AGW=dead lizards? Maybe it's not the heat, but the handbags and herpetology aficionados?

Lizards are breathing CO2 just like us, right? So when Lizard population goes down…less CO2. That is negative feedback.
Dr. Spencer!

It should read ‘afficionados’

Truly annoying, as usual. Anyone who has driven around south of the border has seen kids selling exotic animals by the side of the road. In fact I saw some Mexican American kids in my town essentially trying to do the same thing with turtles they found. Lizards are also edible. These “journalists” take anything these “scientists” say and strip out any caveats or subtleties (if present) and proclaim the end of the world. grrr.

In South Sarasota (FL) County they set aside several acres and made it into a scrub jay reserve. There is a big sign telling us what it is. Apparently scrub jays cannot read as scrub jays have not been found to be nesting there.

That’s pretty insulting to the lizards. They move around regularly during the day to sunnier / shadier spots to control their body temperature. And while egg temperature is very important to breeding, the lizards are pretty good at figuring out were to bury their eggs (soil temperature, moisture, etc). I’m sure there’s some point where they would be unable to adapt and reproduce, but it would have to be fare more drastic than what’s observed so far.

Mexicans *eat* lizards too. I have Mexican cousins who love them. Especially the big ones. Much like Cajuns eat alligators. When you’re poor any source of protein is a win.

Temperature in Mexico:
http://climexp.knmi.nl/data/icrutem3_hadsst2_250-265E_15-30N_na.png
I can’t imagine the lizard die-off in 1860s or 1940s.
Look how the sinusoidal wave starts to go negative again.

Correct spelling: AFICIONADOS
Anyway sun-made climate change: Solar flyux=68, call 911!

Lizards feeling sympathy pains for polar bears?

Anthony, I agree with your general skepticism, but what about this statement:
“To get this kind of pattern, on five continents in 34 different groups of lizards, that’s not random, that’s a correlated response . . .” Seems bigger than just some folks in Mexico selling pets.
The reality is, we’d probably need to see the details of the study, how the populations were counted, how the temperatures were assessed and correlated, potential non-temperature factors for the 34 different groups, etc., in order to make a definitive statement about whether the study holds water.
REPLY: I hear you, and I’ll also point out the interest in lizards and herpetology collecting is gaining momentum worldwide. The trade is happening on all continents. – Anthony

As an Australian this makes my day, mate. Global warming kills your lizards – then we make a killing by selling our bearded dragon lizards. The perfect crime!

When I wear my twin lizard cowboy boots and walk down the street. It must put lizards out of the mood romantically to see their brother on a pair of boots.

Anthony, here’s the catch/caveat to this:
“Sinervo and collaborators resurveyed 48 species of spiny lizards”
Thanks to DNA, we now have at least 7 species of giraffes.
Where in the very recent past, we only had one species of giraffe, and that one species was not in any danger.
Now, we have 7 species of giraffe, and they are all in danger.
Grouped together as one species, giraffes were in no danger.
Divided up into 7 species, all 7 species are in danger.
Get it?

BTW, all living beings increase or decrease its “estro”(reproductive desire) as a consequence of sun light brigthness, which through the eyes act on internal secretion glands.

Shub said (June 7, 2010 at 1:09 pm): It should read ‘afficionados’
No, ‘aficionado’ is correct. It’s from Spanish, which doesn’t allow a doubled consonant except when it has a different sound from the single version (for example Spanish ‘rr’ sounds different than Spanish ‘r’).

Tastes like chicken and the lizard shoes sell for 3000 bucks

kenboldt says:
June 7, 2010 at 1:06 pm
“And now the million dollar question: What’s the fastest way to increased grant money?
Anyone?”
Add the words “climate change” somehow, of course.
And to maintain or increase the flow of cash, find some connection.
To make the flow permanent, make sure you need to monitor the impacts of climate change on your chosen ‘victim.’
This has been one of the main thrusts of the pesudoscience of Conservation Biology since its recent invention, and it explains a lot of the alarming headlines about just about everything.
I have seen this trick work too many times, and the opposite effect as well…

latitude says:
June 7, 2010 at 2:16 pm
Anthony, here’s the catch/caveat to this:
“Sinervo and collaborators resurveyed 48 species of spiny lizards”
Thanks to DNA, we now have at least 7 species of giraffes.
Where in the very recent past, we only had one species of giraffe, and that one species was not in any danger.
Now, we have 7 species of giraffe, and they are all in danger.
Grouped together as one species, giraffes were in no danger.
Divided up into 7 species, all 7 species are in danger.
———-
And each of these “species” becomes a separate lucrative franchise for a Conservation Biology team, or even a taskforce, which must research, monitor and ‘save’ it.
So 7 times more of these ‘experts’ are required – at least. If borders are crossed, each country often also has their own. Fantastic scam.
This also explains why various species at-risk lists keep growing, which in turn is used to fool/scare the public into thinking they actually mean something.

Maybe global warming. Maybe the lizard gods didn’t get enough sacrifices. Maybe too much poaching. Who knows.
I wonder if those lizards are just doing what’s worked well for them for all of prehistory: migrate. Migration is a great adaptation skill, so I imagine it is pretty deep in their instincts. Only now, migration means walking out of the isolated protected areas to places where they are in serious jeopardy from humans and their pets.
On the other hand, people are probably helping them migrate to places they’ve never been able to get to before, thus becoming the “invasive species” over there.
So just looking at their original locations doesn’t tell the whole story.

Re: biology professor Jack Sites
He don’t get out much, do he?
(Although the same can be said about many alleged research scientists who go through life wearing blinders to all but their narrow-focused concern.)

Eric Anderson says:
June 7, 2010 at 1:53 pm
Anthony, I agree with your general skepticism, but what about this statement:
“To get this kind of pattern, on five continents in 34 different groups of lizards, that’s not random, that’s a correlated response . . .” Seems bigger than just some folks in Mexico selling pets.

——–
Eric, do you remember the frog deaths that happened worldwide. Maybe there is a similar situation happening with the lizards. Similar situation with bee deaths worldwide. The AGWers’ mistake is to assume it must be man-made co2 warming and so don’t bother to look at any other possibility because it doesn’t pay too well in grant money. What a croc!!!
So let’s reconsider: What is the most probable cause of the lizard population decline wordwide? Capture as pets, killing for handbags / shoes, disease OR a 0.7c rise in temps which previously failed to wipe out their ancestors or their dino cousins. Where is their evidence of the temperature rise in their study area? Can it be believed?
Frog deaths:
http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2008/03/080326195628.htm
http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2009/11/091119135642.htm
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/science/nature/5008940.stm

I blamed my neighbour’s cats for the decline in the local species of skinks. Once neighbour plus cats were gone the skinks flourished — to be taken by a burgeoning flocks of Kookaburras and once again the population of skinks has begun to decline …. The solution is simple: I’ll call any cats and kookaburras I see “global warming”.

Excellent debunking of yet another false AGW claim.
Another 10.000 to go.
Unfortunately.
And those debunked effectively t will pop up again after some time.
It’s almost natural, the propaganda comes in waves that coincide with Senate Bills.
Cap & Trade is still on the agenda.

Professor from BYU?
Maybe he can shed light on the extinction of a feathered reptile:
His Name, Quezalcóatl, means literally “Quetzal-snake” or “the plumed serpent”. To the Aztecs the feathers of the quetzal bird were a symbol of something precious. Cóatl also means “twin brother”.. Thus the name Quezalcóatl is understood by Mormon Scholars to mean “The Precious Twin”,
From the Mormon writings.

“Species” is used very loosely in most instances. Seldom is the biological definition used which is that distinct species are those genetically incapable of producing fertile hybrids.
Imagine how difficult it would be to test for true speciation. It’s often difficult to get two of the same species to reproduce in captivity to say nothing of two that may be only subspecies. Because of this difficulty two populations that aren’t observed to interbreed in the wild because of sexual selection preference or geographic isolation are classed as separate species. If this same metric were applied to humans we’d have a couple dozen species of humans on the planet instead of just one.
So when you hear about species going extinct take it with a huge grain of salt because it’s highly likely it’s only a sub-species going extinct and no genetic diversity is actually being forever lost. It’s the loss of genetic diversity we want to avoid. Losing some populations which are merely sub-species is not a big deal because given the same selection pressures which produced the sub-species are applied to other members of the species the true breeding variant will return.
For instance look at all the different sub-species of dogs there are. Most if not all of them originated within the last 20,000 years from wolves, coyotes, and jackals (the latter three can all interbreed). The original genetic stock still exists and with selective breeding all the dog breeds can be reproduced from wolves, coyotes, and jackals. If all the dog breeds were wild, which is a laugh because few of them would survive for long, they’d be classed as a hundred different species. Given we know for sure they can interbreed because they’ve been so closely watched for so long we know that are only three wild sub-species and all the domestic canines are just inbred combinations of them selected for traits that are recessive in the wild.

So does this mean that lizards can only survive at very strict latitudes and if they stray south by, say, 20 miles/32 km (or whatever it takes to change a few tenths of a degree) they will die out? Or, if the breeding month has a +2C anomaly for a few years in a row locally (not beyond the realm of belief if kept locally for a few years), will the lizards die out?
Seriously, if they tied it to AGW in some way other than temperatures (maybe rainfall or something), then it MIGHT be buy-able, but to tie it to temperature is absurd.
I don’t care if you’re a hardcore evolution follower or think God made it all…if life was really that fragile, it wouldn’t be around today!
-Scott

Perhaps the problem is not AGW but chemicals in the environment that affect the reproductive cycle. I wonder if there have been any studies that track those types of changes. An interesting documentary from cbc on how human reproduction is being affected by the myriad of new man-made compounds that are being found in the environment.
http://www.cbc.ca/video/#/Shows/Doc_Zone/ID=1233750780
Stan

We watched as the iguana’s fell like rain it was so cold. The pythons stopped traffic, the only warm they could find was the blacktop to get them through the nights.
And our coconut palms died for no reason right on down to the Miami City limits and beyond. It was brutal what cold did.
And you don’t even want to hear what happened to the manatee and fish populations. Needless to say many fishing seasons had to be closed because of the cold weather die offs…

At least it’s anthropogenic..

Living in the UK I can vouch that I have never seen a lizard in the countryside. I think it’s because the UK has miserable cold weather. When I visit a hot country, they’re everywhere. I’m no expert, but I think lizards like it hot.
I saw a newt once. It looked like a wet lizard.

The Polar Bears in Manitoba are next if one believes a recent study http://www.calgaryherald.com/technology/polar+bears+could+disappear+years/3122881/story.html
“WINNIPEG — Northern Manitoba’s celebrated polar bear population is set to vanish in just a few short decades, if research by two of the world’s top experts proves right.
The Western Hudson Bay subpopulation of polar bears, estimated at 935 animals in 2004, is expected to decline over the next 25 to 30 years to the point where there are not enough bears to sustain a breeding population, predicts University of Alberta biologist Ian Stirling, who’s been studying polar bears for 37 years.
The increasing length of the ice-free season on Hudson Bay will soon reach a tipping point where 20 to 30 per cent of Manitoba’s polar bears will begin dying off every year, according to a mathematical analysis released by Stirling’s colleague, University of Alberta biologist Andrew Derocher, who has studied polar bears for 28 years.
Read more: http://www.calgaryherald.com/technology/polar+bears+could+disappear+years/3122881/story.html#ixzz0qDXp0VeI”
That is IF these two guys are proven right.
Those mathematical analysis are the latest toy to predict doom and gloom thanks to global warming. Watch out what will be the next prediction… How about funding for David Barber’s rotten ice research?

Climate made Europe’s apes vanish.
Great apes were wiped out of ancient Europe when their environment changed drastically some nine millions years ago, a new study shows.
But now they are back.
You find them with the BBC.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/science_and_environment/10209492.stm

latitude says:
June 7, 2010 at 2:16 pm

Anthony, here’s the catch/caveat to this:
“Sinervo and collaborators resurveyed 48 species of spiny lizards”
Thanks to DNA, we now have at least 7 species of giraffes.
Where in the very recent past, we only had one species of giraffe, and that one species was not in any danger.
Now, we have 7 species of giraffe, and they are all in danger.
Grouped together as one species, giraffes were in no danger.
Divided up into 7 species, all 7 species are in danger.
Get it?

Oh that term ‘species’ is a slippery little devil.
Biologists intentionally use the term to describe what is really a subspecies.
We had a big hoedown here in Colorado over the meaning of subspecies versus species.
http://www.hcn.org/issues/327/16445
The upshot?
North of the Colorado/Wyoming border this critter is fair game because it is simply a Montana Jumping Meadow Mouse. South of the border it is an endangered Preble Jumping Mouse.
I’ve been tempted to collect a few thousand of the Montana critters and setting them loose in Colorado riparian areas. Wait a few years and demand a resampling of the DNA. It would be very entertaining. Maybe the local mice would consider the imported mice ‘exotic’ and make the game even more exciting.
Naw. I would get busted and suffer years of imprisonment for messing with the endangered species act. It would be much safer to just kill a human.

It’s not the heat. It’s the stupidity.

Species go extinct all the time, and new species are evolving all the time. Get used to it. It’s called EVOLUTION. I thought the science behind that concept was settled!

alan says:
June 7, 2010 at 6:29 pm
“Species go extinct all the time, and new species are evolving all the time. Get used to it. It’s called EVOLUTION. I thought the science behind that concept was settled!”
Well, …….there was a consensus……..

As I sit here, ruminating about the many inaccuracies (falsehoods?) inherent in this line of “research” I cannot help but wonder when this is going to start affecting us in Texas? I’m writing from my favorite chair, a low federal style which has been in our family since at least 1850, which is in my upstairs office. The reason that this is important to the discussion is that on the window sill there are currently 6 Anoles, a lizard that is familiar to most people from pet stores, which are sold as “chameleons”. Unlike a true chameleon, these lizards change colour according to the temperature, a brilliant green when it’s hot, currently 101 degrees (F) and a dull brown when cold. At night, they may be found under the lip of my roof, which is when the geckos come out.
My small property here actually has representatives of 3 types of lizards and I seem to be overrun with them. I’m not sure of the species of the third type, it’s rather large, about 5 inches without the tail, grey/green/yellowish, lives under my palmeto and has a nasty temper.My long, rambling diatribe does have a salient point; these lizards are sold by the bucket load to pet stores throughout the country, saving only our southern states where they are common, and it’s illegal to catch them in the “wild” for resale purposes. As many others have pointed out, the decline in numbers (if we can even trust that) is probably due to “loose protection” laws; as our climate here is very similar to northern mexico.

looks like nothing will come out of Bonn:
8 June: AFP: 10 years needed to seal climate cuts, says UN pointman
“I don’t see the process delivering adequate mitigation targets in the next decade,” Yvo de Boer, executive secretary of the UN Framework Convention on Climate Change (UNFCCC), said in a webcast from Bonn….
http://www.google.com/hostednews/afp/article/ALeqM5iz2-vCgzscFjoJP-h97HLvlcgkrA
8 June: Hindustan Times: US, EU differ on future climate change negotiations
At Bonn, however, US officials appear to have softened their stand on Kyoto Protocol, saying they don’t mind it being discussed. “US is not a signatory to Kyoto and, therefore, any discussion on it does not matter to it,” said an Indian negotiator, participating at the 185-nation conference, biggest after the Copenhagen climate summit in December 2009.
The European Union, on the other hand, says there is no future for Kyoto Protocol and wants to discuss the new climate agreement where some responsibility is defined for all nations. The view is opposed by developing nations represented by G-77 plus China. ..
Chief South African delegate Alf Wills said the document put too much burden on developing nations, devoting a whole chapter to emissions curbs by the South but not the North. “It’s completely unbalanced in that respect,” he said.
Other major economies — India and China — have backed South African view…
http://www.hindustantimes.com/US-EU-differ-on-future-climate-change-negotiations/Article1-554576.aspx
8 June: Next: Climate change fund will be a grant
Yvo de Boer, the executive secretary, United Nation Framework Convention on Climate Change, said on Monday that only Japan who pledged $15 billion to the proposed fund indicated that certain portion of her pledge would come as loan…
http://234next.com/csp/cms/sites/Next/Home/5577183-146/climate_change_fund_will_be_a.csp

ImranCan says:
June 7, 2010 at 7:13 pm
“Its the lack of intellectual curiosity……….”
That stuff is sooo passe. The word “intellectual” doesn’t belong in a CAGW discussion. True, many are educated, but I find intellectual pursuit woefully lacking. Very few have, none as far as I can tell, stated that even if all the doom and gloom the CAGW people have proposed is true, that the cure is still worse than the illness. In my estimation, this is true. To take a quote from a book that many here seem to disdain, regardless of the well-founded logic, “Let us do evil that good may come?” How much harm must we do to our fellow man before we save humanity? Yes, that’s a moral question, but it is also incumbent upon us to intellectually ask the question. The worst case scenario: how much are we willing and able to pay? For me, the answer is, the price is already to high. For us to be forced to deal with trifling studies about lizards which have thrived in much warmer conditions isn’t superfluous, it is a horrible harm to mankind.

aficionado = modest enthusiasm; afficionado = strong enthusiasm; affficionado = really great enthusiasm. apicicionado = softly enthusiastic; appicionado = …

surprised any MSM reporting on this:
7 June: LA Times: Andrew Malcolm: The ties that bind. Remember Rahm Emanuel’s rent-free D.C. apartment? The owner: A BP adviser
Greenberg’s consulting firm was a prime architect of BP’s recent rebranding drive as a green petroleum company, down to green signs and the slogan “Beyond Petroleum.”
Greenberg’s company is also closely tied to a sister Democratic outfit — GCS, named for the last initials of Greenberg, James Carville, another Clinton advisor, and Bob Shrum, John Kerry’s 2004 campaign manager.
According to published reports, GCS received hundreds of thousands of dollars in political polling contracts in recent years from the Democratic Congressional Campaign Committee.
Probably just a crazy coincidence. But you’ll never guess who was the chairman of that Democratic Congressional Campaign Committee dispensing those huge polling contracts to his kindly rent-free landlord.
http://latimesblogs.latimes.com/washington/2010/06/rahm-emanuel-bp-gul-oil-spill.html

alan says:
June 7, 2010 at 6:29 pm
Species go extinct all the time, and new species are evolving all the time. Get used to it. It’s called EVOLUTION. I thought the science behind that concept was settled!
You’re right, alan. Species go extinct all the time. In paleobiology we have learned that the only way a species radiates is through the extinction of another avatar. Exempli gratia, an avatar 2 living in a given region survives a climate change and an avatar 1 living in the same biotic patch starts succumbing to that climate change. Until this moment, this is the sole mechanism by which a species radiates, evolutionary talking. The other mechanisms are highly vague. In other words, climate changes are ideal for biodiversity. Those guys on the AGW side have turned the science up down.

Chances are the the studies are flawed. There are some significant signs that this is propaganda and not science. There is no such thing as extinction of local populations. The “12% of the local populations had gone extinct” line is a weasel sentence. Most specie of Sceloporus are pretty damn easy to breed and most of the animals in the pet trade are captive breed. The “Evil pet trade causing extinction” line is just propaganda. I am also a bit sceptical of the definition of species being employed. Herpetology has been pretty much be taken over by radical moonbats who are always “splitters”, i.e. those who try to define every population of an animal as a separate species, e.g. Ambistoma californium which really is Ambistoma tigrinum californium.

Uh oh, or heh. Waiting to find out. I am acquainted with Jack Sites as he lives a couple miles from me, and we share an interest in reptiles. I’ve not talked to him in since the late 80s, so I’m not up to date on his research. When he was working in Mexico, the lizards he was studying were not the kinds used for skins or pets. They were small common ones and he was studying them because some of them were showing signs of being in the process of differentiation into distinct genetic types. You might want to check on the kinds of lizards cited in the study. And his notes.
That being said, I’m somewhat skeptical of the claims in the study since temperatures were warmer than now during the medieval warm period. So I don’t think temperature is responsible. I’d more suspect disease. There may be other factors such as other parts of the food chain being disrupted for reasons other than temperatures.
I can’t tell you if he’s just an AGW tool since I haven’t worked closely with him. But when I knew him, he seemed to be a reasonable guy. So I think it would be nice and wait until we’ve seen the data and the alternate explanations before making fun of or mocking him. This is the first time on this blog I actually know the person being talked about, and it feels, um, awkward watching all the put downs before we’ve examined the data and methodologies.

Cue picture of a lizard on a melting ice floe………Good grief! I cannot even get mad at these con merchants anymore. Are they trying to bore us into agreement?

I don’t know why you focus on lizards. There are much more serious threats against us humans. The Vikings went extinct because of climate change.

Joe says:
June 7, 2010 at 5:06 pm
Living in the UK I can vouch that I have never seen a lizard in the countryside. I think it’s because the UK has miserable cold weather. When I visit a hot country, they’re everywhere. I’m no expert, but I think lizards like it hot.”
Lots down here in Dorset UK. It’s a function of being slightly warmer than rest of UK but mainly because of habitat, sand and heath.
I can’t believe that ‘science’ paper. Lizards dying from heat? If it was that bad a lot more creatures would have died first surely? Lizards can’t be that sensitive. They’re having a larf!
Regarding extinctions I read in a science paper that a species was 90% extinct – either it is or it isn’t? Can you be 90% pregnant?
cheers David

RE: “‘Science’ Paper links warming to lizard die-offs”
The word order here seems to indicate that scientists have discovered that warming has been caused by the death of lizards…

Global Warming is and will be the cause of the disappearance of many important things, among these freedom.

Excellent research for this post. Some people never move out of their own bubble. Like the good Christian lady, years ago ,who tried to convince me that the best thing the missionaries did in the Pacific Islands during the Early Contact era was to induce the natives to wear clothes. Her mindset was unshakeable and she just smiled at me with irritatingly superior niceness when I attempted to counter her arguments. She ‘just knew’.

Like most people who grew up in a rural environment, I very much enjoy programmes about the countryside and farming. For that reason, I watch BBC’s ‘Countrywatch’ series, which is usually quite down-to-earth and rational. But in every programme, there just has to be a nod to CAGW and I find that irritating in the extreme. Most of these ‘nods’ are slipped in surreptitiously, but some are total clangers. If the BBC wish to campaign for CAGW, why do I and others have to have this fed to us on our quite large licence fee?

“”Spector says:
June 8, 2010 at 3:54 am
RE: “‘Science’ Paper links warming to lizard die-offs”
The word order here seems to indicate that scientists have discovered that warming has been caused by the death of lizards…””
That actually makes more sense. 😉

When I was a kid (30 to 40 years ago), we had quadrillions of small lizards here on our ranch in South Texas. Now we have very few. Also now have very few quail and rabbits, and wild turkeys seem to be declining. What do all of these animals have in common? They nest on or in the ground. What species has moved in and drastically multiplied over the past 30 or 40 years? Fire ants. They kill and consume all types of ground-nesting animals, sometimes including newborn calves.

Stan Buffel says:
June 7, 2010 at 4:13 pm
Perhaps the problem is not AGW but chemicals in the environment that affect the reproductive cycle….
_____________________________________________________________________-
You have hit on the answer! It was found that the GM corn, Starlink, has jumped the border and is now found in Mexico.
“A small California biotech company, Epicyte, in 2001 announced the development of genetically engineered corn which contained a spermicide which made the semen of men who ate it sterile. At the time Epicyte had a joint venture agreement to spread its technology with DuPont and Syngenta, two of the sponsors of the Svalbard Doomsday Seed Vault. “ source
So there is your answer. Spermicidal GM corn also jumped the Mexican border and was eaten by the lizards or by the insects who are the lizards prey, thereby rendering them sterile!
Well, it makes as much sense as a 0.7C temp rise as the cause doesn’t it?

I still don’t see where they looked at both side of the temperature data. They calculate how much “active” time is reduced due to temps that are too high, but don’t consider how much active time is increased due to a reduction in temperatures that are too low. Either I’m missing something, or the reviewers did.

Russell M says:
June 8, 2010 at 7:59 am
When I was a kid (30 to 40 years ago), we had quadrillions of small lizards here on our ranch in South Texas. Now we have very few. Also now have very few quail and rabbits, and wild turkeys seem to be declining. What do all of these animals have in common? They nest on or in the ground. What species has moved in and drastically multiplied over the past 30 or 40 years? Fire ants. They kill and consume all types of ground-nesting animals, sometimes including newborn calves.
_______________________________________________________________________
Yes and now they are headed for Washington DC. They are already past Durham NC and on their way north by leaps and bounds (about 10-20 years to travel the length of NC)
Do you think they will do us a favor and wipe out the not so rare species of two legged snakes in Washington DC???

“But for the phenomenon to be linked to climate change, the pattern would need to be seen globally. Sites connected Sinervo with researchers in Chile and Argentina, where Sites has been working for a decade. Sinervo also worked with researchers who documented lizard declines in Africa, Australia, and Europe.”
Five continents show the exact same pattern *as predicted* by research and it’s explained away by kids selling lizards in Mexico. Interesting way to avoid the point. But hey, some guy in Texas saw some lizards outside, so there’s no issue here. BTW, it got cold again this winter, Global Warming is such a joke.
Funny here how the hypothesis (Mexican kids are decimating global lizard populations) is accepted as proved because, duh, global warming is a hoax created by those rich research scientists to pay for their Ferraris. Oh, and look at shoe prices, doesn’t that prove the Mexican Kid theory?

RoPiNi says:
June 8, 2010 at 12:53 pm
“But for the phenomenon to be linked to climate change, the pattern would need to be seen globally. Sites connected Sinervo with researchers in Chile and Argentina, where Sites has been working for a decade. Sinervo also worked with researchers who documented lizard declines in Africa, Australia, and Europe.”
Five continents show the exact same pattern *as predicted* by research and it’s explained away by kids selling lizards in Mexico. Interesting way to avoid the point.
——
But you miss the point. First and foremost, one needs to know the details of each one of those lizard declines before one leaps to any conclusion that may or may not apply to all of them.
What exactly is this “exact same pattern” you refer to? Why can only climate change explain it, if it actually exists at all?
Second, the key point is that there are many potential factors which may contribute to the decline of any species but you, like these researchers (Sites et al), jumped to the climate change conclusion.
And what makes this particular case so dubious is that whatever climate changes which may have impacted this species since the baseline 1970s observations have been so insignificant relative to the long history of much more dramatic climate changes that these lizards have survived that this conclusion borders on the ridiculous.
One can selectively look at all the continents and find examples of birds whose populations have declined for a variety of known reasons other than climate change.
Following your/this logic one would jump to the conclusion that they were all caused by climate change.
No wonder people find these stories increasingly laughable. Definitely not objective science, to put it mildly.

“For all I know, the advance of fire ants (a non-native species which arrived in Texas in the 1950′s) could be due to global warming, but I’d need a few million in grant dollars to answer that definitively.”
Great, go and finish your doctorate, write up a proposal and we’ll see how it goes. Someone’s got to pay that Ferrari that all research scientists drive.
You could have just said, “I have no idea how reasearch grants are done” and saved everyone some time.
“Al Gored says: ”
Haha, you added a ‘d’ to Al Gore’s name, that’s genius. I’m expecting great things from your insights.
“First and foremost, one needs to know the details of each one of those lizard declines before one leaps to any conclusion that may or may not apply to all of them. ”
That’s what they did. “Sinervo also worked with researchers who documented lizard declines in Africa, Australia, and Europe.”
I’m pretty sure one of those other scientists would have noted all the Mexican kids running around snatching up lizards.
“What exactly is this “exact same pattern” you refer to? ”
Here in the article….you might want to read it before you next set of questions…”The researchers surveyed lizard populations, studied the effects of rising temperatures on lizards, and used their findings to *develop a predictive model of extinction risk*. Their model accurately predicted specific locations on five continents (North and South America, Europe, Africa, and Australia) where previously studied lizard populations have already gone locally extinct.”
“Why can only climate change explain it, if it actually exists at all? “”
Because outside of a few strange areas, everyone else has been noticing, and documenting, how the changing climate is affecting the world. BTW, you maight want to read the article again, “They later connected the lizards’ decline to climate records and studied the effect of rising temperatures on lizard physiology and behavior. For example, cold-blooded lizards can’t forage for food when their bodies get too hot – they must seek shade because they can’t regulate their own temperature. The researchers found that the hours per day when the temperature allowed foraging dropped significantly.”
Having a PhD in herpetology might help here. That way one can accurately gauge how changing temperatures affect cold-blooded animals. Sadly, it’s not as simple as “it’s hot, they should be going faster, durhh, durhh.”
“Second, the key point is that there are many potential factors which may contribute to the decline of any species but you, like these researchers (Sites et al), jumped to the climate change conclusion.”
Right, the Mexican Kid Theory. So where’s the data on that? Or is it the “Manolo Blahnik Great Shoe Extinctions Theory”? Have you collected any data at all? When you have a theory that accurately explains the data, a predictive algorithm, and correlates to known physiologies, you publish. When does the MKT appear in print?
“One can selectively look at all the continents and find examples of birds whose populations have declined for a variety of known reasons other than climate change.
Following your/this logic one would jump to the conclusion that they were all caused by climate change.”
One can make up any sort of fantastical study to prove their point), but that has nothing to do with science, nor logic. Unless you have a link for the one you mentioned. I’m sure with their many millions of dollars most research scientists would be more than happy to put this together for you, as it seems to be a totally relevant arm of science

Quit using weed killers and pesticides at home, then watch as the wildlife shows sudden appreciation of your cleaner enviro.

Related article: http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/sci/tech/8727863.stm
Snakes in mysterious global decline
“Populations shrank even in protected areas, suggesting that the progressive loss of habitat for wild animals being seen all over the world is not the only cause.”
Perhaps we should be bemused as to the decline of Tuna stocks also.

First thing I would look at is the chemicals being dumped into the sinks/waterways of America, and ask questions of the EPA. What do you want to bet that there is a cozy relationship similar to the MMS?

Scott Brim says:
June 8, 2010 at 8:15 am
Didn’t the lizards evolve long ago during periods in earth’s geologic history which were from five to ten degrees Centigrade warmer than today? As is said in the opening paragraph of the Wikipedia article concerning the evolutionary history of reptiles, “The origin of the reptiles lies about 320–310 million years ago, in the steaming swamps of the late Carboniferous period…..”
That was one of the salient points I was trying to make in my rambling, and somewhat disjointed post. Another I would like to make is regarding the live reptile trade, which is not “a few kids selling some lizards to tourists” , but is rather a multimillion dollar business, with a long history of disregarding what regulations there are, which, in many countries is nil. If people are barely surviving, they usually have better things to do than obey laws regarding 6 inch lizards. This quote is from the Humane society website regarding the illegal reptile trade.: http://www.humanesociety.org/issues/exotic_pets/facts/reptile_trade.html
“While many pet reptiles are bred in captivity, many are still taken from the wild or born of wild-caught parents. Each year nearly 2 million live reptiles are imported into the United States, and about 9 million are exported. This poorly regulated trade leaves behind depleted wild populations and damaged habitats. Brute force or gasoline may be used to rouse reptiles from their burrows.
Harsh capture techniques, compounded by poor shipping methods and inadequate care, kill many reptiles before they reach the pet store or dealer. An estimated 90 percent of wild-caught reptiles die in their first year of captivity because of physical trauma prior to purchase or because their owners cannot meet their complex dietary and habitat needs. ”
Now, think about this: how many pet stores are there in your hometown? How many sell reptiles? 80 percent of reptiles caught in the wild die in transit, or while awaiting a commercial broker. 20-45%(according to Live Science.com) of those that make it to a pet store will die of shock, poor treatment, and inadequate facilities. Reptiles in captivity require very intensive care, which varies from species to species. Geckos are nocturnal, and hide from the light that other species require for the production of vitamin e3, a vital supplement. Geckos receive e3 directly from prey. Most species will require a 12 gallon aquarium (minimum for 3 six inch lizards), a full spectrum light, often referred to as “grow and show” ground cover (varies by species, gravel, sand, bark) and must have a varied diet (fence lizards and anoles are insectivores, Iguanas are herbivores, and the bearded dragon is an omnivore) to support good health, and yet, most are sold to unprepared purchasers as “low maintenance” pets.
http://www.animallaw.info/articles/ddusitwr.htm
“Modern reptiles are found upon every continent except Antarctica. However, the ones most frequently seen in the pet trade are mostly from isolated regions of the globe. These regions are typically further characterized by a certain socioeconomic characteristic. Pressure from buyers and pressure upon collectors to procure specimens unfortunately may act in concert with socioeconomic pressures upon the individuals where the reptiles live to provide these animals. Economic Pressures
There is an immense pressure from buyers who desire reptiles as pets. According to TRAFFIC (http://www.traffic.org), the exotic animal trade is second only to the drug trade on a global scale. An old adage of economics dictates that when there is demand, there will be sellers. Moreover, the greater the demand, especially when the supply is limited (either due to resources or legal regulations/ramifications), the more people will take on risks to sell for a profit.
The collection of reptiles, and all wild-caught exotics, does provide much needed income for indigenous people. A native farmer may make a paltry sum in farming, which may be supplemented generously by supplying animals to the foreign marker.
An article appearing in the East African Standard (Nairobi) detailed just how important collecting wild animals may be for poor locals. Hundreds of villagers who were eager to get rich flocked a rural market armed with chameleons they hoped to sell. However, the much awaited buyer failed to arrive leaving villagers unsure what to do with the animals. Many were abandoned at the market. In all, about 3,000 chameleons had been captured and brought to the market. The get-rich frenzy spread through word of mouth and attracted people from considerable distances. The villagers were reacting to some posters claiming a chameleon buyer would come to the market. One woman had trekked for about four kilometers to the market. One octogenarian proved that age was not a deterrent as he managed to take four from his coffee estate. He claimed he would return the animals to his farm if the transaction turned out to be illegal. Amos Kareithi, Hundreds At Chameleon Market That Never Was, The East African Standard (Nairobi) (May 2, 2005).”
My point is this: Do not underestimate the cupidity of the live caught reptile trade. Fence lizards are not very exotic in the U.S., but the primary market for them is elsewhere, Japan and Europe.

Smokey you are very funny.
Speaking of the lizard trade again, a tidy sum to be made from large populations where culture is based on traditional [chinese] medicine (TCM). Wiki has a clear photo of ginseng, gecko and wolfberry:-
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chinese_medicine
and this chap discusses dried lizard: –
http://www.weirdmeat.com/2007/01/lizard-soup.html
TCM may compete with genome research, where Prof Sites is listed Appendix 1, p12 as providing comment:-
http://www.genome.gov/Pages/Research/Sequencing/SeqProposals/GreenAnoleLizardAmericanAlligatorSeq.pdf
The TRAFFIC website provides reports on an extensive trafficking enterprise based in Malaysia.
I imagine that these trades occur where there is poor governance and corruption, cheap labour, large numbers of fauna [or flora] and the capacity to access cheap transport to markets or have very good cost recovery in such an enterprise.