Guest essay by Eric Worrall
According to US climate change campaigner Katharine Hayhoe, Greta Thunberg’s attempts to shame people into climate action are counterproductive.
Shaming people into fighting climate change won’t work, says scientist
Climate scientist Katharine Hayhoe says trying to inspire people is more effective
CBC Radio · Posted: Aug 19, 2019 9:30 AM ET | Last Updated: 4 hours ago
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Climate scientist Katharine Hayhoe says strategies that aim to shame aren’t effective.
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Hi Greta, I’ve just booked some long haul flights for my family to enjoy some winter sun on the beach this Christmas.
— Julia Hartley-Brewer (@JuliaHB1) August 14, 2019
Level of guilt being felt: 0% pic.twitter.com/BVE3JyiNgiHayhoe recalls being told by a fellow climate activist that “every time you turn on your car, you’re sinning.“
“My visceral reaction to somebody saying that to me was: ‘Oh, so when I take my child to the doctor, you’re saying I’m sinning? When I go to work to support my family, I’m sinning?'”
She told Galloway “that shaming made me want to just go out and find a Hummer and drive circles around that person.“
…
I can understand Katharine Hayhoe lashing out – when is the last time Katharine was invited to speak to the European Union or French or British Parliaments?
But Katharine’s impatience with this new climate hero upstart in my opinion has led her to make a classic strategic error.
Update (EW): Katharine seems a bit unhappy at this post:
The following is a screenshot of the title of the CBC article:
Archive of the CBC article available here:
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Katharine Hayhoe should talk, given all the nonsense she has spewed. I’ll take Lil Greta any day. She doesn’t much know what is really going, but at least she puts her money where her mouth is. All of those so called climate scientists should take a slow boat to Chile.
Don’t you really mean “but at least she puts somebody else’s money where her mouth is.” I can’t see her paying for her luxury transatlantic cruise out of her own (or her parents’) pocket.
Well, Greta probably doesn’t have any money and it is all a stunt anyway. This isn’t about money but about optics. It is all absurdity and farce now, although the message we skeptics should be stating is that all the other scientists and celebrities going to the Chile shindig are hypocrites compared to Greta, telling the rest of the world to lay off the carbon, while they indulge themselves up to their eyeballs in their scientific malfeasance. That is the split between Greta’s message of her supposed purity and their hypocrisy. She really believes it, but I don’t think we can hold her responsible given the manipulation all her short life by her parents.
Just listening to Hayhoe bellyache is music to my ears. Both sides are bizarre and it looks like a small wedge forming between the idealists and the crooked likes of Big Klimate. We should give it a push.
There are many reports that Greta’s parents are making a fortune off of their child. Her mother’s first book publication about impending doom was tied to Greta’s first major appearance. I suspect they have plenty of money but they will make more if Greta toes the line and behaves as the sacrificial lamb.
I prefer to think of them as child abusers rather than parents. Think of the psychological problems that Greta will face when, inevitably, her whole world comes tumbling down and she realizes that she has made a fool of herself in front of millions of people.
She already has psychological problems, which her mother pointed out in a book. Greta has gone weeks without eating (does she look 16?) at times as a result of problems attendant with being on the autism spectrum; her younger sister has similar troubles. Her focus on climate is typical of the kind of single-mindedness these children can develop; unfortunately for the world, Greta didn’t memorize train timetables instead.
Using her to fight “climate change” is like using a child born without legs to collect money from passersby.
we can all manage sustainable travel provided we can :
Borrow a rich man’s toy at no cost
Which has a carbon footprint from construction that makes a brontosaurus track look like a chihuahua’s
endure accommodation and rations that would disgrace an 18th century blackbirder
accept that as a consequence more people will use air travel than if you had flown yourself
don’t mind a ride quality similar to a rapid transit over rough terrain in an AFV
can afford a 4 weeks travel time extension to the trip.
Are willing to accept a high level of personal risk, not to deliver a vaccine or search for the cure to cancer, but to attend a talking shop that won’t decide anything.
You hit the proverbial nail on the head, great post.
And don’t have to count other people’s “carbon expenditures” in making it happen. (Otherwise it’s far from “sustainable”)
We too did 11,000 km with our 2007 A4 Audi diesel in 3 weeks visiting cold and very wet Ireland, Scotland, Wales and England. Even Calais was cold and wet and we could not dry the tent before we were home in Barcelona.
The good professor thinks scary drought scenarios are more inspiring than end-of-times carbon-cult religion. Too bad nature has already rained on (or flooded) her parade!
Which one has the most climate science credibility?
Hayhoe is a Professor of Political Science at Texas Tech [!] who learned her communication skills from her Evangelical preacher husband.
Greta is an uneducated 16 year old with psychological difficulties who has a zombie stare.
Tough decision.
What an ugly comment about a young person, actually any person who appears different . Education is a virtue only if it removes ignorance and increases curiosity about things that appear strange and inexplicable. I will always be more impressed by people who behave in an ‘educated’ way rather than by the string of abbreviations they put after their names.
Part and parcel of being a teen-ager is to call sophomoric BS on the obvious hypocrisy of grown-ups, who need to live in the real world in order to support their families.
But that doesn’t excuse Heyhoe, who, like all her fellow alarmists, want the hoi poloi deplrables to revert to the 17th century, while they, thanks to their sanctimonious wokeness, enjoy dispensations to behave as 21st century saviors of humanity (whose numbers they want to reduce by an order of magnitude).
As a minor, Greta can’t be blamed for advocating mass genocide. Hayhoe, not so much.
My niece was diagnosed with aspergers, she can be infuriating to deal with because of her bluntness and unconcern about others feelings, but I’ve managed to become the best in the family at persuading her because of a couple factors.
What seems to work with her is to present her with facts, don’t let her get you mad, and don’t try emotional or authoritarian appeals. People with aspergers are accustomed to angry disputes with others, and are likely to have been badly treated by those they see as dumb, emotional – hostility and bullying from other teens.
That’s my observation of my niece – results may vary. It seems like she is very appreciative of being reasoned with, and given credit for smarts – which is often the case with aspergers types because of their ability to hyperfocus and use reasoning skills surprising in a teen girl. They are said to have a hard time learning social rules – but those are vague, subjective, contextual – so when they are presented with logical rules for reasoning and debating they are likely to take a great interest? (till they learn that most people actually think emotionally)?
Somebody with a clear, concise explanation could turn her against the bullying, lying and emotional appeals that are the usual tactics of leftists could well turn her against the Commisars that are putting her into a terribly adversarial position and adding a big load of hostile interactions to the emotional problems a young woman with socialization deficits is likely to have. I’m very upset to think of the load they are dumping on her. She can probably handle angry debate, but she surely doesn’t need more emotional trauma.
TLDR
Be nice to her, reason with her like an adult or maybe a lawyer, give her something to think about other than appeals to authority and emotional threats to her social life. She’s probably smart enough to tell the difference between that and the leftist tactics she’s surely gotten from her “friends”.
? appoint a debate champ, who speaks her native tongue?
What I mean by “clear, concise explanation” is to give an overview of factors like absorption spectra, positive feedback, and point out that temperatures rapidly decrease where there is little H2O vapor and only CO2 to stop heat from radiating to space rapidly (deserts, arctic, airliner height, low humidity nights). And mention that convection is a huge factor in heat transfer to the upper air(70% ) and a big negative feedback .
Smart, educated people have a drawback explaining things to ignorant people – this is a teen girl. The general public is given obfuscating, emotional arguments from the warmists and skeptics may well be talking over their heads, and well beyond their interest in learning about it. Stick to the stuff that ??
So …. IOW …. Greta is just a product of her lunatic parents, who have probably prevented her from being exposed to fact and truth.
More evidence they are engaged in child abuse, not parenting.
Yes, but it’s not just her that has been terribly mal -educated on the topic. The warmists are abusing the whole world with their BS, and actual scientists are perhaps reluctant to yell BS! about a field they don’t specialize in, are hampered in their ability to reach the general public because of biased media, and the discussion at sites like this may be too educated for most people to learn from.
Something simple and persuasive, that can be yelled at a rally and is hard to unhear without provoking a bit of thought. I dunno, maybe: “hot air rises, and it’s cold as hell up there w/o water vapor” – this uses a couple facts that most anybody likely knows, and introduces the idea that water vapor is the cause of most greenhouse effect – a fact obfuscated by warmists.
a haiku?
– hot air rises high
-it is cold as hell up there
– because no H2O
Apart from the fact that little Greta claims to be able to see CO2. That puts her firmly in the stark raving mad category. She needs professional help, not more airtime.
On point. The Climateers want me dead. They want a lot of people dead. They have a long list, and keep adding to it, every day. But that’s leftists and left-ism for ya – a giant death cult. Anyone with two working brain cells can predict what will happen if the Climateers get their way. But few ever call them out on it.
(snipped. Mod.) do you really think her lifetime of study and achievement is complete (snipped. mod)? You must be crazy. Go read the stuff she’s done and tell me honestly that you think it’s false.
I would leave a longer reply, but I’d feel too guilty about the cost of electricity to keep my computer on any longer.
Off to eat some sprouts now and light the candles.
Shame! Shaaaame!
Light the candleS? You must make do with one candle Repent, sinner, and say 25 Hail Gretas for your penance.
Don’t let your methane emissions near the candle, Robert.
Good way to ease him into the next phase of collecting his farts in a plastic bag to heat and cook with.
Stop !!!
Most candles are made from fossil fuels. You are adding to the problem.
Try catching fireflies in a jar. 100% natural.
Nope. Where do glass jars and metal lids come from? THINK, man!
Except for the jar
SINNER! Catching fireflies against their will is upsetting the natural balance!
You can argue someone into a corner with facts and logic. Even so, people realize when things aren’t fair even when they don’t have the words to prevail in an argument. That’s why the forgotten people elected President Trump, and lied about their intentions on the polls.
You can shame people into submission but eventually you’ll get your comeuppance.
I don’t think it’s got anything to do with lying. If you’re the kind of person who is obsessed with listening to the fake news, then you’re the kind of person who is really easy for the pollsters to contact. So, polls overwhelmingly represent the people who listen to fake news and those people are indoctrinated to be anti-Trump (or anti-Brexit in the UK).
The polls are not diagnostic or predictive. They’re intended to discourage conservative voters from showing up and to determine how many illegal aliens must be transported to vote.
Why do you call Trump voters the “forgotten people”? There were many somewhat liberal people who simply hated Hillary Clinton and would never vote for her. My brother and his wife both voted for Obama and then Trump. As for the majority of Trump voters, they would have voted for whoever the Republican candidate was. Trump just energized some followers and puts on a good show, he is not another Hitler like the Democrats would like you to believe.
See the online discussion of why Trump won by Victor David Hanson. It explains who the forgotten are.
Thanks. He points out that 85% of geographical America voted for Trump and a mere 15% voted for Ms. Clinton. That has to be a problem.
Indeed. It could well be that our beloved Greta doesn’t have the intellectual capacity to be a hypocrite. You go girl!
If you read the linked article, you may become ‘woke’, just not the way the SJWs define the term.
Crispin in Waterloo,
“See the online discussion of why Trump won by Victor David Hanson. It explains who the forgotten are.”
Seems you2 remember Peterloo:
https://www.google.com/search?q=peterloo+massacre&oq=peterloo+massaker&aqs=chrome.
Did not think I would ever agree with Katherine on anything. Changed my mind.
If Hayhoe were a witch, I bet she wouldn’t fly her broom because first class with the mortals is much nicer.
Maybe Hayhoe needs pigtails to keep her younger sister from getting the spotlight and all the action!
It’s an adventure.
It’s just the left eating their own, look the other way and hurry by.
Naw, pop up some popcorn and pull up a lawn chair.
And do not forget to wish them ‘bon apetit’.
Although Greta is a joke IMO, her enablers, enablers who want my electric bills to double or triple, and gas pump prices to triple so they can acquire more political power and money in their hedge funds and “green” renewable energy investments, are NOT a joke.
Greta’s enablers are to be taken seriously for their planning-execution of a propaganda campaign to destroy Western free-market capitalist society and the large middle class that has produced.
True believers respond to messages of shame, and shame seems to be a powerful feature of the social landscape of Scandinavian countries, judging from my personal experience spending time with Scandinavians.
But Katharine is right that many Westerners outside Scandinavia find shame campaigns insulting and offensive.
Shame does not not work on Socialists however Eric. It is a one-sided assault.
Shame for socialists does not exist, those think they are correct in dictating to others the behaviors they should conform to. Obama, DeBlasio, Bloomberg, all are shameless hypocrites who tell others how to behave without applying that normative behavior to themselves.
Think Orwell’s “1984.” Only instead of a giant head of a mustached Big Brother staring down at you plastered on every wall, it’s a giant head of a pigtailed Big Greta. Goebbels would say “Absolutely brilliant.”
…and yet….at the same time thinks making things up and flat out lying is the way to go
I tried to get Katharine Hayhoe to make a short stop to visit with us when she was in California in her travels from LA to SF. Atascadero is smack dab in the center. Our nearest city is SLO and they have an airport.
I really believed that she was all about reducing CO2 emissions, and her being worried that the USA was falling behind at doing their part. We were in contact with her and her people and we informed her that we wanted to share our Affordable Carbon Capture Utilization System with her. https://youtu.be/RQRQ7S92_lo
She didn’t have time, and she never called back to reschedule anything. My question to her is “Is Climate Change Really Important To You?” or does it pay you well to travel and speak about climate change.
Sid Abma
(805) 462-1250
http://www.SidelGlobal.com
Well, whaddya know. I actually agree with Katharine Hayhoe about something climate-related. That’s a first!
“We were in contact with her and her people”
Katherine has people? How many? How much money do they get paid? Who pays them? Just curious.
Do all high-profile alarmists have people?
Do all high profile alarmists have people?
We call them minions where I come from. The minions just don’t realise their social position…yet.
Funny, all the talk about reducing emissions, the Paris Accord etc., but guess who is the only developed, major country to have actually cut emissions?
U.S. Cuts ‘Global Warming’ Gases Faster Than Anyone Else, But Media Ignore It
https://www.investors.com/politics/editorials/u-s-cuts-global-warming-gases-faster-than-anyone-else-but-media-ignore-it/ via @IBDeditorials
Hmm… the CAGW Propagandist attacking the CAGW Messiah. This could be interesting.
I’m reminded of Trotsky and Stalin…
I admire Greta Thunberg for her dedication but it would help if she actually knew what she was talking about.
She needs to gather all of the facts rather than go all “AOC” on people. Not to worried, she will grow up eventually.
Yeah, but she does not go to school.
How many people do you know who are well informed after dropping out of school prior to the age of 16?
Maybe seeing 1100 ppm of CO2 in the classroom air gave her panic attacks.
AGE is a religion and religions just love schisms _ think Sunni vs Shia or Protestant vs Catholic So we should do all we can to foster schisms in the church of Green Nuclear vs non nuclear Greta vs Kate Ball is in Greta’s court Time to cast out the apostate Greta. Go for it girl
I welcome further ammo for sowing dissent in th ranks of the faithful suggestions please?
Hey Katharine, if you are reading this; you can rest easy. Greta has not shamed me into taking any action to fight climate change!
Bob,
Did the GSA seek the opinion of its members prior to taking a AGW stance
The GeolSoc of London takes a similar stance but did not seek the opinion of its members before joining the crusade
“Hey Katharine, if you are reading this; you can rest easy. Greta has not shamed me into taking any action to fight climate change!”
I think Katherine might be the one feeling shame. After all, she is the one complaining about it.
I first heard of Hayhoe when she was interviewed on Canadian Broadcasting Corporation radio one Sunday afternoon in March a few years ago. She turns out to be one of the CBC’s regular go-to climate authorities—the distinction between a climate modeler and a climatologist being irrelevant—but she certainly has the communication skills to deliver exactly what they want to hear. Anyway, Hayhoe was recounting, much to the (conspiratorial) amusement of her host, how she had given an invited talk to the West Texas Geological Society, and painted a picture of an audience of grumpy, spluttering old men who needed to get into the 21st century in terms of climate change and by implication accepting women in science and technology. She told them a thing or two, by golly, that sort of thing, all of which was eagerly lapped up by the host. It was most ungracious to say the least, since she was their guest after all, and collectively there were centuries of advanced education and experience in the audience, even though it is just geology, not terribly scientific you know. Some were undoubtedly churchgoers, just like she is, so doubly disrespectful. Fortunately, the WTGS seems to be thriving regardless, oil and gas continues to be discovered, and one good thing about the radio is that most of the time things go in one ear and out the other. Hayhoe is an invited lunchtime speaker at the Geological Society of America annual meeting next month. Maybe she will stick around and discover a few things about the geological record of climate change, although my hopes are not high.
She thinks talking to skeptics is like playing Whack-A-Mole. She thinks she has them argued into a corner and they just bring up something else. That’s the joy of the skeptic position, there’s so much evidence and so many lines of reasoning. If it weren’t for its political utility, CAGW should have been dead and buried a long time ago.
I would have broken this large paragraph into at least 3 or 4 paragraphs.
I got half way through and quit.
Sorry Brian, , , ,
JPP
“According to US climate change campaigner Katharine Hayhoe, Greta Thunberg’s attempts to shame people into climate action are counterproductive.”
Because she has been so successful… LOL.
Is the fallout from such things as
https://wattsupwiththat.com/2019/08/17/the-nature-communications-hate-list-a-fast-moving-story/
Who is handling this young person?
Her parents should be ashamed of themselves for letting their daughter be the poster child for this propaganda campaign.
Are her parents getting paid for their daughter’s participation in this show. I hope they are accompanying her on this trip across the Atlantic during hurricane season.
I don’t care how much money anybody could throw at me or my daughter, this would never happen in my family.
This Quillette article from April may give you some insight into the parental motives: […] The book Scenes from the Heart (“Scener från Hjärtat,” 2018) recounts these medical difficulties and the events that led to Greta Thunberg’s now-famous “school strike for climate,” in which hundreds of thousands of children have refused to attend school to protest about government inaction over climate change. Greta herself strikes every Friday and spent three weeks sitting outside the Swedish Parliament at the beginning of the school year. Written by her family—mother, father, Beata and Greta—the story is told in the voice of Greta’s mother, the opera soprano Malena Ernman, who was a celebrity in Europe long before her daughter’s fame. Although the book is only available in Swedish for the time being, it is already being translated into numerous languages—a development that reflects the global fascination with Thunberg’s campaignhttps://quillette.com/2019/04/23/self-harm-versus-the-greater-good-greta-thunberg-and-child-activism. […] /?fbclid=IwAR02mGGHFxeW131IUpb1UMzbXV-l2_iifq9mv7flJmjxdGkVbZdSJTdjekM
From history, we read of the Catholic Church seeking “indulgences” to absolve sinners of sin for a fee. This is exactly what we are seeing now- a sin tax that is actually a scam to extract easy money. The virtue signalling and subsidising all but useless renewable power is a modern day example of this age old theme.
The Vatican became extremely rich and powerful on the back of the indulgences scam. The UN is now becoming rich and powerful on the back of their cAGW scam.
How convenient that the UN is the organisation that both promotes the notion of cAGW/ “climate change” at the same time as raking in hundreds of billions a year to “combat” “climate change”, which is their invention. And to think it is so serious we are not even allowed to debate the issue-the science is settled and you will be shamed and lose your job if you dare question the narrative.
How much like dung beetles have humans become. Only a dung beetle should be swallowing so much BS. What is even more absurd is that humans chase down the buckets of BS with Kool aid.
The analogy would be lord who in order to absolve himself of the sins of raping and pillaging …. goes out to rape and pillage to pay the indulgences.
For all we are doing by pushing “Green economics” is giving an almighty boost to fossil fuel consumption to build all the Green rubbish which because the green rubbish hardly reduces fossil fuel usage at all, the whole scam is just increasing fossil fuel use (albeit mainly in China).
There’s a little background in an article in the Americanthinker:
https://www.americanthinker.com/blog/2019/08/swedish_child_climate_activist_reportedly_a_tool_of_big_green_corporate_energy_interests.html
Just like AOC she’s just an invention of elites.
Someone send Keyhoe one of these stickers
(SNIPPED. Mod)
All i’m hearing from Hayhoe is naked jealousy,she has been upstaged by the Child Crusader and is losing the spotlight.
Even CBC ignores her as the fawn over St Greta .
Hayhoe has lost her position as victim and virtue signaller of the week.
And to top it off,Greta of the 100 yard zombie stare is still cuter than Climate Nag and scold Hayhoe,hayhoe.
Nail hit well and truly on the head…older sister not pleased
Gosh darn it! Elton balanced the carbon footprint by paying the tax, or something, on behalf of the Royals private jet trips! They really needed to get away from their stressful lives!
Oops, sorry. Wrong article.
Brian Pratt
Your post includes that Hayhoe will be a speaker at a Geological Society of America luncheon.
The society believes in man-caused global warming.
Check out their website.