NBC News: The Climate Campaign Against Meat is Distracting Attention From the Campaign Against Fossil Fuels

Car: By Sicnag1950 Ford Custom Coupe, CC BY 2.0, Link. Steak: By Maggie Osterberg – Transferred from en.wikipedia to Commons., CC BY-SA 2.5, Link

Guest essay by Eric Worrall

Climate campaigners are worried that greens who go vegetarian to save the planet think they have done their bit.

Can vegetarians save the planet? Why campaigns to ban meat send the wrong message on climate change

Now more then ever, it’s vital that we continue holding transportation’s feet to the fire.
by Erin Biba / Aug.06.2018 / 3:34 PM ET

WeWork, the co-working mega-giant, recently instituted a new policy at its office spaces across the world: No more meat.

Amid some backlash, the company said the decision was an attempt to reduce its carbon footprint and overall impact on the environment. And while this is a truly noble mission, if you take a deep dive into the science of climate and carbon emissions, the policy starts to look half-baked. For one thing, it perpetuates a ubiquitous myth in climate change messaging that individual decisions are more important than the actions of industry.

Worst of all, the growing campaign against meat is shifting the focus away from the world’s worst carbon emitter — the fossil fuel industry. (One popular Netflix documentary in particular has gotten a lot of attention, despite its egregious factual errors.) Caring about the planet — and trying to do something about it — is a noble cause. But with the stakes as high as they are, accuracy in messaging is important. Indeed, the Trump administration just announced it is still planning on rolling back the fuel economy mandate set by the Obama administration. Now more then ever, it’s vital that we not turn away from holding transportation’s feet to the fire.

But according to renowned climate scientist Michael E. Mann, who has worked on the United Nations’ Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change’s (IPCC) Assessment Report — the report that gives a status report on the global climate — the way WeWork has framed its message is misleading. “It let’s fossil fuels off the hook. It’s implicitly accepting the notion that climate solutions are voluntary measures,” Mann told me. “They’re important. But it’s really frustrating to me when they say eating less meat. When it’s framed as if influencing the political process isn’t part of the constellation.”

Read more: https://www.nbcnews.com/think/amp/ncna896811

Normally it is entertaining to watch climate advocates squabble over which misery to inflict on us first, but the compromise solution in this case will most likely be to try to restrict private use of gasoline powered automobiles AND restrict meat consumption.

Naturally important people like our climate heroes will be excused from any restrictions imposed on ordinary people, their tireless efforts to save the world more than justifies their large personal carbon footprints.

Climategate 2 email 3980.txt (Michael Mann speaking)

Looking forward to seeing you in Tahiti, we can enjoy some nice tropical drinks w/ umbrellas in them.

where are you planning on staying by the way? I haven’t decided yet. The cheap options sound way to spartan to me, but the nicer options are so expensive!…

Climategate 2 email 3980.txt (Phil Jones replying)

…As I’ve booked the flights on frequent flyer miles, I’m wondering if I can convince myself (my grant) that I can justify the hotel…

Source: Wikileaks

0 0 votes
Article Rating
Newest Most Voted
Inline Feedbacks
View all comments
August 7, 2018 5:11 am

1950 Ford Custom Coupe — COOL!

steve case
Reply to  beng135
August 7, 2018 7:38 am

I learned to drive on one – well OK it was a four door but it was black AND had a sun visor.

Reply to  steve case
August 7, 2018 9:14 am

yes but can anyone identify that juicey looking cut of MEAT ?

“if you take a deep dive into the science of climate and carbon emissions, the policy starts to look half-baked. ”

if you dive into the science of climate , everything starts to look half-baked. Including the planet. 😉

Bryan A
Reply to  Greg
August 7, 2018 12:12 pm

I had a 51 Ford Custom Deluxe Business Coupe as my second car (first was a 72 Ford Pinto) Liked the ’51 though no back seat just a flat bed. The juicy meat is a 1″ thick New Your Steak

Reply to  beng135
August 7, 2018 4:39 pm

I don’t think so. It looks like a Studebaker to me.

August 7, 2018 5:17 am

Vegetarians scare me. They are out of contact with the reality that humans are apex omnivorous predators and probably refuse to acknowledge that our cousins, the chimpanzee tribes, kill and cannibalize each other.

It’s a shame that they are afflicted with such a narrow view. It is, however, their choice, but inflicting it on others – trying to force the rest of us to follow – is just not nice. They aren’t forced to eat meat, are they? It would be nice if they’d just mind their own business, but it appears that this is the Age of The Nosy Busybody.

Gee, now I want a thick, juicy steak with really crispy fries and a green salad with an oil & lemon juice vinaigrette. And for afters, cheesecake with a scoop of REAL chocolate ice cream.

Reply to  Sara
August 7, 2018 6:00 am

SARA : You say “Vegetarians scare me .”
Sounds as though you can “scare up” a decent meal when you choose !
HINT : Skip the dessert ! Then you can ENJOY more of the vegetarian !!

Reply to  Trevor
August 7, 2018 6:36 am

precisely, I mostly eat vegetarians. Carnivores are a bit too gamey for my tastes.

Bryan A
Reply to  Karlos51
August 7, 2018 12:14 pm

Sure beats a Wish Sandwich

Reply to  Trevor
August 7, 2018 8:14 am

I like vegetarians, but I can’t eat a whole one.

Reply to  WXcycles
August 7, 2018 9:19 am

Really? There not much meat on them. more like spare rib than a decent steak.

– trying to force the rest of us to follow –

Na, most of them are pussies who have no strength and smoke pot. If push come to shove they won’t be doing much pushing.

Bryan A
Reply to  Greg
August 7, 2018 2:07 pm

Steers are Vegan and certainly fit the bill

Joel Snider
Reply to  Trevor
August 7, 2018 12:11 pm

The thing is, most of them are urbanites who – while they encourage the conservation (and even introduction) of large carnivores – wolves, cougar, grizzlies – and crocodiles and white sharks where available – they tend not to be at risk of actually becoming a meal for one of them.

Crispin in Waterloo
Reply to  Joel Snider
August 7, 2018 5:59 pm

Shark meat is surprisingly tough. Crocodile has the texture of chicken but smells like fish.

Reply to  Trevor
August 7, 2018 4:41 pm

Trevor, you NEVER, NEVER, NEVER skip dessert.

Well, really, you don’t skip dessert unless it’s 1:30AM your time and you’re at a roadside diner because there’s a snowstorm that has bogged down the highway until the county can plow it out (and kudos to those guys, because they are on call 24 hours a day) . And at this roadside diner, you’re faced with a waitress named Pearl whose idea of dessert is a slice of pumpkin pie from the bakery case, with a crust so thick and hard that you could use it for a doorstop after you empty the canned whipped cream and canned pumpkin filling out of it.

That is when you skip dessert.

Reply to  Sara
August 7, 2018 5:57 pm


Then call your mom, and tell her, “MOM, I’M SPOILING MY MEAL!”

J Mac
Reply to  Trevor
August 7, 2018 7:19 pm

Life is uncertain. Eat dessert first!

Reply to  Sara
August 7, 2018 7:51 am

Walk away from the computer, and in real life how many people you know are literally getting in your grill about your eating meat? Riiight. Thought so!

An amazing amount of mental noise these days is the product of social media, and barely even exists in the real world.

Reply to  Goldrider
August 7, 2018 10:22 am

Goldrider, don’t know where you live but I am in a university (two) and government town. Vegetarianism and now pure veganism is alive and well and gets thrown in our faces regularly. Sure it is all over social media but large sections of our grocery stores have vegetarian sections and offer far more vegetarian foods than they did twenty years ago. Worse is the anti-gluten mythology.

Reply to  Edwin
August 7, 2018 3:04 pm

Here, too–I live in a bastion of deep blue progressiveland, where virtue-signalling is the national sport. And while those choices certainly have proliferated in the supermarkets of “trendy” districts, I haven’t had MY choices restricted yet. No market staff are buttonholing me and trying to direct my choices or propagandize. I could do without them hitting on every customer for dubious “charity” donations, though!

Bill Powers
Reply to  Goldrider
August 7, 2018 10:38 am

2 out of every 100 people you encounter and they tend to be vocal virtue signalling about how much better they are than meat eaters. Interesting breakdown most are left leaning liberal women.

Joel Snider
Reply to  Bill Powers
August 7, 2018 12:52 pm

I was standing behind a woman in a Costco – I’d just bought two large roasts on sale, and she had a carrier-basket full of carrots, lettuce – generally rabbit food.

Unable to let it go, she made a comment on how much meat I was buying – I played along (still stuck in line, remember), indicating her own groceries, and said, “yeah, I kind of went the other way’.

This was apparently interpreted as an invitation – she started rattling off all the benefits of veggies (while I’m still stuck, remember) and all the ills (both physical and environmental) of eating meat, THEN – after I paid – she FOLLOWED ME OUT OF THE STORE – still going on.

Finally, starting to get impatient, I simply turned and said, ‘Look – I burn a lot of calories in a week – that’s what happens when you work for a living.”

Got in my fossil-fuel burning car and drove off.

Reply to  Joel Snider
August 7, 2018 3:06 pm

I would have greatly enjoyed telling her to go pound sand.

Joel Snider
Reply to  Goldrider
August 7, 2018 4:11 pm

I was trying to be nice.

Reply to  Bill Powers
August 7, 2018 4:48 pm

Are any of those “virtuous” vegan wimmins aware that continuous consumption of phytoestrogens may contribute to cancers of various kinds????

Reply to  Sara
August 7, 2018 6:27 pm

And the WHO itself classifies at least one form of the birth control pill as being a Class 1 carcinogen.

Joel Snider
Reply to  Sara
August 8, 2018 8:13 am

There you go – assuming awareness.

Reply to  Goldrider
August 7, 2018 2:52 pm

Hmm, I hear it a fair bit. Mentioning my SIBO I attempt to suggest it’s not a viable option..

“Have you tried (insert vegetable of the week) ?” no, I cannot eat carbohydrates or fiber.
“What about potatoes ?” no that’s carbs and fiber.
“OK, what about carrots?” Do you even know what carbohydrates and fiber are? No, I cannot eat those things. “have you tried (something else) I am sure THAT would help.”

Oh for the love of god, did you do biology in school, do you know how a gut works, have you any clue what happens in side you? Not everyone is capable of digesting things you may be able to digest. wood is ‘fiber’ – we can’t digest it but cows can, just as melamine is a protein that cows can use but is toxic to us. Uncooked egg whit protein is not a protein we can use, but cooked it is – please, learn some biochem and how stuff works.. some of us are lucky and can choose what we eat, some of us are not so blessed and have limited diets. I have a cousin for whom almost all proteins are toxic -I fully understand how dangerous her life could be if she’s careless, please – this is not a just universe and sometimes shitty things happen to people for no reason. Now I love you can eat vegetables, they are my favourite food, I desperately crave celery – but I cannot eat it without suffering severe complications and doing myself harm.. got it?

“what about pears, do they have fiber in them?” (/facepalm)

Reply to  Karlos51
August 7, 2018 6:31 pm

Some groups in sub-Saharan Africa apparently have a partial ability to digest cellulose, due to differences in the makeup of their gut bacteria.

Reply to  drednicolson
August 7, 2018 6:56 pm

I read about that only recently, lucky buggers..

Reply to  Goldrider
August 7, 2018 3:29 pm

Every insane thing the Democrats are currently pushing started out as a wacky idea pushed by a few fringe nut cases.

Joel Snider
Reply to  MarkW
August 7, 2018 4:12 pm

That’s what scares me – there doesn’t seem to be any common sense boundaries.

Reply to  Goldrider
August 7, 2018 6:05 pm

My normal reaction to these virtue signalers is to ask, with mock sincerely:
“Well, if you are going vegetarian and all, can I eat your share of the meat?”

I explain further, looking very earnest with the puppy eyes, like they do when they’re talking about slaughtering innocent celery and asparagus:
“I’m a meatetarian – it’s like, a life choice?”

Reply to  Sara
August 7, 2018 8:12 am

Ya got my vote.

J Mac
Reply to  Sara
August 7, 2018 9:06 am

The hemp robed, B12 deficient vegans can try to pry my last smoke roasted medium rare prime rib from my cold, dead ancient fingers. They will fail…..

John Endicott
Reply to  Sara
August 7, 2018 9:31 am

Vegetarians aren’t scary. They mostly live and let live. Vegans on the other hand aren’t content to choose for themselves whether or not to eat meat, they think they have the right to choose for everyone else as well.

Reply to  Sara
August 7, 2018 9:35 am

I tried to be a vegetarian for about five or so years, fifteen or so years ago. I did okay, I guess.

I grew out of it, as the years went by. The supposed health reasons started to crumble amidst my reevaluation of eating a balanced diet.

Balance, proportion, moderation, and intelligent choices replaced restrictions, abstentions, guilt, and fear.

Tofu just doesn’t cut it, health-wise or otherwise.

0 fat + 0 sodium + 0 sugar + 0 salt + 0 gluten = 0 fulfillment and probably 0 real good.

I am still trim and toned in my advancing years.

I guess vegetarians, in an apocalyptic situation, would die.

On the other hand, I COULD be a vegetarian, if that were the only option, but why force what now seems like such an unnatural course of behavior onto a person who has such a wide range of possible choices to eat sensibly and healthy? I eat lots of fruits and vegetables, in addition to meat and eggs. This way, I have more and greater opportunities to take in the nutrients that sustain my physical being.

Oh, and even though I rarely eat fries, I would take fries on the side with my vegetarian.

Reply to  Sara
August 7, 2018 2:36 pm

Have two scoops, Sara.

Reply to  michael hart
August 7, 2018 4:51 pm

Absolutely, Michael!!

Crispin in Waterloo
Reply to  Sara
August 7, 2018 5:56 pm

I am still an indirect vegetarian – I only eat animals that are vegans.

August 7, 2018 5:20 am

I was going to say that extremists can never be good enough. They will always slip up in some manner and the rest of the extremists will jump on them. Googling for evidence, I stumbled on this:

“Yes, today we have genuine Russian weather. Yesterday we had Swedish weather. I can’t understand why your weather is so terrible. Maybe it is because you are immediate neighbours of NATO.”
(Kruschev) At a Swedish-Soviet summit which began on March 30, 1956, in Moscow. link

It is not about the climate, it is about abolishing capitalism. link Some folks think it’s about the climate but they’re just useful idiots. Eventually you get a Stalin or Mao who can consolidate power and hundreds of millions of people die.

Steve O
Reply to  commieBob
August 7, 2018 7:03 am

It’s hard to speak definitively about the ultimate purpose of climate alarmism. Socialists use the issue to advance socialism. Those who want to redistribute wealth use the issue as a means to make wealth transfers. Governments tend to expand regulatory power and to raise taxes.

Some people just have a need to feel superior.
Some have a need to save the world.

Some just want to get rich, or advance their careers. (Just remember that money is selectively corrupting. It only affects those who are on the side of “the fossil fuel industry.”)

Reply to  Steve O
August 7, 2018 8:03 am

Nope. Most are stupid.

“Never ascribe to malice that which is easily explained by incompetence (or stupidity)”

Joel Snider
Reply to  KAT
August 7, 2018 1:21 pm

I think there’s a lot of malice in there too. You give people a reason to justify it, a lot of people will act on it.

Reply to  KAT
August 11, 2018 1:54 pm

Most are terrified to think outside a group or be outside a group.

Reply to  Steve O
August 7, 2018 9:45 am

I don’t think that there is one unified purpose to climate alarmism. And I don’t think that there is one unified awareness of the facts among climate alarmists. I don’t know who does and who does not know better. There are those who are innocent victims of propaganda, those who are too stupid to know better, and those who very well might be liars.

I suppose everybody who is an alarmist could eventually be classified as a liar, because they ultimately are lying to themselves by ignoring the facts in holding to their comfortable points of view.

August 7, 2018 5:21 am

I’m willing to do my bit to save the planet. I pledge to never sip meat through a straw again.

Reply to  BallBounces
August 7, 2018 6:16 am

Again? 🙂

Reply to  BallBounces
August 7, 2018 9:24 am

I contribute feedstock to the glass fibre insulation industry every day. An ongoing commitment to save the planet. Cheers !

Richard of NZ
Reply to  BallBounces
August 7, 2018 2:41 pm

Surely that should be a plastic straw.

Crispin in Waterloo
Reply to  BallBounces
August 7, 2018 6:11 pm


…through a plastic straw…

Jeff L
August 7, 2018 5:36 am

Health science / diet science is as political, if not more political than climate science, if you look into it (ie the “food wars ” series presented here by Kip Hansen). Vegetarianism fits nicely into the left’s worldview, just as CAGW does. Just as with climate, a deeper dive is required to find out what’s really going on & what’s good for your health vs what is “fed” (pun intended) to the public by MSM.
Having done the research, I’ll be sticking to my omnivorous diet , not just because I enjoy it, but it will be good for my long term health / avoidance of chronic disease.

Reply to  Jeff L
August 7, 2018 6:55 am

Courtesy of a rather nasty brown snake envenomation I was left with a dysfunctional autonomic nervous system that isn’t so good at regulating my temperature, heart rate or breathing too well – the other bit it fails at is the whole gut peristalsis trick, subsequently I’m lumbered with SIBO as it takes forever (you have no idea!) for food to pass through the pipes.

Well intentioned but ultimately ignorant (sometimes willfully) West Ozzie doctors like to prescribe fiber and an increase in vegetable intake – completely the wrong thing for folk who’s small intestine doesn’t shuffle things along.. *

In fact it was only when I moved to a meat+fat only diet that the ‘ermagherd, i’m gonna die’ sensation of being punched repetitively in the gut pain that occurs immediately after I eat ceased.

So it seems given I can only eat things I can digest without the aid of bacterial assistance, leaving me an obligate carnivore. Will the future Green Overlords, Protectors of Mother nature the Redeemer assure a place for ones such as myself?

*(one clodoctor insisted ‘take MgSO, it’ll work’ I says it doesn’t.. he demands “just keep taking it, it’ll work”. I ask when? He says ‘just take it, it’ll work’ like a broken record. Out of sheer frustration and spite I go back 10 days later and say ‘it did nothing’. His reply ‘just keep taking it, it’ll work’. I ask ‘so what if I took 250 grams in one go?’ – ‘wtf, no dear god, you only need to take a normal dose, it’ll work’ .. I tell him righty, you listening now? I’ve had 25 grams a day for 10 days and nothing has moved, that means I’ve consumed a whole 250 grams.. DO YOU UNDERSTAND?’ he looks confused and says ‘b..but, it has to work’. Honestly, getting help from these fish heads is utterly impossible – dare to question their authority and you’ll be directed to a psychologist and all help ceases) /rant

Reply to  Karlos51
August 8, 2018 3:34 am

you thought about asking VETS about your issue?
one that handles a lot of snakebite may have some solution to similar in pets after bites
admit i havent heard of this before
did read yesterday that a serious bad gut pain etc issue can be from probiotics breeding up in small intestine where they should NOT be doing that.
also consider a “fecal transplant” to get thing sorted and establish healthy bacteria.
sound nasty but the results are suposed to be worth the yuck factor for the relief factor;-)

Reply to  ozspeaksup
August 8, 2018 4:00 am

it’s not so much a case of the wrong bacteria as there’s no peristalsis or housekeeper waves shuffling anything along. A transplant won’t solve damaged neural connections 🙁 The small intestine is supposed to have a really low bacteria count, the large intestine is where the festering occurs, however with sibo the bacterial count in the small intestine is comparable with the large as they basically migrated up to where they ain’t supposed to be. Standard treatments are surgery to implant a peristaltic pump/pacemaker, regular doses of extremely expensive antibiotics and reducing fiber and non-fat intake to zero.

Yes, I know 3 vet-friends who are well aware of the issue, they see it regularly, they know the signs but doctors around here.. nope. Took me 10 years of asking for the specific test before one would prescribe it, they basically kept saying ‘oh no, that’s really rare’ – even when they got the results they default back to their willfully ignorant position of pushing laxatives , something that’s dangerous if the gut isn’t squishing things along. As to the hope of getting a gut pacemaker fitted, I just spent a year going in a circle with a ‘specialist’ who now wants me to have the same scans that got me sent to him in the first place grrr

Ken Irwin
August 7, 2018 5:46 am

There’s no such thing as healthy food – try telling a starving man that a McDonalds is bad for him.
Only unhealthy diets & lifestyles.

Walter Sobchak
Reply to  Ken Irwin
August 7, 2018 6:48 am

Or, as I always say: “There is no such thing as bad food, there are only bad people.”

August 7, 2018 5:51 am

Translation: NBC News: “We need to prioritize our various outrages.”

August 7, 2018 6:06 am

Sure, being a vegetarian helps save the planet–a shortened life will cull such idiots from the general population. And I will continue to raise beef cows and consume prime beef! Bon apetite!

August 7, 2018 6:09 am

If meat goes, pets are next. Climate change requires a vegan lifestyle and no pets. How many Americans are going to give up their pets and meat? (Notice that pet foods are now meat, not meat by-products. Considering the number of cats and dogs in America, I wonder how much meat is required to feed them using the good stuff, not the by-products. In meantime, this change has at least tripled the cost of pet food.)

Reply to  Sheri
August 7, 2018 6:30 am

How can I not give my dogs and Cat the best? They would surely die for me in a pinch with a bear or lion, both of which are plentiful here. And they’re just bird dogs. The cat, as well, has proven herself by attacking an invading neighbor dog which was attacking one of our dogs, which she doesn’t even really like. Though Cat, I am certain would eat me were she larger or I smaller, even though she pretends to be very friendly and loveable. But that’s just because she is a cat. How can I deny any of them the meat they love?

Reply to  JimG1
August 7, 2018 1:56 pm

Do you want to save the planet or not!

Reply to  Sheri
August 7, 2018 4:38 pm

The planet needs no *saving*. Should the current state of the planet shift precipitously, then evolution dictates that there will be new species in the next epoch. If I’m not here to see the *new world*, so be it. Our successors will enjoy it, whatever state it becomes.

Reply to  Sheri
August 7, 2018 7:17 am

My cat is a premium mouse hunter/killer. I cannot do without her and her teeth and claws. Of course, getting the mouse away from her for disposal is not easy, but can be done with a bribe of tuna.

Reply to  Sheri
August 7, 2018 7:53 am

Now that would be a fun poll–which would you rather keep, your pets or finger-wagging, nanny-stater progs? That would generate some fun numbers . . .

Reply to  Sheri
August 7, 2018 9:51 am

No meat, no pets, no sex, no fossil fuel,… yeah, that’s the kind of future I want to be part of.

Reply to  Robert Kernodle
August 7, 2018 1:56 pm

If we could just get these idiots to do the no sex part this situation would eventually rectify itself. However, just like eveything they preach it is do as I say, not as I do.

Reply to  JimG1
August 7, 2018 4:58 pm

Try offering them a free spay and neuter clinic, with a free set of CDC-approved vaccines for such nasty things as rabies, tetanus, diphtheria, rubella, measles, chicken pox, polio, and that nasty shifting-antigen flu virus, H1N1, originally known as the Spanish Flu, which is still on the Flu A list (no vaccines yet) this year.

And for Pete’s sake, don’t offer the mumps shot. If they get mumps as adults, it makes the male vegans sterile. Ma Nature’s built-in birth control has its advantages, doesn’t it?

Crispin in Waterloo
Reply to  Sheri
August 7, 2018 6:25 pm

Can I have a pet rock?

Roll over!
Play dead!

Reply to  Crispin in Waterloo
August 7, 2018 11:14 pm

Just so long as he’s a carbon-free rock. 😉

August 7, 2018 6:20 am

Mann created himself following the directions straight out of the leftist instruction manual: wrap yourself in a noble sounding facade and tell others to do as you say not as you do while you accuse them of doing exactly what it is that you’re doing. How big of a narcissist do you have to be to live with yourself being that big of a hypocrite?

mark from the midwest
August 7, 2018 6:22 am

Interesting that the graphic has two of my favorite things, red meat and old Fords, is this an omen?

August 7, 2018 6:25 am

The war on meat, is the war on ranches and farmers who they plan to drive off their land, as part of the UN’s wetlands project, and is part of agenda 21. A nutty professor from Vancouver was interviewed on a Calgary radio station earlier this year. Take away the ranchers, farmers and the fuel, and they also get their population reduction.

Reply to  Rob
August 7, 2018 7:19 am

Has anyone asked them how they plan to stay warm, never mind fed?

Reply to  Sara
August 7, 2018 7:43 am

Don’t know, but they’re not very smart in the first place, so they likely haven’t thought that far ahead. There big concern seems to be to get everyone herded into cities.

Reply to  Rob
August 7, 2018 8:09 pm

Once the proles have been herded into cities, it will be much easier to reduce the planet’s population by 90%.

Reply to  Sara
August 7, 2018 5:03 pm

Exactly, and the problem is that, without animals like cattle and sheep producing pooh for fertilizers, growing vegan food crops on the same land repeatedly will in no time at all exhaust the nutrients in that soil, and also start the process of erosion sooner than it should be occurring.

Glad I drew up with parents who gardened to put food on the pantry shelves. They encouraged me to have a couple of horses, because the horse manure, once it decayed a bit (aged) was spread on the garden, plowed under, and along with leaves from the trees in the yard in the autumn, returned minerals, nitrogen and carbon to the soil in the garden and the yard.

Crispin in Waterloo
Reply to  Sara
August 7, 2018 6:30 pm

Silly Billy! Food comes from stores!

David Lupton
Reply to  Rob
August 8, 2018 3:57 am

The argument against meat is (I presume) based on the methane produced by cows. Otherwise meat production would be carbon neutral or better. Life sequesters CO2. If grain is fed to cattle rather than being eaten by humans, some of the carbohydrates (the ones that end up as meat) remain unoxidised for a further period of time. If its the methane that is the problem, the last thing a true believer would want is for the land to revert to wetlands. Or let it be said, to be used for the production of rice, Wetlands and rice paddy produe more methane than animal husbandry,

Andy Pattullo
August 7, 2018 6:35 am

If you believe the Earth is a living being with feelings and that it is harmed by human success then of course it is easy to believe that eating meat is sinful in spite of all the evidence that nature provides showing it is part of the normal circle of life. Non-human animals aren’t nearly so conflicted and just do what nature directs – anything to survive and thrive. If someone feels they can’t eat meat because of compassion for animals that’s fine and I commend them for living by their principles but belief systems are so diverse and have so many different points of conflict with each other that it is imperative that we ensure one person’s belief systems cannot be forced on another.
As for the Mann, let him start living by his professed beliefs and stop globe trotting on public funds before we give any credence to the nonsense that flows endlessly from his gaping cakehole.

August 7, 2018 6:41 am

“the world’s worst carbon emitter — the fossil fuel industry.” Apparently NBC can’t afford fact checkers.

Jeff Alberts
Reply to  Craig
August 7, 2018 6:48 am

Yeah. Is it the industry that emits all that “carbon”? Or the end users?

Reply to  Craig
August 7, 2018 7:22 am

Really, isn’t it the media and its inhabitants that are the worse offenders in that venue?

If only there were some way to put them on their own planet… where no one would pay any attention to them. I hear the TRAPPIST system has 7 Earth-type planets. One of them even seems to have a supply of water. Maybe it’s full of large toothy fish…. Hmmm…..

Reply to  Craig
August 7, 2018 7:40 am

A ban on volcanoes might fix it.

Bryan A
Reply to  Tim
August 7, 2018 12:26 pm

Just a ban on Argumentative Straw Men. Perhaps we could feed them to the Vegans? Of course this could be viewed as a form of cannibalism.

Stephen Cheesman
August 7, 2018 6:57 am

Once I saw the apostrophe in “let’s fossil fuels off the hook” I could read no further (and it is in the original).

August 7, 2018 6:58 am

All good religions require sacrifices to be made. gang Green has placed Humans above all, lumbered them with original sin, and demands sacrifices be made.

Early Earth-mother deities seemed to resemble largely shapeless blobs of clay.

I was wondering what the Mann inspired religious icon would look like and it came to me that uh, it still looks like a largely shapeless blob of clay..

kent beuchert
August 7, 2018 7:26 am

If vegetarians are consuming foods that have few or no calories (lettuce, ec) they are eating basically non-foods that required carbon to produce.

Reply to  kent beuchert
August 7, 2018 7:04 pm

Apparently iceberg lettuce is so nutrient-lite that it’s a net energy loss to cultivate it.

August 7, 2018 7:33 am

I wonder if some biotech-faux-meat company is behind this proposed anthropocene shift in our diets.

The “Anthropocene Diet” has a nice ring to it. Make sure you get at least two servings of beeph, phish or chikken at each meal. Taste the quality… Eat with the satisfaction that you knowingly saved an animal…

lnto the culture tank goes organic soy powder, organic cane sugar and purified water. Made globally…choked down locally. Only $75 per pound with your enviro-credit card wristchip.

Some people experienced these side effects; vomiting, diarrhea, liver and kidney failure. We did research with a final consensus that would suggest three servings of faux meat per meal followed by a delicious carbon powder shake could help.

Reply to  Willard
August 7, 2018 7:58 am

What “shift in our diets?” Vegans comprise only 1.5% of the U.S. population, and most of them stay with it for an average of 6 months. Vegetarians are only a slight percent more. Consumption of meat and poultry is up all over the world for a simple reason–we evolved to eat it, it has a number of essential nutrients we can’t get from plants, we lack a rumen/cecum to even DIGEST much of plants, and plants are incredibly unsatisfying to consume unless you are trying to willfully starve in the midst of plenty–another obsession of social climbers, fashionable emaciation. Most of us eat what we like and can afford.

Bryan A
Reply to  Goldrider
August 7, 2018 12:29 pm

And They think the world is 98.5% overpopulated

Bryan A
Reply to  Willard
August 7, 2018 12:28 pm

Don’t forget about the Krab and Tofurkey

Reply to  Willard
August 7, 2018 5:08 pm

Soy, as you know, is a plant that is high in phytoestrogens.

Is there any information on the rates of cancers in soy consumers versus the beef eaters?

I’d like fries with that, thanks!

Really, I tried soy burgers, which had a small amount of beef powder sprinkled on them. One pack of six later, I was back to real beef with real potato french fries.

They don’t have to eat what we eat. They are free to choose, but they should be willing to extend us the same courtesy.

Bryan A
Reply to  Sara
August 7, 2018 8:17 pm

Beef Burgers with a sprinkling of Soy Powder certainly beats Soy Burgers with a sprinkling of Beef Powder

steve case
August 7, 2018 7:36 am

Government permission to eat red meat, travel, have kids, live past age 65 soon to follow.

August 7, 2018 7:49 am

Do you see meat or gasoline rationing on the horizon? Realistically? Neither do I. Especially given that recent Gallup poll showing that “climate change” doesn’t even make the list of American’s to 36 life concerns.
These people’s ravings are now just one more form of virtue-signalling–a form of social climbing where showing “Concern for the Planet” tm. is “branding” oneself as “upper middle class.” Think NPR tote bags.

To the rest of us, they’re not even as relevant as fleas.

Ivan Kinsman
Reply to  Goldrider
August 7, 2018 8:06 am

A sceptic like you makes me laugh the way you casually throw out disinformation on climate change. This issue is growing in importance as Americans come face to face with the reality of climate change in their own backyard. Be more specific in what you write and I suggest you read up more on climate change: https://mankindsdegradationofplanetearth.com/2018/08/05/our-climate-plans-are-in-pieces-as-killer-summer-shreds-records-cnn/

Pat Frnak
Reply to  Ivan Kinsman
August 7, 2018 10:43 am

Who at CNN has published anything on climate science, ikm? (hint: no one)

Who at CNN understands anything about science? (hint: probably no one)

What published work on climate changeᵀᴹ includes physically valid error bars? (hint: none)

What published work on climate changeᵀᴹ is actual science? (hint: none of it)

Does ivankinsman know what s/he’s talking about? (hint: no)

Reply to  Ivan Kinsman
August 7, 2018 3:03 pm

and yet every few months we hear a plan from the media about some addled academic who’s contrived a new method of stripping the (0.04%) CO2 from our air to Save The World©

how many of them present the carbon cycle in their hysterical media rants ? How many stress the dangers of a low CO2 atmosphere?

Methinks not one of them has a clue how long life would last on this rock should CO2 levels dip below 0.018%, or how dangerous colder weather would be with CO2 dissolution increasing with lower temperatures, or reductions in CO2 would cascade as the plants do their damnedest to suck every last molecule from the air each and every day.. how they drive the levels so low so quickly they’re wasting water photorespiring after the first hour or two’s rapid depletion..

warming increases the rate of the carbon cycle, CO2 added to the system increases the mass of living things in the carbon cycle. Where’s the risk?

August 7, 2018 7:57 am

Read and learn and you will certainly start thinking more about your meat consumption. Dieteticians say you should not eat a piece of meat bigger than your hand – easy rule to keep in mind: https://mankindsdegradationofplanetearth.com/2018/08/05/watch-meathooked-end-of-water-vice-on-hbo-season-4-episode-5-on-youtube/

D. J. Hawkins
Reply to  ivankinsman
August 7, 2018 10:03 am

Is that dieteician one of those idiots that cheered on Ancel Keys as Americans moved away from meat and fat toward more carbohydrates it their diet, and obesity marched along in lock-step? Humans evolved as meat-eaters. The whole “hunter-gatherer” was a LOT of hunting with a bit of gathering. Kip Hansen has done a great job addressing this at elsewhere at WUWT .

Reply to  D. J. Hawkins
August 7, 2018 10:48 am

Hunter gatherer was when man was on the move doing very hard physical tasks. Modern man sits in front of his/her computer 8+ hours a day. Obesity rates are rocketing as a meat rich fast-food diet fills many bellies. Keep up your excessive meat consumption and eat yourself to an early grave my friend.

Reply to  ivankinsman
August 7, 2018 12:20 pm

Between 30,000 and 10,000 years ago, Cro-Magnon people had a relatively easy life, with more leisure time than at any time up until the 20th century.

The transition to a harder life at 10,000 years came when all the large game had been obliterated. Guess how that happened (hint: at the hands of those eco-stewarding, nature-balanced, weapon-wielding, meat-eating paleo-people.).

And all before capitalism (and its rescue of leisure time). What a shocker.

Reply to  ivankinsman
August 7, 2018 1:54 pm

Does a Big-Gulp in one hand and a large bag of potato chips in the other have anything to do with the plus sized 2 legged whales?

Reply to  eyesonu
August 7, 2018 1:56 pm

Mmm … could be a connection there. Maybe you should tell them about it and see what they say…

Reply to  eyesonu
August 7, 2018 1:56 pm

Mmm … could be a connection there. Maybe you should tell them about it and see what they say…

Joel Snider
Reply to  eyesonu
August 7, 2018 4:18 pm

More likely booze.

Reply to  eyesonu
August 7, 2018 5:19 pm

If the sweetener is aspartame, then yes, it does.

Joel Snider
Reply to  ivankinsman
August 7, 2018 4:17 pm

Total crock. Blanket bullshit statements like this are what misinformation is based on and what progressives live for.

Reply to  Joel Snider
August 7, 2018 10:37 pm

No idea what yoy are talking about and what ‘progressive’ is referring to – seems its a label you slap on everything you disagree with.

Reply to  ivankinsman
August 7, 2018 5:18 pm

I hate to burst your bubble, buddy boy – no, wait – I’m HAPPY to burst your bubble, IKM, because more obesity is caused by the consumption of aspartame than anything else.

How do I know this? Well, frankly, I started drinking Diet Coke as soon as that came on the market, and gained weight at an unbelievable pace. I also exercised vigorously, running 3 miles a day 5 days a week, swimming laps and treading water at the local YMCA pool 4 days a week after I quit running, and then spending as much as 8 hours (3 AM before work and 5 PM after work) in skating practice, over a period fo 30 years, and yet, I kept gaining weight to an astonishing degree. And I do not eat crappy food, either. I detest junk food.

Got that so far?

Despite my efforts to drop all that excess weight, nothing happened, until two years ago, when I could NOT justify the price of a 12 can pack of Diet Coke – loaded with asapartame – at $5.00/pack, when that was 2/3 the cost of a pack of chicken. I opted for chicken in stead of Diet Coke, and the pounds started slowly comoing off. I weighed in at the local FHCC last fall when I went to get my flu shot. I found that I had lost 37 pounds, just from NOT drinking that crap. I continue to lose and will reach my normal weight before long. And no, I don’t skate or swim any more.

And frankly, IVAN, I don’t care whether you believe me or not.

Aspartame and soy phytoestrogens are far more harmful than any kind of beef or pork, including ham, bacon, and chuck roast.

Reply to  Sara
August 7, 2018 5:59 pm

I would have thought soy phytoestrogens were beneficial for post-menopausal women, Sara. Is that wrong?

(not that I’m thinking you yourself are post-menopausal)

Reply to  Pat Frank
August 7, 2018 7:28 pm

I don’t know, Pat. I don’t think anyone has done a comparative study on conjugated estrogens v. phytoestrogens.

Reply to  Sara
August 7, 2018 10:34 pm

Ok Sara – don’t think I am suggesting everyone give up meat tomorrow – I am not. My point is more about the way the meat is produced and the amounts eaten.
Personally, I never drink sodas so I get your point on this. I also never eat the crap from KFC, McDonald’s etc. I eat meat and processed meat regularly but now trying to buy more free range and avoid eating it every day of the week.

Reply to  ivankinsman
August 7, 2018 7:14 pm

Following the traditional Atkins diet (all protein/no carb) will make you consistently lose weight. Meat rich diets cannot contribute to obesity rates and make you lose weight at the same time. You are therefore claiming an impossibility my friend.

Reply to  drednicolson
August 7, 2018 8:12 pm

The left love carb-rich diets because they kill people and help their depopulation agenda.

Reply to  drednicolson
August 7, 2018 10:23 pm

Keep on thinking that. I too am a meat eater. The debate is not about eating meat, but the quantities one should eat. 2-3 hand-sized portions per week is sufficicient.

Bryan A
Reply to  ivankinsman
August 7, 2018 12:31 pm

Sure glad I have size 13 fingers, a 10″ finger span and two hands.
I’ll have that 20oz. Porterhouse after all

August 7, 2018 9:05 am

This is all really funny since it’s bad statistics and shoddy science that cause global warming.

August 7, 2018 9:09 am

The unspeakable in pursuit of the inedible. /sarc.

Peter Morris
August 7, 2018 9:11 am

I wanted to click over to NBC to read more, but I couldn’t get past the misuse of then and than.

They’re not the same word.

Rich Davis
Reply to  Peter Morris
August 7, 2018 6:32 pm

Than why didn’t you go to a better website then that?

August 7, 2018 10:06 am

It’s a disease. They want to control what you eat, what you say, what you think, who you vote for, what you drive, where you go, what doctor you see, what meds you take, on and on ….

Reply to  pochas94
August 7, 2018 7:30 pm

Are you saying they are all Captricorns? 🙂

Joel Snider
August 7, 2018 12:09 pm

Yeah, that’s the thing about ALL progressive methodology – it requires FULL compliance across the board.

Reply to  Joel Snider
August 7, 2018 12:33 pm

Only one exception – marijuana. That helps degrade the culture.

Joel Snider
Reply to  pochas94
August 7, 2018 1:08 pm

That’s one of the vices they use to attract the degenerates – sex, drugs, etc. – then they use it as a control.

David Paul Zimmerman
August 7, 2018 1:47 pm

I am a vegetarian. My reason is I attempt to only eat that which I would be willing to kill or harvest myself. Eggs are fine and so is dairy.
I feel that if I eat meat but am queasy or uncomfortable about killing and slaughtering animals I would be hypocritical.
I do not try to push vegetarianism as I think it is a personal choice and none of my business what others choose to eat.
My wife, who is not a vegetarian, thinks my vegetarianism is due to my Mom over cooking meat. My Mom, long since passed on, used to turn meat into something gray and quite tough. While Mom made excellent Apple pies her roasts were not only merely dead, they were oh so sincerely dead.
I do very rarely eat fish, as Dad was an avid fisherman and I have caught and killed a number of fish in my past. Mom once again only knew how to seriously overcook the fish which tasted more of burnt flour breading than fish.
I have tasted properly breaded and cooked fish and find it OK but not really something I want to go out of my way to eat.

I am not out to save the planet by being a vegetarian. Just reduce my own internal hypocrisy level.

On the other hand I do own guns for self defence so am in a slight quandary about my willingness to take a life in self defense. That would imply being willing to eat the deceased home invader which I have heard tastes somewhat like pork. Perhaps smoked cuts such as ham and bacon?

Joel Snider
Reply to  David Paul Zimmerman
August 7, 2018 2:43 pm

That’s called simply living your life as YOU choose. I have no problem with any of it.
That’s the thing about live and let live – it’s dependent upon LET live.

Reply to  David Paul Zimmerman
August 7, 2018 3:20 pm

I hear you. My mother was known in the family as ‘the poisoner’. When I first met my wife I only ate raw celery and cereal ‘would you like some eggs?’ nope, don’t eat those.. “bacon?” nope, don’t eat that. Took me a while tentatively sampling things to discover food had actual subtle tastes and complex flavours and that charred acrid after taste I was used to was not the norm.

I admire your concerns regarding the taking of lives too. I have no hesitation killing things if the need arises for food or vermin clearing, but it’s not something I enjoy or seek out for pleasure – but that’s me. I get hunters, I just am not one.

I do hesitate at some of what you’ve said though, I know my wife really dislikes killing things, so I happily take on that role out of concern. there’s no hypocrisy there, it’s just pragmatism. I’m good at killing and dressing meat, she is not. I consider the whole meat industry an extension of the civil society working in harmony (with capitalism greasing the gears) such that the killers do the killing for those who don’t wish to kill. No hypocrisy ..

Interestingly my wife is Jaina descent, that tiny population of Indians who practice a philosophy that basically says ‘I have a right to life and wouldn’t want anyone to take mine, why should I view any other life as different?’ – The principle of not taking life for *any* reason is extreme and includes self defense – all life is sacred, with no reason being acceptable to strict adherents.

Her grandmother went bare footed to avoid squishing things, her diet included nothing that could give rise to life (grains and seeds) nothing from the ground like root vegetables (broken ground means things in the soil may die) – basically they graze, and her family are *tiny* people. most below 5′ , many below 4′. Even more interestingly they don’t preach – they’re aware everyone is on their own path, they’re tolerant of meat eaters and comprehend pragmatism.

I hope you find a comfortable place in resolving your dilemmas regarding food.

Reply to  David Paul Zimmerman
August 7, 2018 7:46 pm

No, David, we are all predators, you included. We evolved that way. We need meat for proper nutrition. That we can let others take care of the wet work doesn’t change anything.

Bob H
August 7, 2018 2:27 pm

It will be a lot easier to cure diabetes, heart disease , and cancer with diet then it will be to cool the earth by not eating meat. I think the greenies found a weak link with the climate deniers – you can’t beat them with the science so start a food fight.

August 7, 2018 3:24 pm

I recently discovered that the “local health food” co-operative sells chopped dried nettles for about 30.00£/kilo.
Sometimes I think I must have missed my optimal path in life.

Reply to  michael hart
August 7, 2018 7:00 pm

pack up some coal dust, describe it as a ‘all natural eco-friendly high energy, zero carb health food supplement with no added chemicals’. Be sure to use the brown stuff with extra sulfur, the flatulence will assure them it’s working.

Reply to  Eric Worrall
August 8, 2018 4:06 am

what th.. well there you go, no idea is too stupid for these people.

sand? has anyone sold them all-new pure silicon dioxide digestive aid yet? Come on, there’s dollars to be made , the ignorant seem incredibly willing to hand their money over for the most idiotic things.

August 7, 2018 4:55 pm

Once again vegetarians, pay attention. If you graze on grass like cattle, you will starve to death. Only beings with multiple stomachs and chew their cud can get nourishment from grass. Also, if the grassland is not grazed, it will die. A win/win/win for the earth, the cattle, and people. Grilled on a propane fossil fueled barbeque, medium rare.

August 7, 2018 7:25 pm

They’ll take my Porterhouse when they pry it from my cold dead jaws.

Craig from Oz
August 7, 2018 8:13 pm

I have just read through the 120 odd comments and believe that unfortunately most of you have missed the point.

The discussion isn’t between the amazing advantages of eaten tasty dead animals over soy, it is the point the article is trying to make. Going Veg has shifted focus away from the fossil fuel industry. This is their claim. Their words.

So taking their words to the logical conclusion, Vegans and Veggies are causing Climate Change(tm)!!!

So next time some malnourished green tries to guilt trip you over your commitment to saving the planet, just tell them you had steak for breakfast and cite this article. 😀

Reply to  Craig from Oz
August 7, 2018 8:16 pm

It’s all irrelevant anyway, because the majority of meat will be grown artificially in a few years.

The left waste their lives campaigning for things that evil profit-seeking corporations do anyway. What a sad bunch they are.

August 7, 2018 10:43 pm

Liberals I engage with in the travel hacking community (flying in business/first using frequent flier miles earned mainly through credit card signup bonuses) justify their flying activity by the naive notion that “if I don’t take that seat on the plane, the flight will still fly anyway, so I’m not causing any emissions”. Nevermind the fact that them flying is part of the overall demand signal, and also that their extra weight does indeed burn extra fuel. So I guess we can take a similar tact. If I don’t buy this tank of gas, the refinery won’t shut down, so doesn’t matter!

John F. Hultquist
August 7, 2018 11:33 pm

Vegan. Think you are eating healthy?
Most vegans, those who don’t eat any animal products, and vegetarians, who don’t eat red meat, seafood, or poultry, are short on B-12. A study published in the American Journal of Clinical Nutrition found nine in 10 vegans had below-normal levels of B-12.

Reply to  John F. Hultquist
August 8, 2018 3:53 am

yeah 2 vegetarian mates have serious B12 issues as well as iron deficiency and both had to get infusions of both before they keeled over
both are also overweight, one drinks beer so that sorts her out
the other?
utter mystery she is a real and serious gluten allergy sufferer as well so snacks n bought foods are excluded, no fizz drink etc
can help but reckon a keto diet might be better for her, but thats for her to choose or not.
on that topic epileptics DO do a lot better on keto diets, so do they have to be guilty or risk death to please the vegie crowd?

David Paul Zimmerman
Reply to  John F. Hultquist
August 9, 2018 6:36 pm

Yes, had to start taking iron supplements regularly. I also take a multivitamin. What is odd about vitamins is that “over 50” and “men’s health” have no iron. Charge you more to give you less seems to be the theme. Vegetarians should take multivitamins that provide iron, which leaves you those for menstruating women. Lucky those are usually the best priced. Helps with the b vitamins also.
As for missing the point about vegawhatevers helping to cause AGW, one would first have to agree there is a dangerous level of AGW. Most commenters here are likely very skeptical about that so we talk about tangential topics that are more interesting.

old construction worker
August 8, 2018 12:56 am

Vegetarians – I always ask why do we have canine teeth?

Bryan A
Reply to  old construction worker
August 8, 2018 12:18 pm

it’s how they’re rooted

David Paul Zimmerman
Reply to  old construction worker
August 9, 2018 6:43 pm

All the better to slash and rend those tough broccoli stems and crunchy celery stalks. Seriously, how many human carnivores use their canines? That is why we pound, let rot, and cook meat. The incisors do the cutting and the molars turn to a paste and the canines serve as fiber catch alls which is why the toothpick and dental floss industries are still in business.

Filbert Cobb
August 8, 2018 12:55 pm

In the UK there are many vegans in positions of influence in academia and on steering bodies appointed to screw us over using the Climate Change Act. Only some widespread defunding will defeat their vegan agenda.

%d bloggers like this: