CTM is Contacted by the Norfolk Constabulary and Responds

Me ~ ctm

by charles the moderator

I received the following this morning,

Dear Mr Rotter

I am part of the enquiry team who are investigating the theft of data from the UEA in Norwich last year.

As part of the investigation we would like to speak to everyone who has made any requests for information relating to the CRU at the UEA.

Records indicate that you made such a request last year and as a result I would like to discuss this and any other knowledge you may have with you at a convenient time.

Please can you contact me (I would suggest initially by e mail) leaving a contact number so that we can have a chat.

Kind regards

Sean Baker

Sean Baker

Detective Constable

Joint Major Investigation Team

Norfolk Constabulary

Lowestoft Police Station

Old Nelson Street

Lowestoft

Suffolk

NR32 1PE

Tel: xxx

Mobile: xxxx

This e-mail carries a disclaimer [this was a dead link. Put here for reference. ~ ctm]

Go here to view Norfolk Constabulary Disclaimer

I responded within a few hours with this:

I can be reached at xxx. I work nights so please don’t call before noon PST. I’m in San Francisco. Between noon and 1 PM is the best time to contact me.

I have previously posted my entire involvement with the CRU leaked emails and files online here:

http://wattsupwiththat.com/2010/01/13/climategate%E2%80%94the-ctm-story/

I’m not sure what else you would like to know. I’ll see if I can cover it in advance.

1. I have never received any money for my volunteer services at wattsupwiththat.com

2. I met Steve McIntyre once for dinner two years ago when he was in town for AGU. I paid for the dinner.

3. I read Climate Audit.

4. [personal info]

5. [personal info]

6. [personal info]

7. I am 51, turning 52 next month.

I understand that you are diligently performing your investigation, and I’m not sure how well you understand the perspective from this side of the fence.

The multiple FOI’s were submitted in response to Phil Jones’s obstruction of the scientific process of verification and replication. Had he behaved as any scientist should, no FOI requests would have been required and it would have been ten minutes work to respond to the original request. The CRU began moving the goal posts, making up more and more unbelievable reasons why they should not give data to perceived critics, thus causing the subsequent FOI’s and escalation, in which I participated. It seems likely that soon after Steve McIntyre’s appeal was denied, someone at the University of East Anglia, disgusted by what he or she witnessed, subsequently leaked the files. I have no knowledge or direct evidence that this is the case, but it is the explanation that makes the most sense.

If you would like more information on the escalation of FOI requests and the obstruction by CRU, as confirmed by your own ICO, I can dig up the relevant threads.

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Man these guys hit the ground running!
How long have you been public with the facts of the case and they are just contacting you.
They know that these cases require fast investigation…. IFF you want to catch the perp… IF.

Carbon Dioxide

You could also add that:
1) The Information Commissioner’s Office (ICO) have stated that Phil Jones and UEA acted unlawfully by failing to comply with your lawfully submitted FOI request.
2) British Government ministers have refered to this matter as an internal leak.
Happy birthday for next month 🙂

Sunfighter

Why would he say he wants you to respond back via email first? That sounds weird. The whole thing sounds weird to me…*shrug*

Atomic Hairdryer

I get the feeling that this must be the most exciting thing that’s happened to Norfolk Constabulary. Much of the time they investigate animal abuse and speeding on the Broads.
(disclaimer, I’m from Suffolk, if you want any real North/South divides, live in East Anglia. Anything beyond that is marked ‘here be monsters’)
Other than that, it’s interesting to see it’s a major investigation and has roped in resources from outside of Norwich, as it perhaps should given this is a potential fraud larger than Madoff, Worldcom, Enron combined. But I still get the feeling they’re out of their depth, hence the ‘theft’ investigation. In law, that’s clearly defined, and in this case, unproven.

George Turner

You’ve never received money for services at WUWT? Hey, somebody needs to hit the tip jar! 🙂

geo

You were always high on my suspect list, ctm. Oldest dodge in the book that “somebody posted the link where only I could see it” thing, really.
Be sure to mention your roomie is getting rich and famous off the whole thing too, that’ll help a lot in allaying their suspicions.
😉

I thought they had already white washed their way out of that incident? I did’nt realise the investigation was still open.

Mike Clark

Charles,
You are giving the best response. This guy knows if he goes ahead and tries to drive you down a reconciliatory road, he will have his head handed to him.
You remind me of an old Uncle Remis story that being of “Brair Rabbit” and the “Tar Baby”. If this guys got any sense, he’ll run on your side of the story which is the side of truth. If he chooses to do otherwise, he’ll have trouble in ways he never imagined.
Thanks for your “Truth”

NickB.

Nice reply!
BTW – in case it hasn’t been said lately you mods are doing an absolutely incredible job and, for the record, loved the reply in the Lacis thread!

Good to see that the bobbies are continuing to investigate this. I also submitted an FOIA request to either CRU or Hadley/Met Office last year about the same time we were all filing complaints with the US inspector generals office in regards to Jim Hansen’s politicking and protesting on salary. I got the same runaround excuses as everybody else.

TinyCo2

LOL this must be one of the first cases in history were just about everything about it has been written about at length and posted in public. Is it reasonable that the police buy a copy of everybody’s book as evidence? No freebies, obviously.

Daniel H

So does this mean the investigation has turned up so many dead leads that they’re harassing anyone who ever submitted an FOI request now? If submitting an FOI request makes someone a suspect in a crime investigation then it will have a chilling effect on the FOI Act itself. This is truly Orwellian. They’re going after the skeptics for the crimes committed by Jones et al!

Jeremy

Your age is personal info. Can’t be too careful on the internet my friend.

Ross M

Hacker!
Will be interesting to see if they take the history of the FOI wars into account.

Pascvaks

Sounds like the beginning of an Agatha Christy mystery.

I am part of the enquiry team who are investigating the theft of data from the UEA in Norwich last year.
Theft? I find the term interesting.
They are not investigating the nature / method of the release of information?
They ‘assume’ it was a theft?
Are they also investigating the potential that CRE / UEA violated FOI laws?

Craig Moore

Your picture makes you look guilty as all hell and gone. Better fess up.
😉

Rick K

Charles,
If you need a character witness just let me know!
(Or anyone on WUWT)
Rick

They’ve been asking these questions for quite some time now.

Lesson: the FOI act was designed to go after those seeking the information. We will protect the information and seek out those who tried to get it.

Charlie A

I suspect that they may be dissembling a bit when they say they are contacting you because they are contacting all that submitted a FOIA/EIR request.
It is quite possible that they have read the blogs and books about this incident and are interested in you because you were one of the first to download, or archive, or distribute the files.
Then again, maybe I’m just feeling neglected since I submitted 3 FOIA requests to UEA last summer and the constulatory has not contacted me. 🙂

IsoTherm

I am intrigued by this phrase “theft” of information. As I understand the law regarding information, one has copyright on information and and as far as I am aware there is no such thing as theft of information only infringement of intellectual property rights.
Indeed, our right to obtain information is explicitly outlined in the UK human rights act:
Article 10: Freedom of Expression
(1) Everyone has the right of freedom of expression. This right shall include freedom to hold opinions and to receive and impart information and ideas without inference by public authority and regardless of frontiers. This Article shall not prevent States from requiring the licensing of broadcasting, television or cinema enterprises.
Note it specifically gives us a right to “receive and impart information and ideas without inference by public authority and regardless of frontiers.”
For the police to act conspire “interfere” with this right would in itself be breaking the law and subject to legal action.
OK, I’m no lawyer, but the right to exchange information seems to be very explicit, and as I understand it the law regarding intellectual property is a civil matter and has nothing to do with the police.

rbateman

What am I missing here, charles?
They whitewash an FOI investigation on grounds of statute of limitations, but are hot & heavy on ‘alleged hacking’.
Seems to me the statute of limitations would begin AFTER the last correspondence of denial of public info on the private communication excuse tab.
Which means they are looking for an external scapegoat to fry.
Smart move making their inquiry public.
Political agenda, like climate, nevers sits still, but twitches like an overactive child. Eventually, the winds change. They must be on a tight schedule.

Douglas DC

I’ve been falsely accused in my life.I fought mine by making suing noises.
Nasty letters from the attourney, etc. No evidence no case.That plus at the
time of the incedent- a hit and run by a guy using my name-I was somewhere
north of Faribanks dropping mud on a tundra/tagia fire.I even had acess to the
CO’s office at Ft. Wainright to confirm this-just in case….

I am not sure if you will appreciate this but: I will say a Rosary for you tonight. You are a brave and good man.

Squarebob Spongepants

Now isn’t the CRU the Criminal Records Unit, and the IPCC the Independent Police Complaints Commission?
I think they may be feeling threatened.

TerryS

Your email was from “Joint Major Investigation Team” and the one I received was from “Protective Services” and we know the “National Domestic Extremism Team” is also involved. I wonder how many other branches of Norfolk Constabulary are investigating?

Ciskepic

Evidently no one ever taught Charles that in dealing with law enforcement, less (talking) is more.
They just want you to answer some questions, Charles. They aren’t interested in your theory of the crime.

You’re screwed! (Oy Inspecta’ !, I nicked the ‘acka. It’s this cheeky Yank over ‘ere), Just remember, in the UK, judges are referred to as “M’ Lord” not “Your Honour”—this might shave a few years off your sentence.

Steve E

Sad to say, despite the obviousness of it all, my read is that the fix is in. They’re looking for the lime to complete the whitewash. It would appear that it’s in the “established best interest” to maintain status quo ante bellum. I mean, despite what our parents told us, when did we ever win as children when we told the truth?
Sorry to be so cynical…

kadaka

The Google ad:
“Master of Arts in Diplomacy
Norwich University”
BTW, 51 going on 52? How old is that photo?
Reply: I saw the same ad and thought it was hysterical. The photo is a couple months old. Most people think I look in my mid to late 30’s. This is good because I am very immature for my age. ~ ctm

Curiousgeorge

Let me get this straight. You are a US Citizen, being investigated by a a local British Constable? Have they contacted the State Dept.? Or bothered to coordinate with a US Police Dept. that has jurisdiction? If not, I’d tell them to piss off.

Michael

Carbon Market Update
Wrapped in the Man-made Climate Change Meme, the money to fund the worldwide global governance carbon tax is being financed through offshore island wealth funds. It seams the elite of the world are still hell bent on implementing the global carbon tax despite the climate change hoax being exposed.
“Islands of money
At present, almost US$13 trillion in secrecy-protected wealth is held offshore and out of reach. If moderately taxed, these funds would yield over $250 billion. Such funds could more than finance the Millennium Development Goals, which are estimated by the World Bank at $40 billion to $60 billion annually through 2015. They could also go toward the adaption and mitigation funds needed by developing and emerging nations, which the UN puts at $4 billion to $86 billion annually.
The recovery of this illicit capital will be difficult. The islands that host these accounts are dependent on this revenue. The economy of the Seychelles is dependent on the financial sector for 11% of its GDP. This puts the Seychelles not far behind the notorious Cayman Islands, the world’s fifth-largest financial center, where financial services account for 14% of GDP. Switzerland, which launders one-third of all illicit capital, depends on financial services for 15% of its GDP. ”
“Meanwhile, Group of 20 (G-20) governments subsidized fossil fuels to the tune of $300 billion in 2009. So, as the G-20 spends its time creating a carbon trade market that does little to reduce carbon emissions, multinationals continue to expand their extractive enterprises, dictators continue to siphon off capital, financial firms cash in on pollution credits, and this illicit capital continues to flow into offshore locations that are themselves threatened by the rising waters associated with global warming.”
Climate Change’s Secret Weapon
http://www.atimes.com/atimes/Global_Economy/LB26Dj02.html

Greg Cavanagh

Lee Kington (16:04:08) :
It was the CRU team that made the original claim of hack and theft. The police got involved because of the claimed “theft”. The police investigation may go on for a long time; they will be thorough and bring charges only when they have sufficient evidence to prosecute.
Whitewashing can only be done by the University itself, the police are a red hearing in all this and their final outcomes are unpredictable at this point in time. Though it should also be remembered, they are investigating the reported hack and theft, not the science.

Gary Hladik

steven mosher (15:47:00) : “How long have you been public with the facts of the case and they are just contacting you.”
The wheels of justice may grind slowy, but they grind…uh…slowly.

Robert of Ottawa

Mr. Plod is still investigating “The Theft”. Hmm, it’ll be a long time before they uncover anything, I think. Possibly they will cover it up before they uncover it :-^

Robert of Ottawa

Clue Game!
It was Jones, in the washroom, with his portable!

[quote Pascvaks (16:03:00) :]
Sounds like the beginning of an Agatha Christy mystery.
[/quote]

And a new mystery cliche for the technology age:
The moderator did it!

Ian

As a Brit, we do sort of like the “slowly slowly catchee monkey” approach of our “plod” (cops). Despite the attempted politicisation of the UK police by the “guv’mint” there are still some good guys out there.
Take it for what it is, answer the questions, tell the truth and put the boot in, where it belongs.
You might be surprised.
Believe it or not some of them don’t believe in AGW either, especially the ones in my neighbourhood. (600 feet above sea level, overlooking Loch Ness with 3 foot snow drifts outside). Nothing new, it was worse in the 1970s. Worse still in the 1960s, but i was just a “waen” then!
Best wishes
Ian

Carbon Dioxide

No- it was Mann, in the common room with the hockey stick!

Sharon

Pascvaks (16:03:00) :
Sounds like the beginning of an Agatha Christy mystery
*************************************
Or an episode of “Mystery!”
You know, something tells me Climategate is the absolute last thing the Norfolk PD wants to investigate.

climatebeagle

I would guess they call it a theft because that’s what they were asked to investigate by CRU. Not sure the police would have the authority to investigate a whistleblower. Their investigation may come to the conclusion that it was not theft.

cedarhill

One should be very suspicious of detectives. They told you it’s a criminal case (theft). They’re not asking you questions just to fill in their story but, imho, looking at you as a person of interest or at least potential person of interest. You should have asked a lawyer before responding and had the lawyer email them. You should not have responded via email. You should have dropped a note in the mail to their address, made a copy, and got a receipt from the postal service. Consider:
They may want you to respond by email so they can track your MAC address so they can use that for tracking and use, if needed, as circumstantial evidence against you. It’s sort of like asking for your DNA. If that’s what they wanted and to confirm the MAC and tie it to you, the noose is tightening for whatever crime/infraction/et al the UK penal code and international treaties may yield.
The request, especially the “any other knowledge” is about as broad as they get and is potentially dangerous. if you’re foolish enough to talk to them without a lawyer present at least get a really good recorder and make 100% certain that you tell them you’re recording the conversation and be sure to get a device that does the “beep” periodically.
You should ask, directly, if you are under suspicion of any crime, wrongdoing, ethics breach or responsible in any legal manner to their knowledge. Ask how many other FOI requests they’re checking out, whether you’re the first, whether there is any special reason for them talking to you versus the dozens of other that filed FOI, etc. Ask if they consider you a material witness. Ask if they’re considering charges. I.E., you should question them to the same extent they question you. They won’t likely tell you but it will sound better on the record and may help if you need to consider entrapment. Plus, you are not compelled to answer any question, period. It’s ok to just say “see what I wrote”. After all, perjury is a possibility – don’t forget what happened to Scooter Libby.
You’re a player in the publication of the subject matter of the theft. If you were my client, I’d just refer them to the what you’ve already written and simply not talk to them at all unless and until they gave you a legally binding written statement that you will not be prosecuted. Period.
I’d ignore the rather cavalier/libertarian advise and comments on this thread. Extreme caution should be your guide. It’s a lot easier to avoid a charge that to defend one. And it’s your skin, not theirs.

Carbon Dioxide

Your joking Sharon!!!
This is the most exiting thing to happen in Norfolk in years!

kadaka

Gary Hladik (16:31:50) :
The wheels of justice may grind slowy, but they grind…uh…slowly.

They grind exceedingly fine… yielding a light powder that gets into the air and spreads everywhere… then comes a spark…

Neil Crafter

“Pascvaks (16:03:00) :
Sounds like the beginning of an Agatha Christy mystery.”
Is that John Christy’s mother perhaps?? 😉

Pamela Gray

I’was the janitor what done im in!

NickB.

Didn’t think about the jurisdiction issue – should have told him you’ll help them out with their hacking as soon as they hand over the DoD assburgers hacker 😛

Carbon Dioxide

For Norfolk, think endless miles of carrot fields. An endless vista of agricultural flatness as far as the eye can see.
Antique dealers with insecure loads on their roof racks is pretty much the extent of law breaking in this corner of the Queen’s realm. 🙂

wws

From someone who has some involvement with the legal system, this investigator is just doing his job. It is altogether proper that he not just copy files from the internet, but that he personally contact everyone who may have some input and ask them what they have to say, including people in other countries than his own. I would be very surprised if this man will make the decision about where to go next; typically several people will work tracking down information and after it is accumulated a decision about where to go next will be made one or two levels up the organization.
Understand that he is just a researcher, in the same way that scientists are researchers. At this stage it is his job to make sure that the questions are asked all the way around, and that all of the answers are as complete as possible.
and a handy thing to remember if you are ever involved in *any* investigation, in the US or the UK – very often the investigator does indeed know most of the facts of the story already. He is asking not just to seek confirmation, but more importantly to observe the reaction he gets. Someone who freaks out at a set of completely ordinary questions is someone who is sending up huge red flags that there is something more to look at. Always cooperate, always be calm, just as CTM was here.