Image from WUWT reader “Boudu”
The Guardian’s George Monbiot suffers (at his own expense) from excessive zeal in trying to disprove a statement by Telegraph Columnist, Christopher Booker, in his post: How to disprove Christopher Booker in 26 seconds
I set the stopwatch running, pasted “National Snow and Ice Data Center” into Google, found the site, clicked on News and Events > Press room > Arctic Sea Ice News and Analysis and discovered that Booker’s claim was nonsense. It took me 26 seconds.
But then a couple of hours later, when commenters on his blog point out Monbiot’s own error in his 26 second rebuttal, he admits he’s “boobed”:
Whoops – looks like I’ve boobed. Sorry folks. As one of the posters on this thread points out, there are in fact two averages in play – 1979-2000 and 1979-2009. It is therefore correct to state that the April 2009 extent exceeds the 1979-2009 average, but not the 1979-2000 average. It remains the case, however, that the data relate to April, not May. Please accept my apologies for my mistake and the confusion it has caused.
He also confused Global and Polar.
Booker’s article said:(underline mine)
“..the world’s polar sea ice is in fact slightly above its average extent for early May since satellite records began in 1979.”
Monbiot’s rebuttal said:
“In other words, Arctic sea ice extent for April is in fact slightly below its average extent since 1979, not slightly above.”
Meanwhile in comments for the Monbiot 26 second rebuttal, some people think the picture of the U.S.S Skate nuclear submarine surfacing at the North Pole in 1959, as reported here. is a fake due to the photo being taken in “twilight”.
One commenter points out the official US Navy record:
Now you are trashing the source of the historical photo of the USS Skate surfacing at the North Pole on 17 March 1959, claiming that such a surfacing could not have occurred on this date.
Check the OFFICIAL U.S. Navy historical archive on site:
http://www.history.navy.mil/wars/datesmar.htm
Click on MARCH.
Scroll down and you will read for March 17:
1959 – USS Skate (SSN-578) surfaces at North Pole
Proof enough for you?
Apparently not.
The problem with that photo is that it was taken in daylight, whereas the Skate surfaced on March 17, before sunrise at the North Pole. That set off a flurry of troofer factoids trying to turn day into night.
I guess some people don’t understand the period of twilight, how much light would be available, and how B&W long exposure photography works.
Indeed, the discussion has become the Twilight Zone.
Discover more from Watts Up With That?
Subscribe to get the latest posts sent to your email.
Good publicity for what Booker said.
Whenever I point out to people that the Arctic ice has largely recovered and that Antarctic Ice has been above average for some time the standard and unsurprised response is that neither politicians nor media are to be trusted.
A number of recent events have destroyed public confidence in what people have been told on every subject.
We are probably pushing on an open door and quite soon voter power will cause a U turn in political attitudes.
hey hey hey heck, March 17th, sun still not properly risen (that darn twilight) and no ice at the North Pole… there must’ve been a lot of heat around that year or the one before…
…anyway I’ve used that pic already for my Arctic bumper sticker design… Anthony I’ll be in touch soon, I’ve done 30 designs. That pic has gotta be correct or else!
At least it’s obvious now who the real “deniers” are. Whether they’ll admit it or not, it’s looking less and less like those who ask questions are the ones with their heads stuck in the dirt.
Off topic question: I would like to offer a guest post. How can this be arranged?
History Erasers work much the same as Pencil Erasers: They both leave telltale smudges.
Twilight in the Arctic and long B&W exposure on March 17th, 4 days before Equinox is highly plausible in the case of the USS Skate photo.
The Navy said it happened, took photos, and the image speaks for itself.
It was a first in an era of “Can Do”.
10 years later we have men walking on the Moon.
We still have “It was faked” conspiracies, and always will.
But in those days, when those events were happening, we had real effort, and real journalists.
Steppin’ into the the ~Twilight Zone~…
How Monbiot proved himself to be a prize ass in 26 seconds!
Is there no end to this man’s obtuse mediocrity?
As with most of this stuff, for ideologues if it doesn’t fit their world view it must be wrong, even if it’s true.
Monbiot should be applauded for admitting his mistake. There are very few in the public eye these days who do the same.
Mike
Revisionism strikes again. If a historical fact doesn’t match your cherished belief – trash it.
What will the ‘troofers’ say about the recorded incidences of the North West Passage being navigable (1903-06 Roald Amundsen) way before ‘global warming’ was supposed to exist? Sheesh.
Not only are the AGWers ignorant about the climate, they’re also ignorant about how to use a camera.
the cryosphere site has not been updated for about ten days. Why not?
REPLY: According to Walt Meier, the server that provides them with raw satellite data is not updating – Anthony
I have just come across this news item on ‘Voice of Russia’. Nothing of this on the BBC, naturally! It rather puts the Catlin Caper in perspective.
http://www.ruvr.ru/main.php?lng=eng&q=44335&cid=219&p=27.04.2009
Russian motorists drive to North Pole
27.04.2009
Russian motorists have reached the North Pole for the first time in an Arctic expedition. The new record has been set by a team of seven Russians. They set out for the Pole from the Severnaya Zemlya archipelago on two experimental Russian-made YEMELYA cars on the 20th of March, covered over 1,100 kilometres on pack ice, and reached the earth’s northern pole on Sunday, the 26th of April. The jubilant team of seasoned travellers is now receiving congratulations from across Russia.
Mr Monbiot also remarked, in the same article, that Mr Booker was in the habit of quoting unsupported figures and that it was perhaps time for the editor of the Telegraph to take him to one side and have a quiet word with him. Perhaps now Mr Monbiot would like to apologise for that personal attack?
rbateman,
“But in those days, when those events were happening, we had real effort, and real journalists.”
Sorry, if you did in depth research on the Vietnam War and how it was reported you would find that your statement does not correlate with reality. You should also check out the reporting on a book called Silent Spring, the issues involved, and how it was reported. Again, little connection.
Back when the US was created we had something called the Yellow Press. Not much difference between then and now.
The biggest difference in reporting then and now is who was doing it and what their agendas were/are.
Please`don’t be too hard on The Guardian, at least it does not appear to censor posts such as sites like Real Climate, where debate is not even considered unless our Gav can shoot someone down?
Shock, horror, awe! The Monobot not only makes one mistake, in fact two, but actually admits to one of them. Well I never!
And we all thought he was an infallible disciple of the Great Goracle himself with the little red bobble on the top: that fount of all wisdom and inventor of t’internet.
Bet it never appears in the Grauniad itself though: not that I read it.
Sorry for the British flavoured jokes.
Kindest Regards
The problem with that photo is that it was taken in daylight, whereas the Skate surfaced on March 17, before sunrise at the North Pole. That set off a flurry of troofer factoids trying to turn day into night.
I’m not a photographer but If you look at the picture, the light source is from behind the sub and directly in front of the photographer. I don’t think you would try this without special equipment. Who ever took the picture was making the most of the scattered light. What would you expect from a crack team of mariners?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:USS_Skate_at_North_Pole_-_0857806.jpg
So was there a nuclear submarine on the grassy noll?
Looks to me like the North Pole is still frozen solid and the temperatures there are back down to around -10C. It has been pretty cloudy and they got a pretty good snowstorm a couple of days ago that covered the camera lens with snow. It did warm up to -1C there for a while, but went back down after the storm passed.
Looking at the picture, I thought there might have been some open water beyond the wind generator but then realized that those were cloud formations above the horizon. Hard to make things out in that low light.
Certainly contemporary films/ books such as ” Ice Station Zebra” show subs in the 60’s punching through the ice at the North Pole. These were the techno thrillers of the day and would be well researched, and I beleive it was common place for Nuc Subs to punch through the ice in this era. Perhaps some of our submariners from the period could comment? And before we trash them the UK Navy took its top recruits into the Submarine programme, and I would Imagine the US was the same. These sailors would be highly trained committed personnel
If there is contention around how light it is in the North Pole around March then there must be plenty of photos, taken since USS Skate, of around the same time. I think the Catlin expedition started on the ice around the end of Feb.
Hey, Crosspatch.
NO FAIR CHEATING…and doing a LIVE OBSERVATION WITH A WEB CAM.
That takes away all the fun of lying.
Gee, the next thing you know you’ll find some RECORDING of a CIA briefing from 2002 of certain congresspeople.
NASTY things these modern electronic devices. Making it harder and harder to use HUMAN RECOUNTING as a “sine qua non” source of information.
(Actually, seriously, very happy several people have found that NP web cam. Keep up the good work group!)
Re: twilight. The farther one gets from the equator, the longer the twilight.