By: Admin – Climate Depot
Testifying before the US House, FERC Commissioner Mark Christie says America’s power grid is facing ‘very dire consequences’ due to the ongoing retirement of coal and natural gas power plants.
US House Committee on Energy and Commerce
Oversight of FERC: Adhering to a Mission of Affordable & Reliable Energy for America
June 13, 2023
FERC Commissioner Christie: “I think we’re heading for potentially very dire consequences, potentially catastrophic consequences in the United States in terms of the reliability of our grid, and I think that the basic reason is that we’re facing a shortfall of power supply. You know the term we use is resource adequacy, but what we’re really talking about is potentially a shortfall in power supply. You have to remember about the grid. The grid has to have power being fed into it every second of every minute of every hour of every day to keep the lights on. You can’t store it up and bring it out the next day. Because of that you have to have a power supply that is feeding into the grid on a continuous basis. We can’t tolerate shortages because shortages mean the lights go out. So what’s going on now and what’s the threat to reliability? In summary, what the threat is is this. We are facing cascading retirements of dispatchable resources, specifically coal and to a lesser extent gas. And, the problem with losing that many dispatchable resources is you’re losing the supply that is going to keep the lights on. The problem is not the addition of wind and solar. The problem is the subtraction of coal and gas and other dispatchable resources which are the ones we need during this transition to keep the lights on. That’s the fundamental problem.”
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Related:
FERC Commissioner Christie: “The one issue I want to focus on today, I think is reliability, and I’m really afraid to say that I think the United States is heading for a very catastrophic situation in terms of reliability — hope it doesn’t happen, but I think were heading for potentially catastrophic consequences. And, the core of the problem is actually very simple. We are retiring dispatchable generating resources at a pace and in an amount that is far too fast and far too great and it is threatening our ability to keep the lights on.”
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“FERC Commissioner Mark Christie”
Sounds authoritative. But FERC commissioners are political appointments, representing parties. Mark Christie of course is a Republican representative, appointed by Trump.
James Hansen? Gavin Schmidt? To name but two.
Trust Nick to ignore the substance of the debate by a purely ad hominem statement completely irrelevant to the need for electricity.
Maybe he was implying that a Trump hire was more likely to tell the truth. 🙂
There is no substance here. No numbers. It’s just opinion. So it is worth knowing whose opinion it is.
And as usual, Nick tries to duck, dodge and weave rather than actually address the topic at hand.
Nick,
it is a valid opinion, you can’t run a grid on renewables without a corresponding amount of dispatchable capacity.
Mr Christie was simply talking about capacity but the loss of these conventional power plants is a loss of inertia (for stability), a loss of reactive power (For voltage stability) and a depletion of short circuit current levels (for transmission line protection effectiveness).
It is basic grid engineering, which politicians in many countries are ignoring. There will come a time when we will suffer a real grid failure that will take days to bring back on line. It is unimaginable to be without power for so long but it seems we are going blindfold into such a situation.
“we will suffer a real grid failure”
Those pushing this agenda should get life in prison when that happens.
You describing “climate science?”
yuh, just an opinion, after all, what would he know, just being on FERC?
Nick, with that statement—which after all is just your opinion—you imply (“no substance . . . no numbers”) that Christie’s testimony may not be truthful. Got any facts to go along with that?
What is the alternative? Commissioners ought to be randomly dragged from the streets into a van and hauled off to a black site for three years?
Recruit lobbyists and insiders from drawing names from a hat? Have Karen in HR sift through résumés prioritizing credentials and pronouns? Outsource it to China? Winner of lottery or poker tournament? Most substantial bribes?
Why is political affiliation so important? Are you suggesting that veracity and integrity are determined by party identity? If so, it seems that you have zero interest in facts and logic and full dependency on ideology, social status and political grift.
Does accurate forecasting of grid status depend only on the metric of supporting Ukraine, BLM and LGBT+ ? If so, we can certainly ditch STEM classes and rely on commissars with credentials in sociology to get our SCIENCE! right.
“we can certainly ditch STEM classes and rely on commissars with credentials in sociology”
Mark Christie is a lawyer.
So is Danly. Point?
Mark Christie isn’t the only one raising concerns about the stability of the U.S. powergrid. Are all the others raising concerns Republcians, too?
Texas is not the only State that faces blackouts because of the failed energy policy of replacing dispatchable generation with unreliable windmills and solar.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/business/2023/05/17/blackout-risk-summer-heat-grid/
I’m going to have to buy myself a propane-powered home generator because of these fool Democrats and their fool CO2 policy.
Nick, the whole climate “crisis” / “renewable” energy topic is nothing but a political put-up job.
That includes you, me and many others here debating the “gotcha” points every other day.
But the difference between you and me is –
I’m not fooled into believing there is any proper science in the AGW conjecture.
I doubt Nick believes it either, however his paycheck depends on the scam continuing for a few more years.
And so is lying inhisteeth as he trousers wads of cash frombigoilandthe koch bros
Notice how Nick doesn’t even attempt to refute what was said, instead he tries to discredit the speaker. Funny how political affiliations only matter when the person speaking disagrees with an alarmist.
That’s what all people on the left who don’t have an answer do: They attack the messenger. As if that’s relevant.
Exactly. The best riposte is to ask, “What has he said which is false?” and watch the Leftist/Alarmist squirm.
The Left always operates on the Politically-correct/Politically-incorrect axis, not the True/False axis.
If Nick ever had any personal integrity, he sold it years ago.
Lawyers under oath testifying before congress only lie when they are republican. You heard it here first direct from Australia.
You forgot the /sarc tag.
Most Democrats believe that.
They also believe lies only matter when it hurts their causes.
Hillary destroying documents under subpoena, no big deal.
Trump not turning over documents until they are subpoena’d, criminal.
oh, so therefore he’s lying, right Nick?
Warnings have now been given by all FERC Commissioners, the head of NERC and most ISOs. The problem is that generation is under State authority. Some even have crazy laws requiring replacing coal and gas with wind and solar. Virginia for example. Most have unworkable policies like that.
Here is a solution:
https://www.cfact.org/2023/02/24/how-ferc-can-protect-the-grid-from-wind-and-solar/
Connection to the grid requires Federal approval. Only allow connection of wind and solar where dispatchable backup can be certified by the responsible utility.
Having more than a certain percentage of weather dependent sources on a grid will make it unstable. Doing away with policies encouraging non-dispatchable sources is the problem.
Yes, adding unreliable windmills and solar to the grid and subtracting reliable coal and natural gas generation from the grid, is the problem.
The real problem is the mass delusion over CO2 being something that needs to be eliminated. The reality is that CO2 is a benign gas, essential for life on Earth, and there is no evidence showing CO2 needs to be regulated or controlled in any way.
We have a winner!
I’m not sure what the House can do about it. Most likely nothing because the Executive has decreed that thermals must be destroyed and the grid collapsed.
Even if Babylon DC had a Come To Jesus moment, how do you manipulate the energy and finance market to invest in something that can be condemned the next election cycle?
Unfortunately, a Constitutional Amendment insuring that investments in thermals will be guaranteed, and I can’t imagine what that language would look like, would be required at this point because we are living in Clown World.
It will be fun to watch ERCOT in TX the next few weeks as a High Pressure dome sits on the middle of the state idling wind mills and sending temperatures over the century mark.
They have been pissing away all kinds of money to not have a repeat of February 2021, but absolutely nothing for every summer in Texas with a massively growing population.
But why Mr. FERC are the coal and gas plants being retired? A shortage of lemonade perhaps?
Since the renewables require 100% backup, the coal, NG plants must remain at 100% dispatchable capacity and need to be replaced as they age, otherwise we will become Germany and Great Britain.
“otherwise we will become Germany and Great Britain.”
I think we are well on the way to getting there. Currently, not only is Texas at risk of blackouts, but half the States in the U.S. are at the same risk. I believe it was stated in one article that reliable power generation has been reduced by 2.5 percent in the States west of the Mississsippi river and this has put those powergrids at risk just like in Texas.
Our national leadership is doing just the opposite of what would fix this problem; adding reliable generation to the grid. Instead, they are making things worse by the day, by adding more unreliable windmills and solar to the grid. All made in China.
This Human-caused Climate Change Hoax is going to destroy Western Civilization if we don’t do something about it soon.
Most likely due to the distortion of the electricity market by government fiat.
“but I think were heading for potentially catastrophic consequences.”
This is from someone who KNOWS we are heading for catastrophic consequences. Not think. Not potentially catastrophic! And not dispatchable resources which are the ones we need “during this transition to keep the lights on”.
Why do even those on the logical side of the issues feel they have to lock themselves up in caveats and genuflections to express concerns to the idiotocracy. I guess they got used to sprinkling trigger words through their university years.
The “transition” is the problem. We don’t need to transition to windmills and solar. Windmills and solar cause problems, they don’t fix problems.
“The “transition” is the problem.”
*************
Agreed Tom. The problem beyond the transition is that no one in power is willing to come out and say that. The political clout of the environmental movement on both sides of the Atlantic makes it hard for those in power to stand up against them. So, they have to play along with the climate alarmist narrative and the wind and solar game plan.
President Brandon is certainly no exception to the political class of environmental appeasers. Everyone in power on the other side of the Atlantic appear to be appeasers as well.
As long as no one in power develops a spine and shows the intestinal fortitude to stand up the eco-movement and the climate alarmist narrative and push back, this “net zero” transition will continue with all its perils, bad science, bad engineering and stupidity.
The road to Hell is paved with good intentions.
Not only is the “transition” the problem, the “transition” is nonexistent.
We cannot “transition” to ‘electricity at the whim of the weather and time of day’ without it becoming a catastrophe, period.
The only actual question is will we get enough people with some actual brains into power in time to avoid the catastrophe or not.
Maybe JB and some of his closest advisers should spend the happy month of December in a rural location somewhere southeast of Dalhart, Texas, instead of hiding in the basement in Delaware.
(1) “The problem is not the addition of wind and solar”.
(2) “The problem is the subtraction of coal and gas and other dispatchable resources which are the ones we need during this transition to keep the lights on. That’s the fundamental problem”.
Statement (2) directly contradicts statement (1).
This so-called ‘transition’ is to have more and more wind and solar to replace those dispatchable resources.
Chris,
no it doesn’t simply because you cannot rely on the installed capacity of renewables of provide much more than zero.
In other words it matters not how much renewable capacity is connected to the grid if there is insufficient dispatchable capacity in times of low renewable output, then you are in trouble, or rather in the dark. Out must always be met by in.
Yes but It sounds like the Regulatory Commissioner is trying to have his cake and eat it, or maybe protect his job.
Why doesn’t he come out and say that the problem is the ‘transition’?
Ian and Chris,
Read my comment at 5:12 AM above in response to Tom Abbott.
It is a real challenge to rational thinking isn’t it. You have a system that works which is being actively destroyed. You are advised the known unreliable intermittent replacement will be the ideal option.
What will it take to shame these energy destroying publicly funded agents to change their policies?
If the Texas Feb 2021 power outages does not convey the message, that intermittent weather dependent energy is dangerous what will?
Meanwhile here in the UK we are having summer weather mid 20s C. Some areas have achieved high 20s C with urban hot spots reaching as much as 30 deg. C . The so called heat wave which is wonderful for the majority is giving issues to the power grid. The installed solar panels don’t like it ‘hot’ and the managers of the system have asked coal powered plant to fire up to save us from power cuts. The height of summer and the solar arrays are failing because they are too hot!! Did I mention the wind hasn’t been blowing here for the past week or so either?
Right now (09:17 AM) on a fine summer day in the UK:
Wind = 13.13% of demand
Solar =13.89% of demand
Nuclear = 12.47% of demand
CCGT = 36.33% of demand
Coal, biomass, interconnects etc all in low single figures. Gas seldom falls below today’s figure, wind and solar seldom do better. If they can’t compete on a day like this, they are a complete waste of money.
https://www.gridwatch.templar.co.uk/
They *are* a complete waste of money. They are even worse then that, they are destructive to the economy and society.
Update at 02:00 PM:
Wind has dropped to 10.7%
Solar has improved to 29.05%! (it is an exceptionally sunny day for the UK)
Nuclear about the same at 11.9%
CCGT turned down to 27.07%
Despite having more than double solar generation, gas has only dropped by about a quarter.
“What will it take to shame these energy destroying publicly funded agents to change their policies?”
It’s probably going to take a lot of people dying before these politicians and the people who elected them, wake up.
The trouble with the Warmistas is that they are “all or nothing”. Supplementing our power generation by adding a measure wind and solar to meet inevitably increasing demand – whilst simultaneously making our natural resources last longer than they otherwise would have – is not good enough for them; no, they want fossil fuels eliminated entirely. That’s the problem with zealots, they’re never satisfied and can never see beyond the end of their own obsessions.
“That’s the problem with zealots, they’re never satisfied and can never see beyond the end of their own obsessions.”
We have a bunch of them on the left side of the political spectrum.
I think radical Leftists all suffer from mental illness. I think you have to be mentally ill to be a radical leftist. So that’s what we are really dealing with: a bunch of people who are unhinged. Unfortunately, these people are currently running our nations. Into the ground.
There will be no transition because it’s impossible … quit talking like it is …
Commissioner Christie nailed it except for ONE thing.
Adding wind and solar to the grid IS ABSOLUTELY “the problem.”
Without those worse-than-useless additions to the grid, the “retirements” of dispatcheable energy plants would not be taking place, or their “replacements” would be alternate dispatcheable energy plants, and the “problem” would be nonexistent.
The mandates, subsidies and tax credits showered upon worse-than-useless wind and solar creates a disincentive to build new dispatcheable energy plants, all of which are being forced to stand in line behind their inferior but mandated “competition.”
So yes, the addition of wind and solar IS THE PROBLEM.
Of course, the MSM will spin any blackouts as another sign of climate change and demand that we accelerate the closure of reliable power plants while building more wind/solar farms. I doubt true believers will ever be convinced that their “solution to the climate crisis” is what is causing the blackouts.
I really hope some MSM journos get stuck in a lift one day when Renewables let the Grid down. I suspect this will cure them of their belief in Wind and Solar.
From the above article:
Well, it’s not like you guys weren’t warned about this about this situation five or more years ago.
Hey, and here’s an idea for you: we’ve known that the US electrical power generation supply and distribution margins were getting pretty thin over that time, so what do our Federal and State
leadersbureaucrats do . . . why, encourage the whole nation to shift over to electric vehicles. Yeah, THAT’s the ticket!You can’t make it any clearer than that. Why are people so stupid?
I think it has more to do with human psychology than with people being stupid. Lot’s of smart people are CO2-phobes, too.
Rather than stupidity, it is more like mass delusion. The system is set up just perfectly for brainwashing people, and lots of people are easily influenced by the powers-that-be. If the powers-that-be are deluded, then the easily influenced will also be deluded.
And then there are those who cynically use the situation for their own selfish purposes.
The end product is the same.
No sh1t, Sherlock?????