Pants on fire and all that – but well deserved. Kudos to Pielke Jr, for speaking out.
http://rogerpielkejr.blogspot.com/2012/05/joe-romm-is-liar.html
He says it isn’t the first time. It will be interesting to see Joe Romm’s reaction spin to this charge.
It seems that Heartland has listed Roger Pielke Jr. as one of their experts here:
http://heartland.org/roger-pielke
But from Pielke’s tone and description, I think both Heartland and Romm have erred.
As I see it, Romm put a question mark on the end of his post, suggesting he’s unsure…but went ahead with the story anyway and used the question mark as his “out”.
I think what Pielke Jr. is saying is that he has no professional relationship with Heartland, and on that point I believe him. He’s never been to one of the conferences that I know of. Nether has Pielke Sr. I think Heartland has listed a number of people in that page that aren’t necessarily part of any official relationship.
Lately, much of the climate debate has devolved into personal attacks/smears and tit for tat infowars. It’s not doing anyone any good.
UPDATE: In May 2011, RP Jr. wrote this about Romm:
It is long overdue for the environmental community to start pushing back on Romm as he continues to stain their entire enterprise. His lies and smear tactics, which are broadly embraced and condoned, are making enemies out of friends and opponents out of fellow travelers. Vigorous debate is welcome and healthy. Lies and character assassination not so much.
I concur. Romm and the whole ThinkProgress team use poisonous tactics, but that’s part of the MO for the Soros funded center for American Progress. On the plus side, most reasonable people with critical thinking skills can see right through these guys, so they tend to turn off the very people they are trying to reach, leaving ThinkProgress left with the bereft.
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Unfortunately, Pielke Jr.takes their bait. Now they have a sound bite/quote saying not only is he not an expert for Heartland, but “I have absolutely no relationship with Heartland — never have, never will. Period”.
More food for the attack dogs to futher marginalize Heartland. Shame.
From the first comment on http://rogerpielkejr.blogspot.com/2012/05/joe-romm-is-liar.html it would appear that Heartland are listingRoger Pielke Jr. as one of their experts.
There would appear to be a fair number of loose canons around at the moment.
REPLY: What Pielke is saying is that he has no professional relationship with Heartland, and on that point I believe him. He’s never been to one of the conferences that I know of. Nether has Pielke Sr. I think Heartland has listed a number of people in that page that aren’t necessarily part of any official relationship. – Anthony
“Lately, much of the climate debate has devolved into personal attacks/smears and tit for tat infowars. It’s not doing anyone any good.”
Was it not bound to happen as the CAGW / AGW false hypothesis collapsed?
I’d have just kept them guessing…Just my thoughts
I think Heartland has listed a number of people in that page that aren’t necessarily part of any official relationship.
Must just be more of that “battle fatigue” right?
REPLY: Go ahead, spin away, make my day! – Anthony
Tit for tat is a heck of a lot better than it was than before, when there no tat was allowed.
Ha ha ha ha…Maybe Heartland should list Romm, Jones, Briffa, Mann, Schmidt et al…..snicklers
Moderator, please give up on making sense of that and I’ll try to do better.
It is also possible that the page is a listing of the people that Heartland recommends or trusts and considers competent authorities in their field. Sort of a “we trust these people” listing.
Lots of web sites list resources that they consider trustworthy.
If you use the filter options on the right hand side of the page Pielke comes back as a “global warming expert”, if you search under “experts” he does not get selected. The “Policy adviser” does not return any experts.
I don’t think the intent was to imply a professional relationship, but to list them as people who are respected in their fields.
Larry
REPLY: Heartland should make that clear, so as to not give ammo to Romm types, of course next, I’ll expect Romm will claim they are hypocritical because they have the color green in the Heartland web page header. – Anthony
Larry Ledwick (hotrod ) says:
May 9, 2012 at 6:03 pm
Good Catch!
+1
I think Heartland has listed a number of people in that page that aren’t necessarily part of any official relationship. – Anthony
======
You are possibly way out of your depth, Anthony.
Start reinforcing the flanks, and bring up the reserves.
REPLY: Go ahead, spin away, make my day! – Anthony
I’m not spinning anything; I’m just reminding you that you still haven’t properly criticized Heartland for their offensive billboard. And here it is, days later, by which time the “battle fatigue” should have worn off and you should be able to let your readers know that what Heartland did was wrong, was over the top and clearly offensive, and that Heartland should issue a formal apology to the thousands of honest scientists who do valuable, legitimate climate research, that they just so happen to disagree with. Instead, you choose to call Joe Romm a liar. I’ve read his post. Can you quote verbatim here anything he’s written that is a lie? No, you can’t. So you must just be suffering from “battle fatigue.” Time to rotate off the front lines, Anthony!
REPLY: Excellent spin, you’ve made my day. And, like Romm, you haven’t a clue, only your memes. – Anthony
Phil C says:
“…you that you still haven’t properly criticized Heartland for their offensive billboard.”
Phil C, you do not understand. Heartland told the truth. You just don’t like the truth.
The fact is that Ted Kazynski, Al Gore, Joe Romm, Fidel Castro, Charles Manson and you all believe the same nonsense.
Heartland did nothing wrong. It told the truth. If you don’t like hearing the truth, tough noogies.
Phil C says:
May 9, 2012 at 6:24 pm
“Instead, you choose to call Joe Romm a liar.”
xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Reference please
Phil C:
I am not Mr. Watts, but I certainly know that Mr. Romm is a liar. I have tried to correct him numerous times, but somehow my post never gets posted.
Now I don’t bother to go to his site since he posts so many falsehoods and is not man enough to allow someone to show where he is flat out wrong. Why bother with idiots?
The Heartland site says “Heartland Experts”
And then proceeds to talk about Pielke.
http://heartland.org/roger-pielke
If you work really hard…they will give you training pants…and then big girl panties
Tom,
So what? Read what hotrod said above: “Lots of web sites list resources that they consider trustworthy.” Got it, now?
I had twenty hours in a car with my alarmist sister this week. It turned out that her big concern was water in Manhattan. Freaking elitists. But, she’s been schooled, thanks to you, Anthony.
@ur momisugly Smokey;
So to be clear, you are endorsing that in order to properly understand what Heartland is saying you need to interpret the page after going through convoluted and inconsistent navigation and then cross-correlate on the “experts” personal blog to properly understand the affiliation?
It would seem to make a lot more sense for Pielke to call out Heartland for being misleading…
Anthony says “Lately, much of the climate debate has devolved into personal attacks/smears and tit for tat infowars”
Interesting. Given than the majority of comments here tend to make personal attacks on people that accept the science I wonder what might be done here leading by example?
REPLY: Great, I’ll round up all the comments like that you’ve made here, including the ones under fake names, and you can critique them – Cheers, Anthony
Romm habitually hides lies behind question marks.
Yawn.
Thanks Anthony, Romm knows he has erred, as he has updated his post twice now, and the title as well. He has also visited my blog trying to explain his efforts. I suggest that your commenters visit his site and (politely please) let him know that such dishonorable behavior is not acceptable — on any side of this debate. Thanks.
Tom,
Apparently Anthony knows you are a multi-screen-name sock puppet. Given that, don’t you see your glaring hypocrisy? You get to comment here all you want, under different names, while skeptics are moderated out of existence by Romm, RealClimate, and the rest of their ilk.
Personally, I do not attack “people that accept the science”. I attack pseudo-science, and the climate charlatans who hide out from debate. So go lead by example yourself, and tell your boy Romm to start posting skeptics’ comments. He won’t, of course, because he would quickly lose the debate. So he censors.
“The science” means science according to the scientific method, which requires full transparency. Wake me when the charlatans decide to be transparent. Until then, they’re preaching anti-science.
A quibble:
“Lately, much of the climate debate has devolved into personal attacks/smears
and tit for tat infowars. It’s not doing anyone any good.”
The Climategate emails would indicate that personal attacks/smears were a modus operandi of the CAGW alarmists for years. It did the CAGW side a lot of good in that it has delayed the reckoning for years.
Regards,
Steamboat Jack (Jon Jewett’s evil twin)