let them eat cake!” moment.

  123. A. Magnus says:

    For all the people claiming depleted uranium doesn’t cause cancer, I suggest allowing your homes to be used for live fire exercises by A-10 Warthogs, then you should rebuild right over the exact same spot and live there. I’ll check in on you in a few years and verify that you’re all tumor-free. If you’re not willing to put your money where your apologist mouths are then kindly STFU.

  124. Anthony Watts says:

    Some people think the $200 million figure is ludicrous. Well, there’s no denying that.

    You want ludicrous? how about this:

    Mile long bomb proof tunnel so Obama can visit the Ghandi museum

    http://www.dnaindia.com/mumbai/report_tunnel-for-obama-near-mani-bhavan_1461946

  125. evanmjones says:

    The $200 million per day is no less credible than the Lancet article which claimed 100,000 dead Iraqi civilians.

    You left out a zero. IIRC, they had it at 600k at first, and then upped it to 1.2 mil.

    Anyone who knows anything about the Iraq War (or the Iran-Iraq War) found the Lancet report to be risible.

  126. BS Footprint says:

    DL says:
    November 3, 2010 at 4:42 am
    How could anybody spend a billion dollars for a 3 day event? The G20 met a few months later in Seoul so the billion dollars was for a meeting that will happen seveal times a year.

    A billion $ just doesn’t go as far as it used to. What with inflation and all. (Oh, never mind, we’re experiencing deflation.)

  127. Jeff Fujita says:

    First off, I’m as big a skeptic as the next poster and I do realize politics unfortunately go hand in hand with alarmist “science”. However, what I do like about this blog is that much of the argument is based on science and/or a review of so-called “settled science”, and much of the success of this blog and others is that facts are brought to light. Now here we have a report claiming the $200M per day figure and all the other support allegedly anticipated for Obama’s trip that was generated from an Indian reporter and an undisclosed source. Can we just sit back and calmly examine these numbers and see if they make sense? I’m not an Obama apologist but I hate to see attacks based on suspect information and sources. Isn’t that behavior the very behavior we skeptics abhor? Before you slam our president, can’t you at least make sure your attacks are based on something more reliable than an non-cited single source?

    I’ve always been uncomfortable when I read support for Tea Party and other conservative politicians speaking out against climate change and global warming – I don’t trust them any more than I do the kool-aid drinkers. They often possess no more intelligent capacity than the Al Gores of climate change. They tend to push the notion that higher education is something is bad. No, the opposite of failed science isn’t the absence of science, it’s better, more accurate science. As far as slamming the current president for taking over a large contingency of business owners, staff, and Secret Service, well that’s just hypocrisy – many politicians of BOTH parties grease the wheel and help supporters of their respective candidacies on these foreign trips. Politicians from BOTH parties have been using their juice to gain political power and often at the taxpayers’ expense. Look, I don’t like expensive junkets but if this trip means more jobs for middle class workers, and maybe keeping some of the jobs here at home versus using Indian and other foreign workers, then I’m for it. At this point, none of us knows the extent of the trip’s final cost and success in establishing better business relations with India. Americans are losing jobs to foreign workers and if Obama and his guests can generate more jobs here, then it’s worth it. If he tries to do something abroad, then he’s wasting money. If he stays home and hopes foreign companies come to us for work, then he’s Pollyanna – he can’t win.

    As far as pointing out the inconsistency of the “greenest” President and his trip’s purported outrageous cost daily figure, I think Anthony should stick to the hard science at hand and refrain from stooping to the level of alarmists and throwing something that suits our ideal and see if it sticks on the wall. Leave the one-sided mudslinging to the Limbaughs, Hannitys, and liberal mass media – we skeptics need to be better than that. Skeptics’ arguments should be based on examination of data and not emotional sentiments. It shouldn’t be a matter of winning at all costs but because it’s honest and accurate.

  128. Steve says:

    Don’t forget the 34 warships.

    And the US military building Obama a 6/10 mile long bomb-proof tunnel just so he can visit the Gandhi museum.

    Can we refuse him entry when he returns with his imperial court, due to lack of a valid Indonesian visa?

    In addition to all the good points on Fallujah, I’ll remind about Hussein’s (Saddam, not Barack) uranium stockpiles and biological and chemical warfare stockpiles. Some were released during the initial UN-mandated fighting, and some have been captured and reworked by the Iranians for the terrorists to use against the Iraqi population.

  129. JPeden says:

    Anthony Watts:

    “Mile long bomb proof tunnel so Obama can visit the Ghandi museum

    http://www.dnaindia.com/mumbai/report_tunnel-for-obama-near-mani-bhavan_1461946

    The tunnel would be a kilometre long and measure 12ft by 12ft — enough to let Obama’s cavalcade pass through. The tunnel would be centrally air-conditioned, fitted with close-circuit television cameras, and will be heavily guarded at every point, including, of course, its entry and exit.

    Sounds to me more like an unintended invitation/opportunity for terrorists to try something – long confined space….

  130. Blade says:

    eadler [November 4, 2010 at 5:59 pm] says:

    Hmmmm. Why does that date ring a bell? Oh I remember November 3 was the election. Having a bad day are you eadler? It’s showing.

    “Yet another Watts blobpost based on incorrect information, swallowed whole by the acolytes who comment here.”

    Whoa, calling Anthony a liar (and the commenters worshippers), or are you accusing the Indian news agency, which is it?

    “The figure of $200M/day and the others associated with it are made up out of whole cloth by an Indian News Agency. The details mentioned are denied by administration spokespeople for the Pentagon and the Whitehouse.”

    So what are the actual numbers, you offer none? asnyway, I say we go with your Precautionary Principle (heh, literally hoisted with your own petard!). Assume the worst, or even worse than that. In all seriousness, since this is a bonafide state secret (at present time) YOU cannot possibly know the actual answer, nor can …

    http://www.snopes.com/politics/obama/india.asp

    (IMHO) Snopes is a left-wing website run by moonbats, sorry. They were untrustworthy even before Wikipedia, a looong time ago. At least Wikipedia is open about their biases and we see the backroom discussion. So what did Snopes tell you: nothing! They told you to trust them that the price is inflated. Yeah, sure.

    “Is this website turning into a shill for loopy conservative Republicans like Michelle Bachmann?”

    You say Conservative (I think a better word is ‘Constitutionalist‘) like it is a bad thing. Bachmann is always citing the Constitution as her guide, as should all 537 of the elected federal public servants. You have a problem with this? Would you like her better if she chucked the Constitution and cited ideology as her guide instead? Honestly? Well, here’s what I think: I see your comment as a classic case of mouth frothing smearing by liberals when women, blacks and hispanics stray off the reservation, refusing to be slaves to the democratic socialist party. Many wonderful examples of this occured on November 3, which explains these hyperbolic bedwetting comments seen on November 4. Emancipation, and there is much more to come.

    P.S. How ironic is it that Eadler whines about allegedly incorrect cost projections because of missing data (heh heh). Pointing to Wikipedia I mean, Snopes for moral support, accusing the website host of lying and its commenters as being religious worshippers! AGW :: Politics. Life imitates Art ;-)

  131. Chas says:

    [snip -off topic, religious issues]

  132. Blade says:

    Blade [November 5, 2010 at 2:09 am] says:

    “… November 3 was the election.”

    “Many wonderful examples of this occured on November 3 …”

    Arrrgghhh! Let me try again!

    “… November 2 was the election.”

    “Many wonderful examples of this occured on November 2 …”

    Sorry for the mistake (not a typo!) No excuse except for being tired.

    I actually did vote at 6am (3rd person in the door) in fact I left a post here right before leaving for the polls.

    If I were a liberal I’d blame the lack of post preview (or the mods for letting it through ;-) <— sarc!

  133. H.R. says:

    H.R. says:
    November 3, 2010 at 8:06 am
    tallbloke says:
    November 3, 2010 at 7:00 am

    :o) I appreciate your point, tallbloke, but this trip isn’t even to start a war. As near as I can make it, it’s pure sightseeing… and photo ops. of course.

    I’ll eat my cyberwords if he makes it back home having accomplished anything of consequence.
    ————————————-

    Regardless of the true cost of the trip, which won’t be cheap by any measure, I’ll be interested to see if I have to eat my cyberwords after the trip is done and the list of “accomplishments” on this trip is trumpeted throughout the land. I still predict nothing of consequence will result given the money spent.

    I’m hoping for a followup main post after the trip is over, but that’s in the hands of Anthony.

  134. Matt says:

    Little insight from the Economist on Obama’s trip: http://www.economist.com/blogs/gulliver/2010/11/obamas_india_trip

    Sad to see how inconsistently reports from the media are now being treated here. Media report on global warming? Question and examine aggressively for minute errors. Media report from anonymous source casting bad light on Obama? Vehemently defend conclusions or pass blame onto other site for reporting it. Amazing.

  135. kadaka (KD Knoebel) says:

    Re: Matt on November 8, 2010 at 3:54 am

    The headline is ‘Greenest President Ever’ trip to India has a carbon footprint bigger than the citizens of many US cities. Your Economist link doesn’t dispute that. The “$200 million a day” was tossed around and eventually shot down, although as such estimates go, on the final tally figuring in all the behind-the-scenes logistics, it might not be that far off.

    As it is, “reports from the media” are treated rather consistently here, despite what you say. “Global warming” is climate science and gets examined critically, as this is a science site. “$200 million a day” was simple politics, not related to climate science, and was tossed in “just for fun.” This is a science site, after all. ☺

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