US Election Open Thread

People want to vent so here’s a space. Please do not veer into threats or other potential violations of our terms of service.

Most of our readers realize that today’s media pronouncements are meaningless and we are in for a month or more of lawfare.

Stay calm, breathe, and have faith.

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B d Clark
November 7, 2020 2:08 pm

My question is does Biden take the presidency while Trump appeals? If he does and its found out fraud was committed will he be kicked out and who implements this?

Reply to  B d Clark
November 7, 2020 2:20 pm

First it’s neccessary to have proof of fraud.

Tom in Florida
Reply to  Krishna Gans
November 7, 2020 2:23 pm

Simple recounts of all mail in ballots in the Philadelphia and Atlanta areas would settle that easily.

Reply to  Tom in Florida
November 7, 2020 2:31 pm

And the check if they are correct, simple counting isn’t enough.

Loydo
Reply to  Krishna Gans
November 7, 2020 4:29 pm

And if they are shown to be correct, why, that just shows how deep the fraud goes.

Doesn’t matter now that even Murdoch and Fox – that hotbed of Marxist Biden stooges – have abandoned him.

sycomputing
Reply to  Krishna Gans
November 7, 2020 4:49 pm

And if they are shown to be correct, why, that just shows how deep the fraud goes.

Actually that’s more on par with the ilks of thee, of whom many even now still believe Trump was a Russian agent, and this AFTER their own kind spent $40M to try to prove it and couldn’t.

Think of all the poor that could’ve been comforted had the hatred of progressives not bound their minds into a lie?

Ian Hawthorn
Reply to  Tom in Florida
November 7, 2020 2:31 pm

Not easily. Not with the reports we’ve been seeing on veritas of late arriving votes being postmarked early.

DocSiders
Reply to  Ian Hawthorn
November 7, 2020 2:47 pm

Postmarks are not secure… easily altered or faked (with a $20 rubber postmark stamp from eBay).

Postmarks should be legal proof of nothing until extensive forensics is applied to each stamp.

Tom Foley
Reply to  Ian Hawthorn
November 7, 2020 7:23 pm

Late arriving votes being postmarked early? Well, they are more likely to be genuine than early arriving votes being postmarked later.

Any greater than usual delay between postmark date and delivery date is likely to be due to the increase in amount of mail due to the election, combined with the cutbacks in the postal service.

Is it realistic to imagine a concerted effort to fake postmarks? To do enough to make an impact would need factory line production and the skills to falsify the postmark so well that it was not obvious. Or, to post a huge number of fake voting papers on, say 4 November, with faked earlier postmarks. The catch is those envelopes probably would not have arrived yet!

Claiming that there would be enough falsified postmarks etc to have an impact seems like clutching at straws.

Steve Keppel-Jones
Reply to  Ian Hawthorn
November 9, 2020 6:59 am

Apparently at least one whistleblower in the Post Office admitted that they did this. The rot runs deep when the Post Office is in on your scam…

Robert Davis
Reply to  Tom in Florida
November 7, 2020 2:33 pm

In Philly they threw away the mail in envelopes. Now there is no way to tie together a ballot with a person. Trump got trumped. Pinnacle game over.

mario lento
Reply to  Robert Davis
November 7, 2020 2:37 pm

Revote in that county. Done

Tom in Florida
Reply to  Robert Davis
November 7, 2020 2:47 pm

Then those ballots should be thrown out in a recount. But of course a judge somewhere will over rule that.

David Brewer
Reply to  Robert Davis
November 7, 2020 2:51 pm

Actually the fact that they denied poll watchers access, beyond being illegal, creates an argument for spoilaition of evidence. Basically we don’t have any proof but the only reason they would deny access is to create fraudulent ballots. It’s a solid legal argument with significant precedent in both civil and criminal cases. Thus the lack of “evidence” isn’t a show stopper because of the refusal to allow GOP poll watchers to do their job.

MarkG
Reply to  Robert Davis
November 7, 2020 2:57 pm

Trump can force the election to go to Congress, and the Republican-run states can either vote for him or wreck whatever remains of the Republican party.

Or he can invoke the 14th Amendment, under which Biden is probably ineligible to be President.

He has plenty of ways to win.

EdB
Reply to  Robert Davis
November 7, 2020 3:05 pm

Throw away the envelopes, that’s the key. It is so easy to make up ballots and envelopes and get them in, using feedback from voters lists.(your poll person keeps a tally of voters, then you know the names of who is missing, inc. dead people who didn’t vote!)

Once the envelopes, and thus the names of the voter, are discarded, you are scot free. No evidence trail.

MarkG
Reply to  Robert Davis
November 7, 2020 3:47 pm

‘Once the gun, and thus your fingerprints, are discarded, you are scot free.’

I’d bet a lot of people in jail thought like that.

The simple answer, as someone else said, is that any votes that can’t be proven to be valid are tossed out. It’s little different to tossing out a vote where you can’t tell which candidate they voted for.

Rich Davis
Reply to  Robert Davis
November 7, 2020 3:50 pm

MarkG
How do you figure that the 14th amendment is relevant?

Maybe you mean Section 3:

“No person shall … hold any office, …who, having previously taken an oath… to support the Constitution of the United States, shall have … given aid or comfort to the enemies thereof.” (Heavily redacted for clarity, but I trust not changing the meaning).

That would require proof that Biden gave aid and comfort to enemies of the Constitution.

I’m not sure that’s quite the same thing as accepting bribes from an unfriendly government (China, Russia).

Or you could say that encouraging Antifa to riot constitutes insurrection and is giving aid and comfort to enemies of the Constitution, but what constitutes “aid and comfort”? It would seem that it can’t be words alone for the 1st amendment to still apply.

Janice Moore
Reply to  Robert Davis
November 7, 2020 3:51 pm

EdB,

Not “scot free.” The LACK of the paper trail (evidence) is actionable. (See also Mr. Brewer’s comment re: spoliation of evidence- you do that, you lose).

Mail in ballots must be done per the law, otherwise, they are void.

Just as ballots are void for failure to sign, the failure to allow legally required observation voids all those ballots in Detroit and in Philadelphia and elsewhere where observers were prevented from meaningful observation.

MarkG
Reply to  Robert Davis
November 7, 2020 5:10 pm

I don’t think it’s too hard to claim that Biden has “given aid or comfort to the enemies thereof” with the numerous revelations about his deals to sell out the US for $$$$. It’s just a question of whether there’s enough to stand up in court.

That’s assuming he’s still alive, of course. Because he seems remarkably absent for a President-to-be.

Duker
Reply to  Robert Davis
November 7, 2020 9:53 pm

USPS scans the address front of all posted envelopes.
https://www.uspsoig.gov/document/package-delivery-scanning-%E2%80%95-nationwide

You can even get email of the mail nvelope adressd to you before it’s delivered

Andrew F
Reply to  Robert Davis
November 7, 2020 10:12 pm

Learn the law Robert.

The PA Supreme Court is already in violation of the Constitution.

https://macris.substack.com/p/why-trump-will-triumph-in-pa-litigation

And on the other ‘evidence’ of fraud or malfeasance, our old friend Ed Berry

https://edberry.com/blog/polymontana/my-election-prediction/

Duker
Reply to  Robert Davis
November 7, 2020 11:51 pm

Doesnt matter about Pennsylvania, Trump needs it to win while Biden doesnt.
Trump needs all of 5 ‘closest’ states to reach the 270 level, Biden doesnt

MFKBoulder
Reply to  Robert Davis
November 8, 2020 12:28 am

As far as I know there is no democratic country where a ballot could be tied together with a person.
This is democracy.

Ohterwise you could call it Belear US.

Trebla
Reply to  Robert Davis
November 8, 2020 9:47 am

What is the theory here? All democratic ballots are fraudulent, but no republican ballots are? All the evil and conniving is on one side? Come on!

Janice Moore
Reply to  Robert Davis
November 8, 2020 2:27 pm

For Trebla and any others needing more facts:

1. Read this entire thread (e.g., the video I posted in my comment would help you).

2. Also see, this thread: https://wattsupwiththat.com/2020/11/04/the-usa-is-no-longer-a-party-to-the-paris-agreement/ — many relevant, insightful, well-informed, comments there, e.g., those of Pat Frank)

3. See the following comment on this thread, for a list of some of the evidence supporting the “theory” that the Dem crime machine fixed the election:

(Excerpts)

… there are several Milwaukee [,Wisconsin] precincts with voter turnout over 100%

*** The big voting dumps in Michigan and Wisconsin happened around 4[AM ] after they had announced they were stopping for the night and Republican poll watchers [left]

– the big voting dumps for Biden defy belief probabilistically. ***

– all the IT ‘glitches’ favoured Biden. Again, from a probability standpoint, this is really unlikely ***

– some analytical tools [ ] (Benford’s Law) suggest anomalous voting … .

Kent Clizbe, https://wattsupwiththat.com/2020/11/07/us-election-open-thread/#comment-3120339

4. Read this EXCELLENT article https://theredelephants.com/there-is-undeniable-mathematical-evidence-the-election-is-being-stolen/ posted on this thread by Mario Lento very early this morning.

niceguy
Reply to  Robert Davis
November 9, 2020 4:46 pm

Obama’s own life history was that he was foreign born – not from Hawaii. There was a lot of evidence Obama is fake persona yet nothing happened and not even Breitbart wanted to touch any of that, even less phony Fox News.

JohnM
Reply to  Robert Davis
November 9, 2020 8:03 pm

The USPS photographs each envelope as it passes through the system……just saying

sycomputing
Reply to  JohnM
November 10, 2020 4:55 am

JohnM:

“Mr. Donahoe said that unlike the National Security Agency’s collection of phone logs and overseas Web traffic that has come under scrutiny, the Postal Service does not maintain a massive database of the letter images. The scanning machines at the mail processing centers only keeps images of the letters they scan.

‘It’s done by machine, so there’s no central area where any of this information would be,’ he said. ‘It’s extremely expensive to keep pictures of billions of pieces of mail. So there’s no need for us to do that.'”

https://www.nytimes.com/2013/08/03/us/postal-service-confirms-photographing-all-us-mail.html

Mario Lento
Reply to  Tom in Florida
November 7, 2020 2:36 pm

Well a recount of fraudulent ballots might not be enough. We need to also figure out which ballots are bogus, and that will be more difficult.

Mark A Luhman
Reply to  Mario Lento
November 7, 2020 4:21 pm

A lot of ballots were sent out to people not their are not even resident to state, it not unusual to hear some on who got multiple ballots delivered to their address for people that have not lived their for years. If the used those ballots they are not bogus, just illegal use to vote multiple time. Somehow I don’t think that was accident.

Jeff Alberts
Reply to  Mario Lento
November 8, 2020 4:15 pm

Mark, do you even look at what you type?

Mark A Luhman
Reply to  Tom in Florida
November 7, 2020 4:16 pm

How do you sort out the bad ballots from the good now they are mixed?

Willem post
Reply to  Tom in Florida
November 7, 2020 4:41 pm

Ballots should be numbered, as are lottery tickets.
All ballots must be run through a machine on or before Election Day.
No ballots are valid, unless post-marked on or before Election Day.

With a proper computer system, immediately after the polls close, it will be known which ballot numbers are missing, such as someone died, moved away, or did not bother to vote.

Those numbers would be declared void, to avoid printing on the sly.

There would still be many smaller ways to game the system, but at least the barn door would be closed before the horse got out.

Before the present election, truckloads of ballots were printed, and filled out, for Biden, and distributed, as needed, to tip the various races in favor of Biden; a pre-meditated plan hatched in Democrat-run cities.

Trump litigating would not catch enough fraud to make a difference.

Changing the rules?
Will never happen, because power folks like losey, goosy rules.

Adrian Mann
Reply to  Willem post
November 7, 2020 5:47 pm

“Before the present election, truckloads of ballots were printed, and filled out, for Biden, and distributed, as needed, to tip the various races in favor of Biden; a pre-meditated plan hatched in Democrat-run cities.”

Really? Truckloads? You got some evidence of that? Photos? A paper trail? Anything? You want to go to court with that? Really?

Not enough people voted for Trump in order to retain the Presidency, and the guilty party in that is Trump himself. He is an utterly vile person and enough people figured that out to deny him a second term. It’s that simple. Crying fraud and cheating and stealing just makes you sound pathetic. Some you win, some you lose. It’s how you deal with that that marks you out.

Reply to  Willem post
November 7, 2020 6:47 pm

Adrian CNN

willem post
Reply to  Willem post
November 8, 2020 1:05 am

VERMONT ELECTION

In Vermont, a blank ballot was mailed to each active registered voter, dead or alive, moved away or not.
Registered voters 506,312
Votes cast 372,366,
https://electionresults.vermont.gov/Index.html#/voterturnout

Those who received a ballot, but lost it, could obtain a new one on Election Day by signing an affidavit at their polling place.
When I arrived in early morning, there already was a box full of signed affidavits.
That means many more blank ballots were printed, and available at each polling station
A number of blank ballots may have been kept” in reserve” to be filled out, as needed, at each polling station, or elsewhere, to tip close races one way or another.
This would especially be the case in swing states, such as Michigan, Wisconsin, Pennsylvania, Georgia, North Carolina, Nevada and Arizona.
In all these states, Trump was ahead, then “all votes were counted”, including “reserve votes” appearing from all over the place,
Counting went on for days after the election, until Trump ended up behind, and was not elected.

willem post
Reply to  Willem post
November 8, 2020 1:08 am

SIX-PART VIDEO OF ELECTION FRAUD ON TWITTER
https://dailycaller.com/2020/11/04/republicans-donald-trump-scott-baio-benny-johnson-election-conspiracy-theories/

I watched a Twitter 6-part video on my iPhone, showing a woman poll worker talking about three trucks arriving at her polling station in Detroit, Michigan.
The trucks delivered more than 138,000 ballots all marked for Biden.

She was talking for about 20 minutes about what she and other people saw.

This is a huge bit of news.
Organized fraud on a large scale, to deprive Trump from being re-elected.
It is just unbelievable
And the same thing happened in Wisconsin!!

This major fraud, on a large scale, just had to be prepared in advance, and in secret.

This is a direct consequence of mail-in ballots, and “counting” ballots up to 10 days after election day.

willem post
Reply to  Willem post
November 8, 2020 1:10 am

Here, on TWITTER, is a 6-part video of a poll station worker talking for about 20 minutes
She, and others, saw 3 trucks arrive about 4 AM Wednesday, Nov 3, with more than 130,000 ballots, all filled out for Biden, ready for counting.

I recommend you watch all 6 parts to get a democracy-in-action education.

She said: Poll workers were astounded all the ballots were marked for Biden.
We were told to scan/count them, even though none of them had been verified.
She said: Poll challengers/poll watchers were barred to observe the scanning/counting.
https://twitter.com/Amberfiremusic/status/1324221767708266496

willem post
Reply to  Willem post
November 8, 2020 1:13 am

Here’s another fascinating perspective that simply does not agree with normal reality.
Votes appear from nowhere for Biden in Republican districts.
https://www.zerohedge.com/political/why-does-biden-have-so-many-more-votes-democrat-senators-swing-states

Ursus Augustus
Reply to  Willem post
November 8, 2020 1:34 am

You mean so there world be a permanent record of how you voted? Police State Rule 1 it would seem to me.

Ursus Augustus
Reply to  Willem post
November 8, 2020 1:37 am

Willem, you spend way too much time on Twitter. Twitter is designed for bird brains, that’s why it has the name.

willem post
Reply to  Willem post
November 8, 2020 1:42 am

DESTROYED, MISPLACED BALLOTS

With the internet, and uncensored social media, there is no place to hide, as SNOWDON has been telling us.

Democrats, with help of the MEDIA, are declaring victory, BEFORE RECOUNTING ANY BALLOTS.
However, the wrong-doing have been so extreme, it would take months to PARTIALLY get to the bottom of it.

So the Democrats and the Media tell us: Throw in the towel, move on, time to heal!
There is nothing to see here.
Nothing needs to be investigated
All is fair and square

That would mean it would again happen in the next election.

Trump wants to show his 70+ million supporters how much wrong-doing has been perpetrated, for the record.

Here, ON TWITTER, is a video of a postal worker being told to backdate ballots so they could be counted.
He says: Normally this would be done by a clerk, but this time the supervisor was backdating.
https://twitter.com/JamesOKeefeIII/status/1324174186366074880

willem post
Reply to  Willem post
November 8, 2020 1:58 am

SEE THE GRAPHS OF THE BIDEN BUMPS IN THIS WEBSITE
https://dailycaller.com/2020/11/04/republicans-donald-trump-scott-baio-benny-johnson-election-conspiracy-theories/

Voter tallies before the bump in Michigan:
Trump had 2,200,902 votes
Biden 1,992,356 votes
Trump had a lead of 208,546 votes, which could not be offset with mostly Democrat mail-in votes.

Voter tallies after the bump in Michigan:
Trump had 2,200,902 votes
Biden had 2,130,695 votes
Trump had a reduced lead of only 70,207 votes, which could easily be offset with mostly Democrat mail-in votes

The instantaneous Biden bonus was 138,339 votes
The instantaneous Trump bonus was ZERO votes.

Daily Caller: While these are solely “allegations”, Michigan and Wisconsin election officials refuse to explain Biden’s dramatic vote tally increase that occurred in both states overnight.

Here is the BS obfuscation from Michigan election officials
“It was a simple error from a file created by the state that we ingested. DDHQ does not correct/amend/adjust any state provided file. The state noticed the error and produced an updated count. This happens on election nights and we expect other vote tabulators in MI experienced this error and corrected in real-time as we did,” the company said in a statement, according to Politifact.

Here is the BS obfuscation of Decision Desk HQ echoing Michigan election officials
Decision Desk HQ, from which many screenshots of the supposed discrepancy were obtained, claimed that the jump in Michigan was due to “a data error”.
The entire ballot bump is for Biden, and there is zero bump for Trump?

Here is USAToday leaving out some important details
“The jump in Wisconsin occurred when Milwaukee reported its absentee ballot results”, according to USAToday.

Sure. The ballots arrived on 3 trucks, at the polling station, from who knows where, at 4 am.
The upward Biden bump was registered on websites before 6 am.

JimW
Reply to  Willem post
November 8, 2020 1:44 pm

As a complete neutral living in France but spending some time in US , out of interest I had one of the interactive maps open on the 3.4,5 of Nov, showing the votes per county and percentage outstanding updated regularly.
I can confirm that something very strange happened in Detroit early morning the day after the election. Suddenly just under 138,000 votes were registered to Biden yet there was no change to the outstanding percentage. Two hours later exactly the same happened in Milwaukee with 100,000 votes. I mentioned to my wife that this seemed very strange.
Of course the snail pace of counting outstanding votes across 5 other States seemed also odd. I am used to competition between polling stations over who can finish fastest.
Prima facie there appears to be something worth investigating if the money and/or will is available to do it.

willem post
Reply to  Willem post
November 8, 2020 1:47 pm

ELECTIONS IN VERMONT AND SWING STATES

In Vermont, a blank ballot was mailed to each active registered voter, dead or alive, moved away or not.
Registered voters 506,312
Votes cast 372,366,
https://electionresults.vermont.gov/Index.html#/voterturnout

Those who received a ballot, but lost it, could obtain a new one on Election Day by signing an affidavit at their polling place.
When I arrived, early morning, on Election Day, there already were boxes with signed affidavits.

Spare Ballots: That means an extra quantity of blank ballots were printed, and available at each polling station.
Some of these ballots could be used by polling station insiders to tip close races one way or another.
It is likely, an extra quantity of blank ballots were kept “in reserve” elsewhere.
They likely were already filled out, to be distributed, as needed, to tip close races one way or another.

Swing States: This would especially be the case in swing states, in, such as in Michigan, Wisconsin, Pennsylvania, Georgia, North Carolina, Nevada and Arizona.
Various irregularities have been reported in five Democrat-Big-Machine cities, such as Detroit, Mich.; Philadelphia, Pa.; Atlanta, Ga.; Milwaukee, Wis.; and Las Vegas, Nev.

The Coup d’Etat: As if orchestrated, ballot counting was halted or slowed down, about the same time, in a number of key states, starting late Tuesday, November 3, and early Wednesday, November 4.
Panic! Trump was too far ahead! Biden votes were needed to be distributed to polling centers for counting on Wednesday, Thursday and Friday.

A few hours later, starting about 4 am, there were steady influxes of Biden votes in Michigan, Wisconsin, etc.
Trump saw what was happening, and wanted to stop the counting. All to no avail.
Poll station monitors were not allowed to watch. Windows were being boarded up.
Call the FBI to investigate?
The FBI would be of no help, because it has been actively undermining Trump, with help of the Media, which is 93% anti-Trump.

The allegations are:

1) Mysterious ballot drops that seem to show tens of thousands of votes for Joe Biden and zero votes for President Trump,
2) Inexplicable record turnouts in late-counting counties (all Democrat-dominated) that far surpass turnouts in counties in other states where the votes were counted on a timely basis; and
3) The illegal banning of election observers in those very counties where the most outrageous anomalies were reported.
https://www.realclearpolitics.com/articles/2020/11/06/the_kafka_election_finding_a_way_out_of_the_maze__144618.html

In all these states, Trump was ahead, then using the mantra “all votes must be counted”, Biden votes were appearing from various places.
Counting went on for days after the election, until Trump ended up behind, and was not elected.

Jeff Alberts
Reply to  Willem post
November 8, 2020 4:17 pm

Adrian: “Not enough people voted for Trump in order to retain the Presidency”

More people voted for him this time than in 2016, about 10 million more.

Reply to  Tom in Florida
November 7, 2020 7:07 pm

Recounts only help if the fraud is by manipulated computer ballot counters.

Ballots are not signed. Your signature is on the envelop, not the ballot. Those two pieces of paper or irretrievably separated. There is no way to know if that recounted ballot is a ballot from a real, living, registered citizen voter…

… unless, as Steve Pieczenik has stated, the Dem fraud was anticipated and the ballot paper itself is watermarked. https://www.infowars.com/posts/groundbreaking-claim-trump-set-up-democrats-in-sophisticated-sting-operation-caught-stealing-election-red-handed/

Steve
Reply to  Bud Bromley
November 8, 2020 12:04 am

I’ve read that the watermark story is just a story, that each state prints its own ballots. I am unsure where the truth may lie, though.

Reply to  Tom in Florida
November 7, 2020 7:13 pm

Tom,

Consider this,

Crooked Pollsters create fake papers for Biden. Easy to pick.

But they can just as easily take away the same number of Trump papers.
Not so easy to pick right?

There will be all sorts of Sh-t going on in my view.

We are very likely witnessing the demise of the USA. Trump was bringing the place back, but the corrupt officials and “elected” people are now showing how they can get away with anything without fear of being caught or ending up in front of a non corrupt judge.

God Save the United States of America!

Roger

Tom Foley
Reply to  Roger Surf
November 7, 2020 7:31 pm

Trump seemed to be disuniting America. Evidence? That Trump supporters believe that non-Trump supporters are corrupt. Just maybe, more people dislike Trump than like him?

Indeed, God save the United States of America. You certainly need some help to stop hating each other and become united, for the good of the world and for your own sake.

drednicolson
Reply to  Roger Surf
November 8, 2020 8:29 am

Trump supporters weren’t the ones rioting in the streets for the past five months.

TonyG
Reply to  drednicolson
November 8, 2020 9:20 am

Nor have Trump supporters been accosting Dems in public for the last four years.

MatthewSykes
Reply to  Tom in Florida
November 8, 2020 12:26 am

Recount all votes in all swing states, Arizona (hardly ever votes Dem) and Michigan (known software glitch). Georgia, suddenly 36% more dem votes than Obama got. And so on. It stinks.

Kenji
Reply to  MatthewSykes
November 8, 2020 9:53 am

Total turnout THIS elections: 67% … the highest voter turnout in 120 years!! For a dementia patient for POTUS. Total 2008 turnout for the FIRST (half) Black POTUS: 58%. Sorry … that beggars belief. My experience at my own polling place (2008 was busiest in my 38 years of voting here) certifies the Biden turnout was vote fraud

Jeff Alberts
Reply to  MatthewSykes
November 8, 2020 7:10 pm

Kenji. The turnout was against Trump, not for Biden. A ham sandwich would have gotten the votes.

tonyb
Editor
Reply to  Tom in Florida
November 8, 2020 7:42 am

Is there a handy listing of actual voter turnout by % in each voting area, as a very high turnout above the average might indicate something was amiss, otherwise we appear to be in to conspiracy theories.

tonyb

Reply to  tonyb
November 8, 2020 10:40 am

Hi Tony,

“Conspiracy theories”? Surely not!

Any sign of the “handy listing” you seek yet?

hiskorr
Reply to  tonyb
November 8, 2020 1:01 pm

The smallest possible “voting area” is the county. Since the introduction of the “early voting” fraud, voters from any precinct in the county could vote at any poll. This was done so that poll watchers at a precinct could not spot someone impersonating their neighbor.

Bengt Abelsson
Reply to  Krishna Gans
November 7, 2020 3:24 pm

Apply Benfords law.

Adrian Mann
Reply to  Bengt Abelsson
November 7, 2020 5:55 pm

Better yet, apply Betteridges law to the following:

Can Trump Retain the Presidency Through the Courts?

Scissor
Reply to  Adrian Mann
November 7, 2020 8:54 pm

All explained here.

whiten
Reply to  Krishna Gans
November 7, 2020 4:00 pm

Krishna Gans
November 7, 2020 at 2:20 pm

There is a clear infringement of the USA Constitution, knowingly and willfully committed by the courts and the Government of Pennsylvania in consideration of the Federal Presidential elections… in consideration of counterfeiting the vote and the will of the people intentionally… and wholly grossly irresponsibly.

Persons responsible for such a crime better wish that the clause of collaboration and planing is not added on the top of it all.

It is not just simply a case of only fraud.

The Legislature makes laws..
not the courts or the governors.

In the case of Pennsylvania, such a crime has clearly effected the result… in favor of the Democrat candidate for presidency.

Where and when almost the whole MSM has already declared they favored darling as President-Elect, regardless not only of the proposition of such a big serious problem with voting in Pennsylvania but also when and where the counting of votes still in play… and when clearly they happen not to be the Legal authority vested with
the power and responsibility for such calls.

Clearly most of MSM is oppressing and infringing openly and feverishly the right of legal institutions which by the means of the USA constitution have the power and responsibility to exercise and discharge such a duty in behalf of the People.

That is a clear case for a serious Federal investigation, on top and following the rest of all other legal litigations and the Legislature act-decision in consideration of the Pennsylvania votes.

cheers

Duker
Reply to  whiten
November 7, 2020 9:57 pm

So what , even if Congress both houses reject the electoral college votes of Pennsylvania , Biden still wins.
In reality you are just spouting high class bull with no evidence

Scott Rogan
Reply to  Duker
November 8, 2020 8:16 am

It’s not high class bull, as you call it. It is a correct interpretation of United States Election Law. There are serious issues that need to be investigated here and I would say that regardless of who the candidate is. This is not about personalities. I grew up in a country that had faith in the electoral process(warts and all). This is just too much to be ignored. If any wrongdoing, on either side is discovered, it has to be transparently and publicly dealt with so Americans can know they have legitimately elected office holders.

As far as no evidence. That gets shown in court and is decided upon. It is not for you to say what is or is not evidence. In the same manner that the winner is not selected by the press. States certify their votes, they declare who won which state. Then it goes to the electors and finally to Congress. We have a 200+ plus year legal process to resolve disputes in this country. I say let that process work.

whiten
Reply to  Duker
November 8, 2020 1:49 pm

Duker
November 7, 2020 at 9:57 pm

Oh, well Duker.

You want to hear some “high class bull”.
There it goes.

When it comes to USA Military, “these guys” are not obliged either by the
USA Constitution or any other law of the land to disclose to, alert or informing any one
whomever whatsoever of any of their investigation conduct, whatever the case be, may be or could be, whomever be cold be or may be subject to it.
Tough “high class bull”, as you may say.

I know,
I should have resist it, but could not… the “bull” thingy still gets me weak point there.
🙂

cheers

Pat Frank
Reply to  Krishna Gans
November 7, 2020 4:59 pm

Everyone should take a look at the Benford Law analysis of votes in Milwaukee, Chicago, and Allegheny, here:

https://github.com/cjph8914/2020_benfords

Only the Biden votes show anomalous behavior, when comparing sets of votes taken from the identical county or precinct.

The analysis is not proof of fraud, but it is extremely strong indicator of investigation for fraud.

sycomputing
Reply to  Pat Frank
November 7, 2020 5:03 pm

There’s a criticism of that method here: https://github.com/cjph8914/2020_benfords/issues/9

I’m not competent in statistics and thus can’t evaluate it.

What say you?

Pat Frank
Reply to  sycomputing
November 8, 2020 6:45 am

Why would one expect a symmetrically distributed vote count, Sy? That, in itself, looks suspicious.

sycomputing
Reply to  Pat Frank
November 8, 2020 7:35 am

Thanks Pat.

ThinkingScientist
Reply to  sycomputing
November 8, 2020 7:13 am

I think the criticism of the Benford Law analysis is fair enough, but it was based on synthetic data. That’s a problem straightaway. There is online rejection of the criticism too.

The red flag for me is that the graphs are comparing Biden to the other candidates in the same area. So in states like Florida Biden’s graph looks like all the others. In the Milwaukee, Chicago and Allegheny graphs – Biden’s looks like the odd one out. Why is it only Biden’s that looks odd in multiple areas?

Suspicious? Yes.
Evidence of fraud? No, insufficient.

Red flags are signs something needs investigating. There do seem to be some legitimate red flags. Evidence is what is needed before making accusations.

sycomputing
Reply to  ThinkingScientist
November 8, 2020 7:29 am

Thank you for weighing in. I see your point re: the odd behavior in certain cities.

Pat Frank
Reply to  sycomputing
November 8, 2020 8:52 am

ThinkingScientist, that was my initial take as well. All the vote counts from the same county or precincts, and all but Biden’s approximated Benford’s Law.

Very good cause for suspicion. A widespread Benford’s Law analysis of votes would allow quick zeroing-in on areas worthy of detailed evaluation.

Josie
Reply to  Pat Frank
November 8, 2020 6:34 am

As a tax inspector I’d say it’s a strong indicator but one needs more to really seal te case. Been there done that. Won’t be easy here. I have no skin in the game btw being Dutch….not much anyway. 4 1 (for one) I’d be sorry to see Trump go.

sycomputing
Reply to  Pat Frank
November 8, 2020 2:27 pm
John Galt III
Reply to  Krishna Gans
November 7, 2020 6:36 pm

I’m a chief election judge and Joe’s Party committed fraud on a pre-planned, systematic and industrial scale.

marlene
Reply to  Krishna Gans
November 7, 2020 6:57 pm

“Generative Adversarial Networks (GANs) are simulated constructs that appear to be real. Very advanced AI.
Generative Adversarial Networks (GANs) are simulated constructs that appear to be real. Very advanced AI
https://brandnewtube.com/watch/fLF9H5IbA8QswRn
This may be a ⁣Generative Adversarial Networks (GANs) simulation. GANs are simulated constructs using advanced Artificial Intelligence (AI).
For more about GANs, see ⁣https://wiki.pathmind.com/gene….rative-adversarial-n
https://wiki.pathmind.com/generative-adversarial-network-gan – Beginner’s Guide to Generative Adversarial Networks (GANs)

niceguy
Reply to  Krishna Gans
November 8, 2020 4:22 am

And when you have hard evidence of SOME fraud, then what?

When someone caught cheating, there is a usually small upper bound on his cheating.

[It’s pretty much like the overwhelming evidence that the Hep B causes MS, or that ROR causes brain issues, you almost can’t find proof for a single case. Yet the explosion of cases is a statistical reality and can’t be explained away.]

We NEVER ask for what you mention for third world phony “elections”: the simple fact the result is unbelievable is enough.

The simple fact you ask for more is proof the process is not OK.

B d Clark
Reply to  Krishna Gans
November 8, 2020 5:15 am

“and its found out fraud was committed ”

There is enough suspicion that parts of the election was rigged, particularly in the key states were voting was suspended for a number of hours. That needs investigating .

That’s why I quoted myself “and its found out fraud was committed ” proof will be found for fraud or not in a investigation. The suspicion is overwhelming ,surley democrates will not try to block a investigation that calls upon integrity, honesty of the voting system of the USA.

niceguy
Reply to  B d Clark
November 9, 2020 10:21 pm

In France they changed the standard of proof, by fiat (the power of unelected, incompetent “so called judges”) to prevent the indemnification of victims of the horrible hep B vaccines. They changed it to an impossible as well as meaningless standard of “direct causation” which is not even a science thing. (Judges are ignoramuses.)

And the intelligentsia was ecstatic: they worship vaccines. (Now Europe has reversed that mega extreme craziness and we are back to normal crazy bias against victims of vaccines.)

It’s the same exact issue. You can never prove exactly that thousands of frauds occurred (each single one), with thousands of proofs (one proof per crime). It isn’t even imaginable.

Likewise, you can never prove without a possible doubt that a single case of MS is with absolute certainty caused by a drug. In fact you can almost never prove ANY crime with that level of certainty.

That’s why the standard is “reasonable” not “possible”. That evaluation is only possible with a reasonably educated population, not the edu-cretinized populace with have thanks to schooling fundamentalism (= school good, education is a sound investment, longer education better, as much people as possible should go to university, etc.).

And the same people dare criticize “CSI” because it makes jurors in NY (why just NY?) incapable of daring a guilty verdict without tons of forensic evidence that cannot be expected in most cases.

How do you know these whiny “CSI made me lose an easy case” prosecutors are not just inept and bringing badly argued case with lots of unknown and too much uncertainty? Why should we trust by default these prosecutors? Why can’t the media ask them why we shouldn’t conclude they suck? (Remember it’s the same NY populace that is presumed by the same media to be more evolved, more educated, better informed than the rednecks in flyover country and the black-“internalized white supremacy”-people.)

Carbon Bigfoot
Reply to  Krishna Gans
November 8, 2020 5:55 am

Krishna here is your proof:

Bruser
Reply to  Carbon Bigfoot
November 8, 2020 11:26 pm

Wow … this video is amazing.

Paul of Alexandria
Reply to  Krishna Gans
November 8, 2020 9:30 am

The evidence of fraud looks generally like this (partial list):

Extended voting beyond legal limits (PA)
Failure to segregate late versus timely ballots (PA)
Failure to check identifying marks on ballots (PA, GA, MI, NV)
Refusal to allow Republican election observers (most)
Blocking windows to prevent observation (Detroit)
4 A.M. dumps of 100% Biden votes (WI 65K, MI 138,499)
Large number of Biden ballots with only president vote compared to Trump ballots
Voting wards with more votes than voters (WI)
https://www.americanthinker.com/articles/2020/11/what_the_layperson_can_make_of_election_law.html goes into some detail on the subject.

TonyG
Reply to  Paul of Alexandria
November 8, 2020 11:31 am

4 A.M. dumps of 100% Biden votes (WI 65K, MI 138,499)

Can we drop the MI claim? It has been shown untrue, and most articles I’ve seen about it (including at The Federalist and Western Journal) have posted retractions.

I’m with you on the evidence, but it hurts the case when you include invalid evidence. Let’s stick with what’s been shown and NOT disproved/retracted.

bigoilbob
Reply to  TonyG
November 8, 2020 2:31 pm

“I’m with you on the evidence, but it hurts the case when you include invalid evidence.”

+1

You’re being kind. There have already been ass eatings by judges tiring of frivolous motions. This coming week we can look forward to MANY more. FYI, judges can sanction them when they become even more ridiculous.

D. J. Hawkins
Reply to  Krishna Gans
November 8, 2020 1:37 pm

Jonova has a post referencing statistical analyses used by forensic accountants to uncover fraud. There is ample prima facie evidence for fraud in Wisconsin, Michigan and Pennsylvania.

http://joannenova.com.au/2020/11/biden-votes-pattern-fails-an-easy-first-test-for-tax-fraud/

Juhn Green
Reply to  Krishna Gans
November 8, 2020 4:02 pm

Thus the word if.

Harry Davidson
Reply to  B d Clark
November 7, 2020 2:53 pm

Con duct of elections is a matter for the individual States, that is what the Constitution says; they are not a Federal matter. The Supreme Court has, correctly, always been very reluctant to get involved. The States most in question, their Supreme Courts are by and large solid Democrat. A Court that doesn’t want to be convinced won’t be.

Don’t expect Trump lawfare to get many wins.

Adrian Mann
Reply to  Harry Davidson
November 7, 2020 5:40 pm

In fact, don’t expect any. Even if he does manage to win in court, that’s not the same thing as him overturning the votes and winning the Presidency. Ye Gods and little fishes… can anyone imagine the utter omnishambles of your country if, against all the odds, he somehow overturns the results and claims the Presidency? Now there’s a recipe for chaos.
As an aside, merely claiming that there’s been fraud is not evidence of that fraud. From way back, it was perfectly clear to anyone with the most basic grasp of US politics that he would lose. Therefore, it should come as no surprise that this has come to pass.
Trump is, as is universally known, a liar and a sore loser. He will grasp any straw, try any trick, tell any lie in order to not be, in his eyes, that most despised of creatures – a loser. However you want to try and wriggle your way out of it, finesse the details, look for grey areas, Supreme Court this or Federal case that, cite the Constitution, peddle baseless conspiracy theories, indulge in wishful thinking because things haven’t gone the way you want, the evidence points to an inevitable conclusion: Trump failed to gather enough votes to win. He failed because of a failure of his intellect and understanding of what was necessary to win. He failed to understand that what worked the first time would not work the second time.

One Term Trump. And so, predictably, it came to pass.

Loser.

Reply to  Adrian Mann
November 7, 2020 7:21 pm

mann oh mann
I studied the results of the Trump Administration and wrote two eight page articles for my former newsletter ECONOMIC LOGIC.
I gave Trump a “B” for his first two years and and “C” for his next 1.5 years.

I believe as a libertarian I can fairly analyze both Republicans and Democrats. I did not vote for Trump in 2016 but did vote for him in 2020 only because the sad alternative was to reward the head of the Biden crime family (over six articles on the subject on my politics blog at http://www.ElectionCircus.Blogspot.com )

I think it is pitiful that Trump and Biden were the two “best and brightest” people to run for president in 2020. But then I also think every president is worse than the prior president, since Eisenhower.

Trump may be a blabbermouth constantly bragging about himself, but he stood up to you horrible leftists lying about his character for five year, starting with the completely fake Russian Collusion Delusion and then impeachment with no specific federal crimes ever stated.

What I give Trump credit for is drawing out onto the public the horrible, hateful characters of most leftists. I realized there was a serious problem when I began studying climate science in 1997.
Trump helped reveal the true hatred by leftists, of everyone who does not support their socialist policies.

Obama “promised” I could keep my doctor, and my medical insurance plan, when I joined his O’Bummer Care. Well, of course I could not keep my reasonably priced Blue Cross plan and I lost my primary care doctor when I signed up for a reasonably priced ObamaCare plan … at double the cost per month … and with a much higher deductible. Talk about lying !

Truth is not a leftist value.

Tom Foley
Reply to  Richard Greene
November 7, 2020 10:28 pm

I’d suggest all Americans look in the mirror. Those on the right believe those on the left are horrible hateful characters. Those on the left believe those on the right are horrible hateful characters. Either you are all horrible hateful characters, or you are all unfairly judging each other. Trump just demonstrated this!

You must be aware that the legislature was stacked against Obama, and anyway, any small attempt to fix part of the medical system was probably doomed to failure.

A C Osborn
Reply to  Richard Greene
November 8, 2020 3:39 am

Mr Foley, are you even aware of what the Democrats have been doing for last 4 years?
Hateful doesn’t even cut it where that was concerned.

D. J. Hawkins
Reply to  Richard Greene
November 9, 2020 5:16 am

Well, Tommy-boy, it hasn’t been the Republicans burning and looting and throwing up fake conspiracies and weeping about the election results for 4 years running. Didn’t do that during the 8 years of the Obutthead administration. Projection, much?

MFKBoulder
Reply to  Adrian Mann
November 7, 2020 11:51 pm

It is what it is.

miha
Reply to  Adrian Mann
November 8, 2020 4:51 am

The idea that a deficit of a couple of million votes in a voting population of around 140 million people somehow valides your various claims about Trump (or Biden for that matter) is nonsense. The future of America depends on an understanding that around 67 million people chimed with Trump’s vision of how the US should be governed while 69 million (apparently) sided with that of the Democrats. Biden himself is merely a figure-head. Trump has never been that. To repeat if I may, the idea that a failure of intellect on the part of Trump is demonstrated by a voting deficit of 2 million people is simply nutty.

John piccirilli
Reply to  Adrian Mann
November 8, 2020 6:49 am

He did not fail. Not a single military conflict, nominated for Nobel peace prize, booming economy for all of America, withdrew from Paris accord, defeated isis, made US energy dependent, peace deals between Israel and several Arab countries. All while fighting off bogus Russia hoax,
And foolish impeachment…

J. C.
Reply to  John piccirilli
November 8, 2020 9:08 am

And so much more! Our country is on the brink of total socialist take over. The repercussions of that will make the Obama years seen like a cake walk. When they come for our second amendment there will be very bad consequences. And they will come. Many years ago I told friends and family the path to take our freedom was simple. First, limit speech. That’s done. Take control of health care. It has been close to being destroyed. Now it will be. Limit our ability to move around at will. They have been working on that for years. Take away cars powered by fuel and destroy the energy independence Trump built we are very restricted. Tnen when they come to take our guns we have little recourse but to surender. And the democrats everywhere are celibrating as this is starting. I’m really sad this day has come.

Paul of Alexandria
Reply to  Adrian Mann
November 8, 2020 9:34 am

Actually, no Trump is not a liar. As President, he has only told the truth and abided by the Constitution.

Remember, here in the US the president is not elected until the electoral college casts its votes in December, and they are beholden only to the state legislators.

The evidence of fraud looks generally like this (partial list):

Extended voting beyond legal limits (PA)
Failure to segregate late versus timely ballots (PA)
Failure to check identifying marks on ballots (PA, GA, MI, NV)
Refusal to allow Republican election observers (most)
Blocking windows to prevent observation (Detroit)
4 A.M. dumps of 100% Biden votes (WI 65K, MI 138,499)
Large number of Biden ballots with only president vote compared to Trump ballots
Voting wards with more votes than voters (WI)
https://www.americanthinker.com/articles/2020/11/what_the_layperson_can_make_of_election_law.html goes into some detail on the subject.

John piccirilli
Reply to  Adrian Mann
November 8, 2020 12:15 pm

The only thing he, and everyone else fail at was to see how crooked the dnc was, is and always will be.

Brad-DXT
Reply to  Harry Davidson
November 7, 2020 10:13 pm

The state legislatures determine the laws regarding voting and elections in their state.
The laws on the books during an election cannot be changed by a justice, governor, or secretary of state. They don’t have the authority.
Any changes made to the electoral process that did not pass the state legislature prior to the election are not valid and subsequently, those ballots that did not meet the criteria set forth in the law, are invalid.

Reply to  B d Clark
November 7, 2020 3:45 pm

Bee Dee Clerk
Biden will be president in late January unless he forgets to go to the swearing in, or gets lost on the way because Kamala gave him the wrong directions. Fraud happens in every election. This may have been the worst because of the large percentage of mail in ballots, and ballots delivered to old inaccurate voter registration list addresses.

A friend originally from another state got a ballot delivered to his parents home in that state, where he first voted at age 18, and never voted in that state again. He has not lived in his parents home, or in that state, since going to college. His parents tore up the ballot. Other less honest people might have mailed it in. The friend is in his late 30’s now !

Proven fraud would have to be large enough to change who won a state, and enough states with proven fraud to keep Biden under 270 electoral votes. Almost impossible to do with so many mail in ballots where signatures were never checked by handwriting experts.

I wrote a short article on the subject today, with a long title: “Not one currently known election rule change, rule breaking, action, or glitch favored President Trump. If the “errors” were random, some would favor Trump.” … at my politics blog where many other articles reveal how Biden is the most corrupt politician ever elected as an American president:

http://www.ElectionCircus.blogspot.com

Adrian Mann
Reply to  Richard Greene
November 7, 2020 5:48 pm

… “Second most corrupt politician ever elected as an American President.”

There – fixed that for you. You’re welcome.

Reply to  Adrian Mann
November 7, 2020 7:05 pm

Manny
Who would the most corrupt politician be, Obama?

paul courtney
Reply to  Adrian Mann
November 8, 2020 6:30 am

Adrian Mann: Where do you go from here, down to “I know you are, but what am I?” routine?

Paul of Alexandria
Reply to  Richard Greene
November 8, 2020 9:35 am

Sorry but you are wrong. The various actions do make a difference and are enough to swing the election.

The evidence of fraud looks generally like this (partial list):

Extended voting beyond legal limits (PA)
Failure to segregate late versus timely ballots (PA)
Failure to check identifying marks on ballots (PA, GA, MI, NV)
Refusal to allow Republican election observers (most)
Blocking windows to prevent observation (Detroit)
4 A.M. dumps of 100% Biden votes (WI 65K, MI 138,499)
Large number of Biden ballots with only president vote compared to Trump ballots
Voting wards with more votes than voters (WI)
https://www.americanthinker.com/articles/2020/11/what_the_layperson_can_make_of_election_law.html goes into some detail on the subject.

Timothy R Robinson
Reply to  B d Clark
November 7, 2020 3:49 pm

With Biden’s declining health, we don’t need to worry about him reaching the white house. Kamala will be sure he isn’t sworn in.
Many other things I could say, but the electorate will have final say in December.

marlene
Reply to  B d Clark
November 7, 2020 6:56 pm

“Generative Adversarial Networks (GANs) are simulated constructs that appear to be real. Very advanced AI.
Generative Adversarial Networks (GANs) are simulated constructs that appear to be real. Very advanced AI
https://brandnewtube.com/watch/fLF9H5IbA8QswRn
This may be a ⁣Generative Adversarial Networks (GANs) simulation. GANs are simulated constructs using advanced Artificial Intelligence (AI).
For more about GANs, see ⁣https://wiki.pathmind.com/gene….rative-adversarial-n
https://wiki.pathmind.com/generative-adversarial-network-gan – Beginner’s Guide to Generative Adversarial Networks (GANs)

Reply to  B d Clark
November 7, 2020 7:04 pm

First of all, only the Media has said that Biden has won and Trump has lost.

Nothing is official until – Monday December 14, 2020 – Electors cast their electoral votes – and Wednesday January 6, 2021 when Congress counts and certifies the electoral votes.

Cheers

Roger

So Sa
Reply to  B d Clark
November 8, 2020 7:42 am

The clue is : who can honestly say Trump was ever going to accept any defeat?
He lost by probably 5% popular vote
4 million votes
7O ECV

It could have been double and he’d have said exactly the same.

Reply to  B d Clark
November 8, 2020 7:59 am

Focus please people. The question wasn’t whether fraud was committed but what happens if it was and it ends up being demonstrated. Which is an excellent question because if in fact it turns out that there was a sufficient level of ballot skulduggery to change the election, but it is not confirmed until after the president is sworn in, it is a very major problem what is then to be done. Especially given the massive size of the modern Executive Branch and the sheer administrative scale of transitions.

It seems to me the best solution is to bring forward any credible evidence as quickly as possible and investigate anything credible as quickly as possible, all as fair-mindedly as possible. In the current environment a lot of people are losing their cool and jumping to conclusions in both directions including rushing to answer a different question than was actually asked.

Let’s try to stay calm, rational and systematic.

BFL
Reply to  B d Clark
November 9, 2020 5:08 pm

“My question is does Biden take the presidency while Trump appeals?”

Regardless of MSM claims, Biden is not president, and has no power as such, until sworn in on 20 Jan 2021.
For an overview of the process, which is complex see:
https://crsreports.congress.gov/product/pdf/IF/IF11641

bigoilbob
Reply to  BFL
November 10, 2020 2:38 am

“Regardless of MSM claims, Biden is not president, and has no power as such, until sworn in on 20 Jan 2021.”

Which MSM outlet says any differently?

B d Clark
Reply to  bigoilbob
November 10, 2020 3:37 am

B.O.B your being obtuse, all MSM reported Biden as president when he reached 279 votes, it was a couple of days later when they changed the statement to ” president elect”

bigoilbob
Reply to  B d Clark
November 10, 2020 4:35 am

“B.O.B your being obtuse, all MSM reported Biden as president when he reached 279 votes,”

Folks, another alt. fact. Citation please, for that BigFoot MSM outlet that said, or inferred, that Biden was already president. Let alone, “all MSM”…..

JohnM
Reply to  B d Clark
November 9, 2020 8:35 pm

Timetable:
3 November = Election Day
3 December = Electoral College Voters selected
14 December = Electoral College Voters cast votes
6 January = The new Congress counts Electoral College votes
20 January = Inauguration Day.

Meanwhile, several states have election results close enough to qualify for a mandatory recount.
Oh, and the USPS photographs each piece of mail that passes through its system.

And even if all the “evidence” of voting fraud is thrown-out, there will still be many who don’t believe even that evidence!

It’s fascinating to watch The Fall of the USA empire, in real time.

sycomputing
Reply to  JohnM
November 10, 2020 5:11 am

Oh, and the USPS photographs each piece of mail that passes through its system.

“Mr. Donahoe said that unlike the National Security Agency’s collection of phone logs and overseas Web traffic that has come under scrutiny, the Postal Service does not maintain a massive database of the letter images. The scanning machines at the mail processing centers only keeps images of the letters they scan.

‘It’s done by machine, so there’s no central area where any of this information would be,’ he said. ‘It’s extremely expensive to keep pictures of billions of pieces of mail. So there’s no need for us to do that.'”

https://www.nytimes.com/2013/08/03/us/postal-service-confirms-photographing-all-us-mail.html

Old.George
November 7, 2020 2:13 pm

Get ready for an interesting month. There will be lawsuits.

Peter W
Reply to  Old.George
November 7, 2020 2:37 pm

Judicial Watch is already working on it.

Curious George
Reply to  Old.George
November 7, 2020 3:16 pm

Biden decided to take an initiative and declared himself President without waiting for courts. Welcome to Banana Republic USA.

starzmom
Reply to  Curious George
November 7, 2020 3:59 pm

What the media and Biden say is legally irrelevant. The election will not be decided until the states all certify their elections and the electoral college votes. There is lots of time for law fare between now and then. Just remember, in 2000, Gore did not concede until 3 weeks after the election, and multiple recounts and 2 Supreme Court decisions.

This time around, if there are big irregularities that can be proven–a big hurdle–we will know soon enough. And there will be time enough to work things out. All I ask at this point is that Trump be gracious and polite–he doesn’t have to concede anything yet, and he certainly seems disinclined to do so.

Tom in Florida
Reply to  starzmom
November 8, 2020 6:44 am

I don’t think these proclamations by Biden and the media are irrelevant. They are implanting the idea that the election is over and Biden has won. If, and only if, the legal challenges are upheld and Trump ends up the winner, then those who have fallen for the false narratives of the polls, the unofficial declarations of Biden and the media will protest as if Biden had actually won. Setting the mind set against a reversal is what they are up to.

bigoilbob
Reply to  Tom in Florida
November 8, 2020 6:51 am

“Biden and the media will protest as if Biden had actually won.”

Nope. More Trumpian projection. Please provide the name of ANY losing Dem prez candidate who handled it worse than a’lOrange.

Tom in Florida
Reply to  Tom in Florida
November 8, 2020 10:44 am

How about every single liberal politician and news person when Trump won in 2016.

ghl
Reply to  Tom in Florida
November 8, 2020 7:56 pm

Oily
L”orange has not lost yet.

niceguy
Reply to  Tom in Florida
November 10, 2020 4:15 pm

Clinton said it was the Russians, with zero evidence, and accused Trump of a bizarre conspiracy, so there is that.

Simon
Reply to  Curious George
November 7, 2020 4:23 pm

Why should Biden wait? All of the states have indicated the voting was counted legally and in accordance with their guidelines, so in the eyes of the law, that’s it. Game over.
Now if Trump thinks he can prove anything that would change the outcome, then that’s on him. Let’s see what he has got?

bigoilbob
Reply to  Simon
November 7, 2020 4:30 pm

+1

Transition activities should begin Monday. There have been zilch actual voting issues, that haven’t already been dealt with for decades. The only legal issues will be to ensure that i’s are dotted, t’s crossed. By the time the electors meet, all will be decided, and there will be only the whiny capital tweets to ignore…

Carlo, Monte
Reply to  bigoilbob
November 7, 2020 5:56 pm

The O-Bots have spake, so mote it be.

Thank you for revealing that you are not honest people.

Clyde Spencer
Reply to  bigoilbob
November 7, 2020 6:07 pm

b.o.b.
You said, “There have been zilch actual voting issues, that haven’t already been dealt with for decades.”
I don’t think that you have been paying attention. Or, perhaps, you are wearing political blinders. This election was anomalous because of the large percentage of mail-in ballots, in part because of the COVID-19 situation, in part because Democrats have been pushing for them, supposedly to make voting easy for people they claim are disenfranchised because of poverty. The point being that it isn’t the presence of voting fraud that is important, it is the potential for voting fraud of a magnitude not previously experienced in this country because of the high percentage of mail-in ballots and claims that poll watchers were not allowed to monitor the handling and counting.

At this point there is primarily anecdotal evidence of a high level of fraud. However, unless the complaints are investigated, the public will never know if the complaints are valid. “The lack of evidence is not evidence against.”

Loydo
Reply to  bigoilbob
November 7, 2020 10:49 pm

“anecdotal evidence”?

In lieu of actual evidence the word you’re looking for is gossip.

Trump has a handful of minor technicalities he is challenging, but even most of those will be dismissed as trivial.

Richard M
Reply to  bigoilbob
November 8, 2020 9:10 am

Watch the video above, linked to by Carbon Bigfoot, and tell us again there is no evidence of voter fraud. If you don’t want to watch the entire hour, view starting at about 45 minutes and see what happened in Michigan.

It also appears the same type of change that appeared in Michigan may have also occurred in Pennsylvania at about the same time.

Also note that there were more votes cast in Wisconsin than there are registered voters with Trump getting more votes than he got during the last election and still losing. That has never happened before.

It is not just Trumps tweets, it is real and obvious problems that indicate blatant voter fraud in multiple states. Most Americans will never see any of this from the mainstream media. The cover-up is under way.

bigoilbob
Reply to  Richard M
November 8, 2020 10:12 am

“Most Americans will never see any of this from the mainstream media. The cover-up is under way.”

Reynolds wrap hoodie territory. Thousands would have to perfectly collude in this Dr. Evil “cover up”. But I’ll throw you a bone. I’ll bet that there are dozens of messages just like yours, here in alt. world. They are the same crowd that believes that tens of thousands of scientists are inventing AGW for grant money – when the $, by orders of magnitude, are in denial.

MarkG
Reply to  Simon
November 7, 2020 5:15 pm

Why are you so desperate to push Biden into the White House right this minute?

Is it because you know that there’s no way to hold the fraud together until January?

All it takes is for a few fraudsters to get arrested, and the others will start turning each other in to avoid jail time.

Adrian Mann
Reply to  Simon
November 7, 2020 5:53 pm

He’s got nothing, as we all know. He was laying the ground for this course of action more than a year ago when it finally dawned on him that he could not, would not, win. The result will stand. One Term Trump will debase and humiliate himself, and will ultimately suffer the most egregious and draconian punishment imaginable – his Twitter account will be suspended.

Clyde Spencer
Reply to  Adrian Mann
November 7, 2020 6:17 pm

Mann
You claimed, without evidence, “… it finally dawned on him that he could not, would not, win.”
Why would he or anyone come to that conclusion, when in retrospect, he has taken all the ‘Flyover States,’ and come within a couple percentage points of winning the key swing states? It is only the Media, pollsters, and irrational Democrats that were convinced that Trump didn’t have a chance and would lose by a wide margin. Or were they trying to convince the electorate that Trump would lose by such a wide margin that it wasn’t worth the effort for supporters to vote? Or that fence sitters should ‘get on the band wagon?’

Your remarks sound like you are giving yourself too much credit for being able to read people’s minds.

philincalifornia
Reply to  Simon
November 7, 2020 6:39 pm

Simon says “Why should Biden wait?”

Probably because he has to, by law, wait for the Electoral College vote on December 14th.

Amazing what you can learn on here isn’t it?

Simon
Reply to  philincalifornia
November 7, 2020 8:21 pm

philincalifornia
Huh? Trump claimed victory pretty soon after he won just like Biden has. It’s customary.

philincalifornia
Reply to  philincalifornia
November 8, 2020 5:26 am

Juvenile comment as usual. The question was about Biden and had nothing to do with Trump.

…. and customary my ass. It’s customary when the opponent has conceded in a close race. For example, even from your own propaganda channel:

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2016/nov/08/presidential-election-updates-trump-clinton-news

But, the voices in your head know best, eh?

Simon
Reply to  philincalifornia
November 8, 2020 11:02 am

philincalifornia
Trump claimed victory the night of the election saying a huge fraud had been committed on the American people. I don’t think his supporters have any right to complain about the guy who got the most votes doing the same thing given Trump is not going to concede any time soon.

philincalifornia
Reply to  philincalifornia
November 8, 2020 11:40 am

OK, cool. It seems that we both agree that you can’t answer the question tabled.

Tom Foley
Reply to  Curious George
November 7, 2020 10:34 pm

At most Biden has claimed he is president-elect, as most candidates with the electoral college numbers at this stage of the process have done in the past. You obviously know that this will not be confirmed until December at the earliest (allowing for legal challenges). So your statement is just muddying the water.

Doonman
Reply to  Tom Foley
November 8, 2020 10:11 am

I don’t remember any presidential candidate claiming to be president-elect until the other has conceded the election. Apparently, you do or you would not have made the statement. Please convince me my memory is faulty by providing the name of those candidates who did. I’ll anxiously wait while you do that.

bigoilbob
Reply to  Doonman
November 8, 2020 11:15 am

“I don’t remember any presidential candidate claiming to be president-elect until the other has conceded the election.”

And I don’t remember any president or presidential candidate failing to graciously concede the election, when the result was certain. Since Joe and Kamala want to get things going in the right direction ASAP, it made perfect sense.

Doonman
Reply to  Doonman
November 8, 2020 11:48 am

Apparently, bigoilbob can’t provide the names either.

MFKBoulder
Reply to  Curious George
November 8, 2020 12:16 am

I guess your TV was not working Tuesday night.

bigoilbob
November 7, 2020 2:14 pm

“Most of our readers realize that today’s media pronouncements are meaningless and we are in for a month or more of lawfare.”

It’s the “lawfare” that will end up being meaningless. What is important now is a smooth transition. I’m sure we will get Don’s full co-operation…..

starzmom
Reply to  Charles Rotter
November 7, 2020 4:09 pm

Bob might not opine, but I will. The Supreme Court, in what I believe was a 6-3 decision in Bush v. Gore, held that Florida must adhere to its own election laws to stop counting at a certain point in time. The Gore campaign was trying to argue that some counties should have extra time to do recounts, but other counties (favoring Bush) should not be permitted to recount at all.

After the dust cleared on the election, the New York Times, through the Freedom of Information Act (or something comparable in Florida) conducted its own recount of all ballots, and concluded that Bush did indeed win.

The interesting comparison is that no one was alleging voter fraud in 2000–most of the argument was over how to count anomalous ballots–hanging chads and more than one vote for president and the like.

niceguy
Reply to  starzmom
November 9, 2020 8:35 pm

“The interesting comparison is that no one was alleging voter fraud in 2000”

That statement is misleading at best, if not a lie.

The main allegation was that the ballot caused confusion on which hole to punch to vote Gore, and the design was indented to confuse voters. So there were allegations of dishonesty (if not fraud or vote suppression) against Republicans.

As a French citizen who barely followed US politics at the time, I know that.

bigoilbob
Reply to  Charles Rotter
November 7, 2020 4:15 pm

“Please opine with your wisdom on Bush v. Gore.”

Why? That was one state, incredibly tight. And none of the fact free allegations/whines capital tweeted out so far. And a respectful concession at the end. And a co-operative transition.

The lawfare will be an irrelevant side show. What counts is anything approaching President Obama’s 2016 transition co-operation. I’m guessing, infantile tantrums, starting at the top, instead…

YallaYPoora Kid
Reply to  bigoilbob
November 7, 2020 8:43 pm

Yes such cooperation and calmness by Obama.
Setting up Trump at the time to be undermined by the FBI like a smiling assassin.

Tom Foley
Reply to  YallaYPoora Kid
November 7, 2020 10:52 pm

Obama (as Trump now, and all departing presidents) had two choices: assist with an harmonious transition, or spit the dummy and whinge about the opposite party winning.

Why would cooperation and calmness set up the winner for undermining? Wouldn’t whinging and negative comments be more effective if that was the aim?

Anyway, the FBI didn’t need any encouragement to keep an eye on Trump; they would do this with any leader. As we’ve seen over the years, the relationship was fractious. And goes back well before Trump became president. The new documentary ‘An American Affair: Trump and the FBI’ should be interesting.

niceguy
Reply to  YallaYPoora Kid
November 9, 2020 8:32 pm

The FBI kept an eye on Obama? Even when he sent billions of dollars to a terror enabler state?

paul courtney
Reply to  bigoilbob
November 8, 2020 6:50 am

bob: President Obama’s 2016 transition? So, you’re OK if Trump’s team at FBI and DOJ investigate Biden, keep it from him, set up a special counsel staffed with trumpkins, and impeach Joe? Seems like a long ‘way round the barn to get the Pres. Kamala of your dreams.

niceguy
Reply to  bigoilbob
November 8, 2020 9:48 am

“That was one state, incredibly tight”

Nope. Incredibly large, unbeatable difference of many thousands.

You will believe ANYTHING. It’s practically the requirement to get jobs in political analysis or epidemiology or criminology to accept that

– mass immigration in Sweden didn’t cause super-explosion of rapes
– the HBV in France (one of which was so awful, the producer didn’t try to have it accepted anywhere else) don’t cause tripling of MS
– the Dems were not in the process of stealing the Bush election in Florida by making up votes

Reply to  Charles Rotter
November 8, 2020 5:23 am

My pleasure Charles,

Hanging chads!

Tom in Florida
Reply to  bigoilbob
November 7, 2020 2:24 pm

If Biden has won fairly, then no problem

mario lento
Reply to  Tom in Florida
November 7, 2020 2:40 pm

“If Biden has won fairly, then no problem”
Based on what I have seen, that hypothesis no longer exists. The only question now is, To what extent did the fraud (several categories) affect the results.

Harry Davidson
Reply to  Tom in Florida
November 7, 2020 2:54 pm

Define fairly. Name a US Presidential election, ever, that was free of fraud.

J t
Reply to  Harry Davidson
November 7, 2020 3:15 pm

So…I take it that in your simplistic view of the universe, there’s no difference between burning your steak and burning your house down. And slapping someone’s cheek is no different than breaking his face and busting three ribs.

Harry Davidson
Reply to  J t
November 8, 2020 9:00 am

A strawman only wins an argument between idiots.

Tom in Florida
Reply to  Harry Davidson
November 7, 2020 3:15 pm

But never such blatant fraud and on this level.

MarkG
Reply to  Tom in Florida
November 7, 2020 3:48 pm

Yes. This is fraud on a level never previously believed possible.

If Harris is allowed to win, America will officially have reached Banana Republic status.

Simon
Reply to  Tom in Florida
November 7, 2020 4:28 pm

Tom
Well come on what proof have you got these was major fraud? I mean it what can be confirmed here? I think you will find apart from the odd individual doing dumb stuff this was a fair election. Yes some of the watchers were asked to stand back in one or two locations…. but that wont change a thing. And all those ballots can be counted and checked. And let’s not forget Georgia was one of those states that had Biden surge back late and that election was run by the Republicans in charge.

Tom in Florida
Reply to  Tom in Florida
November 7, 2020 5:07 pm

Simon,
The change in election law by the PA Court is number one. As in Bush v Gore, the SCOTUS threw out the Florida SC change in the law reaffirming that only the legislature can change laws. Second, the unverified mail in vote is suspicious enough for a recount. Third, the problem in Georgia was in Atlanta where the Democrats run the election in those precincts.
Isn’t it odd that only in Democrat run cities of Atlanta, Detroit, Milwaukee and Philadelphia is there suspicion of fraud. And those are the cities that overcame large Trump leads after the election. You bury your head in the sand and ignore it all because you agree with the current outcome.

Adrian Mann
Reply to  Tom in Florida
November 7, 2020 5:57 pm

Let’s see the evidence to back up that claim.

No… Tweets from Trump do not count as evidence.

Simon
Reply to  Tom in Florida
November 7, 2020 6:58 pm

Tom

hey look, if a recount is needed then lets’ do it. I for one don’t believe there will be anything untoward found. It all made sense. Dems said do mail in to their voters and so those states that counted them last showed a claw back near the end. Also let’s not forget the polls in Philadelphia showed Biden clearly ahead. Now I know the polls have been off in quite a few places, but my point is it it was no surprise Biden won there. In fact the surprise if anything is that Trump did as well as he did across the nation.

mario lento
Reply to  Tom in Florida
November 8, 2020 2:35 am

Tom: You’re right.

I was not allowed to post this on FaceBook. It does a nice job of making the case for fraud through statistics. Anyone here want to take a look and let me know what to think?

The message warned “Pages and websites that repeastedly publish or share false news will see their overall distribution reduced and be restricted in out ways.”

https://theredelephants.com/there-is-undeniable-mathematical-evidence-the-election-is-being-stolen/

Splitdog Homee
Reply to  Harry Davidson
November 7, 2020 4:10 pm

Are you are OK with this level of fraud? Sounds like you are.

mario lento
Reply to  Harry Davidson
November 7, 2020 4:28 pm

Harry: You have just make no point whatsoever if you think lawlessness is OK because it’s been done before. You must also think peaceful protests mean burning down the streets and killing people.

mario lento
Reply to  Harry Davidson
November 9, 2020 9:39 pm

Harry: And what you wrote, is sophomoric non sequitur as is used by children. Looks who’s talking about using a strawman. You are not a serious person.

Old Woman of the North
Reply to  Tom in Florida
November 7, 2020 5:43 pm

Biden himself said on TV that ‘the Democrats have organized the most comprehensive voting fraud in history’ everyone thought it may have been his mental state but now, it seems, he was just telling the truth.

Simon
Reply to  Old Woman of the North
November 7, 2020 8:23 pm

Old Woman of the North
“‘the Democrats have organized the most comprehensive voting fraud in history’ ”
No he didn’t.

Farmer Ch E retired
Reply to  Old Woman of the North
November 7, 2020 9:17 pm

I copied the quote from a video of his speech.

Farmer Ch E retired
Reply to  Farmer Ch E retired
November 8, 2020 2:57 pm

More political satire (with an assist from The Political Art of David Dees)

Doonman
Reply to  Tom in Florida
November 8, 2020 10:18 am

Yes, kicking out poll observers, ignoring judicial orders to access and covering up windows to prevent looking in is always an indication of fairness.

Reply to  Doonman
November 8, 2020 2:22 pm

Consciousness of guilt. Much like when HRC destroyed evidence subpoenaed by Congress. What was she hiding? I don’t think it was influence pedaling through the Clinton Foundation, as this was already widely known. I’ll bet it was her involvement in making up the whole Russian collusion hoax which would have also implicated high level people in the Obama administration, which we now know went all the way up to Obama and Biden.

Reply to  bigoilbob
November 7, 2020 2:35 pm

The Democrats set the bar pretty low when it comes to the smooth transition of power …

Although, Biden chose Harris for the same reason Obama chose him as VP. The results of an impeachment would be worse. None the less, Biden won’t last until the end if 2021 and will either resign for health reasons or be impeached by his own party for influence peddling. Pelosi no longer needs her 25’th amendment ‘fixes’.

Rich Davis
Reply to  co2isnotevil
November 7, 2020 4:54 pm

It will be a bizarre sight, but surely enough Republican senators would acquit on impeachment rather than allowing Harris to assume office. So we’re back to the 25th amendment or voluntary resignation, death, or Clinton-style “suicide” aka assassination.

The 25th amendment won’t work for the Dems unless Biden agrees to it. If he agreed to it, he would just resign, with no further drama.

If he disputes his incapacity under the 25th amendment, it will require a 2/3rds vote of the both the House and Senate to remove him. As with impeachment, Republicans will oppose removal if it means that Harris assumes office.

What if the Senate is stolen as well? If Pelosi and Schumer push through a law designating a different body to determine whether a president who disputes incapacity under the 25th amendment can be removed, such that Republicans could not block removal, then Biden would presumably veto the bill, thus requiring 2/3rds majorities to override the veto, which Republicans would block.

So if we want to avoid President Harris, we must hope that Biden wants to be president and is not “suicidal” or otherwise on his death bed.

Well first of all, we can hope that the fraud can somehow throw out the EC electors from disputed states, or some state court decisions reverse the outcomes in enough states.

I am not very optimistic about that. This is the flip-side of the Electoral College and 10th amendment. The sovereign states decide the process whereby their electors are selected, and their Supreme Courts alone have jurisdiction on interpretation of their state law and constitution, except in the event that a state law violates the US Constitution.

The US Supreme Court cannot legitimately rule that a (US-)constitutionally valid state law has been violated or is in violation of that state’s own constitution. The conservative justices are conservative because they refuse to make decisions based on their own political preferences, unlike the liberal justices who make it up on the fly.

My take is we probably have to live with Dementia Joe and pray for Georgia. Then in 2022, take back Congress to get gridlock firmly in place.

But I’m just a semi-informed layman, so maybe I’m missing something here.

Adrian Mann
Reply to  Rich Davis
November 7, 2020 6:00 pm

Yep, I can confirm that for you – you are definitely, absolutely missing something.

Your task is now to figure what that is, and then you can start to make some sense of this omnishambles.

Rich Davis
Reply to  Adrian Mann
November 7, 2020 6:37 pm

Wow, Adrian, I am reluctantly confirming that Trump is unlikely to win through the courts. It seems you are too dim to grasp that.

Rich Davis
Reply to  Adrian Mann
November 7, 2020 8:35 pm

I apologize for that comment. I thought you were someone else who was arguing that Biden won fair and square.

There is some hope for action at the state level, such as recounts discovering discrepancies or legislatures disputing results, etc.

Maybe there could be a basis for some actions being unconstitutional at a federal level. I could certainly be missing something. So far I haven’t heard anything promising.

TRM
Reply to  Rich Davis
November 7, 2020 6:03 pm

Good possibility. Sort of like the Democrats had to get rid of Agnew before they would go after Nixon. Could happen.

starzmom
Reply to  Rich Davis
November 7, 2020 6:20 pm

The US Supreme Court can rule that a state cannot violate its own laws, and they did just that in Bush v Gore in 2000, when they said that the state must adhere to its own laws governing when counts and recounts must end. They are the court of final jurisdiction in the country.

Also the 25th amendment has a couple of avenues to push aside the President if he is incapacitated, one of which involves the President disputing the incapacity, in which case the and other executive branch officers may provide their own declaration of incapacity again, and the matter goes to the Congress, where a 2/3rds vote of both houses of concurrence is required. The President does not need to sign anything. He is also not removed from office–he is merely moved aside while the Vice President assumes his duties as acting president. The language of the amendment appears to assume that in the event of a terminal condition the President would either resign or die, in which case the VP would become president and a new VP would be nominated and confirmed by both houses of Congress. Since this amendment has never been invoked, there are no judicial opinions covering the situation in which an incapacitated president refused to leave office willingly.

Rich Davis
Reply to  starzmom
November 7, 2020 6:50 pm

It is a political decision, just like removal by impeachment. It’s very clear in the text. No need for any precedent. If the president disputes incapacity he immediately resumes office until and unless both houses of Congress come to a political decision with a supermajority of 2/3rds to remove him. It is not a scientific question to determine if he is incapacitated. If he’s alive and has disputed incapacity, they must vote or he stays. I guess that if he were unconscious and the cabal once again asserted incapacity such that he could not dispute it, then the conditions would apply so long as he remains unconscious or dies.

It’s foolishness to discuss 25th amendment involuntary removal. In order of likelihood, he will serve out his term, resign, or die in office. He will never be removed involuntarily by impeachment or asserted incapacity.

Reply to  starzmom
November 8, 2020 9:27 am

I’m pretty sure he made a deal with his handlers to step down after the election. After all, they certainly knew of his mental deterioration and that he’s incapable of performing the most demanding job on the planet. He might have backed off on that promise which was why Pelosi was looking at changing the 25’th amendment.

His handlers boxed him in to choose Harris by forcing him to declare that his running mate would be a woman of color. They knew that Harris was the least toxic of the possibilities, they wanted to appease their far left base and knew that Harris would become the President shortly after the election. How else could they fool the electorate to ‘elect’ the most far left, absolute worst candidate in the Democratic field.

Reply to  Rich Davis
November 7, 2020 8:20 pm

Err… No. There are many instances where SCOTUS has overruled a State high court that has “interpreted” a State statute in an egregiously opposite way from even the most obfuscated language. The precedent is that legislators legislate, courts do not. (Yes, I know, I know – “activist judges.” Note, however, that even the most “activist” decisions are “justified” by appeals to the Constitution in the judgement that is handed down.)

Rich Davis
Reply to  Writing Observer
November 7, 2020 10:14 pm

As I understand it, the states are sovereign to interpret their own laws and constitution. The US Supreme Court is the final arbiter of whether a state law or state constitutional provision is in conflict with the US Constitution, not whether the state law is just or prudent, or consistent with the state’s constitution. If a state SC rules that a state law should be interpreted a certain way, even though a reasonable person would see the interpretation as unreasonable or even corrupt, I don’t think the federal authorities have jurisdiction unless they can argue that some US Constitutional provision is being violated such as the equal protection clause.

If the SCOTUS could overrule a state SC ruling on a matter not touching the enumerated powers of federal government, then all state laws could be nullified by someone suing in state court and appealing to the SCOTUS, which would make a mockery of any state sovereignty.

If I recall correctly the SCOTUS in the Florida recount case Bush v Gore based the decision on equal protection grounds.

I have to assume that Trump’s team has some rationale for litigating in federal court and we’ll hear what that is as things unfold.

Andrew F
Reply to  Rich Davis
November 7, 2020 10:23 pm

The issue with respect to PA and its State Supreme Court is not one of interpretation, but rather that the SC usurped the unambiguous word of law – effectively creating new law (or changing the existing) – and that is not their mandate – that is logically and legally the mandate of the state legislature.

And the Federal Supreme Court will smash them for it 0- as they should.

Tom Foley
Reply to  Rich Davis
November 7, 2020 11:06 pm

Rich Davis: so you want to take back Congress and get gridlock firmly in place? That sounds as though you want a system that prevents the Democrats ever governing and embeds Republican control. In effect, disenfranchising more than 50% of the population.

What a great role model as leader of the free world! The irony of it: to advance democracy, you would behave undemocratically?

Rich Davis
Reply to  Tom Foley
November 8, 2020 11:25 am

The government that governs least, governs best. (Thomas Jefferson)

Absolutely I want to block every damn one of the Democrat’s suicide pacts.

Nobody is disenfranchised because they don’t get what they want. They vote and they lose. We have an intentionally encumbered republic that has numerous checks and balances to prevent the tyranny of the majority. We are not a parliamentary democracy. The executive and the legislature are completely separate by design.

And another thing. We are a role model for the world. It’s just that the world keeps getting its panties in a twist over the fact that we’re not following their script.

bigoilbob
Reply to  Rich Davis
November 8, 2020 11:34 am

“They vote and they lose. We have an intentionally encumbered republic that has numerous checks and balances to prevent the tyranny of the majority.”

Minority rights has been perverted into minority rule. A minority of red taker states has a vested interest in disenfranchising the rest of us.

Mark Luhman
Reply to  bigoilbob
November 7, 2020 2:42 pm

Like Trump did of Oblama. If we follow that model, Biden will be charge with money laundering by the end of the month. Unlike Trump Biden sold us out for money a long time ago and he hid the transfers. Only useful idiot don’t know this by now.

Tom in Florida
Reply to  Mark Luhman
November 7, 2020 4:05 pm

I have speculated about this. If the Democrat controlled House impeaches Biden for the dame crimes they accused Trump of committing, the they get a twofer. They can claim that they would prove themselves as being fair by treating both men the same and they get rid of Biden at the same time.

Clyde Spencer
Reply to  bigoilbob
November 7, 2020 6:20 pm

b.o.b.
A smooth transition will be very difficult after deep thinkers like Pelosi said, “He’s not My president!”

David J Bufalo
November 7, 2020 2:17 pm

I suspect that Biden will either resign voluntarily because of health reasons, or Nancy Pelosi/Kamala Harris will invoke the 25th amendment. Harris becomes president and Pelosi becomes vice president. Then suppose Harris resigns and Pelosi becomes president? Far fetched? Maybe. Would any of this be called election fraud?

icisil
Reply to  David J Bufalo
November 7, 2020 2:24 pm

It doesn’t work that way.

Rich Davis
Reply to  icisil
November 7, 2020 5:06 pm

Right see my comments above.

Also, the Speaker of the House only succeeds the president if both the president and vice president have died, resigned, or have been removed (in the right sequence without having the VP replaced). Of course a Dem-controlled Senate could join the Dem-controlled House in approving Pelosi as VP, after the death, resignation, or removal of Harris, if Biden nominated Pelosi, but in that case, Harris obviously does not become President.

Tom in Florida
Reply to  David J Bufalo
November 7, 2020 2:30 pm

No, first if Biden was out, then Harris would have to nominate a new Vice President. The only way the Speaker of the House (and it may very well not be Pelosi) is if both the President and VP go out together. But let’s suppose that AOC becomes Speaker of the House? She is not eligible to be President so who would it be then? President pro tempore of the Senate who is currently a Republican.

Conor Duggan
Reply to  David J Bufalo
November 7, 2020 2:34 pm

It’s highly likely that he won’t serve the full term. If he does serve his full term then it’ll be Harris or others in his administration making all the decisions, they’ll wheel him out on special occasions to wave at the crowd.

Tom in Florida
Reply to  Conor Duggan
November 7, 2020 2:46 pm

Weekend at Biden’s?

Janice Moore
Reply to  Tom in Florida
November 7, 2020 4:34 pm

Heh.

TRM
Reply to  Tom in Florida
November 7, 2020 5:51 pm

LOL. Good one.

Mark A Luhman
Reply to  Conor Duggan
November 7, 2020 4:15 pm

At present Harris is being cut out of the action. It looks to me a cabal is going to run the presidency with Biden as the figure head. The hope they have is he can last eight years. It no a bad plan by the big tech and corporate master, an even worse thought is the CCP might be part of the cabal also.

Gary Pearse
Reply to  Mark A Luhman
November 7, 2020 5:47 pm

Mark, Biden might dribble his way through 4 yrs from the Whitehouse basement with someone else running the show, but he won’t go through another election which he would have to do to serve 8 yrs.

icisil
Reply to  Conor Duggan
November 7, 2020 4:16 pm
icisil
Reply to  icisil
November 7, 2020 5:26 pm

Forgot to add…

Kamala: Oh look, Joe, there’s Cliff; wave at Cliff.”
Biden: [waves]”Hi Cliff”

JimH in CA
Reply to  Conor Duggan
November 7, 2020 4:37 pm

Not serving a full term would mean that all that construction expense of a new oval office, IN THE BASEMENT, for Biden would be wasted…but maybe not, as a bunker for Kamala.

David Guy-Johnson
November 7, 2020 2:17 pm

Lawfare because Trump is a bad loser. He lost this for the Republicans.

markl
Reply to  David Guy-Johnson
November 7, 2020 2:26 pm

You mean the Republicans that never supported him from his campaign through today?

Tom in Florida
Reply to  David Guy-Johnson
November 7, 2020 2:31 pm

He hasn’t lost just yet.

M_N
Reply to  Tom in Florida
November 7, 2020 3:24 pm

Yes, he has.

Tom in Florida
Reply to  M_N
November 7, 2020 3:58 pm

Have the electoral votes been cast and counted yet? No, so there is no winner yet.

TRM
Reply to  Tom in Florida
November 7, 2020 5:59 pm

December 8th is the next date. Let’s see what the next month holds.
Gore and Kerry took a dive to support the corrupt political system. I don’t think Trump will as he has nothing invested in the system.

philincalifornia
Reply to  Tom in Florida
November 7, 2020 6:46 pm

TRM, yes this may be a case of careful what you wish for. Unless Trump rides into the sunset quietly, ha ha very unlikely, he’s probably going to be more dangerous as a civilian than as President.

Adrian Mann
Reply to  Tom in Florida
November 7, 2020 6:01 pm

Yes, he absolutely has.

Janice Moore
Reply to  David Guy-Johnson
November 7, 2020 2:37 pm

Trump hasn’t lost.

https://youtu.be/gojAer8RavU
(Liberal Hivemind, youtube, 11/7/20)

Adrian Mann
Reply to  Janice Moore
November 7, 2020 6:06 pm

Er… yes, he actually has. He got less votes than his opponent. His opponent got more votes. That’s kinda the point. That you don’t like it is of no importance.

starzmom
Reply to  Adrian Mann
November 7, 2020 6:24 pm

No votes have been certified anywhere yet. Most states haven’t even finished counting. anything the media tells you or Biden says to the contrary are wrong.

Carl Friis-Hansen
Reply to  Janice Moore
November 8, 2020 2:00 am

“The people who cast the votes decide nothing. The people who count the votes decide everything” – Joseph Stalin

This was a quote from one of the commenters on YT below the video

mario lento
Reply to  David Guy-Johnson
November 7, 2020 2:44 pm

Trump won this, Dem’s did what they do, cheated, and they have been caught.
Whether they pay for it is politics. But your framing of the situation is false on its face. Trump caught all of the prior Dem tricks, and this too will run its course.

Doc Chuck
Reply to  mario lento
November 7, 2020 4:47 pm

And this is just the latest formidable contribution of a political outsider willing and able to ‘make America great again’ despite being subject to ceaseless personal vilification — unmasking all the recurring hate-filled deceit among that entrenched self-serving swamp of mislabeled ‘public servants’ that extends well beyond D.C. What a record of nearly single-handed service to his nation he has fulfilled at the expense of gratuitous personal attacks inflated by the rank abandonment of honest journalism. This ‘orange man’ has proven such a valuable litmus test to expose the covert dishonor of so many of his fellow politicos and their fellow traveling toadies whose conduct is beneath contempt.

Gary Pearse
Reply to  Doc Chuck
November 7, 2020 5:53 pm

And he may win a much deserved Nobel Peace Prize. Deserved! What a concept. They’ve doled them out to some ugly characters in the last few decades.

James Stagg
Reply to  Doc Chuck
November 7, 2020 6:13 pm

+10, ((if I could!). Well-stated!

Paul Seward
November 7, 2020 2:21 pm

Will America ever again, at least in our lifetimes, believe the results of any future election? Will this further divide the country in two? Will this result in a despotic government run by the communists (currently called democrats)? Will this eventually result in civil war?

leon tesla
Reply to  Paul Seward
November 7, 2020 2:35 pm

The democrats are anything but communists. They are two-faced, triangulating, opportunistic, bottom-dwelling corporatists. Please get your terminology straight!

Mark Luhman
Reply to  leon tesla
November 7, 2020 2:52 pm

No the a leftist, the same leftist that was silence when there fellow leftist murder over 200,000,000 people in the twenty century. Already the are talking reeducation camps. They are going to need them when their incompetence will causear them to fail. The question is, will thing get so bad the as usual end up shooting their useful idiots also. That is the left it model or rule. The left’s useful idiots never learn, of course that not surprising since the so call enlighten member of the left never learn. So thank useful idiot this is the first time we may have elect a President that is not capable of doing the job, yet the fools of his party never as the question what now. Not surprising the left destroys everything the touch.

Willem post
Reply to  leon tesla
November 7, 2020 4:48 pm

Democrats are command and control people, who use government to have power.
Republicans are command and control people, who use private corporations to have power.

PC_Bob
Reply to  Paul Seward
November 7, 2020 3:09 pm

If Trump loses this election, I vow to never vote, ever again! I will have lost ALL sense of what’s right! I’ll feel that my military service was all for naught! None of Americas values will stand for anything. So, yes, there will be a huge divide in this country, but, then, we already have that, now! It was NOT caused by Donald Trump, but started the first day of Obama’s first term, and , in fact, started even earlier, during the Clinton years, when he was allowed to escape his impeachment! The Democrats have been busily engineering this since at least 1950! It has been a very long, steep downward spiralling descent into the destruction of this country. Trump did NOT cause that!

TonyG
Reply to  Paul Seward
November 7, 2020 3:34 pm

The election process is so compromised I can’t imagine anyone believing the results of any election – that doesn’t go their way (about what we seem to have now).

I don’t see a Biden presidency bridging the divide, and a Harris presidency will be even worse. I am convinced at this point that we are witnessing the end of the nation.

MarkG
Reply to  TonyG
November 7, 2020 3:50 pm

America isn’t a nation, and hasn’t been for a couple of hundred years. It’s a gaggle of competing nations stuffed into the same country.

Which is always a recipe for conflict followed by secession.

starzmom
Reply to  TonyG
November 7, 2020 4:13 pm

Biden said he wants to be president for all Americans. Well, not this American. He will never be my president, and I suspect many others feel the same way. He will never bridge the divide, and neither will his running mate.

Splitdog Homee
Reply to  Paul Seward
November 7, 2020 4:19 pm

A fair election could happen and believed. This was not it.

Adrian Mann
Reply to  Splitdog Homee
November 7, 2020 6:05 pm

And how have you arrived at this opinion? Because your preferred candidate did not win? Is it only fair if it goes your way? I think you need to re-evaluate your understanding of this.

November 7, 2020 2:23 pm

Voting by mail is well known to be wide open to vote manipulation.
So much so, that there are bound to be many such instances.
The issue is going to be whether the scale is sufficient to make a difference and whether it was authorised at a high level within the Party benefitting from it.

Tom in Florida
Reply to  Stephen Wilde
November 7, 2020 2:34 pm

The Democrats have been practicing this in California for years. They call it ballot harvesting and it always favors the Democrats days later when Republicans win on election night.

Bindidon
Reply to  Stephen Wilde
November 7, 2020 2:51 pm

Stephen Wilde

” Voting by mail is well known to be wide open to vote manipulation. ”

1. From Germany I tell you: bare nonsense. Everybody here is allowed to vote by mail:

.
Absentee voting has existed in Germany since 1957, originally in order to ensure that all German citizens, especially the old, sick, and disabled, and citizens living abroad, have the opportunity to participate in elections.
.
At first, postal voters had to state why they could not cast their vote in person on Election Day; but this requirement has been dropped in 2008, allowing everyone to use postal voting.
.
Like in many other countries, in more recent years, voting by mail has become increasingly popular among younger and non-disabled citizens residing within the country; as such, various tools are being developed to help citizens, both domestic and abroad, more easily apply for postal voting.
.

My German lady often made use of this possibilty.

2. Until this year, Trump used mail voting all the time.

This time, by accident of course,
– he accuses mail voting, like you do here, of being a major source for fraud;
and consequently
– he voted in persona for the first time.

Some comment, Mr Wilde?

Best regards
J.-P. D.

Tom in Florida
Reply to  Bindidon
November 7, 2020 3:18 pm

You are confusing absentee ballots which are strictly controlled to general mail in voting which has no controls. Try to keep up.

Reply to  Bindidon
November 7, 2020 3:18 pm

You can’t compare German elections with Americans.

Curious George
Reply to  Bindidon
November 7, 2020 3:24 pm

You confuse absentee voting with voting by mail. In an absentee voting, a voter requests a mail ballot, and returns it. In a voting by mail, a registrar of voters mails ballots to everybody on voter rolls, including deceased voters and voters who moved away years ago.

saveenergy
Reply to  Curious George
November 7, 2020 4:44 pm

“a registrar of voters mails ballots to everybody on voter rolls, including deceased voters and voters who moved away years ago.”

So why don’t they keep the voter rolls up to date ? it aint rocket science, if Google & Amozon can track every move you make, why cant the registrar of voters ???

Tom in florida
Reply to  saveenergy
November 7, 2020 5:12 pm

Because it is advantageous for the voter rolls to be incorrect. One side or the other will take advantage of it.

Rich Davis
Reply to  saveenergy
November 7, 2020 5:14 pm

Um, because that would block voter fraud obviously. It’s not incompetence, it’s evil genius.

Curious George
Reply to  saveenergy
November 7, 2020 5:21 pm

An excellent question. Probably not enough money. Are you sure that Google and Amazon know your permanent address?

Gunga Din
Reply to  saveenergy
November 7, 2020 5:42 pm

Ohio tries to do that. (Guess who screamed bloody murder?)
To “paraphrase”, if a registered voter shows no voting activity for a certain number of years (6?) then they a are a notice that if they don’t respond to the notice then they will need to re-register.
(I said “paraphrase” because I don’t recall all details but the gist of what I said is correct.)

TonyG
Reply to  saveenergy
November 8, 2020 8:48 am

So why don’t they keep the voter rolls up to date ?

The registrars don’t seem to bother, and whenever anyone tries to get them updated, you have certain groups (all of which lean Dem) screaming about “voter suppression” and the like; even trying to block any such updates from being done.

Jeff Alberts
Reply to  Bindidon
November 7, 2020 3:26 pm

Small country with a single government. Not a valid comparison.

Rich Davis
Reply to  Jeff Alberts
November 7, 2020 5:20 pm

Germany?
83.8 million

Neither so small, nor a single government. That’s what Bundesrepublik means — Federal Republic. 16 states (Bundesländer)

Reply to  Rich Davis
November 8, 2020 4:03 am

Federal Parliament and Chancellor elections are done at once in complete Germany.

Rich Davis
Reply to  Rich Davis
November 8, 2020 11:31 am

Yes, but my point was not that there is an electoral college, but that there are state governments that at least in theory are not just administrative districts of the national government. The difference you refer to is the difference between having an independent executive and having a parliamentary democracy where the executive is controlled directly by the leading party or coalition.

Larry in Texas
Reply to  Bindidon
November 7, 2020 3:45 pm

All the time? Trump has only run for office once – in 2016. We didn’t have a mail-in vote system like this one, ever, until this year. There are and have been absentee ballot systems (with very specific grounds and procedures, although those vary a lot among the 50 states) that have been in place. You have to specifically REQUEST an absentee ballot in most, if not all, of the 50 states.

Trump hasn’t used any “mail-in” voting before this election – and it wasn’t his choice, either.

By the way, Germany is one of the few European countries to have absentee/mail-in voting for anyone. France made a specific exception ONLY for this year to allow mail-in ballots to those who are actually sick or at risk of the COVID-19 virus; otherwise, it is prohibited. Poland has an exception that allows mail-in ballots ONLY for the disabled, upon presentation of a special certificate; Poland allowed mail-in balloting this year ONLY because of COVID-19. It’s gone after this year.

A sizeable number of European countries have significant restrictions on absentee/mail-in voting – like requiring a photo ID (which none of the states currently in dispute have), which would be an excellent idea. You think you can troll the Democratic National Committee and tell them that?

Gerald Machnee
Reply to  Larry in Texas
November 7, 2020 5:33 pm

It is not the mail in voting but the computer system:
see:
This is about an hour, but it tells you what went on.

https://realclimatescience.com/2020/11/cnn-provides-smoking-gun-of-election-fraud/

Old Ski Bum
Reply to  Gerald Machnee
November 7, 2020 6:52 pm

Yes! I watched the entire video. It clearly shows how they did it including the “pause” the 5 state took at the same time Tuesday night. It’s a myth the voting system is not connected to the internet.

Buz Bohmeyer
Reply to  Bindidon
November 7, 2020 3:48 pm

There’s a big difference between the requirements for an Absentee Ballot and blindly mass-mailing ballots using outdated voter lists that contain dead people and folks who have moved.

Rich Davis
Reply to  Buz Bohmeyer
November 7, 2020 5:23 pm

Yes in fact there were 3 people still on the voting rolls in my town who used to live in my household.

Gunga Din
Reply to  Buz Bohmeyer
November 7, 2020 5:55 pm

How many states require proof of citizenship to register to vote?

Mark A Luhman
Reply to  Bindidon
November 7, 2020 4:28 pm

you can thank God Germany does not have a criminal organization parading around as a political party. That is the history of the Democrat party. Their first President elected they got elected defied a Supreme Court Ruling, which lead to the train of tears. The Indian Tribes won a ruling the they owned their land in the southeast US, Jackson had the military forcibly remove them from their lands. He ignore the Courts ruling.

Bindidon
Reply to  Stephen Wilde
November 7, 2020 4:24 pm

Oh Oh Oh… Please stop your ridiculous arguments.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Postal_voting_in_the_United_States

.
Postal voting in the United States, also referred to as mail-in voting or vote by mail,[1] is a form of absentee ballot in the United States, in which a ballot is mailed to the home of a registered voter, who fills it out and returns it by postal mail or drops it off in-person into a secure drop box or at a voting center.
.
Postal voting reduces staff requirements at polling centers during an election. All-mail elections can save money, while a mix of voting options can cost more. In some states, ballots may be sent by the Postal Service without prepayment of postage. Vote by mail is available in both red and blue states.
.
Research shows that the availability of postal voting increases voter turnout.
.
It has been argued that postal voting has a greater risk of fraud than in-person voting, though known instances of such fraud are very rare, with one database finding 491 cases of absentee ballot fraud from 2000 to 2012, a period in which billions of votes were cast.
.
Processing large numbers of ballots and signature verifications accurately has numerous challenges other than fraud.
.

And again: I ask why in 2016 vote by mail {NOT: absentee voting} still was not considered a problem. Even the Trumps voted by mail.

It is absolutely evident to me that this fraud story is a pure invention of the Trump administration.

You are here all pro-Trumps? Ha. No problem for me, I’m happy that the Globe got rid of him.

Good night to all of you,
J.-P. D.

Curious George
Reply to  Bindidon
November 7, 2020 5:30 pm

You quote: “491 cases of absentee ballot fraud from 2000 to 2012, a period in which billions of votes were cast.” This says nothing about mail-in voting. Read my comment above.

philincalifornia
Reply to  Bindidon
November 7, 2020 6:05 pm

It is absolutely evident to me that this fraud story is a pure invention of the Trump administration.

You are here all pro-Trumps?

There is scientific evidence that fossil fuel emissions over preindustrial levels of 280 ppm cause global climate change.

0 for 3 saddo.

You can rephrase the last one if you want, you’ll still be zero for three

Adrian Mann
Reply to  Bindidon
November 7, 2020 6:13 pm

No, we’re not all pro Trumps, though we are in a minority here.
It’s simple to understand Trumps response – he’s a sore loser. His supporters are also sore losers, grasping at straws.
Have you noticed that the world collectively breathed a sigh of relief when the result became known? Suddenly everything seems better, more hopeful, more positive.. the darkest days may be behind us, the aberration has been excised, and we can all move on

Bindidon
Reply to  Adrian Mann
November 8, 2020 3:04 am

Have you noticed that the world collectively breathed a sigh of relief when the result became known?

Oh sure I did, you can’t imagine our reaction at home as we suddenly saw WashPo and NYT telling us that Biden had defeated Trump.

J.-P. D.

Izaak Walton
Reply to  Stephen Wilde
November 7, 2020 5:11 pm

This should not come as a surprise to anyone. Trump is not popular and has never been popular.
He lost the popular vote to the most despised woman in America in 2016 and only won by a fluke of
electoral college maths. Since then he has done nothing but increase the level of division and drive
moderates away from him. There was a massive blue shift in 2018 showing the lack of support for
Trump. Trump has also been losing to Biden in the polls since late 2019. Trump is also losing the
popular vote by 4 million and is projected to lose that by several million more. So it should not come
as any surprise that he lost in the electoral college.

Futhermore the way that Trump lost was predicted by the media months ago. Polling showed that
democrats were about 4 times as likely to vote by mail than republicans so it was always obvious that
Trump would have a large lead on election night and that lead would disappear as the mail-in votes were
counted. There is no evidence of widespread fraud at all — Trump lost because he was historically unpopular and it is as simple as that.

Carlo, Monte
Reply to  Izaak Walton
November 7, 2020 6:02 pm

More leftist/marxist propaganda from a dishonest person.

Next…

philincalifornia
Reply to  Carlo, Monte
November 7, 2020 6:16 pm

Sort of, but I think this guy is in the UK, so he just gets to recycle BBC turds amongst other turds he recycles. Like the other “musn’t grumblers” there, too lazy to actually do any independent research that would stifle their silly virtue-signaling.

I understand this well, as I’m a “musn’t grumble” refugee as well as a climate refugee.

Strangely, I was a believer in Democratic party thinking when I arrived here in 1980, with similar politics to Joe Biden even. As someone quoted on here recently “I didn’t leave the Democratic Party, the democrat party left me”. It’s quite sad that they make a guy with the onset of Alzheimers fake being a ph0ny-socialist, just because he can bark stupid slogans at a microphone, and not even do that well.

The other shoe has yet to drop.

Carlo, Monte
Reply to  philincalifornia
November 7, 2020 7:27 pm

Biden is the epitome of a big eastern machine politician, he stands only for himself. He was the chairman of the Senate Judiciary committee and started the Democrat process of assassinating the character of Republican court nominees, aka “Borking”. He’s also an old-line Democrat racist.

How will there ever be trustworthy elections in the U.S. again? If this fraud holds it will be the beginning of one-party rule.

Clyde Spencer
Reply to  Izaak Walton
November 7, 2020 6:36 pm

Walton
You claimed, “Trump has also been losing to Biden in the polls since late 2019.” Or so the Media and pollsters would have you believe. However, the results of the election demonstrate that the pollsters were wrong by an even larger margin this year than in 2016. The question is, was it incompetence or malfeasance?

Tom in Florida
Reply to  Clyde Spencer
November 7, 2020 8:33 pm

The idea that Biden was so far ahead in the polls was to instill a false sense that Biden should win and that any irregularities wouldn’t matter. A couple of comments using those polls as “proof” that Biden would have won anyway supports this.

Gary Pearse
Reply to  Izaak Walton
November 7, 2020 7:08 pm

Yet roughly 70 million people voted for Trump. Do you not see I. W. that you are delegitimizing 70 million Americans with your flippant remarks. Hey, Biden may end up legitimately running the rest of the table, but by any sane measure, Trump is enormously popular.

The hardest thing to figure out is how half of American thinks a guy who is in an early stage of dementia can handle the presidency. What has he done in 47 years on the job of governing when he had all his marbles that gives his supporters great expectations. At least Trump can run an economy and is tough enough to deal with the likes of China. It ain’t good that China appears to have already bought Joe, either.

Izaak Walton
Reply to  Gary Pearse
November 7, 2020 7:39 pm

Gary,
Trump may have gotten 70 million votes but Biden is currently at 75 million. Again Trump
is significantly less popular than Biden just as he was less popular than Clinton.

sycomputing
Reply to  Izaak Walton
November 7, 2020 7:56 pm

Good grief THANK YOU Izaak for pointing out to these rubes how roughly the population of TWO American cities, e.g., Los Angeles, CA and Austin, TX, separate the votes between Trump and Biden at the moment, and how this PROVES how hated Trump is.

I mean come on! How can these people be so blind?

Pariah Dog
Reply to  Izaak Walton
November 8, 2020 2:01 am

And yet, Trump is more popular than former President Barack Obama, who won in 2008 with 69.5 million votes, and 65 million votes in 2012, vs – as you say – 70 million for Trump. Face it, nobody in this election voted for Biden. They either voted for Trump, or against him. The polls and the media predicted a landslide for Biden, and that didn’t happen. The fact that it’s come down to a squeaker in 5 states shows that Trump is far more popular than the media would have you believe.

Clyde Spencer
Reply to  Izaak Walton
November 8, 2020 11:34 am

Walton,
Of the total votes tabulated thus far (subject to revision), Biden has received slightly less than 51%. That is a majority but does not rise to the level of a super-majority. I don’t see how any objective person could claim that 48% is “significantly less popular” than the alternative. It is a small margin that best illustrates how polarized the country has become, with the division largely reflecting the life styles of coastal urbanites versus the rest of the country.

However, I have come to expect less than rational responses from you.

bigoilbob
Reply to  Clyde Spencer
November 8, 2020 2:26 pm

“It is a small margin that best illustrates how polarized the country has become, with the division largely reflecting the life styles of coastal urbanites versus the rest of the country.”

And? A win is a win. Do we disenfranchise “coastal urbanites” v “the rest of the country”? Seeing as to how the former disproportionately “gives” while the latter disproportionately “takes”, why is one any more “American” than the other?

Clyde Spencer
Reply to  Izaak Walton
November 9, 2020 4:59 pm

b.o.b.
Where did I suggest disenfranchising any group. I was responding to I.W. who claimed that the vote demonstrated that Trump was “significantly” less popular than Biden. I was disagreeing with his ‘logic.’ Please try to keep up with the discussion if you are going to comment.

bigoilbob
Reply to  Clyde Spencer
November 10, 2020 2:02 am

“Where did I suggest disenfranchising any group.”

The only reason for mentioning coastal voters and the “rest of us” is to do so.. But I stand corrected, and am glad you agree that, even in our one national election, a vote is a vote, whether from the interior or from the coasts. Which, of course, invalidates the efficacy of the electoral college….

markl
November 7, 2020 2:24 pm

The fat lady hasn’t sung yet. Too many inconsistencies in vote tabulation and voter validation have come to light that need to be properly answered. Biden may be the winner but the MSM saying so today is more of what they’ve been doing all along……. propaganda. Whoever wins let’s hope it’s convincing.

EOM
November 7, 2020 2:27 pm

Ancient writers maintained that representative governments last 200 to 250 years. That included Rome. Here, it has been fun. Where are we going?

Tucker Carlson maintains that we are becoming an oligarchy, run without public input; voter fraud has proven that we have no power. Unfortunately, Tucker Carlson implies that Red China is a major part of this oligarchy that will govern us.

Trump has stood in the gap, alone. He is not “obedient”.

EOM
Reply to  Charles Rotter
November 7, 2020 7:21 pm

No

Jeff Alberts
Reply to  EOM
November 7, 2020 3:19 pm

The fact that Trump got elected the first time disproves the theory.

sycomputing
Reply to  Jeff Alberts
November 7, 2020 3:53 pm

I don’t think that follows Jeff. No one expected Trump to win in 2016, thus, no need for fraud.

This time it was different, however, thus Carlson’s argument has merit.

Mark A Luhman
Reply to  Jeff Alberts
November 7, 2020 4:10 pm

The Dimms in 2016 did not think they had to cheat, they certainly learned from their mistake.

MarkG
Reply to  Jeff Alberts
November 7, 2020 4:15 pm

No, it doesn’t.

The left simply believed their own nonsense, that Clinton couldn’t lose. Had the fraud been on the scale that was used for Harris, Clinton would have won 57 states.

Michael Ozanne
November 7, 2020 2:30 pm

All I know is that you can get a 12 hour twitter ban for suggesting that words frequently used to describe Mr Trump are at least as easily applicable to Mr Biden, if not more so…

All part of being a platform not a publication….. 😆

dmacleo
Reply to  Michael Ozanne
November 7, 2020 4:11 pm

you can also get a 12 hr time out for responding to don lemon post about how the last 4 years were rough on him. call him a whiny little c*nt and banned in 30 minutes.

Ricky
November 7, 2020 2:33 pm

Imagine the results were the reverse, we’d be hearing 24×7 how the fix was in and guarantee the “media” would be investigating full bore, as it is just crickets from ’em.

After 4+ years of continual bad press there were still 70 million+ folks who chose freedom. In the end hope the Republican party builds on the gains made and doesn’t pick one of the “establishment types” to lead, time for the younger and much more diverse generation of conservatives to take the lead, and I say that as a middle aged “white” guy..

November 7, 2020 2:34 pm

Listening to PC-Prog media influence message loop: “No evidence of vote fraud.”?

Don’t.

Just read this 2016 review of how to spot the tell-tale signs of vote rigging (yeah, they were talking about Gabon, Togo, and the Congo, but…it fits in Atlanta, Detroit, and Philly, too.):

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-africa-37243190

–Too many voters
–A high turnout in specific areas
–Large numbers of invalid votes
–More votes than ballot papers issued
–Results that don’t match
–Delay in announcing results

Pretty clear that 100% of those indications are present in this rigged election.

Don’t give up. It ain’t over.

DMA
Reply to  Kent Clizbe
November 7, 2020 3:10 pm

KC
Have you seen: ( http://joannenova.com.au/2020/11/biden-votes-pattern-fails-an-easy-first-test-for-tax-fraud/ ). I do not have enough math knowledge to understand it all but it seems to be a mathematical “proof” of fiddling with the vote counts. Can anyone here verify this?

Rick C PE
Reply to  DMA
November 7, 2020 4:39 pm

This is about Benford’s law which is used by financial auditors as a signal that numerical data may be made up. It’s based on the rather odd fact that legitimately acquired data will have first digits that follow a specific distribution with 1s being most common, 2’s second most, etc. Made up data tends to have a more uniform distribution or even a normal distribution. It is a reasonable indicator, but not proof of a problem. But it does give auditors/investigators a good idea of what data should be more thoroughly investigated. Interestingly, Bernie Madoff’s scam looked OK based on the first digit data, but the Benford law also looks at second, third and 4th digits as wells the first 2 and first 3 digits. Each has a particular expected distribution. Madoff’s data failed the second and first 2 digit tests.

It might be interesting for someone to look at climate data from the alarmists using Benford.

Allen Stoner
Reply to  DMA
November 7, 2020 4:47 pm

Nice info

Larry in Texas
Reply to  Kent Clizbe
November 7, 2020 3:49 pm

I read it. Pretty eerie, isn’t it? The similarities are stark.

John
November 7, 2020 2:35 pm

This was an unprecedented election in that Trump received 8MM more votes than in 2016 and still lost. What made the difference was our Covid response which kept our young people home with ballots mailed to them. Nothing else to do but vote. Without Covid and the lockdowns this never would have happened. Thanks to YouTube and other media, the conservative voices in social media were blocked. These are the two most powerful reasons in my opinion.

Simon
Reply to  John
November 7, 2020 4:38 pm

John
“Nothing else to do but vote.”
But surely you are not complaining that more people voted? Is high voter turnout not the life blood of any democracy. It should be as easy as it possibly for citizens to vote. It’s crazy that the US votes on a Tuesday anyway. It penalised the working class many of whom struggle to get away from work and wait in long cues. I think you will find mail in voting is going to become more prevalent going forward.

John
Reply to  Simon
November 7, 2020 7:43 pm

I agree that we should want as many legally voting as possible in the easiest way possible. I don’t agree with media censorship of certain political views. There were also verified voting machine problems that were corrected with a manual recount. If this is a more widespread problem with software “glitches”, then the results are currently suspect. I want the person who won the most real votes resulting in a majority of electoral votes to win the Presidency no matter who it is.

David Dibbell
November 7, 2020 2:37 pm