CREDIT Patrick Mansell, Penn State
Guest essay by Eric Worrall
The part I don’t get – why is it important to greens not to “fall behind”?
Climate Change Impacts ‘No Longer Subtle,’ Scientist Says
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Here & Now’s Jeremy Hobson talks with Michael Mann (@MichaelEMann), distinguished professor of atmospheric science and director of the Earth System Science Center at Penn State University.
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“What we’re seeing right now across the Northern Hemisphere is extreme weather in the form of unprecedented heat waves, droughts, floods, wildfires. In isolation, it might seem like any one of these things could be dismissed as an anomaly, but it’s the interconnectedness of all these events and their extreme nature that tells us that we are now seeing the face of climate change. The impacts of climate change are no longer subtle.
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“That’s a huge lost opportunity when the media does not connect those dots for the people, because this is the face of climate change, and we have to understand it’s not just about polar bears up in the Arctic. It’s about extreme damaging weather events that we’re experiencing now in real time.”
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“So the world is moving on, and the question now is, simply, is the United States going to join the rest of the world in what is the great economic revolution of this century, the green energy revolution, or are we going to fall behind the rest of the world? That’s the decision that we have to make, and if we don’t like the path that we’re on right now with the Trump administration and Republican leadership in Congress, we’ve got a midterm election in less than 100 days, where we can speak out and say, ‘We want a different path. We want to join the rest of the world, rather than be the last holdout towards progress.’ ”
Read more: http://www.wbur.org/hereandnow/2018/08/02/summer-weather-climate-change
Why is it so important to greens for the USA not to “fall behind” the alleged renewable energy revolution?
Back in 2014, an engineering team working for Google discovered to their horror that there is no economically viable path to 100% renewable energy. No matter what they tried, the cost of building all the green energy infrastructure which would be required to get anywhere close to 100% renewable energy was an insurmountable barrier.
Spending money on green energy R&D – I don’t have a problem with that. But spending money on green energy infrastructure is a high risk investment in an unready technology which currently has no chance of delivering. Even Google’s engineers couldn’t crack the problem.
My question – instead of risking national economic ruin by trying to jump to the front of the pack, why not continue with the status quo? Encourage US entrepreneurs servicing the technology needs of green states and other countries to solve the problems, without risking the national economy.
That way countries or states which are enthusiastic about solar and wind take the risks, while states which are less enthusiastic about green energy provide an economic safety net in case the green energy revolution doesn’t work out.
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Because if they “fall behind” they don’t make a dime. Remember, it’s money that’s at the heart of it all. The redistribution of wealth. Everything that is hyped, made to look like a climate or ecological crisis, and breed climate hysteria is all about taking money out of all of your pocket and putting it into theirs. They’re greedy and they want their cut of all of our money.
The part I don’t get – why is it important to greens not to “fall behind”? – The reason they don’t want to fall behind is because it hits them in the wallet. They want to redistribute wealth from your wallet to theirs. That’s why they have this fake crisis mentality. They want their cut of our money to line their pockets and pay for their agenda. Fortunately, we have the ability to stop them in their tracks. Trump has kept his promises and pulled us out out Climate Change agreements and executive ordered the reversal of much of Obama’s environmentalist agenda.
Or: Will the USA Join the Green Energy Revolution ‘and’ Fall Behind?
They are getting desperate. They have lost every argument, and now only have ‘be part of the first world’ left.
Well now, As a Professional Engineering practitioner, there is a BIG disconnect between the Practitioners on the ground in everyday life and the “professors” in their ivory towers shouting along the corridors, across the vennels to their fellow elitists ( politico, etc). ……. could go on , but I have a job to do and a wage to earn…
I mean, …. that we have to Listen to the continuous drabble from them and the Media with their cohorts – any story this past while, seems to include a reason for failure is attributed to climate change. …
What green energy revolution is there to join?
Yeah, Green Energy Revolution as a movement is so passe. Come on Mann get caught up with the times! The term green energy is so Obama era. Its time and their fantasies and failed policies has come and gone.
If only mankind could harness the power of Michael Manns smugness
What is the carbon footprint of building all this “green” infrastructure? What is the carbon footprint of a wind farm compared to the annual carbon emission savings, and what is the “payback period?” Given that we have only five years to blah blah blah, I hope it’s not more than five years.
(Besides, how much wind do those things actually create? They look like they use up a lot of electricity. )
https://www.carbonbrief.org/solar-wind-nuclear-amazingly-low-carbon-footprints
Lots of good info there.
The “all in” renoobles countries are trying to back out while they still have an economy. Trump saved the world but I hope he has a Kevlar suit on. There are sane sober believers in the AGW alarm stuff but it is an attractive type of issue for psychologically impaired types, angry haters and the like. I dont thing the come-down is going to be pretty.
why is it important to greens not to “fall behind”?
Because they’re so far behind they think they’re ahead.
I find it interesting this perspective that a nation or people would be “falling behind” when failing to adopt the green approach to energy, when observations are that adopting green policies actually are set-backs in advancing a culture and society.
Green energy = the most expensive energy on the planet!
And the most environmentally damaging and least reliable.
They have to press right now. They have to try to imply that we need to catch up and that we need to act fast…while they have the chance.
We’re currently undergoing a string of inclement weather (I seriously doubt the “unprecedented” part) that they have to exploit while it’s still in the forefront of people’s minds.
They sure can’t do it when this dies down and we have a run of “run of the mill” weather.
Actually, that’s pretty much the summer we’ve had in my area…pretty much exactly what we expect from summer in this area.
I wonder how many other areas are like that too, but by the time the media gets done reporting on it, anyone that’s NOT from there gets the impression that it’s been an extreme, “unprecedented” summer.
California’s got a bad wildfire going on. Um…doesn’t that happen pretty much every year?
“New heat records in death valley and Morrocco!!!!1!!11!!!!1111” The desert is hot. Duh.
We’ve had a heat wave. We’ve had heat waves for as long as I’ve been alive. We’ve also had blizzards, deep freezes and really mild weather too at various times. None of that, in my limited experience, is the harbinger of the end of the world…it’s called “weather”.
Anyway…Mann and company have to try to exploit the weather to push their agenda while they can because they know as well as we do that it won’t last forever and it’s a lot harder to push their agenda when it’s nice outside.
http://i67.tinypic.com/2rohk00.jpg
Oh, Mann means the green energy revolution like in the Netherlands where they put out hundreds of electric generator windmills only to take them down because they were costing more to operate than the power they were supplying. Until there is a battery technology breakthrough, renewable energy will never be feasible for more than a fraction of the world’s energy needs.
Even with batteries, they fail. It has to do with energy density and consistent performance (the battery bank required to cover a week of no wind would probably dwarf a city). I guess we could change the laws of physics. They vote on that, right?
“Until there is a battery technology breakthrough”
This will be quite literally swamped by the (inaptly named, I think, because it has nothing to do with the sun as in solar) “SunCell”.
Until there is a battery technology breakthrough
Battery tech is mature — has been. Incremental improvements like lithium batteries can occur, but that doesn’t change the fact of very-low energy density.
Germany launched the major PV transition by its guaranteed solar power buy back program.
China then committed $47 billion to capture the global PV market.
https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/why-china-is-dominating-the-solar-industry/
To some of us in the UK this is reminiscent of the history of liquid crystal displays . The materials were first explored in Germany and in the UK ( by Gray at Univ of Hull) and the research on application to displays was promoted by the UK Govt through , eg the Royal Radar Establishment in Malvern and the work of Prof Cyril Hilsum .
However it is Japan , S Korea and Taiwan and the companies there that reaped the major commercial benefit through their massive industrial investment from the 1980s.
Woou8ldn’t it be better if this “disgrace to his profession” actually limited his disgrace to his profession?
Leaders in science fields are a “disgrace to (their) profession.”
We get it. You don’t like scientists who are published and peer reviewed, especially when their work is confirmed by many studies in the next few decades.
Ally, I suggest you read “”A Disgrace To The Profession” The World’s Scientists, In Their Own Words, On Michael E Mann, His Hockey Stick And Their Damage To Science Volume I”. You might learn just what his peer think about this “leader” you so blindly defend.
His bank account must be getting low.
No, he’s doing fine. Director of the Earth System Science Center at Pennsylvania State University and several books (well written too, not sure if he had a ghost writer.)
I think the sites that peddle non-science are hurting.
There’s an old saw that seems to apply, if I could just remember it correctly… Something like, “At first I was proud of the General, as a great leader, for running out in front of his troops, until I realized they were in full retreat.”
Does anyone else remember such a quote? Who said it? Unless I’m the one that made it up, in which case I take full credit.
What I’m trying to say is, there’s all kinds of leadership, not all of it desirable.
I’ve seen leadership defined as “Figure out which direction people are moving, then run that way.”
“Spending money on green energy R&D – I don’t have a problem with that.”
I do. There is no upside in it. Windmills are thousand year old technology. Batteries 220 years. Solar thermal ancient. Solar cells are only at 110.But the point is made. Pouring money into “renewable” R&D is just welfare for white people. A waste of money and time.
1. Virtue-signaling “Ahh others are ahead op us in the virtue race! Unacceptable!”
2. Attempt to appeal to naive competitiveness “Americans love to be first. Tell them they are falling behind.”
I can not for the life of me figure out the motivation of Michael Mann. As a climate scientist he must be aware of and studied all the data, yet he makes these statements which he must know are false. He must know that amid all this hysteria over heatwaves, the northern hemisphere is only 0.2° C above the average, and that the northern Atlantic SST has dropped by over 0.5° C. He must also know that parts of the southern hemisphere are suffering abnormally low winter temperatures. Maybe it was getting away with the deception of the hockey stick chart that went to his head.
I can not for the life of me figure out the motivation of Michael Mann.
Hubris overtakes rationality; the desire for fame and a ‘name’ outstrips all other motivating factors, including the exercise of discretion.
“the northern hemisphere is only 0.2° C above the average”
That makes no sense. Scientists would indicate what average they are talking about. You seem to have picked an arbitrary average.
And picking specific parts of the globe is interesting, but are duly noted in the global average.
Idiots all. The “SunCell” courtesy of Dr. Mills is going to eat a lot of “lunches” in the energy field …
I add this for ristvan’s edification: “From the time of its inception, quantum mechanics (QM) has been controversial because its foundations are in conflict with physical laws and are internally inconsistent. Interpretations of quantum mechanics such as hidden variables, multiple worlds, consistency rules, and spontaneous collapse have been put forward in an attempt to base the theory in reality. Unfortunately many theoreticians ignore the requirement that the wave function must be real and physical in order for it to be considered a valid description of reality.
These issues and other such flawed philosophies and interpretations of experiments that arise from quantum mechanics are discussed in the Retrospect section and Ref. [8, 10, 12]. Reanalysis of old experiments and many new experiments including electrons in superfluid helium and data confirming the existence of hydrinos challenge the Schrödinger equation predictions.
Many noted physicists rejected quantum mechanics, even those whose work undermined classical laws. Feynman attempted to use first principles including Maxwell’s Equations to discover new physics to replace quantum mechanics [34] and Einstein searched to the end. “Einstein […] insisted […] that a more detailed, wholly deterministic theory must underlie the vagaries of quantum mechanics [35].” He believed scientists were misinterpreting the data.”
From: https://brilliantlightpower.com/wp-content/uploads/theory/GUT-CP-2016-Ed-Volume1-Web-121517.pdf
Michael Mann apparently lacks the engineering/science skill to adequately understand what is wrong with depending on solar and wind for energy.
The fallacy of renewables is revealed with simple arithmetic.
5 mW wind turbine, avg output 1/3 nameplate, 20 yr life, electricity @ur momisugly wholesale 3 cents per kwh produces $8.8E6.
Installed cost @ur momisugly $1.7E6/mW = $8.5E6.
Add the cost of energy storage facility and energy loss during storage/retrieval, or standby CCGT for low wind periods. Add the cost of land lease, maintenance, administration.
Solar voltaic and solar thermal are even worse with special concern for disposal and/or recycling at end-of-life (about 15 yr for PV).
The dollar relation is a proxy for energy relation. Bottom line, the energy consumed to design, manufacture, install, maintain and administer renewables exceeds the energy they produce in their lifetime.
Without the energy provided by other sources renewables could not exist.
Dan, in the engineering world “mW” indicates milliWatts via the lower case “m”. The term MW indicates the desired MegaWatt unit you desire …
Ref: https://physics.nist.gov/cuu/Units/prefixes.html
Newsflash, “revolutions” are created, funded and promoted by Governments in power. Revolutions are usually the result of Tyrannical Governments wasting peoples money to the point of destroying an economy so the people can do nothing but rebel. Think of Venezuela and Iran.
Also, Revolutions usually aren’t based upon lies.
Isolating the Impact of CO2 on Atmospheric Temperatures; Conclusion is CO2 has No Measurable Impact
https://co2islife.wordpress.com/2018/08/01/isolating-the-impact-of-co2-on-atmospheric-temperatures-conclusion-is-co2-has-no-measurable-impact/