Guest Essay by Kip Hansen
In the current round of discussion over at Climate Dialogue, which is about the effects of the Sun on Earth’s climate, one of the participants, Dr. Mike Lockwood, in his essay “The sun plays only a very minor role”, lists the following item as one of seven fundamental considerations which are often overlooked in discussions of climate issues:
“7. Logic based on the name given to a phenomenon, interval or feature is bad science, because the name is often inadequate and misleading.”
— Mike Lockwood
Dr. Lockwood later gives a specific instance saying “The ‘Little Ice Age’ — I dislike this name as it has been used to build arguments that rely on the name which, as mentioned in point 7, is inherently bad science.”
His point 7 struck me as much more widely true and as a logical fallacy or error in critical thinking of which I was aware, and which I would often call out in discussions as invalid logic, but not quite in that finished sense.
Presuming much more learning and authority than I have, I suggest in the title of this essay a proper Latin name which might be used for this error: Propter nomen with a casual translation of “Because of the name”.
We could restate Dr. Lockwood’s consideration this way:
“Propter nomen: A logical argument in which the assumption of truth or logical validity is based on the name or title of a thing. Such logical assumption, based on the literal name or title given to a thing, is fallacious, because the name or title itself may be false, self-serving, inadequate and/or misleading.”
This informal logical fallacy can lead to, depend on or contribute to other logical fallacies: take the World Bank whose name appeals to authority (which grants itself, by name, worldwide authority in financial matters — which it does not have) or the self-serving organizational name Center for Science in the Public Interest which, by name, claims appeals to the scientific authority of “science” and assures us that their efforts are “in the public interest”. (CSPI is really a Washington lobbying organization, not necessarily made up of scientists, sometimes called “The Food Police”, infamous for being nearly always scientifically wrong about the issues it lobbies for, thus almost never acting in the real public interest). If we were to base our logic on the names of either of these organizations, we might think that the World Bank must be honorable, well-meaning and in charge of world finances or that CSPI was certainly operating in our best interest out of concern for us poor benighted ignoramuses. Then we have the Berkeley Earth Surface Temperature project and its products which some people use while literally accepting the acronym as fact, Propter nomen — “because of the name”.
How many studies and news articles have we seen in which the authors claim that such and such a local or regional phenomenon is caused by Global Warming? — without any data in the study about the temperature record in the region or at the locale under consideration — assuming that since Global Warming is named “Global” Warming, that such data is not needed…after all, the whole globe is warming — it’s right there in the name.
We often see this with Global Mean Temperature. Giving this data set such a name is not the same as it actually being global or the mean or the temperature. It is not meant to be the temperature of the globe itself as a three-dimensional object. It is not strictly a mean but could be seen as “an average of averages of averages”. It does not literally represent an average (mean) of Earth temperatures at any given time. Thus, when some specific phenomena is listed as caused by an increase in Global Mean Temperature, it is nearly invariable false. Propter nomen — fallacious logical assumption that Global Mean Temperature is actually literally as named, thus, like Global Warming, if it is rising, it must be affecting all things everywhere on the globe.
We have seen in the main stream media, and especially in the environmental media, articles which refer to “the 6th mass extinction” or “current ongoing mass extinction” which is fallaciously granted power and magnitude by its name alone — even though it is apparent, based on data from the IUCN, that it is not only not ongoing, it is not great and there is no mass extinction (nor has there been any in the 19th, 20th or 21st centuries). The IUCN Red List has as “extinct” only 828 plants and animals since records began to be kept, the vast majority of these occurring on islands and other isolated niche micro-environments: island extinctions almost invariably caused by arrival of rats, cats, dogs and pigs brought by sailors and colonists. The Red List has not yet been updated for the re-discovery of Rhachistia aldabrae — the Aldabra Banded Snail — so there are only 827 correct listings. Many of these articles start with “the 6th Mass Extinction” as a given, assumed true because of its name, and go on to build a logical house of cards from there. Propter nomen — you can’t create something just by giving it a name — the name does not grant actual existence nor physical (moral, natural, chemical or any other kind of) properties to the thing — to assert or assume so is a logical fallacy, an error in critical thinking.
Yes, I know that there are real, scientific definitions of Global Warming and GMT and that it is possible if one searches long and hard in the literature, one could find out exactly what is really meant — but there are many different data sets, all calculated differently resulting in different values and often based on different definitions — and yet still called by the same, sometimes misleading, names. Sometimes the names or titles themselves are mistakenly believed to be literally true and used as the basis for logical argument — Propter nomen.
I have no wish to argue or discuss Global Warming or to complain about the commonly used names of climate science things, everything must have a simple common name if we are to refer to it often in speech or text — this is about Logic and Critical Thinking — the error of assuming in a logical argument that the Name or Title of a thing grants it existence or properties, literally as named.
I would like to read your experiences in which Propter nomen has raised its head in providing a false logical step or false basis to a logical argument. Do you think that such an error in logic or critical thinking really exists? Would you like to supply a better definition?
# # # # #
Author’s Reply Policy: This essay is not about Global Warming, Anthropogenic Global Warming, Global Cooling, the effects of the Sun on Earth’s Climate, proper scientific calculation of Global Mean Surface Temperatures or any of that boring stuff. This is an idea about a newly defined (maybe — it might be on someone’s list somewhere) Informal Logical Fallacy or maybe just an Error in Critical Thinking. It is meant to be interesting, informative and fun. I’d like to read your examples and ideas. I’ll reply as I can as my wife and I are on the move again.
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Hmm What about global warming or ocean acidification
What about it Stuart? Provide links to where the the world is actually warming or the oceans are acidifying please. Driveby postings are not accepted without proof of assertions
I think Stuart is citing global warming and ocean acidification as examples of Propter nomen which make his comment on topic.
Thank you Terry
Thats what I meant, I don’t believe our globe is warming (it is a scary Nomen) and ocean acidification is not only a bad nomen, it is totally untrue all the oceans are alkaline.
Yes, I’ve just had some idiot say “ocean acidification”. As I understand it, the change in acidity from day to night is greater than the total effect of doubling CO2. The ocean is alkaline now and it will be even which much higher concentrations of CO2. And I recall that when all the huge limestone rocks were being laid down, the level of CO2 was much higher.
I believe the appropriate term would be “[immeasurably small] ocean neutralisation”.
(unless you are a squealing propagandist)
While on the subject of the sun, can anyone tell me why TSI has fallen off the chart
http://www.leif.org/research/TSI-SORCE-Latest.png
Is it real or instrument error.
Perhaps something to do with someone actually cutting through cables between two data centres.
On the other hand TSI is down when F10.7 is high, so maybe the case that the TSI simply run out of the chart’s scale (1358.8).
Sorry. Here, let me plug that back in. I was making waffles.
It is real and due to [as the chart hints] active region 2192
TSI dipped by several W/m2 on Oct 23 when the Moon eclipsed the Sun (and the SORCE satellite.) See http://www.spaceweather.com/archive.php?view=1&day=23&month=10&year=2014 and http://lasp.colorado.edu/data/sorce/total_solar_irradiance_plots/images/tim_level3_tsi_24hour_3month_640x480.png
This “daily” TSI plot is always a week behind (a 14-day running average?)
The SSN for Oct 23 was 123 and solar flux in F10.7cm was 216 sfu. Today the SSN is 107 and the F10.7cm flux is 136 sfu. http://www.swpc.noaa.gov/ftpdir/indices/quar_DSD.txt
Which is an interesting coincidence with the passage of AR2192 nearly directly Earth-facing on the same day. It is known that large sunspots can reduce TSI briefly.
The solar data from Oct 23 ought to give pause to anyone using TSI to understand solar effects, since F10.7cm remained high as TSI dropped due to AR2192. The SSN was only a few points higher on Oct 23 than today, but F10.7cm flux was considerably higher on Oct 23 than today. TSI was below the usual range for eight days as AR2192 made it’s transit, all the while F10.7 ramped up.
In retrospect the eclipse was just a side show wrt TSI.
All full-disk indices [TSI, F10.7, SSN, …] are always 14-day running averages [done by the Sun, not by us]
When a large sunspot group appears on the East limb TSI is always high and F10.7 is low. During disk passage, TSI decreases and F10.7 increases until the group is at the central meridian, then everything reverses as the group travels to the West limb. Again: there is no such thing as a daily’ value. Everything is always a 14-day running average.
When were we on the subject of the sun? Nice derailment.
“Propter nomen: A logical argument in which the assumption of truth or logical validity is based on the name or title of a thing.
World Series (baseball) that always gets a good laugh outside the USA…
Suggesting there may also be; politico, religious and geo-blind spots?
Many years ago, I sat through a seminar by an English business professor who used this as one example of American insularity. Most of the audience was American. Even so, there was some surprise when it was pointed out that the ‘World’ concerned was the ‘New York World’ newspaper, which finally folded in the 1960’s. They were the sponsors of the early World Series and the name has stuck.
Urban legend.
http://www.snopes.com/business/names/worldseries.asp
cntxim,
Are you suggesting that another team from another country can now come to the US and beat the Giants? Bad analogy.
pbh
With or without pharmaceutical intervention?
Considering the number of Latin American players, I think it could legitimately be called the Western Hemisphere Series.
Uh, add in the Japanese players and we get the Northern Hemisphere Series.
🙂
So doesn’t all this add up to…it’s a world series? Every added player, Korean, Australian, Japanese, Venezuelan, et al make it more a world series every year. Still a bad analogy.
11 year sunspot cycle: name based on series of counts started long before it was known what is physical reality behind the phenomenon of the events counted.
Centuries later it was found that there are two distinct 22 year magnetic cycles, one in each solar hemisphere, overlapped by yet another 22 year global magnetic cycle.
22 year global magnetic cycle:
There is not such thing
Sun is a spherical body, a globe for short
http://www.leif.org/research/Solar-Polar-Fields-1966-now.png
Making up a name does not make the phenomenon. There is no 22-year ‘magnetic cycle’. Each 11-yr sunspot cycle is an entity by itself, born from the polar fields at minimum. There is no ‘memory’ of previous cycles.
Point taken.
I came across couple of references to Lassen and Friis-Christensen 1995 paper
“Variability of the solar cycle length during the past five centuries and the apparent association with terrestrial climate”
mentioning presence of 400 solar ‘cycle’. the paper is beyond pay wall, any chance of a short quote from the paper referring to this to me previously unknown 400 year cycle.
Perhaps you might wish to elaborate further, since 400 years from the Maunder Min start is only just few decades away.
That is why I changed my name to “The increadably Handsome, Most intelligent and Unimaginably Wealthy Paul Mackey”.
Unfortunately, in my case, “Prompter nomen” does not seem to work …..
@ur momisugly Dr Paul mackey
You forgot “sex machine”.
Take it to the bridge!
Why are you blockquoting all your replies?
Fragile Ecosystem.
Whenever any green groups talks about any ecosystem it is nearly always called a fragile ecosystem as though any slight change will inevitably result in its catastrophic demise. Yet these ecosystems have usually survived wildly varying climates and natural disasters over the years making them anything but fragile.
Thanks TerryS, this has been a pet peeve of mine for ever. In my experience, there is nothing fragile about nature. It’s true that slight changes in conditions bring about differentiation in nature, but this is its normal condition. A tree falls in the forest and a myriad of changes occur ushering in early colonizing species. The only thing fragile in nature is stasis. Unfortunately, many environmentalists impose their own value judgments on prefered natural arrangements. Nature doesn’t care about a big, beautiful (to us perhaps) tree. Nature is just as content to have alders and other early adapters grow in the trees place (untill another tree eventually gows there) The way nature appears to man at first glance forms the static image in his head of how it ought to be. I live and work outside (spent over 2200 nights in a tent!) in wild places and treasure them but recognize that what I love about these places is a selfish version what I personally find beautiful. This version of nature is no better than any other from nature’s perspective.
The only thing fragile about nature is stasis.
“Natural Disaster” is another one. Hurricanes, tornadoes, typhoons, earthquakes, volcanic eruptions, all part of a constantly changing planet, all necessary to a dynamic world.
Humans are fragile, the ecosystem not so much. An implication is that all humanity will all suffer if the ecosystem is damaged. What is interesting is that even as fragile as humans are, we have adapted to everything the ecosystem has thrown at us over the millennia and prospered. We got a pretty good track record there.
Environmentalist confuse success at adapting to the ecosystem with controlling the ecosystem. We do not control poo in that regard. If all humans disappeared from the earth, the ecosystem would not even blink and would happily recycle everything we left behind.
I am reminded of the Martian “Canali” being mistranslated as “canals”.
In fact in English alone there are waay too many such anomalies to even worry about it. For sure Shakespeare described this naming issue succinctly and sweetly.
Little Ice Age? A storm in a teacup.
Case closed, everyone can go back to work..
As soon as I saw the “Affordable Care Act ” unveiled, I knew it was going to be expensive.
“affordable” in Leftspeak, translates as. “someone else pays”.
The real problem is that regardless of how you address the issue, someone else always pays when someone who can’t afford a doctor needs one. The political debate is simply about whether the “pay” is to be overt or covert.
Yes, the Left is usually much better than the Right at using language to artfully promote their causes, so one should expect more examples of propter nomen in left leaning causes and propaganda than in right leaning causes and propaganda. – just a hunch –
You beat me to it, Geoff. So much legislation employs Prompter nomen.
Well for certain low income people it is affordable, except for those people it was already affordable before under Medicaid. For everyone else your mileage will vary, some people will experience savings, others will get hammered. It’s all over the board by state, income, job sector, age, and familiy size. To be fair there are some good things such as capping out of pocket costs for middle class families with severe illness or injury. Ultimately though it is an extraordinary amount of effort and cost to replace one screwed up system with another screwed up system.
A better name for the “Affordable Care Act” could be the “Affordable Care Lotto Act”. Like on a game show spin the wheel, jump up and down, and hope you end up a winner.
“I have no wish to argue or discuss Global Warming or to complain about the commonly used names of climate science things, everything must have a simple common name if we are to refer to it often in speech or text…”
That’s fine, as long as you recognise that the vague and commonplace terms “global warming” and “climate change” have been hijacked as part of a blatant manipulation. And if you try to get the hijackers to come up with clearer terms to define the phenomena or problems they wish to refer to, it’s surprising how unwilling they are to sacrifice the wriggle-room and emotiional charging they get from their slob terminology. Suddenly their precision and specificity desert them and it’s: “c’mon, guys, you know what I mean. Whatever.”.
Where would the push-pollers of junk science be if they couldn’t ask the punters if they “believe in” or “deny” “climate change” and “global warming”? No, it’s not just about simple communication: the klimatariat know this has been a valuable stunt for them. You’ll have to take their deliberately slobby terminology from their cold dead hands.
+ 10
The Alinsky tactics of the left. I think of Global Warming as a lie so large that you wouldn’t think anyone be so bold as to make it up, Goebbles would be proud. Taxes are now just Revenue or fees. People who believe in the constitution are tea baggers, domestic terrorists etc….
PROMPTER NOMEN….. JUST A METAPHOR FOR FRAUD.
I think this whole argument is absolutely stupid.
You have to name things or subjects one way or the other. To give a name that justifiably describes what you are doing would require many times, if not most times, a title that could go on for several pages.
That is why, we have expressions in the English language like, ” You can’t trust a book by its cover”. This argument, that is, “Prompter nomen”, is just another metaphor that exactly infers this.
How many times do we have to reinvent the wheel! Prompter nomen…. so bloody what!
Let’s get down to the issue… Prompter nomen, is just a fancy, la-la do-do di-di da, way to cover up the real crime here…. ladies and gentlemen, its called, F-R-A-U-D.
When you do things, lie about things, provide false information, to push a false agenda for personal gain, its fraud. Pure and simple.
Lets stop this IDIOTIC, STUPID intellectualization of what is just purely fraud.
Prompter Nomen….is just an academic snobish term invented to redirect the real guilt and dishonest attempts by fraudsters and turn them into some sort of victim of systematic semantic misadventure, how’s that for prompter nomen!
WHAT LOAD OF RUBBISH. ENOUGH OF THIS ACADEMIC SNOBBERY!!
I don’t think Kip was being in the least bit snobbish; it’s a perfectly valid way of looking at the problem. I think your reaction is a bit overly strong Dorian.
Kip is making a valid point about the way names are DELIBERATELY made to fullfil some propaganda role. This is definitely not the same as inadvertent use of unfortunate names to save space. Eg, names like “Democratic republic of . . .” are invariably associated with totalitarian regimes. And who could argue with legislation with names like “Patriot act” or “Mothers and baby welfare act”?
We should all be alert for this kind of language abuse.
it’s not an abuse of language. It is actually one of the beauties of language and rhetoric.
Now I know why I hated English class. If bullshirt is beautiful, there’s no place left for ugly.
Language evolved to extend psyco-social control. So every word is propter nomen.
But it can be redeemed. Each speaker can choose to use words to deceive or educate, to ensnare or enrich. Words lend power to the self or the other.
Harold – where can I get a bullshirt?
Dorian,
you can say temperature anomaly, temperature change or temperature difference. Reading the first name you think that there’s something wrong, the second name is neutral and the third describes the mathematical operation made. Propter nomen!.
Uhm Dorian – the word suggested in “propter”, not “prompter” as in teleprompter. Kip choose ‘propter’ in his suggested fallacy name because it references the formal fallacy “post hoc ergo propter hoc” – roughly translated as “if something happened first, it must have caused what happened later”. Most of the responders here seem to appreciate Kip’s suggestion because it allows us to succinctly identify an idea regarding fallacious reasoning without having to make a long-winded explanation each time it is used.
Perhaps you might have to look up “long-winded”…
Well perhaps I’m not on the same page as everyone else but I think Kip is making an important point about the abuse of language for propaganda purposes. Debates use language as the medium. Capture the language, you frame the debate; frame the debate, you’re likely to win it. By ‘capture the language’ I mean, re-define words so they mean basically what you want them to mean, rather than what they have commonly been understood. The latest example I’ve noticed is that people in England who were sexually abused in the past are now being described as ‘survivors’.
“Well perhaps I’m not on the same page as everyone else but I think Kip is making an important point about the abuse of language for propaganda purposes.”
No, he’s not. I wish he had instead of feeding us this useless tripe.
Tripe? No… He has provided a rather useful name for a common thing / behaviour. I, for one, find it highly useful. So being able to refer to this behaviour in one short phrase, propter nomen, is very useful to me.
Say your elected political machine names a bill “The Veteran Support Act” (as it guts the VA, shrinks the Navy, and reduces benefits to Veterans). That kind of think is rampant in D.C. In fact, I’d wager you can simply list the names of bills from the last 20 years and have a long list of Propter Nomen examples. So why is it done? Simply so that in the next election the proposers of the bill can say “My Opponent voted AGAINST the ‘Veterans Support Act'” and a way to force fence sitters to vote for the bill (often before reading it…) Being able to name that broken form of THINKING by the one doing the voting is just as important as being able to name the act of naming it that way (the fraud).
Kip has provided us with an excellent name for a phenomena we have observed.
WELL DONE!
Sorry E.M.Smith, but you miss my point. The fact is that the essay didn’t go far enough in pushing the point of your second paragraph. The essay, along with much of Kip Hansens writings, avoids the hard and real issue. Instead of attacking lies it presents excuses. Yes, in a general sense the essay is not wrong about these oddities and inaccuracies embedded in our language. To that point, I have no issue, that is I don’t generally disagree.
But so what. Presented in the way it is here it offers only excuses and a soft landing for those who would, have and do use language in nefarious ways, ie Alarmists and their ilk.
Others in this thread, much like yourself have taken it to the next logical step but I think that the essay itself falls far short of any real useful point.
For instance Vince Causey says:
Vince Causey
November 7, 2014 at 4:34 am
Kip is making a valid point about the way names are DELIBERATELY made to fullfil some propaganda role. This is definitely not the same as inadvertent use of unfortunate names to save space. Eg, names like “Democratic republic of . . .” are invariably associated with totalitarian regimes. And who could argue with legislation with names like “Patriot act” or “Mothers and baby welfare act”?
We should all be alert for this kind of language abuse.
_______________________________________________________________________
And I agree 100 % with this, but I don’t think that the essay was really trying to make that strong of a point. I think the essay seems more to try to excuse such supposedly “incidental” uses of propagandized language.
“Yes, I know that there are real, scientific definitions of Global Warming and GMT”.
I’m sorry, that is not true. There are a group of academics who claim to be “Climate scientists” in the way “Social scientists” and “Political scientists” and “economic scientists” and “cookery scientist” and “scientologists” all claim to be “scientists”. But that doesn’t make the definitions dreamt up by climate “scientists” anymore scientific than ones used by “sceptic scientists” on this blog.
So, e.g. as one of the first people to start using “the pause”, I started using it as an accurate description of a cessation of warming. Also from a technical point of view, on a tape machine the pause occurred when the mechanism for play was still engaged. So, there was absolutely no implication of there being a “stop”.
So, why did some idiotic academic invent the word “hiatus” when there was already a perfectly sensible word that everyone readily understood?
The reason is clear: they intended to obfuscate — or in plain language — hide the reality that the climate was no longer warming and they intentionally used a complex obscure word to try to suggest it was something more complex than the simple fact the temperature had stopped going up. So, no science at all there.
I definitely agree about the various groups calling themselves scientists and their speciality a science when there’s no sign of the scientific method. But here’s some fun with propter nomen. Whenever you see the term “climate”, replace it in your mind with “weather statistics”. After all, that’s exactly what it means.
Are there folks claiming to be Economic Scientists? If so, it must be a new thing. My Econ degree is a B. Arts degree in recognition of it not being quite a science… I was specifically told that was why my school did not offer a B.S. Econ (which would be curiously more appropriate 😉 Yes, that was 40ish years ago, and at the time the Econometrics folks were lobbying for a B.S. since they did mathy stuff… but the answer then was no…
Oh Dear… a Google of “Economic Scientist” shows there is… I grieve for my Art…
I blame it on Social Science that is anything but a science…. Talk about a Propter Nomen… The Wiki on Economics says it is a “Social Science” dealing with money stuff, so there is a direct line back to Social Science as the source of the sellers puff and self aggrandizement…
Your comment reflects a phenomenon that has haunted human language since the very beginning. “Arts” used to indicate physical “arts” (i.e. “mechanic arts”, cooking, agriculture, etc.). It was also applied to anything that employed geometry systematically (architecture, engineering, mathematics, etc.). The meaning has drifted and in the process confounded things royally. These days we are faced with “soft” – difficult – sciences (economics, climatology, sociology) which attempt to understand mathematically complex or chaotic phenomena, “hard” – experimental – sciences, which derive from an 18th and 19 century attempt to simplify through laboratory particularization and lean heavily on readily quantifiable observations, and “natural” – largely observational, field – sciences such as geology, astronomy, paleontology, and some phases of archaeology.
Classically (as in Greco-Roman “classically”), no distinction was drawn between what we now call science, mathematics, and philosophy. It isn’t until Francis Bacon that any serious attempt is made to draw a demarcation (see Karl Popper for more about that) between empirically grounded and philosophically “grounded” science.
Using the term “hiatus” is just like P.T. Barnum’s signs saying “This Way To The Egress” and a wonderful example supporting Kip’s Propter Nomen theory. Nice Job.
One of my favorites is “conservative science”. Is there relativity?
“Propter nomen: A logical argument in which the assumption of truth or logical validity is based on the name or title of a thing. Such logical assumption, based on the literal name or title given to a thing, is fallacious, because the name or title itself may be false, self-serving, inadequate and/or misleading.”
It’s a question of precedence or existence. Horses preceded the word “horse”, but we’re still waiting on something to meet the word “unicorn”.
“The Little Ice Age” might be a poor name, but it refers to something real, something that had a significant effect and was commonly observeable.
““The Little Ice Age” might be a poor name, but it refers to something real, something that had a significant effect and was commonly observeable.”
Correct.
Just as for the Mediaeval Warm Period, Dark Ages, Roman Warm Period, Minoan Warm period and even the Current Warm Period.
This article is just another attempt to get rid of earlier climate variations that make recent warmth look entirely natural (as it probably is/was).
Progressives.
Greenpeace.
People’s Democratic Republic of …..
Carbon pollution.
Reality TV.
Recreational drugs.
Liberal Democrats (UK).
Democrats (USA).
Greens (Anywhere).
Sustainable
Zero Emission
Ethical
Enviro Friendly….
My wife brought home a new brand of dog food today…it has an ethical award sticker on it…for not being tested on animals….I kid you not.
liberal!!!
your wife will be testing it first on the dog. what could possible go wrong.
+10
LOL!
Sustainable wind power…
Try “radiative gases” instead of “greenhouse gases”.
Yes, almost all at WUWT fell for it. Thick as…;-)
Yes, “Greenhouse Gases” implies a cessation of convection (which is how a real greenhouse works) while “Radiative Gases” is an accurate description of the physics. That so many of us continue to use the term “greenhouse gases” is a testimony to the power of that Propter Nomen.
excellent point. virtually everyone has bought into the notion of the greenhouse effect based on radiation, but that is completely wrong. the notion that greenhouses warm as a result of blocking outgoing radiation was what we were taught in schools in the 60’s, but it is now known to be completely false.
we now know that greenhouses warm by limiting convection. but we have a whole body of climate science that is based on false teachings from half a century ago. and by and large most everyone on WUWT bases their mistaken beliefs in GHG warming on this false teaching about greenhouses.
So CO2 is no longer the problem (unless it’s C14 CO2) but Radon is?
Re Propter Nomen.
Miss Universe
Yes, those tentacles are clearly a Mrs.
Miss, pah.
the whole of the climate change issue is smattered with “promter nomen”.
Global warming –> climate change (when not warming) –> catastrophic climate change, and to add it’s our fault anthropogenic catastrophic climate change. Solution – study the science with real science (ooops I didn’t mean that).
Carbon dioxide (CO2) –> greenhouse gas –> dangerous greenhouse gas –> carbon –> eliminate –> decarbonisation –> total decarbonisation. Solution – anyone who mentions this should be told to stop breathing immediately, not to pollute the clean air).
Ocean acidification (as mentioned above). the Oceans are naturally base (alkaline) –> Ocean + CO2 = acidification –> destruction of all coral reefs, the death of all sea creatures). Solution – none, there isn’t a problem, the oceans are still alkaline with varying diurnal/nocturnal levels.
Fossil fuels –> dirty fossil fuels –> decarbonisation (again). Solution renewable energy –> solar energy –> wind energy –> green energy. Solution – all alarmists should write an essay on how wind is green (colour), how the sun is green as I am sure it is yellow, and how biomass (burning carbon based material) is going to decarbonise the world.
“I could go on, but time presses and won’t allow me.” 😉
This only true for physical objects.
Superman is not “Super” without the prefix, he’s just a man.
A woman or a man is still a woman or a man whether they are a feminist or not. But if they so name themselves then they become so.
Liverpool FC is Heysel and Hillsborough and “You’ll Never Walk Alone” – a group of loyal supporters and a corporation with a sports club – but the name embodies the whole concoction.
Remember, many people, including politicians, poets and journalists, deal in ideas, not physical objects. They are used to the correct use of names to create things that matter; even if they do not create things composed of matter.
Propter nomen is a fallacy when it is misapplied. It is not false in general.
Why not call “Superman” “Man of somewhat extended physical capabilities that do not necessarily confer any special moral nature or superiority”.
Is “super” not just propaganda: an attempt to create a general aura of infallibility, propter nomen?
Exactly. It creates a role model – a superior – a hero that it is acceptable to support.
“Man of somewhat extended physical capabilities that do not necessarily confer any special moral nature or superiority” is not the same concept at all.
And it has very different utility for persuading children not to smoke (lifesaving) or creating vision of the US as being linked with Truth and Justice or for validating a working woman in the 1930s.
That prefix has real-world power.
Kinda hard to fit on the shirt! Acronym: Mosepctdnncasmnos?
Just to present a counter-point: Merely because something can pretend to be something else does not mean the something else doesn’t exist. People’s Democratic Republics are usually not. But that doesn’t mean there are no Democratic Republics of the People – or that there cannot be.
This statement is still false.
You go too far by saying that names have no meaning and no real value except as signifiers.
Sometimes, in the world of ideas, the name creates the value. Either by aggregating other ideas or by modifying an existing one.
Analogy, a hairband can make a ponytail – but all you have is hair and band. Yet the idea that ponytails can’t exist because hairbands are not always around hair is illogical. Same with names and concepts.
“Hate”. It’s no longer necessary to explain why certain beliefs are hateful or give any examples of behavior by certain groups is motivated by hate, you simply label anyone who disagrees with you a “hate group” and then you’re the good guy forever because you’re against hate and so anything you do–no matter how violent or destructive–is justified.
Hating haters in hate groups gonna hatefully hate.
Some peoples let are not tolerant of their fellow man and I just HATE people like that!
– Tom Lehrer
People’s Democratic Republic of [fill in the blank]…
An interesting argument but all it demonstrates is the inadequacy of formal logic as a basis for argument or discussion. The problem is that in all discourse – whether theoretical, observational or indeed everyday – the words we use signify meaning they do not wholly capture it. Take any term you like, temperature is a good example, as you try to define it you end up introducing other terms which themselves beg definition. This is what the philosopher, David Papineau, talks about as visious meaning regress. If what Lockwood is suggesting is that naming something should not be taken to mean that something has any reality then that is obviously true. However, in practice, all the words we use are inadequate and potentially misleading. Saying that we cannot label concepts and then try to reason from them is just trying to make a clever point. The problem with making clever points is that they are rarely as clever as you think they are.
+1 Mr. Ryan. Sometimes it depends on what the meaning of “is” is.
Exactly Lewis – and that’s why its a futile exercise. Formal logic works well with ‘p’s and ‘q’s which have no meaning content. Try and attach meaning and it only has use to pedants.
I think there might already be a term for this: reification, or reification fallacy. It’s mentioned by William Briggs a lot, but is above my mental pay grade to evaluate.
From Wikipedia:
Maybe someone with more etymological skills than I have could weigh in.
The way that the Greenhouse Effect was taught in schools or treating the mean of thermometer readings as the GMT when modelling might be Reification. The first merely being an analogy so you can’t say that it is not real because CO2 doesn’t create a glass-like ceiling (its just a stupid analogy for teaching kids why its real). The kids don’t assume that we will bang our head on the ceiling if we rise too high.
Prompter nomen might be something like Arabic numerals which implies that they were invented by Arabs although the numerals came from India and the decimal method was invented by a Persian rather than Arab. Its not intentionally misleading because it came to Europe via Muslim literature but it might give the reader the wrong idea.
Bob Ryan:
You have some good thoughts and your point is well taken, but I do not think it counters the issue raised in the head post. Yes, in using language (which by its very nature is necessarily symbolic), every term we use is referring to something outside of itself. However, the point of the head post is not that nothing should have a name; rather that a name can be misleading and can serve less as an accurate representation of the underlying substance and more as a political/rhetorical tool.
Controlling the naming of things is a classic tactic in politics, as well as in debates over controversial social and scientific issues. It is good to be on the lookout for such tactics.
Lockwood was the clown that kept getting SC24 predictions totally wrong and then pretended to be right.
Just as I have suspected all along.
Our climate has nothing whatsoever to do with the sun.
It’s entirely at the mercy of bloody Alpha Centaurus.
So when it’s bloody hot or freezing bloody cold – we just blame bloody Alpha Centaurus.
AND – if it is warming (or cooling), just blame bloody Alpha Centaurus.
Alpha Centauri. Centaurus is the constellation.
What about “the hole in the ozone layer”. It certainly isn’t a “hole” in the usual sense of the word.