Salon: Childless Climate Faithful Upset By Celebrity Hypocrisy

Brad Pitt

Brad Pitt. Georges Biard [CC BY-SA 3.0], via Wikimedia Commons

Guest essay by Eric Worrall

According to Salon, women who have taken a personal decision to help save the planet, by not having children, are angry that celebrity hypocrites appear to be ignoring the climate issues which they claim to take so seriously.

Baby Doomers: As climate change threatens to strain resources, women are increasingly reevaluating reproductive decisions. Now, these women are angry

When Sara Kelly, the 30-year-old founder of SAK PR firm in Philadelphia, posted an article to her Facebook page in December — one describing the growing trend of women refusing to have children for environmental reasons — it received more than 60 impassioned comments, mostly from friends of childbearing age debating the merits of the movement. “The topic comes up at least once a week,” Kelly told Salon. “People on both sides are having to put a lot more thought into their reasons than ever before. We’re forced to weigh the impact of climate change more than any generation before us. At dinner, cocktail hours, birthday parties. . . it’s on everyone’s mind.”

So, in the great population debate of 2016, who came out on top: the pro-baby set, or population-control enthusiasts? It doesn’t really matter, some experts contend, because we’re having the wrong conversation.

“We have a generation of people whose decisions are deeply and painfully complicated by climate change,” Josephine Ferorelli, co-founder of the nonprofit Conceivable Future, which frames global warming as a reproductive justice issue, told Salon. “There isn’t a correct answer here — it’s an impossible choice. So we’re trying to refocus the conversation to something larger.”

Conceivable Future — a network that welcomes parents as well as non-parents — encourages women of every experience to share their struggles in an attempt to put political will behind emotion. So far, they have more than 70 testimonials and counting. While they’re often mistaken for a population control advocacy group, this isn’t the case, largely because discussions of population control, they believe, are often rooted in classist ideology. Because it’s women in developing countries who tend to have more children, it’s these women who are often targeted. In reality, the largest per capita carbon emissions come from America. According to Mother Jones, Brad Pitt and Angelina Jolie’s daughter Zahara will likely produce 45,000 pounds of CO2 yearly, but that number would shrink to 221 pounds had Zahara stayed in Ethiopia.

It’s this discrepancy that’s increasingly shaping the plans of future mothers. Take Mary Sullivan, a 31-year-old school teacher from Newton, New Jersey, who has decided to foster children rather than have her own. “Climate change is already killing children in the developing world, and soon we will see the effects on the most vulnerable citizens of our country,” she told Salon. “Arguably, we are already. I don’t consider myself especially vulnerable, but I also don’t think I’ll ever be in a financial position to guarantee my child’s safety in the midst of a global crisis. With that in mind, yes, it does make me angry that there are people in the world who don’t even have to think about this — and these are often the very people making the decisions causing this disaster or refusing to address the problem.

Read more: http://www.salon.com/2017/01/29/baby-doomers-as-climate-change-threatens-to-strain-resources-women-are-increasingly-reevaluating-reproductive-decisions-now-these-women-are-angry/

It is good that jet-setters who claim to be concerned about CO2 emissions are receiving more public criticism for their hypocrisy. But in my opinion, the real tragedy is women being terrorised out of child bearing by climate propaganda.

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Jamie

Don’t worry guys…..I’m working on this problem as hard as I can

toorightmate

You are a martyr.

FTOP_T

“I do a lot of work with unwed mothers…just helping them get their start.”
— Steve Martin (a wild and crazy guy)

Goldrider

Talk about “fake news!” I should imagine the “childless over fears of climate change” numbers to be right up there with one-legged, left-handed albino dwarfs. We can do without their DNA in the gene pool.

Bryan A

Since Zahara’s carbon footprint will be 45,000 pounds annually in the USA but just 220 in Ethiopia, the solution is simple. Every woman that thinks childbearing is bad for climate change should simply move to Ethiopia.
And, lest you forget, electing to not have children brings about an unconcieveable future

Bryan A

So long as they wear a specific pin identifying themselves as unconceptible, I have no problems with it. I simply won’t marry one

noaaprogrammer

The fewer lefties there are raising future little lefties, the better off the gene pool.

Stupid noaaprogrammer, acquired characteristics are not passed on genetically.

Ghowe

I believe bleeding heart disease is 50/50.

Paul belanger

” We can do without their DNA in the gene pool.”
As long as they remain childless your wish will be granted. Praise the Lord.

Jeff L

The fact that people (both men & women ) would choose not to raise a family because of an unjustifiable fear of climate change / climate impact is immoral & a crime against humanity. It leaves me speechless. Perhaps alarmists should be re-labled “climate terrorists”

On the other hand, women that are gullible enough and stupid enough to believe the climate hype are perhaps unfit to raise children anyhow.

PiperPaul

But it has to turn into self-flattery – “Look at me! I’m not having kids because I’m SavingThePlanet™!”

Walter Sobchak

I think we should thank them for cleansing the gene pool.

Two things strike me; one is that these organisations should be in line for a Darwin Award (no children division) and that these people have not studied history to wit “We’re forced to weigh the impact of climate change more than any generation before us”. I think the generations that suffered through the little ice age with mass starvation due to crop failures and increased conflict over resource had more to worry about!

AllyKat

PiperPaul, you are absolutely right. People who make these kinds of decisions ALWAYS have to “share” them, so that others may see their superiority. Unfortunately, I have had to listen to a few women virtue signal. Never looked at them the same way, especially since their comments revealed a strong contempt of humanity.

RockyRoad

My wife and I used to march our 8 kids arranged by age single file down the grocery store aisle just to see how many climate feminists we could leave fainted on the floor.
It became such an exercise in verbal abuse that we had to suspend such forays into enemy territory.

rogerthesurf

Hear hear!

Alan Robertson

PiperPaul
January 30, 2017 at 8:05 pm
“But it has to turn into self-flattery – “Look at me! I’m not having kids because I’m SavingThePlanet™!”
——————————-
Q: How can you tell which person in the room owns the Tesla parked outside?
A: He’ll tell you.

M Seward

Exactly Karabar, this is precisely how the species evolved its intelligence. The dumb ones didn’t breed enough.

ozspeaksup

if like me those “gullible women” are targeted in their pre teens BY climate conmen allowed to come into schools and be unquestioned in what they told us?
I am one of those gullibles
and my school allowed these basta&rds IN and also the eugenics mobs
from 1970 to 73 we were getting the “new” teachers inspired by mongrels like Hansen ehrlich and strong in our schools.
our parents if they even had any idea? most didnt know, wouldnt have donne anything anyway
you didnt question authority from their perspective the teachers n govt must know more n be right.
thats how it was.
its why I am now so ragingly angry seeing this same sh!t being repeated all over again on a whole new generation.

Mark L Gilbert

self correcting problem I think

Yawrate

They’re just signalling their virtue.

Cube

+10, unfit for a myriad of reasons

Exactly!

JMH

Good point. I sometimes think that many of these women use climate change as an excuse to avoid something they don’t want to do anyway.

AllyKat

Several years ago, there was a couple in Brazil (IIRC) who killed their children and then committed suicide, leaving a note stating that they were too distraught over AGW to continue living and/or to allow their children to experience the negative effects.
I wish I was making that up, even though that would make me a truly despicable person.

Trebla

Shouldn’t these people be dumping on the Sister Wives guy, Cody, whose really cranking out carbon emitters out by the busload? I mean, talk about exponential growth! And what about Nineteen and Counting? Don’t Michelle and Bob Duggar know when to stop? Haven’t they tuned in to the fact that the planet needs to be saved? I haven’t heard a single mention of the AGW crisis on either show. These families are living in a fantasy world, pouring out CO2 by the megaton while the rest of us have stopped having children. The shame of it all! Oh wait! I forgot. It’s a money-making operation in both cases. Where do I sign up?

Boulder Skeptic

I’m very much heartened by two things…
1. The population of those reaching into my wallet to solve a non problem appears to be poised to dwindle in the future. Now there’s a trend I can get behind.
2. “Zahara will likely produce 45,000 pounds of CO2 yearly”. I owe Zahara a debt of gratitude for all that plant food. Thanks for doing your part to feed the world, kid!

David Chappell

She certainly doing more for the people of Somalia rather than staying behind – not that she had much say in the matter I guess

Cube

How does Zahara’s anticipated 45k lbs of annual CO2 production compare to our hero AlGore’s? Should I revise upward my “bar” for Personal CO2 production?

Gene

The fact that they choose anything around this issue, for any reason, is outrageous. Civilization has become maladaptive. Where has the attraction gone? In the wild-type human, it results in babies, unfailingly. A wild man doesn’t choose anything, he simply can’t resist being chosen. Resistance is painful and futile. The cultured ones feel nothing of the kind. They do everything they can to appear repulsive to the opposite sex (what with tattoos and other kinds of self-mutilation), and then if any natural impulses are not completely inhibited by this poisonous lifestyle, they are killed off with “family planning”. We all know how that is going to end, and yet it gets worse from one generation to the next.

Doug

It’s the problem that (eventually) fixes itself.

Such is the insanity of the far-left. What it means is the rest of us need to have significantly more kids to offset the drop-dead stupidity of the leftists.

higley7

If the enviro-weenies, who refuse to learn and understand real science, want to remove themselves from the gene pool, that’s just fine. We win; they lose. We win anyhow as the real world and real science are on our side, but removing themselves is poetic.

BoyfromTottenham

If only we could as easily convince women in the Islamic world to stop having children!

BFL

I don’t think that Islamic women (under Sharia) really have much choice.

Moa

“If only we could as easily convince women in the Islamic world to stop having children!”
Nope. Women in Islam cannot refuse their men. The relevant Islamic scripture is:

“Your wives are as a tilth unto you; so approach your tilth when or how ye will; but do some good act for your souls beforehand; and fear Allah. And know that ye are to meet Him (in the Hereafter), and give (these) good tidings to those who believe.”

(Al-Quran 2:223)
Of course, Islam is a fiction created to advance the interests of Iron Age desert barbarians, so why would it surprise anyone that Islam treats women as slaves to be taken whenever their master feels like it.

Cheryl Davies

It takes a little help from males for any female, of any religion, to have babies.

Ben of Houston

Moa, there is a similar command in the Jewish Bible about how a man may not deprive his wife or a wife deprive her husband. Official punishment was public shaming.
You are reading too much into one statement

Moa, there is a similar command in the Jewish Bible about how a man may not deprive his wife or a wife deprive her husband. Official punishment was public shaming.
You are reading too much into one statement

It is not in the Jewish part of the Bible (the Old Testament), it is in the Christian part of the Bible (the New Testament). And there was no punishment for not giving the spouse their sexual needs because if both partners had mutual consent they could abstain. The point of the counsel, if you read it, is to provide no excuse for either partner in a marriage to commit adultery. The set of scriptures is clear that it is a recommendation and not a law. To verify for yourself, read 1 Corinthians chapter 7.
It is also important to know ancient culture. In Bible times, there was no Hebrew word for bachelor. Especially before Christ, people married young and had plenty of children. This was a necessity of life. It isn’t like today where you have machines to save labor and doctors. Life was hard work for both husband and wife, and families needed all the help they could muster. Not to mention mortality was high and the Middle East was a hotbed of violence even back then. It is for these reasons that having children became an important part of ancient culture. It was a source of great reproach for a woman to be childless. They needed bodies for the hard labor, for the constant wars, and to replace the lives of those who died young. And civilizations went to war for slave labor.
That is still a little bit true today. In parts of the world they don’t have machines enabled by cheap energy or good doctors. So what do you see? Families with a lot of children and slave labor. Give the people cheap energy and those problems will be solved.

Gard R. Rise

Well, that is not just a little bit arrogant, is it? Scoffing off some 1400 years of history, tradition and culture by saying it is “a fiction created to advance the interests of Iron Age desert barbarians”. Yeah, right. It has only been extremely important to hundreds of millions of people throughout the ages and it still is.
Seriously, are we okay with this. now? Full frontal Islambashing, I mean? Why on earth would one want Islamic women not to have any children, by the way? (Unless buying into the Club of Rome narrative?)
Isn’t it at all possible to criticize religions and religious customs (if that is what one wants, for any reason) without being outright offensive?

DonM

Gard,
“Why on earth would one want Islamic women not to have any children, by the way?”
Well, it is pretty simple. The current ratio of martyrs to virgins is now greater than the prescribed reward. They are, or soon will be, running out of appropriate reward in the afterlife. As such, it would be prudent to have less children until societal pressures push the virgin side of the ratio significantly higher.
Can you imagine the resentment if a martyr showed up in heaven and was told he could only have nine virgins…?
(And then for the martyrs that are already there…. “Hey guys, things are changing. But don’t worry, if you like your Virgins you can keep your Virgins; if you like having 72 virgins you can keep 72 virgins.”)
Now think of the angry resentment when the long term, existing, residents of heaven start having their virgins taken away so the newcomers can have an adequate supply.
Silly question Gard.

Gard R. Rise

Scholarly answer, Don.

DonM

Well thank you,
There are Islamic cleric scholars that spend their whole lives interpreting and reinterpreting the Koran to provide for for past, present, and even future direction of the Islamic followers.
My interpretation of the Koran may be just as logical as theirs, but to call it scholarly kind of takes away from the lifelong pursuit those Islamic clerics. To avoid insult to the clerics and their scholarly status (which may lead to attempted murder), maybe we should just call my response an interesting study.
(As a side note, there are those that say that a simple phrase mis-interpretation led people to think “virgins” rather than the intended “grapes”. So Islams’ true promise and reward to suicide martyrs is that, in return for killing themselves for the cause they get 72 grapes. A true scholarly change of interpretation for the Islamic community …. Grapes or raisin as reward. With such changes, I feel I could really warm up to Islam.)

Gard R. Rise

Right, religious bigotry is a whole lot of fun, isn’t it. Also, it is in fashion these days. Count me thoroughly out of it.

DonM

“Isn’t it at all possible to criticize religions and religious customs (if that is what one wants, for any reason) without being outright offensive?”
Were you ACTUALLY offended? If so, I guess the answer to your question is no.

Gard R. Rise

Oh, come on. Where is your sense of moral decency? I haven’t got the slightest connection to any Moslems whatever, other than that they are my fellow citizens whom I meet on my way to work, at work, at my local grocery store. You know, the majority of them tax-paying, ordinary, good-natured, decent folk. None of them overly obsessed by the thought of virgins in paradise, as far as I know.
Now there is this guy openly wishing that Moslem women would have no children in a public forum and you think that is perfectly all right, don’t you? You obviously do, since you instead choose to ramble on with stories about virgins and grapes that amuse you.

DonM

“If only we could as easily convince women in the Islamic world to stop having children!”
I don’t read that comment as a “guy openly wishing that Moslem women would have no children in a public forum”.
Children are enjoyable … and they should be allowed in public areas regardless of their religious upbringing. (If you meant delivering babies … that’s whole ‘nuther story. Personally, I don’t think Moslem women, or women of any religion, should give birth in a public forum).
When I read the guys post, I just assumed “Islamic world” meant areas of the world that are predominantly Moslem, ruled and controlled by church based on Sharia. I do believe that the world would be a better place if women in those areas would have less children and I don’t see any reason not to say that out loud.
I did not read his post as meaning that he thought ALL women in the world, that profess that they are Moslem, should stop having children. Maybe he is saying that, but I don’t begin and end my day looking for reasons to be indignant, so I didn’t see it.

Gard R. Rise

Sure, make fun of my English all you like. If religious bigotry is a fountain of mirth to you, so should foreigners trying to write in your language be. Good luck with your respecting your fellow man; you seem to be doing great with that.

Leo sells his services to the Global Warming crowd, same as paid to advertise watches to him. Allows him to have his private jet and his 482 foot yacht. 482 foot, the way a boat burns fuel its way worst than his jet flying 10 hours to pick up an award….

He could never afford to buy a 482 foot yacht–he just rented it. –AGF

Caligula Jones

…and rented it from an oil sheikh…

BobM

The forces that create these useful idiots are complex, scary, and overwhelming to a large and vulnerable subset of our citizenry that, unfortunately, are so scientifically inept that they cannot string together the simplest logical arguments. Makes one wonder if we shouldn’t encourage them to remain childless and celebrate their selfless contribution toward elevating Earth’s IQ.

John V. Wrighy

+100
“Two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I am not yet completely sure about the universe.” – A. Einstein

Goldrider

You have only to listen to the ridiculous ads on radio for dietary supplements, slimming programs and exotic medical treatments with ZERO biological plausibility to know that the bulk of our population now don’t even have the basic “user’s manual” understanding of Life Itself. I’d bet that unless one is on a med or vet track they aren’t even required to take basic biology in high school. The evidence speaks for itself.

Tom Schaefer

I do hope these climate fools commit demographic suicide. I think they as a group deserve a Darwin Award.

wws

I agree, I’m all in favor of progressive fools refusing to breed.
The sad part, in California as well as Germany, is that the lack of young people able to do non-professional jobs leads them to favor the importation of huge numbers of foreign nationals to do this work for them.

western civilization is hell bent on committing suicide for reasons not known to me.
as evidence i present the zero population growth movement (ZPG) of the 1970s and the current movement to save the planet from fossil fuels that threatens to finish the job that the ZPG started.
the migration crisis in europe has both a supply side and a demand side. the demand side arises fertility rate lost because of the dumb europeans’ wholehearted embrace of paul ehrlich’s population bomb and the ZPG that it engendered.

oops.
“the demand side arises from the fertility rate lost ….

Mike barminski

Anyone who believes they should not have a child in order to save the earth has proven they are not mature enough for parenthood, and therefore should not have children. Anyone who thinks others should not have children for earths sake is either a racist or a misanthrope.

Jim Gorman

Or a liberal. Liberal progressives “feel” everyone should believe and act as they do and are willing to use force if necessary to make sure that happens. I’m not a theologian but that sounds a lot like Islam to me.

JohnWho

I’d like to tread carefully here. People who want to “save the planet” are certainly well-meaning and quite honestly, why wouldn’t one want to save the planet?
However, it saddens me that so many have their “save the planet” endeavors miss-directed. A little extra atmospheric CO2 isn’t harming the planet.

jclarke341

Working towards saving the planet is like putting effort into the sun rising in the east every morning. I could spend billions working on it or spend absolutely nothing. The result will be identical.

Sandyb

Nice!! I’m saving that one.

Cube

The CAGW farce has shown me what many of you have probably already deduced: many if not most people are incapable of reason, and rather than think they react emotionally to issues, clininging to their first emotional response until the next sound bite comes along to distract them.

DonM

hey … it is not possible that my first emotional response to a situation or concept could be wrong. My emotions are valid & therefore must be correct. My logic, and the people I call friends, have always proved my emotions to be correct. 🙂

planebrad

This is like not having kids because you’re worried about the Earth being hit by an asteroid or the eruption of the Yellowstone Supervolcano. If you replace global warming with either of the former, you’d be branded as nuts, but global warming–an event much less likely to wipe out humankind–is somehow exempt from this perception.

Steve Case
co2islife

Without a label, people don’t know what to think.

So the person telling the VHEMT followers what to think is telling them to help make humans go extinct. Didn’t we try that in the 1920s and 1930s? Eugenics and the “isms?”

MarkW

I’ve always wondered why these people don’t volunteer to go first?

Steve Case

Hmmm, three strikes and I’m out, just Google “The Human Extinction Movement”

markl

Climate Change Jonestown.

Asp

If one really cared about the environment, you would raise your children in Ethiopia, where each of them would produce only 221 pounds of CO2 emissions???
This number does not appear to include the CO2 emissions each of those children would emit in the process of metabolizing their food intake.
If one was really serious about saving the planet, not only they could choose not to produce these carbon hungry little creatures around them, they could actually stop breathing themselves. We could then put up a plaque somewhere recognizing those who have made this supreme sacrifice.

BFL

In poorer countries with less stable governments, once the Muslim population hits 30 to 50% they start knocking each other off (just supply lots of ammo). Remains to be seen if this will occur in Europe.

AllyKat

When I read that, I thought, yeah, she’d be producing way less of everything. Because she would likely be half-starved, completely malnourished, and living in squalor.
I guess everyone who made the “mistake” of having children should raise them as if they were living in a Third World hellhole. Just think, if parents doubled down and made their boys be child soldiers, the kids might all get rid of each other!
THIS IS NOT A REAL SUGGESTION. I AM MOCKING THE HEARTLESS IMBECILES WHO SEE CHILDREN AS A PROBLEM THAT NEEDS EXTERMINATED.
Ever notice that whenever “justice” is used in conjunction with an adjective, the people advocating [blank] justice demand that everyone else sacrifice and change? There is also usually something about destroying those who do not agree – personally, professionally, economically, and sometimes even physically. I now have a Pavlovian response: someone uses the phrase [blank] justice and I stop taking anything they say seriously.

Hivemind

In Australia, we have a saying for times like these, “you poor diddums”.
It says it all, really.

Steve

Somebody forward these women the study showing cold weather kills 8 times more people than warm weather. But then they might have kids and raise them to be stupid like they are, so scratch that.

BallBounces

“Climate change is already killing children in the developing world”. So is abortion. Working to reduce abortions would be far more fruitful.

ossqss

Inverse Darwin Award winners?

Patrick MJD

“According to Mother Jones, Brad Pitt and Angelina Jolie’s daughter Zahara will likely produce 45,000 pounds of CO2 yearly, but that number would shrink to 221 pounds had Zahara stayed in Ethiopia.”
What a disgusting thing to say! Clearly not been to Ethiopia (Or any other similarly developing country). Live Aid should not have happened “Mother Jones”?
Disgusting and vile!

Caligula Jones

The hypocrisy of progressives is being produced at such a rate that it will probably exist past the heat death of the universe.
They rather like the idea of “primitive culture” and not allowing our modern age to “poison” the purity of it, while never (and I mean ever) volunteering to live in it. Sure, they’ll go for a photo op or two, or a safari (complete with photos in “Hello” or other trash).
They somehow want to condemn the west for not doing enough to help the Third World while pointing out that we all should be living in Third World conditions. Or something, we aren’t talking of the most logical of people.
And that 221 pounds would also be “better” as it would obviously not be for as many years…

RBom

Baybe Cum Back … You K blambs it alls on meze … I was strong but I juz cant lib …

She’s Gonn … She gonn … Oooo wha … I pay the deba to repla c er …. She Goonnnn … oOOOoo,

Evabody high on … Con sol ape … chum …. Hahahhahahahhah

troe

This is all just political hair shirt wearing except in public. You don’t want children that is up to you. Sure it’s for the best. That you need to turn it into a virtue says something not very pleasant about you.

Joe

Imagine how silly all the environmentalists will feel after they realize that under no circumstances is warming and co2 bad for life on earth and that even if their ridiculous predictions are true their policy is an attempt to pick current property values in coastal cities over the environment?

Old Woman of the North

Most people who practice a religion only become more attached under apparent attack. so I don’t really expect any realisation from environmentalists.

Mark - Helsinki

Expect to see more astroturfed “grass roots” movements relating to not reproducing. Soros loves those kinds of things

Oh my God, theire all gone crazy! Both sides!

“All animals are equal, but some animals are more equal than others”

Bulldust

Yes but if they stop having kids, hopefully the stupid breeds itself out of the gene pool. The foster kids of these people are a worry.

Eric Harpham

My wife’s cousin decided not to have children in the (19) seventies because of fears about their being a third world war (her father’s brain washing having fought in the second world war). Now we are all in our 60/70s and all her cousins have children and grand children and she doesn’t. Regrets? I don’t know. It is too delicate a subject to bring up in casual conversation. When AGW is shown to be false and the majority agree I fear a lot of women will have regrets and a lot of anger against those who perpetrated the fraud.

ozspeaksup

regrets?
many
anger?
plenty!
and yes many of us were just trusting kids when we got brainwashed BY approved teachers promulgating this crud.
blaming us for being scared n mislead n bullied into decisions that made our lives a damn sight less fulfilling isnt helpful

Scott

If these women are that stupid, let them self select out of the gene pool.

Ore-gonE Left

My oh my. I hope these people don’t vote. They obviously don’t have the requisite gray matter!

Allan

I went through this process in the 70’s reading ‘Limits to Growth’ by the Meadows and The Club of Rome.
Since the Earth , according to the Meadows, could not possible support the predicted population I developed an indifference to fathering a child that would have a very tough life in the noughties or so I was told.
The Club of Rome and the Meadows science was rubbish as it has transpired, much like CAGW.
Fortunately a large family has adopted us so we haven’t missed totally the experience of bringing up children but I regret believing a apocalyptic science paper that forecast the end of civilization

ozspeaksup

bless you, glad it wans just us females fell for it too.
yes friends kids are a semi family
but its never the same is it?

David S

Agree entirely with the final paragraph. It’s not dissimilar to the women in Europe who had abortions after Chernobyl even though they were beyond the danger zone. Greens scaremongering has consequences.

Alex
Chris

Yeah, those lame scientists whose work is responsible for the quality of life we have today.

Tim Hammond

I love science, but our quality of life owes little to it. All the great advancements were made with little or no understanding of why they worked, and theres very little that started as science and became something we use. Fire, steam power, the internal combustion engine, vaccines, antibiotics (mainly), sanitation, anaesthetics (which we still dont know how they work), flight…
Experimenters should be our heroes! They are the ones who made life better.

Gene

Experimentation is science. As things stand today, experimental science is the best form of science. Regarding your statement about major achievements not being science-informed, I suspect it is not supported by evidence. I know of at least one case where the evidence is to the contrary. When you get a chance, visit the USAF museum in Dayton, OH. They have preserved parts of Wright brothers’ research lab that existed long before the first flight. Seeing it will be a shock to you if your priors are informed by the media incessantly referring to them as “tinkerers”.

David Walker

“Yeah, those lame scientists whose work is responsible for the quality of life we have today.”
You’re referring to engineers, Chris.
They’re the ones who convert theory into practice, just like the Wright brothers.

catweazle666

“Yeah, those lame scientists whose work is responsible for the quality of life we have today.”
You’re referring to engineers, Chris.
They’re the ones who convert theory into practice, just like the Wright brothers.

co2islife

Real science doesn’t try to disprove God, it tries the explain the world he/she create. Somehow we got to where we are, and somehow all this was created, and that explanation may never be known, but without being able to explain how things were created in the first place, it is kind of difficult to reject God as the creator. Then, of course, you have to ask who created God. Get my point? Some questions science will never answer.

Wrusssr

“. . . there is no cure for stupidity.”
Quite.
If one doesn’t know the right questions to ask, then the answers don’t matter (timeless adage that, regardless of the generation).
So, “Childless Children Doomers” have gone all in for the blue marble and humanity? Hopefully, they won’t consider removing their breasts.
But, there’s really no need for such selfless sacrifice. See, a funny thing happened as the Rockefeller/Gates/et al crowd got their abortion/sterilization/save the earth’s resources (for themselves) programs funded and underway. Couple of early clues: China’s population won’t able to replace itself, thanks to their brilliant one child policy, and Japan’s population looks like a one-winged 747 headed off the bottom of the population charts. But what’s really interesting is this set of world charts comparing replacement workers. I know, I know, we’ve been told we can lab all of–and the type of–humans we want in going forward (can you imagine stepping on a football or rugby field with one of those things), but what if the labs get it wrong? What if the scientists don’t know what they claim to know? Are found to be fallible? Or liars? Psychopaths? I digress. Have a look at the charts.
https://econimica.blogspot.com/2016/06/why-this-time-is-completely-utterly.html

co2islife

the growing trend of women refusing to have children for environmental reasons

Can anyone name a woman that doesn’t think her Children are the greatest joys in her life? What a completely misguided group of people these leftists are, and it is truly unfortunate, let alone, self-limiting. After a few more generations the liberal nitwit gene will have been removed from the gene pool. Their self-hate robs them of life’s greatest joy. BTW, without haveing children you never truly reach adulthood, so it kind of explains why so many of these childless leftist seem to be so developmentally arrested in their teen years.

Jay Hope

Co2 is life, I have a lot of female friends who do not think that ‘having children is the greatest joys in their life’, and they regret having had them. Not everyone wants kids. I certainly do not. ‘Without having kids you never truly reach adulthood’. Really? Tell that to the people who end up conceiving a kid they don’t want. Usually because they were pissed at the time, and didn’t think to take precautions. If you think that’s an adult way of behaving, then you need to grow up.

MarkW

When you are bitter at life, there is nothing outside of you that can change that.
First you need to fix yourself, then you can start enjoying all the pleasures of life.
Of course if you would rather continue to wallow in your bitterness towards others, nobody can stop you.

co2islife

Wow, I thank God I had conservative parents and grew up in a conservative community. The hatred the Left has towards children is shocking. The more I learn about the left, the more morally bankrupt them become, the more black-hearted they become, and the uglier they become. Bottom line, I’m glad I was never part of that anti-children, anti-human, anti-Christian, anti-morality, anti-progress, anti-free-market, anti-America, entitlement minded, collectivist liberal crowd.

joel

I have three kids. Before they had children, our Christmas Eve was boring. A bunch of adults sitting around giving books and shirts to each other.
With the grandkids at Christmas Eve, the party is on. Just no comparison.
Imagine the pity you would feel to people who never had sex for fear of committing a mortal sin. Not having children because of a fear of global warming/whatever is 100x worse.

MarkW

co2islife: Worse, they are going to expect our kids to work so that they can have a comfortable retirement.
joel: Sex is not a mortal sin for several reasons. First, the very idea of a mortal sin is a human invention. From God’s perspective as is made clear in the Bible, there is only sin. There are no gradations of sin.
Secondly, it’s only sex outside of marriage that is a sin. Sex within marriage is a gift from God.

George Lawson

co2islife
Absolutely Those who say they are not having children because they have accepted the preaching of the GW terrorists are undoubtedly those who dislike children in the first place. They find the GW ‘scare’ presents them with a good excuse for justifying their ‘I hate children’ attitude when they would otherwise receive silent criticism from their friends at the dinner table.

co2islife

That is really tragic. The left convinces people to never experience the greatest joy most people ever have. The more I learn about the left, the darker and soulless they become.

DonM

1) “They” are afraid of all sorts of things. Living in fear and not knowing it. The unknowns associated with having kids would just add to their fears (and they are aware of that). But rather than say THEY are afraid for themselves, they say they are afraid for the kids (and they don’t realize they are confused).
2) “They” are selfish and are using whatever is handy to stay away from kids, rather than saying “I am selfish”.
3) “They” are both knowledgeable, and fearful, that the kids that they would likely have would be substandard (in their eyes), so they don’t want kids and use the world problems as an excuse. [these are the ones that I have met in person].
4) There are a few that think non-existence is better than existence with the potential of problems.
5) There are those that think no one would want to have children with them, so world problems are a good excuse.
6) There are chris’ and griffs and similar … that will say anything at any time to get on the bandwagon to get attention.

FTOP_T

It’s a standard distribution curve based on the child’s age. As infants and toddlers, they are the greatest gift. When their teenage (trust me), they are three standard deviations from the “greatest joy” tag. ;-)!!

MarkW

However when they start having kids, they quickly return to the greatest joy category.

Cube

@FTOP_T: I don’tknow, the problems get bigger and they certainly get nasty when the hormones kick in, but at the same time there are moments when you can sit together, and talk, and wonder about the universe that even make those difficult years a joy. And, you can’t get them back, once they’re gone…

FTOP_T

Agreed @Cube,
There was both truth and a bit of tongue in cheek in my bell curve analogy. With two daughters (15 & 16) that are both straight A students, our problems are all 1st world ones. It is difficult to combat the indoctrination they receive from the schools and media. Reading about folks on here whose lives were altered by the Malthusian warnings from their youth is disturbing.
It is all angels on a pin. The sun represents essentially all the mass in our solar system and all of its energy. The ocean absorbs and retains (as latent heat) the gift of life from the sun. It is folly to think man can change the direction dictated by these two forces (sun + ocean).
The green movement seems very dark in its view of the world. Why not enjoy the bounties afforded by how fortuitous we are that the earth formed in such a way as to sustain life. I think I’ll golf in the sun on Saturday.

Jim Gorman

Jay: ‘Without having kids you never truly reach adulthood’ is very true but also has one caveat. Being a parent can make you focus on someone other than yourself, but you have to be willing to also sacrifice for someone other than yourself to achieve the best result. Some people simply never learn to be willing to give up their lives for their children or to love a child more than yourself.

co2islife

So sad, but true. The unselfish aspect is the part the left seems to have a problem with. Tragic.

Jay Hope

Jim, I don’t know who you’re trying to kid – yourself, me, or others? During the Maunder Minimum, people abandoned or ate their children in order to survice, and they will do so again if and when things get bad enough.

Jim Gorman

Jay: What you have said here doesn’t disprove anything. You left out the fact that some people also died trying to protect their children. You simply confirm the fact that some people never learned to be willing to give up their lives for their children or to love a child more than themselves.

James Bull

I think there’s a chance they are after getting a Darwin Award.
http://www.darwinawards.com/
James Bull

Jay Hope

‘They quickly return to the greatest joy category’. They have to. So that they can justify their mistake when they accidently pump out a unit and will now have to live with it for the rest of their silly lives.

Jim Gorman

You just proved to me that you are a liberal narcissist who puts yourself above everyone else!

MarkW

I hope and pray that someone as selfish and self-centered as you, never has children.

Nature seems to sense that, and those who should not have children, usually do not. But as in all things, nothing is perfect, so we hear the horror stories of the few that do have children that should not.

FTOP_T

I’m guessing your middle name is either “no” or “without”

Children are a serious drain, financially and time-wise, on devoting yourself to the seeking of personal pleasure.
That is the real reason these self-centered creatures are not having children – but they have to turn it into a virtue signal.
Now, the one that is fostering isn’t doing that – but no sane foster agency should even consider her as a foster parent; all too likely the kids will end up dead in a murder-suicide like the poor Brazilian children mentioned in another comment.

co2islife

According to Mother Jones, Brad Pitt and Angelina Jolie’s daughter Zahara will likely produce 45,000 pounds of CO2 yearly, but that number would shrink to 221 pounds had Zahara stayed in Ethiopia.

How truly sick and hypocritical is that? Maybe all those elitist journalists at Mother Jones should move to Ethiopia and live in a hut. Last I looked publishing takes a lot of trees, paper, and energy. And I doubt the quality of life in San Francisco is anywhere near that in Ethiopia.comment image

Javier

the real tragedy is women being terrorised out of child bearing by climate propaganda.

No tragedy, as that has always been a personal choice issue. We all descend from people that chose to have children in the face of adversity. For every westerner woman that decides not to have children there are a million Chinese women that are just too happy to have a second child.

commieBob

America’s birth rate is a disaster. The number of young, healthy, productive people is declining. The number of pensioners, me included, is increasing. It doesn’t take a genius to know that it is a recipe for economic disaster.
The idiots, who refrain from breeding so they can save the planet, are just making an excuse for what they would do anyway. People always make up logical virtuous sounding excuses for what they are going to do. The reasons they actually aren’t breeding are deeper and, IMHO, are rooted in their own selfishness and shortsightedness.

TonyL

All my life, I have been told of, and seen, the bad results of population increases. Increased urbanization, suburban sprawl, and encroachment into rural areas. This, of course, has led to near universal zoning laws on the US East and West coasts, pushing housing costs to truly unaffordable levels. We also have population pressures on everything from water resources to fisheries to open spaces and National Parks. On the economic front, when unemployment is calculated the same as when Carter was president, the rate is a staggering 23%. To put this number in perspective, unemployment hit 23% only briefly at the height of the Great Depression, currently this rate has been dragging on for 8 long years. Our Labor Force Participation Rate is back down to where it was in the early 1970s. But in the early 1970s, the one income family with a stay-at-home mom, was still the norm. (Although that would change fast) This Labor Force Participation Rate, when a two income family is needed to pay the bills, is a disaster for the middle class.
Yet everywhere we look, we are told that increasing computerization, the next wave of automation, and robotics will combine to make the employment situation a whole lot worse.
Yet somehow, through it all, we are now told that not enough babies is the problem. The truth is that our economic base is declining faster than our population base. Or, put another way, our economic base is not expanding as fast as our population base. (on a per-capita base, same thing)
The thing really threatened here is the government’s ability to tax, borrow, and spend beyond all reason. Ironically, it is the government’s own social and economic policies pursued since the 1960s which have wrecked the financial foundations of the middle class and turned the govt social programs into giant Ponzi schemes.
And all this is because women are not having enough babies? Really?

You got it TonyL. “The thing really “is caused by” the government’s ability to tax, borrow, and spend beyond all reason. Ironically, it is the government’s own social and economic policies pursued since the 1960s which have wrecked the financial foundations of the middle class and turned the govt social programs into giant Ponzi schemes.” I made one little change. The problem is not that the gov’s tax ability is threatened, the gov’s tax ability has caused the problems. Take a look at Wrusssr’s January 30, 2017 at 11:30 pm link.
https://econimica.blogspot.com/2016/06/why-this-time-is-completely-utterly.html
It has a logical explanation for what is happening to the world’s economy. It is out of control because there is no restraint on the ability of government banks and Central Banks to print money.
Coincidenatly, The WSJ had an article on almost exactly the same thing.`Since the Britain, the US, and the world went off the gold standard the US dollar, as the strongest, most stable economy became the default world currency. Any dollars in other countries were essentially a deficit of dollars in the US. IF currencies are backed by something physical, such as gold, when there are price pressures the price of gold rises. When there is less demand is falls, automatically balancing things out. The ever so smart global banking system seems to have found a way to hide the problem by playing ring-around-the-rosy, passing growing deficits back forth behind the scenes through taxes and exchange limits.

MarkW

Governments pay people to not work, and punish people who do work.
Is it any wonder that more people choose not to work and that those who do work are less enthusiastic about it?

Ed Zuiderwijk

An aptly named website. There is a German word, ‘salonfahig’, which means socially acceptable with the conotation: good for the kudos.

If this is the reason these stupid people aren’t having babies then I’m 100% behind them. It may improve the gene pool a bit.

Tim Hammond

So why are these women not moving to Ethiopia? Why are they using the CO2 producing Internet to complain about CO2?
The whole thing is so illogical and so emotion-driven its embarrassing.

lawrence

“Climate change is already killing children in the developing world”.
Err, where exactly?

Paul Penrose

Nowhere. It’s poverty that is killing people, especially children, in the developing world. And the only way out of poverty is to improve the local economy. That can’t be done without reliable, affordable energy.

Dodgy Geezer

I always believed that the Earth had self-correcting feedback mechanisms.
I’m glad to see that this applies to the humans as well…

Schrodinger's Cat

The other day I was amused to read comments in the Guardian from people genuinely in a panic about climate change. Then I got to thinking about how they arrived at that state of mind. Every day, the Guardian is full of alarmist scare stories and pseudo science articles promising doom.
People are attracted to internet blogs and social media discussions that reinforce their own beliefs. In the absence of counter arguments they end up with a high degree of certainty in what they are told.
However, even provable facts seem to be controversial in climate change. The excellent essay on How Climate Works part 2 had in the comments a strongly contested debate about how the models are tuned. Surely that is known or discoverable? It seems that Climate Science, rather being a search for truth, really is a religious belief system with the threat of fire and brimstone for the sinners.

lonetown

There was a religious sect that forbade sex. Their last 2 followers were 2 brothers that lived in Ridgefield CT. and died (I think) in the 1970’s. They were well into their 80’s.
So it does work, that sect no longer exists and they no longer produce CO2.
They are probably producing methane at this very moment, however.

emsnews

My great-great aunties did that! My grandmother’s parents committed suicide so she was raised by these aunties on their farm commune in upstate NY. She was the only child there and had adventures and then got married and had children. Yes, there were cults that did this.

The Shakers were a Protestant Christian group that had a vocation (calling) to the monastic life, but no idea how to go about it. For many years, they increased because some portion of the many orphans they took in joined them. (The reason they had no idea how to do monastic life and had to reinvent it on their own was because in the Protestant social environment of that time and place, nobody even considered asking Catholics about such a thing.)
thus endeth the pedantic historical note.

MarkW

Sounds like the Quakers.
While they didn’t have their own children, they were quick to adopt any children that others did not want or have room for.
Nor did they pressure these children to become Quakers, as many left the sect when they came of age.

hunter

Another example of the crazy misanthropy that CO2 obsession can lead to.

Apparently God has instilled in the SJWs the ability to accomplish their goals, and leave the rest of us in peace. They will non-breed themselves out of existence.

Bruce Cobb

The Climate Cult is essentially a death cult. They personify evil.

So, let me get this straight: First contrive CO2 as a demon to motivate humans via fear to improve their technology. Now further contrive CO2 as a demon to motivate humans via fear to control population growth, hence infrastructural density (crowding, etc.)
Humans seem to have a genetic need to scare themselves s***less in order to act for the common good.
I can’t say conclusively that the end results of such a process might be bad, … just the way of going about it is f’d up.