Essay by Eric Worrall
A Canadian in a frozen parking lot trying to coax a bit more range, at 45C below zero (-49F).
I think the store behind the charger is a Mark’s clothing and footwear store, though I couldn’t find the exact location.
If Aircon drains the battery that fast, how long would EV owners last, if an unexpected blizzard dumps a few feet of snow while they are on the open road? The electric vehicle in the photo doesn’t look like it has significant ground clearance or off-road capability. At least with a gasoline or diesel vehicle you can sit idling and stay warm for a long time if you get stuck. In really severe frost conditions, an ICE vehicle can pack a few extra cans of gas in the back to stretch your survival time, in case of emergencies.
I hope the Canadian EV owner survives the winter. But continuing to drive a vehicle which struggles to make a few miles down the road in conditions like that? What would have happened to the EV driver if the charger was not working? Would he have had enough power to make it to the next charger?
Its not difficult to imagine such a scenario rapidly becoming life threatening, if the failed EV charger was remote enough that help wasn’t readily available.
Surely it is time for people who live in such places to throw in the towel on EV ownership. At the very least EV owners should purchase a real automobile, for use when driving conditions are too harsh for EVs.
Update (EW): quelgeek figured out the charging station in the photo at the top of the page appears to be in Vegreville.
https://twitter.com/BigJoeBastardi/status/1746673705990664289/photo/1
Down the street from me in my neighbor hood i saw someone recharging a Jeep…I have no words.
Story tip:
https://edmontonjournal.com/news/local-news/how-did-alberta-wind-up-facing-blackouts-in-the-cold
“there’s never one single factor that puts us into a grid alert — it’s the extreme cold, we’ve had reduced imports and very little wind. And of course, when we get into the peak period from 4-7 p.m., at this time of year, we don’t have any solar power”
Can’t operate wind turbines at the temps Edmonton has been getting, even with wind. The turbine blades become too brittle to operate safely.
BS
Only under rare circumstances of blade icing does the cold weather force utilities to shut a turbine down. Wind turbines can be designed and outfitted to operate in whatever weather conditions they’re expected to see, wherever they’re located.
Yep, they often use grid, (coal or gas), electricity to heat the blades.
Or they have been known to hire helicopters to spray de-icing fluids.
Blades CANNOT operate when covered with ice, and in cold weather this is a regular occurrence, not a rare one.
The helicopter method was tried once or twice and dropped for high costs and danger to pilots and blades.
Blade icing does require blades to be stopped and deiced with other sources of power for up to 90 minutes.
The frequency of use of deicers depends on location and weather conditions.
Texas lived without deicers with np problems for 10 years and even with half their windmills iced up in February 2021, their blackout was due ro a shortage of natural gas production.
There was not much wind at the time so even with windmill deicers in Texas, they still would have had a blackout from th natural gas supply shortage.
The same cause as the February 2011 Texas blackout.
And th Texas very cold weather natural gas supply problem is still not fixed.
Uninformed conservatives still blame the Texas blackouts on frozen windmills
I can not find any data on how many hours a year a windmill in a cold state will be stopped for deicing. I would guess that deicing would never be required for about 9 months a year out of 12 months in almost all states.
I do know cold Minnesota ranks in the top 10 states in the nation for generating energy from wind.
How many wind turbines are there in MN?
Minnesota is home to 2,327 wind turbines that produced enough electricity to power 983,000 homes.
“in cold weather this (blade deicing) is a regular occurrence, not a rare one.”
It would seem odd if cold Minnesota had 2,327 windmills even though they regularly require deicing … as you claim without data. And that is the coldest US state south of Alaska.
Even Alaska has windmills
Wind power in Alaska – Wikipedia
Mr Greene,
Look at Wind BEFORE/DURING/AFTER the February Texas Freeze out
Look at Gas BEFORE/DURING/AFTER the February Texas Freeze out
It’s clear the problem didn’t lay with Gas. The only drain on gas supply was due to extreme cold placing further demand on supplies to maintain heating and electric valve controls requiring nonexistent wind generation to operate.
In other words Unreliable Weather Dependent Renewable Generation (AKA Wind and Solar) coupled with a decimated reliable fossil back-up system (less than 100% capacity) created the Texas situation
Are you able to post anything except these two capital letters?
Sorry to see your dissociative disorder is increasing, I’m told that standing outside naked in minus 30C temperatures for 45 minutes can be an effective alternative to electro-shock therapy.
Have you ever seen photos of rainy day charging at these uncovered Tesla charging stations? You plug it in during the cold rain.
Right, unlike gas stations they don’t have covers over the chargers!
The Teslarati are tough kids.
There is no doubt that very cold weather significantly reduces EV range and increases charging time.
EVs are not a good choice for a very cold climate
It takes longer to charge mainly because the battery case and interior have to be kept warm
Few EV owners use on the road fast chargers much because few EVs are used for long trips.
EVs make no sense if you can’t charge them at home. If this EV ownercannot charge his EV at home, the I have to wonder why he bought one.
This story is a photo followed by speculation and false conclusions by an extremely anti-EV author designed to get gullible conservative readers all excited. Sounds like a typicle Fox News opinion.
FACTS:
The EV is being charged and is being used in extremely cold weather, even extreme for northern Canada. Range claimed by owner is 280km or 174 miles in the cold, when cold not defined.
Hyperbolic FICTION from the author:
“I hope the Canadian EV owner survives the winter. But continuing to drive a vehicle which struggles to make a few miles down the road in conditions like that?”
The owner is obviously surviving -45 C., so he will survive the winter
If a 280km / 174 mile range is “a few miles”, then the author needs his head examined.
This is not journalism.
This is anti-EV propaganda.
EVs have a huge list of problems and disadvantages versus ICE and hybrids. They can easily be criticized without exaggerations and false claims. But not by this author.
Dickie’s comment is also full of pure speculation…
Another huge blast of verbal flatulence from the Don Rickles of WUWT
Mo science
No engineering
No data
No attempt to refute anything I have written
Just insults.
You are a boozer and a loser.
bNasty2000
Irony alert.
I have a Nissan Rogue (Gasoline) 33MPG average 15 gallon tank.
If it’s 90°F outside I can travel 400+ miles on a tank and run the A/C and refill in 6 minutes from E-F
If it’s -10°F outside I can travel 400+ miles on a tank and run the Heat and refill in 6 minutes E-F
My car doesn’t care if it’s cold out or hot out.
My car doesn’t force me to stand in the cold for an hour or more to refill my tank.
My mileage is unaffected by temperature or weather (though chains do limit my speed and mileage to an extent)
I can drive 750 miles in 12 hours with refueling stops and meals
Call me when something better is invented.
My gasoline sneers at your cold.
EVs have a niche. You are a retired couple living in the English or European countryside or in a provincial town where there is minimal public transport (no metro or trolleys) you have a driveway where you can charge, the climate is moderate, your drives are never more than 100 miles in a day and are mainly recreational or for shopping. It should work out fine. Overnight charging won’t be a problem. You will have higher insurance costs, and will have higher purchase costs, and buying used you will have the worries about battery condition. But it should be a reasonable alternative, maybe a better one than a 3 year old ICE car. England or Holland will be an especially suitable environment because the winters are mostly very moderate, eastern Europe with its continental climate a bit less so, but it should still work.
Canada or northern US, depending on a car for work in all weathers? No way. Anyone driving any distance in the Canadian winter needs to pack a good sleeping bag and have a full tank. In a battery driven car with range falling with the temperatures it would be more than foolhardy.
EVs have a niche.
As golf carts
…or milk floats…
Gilded Golf Carts
Hybrids get 40mpg? BFD….Geo Metro was getting 50+ thirty y/a, but the EPA & DOT put it out of business. https://cars.usnews.com/cars-trucks/advice/geo-metro
BTW- since the EPA started regulating ICE exhaust 50 y/a, rates of asthma & COPD have skyrocketed …I’m sure glad they’re here to protect us.
Toyota Prius 2024
Up to 57 city / 56 highway
They used to look like a dorkmobile but they look good these days
Hybrids generally are more efficient than comparable conventional vehicles in city driving, which includes a significant amount of idling. Hybrids use regenerative braking to recover energy typically wasted in braking. Since more braking takes place in stop-and-go traffic, hybrids are most efficient in city driving.
And they have zero advantage in highway driving.
Until you can no longer get gasoline (where the Dems are taking things) then you have just another gilded golf cart with a 40 mile range
The only problem is, the place where regenerative braking is the least effective is stop and go driving.
The slower your car is going, the less effective regenerative brakes are.
I had a 2003 Corolla CE for a couple hundred thousand miles. It was a manual (I’m rural) and it got 40-43mpg routinely. I was riding with a friend in his new mid 2000’s Prius and he was going on about it getting as much as 45mpg yada yada. I pointed out that my basic Corolla got the same, and cost about half his Prius. He went silent for a minute or so, I guess doing the math. We did agree that the Prius was a bigger and nicer car.
Same could be said of early 90’s Toyota pickups. I had a ’91 that we drove 1200 miles on a weekend in search of speed goats in northern Colorado and south-central Wyoming. Sadly the EPA has devised some kind of “foot print” requirement for trucks that has nearly regulated small pickups out of existence.
Is there any equivalent “winter service” or “winterisation” (tyres, engine block heating, anti-freeze) for EVs?
Yep it’s a battery heater and draws power from the battery which compromises range limits and drains the battery faster over time.
Tyres not so much. The added Constant 1000# battery weight causes tyre wear to dramatically increase and reduces their expected life to 1/4 … Replacing about every 20,000 miles 32,000K
Of course the other issue is towing anything which can, depending on weight, reduce mileage from 250-280mi on a full charge to under 90mi especially in hilly areas and even further when towing in the winter
The intrinsic value of my old BMW DIESEL AWD X5 just keeps on keeping on up!
Meanwhile in Dublin, Ireland. After much fanfare by the Green minister Eamon Ryan, to announce electric buses, they are being charged using a diesel generator.
https://www.tiktok.com/@seeingdbl2/video/7324271883854236974
How Irish!
Easy for warm winter California to mandate EV’s.
Not so easy for most of America. Even in places like Texas and my NM severe cold tends to hit a couple of times each winter.
There’s a possibility the current really cold snap in the U.S. will result in many EV owners trading back to either hybrid or ICE vehicles.
I really wonder why hybrids have not taken off, but suspect it has to do with subsidies for EV’s and the administration’s vendetta against fossil fuel use for anything from your auto, your oven, your BBQ and your power plant producing the volts and amps to charge your Tesla.
Oh well, east we still have a vote in the fall to rid us of the ignorant zealots.
Gums sends…
This is happening all over Chicagoland right now, temp at -4F, EV’s will not charge. Hilarious for the virtue signallers, not so virtuous tonight!
Apparently so-
Chicago-area Tesla charging stations lined with dead cars in freezing cold: ‘A bunch of dead robots out here’ (foxbusiness.com)
Salute!
You know, Tesla and others may soon add a small, old-style battery that could get the car a few miles in an emergency or at least power the GPS and smartphone device. Apparently, the old lead acid types will work well below zero (H/T “batteryuniversity”). And of course, the Prius folks are laughing today.
Gums sends…
Story Tip
Looks like it’s not just northern cities from Canada where electric cars are not advisable.
It looks like electric cars don’t work in Chicago either.
https://www.foxbusiness.com/technology/chicago-area-tesla-charging-stations-lined-with-dead-cars-in-freezing-cold-a-bunch-of-dead-robots-out-here