Greens Demonizing Greenhouse Gas Emitting Gas Cookers

Guest essay by Eric Worrall

Hobgoblins in your kitchen, to frighten you into switching to a climate friendly electric cooker.

Your Natural Gas Stove Is Fueling Climate Change And Harming Your Health—And It’s Worse Than Scientists Thought

Jeff Kart
Contributor Sustainability

For those of us who enjoy cooking meals with natural gas, there’s a warning from scientists at Stanford University. 

You may have heard that natural gas stoves generate carbon dioxide by burning natural gas as a fuel. It makes sense. 

But natural gas stoves also leak unburned methane into the air, a greenhouse gas that’s 86 times as potent as carbon dioxide (CO2) over a 20-year period. Researchers found that this leaking has a climate impact comparable to the carbon dioxide emissions from a half-million cars. 

Home methane leaks contribute to a third as much warming as the carbon dioxide generated by combustion during cooking. Gas stoves also can expose users to respiratory, disease-triggering pollutants like nitrogen oxides (NOx).

Read more: https://www.forbes.com/sites/jeffkart/2022/01/27/your-natural-gas-stove-is-fueling-climate-change-and-harming-your-health-and-its-worse-than-scientists-thought/?sh=718329222c63

Food chemistry is great fun if you don’t enjoy peace of mind. Nitrous oxides and nitric acid produced from gas flames is nothing compares to what happens to the food IN the cooker. Frying is especially naughty – deep frying at high temperatures, and likely pan frying, creates dioxane and acrylamide, and a host of other chemical nasties.

Of course, if you think about all this too much, the worry is more likely to kill you than any actual toxins in your food. Stress is bad for your heart.

You know what? I think I’ll keep my gas cooker, and keep enjoying life.

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Tom Halla
January 30, 2022 10:05 am

Forbes has obviously jumped the shark into full up Green Blob insanity.

Scissor
Reply to  Tom Halla
January 30, 2022 10:08 am

And Forbes is a “conservative” publication. They should ask for sustainable government.

Walter Horsting
Reply to  Scissor
January 30, 2022 10:18 am

Was! Deep progressive ownership has corrupted both Forbes and SciAm ….not to mention PopSci, Wired…and others…

Punta Gorda
Reply to  Walter Horsting
January 30, 2022 1:26 pm

I told SciAm to cancel my subscription years ago. Too liberal and always pushing the Green scam.

Plus they kept adding syllables to my name. If they can’t get that correct, it’s pretty obvious their accuracy is in question.

Last edited 5 months ago by Punta Gorda
lee riffee
Reply to  Walter Horsting
January 30, 2022 3:33 pm

Sadly there are no good science magazines around these days. I gave up on Sci Am over a decade ago due to the AGW garbage they kept peddling. All I have now is a subscription to Discover. It, like all of the others, toes the AGW line, but for the most part they only devote perhaps a page or two out of a 90+ page magazine to it.

John
Reply to  lee riffee
January 30, 2022 7:13 pm

not just that
all the Engineering Magazines are the same
Australia (IEAust)
UK (IChemE)
America (ACheme)

they think engineers are illiterate so they keep publishing ESG bs and other crap because they hire Politically Correct morons

bonbon
Reply to  Scissor
January 30, 2022 11:34 am

Sustainable government – we already had that when Carl Schmidt declared elections were not necessary, the best one was already in place!

John Garrett
Reply to  Scissor
January 30, 2022 12:43 pm

It went to hell after the Forbes family sold it.

B. C. and Malcolm Forbes are rolling over in their graves and I suspect Steve Forbes and the rest of the family regret selling to the yokels who now own it.

dk_
Reply to  Scissor
January 30, 2022 1:50 pm

Sadly, Scissor, there is a great deal of buy-in to AGW and woke investment economics by allegedly conservative groups and individuals. The draw is that there are huge profits and rent-seeking positions available to early adopters and for virtue signaling support for impossible programs and agendas. Mike Bloomberg and Tom Steyer are just two examples.

Trying to Play Nice
Reply to  dk_
January 31, 2022 8:55 am

I’ve never seen either of those names in the same sentence with the word “conservative”.

Carl44
Reply to  Tom Halla
January 30, 2022 11:41 am

I believe the majority owner of Forbes is a Chinese company.

Richard Page
Reply to  Tom Halla
January 30, 2022 12:10 pm

Somebody ought to break it to them that gas cookers emit far less CO2 than the, so-called, ‘green’ electricity. It’s a con job once again – “conform, conform!”

Scissor
January 30, 2022 10:05 am

Get ready. It’s just a matter of time that we are asked to stay indoors, isolate to flatten the global warming curve.

bonbon
Reply to  Scissor
January 30, 2022 11:38 am

Yeah, indoors with the window open in the blizzard!
Chaplin – the Gold Rush :

Editor
Reply to  bonbon
January 30, 2022 12:45 pm

Thanks, bonbon.

That clip reminded me of W.C. Fields from the movie The Fatal Glass of Beer, saying “It ain’t a fit night out for man nor beast,” each time he opened the cabin door.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nOJVk79N_t4&ab_channel=joemckechnie

Regards,
Bob

william Johnston
January 30, 2022 10:07 am

I will take my steak medium rare from my gas grill, thank you very much!

Scissor
Reply to  william Johnston
January 30, 2022 10:23 am

I’m with you.

I had the pleasure to enjoy an excellent medium rare filet mignon at the Capital Grille Houston Galleria earlier this week. I understand that they pan sear then finish off in an oven.

Kenji
Reply to  Scissor
January 30, 2022 11:02 am

That’s how I cook most of my steaks in the wintertime. In the summer, I use the outdoor propane grill. However, in my community there is some absolute azzhole who sells “PurpleAir” air “quality” monitors … and he claims that Co2 spikes occur at dinner time in the summer … and scolds everyone to STOP firing up their BBQ’s because … the children. Think of the children’s health …

Joseph Zorzin
Reply to  Kenji
January 30, 2022 11:18 am

and the polar bears

H.R.
Reply to  Kenji
January 30, 2022 11:28 am

I find that a plastic bag over my head, cinched at the neck, keeps all that bad ol’ air out.

Perhaps you should suggest it to that neighbor if he’s so afraid of breathing.

Reply to  william Johnston
January 30, 2022 10:44 am

Just charcoal for me, thank you!

Kenji
Reply to  writing observer
January 30, 2022 11:05 am

Too many “spare the air” days in CA … the army of air quality sniffers will find you and FINE you for fouling the air with your DIRTY bbq.

Reply to  Kenji
January 30, 2022 5:27 pm

If a Commisar of the People’s Republic shows up, trying to interfere with my BBQ, I’ll simply make a citizen’s arrest for trespass. I can still do that in Arizona.

(I think that you can simply shoot them in Texas?)

bonbon
Reply to  william Johnston
January 30, 2022 11:44 am

Sure, the gas grill is great, but to do justice to a 3cm thick rib-eye :
Dumas, Chef, Quebec:

https://youtu.be/Kd80mYv8Z2M?t=280

Think what the alarmists do when you light the Cognac!

rd50
Reply to  bonbon
January 30, 2022 7:43 pm

OK. I want to go next time I am in Quebec. Delicious.

alastair gray
Reply to  william Johnston
January 30, 2022 2:09 pm

and the more flatulent the bullock the better

DMacKenzie
Reply to  william Johnston
January 30, 2022 9:24 pm

I could get an electric BBQ, but the electricity comes from a natural gas power station at most of the times I want to grill, and it really tastes a lot better done with gas….

Michael S. Kelly
Reply to  DMacKenzie
January 31, 2022 5:41 am

I actually have a Phillips countertop infrared grill, and love it. Cooks like an outdoor grill, and cleans up by putting the grill and drip pan in the dishwasher – and that’s it. The cook is even, predictable, and controllable. For just my wife and me, it is ideal for a quick steak with garlic toast.

That said, I can’t stand cooking on an electric or induction cooktop. It’s gas, and nothing but gas for me.

Last edited 5 months ago by Michael S. Kelly
Oldseadog
Reply to  william Johnston
January 31, 2022 2:08 am

I believe in the civilising effect of cooking with fire and don’t like my food partly raw so it is very well done for me.
I once confused a waiter in Singapore by say that my Australian steak was still moo-ing and please to take it back to the kitchen and cook it.

Pat from Kerbob
Reply to  Oldseadog
January 31, 2022 12:55 pm

Ah yes, when i was in australia i noticed that the steak was cooked until dust comes out of it, the english disease.
I had to send steaks back several times for new ones, no one particularly happy

Ben Vorlich
January 30, 2022 10:10 am

Well it had to be worse than they thought. But probably not as bad as cooking using cow or chicken dung, or even wood.

January 30, 2022 10:13 am

Why only Greens always are farting ut of their brain ??? 😀

Last edited 5 months ago by Krishna Gans
Quelgeek
January 30, 2022 10:15 am

First they came for the gas cookers…

This is just the opening salvo. Home cooking is energy intensive no matter how you do it and most of the energy goes into heating the appliances and the pots and pans and water that gets discarded, not the food. Mark my words, next we will be exhorted to eat only in canteens, or failing that, to microwave prepared foods. Once they manage that, they don’t even need to try to persuade us to go vegan because we’ll only be able to eat what we’re given.

Last edited 5 months ago by Quelgeek
Geoffrey Williams
Reply to  Quelgeek
January 30, 2022 12:22 pm

It’s all part of the ‘edge of the wedge’ . .

Clyde Spencer
Reply to  Quelgeek
January 30, 2022 3:50 pm

Spoylent Green

Tom.1
January 30, 2022 10:22 am

Funny thing happened. My wife and I have always loved gas stoves, and we could never imagine cooking on anything else. We moved into a new house a couple of years ago, and it had an electric cooktop. We immediately began to plan on how we were going to replace it with gas. But, the electric cooktop was induction, and we have grown to love it, especially since the top is so easy to clean. That said, gas is probably still better for cooking overall, and I won’t lose any sleep over it destroying the planet.

commieBob
Reply to  Tom.1
January 30, 2022 11:01 am

We have a gas range and will keep that until one of two things happens:

1 – We become forgetful and there’s a serious chance we might forget to turn off the gas burner. The induction cooker is way better in that regard.
2 – One of the valves on the gas range fails and we can’t get a replacement.

Our children have induction ranges and they’re a delight to cook on. For some things they’re actually better than gas.

On the other hand, our winter gas bills are large and our summer gas bills are tiny. Most of our summer gas usage is for the water heater. Cooking consumes a tiny amount of the natural gas we use.

Going after gas stoves would have about the same effect on greenhouse gases as forbidding night lights in the baby’s bedroom. Something like that.

Joseph Zorzin
Reply to  commieBob
January 30, 2022 11:21 am

they’ll come for those night lights next….

AndyHce
Reply to  Joseph Zorzin
January 31, 2022 2:39 am

or the kids?

Tom in Florida
Reply to  commieBob
January 30, 2022 6:51 pm

Induction ranges are good until you need a pacemaker.

lee riffee
Reply to  Tom.1
January 30, 2022 3:23 pm

Sounds like you lucked out. Every place I’ve lived in the last 20 or so years has had a glass cook top (non-induction) and my experience is that they are hard to clean and if you choose to use cast iron pans you have to be very careful not to crack the glass. Also, unlike the old coil-style burners, glass cook tops take forever to heat up and cool down. If I was stuck with electric, I’d opt for the coil burners.

AndyHce
Reply to  lee riffee
January 31, 2022 2:41 am

Ive been wondering about infrared stove tops. They are a single sealed top, very much to my liking. They claim rapid heating and precise temperature control. I don’t know anyone who has used one, however, and couldn’t find any reviews that compared them with other options.

Last edited 5 months ago by AndyHce
Lance Wallace
January 30, 2022 10:25 am

Electric stoves are not clean. They emit ultrafine particles in quantities comparable to gas stoves. The mechanism however is completely different. In the gas stove, UFPs are created in the flame. For electric stoves, they are (probably) created from a surface film of semivolatile organics (in every home from plastics, furniture, etc.), which boil off as the temperature increases, reach saturation a few cm above the stove, and then nucleate to form UFPs.

https://pubs.acs.org/doi/10.1021/acs.est.6b03248

Ebor
Reply to  Lance Wallace
January 30, 2022 10:31 am

Dammit – no matter what we do we’re F-d!!!

Mr.
Reply to  Ebor
January 30, 2022 10:56 am

Such is life.

Scissor
Reply to  Lance Wallace
January 30, 2022 11:02 am

ES&T is going down in quality apparently. Much of the data given in the table in the supporting information consist of 17 and 18 significant figure cell entries.

Al foil was exposed for 3.5840277777824667 days.

Reply to  Scissor
January 30, 2022 12:10 pm

Never underestimate nanoseconds. They must be using some fantastic quality timers.

MarkW
Reply to  Curious George
January 31, 2022 6:46 am

Forget nanoseconds, he’s down to femto seconds.

Elle Webber
Reply to  Lance Wallace
January 30, 2022 11:04 am

I think the intention is to have us allowed only electric stoves—and then to turn off our electricity.

Disputin
Reply to  Elle Webber
January 30, 2022 11:42 am

You mean with a “Smart” (i.e. hopelessly stupid) meter?

Scissor
Reply to  Elle Webber
January 30, 2022 12:31 pm

Make sure you boil the water when the power is out.

Smart Rock
Reply to  Elle Webber
January 30, 2022 4:31 pm

They won’t actually turn your electricity off unless you vote for the wrong candidates, or engage in other egregious examples of wrongthink. But it will of course be intermittent and highly rationed, and you will be obliged to engage in spontaneous public demonstrations of gratitude when your ration is increased from 10 kWh to 12 kWh a week.

Don’t forget – you will own nothing and you will be happy. Or else!

joe
Reply to  Lance Wallace
January 30, 2022 12:46 pm

i find ufps to be a flavor enhancer.

Ebor
January 30, 2022 10:28 am

This complete bull crap is beginning to make me regret not spending the $30K+ to get a gas range, propane tank installed and plumbed, and a whole-house propane generator…better get going on that…

Ed Zuiderwijk
January 30, 2022 10:31 am

A juvenile ignoramus farts.

John Bell
January 30, 2022 10:52 am

Another article from the same Jeff Kart:

“A technology company called Our Next Energy (ONE) says it’s demonstrated a prototype battery in an electric vehicle that traveled 752 miles without recharging. The experimental battery, retrofitted into a 2021 Tesla Model S, drove across Michigan in late December at an average speed of 55 mph, ONE says.”

That is a pretty good trick! Hard to believe it.

John Hultquist
Reply to  John Bell
January 30, 2022 11:08 am

 Because of improvements in battery chemistry and motor innovations, such feats will be possible. The one you mention, link is below.
Thus, “range anxiety” will not be a problem for EVs individually. All other criticisms still apply.

“Our Next Energy” Tests Its 750-Mile Range Prototype Battery In A Tesla Model S – CleanTechnica

Joseph Zorzin
Reply to  John Hultquist
January 30, 2022 11:32 am

that site shows a photo of the battery but no dimensions, no cost, and didn’t mention the weight- it’s still just a prototype so I don’t suppose they can offer a cost when its in production

Ijaz explained why he picked a Tesla Model S to demonstrate the new prototype battery.

“It has fairly high efficiency and a fairly large battery pack.”

And a fairly high price for the Model S. Now try it in a low end EV- the kind that we peons will have to buy unless we learn to live with a mule.

MarkW
Reply to  John Hultquist
January 31, 2022 6:50 am

Unless they have invented a new element, major improvements in battery chemistry are unlikely.
Electric motors have been around 90% efficient for 100 years now. Even getting them up to 100% efficient (utterly impossible) wouldn’t result in a doubling of range.

Scissor
Reply to  John Bell
January 30, 2022 11:12 am

“The results were validated by a third party using a vehicle dynamometer where the test vehicle, a Telsa Model S retrofitted with an experimental battery, achieved 882 miles at 55 mph.”

It’s a start. The trip across Michigan, about 170 miles, is more of a real world demonstration.

Joseph Zorzin
Reply to  John Bell
January 30, 2022 11:25 am

I wonder how many sticks of dynamite it’s equivalent to if it blows up.

Paul
Reply to  John Bell
January 30, 2022 4:57 pm

I can’t imagine driving 7-800 miles at 55 mph

MarkW
Reply to  Paul
January 31, 2022 6:51 am

In most of the country, driving at 55mph is going to get you rear ended.

MarkW
Reply to  John Bell
January 31, 2022 6:48 am

I suspect they removed the back seat to make room for a bigger battery.

Trying to Play Nice
Reply to  John Bell
January 31, 2022 9:04 am

Their odometer must have been a little off. Michigan is not anywhere near 752 miles across. And you probably would have a hard time driving 55 mph without getting shot or run off the road.

Alan Watt, Climate Denialist Level 7
January 30, 2022 10:54 am

Jeff Kart, Contributor Sustainability Section. His bio at Forbes:

I focus on interesting, innovative and revolutionary U.S. stories about green startups and nongovernmental organizations as a Forbes contributor. I’m an environmental communications consultant. That means I spent 20 years in print newspapers until the bottom fell out around 2010. I’ve been in the virtual world since then as a blogger, writer, editor and social media manager. I author a weekly public radio show on the environment in Bay City, Michigan, where I go by the moniker Mr. Great Lakes. I received a bachelor’s in journalism from Michigan State University, a master’s in environmental studies from University of Illinois at Springfield and have completed numerous fellowships and been a featured speaker on environmental reporting and social media at a number of conferences. I love camping. I’m a voracious reader who prefers horror and thrillers as an escape.

Translation: no experience actually making anything work, even as a hobby. His professional writing reflects his declared fondness for “horror and thrillers”.

Scissor
Reply to  Alan Watt, Climate Denialist Level 7
January 30, 2022 11:14 am

People like him who are in charge are adept at making horror a reality.

bonbon
Reply to  Alan Watt, Climate Denialist Level 7
January 30, 2022 11:48 am

As a lover of camping, does he set a fire,grill a fish? With wood or a camping burner?
Fires keep the cloud of flies off…

Richard Page
Reply to  Alan Watt, Climate Denialist Level 7
January 30, 2022 12:06 pm

So he’s a big fan of escapism and fantasy, but not so much of reality? Says it all really, doesn’t it?

Clyde Spencer
Reply to  Alan Watt, Climate Denialist Level 7
January 30, 2022 3:59 pm

environmental communications consultant

Reminds of of the graduate marketing manager survivor from the B Ark. “Alright, if you’re so smart, what color would you paint the hexagon?”

RevJay4
January 30, 2022 11:01 am

Its always something…no win for the little people living a comfortable life.
Morons everywhere and they’re all liberals or commie b*stards, same thing actually.

Tony
January 30, 2022 11:29 am

It always amazes me that it is blithely assumed that electricity delivered to your home or business is free of green house gas emissions or produces less GHGs than burning gas directly. Even assuming that the GHG emissions due to delivering the gas to its point of use are greater than for delivering the gas to a power plant, losses in the electricity system (40% efficiency for the generation of electricity and line losses etc} would surely push up the GHG emissions above those of burning the gas directly.

Chaswarnertoo
Reply to  Tony
January 30, 2022 11:07 pm

Much like ‘electric’ ( coal fired ) cars. What’s wrong with LPG?

King Coal
January 30, 2022 11:30 am

Who cares what the green blob thinks or says?!
just ignore them, in that, ignorance truly is bliss

Rob_Dawg
January 30, 2022 11:31 am

Restaurants with legacy gas cooking will be like taxi medallions.

Compare these two:
Transport gas lossless to homes, heat eggs.

Transport gas to generator, make steam with losses, turn turbines with losses, transport electricity with losses to substations with losses, convert to AC with losses, accept anything not used is lost, heat electric elements, burn eggs, heat hot water to scrub burned pan. Smile at successfully virtue signaling.

MarkW
Reply to  Rob_Dawg
January 31, 2022 6:54 am

Transporting gas is not lossless, even in pipes.

Rob_Dawg
Reply to  MarkW
February 1, 2022 1:38 pm

I dismissed the two head to burn paths as a rounding to zero.

Pat from kerbob
January 30, 2022 11:31 am

Ok have over 50 houseplants in my calgary house and all are noticeably happier when I installed the gas range/oven

Gas roolz

MarkW
Reply to  Pat from kerbob
January 31, 2022 6:56 am

We’ve all heard of those people who claim that talking to their plants makes them healthier.
I’ve always suspected that it was actually all the CO2 that they were exhaling onto their plants that was making them healthier.

Pat from Kerbob
Reply to  MarkW
January 31, 2022 12:59 pm

That too but i do most of my talking with the keyboard on here, no co2

January 30, 2022 11:35 am

We need a smart PR person to create an international movement FOGS (Friends of Gas Stoves) flying a flag SOS Save Our Stoves to warn everyone on the planet who uses gas for cooking what the RE loonies are up to.

Disputin
January 30, 2022 11:36 am

I’ve got Hobgoblins in my kitchen – brewed by Wychwood Brewery. And very good they are, too! Hard luck on those who live in less enlightened parts of the world.

Scissor
Reply to  Disputin
January 30, 2022 4:29 pm

Talked me into it.

John in Cheshire
January 30, 2022 11:38 am

Isn’t it true that if all of the Greens ceased to exist, there would be no climate problem?

Richard Page
Reply to  John in Cheshire
January 30, 2022 12:08 pm

As well as a reduction in stress levels and government’s worth their pay (well I can dream!).

MarkW
Reply to  John in Cheshire
January 31, 2022 6:58 am

I can only imagine how much the economies of the world would improve.

Laws of Nature
January 30, 2022 11:40 am

>>a climate friendly electric cooker.
That might hugely depending on the situation and the dish you are cooking!
Gas and electric stoves have intrinsic losses, I am not at all convinces which one wins over the other overal!

Clyde Spencer
Reply to  Laws of Nature
January 30, 2022 4:01 pm

It isn’t about efficiency, its about personal choice. You should be free to make the choice rather than be forced to accept what the government tells you that you have to use.

Philip
January 30, 2022 11:59 am

When we moved to this house, it was all electric. Neither my wife nor myself really liked cooking on an electric range (having grown up cooking on gas). One of the neighbors had regular heart attacks when his electricity bills arrived, so he persuaded a couple of other to join him in trying to get natural gas laid in. They succeeded, and we had a quote for runing it up to our house. The killer was that they insisted that they would replace a perfectly good heat-pump based HVAC system with a gas one. What about AC? Does gas do that??? Of course not, we would have to see to that ourselves. Ok, how about just running a gas pipe? $25k.

Of course, we didn’t bite. Those that did, and have no AC sometimes seem to regret it…

Anyway. We still wanted a gas range. A local gas fitter ran a gas pipe for us from the kitchen to an outside wall. A 30lbs propane tank, and a propane gas range works just fine. The 30lbs tank lasts about a year.

No methane from my gas range!

lee riffee
Reply to  Philip
January 30, 2022 3:10 pm

That’s why my husband and I are planning on doing one day – we have no city gas available at all and don’t anticipate it ever being available. For now we deal with the glass cooktop , which takes forever and a day to heat up and cool down, plus it’s a bear to keep clean. My husband said if he has to stay with electric he’d much rather have a cook top with the old-style coil burners. At least then we’d be able to use cast iron pans without the risk of cracking the glass top.
As for heat, we would like to convert our oil boiler to propane, but that is a less pressing concern. When the boiler has to be replaced, we may look into it then. For my local climate (central Maryland – Baltimore area), heat pumps stink on ice. Winter nights are regularly below freezing and all they do is blow cold air. No thanks….I’m either going to continue to burn the byproducts of 300 million year old dead trees, or, if I have to, I’ll burn very recently dead trees in my woodstove.

Philip
Reply to  lee riffee
January 30, 2022 3:50 pm

Here in the Oregon Willamette Valley, it’s rare for the temperature to fall below freezing. The heat pump works fine most of the time. When it gets near and below freezing there are resistive heat strips that kick in – electricity meter starts to spin fast though. So it works pretty well.

Just before Christmas the fan motor in the air handler died. As you might expect, the local distributor didn’t have one ins stock, and the manufacturer was closed until the New Year. We had a very cold Christmas and New Year. Three electric heaters just couldn’t keep up – mainly because the (two story) house is semi-open plan. The occasional wood fire helped to cheer things up a bit, and even added a bit to the warmth.

But I don’t think I would use a heat pump much above 45° latitude.

You are going to need more than a 30lbs propane tank for heating though 🙂

Peta of Newark
Reply to  Philip
January 31, 2022 1:30 am

The thing that ‘kills’ most small electric motors is the ‘Motor Run Capacitor’ while there is perfectly nothing wrong with the motor itself. ##
That small-ish cylindrical thing attached to the motor.

With a modicum of care you can fix it yourself using just a small screwdriver.
Random Image found by Google

## Replacing the entire motor because of it is akin to changing your car when you get a flat tyre

MarkW
Reply to  Peta of Newark
January 31, 2022 7:03 am

This past year the washer in our apartment stopped working. I was kind of hoping that we would get a new washer. The repairman just put in a new capacitor and it started running again.

Peta of Newark
Reply to  lee riffee
January 31, 2022 1:19 am

Here in the UK you can buy single or double induction ‘hobs’ that simply plug into any wall socket. Prices start at 30GBP
Get a couple and simply sit them atop your existing glass/ceramic hob

Here’s a lovely single-ring hob, made by top quality, made by Tefal at 55 GBP (You’re paying for the name here.
https://www.argos.co.uk/product/9147782?clickSR=slp:term:induction%20cooker:1:482:1
The UK discounters like Aldi and Lidl sell the equivalent for half that money

BUT, they don’t have the grunt for a deep fat frying ** – you’d need a stand-alone fryer for that

** That is, a fryer with real fat in it, such as beef dripping. if you use vegetable oil, start munching down extra Vitamin C like your life depends on it. Because it does.

Inductions have all the advantages of gas but you ain’t gonna set fire to anything, blow the house up, wreck your house/furniture/clothes with water vapour condensation & mould.
Or repeatedly be semi poisoning yourself with Carbon Monoxide. That shit is cumulative and even small amounts make you stupid, dizzy, almost ‘drunk’.
Some of us suspect that is why so many folks like cooking on gas 😀
Before it drives up your blood pressure and hastens the arrival of your own personal heart attack

A great party-trick with an induction cooker is to put a sheet of kitchen tissue on the hob, under your frying pan and then cook up some bacon, eggs, black pudding, tomato, sausage and fried bread.
The tissue won’t be marked, apart from showing up how grubby the underside of your pan was/is – maybe not when in ‘Polite Comany’

Once you get the hang of the timer, the instant response (faster than gas, seriously) and that it will turn any old pan into a slow-cooker for melt-in-the-mouth beef, belly pork & casserole ‘things’
And ‘things’ where you can set it it, leave it and forget it while it does the cooking business.
Just think of all the extra time you can get with the kids, going shopping or for UK folks, slobbed out in front of the TV drinking
(UK is now such a dump that’s all there is left to do)

Once you learn induction, There Is No Going Back.
Unless you’re on a date with Fred Flintstone

MarkW
Reply to  Philip
January 31, 2022 7:01 am

I know that they make propane powered refrigerators, so I suppose a natural gas powered AC should be possible.
I also know that the only place where propane powered fridges are used is in places where electricity isn’t available. So I assume that the operating costs for the propane version would be higher.

Vuk
January 30, 2022 12:01 pm

Guilty as charged. Did it many years ago on safety grounds

John Laurent
January 30, 2022 12:26 pm

In New Zealand we had the delightful publicity around the leader of our Green Party participating in a sausage sizzle around a gas barbecue at their conference.

Scissor
Reply to  John Laurent
January 30, 2022 12:38 pm

Let me get this straight. They were browning their sausages around a gas bbq.

Sounds like something Emmanuel Macron and Justin Trudeau might do.

Pat from kerbob
Reply to  Scissor
January 30, 2022 1:02 pm

Surely Justin (they/them/Xi) but unsure of macaroon?

bonbon
Reply to  Pat from kerbob
January 30, 2022 1:34 pm

C’ést marrant, mais
https://migusto.migros.ch/fr/recettes/marrons-grilles-au-four
grilled chesnuts…

Philip
Reply to  bonbon
January 30, 2022 3:52 pm

Yum! I remember buying those from street vendors in Paris around Christmas time. Standing next to their mobile ovens for warmth while eating them…

Andy Pattullo
January 30, 2022 12:29 pm

So if burning natural gas for cooking is bad for the climate (I doubt it) then burning natural gas or any fossil fuels to mine and transport resources, produce steel, concrete, glass, plastic and electrical components and to assemble and install wind turbines and solar panels must be one of the most evil plots yet launched by right, pardon me left-wing zealots ever.

Clyde Spencer
Reply to  Andy Pattullo
January 30, 2022 4:05 pm

Why do you expect “left-wing zealots” to be rational?

Rud Istvan
January 30, 2022 12:35 pm

The leaking methane when off claim simply is not true. The utilities add mercaptan to the natural gas, so that if there is a malfunction/leak you can smell it immediately and shut off the mains. Same is true for gas furnaces and hot water heaters.

Pat from kerbob
Reply to  Rud Istvan
January 30, 2022 1:01 pm

Yes, we’d be seeing house explosions all over if true
Just more Bs
I love my gas stove, they’ll have to pry it from my cold dead hands

Doonman
Reply to  Rud Istvan
January 30, 2022 9:08 pm

Yes, natural gas is odorless and colorless and is lighter than air. As such it displaces oxygenated air in a room from the top down and accumulates until it finds an ignition source. That’s why mercaptan is added so any leak can be detected immediately. The human nose can detect mercaptan in microgram amounts per liter of air, well under any explosive natural gas concentration. That’s why natural gas explosions generally occur only in unoccupied buildings.

MarkW
Reply to  Rud Istvan
January 31, 2022 7:09 am

I thought they were talking about leaks in the parts per million level.
Natural gas in the atmosphere is in the parts per billion level, and amounts leaked from homes would be only a small fraction of that.

Since nobody has been able to demonstrate that global warming is a problem, the extremely small portion of that warming that is due to CH4, much less then even tinier portion of that, that is coming from homes, is even less of a problem.

Paul Hurley (aka PaulH)
January 30, 2022 12:38 pm

My new natural gas oven arrives in a few weeks. It’ll join my gas furnace, gas water heater and gas fireplace to make one big happy gas family. 🙂

Trying to Play Nice
Reply to  Paul Hurley (aka PaulH)
January 31, 2022 9:17 am

That’s pretty standard where I live. It’s too cold for heat pumps, electric water heaters are ridiculously expensive to install and a gas fireplace with electronic controls is so easy to keep going.

Walter
January 30, 2022 12:48 pm

i think this whole global warming business will end by 2030. When we see that the observations don’t match up the models at all, they’re gonna have to explain themselves. The only problem is we’re all going to be using “clean energy” instead of our fossil fuels.

Steve Case
Reply to  Walter
January 30, 2022 1:46 pm

It should have ended in November 2009 when all those emails were leaked. It didn’t. It will only end when a cooling trend that can’t be fudged away appears. Probably decades from now, and by then the nouveau bolsheviks will have achieved their goal and it won’t matter.

Doonman
Reply to  Walter
January 30, 2022 9:19 pm

At some point the Holocene will end and Chicago will be under a mile of ice again for 90,000 years. Nobody will be campaining about global warming then. If you “follow the science™”, it’s getting late in the game and the optimum is already over.

StephenP
Reply to  Walter
January 31, 2022 9:21 am

The trouble is that they will claim that the move from fossil fuel to renewables was ” wot did it “.

John Garrett
January 30, 2022 12:56 pm

This is all the result of the “Covering Climate Now” conspiracy (see Kip Hansen’s 22 May 2021 WUWT piece: https://wattsupwiththat.com/2021/05/22/following-the-money-covering-climate-now/ )

https://coveringclimatenow.org/sharing-library/

All the soi-disant “journalists” regurgitated the same story. It was all over NPR and the Associated Press (Seth “The Moron” Borenstein, again).

It’s just copy and paste crap that the “journalists” use instead of actually doing any work.

Last edited 5 months ago by John Garrett
Steve Case
Reply to  John Garrett
January 30, 2022 1:50 pm

That Kip Hansen post needs to be pinned to the top periodically.

Punta Gorda
January 30, 2022 1:24 pm

One of the biggest problems with a household Propane tank company here, is that the one guy they have delivering at a nearby town is down sick.

Steve Case
January 30, 2022 1:34 pm

“… natural gas stoves also leak unburned methane into the air, a greenhouse gas that’s 86 times as potent as carbon dioxide (CO2) over a 20-year period. Researchers found that this leaking has a climate impact comparable to the carbon dioxide emissions from a half-million cars. “
________________________________________

An actual statistic repeated adnausium but the climate crusaders never tell us how much the increase in methane will run up global temperature. Probably because they don’t want to say that it’s essentially zero.

They also fail to tell us how much a half-million cars would run-up global temperature. Also essentially zero.

dk_
January 30, 2022 1:38 pm

Just like the battery-electric vehicle, electric cookers run on coal, oil, and natural gas, you just don’t get the smoke and purty flame at the point of use.

Sara
January 30, 2022 1:50 pm

Well, boys and girls, I did wonder how long it would be until the Greenbeaners would condemn cooking and warming a home with gas, and it wasn’t as long as i’d expected.

This is when that “not just NO, but HELL NO” part comes up and the crackpots need a severe lesson in reality. It is winter in my kingdom, and that means cold, snow, ice, possibly bitter winds from those Polar Bears up North of us.

My response to these geniuses is both “YOU FIRST, birdbrain!” and “I wanna see you start a fire by rubbing two sticks together.”

Really, I do want them to have a reality check in the form of a dose of the medicine they wish to inflict on us.

If that doesn’t shut them up, what will?

I do know how to cook on a wood-fired stove, just in case anyone is wondering. Baking bread might require some practice, but there is also the pure ignorance in their notion that generating electricity does not result in CARBON (CO2) PRODUCTION!!!!

What a bunch of loons. Oh, wait – calling them “loons” is an insult to the real loons. “Bunch of dimwitted iggernunt mopes” might be more appropriate.

Last edited 5 months ago by Sara
Philip
January 30, 2022 1:51 pm

Methane is now 86 times as potent as CO2, first it was 4 times, then they told me it was 17 times next it was 45 times, good Lord now its 86 times as potent. One way or another some one has a meth problem but I’m not convinced it’s methane.

Steve Case
Reply to  Philip
January 30, 2022 4:01 pm

The IPCC assessment reports have mostly increased the Global warming Potential (GWP) numbers over the years:

AR1 it was around 50
AR2 – 60
AR3 – back to 50
AR4 – 70 or so
AR5 – 86

The GWP numbers use the CO2 concentration as a standard. Who has ever heard of a metric that uses a standard that constantly changes?

MarkW
Reply to  Steve Case
January 31, 2022 7:11 am

They determine the answer they want to see, then fiddle with the numbers until they get it.

Clyde Spencer
Reply to  Philip
January 30, 2022 4:08 pm

Biden inflation!

alastair gray
January 30, 2022 2:06 pm

Can anyone tell me what they mean by methane is 85 times more powerful than CO2 as a greenhouse gas. This sounds like complete bullshit . Wijngaarden and Happer establish methane’s effect on absorption, like that of CO2 as being essentially saturated and their work looks pretty solid to me.
Also I understand that
W&H METHANE AND CLIMATE
by W. A. van Wijngaarden and W. Happer
was rejected on mickey mouse peer review on one journal and so the climatariat denounce it as denialist maunderings .
Surely to God they can get it published somewhere with a proper peer review system
An article on why this has not been done this would be instructive. Andy May perhaps?

Steve Case
Reply to  alastair gray
January 30, 2022 4:17 pm

The GWP bullshit compares equal masses of CO2 and methane. Methane is on track to increase by about 0.5 parts per million by 2100. An equal mass of CO2 is about 0.2 parts per million. So, if CO2 increases from 415 ppm to 415.2 ppm the increase in global temperature will be essentially nothing, and 86 times nearly nothing is still nearly nothing.

The GWP statistic is real, but total meaningless bullshit.

alastair gray
Reply to  Steve Case
January 31, 2022 4:38 am

Thanks for that Steve . According to Wikipedia methane concentration is about 2 PPM as opposed to 415 for CO2 so a doubling of Methane would be equivalent to about 1 ppm of CO2 . To do that would require a lot of cows belching . Of course when buffalo in US and Wildebeast in Africa and reindeer in the arctic roamed the plains their methane footprint added to that of the termites must have dwarfed our domestic livestock Methane footprint Bullshit squared

stinkerp
January 30, 2022 2:19 pm

C’mon, climatistas. Lead by example. Reprocess your own, er, “organic waste” into fuel and cook with it. Be carbon neutral.

fretslider
January 30, 2022 2:38 pm

“ Home methane leaks ”

Houses are blowing up all the time /sarc

Last edited 5 months ago by fretslider
Shoki Kaneda
January 30, 2022 3:01 pm

I don’t think it affects climate change, but my gas range made some fine Cuban Chicken today.

Dennis
January 30, 2022 3:32 pm

An interesting letter to the editor I read this morning suggested that gas from Australia should not be exported to nations that advocated for Australia to stop coal mining and use and other penalties for our Australian economy during the Glasgow Conference COP or FLOP26.

Clyde Spencer
January 30, 2022 3:45 pm

The solution to the ‘problem’ is to seal the stoves better. Perhaps have the gas utility do maintenance every 5 years to make sure the fitting are working properly. Retro-fit older stoves with electronic ignition.

No more ‘snuff porn,’ please!

n.n
January 30, 2022 4:12 pm

They’re Green, invariably green, but assuredly not green.

Dennis
January 30, 2022 4:37 pm

As the EU Standards penalises ICEV in favour of EV with enormous costs involved developing EV and providing infrastructure, subsidies, and so on, I think about the transition from leaded to unleaded petrol and sulphur in diesel/distillate to no sulphur and associated costs, and then CNG/LPG conversions for internal combustion engines and the technology that evolved into injection systems for gas only fuel in petrol engines (and dual fuel provision) or LPG injected with diesel fuel.

Gas produces far lower emissions than petrol and with injection systems the amount of fuel is only slightly more litres per one hundred kilometres. Injected diesel-gas greatly reduces exhaust particulates and exhaust gas reticulation valves are not necessary. From personal use experience including a small fleet of business vehicles petrol and diesel powered using LPG the operating cost savings are significant. A diesel-gas system depending on ratio of fuels injected, but say 20% LPG exhaust emissions are greatly reduced with a similar percentage gain in power and torque because the diesel fuel burns more efficiently with LPG mixed.

Gary Pearse
January 30, 2022 5:45 pm

Heating up a can of beans apparently causes methane emissions long after the cooker is turned off and cold! A vegan diet accomplishes the same thing even without the cooker.

Tom in Florida
January 30, 2022 7:02 pm

Quick primer for indoor gas ranges. In Florida, gas ranges must be vented to the outside. To calculate the blower strength needed you take the total BTUs of the cook top and divide by 100. That tells you the minimum CFMs needed for the blower. If you have a long vent run to the outside, especially if you have elbow turns, you may also need a second blower inside the system. If the blower above the range is over 600 CFM you need to install make up air.
So, if installing gas, make sure the total BTUs of the cook top are under 60,000 and make the vent run as short and straight as possible.

Dennis
Reply to  Tom in Florida
January 30, 2022 7:23 pm

A few years ago near where I live an elderly man apparently lit an installed gas heater in his home that was connected to LPG cylinders outside, as he had been doing for years.

There was an explosion that completely demolished his house, damaged adjoining houses and the force of the blast sent his car over a perimeter fence.

I understand that questions were asked about regular or annual maintenance having been done, obviously the house owner could not be interviewed.

Last edited 5 months ago by Dennis
Francesco Liposo
January 30, 2022 7:27 pm

One of my favorite WUWT articles: Methane: The Irrevelant Greenhouse Gas
https://wattsupwiththat.com/2014/04/11/methane-the-irrelevant-greenhouse-gas/

Jim
January 30, 2022 8:28 pm

Every time I find information on how greenhouse gasses actually cause warming I find in all cases severely flawed physics. What a black eye for science.
Just think, get rid of CO2 and very little on this earth will remain green. How ironic

griff
January 31, 2022 12:36 am

I have an induction hob and frankly it is as responsive as any gas hob I’ve ever owned, plus it has a flat easy to clean surface.

I’d say leaving all other issues aside, induction is better than gas…

fretslider
Reply to  griff
January 31, 2022 5:15 am

You won’t during a blackout.

griff
Reply to  fretslider
January 31, 2022 8:35 am

And climate change influenced storms aside, I’m not expecting any blackouts here in the UK.

fretslider
Reply to  griff
January 31, 2022 9:38 am

Beware the unexpected griff. Especially wind droughts.

Storms are just weather. You have no 30+ year trend under your arm.

Do you remember the hurricane? Were you even born? That was 35 years ago. It was a one in 300 year event, not a trend. But if it happened tomorrow you would have verbal diarrhoea proclaiming it to be climate change driven.

This is why nobody takes anything you say seriously.

It’s a joke.

Tom in Florida
Reply to  griff
January 31, 2022 6:11 pm

Unless you have any kind of medical device that the magnetism would interfere with, such as a pacemaker.

Alan the Brit
January 31, 2022 12:49 am

“You know what? I think I’ll keep my gas cooker, and keep enjoying life.”

But only if Big Brother allows you to, & if they did, you’d probably have to pay a heavy compensation tax to somebody somewhere!!! It’s all about the money after all!!!

Kristi Silber
January 31, 2022 2:29 am

Since when is informing the public the same as “demonizing”? Should this kind of information not be reported simply because it’s not nice to hear?

Bruce Cobb
Reply to  Kristi Silber
January 31, 2022 8:16 am

You need to learn the difference between “information” and disinformation.

MarkW
Reply to  Kristi Silber
January 31, 2022 12:06 pm

So hyping non-existent threats counts as “informing”?

January 31, 2022 3:00 am

I have recently discovered sous vide low temperature immersion cooking and am enjoying it, especially the searing to Maillard Reaction at high temperature with gas.

Coach Springer
January 31, 2022 6:39 am

That’s old news, but evidence of a concerted effort to limit the use of natural gas in all applications. Do that and we will freeze, overheat and starve and/or increase CO2. The solution is the .problem

Bruce Cobb
January 31, 2022 7:48 am

The sneaky liars are using a 20-year time period to get their 86 times more powerful than CO2 figure. The standard period used even by the Alarmist EPA Liars is 100 years, which gives a figure of 25 times more powerful.

Bruce Cobb
January 31, 2022 8:23 am

A while ago, we needed a new stove, and considered dual fuel ones, which have an electric top and gas oven. These are actually ideal. Electric ovens work better than gas, and gas cooktops work better than electric. The units themselves are very expensive though, perhaps 3-4 times more than just gas, or just electric. But on top of that, most situations are only set up with one, not both gas and electric. In our case, we would have needed to have a 220v receptacle installed. That would probably be $300 right there. I think installation costs are higher as well. So instead of maybe $700 or so, you’re talking more like 3 grand. Pass.

griff
Reply to  Bruce Cobb
January 31, 2022 8:33 am

I think an electric induction hob, with gas like response, performs as good as or better than gas…

Bruce Cobb
Reply to  griff
January 31, 2022 10:07 am

They look interesting, but you need to have the right cookware (magnetic) for them to work. Aluminum or glass won’t work. Pass.

MarkW
Reply to  griff
January 31, 2022 12:06 pm

Your ability to think has never been demonstrated.

Burgher King
January 31, 2022 9:04 am

griff: reply to fretslider replying to griff, January 31, 2022 8:35 am:

“And climate change influenced storms aside, I’m not expecting any blackouts here in the UK.”

These words are now officially recorded for the historical record for later reference when power shortages and blackouts caused by the intermittency of the wind and solar renewables begin hitting the UK.

Dave Andrews
January 31, 2022 9:05 am

So leaking methane from over 40m households in the US that use gas cookers has the same climate impact as half a million ICE cars.

Considering there are over 1.4 billion ICE vehicles in the world surely the problem of gas cookers pales into insignificance even if you are fully signed up to the climate change thingy?

I think some Stanford researchers have too much time on their hands.

Pat from Kerbob
January 31, 2022 1:04 pm

My final comment on this is that like everything else, nothing is perfect. I love cooking with gas in the home because instant on and instant off is most of the battle,
But i use propane bottles for the gas grill instead of using the natgas hookup because propane is hotter.
For the really good steaks, or making bacon i have a big green egg, hardwood charcoal cannot be beat.

But electric gets hotter still, my stove top expresso maker finishes faster with the least amount of water left in the reservoir.
Because it gets hotter, but that is the only advantage.

If the power goes out i can use a match and light the burners to cook.
Electric, not cooking

Hardlyb
January 31, 2022 8:21 pm

’86 times as potent’? What? The graphs I’ve seen show methane as much less potent than CO2 at scattering light (and C02 is nothing to H2O, which is next on their greenhouse gas hit list, I suppose). But do these people not know that methane oxidizes? Easily? I’m not sure what drives this insanity, but apparently now it’s just okay to make up anything you want in the name of saving the planet from something which isn’t happening.

John Baglien
February 1, 2022 9:16 am

OMG!! Researchers found that this leaking has a climate impact comparable to the carbon dioxide emissions from a half-million cars. With 1.4 billion cars in the world, this means that natural gas stoves contribute 36/1000 of one percent of what cars do to global warming!! do these researchers ever consider the total insignificance of their findings? Never mind the wild-ass extrapolations they had to make to come up with their comparability statement.

marlene
February 1, 2022 5:35 pm

I, too, think “I’ll keep my gas cooker and keep enjoying life.” If it’s good enough for commercial cooking for profit, it’s good enough for me!

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