Greenland Is Way Cool

Guest Post by Willis Eschenbach

As a result of a tweet by Steve McIntyre, I was made aware of an interesting dataset. This is a look by Vinther et al. at the last ~12,000 years of temperatures on the Greenland ice cap. The dataset is available here.

Figure 1 shows the full length of the data, along with the change in summer insolation at 75°N, the general location of the ice cores used to create the temperature dataset.

Figure 1. Temperature anomalies of the Greenland ice sheet (left scale, yellow/black line), and the summer insolation in watts per square metre at 75°N (right scale, blue/black line). The red horizontal dashed line shows the average ice sheet temperature 1960-1980.

I’ll only say a few things about each of the graphs in this post. Regarding Figure 1, the insolation swing shown above is about fifty watts per square metre. Over the period in question, the temperature dropped about two and a half degrees from the peak in about 5800 BCE. That would mean the change is on the order of 0.05°C for each watt per square metre change in insolation …

From about 8300 BCE to 800 BCE, the average temperature of the ice sheet, not the maximum temperature but the average temperature of the ice sheet, was greater than the 1960-1980 average temperature of the ice sheet. That’s 7,500 years of the Holocene when Greenland’s ice sheet was warmer than recent temperatures.

Next, Figure 2 shows the same temperature data as in Figure 1, but this time with the EPICA Dome C ice core CO2 data.

Figure 2. Temperature anomalies of the Greenland ice sheet (left scale, yellow/black line), and EPICA Dome C ice core CO2 data, 9000 BCE – 1515 AD (right scale, blue/black line)

Hmmm … for about 7,000 years, CO2 is going up … and Greenland temperature is going down … who knew?

Finally, here’s the recent Vinther data:

Figure 3. Recent temperature anomalies of the Greenland ice sheet.

Not a whole lot to say about that except that the Greenland ice sheet has been as warm or warmer than the 1960-1980 average a number of times during the last 2000 years.

Finally, I took a look to see if there were any solar-related or other strong cycles in the Vinther data. Neither a Fourier periodogram nor a CEEMD analysis revealed any significant cycles.

And that’s the story of the Vinther reconstruction … here, we’ve had lovely rain for a couple of days now. Our cat wanders the house looking for the door into summer. He goes out time after time hoping for a different outcome … and he is back in ten minutes, wanting to be let in again.

My best to all, rain or shine,

w.

PS—When you comment please quote the exact words you are referring to so we can all understand exactly what you are discussing.

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Cynthia
January 8, 2019 3:43 pm

“we’ve had lovely rain for a couple of days now. Our cat wanders the house looking for the door into summer. He goes out time after time hoping for a different outcome”
Cat is looking for a dry warm spot to watch the birds and other prey.
If you want him to leave for longer, cover his favorite spot, and put down a pet heat pad.
Once, I played a bird song CD, and my cats searched everywhere, but could not find …. just a little excitement in their dreary lives.

Cynthia
January 8, 2019 3:52 pm

I assume the source data is the same as used by GRiP ?

2hotel9
January 8, 2019 4:06 pm

Ah, yea, middle of winter. That is what happens.

chaamjamal
January 8, 2019 5:24 pm

The great interest in the Greenland (and Antarctic) ice sheets and the corresponding fear of catastrophic sea level rise are derived from events in the Eemian Interglacial with important differences overlooked including the much smaller size of the Greenland ice sheet this time around.

https://tambonthongchai.com/2018/12/21/eemian/

Cynthia
January 8, 2019 5:26 pm

I don’t like this graph; it implies the next cooling is on schedule, heading for the glacial. Crap.
I’m still hoping there is something about the industrial revolution that will delay or save earth from the next glacial: Perhaps
1) the dirt and ash we threw out landed on the glaciers making them more sunlight absorbent,
2) the heating spilled out from our homes and factories, warming up the environment,
3) maybe a little warming from CO2.

Reply to  Cynthia
January 9, 2019 12:33 am

Problem with ash and soot we are spilling is that it can be covered in matter of minutes by snow and rendered disfunctional. It will help us to maintain heat to some extent but change then will be sudden and system returns to its cold standard,

January 8, 2019 5:29 pm

“Figure 1 shows the full length of the data, along with the change in summer insolation at 75°N, the general location of the ice cores used to create the temperature dataset.”

Now, that is a graphed dataset that should cause everyone to shiver!

Temperatures have been declining since circa 2,000 BCE.

And the recent temperature rise mostly occurred between 1920 and 1940.
1920 anomaly looks to be approximately 0.2°C.
1940 anomaly looks to be approximately 1.175°C.

Personally, I would be happier if we did not descend into another ice age. Though, I am unconvinced mankind has sufficient influence.

Excellent article and analysis, Willis!

Johann Wundersamer
January 8, 2019 7:06 pm

Great: “Our cat wanders the house looking for the door into summer.”

https://knigger.org/heinlein/the-door-into-summer/lang/en/

Our cat “bella” does the same.

I open the door for her and she goes for a brief inspection.

Cats on inspection keep marten away from my automobile.

donb
January 8, 2019 7:40 pm

There are reports that sea level was a few meters higher 6-8 kyr compared to today, presumably a result of higher temperatures.

peyelut
January 8, 2019 10:56 pm

“. . . . . so here are all of the ice core CO2 records that I can find that cover the period of the EPICA dataset.”

Not very Mannly of you, Willis.

Oatley
Reply to  peyelut
January 9, 2019 10:26 am

Most excellent, Peyelut!

Olof R
January 9, 2019 5:42 am

The last two millenia is quite a hockey-stick. The last datapoint is 1960- 1980 ( I assume fractional 1960.0-1980.0, else it wouldn’t be 20 years).
Using KNMI climate explorer I estimated the temperature change from 1960 -1979 to the most recent 20 year average, in a band (74-76 N, 25-55 W) across Greenland.
Berkeley earth rose 1.3 C
NCEP/NCAR rose 1.5 C

Thus, around 1.4 C should be added to the last datapoint, which would make the blade of the stick even longer and penetrate the roof of the chart..

tty
Reply to  Olof R
January 9, 2019 10:50 am

Yes. Actual measurements show that it is now about as warm as in the 1930’s and for a few years around 2005-2010 it may even have been slightly warmer than in the thirties:

https://www.nature.com/articles/s41598-017-01451-7

Johann Wundersamer
January 9, 2019 5:54 am

Great: “Our cat wanders the house looking for the door into summer.”

https://knigger.org/heinlein/the-door-into-summer/lang/en/

Our BLACK cat “bella” does the same.

I open the door for her and she goes for a brief inspection.

Cats on inspection keep marten away from my automobile.

Johann Wundersamer
January 9, 2019 6:05 am
Johann Wundersamer
January 9, 2019 6:28 am

What that academic drissel means :

Cats furs sport 2 colors:

– black: NO color

– red: colored cat.

common cats are a blends.
___________________________________________________

What about WHITE cats.

Well thei’re 256 in colour maps

– ALL notes in RGB or YMG

says

RGB red green brown

YMC yellow magenta cyan

https://www.google.com/search?q=ymca+rgb+colors&client=ms-android-samsung&prmd=isvn&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwiJ5p-C9ODfAhWkqIsKHfVGDxEQ_AUoAXoECAwQAQ&biw=360&bih=560

Johann Wundersamer
January 9, 2019 6:32 am

What that academic drissel means :

Cats furs sport 2 colors:

– black: NO color

– red: colored cat.

common cats are a blends.
___________________________________________________

What about WHITE cats.

Well thei’re 256 in colour maps

– ALL notes in RGB or YMG

says

RGB red green blue

YMC yellow magenta cyan

https://www.google.com/search?q=ymca+rgb+colors&client=ms-android-samsung&prmd=isvn&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwiJ5p-C9ODfAhWkqIsKHfVGDxEQ_AUoAXoECAwQAQ&biw=360&bih=560

Johann Wundersamer
January 9, 2019 7:09 am

What that academic drissel means :

Cats furs sport 2 colors:

– black: NO color

– red: colored cat.

common cats are a blends.
___________________________________________________

What about WHITE cats.

Well thei’re 256 in colour maps == shining bright

– ALL notes in RGB or YMG

says

RGB red green blue

YMC yellow magenta cyan

https://www.google.com/search?q=ymc+rgb+colors&tbm=isch&ved=2ahUKEwiQ67-J9ODfAhUegKQKHR98AD8Q2-cCegQIABAC&oq=ymc+rgb+colors&gs_l=mobile-gws-wiz-img.

___________________________________________________

really miss that f***ing edit function.

DM
January 9, 2019 7:14 am

The insolation & CO2 graphs are great. Thanks.

For the benefit of those less well informed about climate & the behavior of Greenland’s ice cover, pls explain the apparent incongruity. Greenland was warmer during the latter half of the Dark Ages than it was during the Medieval Warm Period.

January 9, 2019 8:11 am

I have a question that has been bugging me recently. Ice caps, Glaciers, etc. move. Slowly flowing downhill toward the sea. When they take these ice cores and produce temperature records, do they (can they) account for where the ice was when it was deposited. How about elevation. Ice deposited today in Greenland is deposited at high elevation, so of course it is cold. How about 10,000 ya? What elevation was it deposited at? How much farther inland was it deposited than were it was sampled from?

Reply to  Jeff in Calgary
January 9, 2019 12:33 pm

Jeff in Calgary,

Most ice cores taken for measurements of ancient gases are drilled at the summits of ice domes, like Law Dome, Fuji Dome, Dome C, to prevent problems like dating the ice layer and its gas content.
I suppose that the lowest layers are just pushed sidewards, while the current height of the dome is not much different from the one in the far past.

There are exceptions like the Vostok ice core which was taken more downstreams and the third (DSS) ice core of Law Dome, to have a longer record with less resolution than at the summit.
In all cases it is only if you have distinct summer/winter ice layers that it is simple to know the age of the ice. At depth and low accumulation, one need to check with radar, electroconductivity, known volcanic deposits. Average gas age is a matter of accumulation, density and temperature and calculation, but often prone to revisions…

Mike Borgelt
January 9, 2019 2:08 pm

Your cat wants in after TEN minutes,Willis? Our last two would hit the wet concrete outside, disdainfully shake a paw and get straight back in before the door closed.

January 9, 2019 6:20 pm

“Hmmm … for about 7,000 years, CO2 is going up … and Greenland temperature is going down … who knew?”

Who knew indeed! I’m sure that all the Team knew, but it’s not something you talk about in polite clime syndicate company, except how to hide the decline. We know we all would know if the data had supported the mene.

joe- the non climate scientist
January 10, 2019 3:01 pm

This study is study is reasonably consistent with three points that Steve McIntyre makes on his website

1) that most of the temp reconstructions provide limited scientific insight to the prior temps,

2) the relative differences in warmth between the present and the mwp is really indisquishable.

3) The warmth in both the present time and the MWP are only bumps in comparison of the entire holocene period

The other point is why none of the warmist look at marcott’s study and never say WTF –